התמלול המלא של Septic Systems, Entrepreneurship, and the Cost of Growth | Walker Maasch

what else would I do? Because I liked excavating and it was available and and a good opportunity. So I just kinda stuck with that for for a while. Actually, right before we had kids, so we we moved to South Carolina. I went to a year of school down there and then finished online up here. when we moved back home, I was working for my dad and we were kinda in the beginning stages of planning to have kids and stuff like that. And as I just kind of looked at my career, I It was really tough to ha find good stability, like you know, year round in excavating. It's a really speaker-1: Well Minnes Minnesota's a kind of a crazy place where the dirt is frozen for six months of the year sometime. speaker-0: It's sometimes half the year. Yeah. So, excavation just really stops. and so hours were tough in the wintertime, really up and down. And my dad had tried a couple of different things to kind of supplement for winter. We tried logging for a few years and that was good sometimes and not great other times. And we tried excavating in the winter. He we built a ground thawing machine and thawed the ground and it It just got to the point where it was not lucrative enough, right? And so the really the only choice would be to to lay everybody off. Cause we were a small enough company to where it was really tough to find ways to keep everybody busy. And so, as I was looking at the reality of things, I was like, Well, hey, I I'm gonna have kids soon. I got a mortgage now, like I need to have year-round income. And so, that's when I kind of had to have that that tough transition point of stepping away from what my originally what my plan was is taking over the company and finding a new d a new dynamic with the family business and stuff like that and giving my finding an opportunity outside of that. So speaker-1: With that, you were going to school. What did go to school for? speaker-0: Business administration. speaker-1: Okay. And then and that from there, once it kind of became clear you might have to change your your path, yeah. What what did you end up doing after that? speaker-0: I actually went to the county. I worked for environmental services department for two years, doing septic inspections for them and then general permitting, customer service. You know, I I started there as administrative support, so you know, front desk. but then kind of as time gone on or went on, I I got a little bit more responsibilities and things like that. And so I I started there because of Ironically enough, even though it was an administrative support position, my experience in the contracting world was really helpful because that department issues all the permits, you know, has all the ordinances and everything. So I was really familiar with what they did. They didn't have anybody working at the office that like boots on the ground did the work. And so it was helpful for me to come in and and, you know, provide insight for w whenever somebody's applying for like a shoreline alteration permit and gonna be building retaining walls near the shore and stuff and it's like I've been doing that for ten years, you know, so speaker-1: I know one of the frustrations that I I can run into, sometimes you especially dealing with government and permitting, there there's a lot of times like, Hey, you can't do that. Well, what should I do or what can I do? Well, just not that. And and so it's nice to have somebody with some experience. And I remember even engaging with you in that role at that time where it's like, Hey, there's some inner play where like hey hey, this added to the experience versus like, Hey, I'm just paying money to make it happen. Yeah. speaker-0: For sure. And it's like, yeah, can kind of speak the same language as the c as the contractors and stuff like that and and have a a a reasonable approach to wanting to work with the customer on like, hey, what's your idea? You know, how can we how can we maybe compromise if what you want doesn't exactly fit like what's allowed by the DNR or allowed by the ordinance and whatnot, but how can we get to a place where everybody's happy, you know? speaker-1: So I know in my in my business it's really nice to have what they call solution people because there's tons of problem people. People will bring you problems all the time. Sure. So if you can have people who bring solutions, maybe even before you know there is a problem, yeah. It's so valuable. speaker-0: For sure. Yeah. speaker-1: And in a business, when you're operating a business, that's where a lot of times you can provide even more value at, you know, Excel around others. Yeah. So you were in in that role for how long? speaker-0: a little over two years. and then that's when I started to kind of realize that I wanted to I wanted something different. so kind of what happened for me there was I looked around and everybody everybody that was working there was it seemed like around ten years from retirement. and then I was I was the youngest. Katie Bennis, the now director, she she's like nine years older than me. And so she was the next youngest and so I just kind of realized I was like, well, people have to move positions or retire in order for me to advance. So I'm like, I might be front desk for ten years. So I was like, I just I gotta figure something else out. So that's what kind of started, you know, motivating the the desire to look for change. speaker-1: Mm. And and I as somebody who grew up in a family of entrepreneurs and seeing that, you know, business, self-employed lifestyle, there's the the appeal to it. Obviously, we also see the difficult times and and the the ups and the downs. But they're I at least for me, I start same thing. I started in engineering where I was an employee, had these different roles, but also then seeing like, hey, I I think I could do something on my on my speaker-0: Sure. speaker-1: did you yeah, would would you say that played a part in being like, Hey, maybe I can do this?

speaker-0: Yeah, big time. Cause you know, business was all I knew. I mean, I I didn't know anything. I didn't really know that go to work, collect a paycheck other than my short time at the county. speaker-1: Nine to five. speaker-0: Yeah, that was a bizarre adjustment. I was like, my gosh, it's it's sunny out and I'm done working for the day. Like that was a weird change. but yeah, I mean, I do think that my path probably would have looked a lot different if I didn't have you know, a also a family filled with entrepreneurs. 'cause I mean, even from a young age, I envisioned myself like, what's this company gonna look like when I'm in charge? You know, and like what kind of things am I gonna wanna do differently or or expound on and those types of things. I was I was having those thoughts when I was a little kid. and pictur myself, you know, going to the shop and being like, Wow, this is my shop now. So yeah, that definitely I would say played a pretty big role in motivating me to find the direction that I actually went on. speaker-1: How did you go from, okay, I've got this, you know, nine to five job? How did you go to, okay, I'm I'm starting a business? Or or what did that process look like? Yeah. Or conversations, anything like that. Yeah. speaker-0: my wife and I had just sat down and talked for quite a while, many different times about like I was just expressing, you know, discontentment in where I was at and trying to figure out like what I wanted to do. I was feeling a little limited, because I wanted to stay in this area, but you know, there's the opportunities are are great for people that want to be business owners or in trade indust industries and stuff like that, but it's not like working down in the cities, you know, where you can find a job doing anything there. The kind of the turning point really was my wife and I sat down at a bonfire one day and I was just like lamenting to her about I just I don't know what I want to do, but like I I need to find something else. And she's like, well, if you could just wake up tomorrow and just be doing doing something, what would it like realistically, what would it be? And I was like, I just want to run a business. I don't really care what it is, honestly. if I can find a way to run a business, I I would like to do that. And so we had talked about okay, well, what would that look like? You know, what what reasonable foot in the door do I have to starting a business? And so it was a natural step for me to consider doing septic designs and inspections because I've been in the I had been in the industry for, you know, around 12 years at that point. I had s I had seen quite a need for it. from from working at the county and issuing permits and asking answering all the questions from people when they're calling and saying, Hey, I need a septic design, who do I go to? And and inspecting everybody's new installation work and seeing like what works really well, what doesn't work. you know, getting a

chance to look at people that are doing things a little bit like above and beyond. And and I remember getting to a couple of sites where I was like, that's a really Great way of doing that. Like I would have never thought of that. And so as I realized like my perspective for this industry was kind of pretty well-rounded at that point, I was like, you know, I think that I would have something to offer to kind of fill a need in this county of an independent designer and inspector that's like not gonna go do installations. So I'm kind of a third party, you know. but but also looking at it from a installation perspective, a design perspective, and an inspection perspective too. So, not just one looking through one lens. And so once we realized that that would be a really attainable path to take, it was kind of a no brainer. So we just started moving forward with it. And step number one was I had to get a different job because it would have been a conflict of interest for me to I can't it's just permit speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: Exactly. So a spot opened up in the assessor's office, actually right around the right time, which I thought was really convenient time, but they also have a really high turnover. a tough job. So I was like, Well, I can go there. I you know, my work experience was adjacent enough to where I was, you know, considered qualified to do that job and so I moved offices and started my business right away and started doing it part time. So speaker-1: With that, what kind of certification or licensing comes with, you know, doing the septic design, septic inspections? Do you have to take some classes or take a test? What what was that like? Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah, so it's it's it's not like a typical trade like welding where you kinda gotta go to school for a year, those types of things. the University of Minnesota does host the classes that you have to take to to be get certified in this. And then how they have it set up is like if you wanted to become a designer, you have to take a basic class, which is like a one week course. It's just kind of an introduction. And then you take a soils class where you learn all about how groundwater behaves in the soil and how our soil treats effluent and all that. That's another like couple days or a week course. And then you take design and then you you I think you do have to take installation as well. Okay. so each class is around a week. They scatter them throughout the year. So it takes a long time. You can't just go, I'm gonna go to the cities for, you know, six weeks and bang them all out. You can't do that. Yep. and so to get fr from start to finish where I'm at. The fastest you could do it is probably 12 months. And that's if you have to pass every class before you advance to the next one. So gotcha. If you end up having a, shoot, I didn't pass that class, you have to retake the exam and then it can throw off your timeline. So typically what I see, cause it to get to become an advanced designer inspector, you have to take I think there's like six or seven different courses. And so it it usually takes people close to To a year and a half, I would say. So yeah, you get your certification. And then as soon as you have that, you have to apply for mem mentorship actually, where you have to do so. For designing, I had to do 15 designs under a already licensed and certified designer. Okay. in order to apply for my own certification and then further apply for a business license. So that can be a really tough part of it because people don't want to train in their competition. Right. and so sometimes people have to search out out of county or or travel quite a distance to to mentor other people or to be mentored. so I've actually done a mentorship for a guy that was in Duluth and he called me and he was like, I haven't I cannot find anybody and he was like, I'm willing to drive up here and so he came and we spent like three days together and did all of his all of his designs that he needed and nice. then he got got what he needed. So speaker-1: Nice and then he can go back home and design there. speaker-0: He was like, I'm not gonna come work here, I promise and was like, There's plenty of work anyways. Like yeah, I don't anticipate you're gonna wanna drive all the way from Duluth to here, but there's lots of work, so it's speaker-1: Okay. You know, you're taking the classes, getting the tests taken care of. you know, what did it look like on the actual business side of things? What did you what did you have to do to get set up for that? You know, how are you getting your your name out there? Just to touch on that, what's the difference between the advanced and basic? What's what what's the difference? speaker-0: so it's all based on design flow and whether or not advanced technologies used to help treat the system. So a regular basic designer can can design systems that are up to twenty four hundred and ninety-nine gallons a day. The cutoff is twenty five hundred gallons a day. That's when it becomes advanced. And then also if there's advanced treatment units like you know, peat filters or aerobic treatment units, things like that that are just a little bit A little bit more high tech. so basic works for honestly ninety-five percent of of systems that are installed in our area. the other five percent would would need to go to someone like me. so if you have like a really big campground or a restaurant, or if you can't meet a lake setback and the county requires that you have an advanced system, then that has to go through someone like me. Okay. yep. So I didn't have that yet. I pursued that after I started my business and got kind of my feet wet and and whatnot with with the industry. but yeah, my my certification was already done. so I just had to apply for a business license and purchase the right tools that I needed to actually physically do the work. So I started collecting the things I needed and I think I had my first customer

like two weeks after my business license was approved. It was like really fast. speaker-1: And when you're, you know, starting out like that, it's kind of I don't know about scary, but were you were you still working at the county sub and then doing this on the side? What what did that progression look like? Yeah. speaker-0: so everything got finalized in I think it was November of twenty twenty-one. So near the end of the season. So I stay working at the county for nine months while running my business. And then springtime hit. There was a huge rush. and things got really, really busy. I was kind of doing both at the same time, but then the the turning point for me to say, it's time for me to leave was since we do foster care, we had a sibling group come to us, w that would have made our family have four kids through three and under. And so we were like, that's pretty tough for me to work, you know, forty hours at the county, thirty hours on my business, and then have four kids. It was just like this too much. So it was time to leave. Yeah. speaker-1: probably using up all your vacation to like go do yeah your right your side hustle and speaker-0: Right. Yeah. And just not getting enough time at home and you know, leaving Danielle to to carry the heavy load of the kids and stuff. So needed to be more available. So speaker-1: Yeah. When when did you go to that full time, hey, I'm just running my own business. Okay. speaker-0: June of twenty twenty two. So yep. speaker-1: And then it's been full steam ahead since then. What what's the growth look like from from there? speaker-0: Yeah, it's been it's been pretty good. The first year I I went past the targets I had hoped, which was great. And then my second year was a really, really big year, which which was really, really I'm really thankful for. I feel like I've kind of hit a point where I'm I've been pretty steady the last like two years. I two or three years I've kind of seen the same amount of of work. However, I'm pretty particular with the work that I take. I don't travel a lot anymore 'cause there's I've I've I have so much local work, you know, first couple of years I was like saying yes to everybody. I was driving up to Grand Moray to do designs and you know, way up in Coochin County and stuff like that. And I was like, I just there's enough local work now. I've, you know, established myself enough to where I don't have to travel so much. So I've kind of like let go of let go of some, you know, out of county work and then I don't do designs for homeowner installations anymore. I just do just for contractors and so so yeah, I've been a little bit more particular, able to kind of pick the things that I really want to focus on. So speaker-1: Yeah, that's kinda nice and I've been able to do that in my business. Like all of sudden, okay, I'm gonna shrink it shrink it back to yeah, I can pick what I wanna do. Yeah. Or or more so. 'Cause it's you know, sometimes you're driving an hour to do the same work that you could be doing. speaker-0: Ten minutes from your home. speaker-1: Yeah. And by saying yes to those, you sometimes give up those other opportunities that are close by. Do you is it just you still or are you just a solo operation or what what's you know speaker-0: Well, I do have an employee now. Her name's Megan. You know, yeah, you know Megan Tim. Yeah. Yeah. She's the best. I love her. She's awesome. Yeah. speaker-1: Sh sh what she do for you? speaker-0: So she is kind of like my administrative support person. So nice. so she does all my paperwork processing. so we have a really good kind of setup. So I do all the field work. I we created these forms that I fill out when I get to the site and I fill them all out digitally and then She gets them as soon as I'm done and so she then takes it from there. She you know, issues the compliance, reaches out to the customer, does all the invoicing, files the paperwork with the county, does all that back office stuff. And so I get to focus on the stuff that I know, the stuff that I'm good at, you know, the field work stuff and she's way better at that stuff than me. So really helpful that I have her to kinda take that load and you know, she gets to kinda pick her own hours and process things as they come in and works really good. So speaker-1: Well, and when you're in that line of work, the design and inspection, you know, it's the really important stuff is taking place on site or you need to get out there. And then a lot of the other things is, you know, it can happen on the nights or weekend where you're processing that and getting that off of your plate as a business owner makes things a lot more scalable. 'Cause if you're not able to go visit a site because you're filling out paperwork, yeah. It's really tough 'cause you can't I mean, i you are getting paid for the paperwork, but not Not in the same way that the actual inspection absolutely getting on site, getting the work done. speaker-0: Absolutely. Well, that's the thing. Cause before her, I was I could comfortably take three jobs a day, you know, between like, you know, because they're not all close by. So it'd be like I'd be on the on the site, like in, you know, boots on the ground for five or six hours, and then I'd come home and do all the paperwork. So it's like a f you know, a full work day. but since having her, it's like I can go do seven jobs, seven seven field jobs and do all the field work, and then I'm home by three or four. And and and I'm done for the day 'cause I've already passed off the paperwork to her and then she takes it from there. So it's like I'm I'm I've over doubled the the the turnover and shrunk my time down. So it's awesome. speaker-1: Which is really big, especially in northern Minnesota, because our season is sh is so truncated with with the weather. Being able to get get that stuff done during when you know make hay when the sun shines, that that is huge. What what do things really look like for

you in the wintertime now that you know, w w what happens there? speaker-0: That's a great question. people tease me because every winter I'm doing something different. so winter times are really tough. But the first year that I started my business, I thought I had it all figured out because I I when I left the county, I had called a a local contractor friend of mine and said, Hey, can I any chance that you'd have like you know, some some work during the winter? I know it's your slow season too, but like any chance that you'd have room for me to come work? And he said, Yeah, I do. And and then he ended up having a really big job that was supposed to get done over the winter time and the concrete was it was a storage unit facility. Concrete didn't get poured before like we got a bunch of snow. And then it was like, shoot, that's gotta be done in the spring now. So he had to lay some people off. Obviously, you know, and reasonably I was first on the chopping block, being the newest person, right? So I was like, no, I have to figure out how to make it through the winter. And we had just got like two feet of snow, and I was like, Well. I checked my business insurance would cover like roof shoveling. So I was like, I'll just shovel people's roofs for cash for right now. And I posted an ad on Facebook and I had like 15 customers the first week. And I was like, Holy buckets. Yeah. And so then I so that got really, really busy and it transitioned into ice dam removal through that winter. And so I I had a really, really big winter that first winter, and I was like, This is perfect. I got my summer business. Opposite of my winter business, that's great. And then we haven't had like an speaker-1: Yeah, that was the last year we had snow. speaker-0: Yep, twenty twenty three. So I got my s my setup all super nice and just really pimped out, ready for ready for the next season, and it was just dead. And so the second winter I didn't really have much going on. just kind of did some odds and ends things here and worked on my business, you know, getting things a little bit more clean and and you know getting some processes nailed down that I wanted to improve and stuff. but then by By the third winter, I I just started you know, I worked for Timbercraft Homes for for a c about a year and a half as as well. And then last winter what I ended up doing is I turn I converted my s my I stammer move steamer to double operate as a ground thawing unit. So so now I can kind of like thaw out people's septic systems if they freeze, thaw lines out, I can get pads ready for concrete if people are kinda late to it or want to get an early start on it in the spring. and that's been surprisingly busy. so I'm hopeful for another busy winter w using that. So speaker-1: What's nice is it is those problems are opposite of the the snow problems. Exactly. Typically if we don't have the snow, that's when we're getting those lines freezing. Yeah. speaker-0: You're the first person that's

ever made that connection without me pointing it out. speaker-1: that's perfect. Same tool you just r realize. So that's speaker-0: Literally just a valve, I just switch and it runs as a ground thawing unit, switch it over and it's a steamer. So speaker-1: So next year if we get a pile of snow, yeah, hey, septics are gonna be happy 'cause they're insulated and good and you know, just speaker-0: People's houses are gonna be leakings. speaker-1: go Yeah, so you go get rid of eye. Yeah, that's pretty cool. So what do you do with you you know, when you're doing the ground thawing, what does that business look like? speaker-0: Yeah, so you know, kind of responding to, you know, any emergency thawing services. So like if you have a water line that's frozen, or like a septic system that's frozen, those types of things, and you need to thaw the ground around it to maybe service it, dig it up, those types of things, or getting, you know, frost to get out of a out of the ground to get ready for a concrete pad to be poured or you know, those types of things. That obviously nobody's really pouring concrete in December, but unless you for some reason had to, but yeah, like usually it would be more like late spring where there's still frost on the ground, but you know, the road restrictions haven't been on yet. So a contractor's like, Hey, I'd love to get a jump on this project and get the basement poured so we can get it thought out and then you know, get concrete poured before road restrictions and then builders can start. So that's, you know, it's more of a late spring thing for that. But yeah. speaker-1: And then again, it it is sweet that your snow and ice removal equipment can be retooled for when yeah when there is no snow. Which is perfect. speaker-0: Exactly. That's great. Yeah. speaker-1: So that kinda is what your winters are looking like now. Yeah. Yeah. you know, what are you looking forward to is in the next, you know, season or your business? Do you have any big plans to expand or change or or just kind of hitting your rhythm now? What what do you what's it look like? speaker-0: You know, I I I'm I'm terrible because I'm like anytime I find comfort, I'm like, all right, now it's time to grow. And my wife is always like, pump the brakes. Yeah. Let's just enjoy it for a minute. You know, so I'm trying to get better at like knowing when the right time is to grow and yeah, like you said, hitting my rhythm. So I feel like this this summer I've been in a really good rhythm. so I'm trying to like kind of let that roll into winter. and then next next year I I have a couple of things in the works for growth and one of the things that I need to do is I really need a pole barn at my house. my garage is packed like a hoarder's house, full of equipment and supplies and and junk that I need to get rid of. And so I I need room to kind of give myself some t area to spread out and stuff. So that's gonna be a pretty hefty expense coming up 'cause it's gonna be a

forty by sixty with sixteen foot walls and that's kind of growth item number one. is get that done and and and then speaker-1: Relieves some stress at home too. Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah, and g let my wife park in the garage again, so speaker-1: Yep. You know, if if there was one thing you could look back on, you know, that you could tell yourself as you were starting this business out to do differently, have you been able to identify anything like that? Yeah. speaker-0: Yeah. I definitely started a business overconfident that like, yeah, I got this, it's gonna be easy. Like super, like I went to school, like I I thought this is gonna be easy. And some things were, but I think that one of the things that I probably tell myself is like make a plan and try not to deviate from it. Like on one hand, you if you're gonna be an entrepreneur, you do have to like know when the right time to see an opportunity is. But like No decision comes without consequence, whether it's positive or negative, or it's like something else happens because you made that decision. And so I would just kind of try to tell myself, like, really acknowledge the the personal life implications of your business decisions. Because like it I mean, sometimes you're gonna have a decision that like might be the what your company needs, right? It might be the best thing for your company. But it's going to increase your time that you need to work, or it's gonna make your family, personal finances struggle a little bit for a little while. And so it's like not always worth the the risk, even if it like for the financial stability of the company, it might be the right choice. So like you gotta look at the whole big picture. and that's something I did really poorly in the beginning is I was like looking like what's best for my business. And that's that was my like my driving factor. between any decisions that I was making. And then it was, you know, a couple of years later I was like, this is all the re all the ways that like my family has had to sacrifice and been suffering because like we I've, you know, I've put either too much risk out there for us or just like given my workload so much that like it pulls me away. And I need to I need to also be a dad and a husband and like take care of my house. And also run by business. So it's kinda like, you know, just slow down a little bit, you know, and it's opposite of what our culture like encourages and celebrates is like, you know, don't sleep, stay on the grind, you know, hustle, hustle, hustle. Yeah. And it's just not good for your mental health. And a book that I read was The Ruth Ruthless Elimination of Hurry. Don't know if you've ever read that book, but it was like life changing, honestly. just a really, really good book and was helpful for me to put into perspective of like, okay, well, you can get to a place where you can manage what you have and, you know, have growth have growth be like a byproduct of that, but like it's okay if it takes a

little bit longer. You know, don't let your family suffer. So that's what I would tell myself five years ago. speaker-1: Yeah. It's it's funny because I think the the people who are entrepreneurial and you know make the leap to actually starting their own business. Yeah, they are kind of delusional in that like, this is gonna be easy. Yes. I think that's really common. You brought that up. But I I I think if we didn't sometimes think that, we probably wouldn't make the leap. Absolutely. And then we're at like, okay, at least we got one foot in already. We better figure it out now. Yeah. But yeah, it is kind of funny how Common that thread is. Like it is. It was gonna be really easy. It wasn't. Yeah. I kind of regret some of it, but now we're now we're figuring it out. Yep. speaker-0: My wife always she's she's a really smart girl and she is funny 'cause I I found in a notebook that we had written down like s business startup expenses and we laughed at it 'cause we were grossly underestimating what it's actually gonna cost to start the business. It was like five thousand dollars and I just was like not even close. And speaker-1: You're like that's for like one thing. Yeah, exactly. speaker-0: Exactly. And like that just gone right away. And so, but you know, she recognizes she's like, Well, I'm glad that I'm glad that you had that fire in you to start it and to k to kind of get it up and get it going. But now it's like, thankfully we're we're we're learning and we're trying our best to kind of, you know, do to do this well. And so, it's time to to s you know, kind of pivot away from the the mentality that's required to start a business is so different than what is required to run a business. And I do think that's a lot of a lot of the reason why you see a business like a first generation business can often only look so good because you you have that person that starts it that's got that like that fire that they're really high risk. They're like like my dad is somebody who's like can will figure a way to get to get the job done. Like he never is stumped. He's like, Well, whatever it costs, whatever we gotta do, we're gonna get the job done, right? And there's so much tenacity that comes with that. And you have to like like he's built so different than like typic the typical second generation that person that comes in and gets to kind of like be involved in the business and then sees like, okay, well, now that we have this here, how can we manage it? Like, you know, a little bit tighter and stuff like that. And then it's like, okay, then then that's when you experience like that next, you know, peak of growth. And so so speaker-1: And it's har it's hard because yeah, d different skill sets. Yeah. And if you're in that second generation but you don't always have that grit to get through it, yeah. That that's where things will fall apart too. And my dad's pretty my dad's pretty similar in that he'll he'll tell you like, I don't know what direction to

go, but we'll let's pick one and start. Yeah, that's the thing. Like we're gonna go. And speaker-0: Both are needed. speaker-1: 'cause I can get analysis paralysis and think about something for forever and six months pass. And you miss the opportunity. Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes you have to just start on it, but sometimes every time well, not sometimes, every time, like like you said, every time you say yes to something, you're saying no to something else. Yeah. Yeah. And it's it's hard to know what those are. And speaker-0: It is really hard to know. speaker-1: and it's funny too, because I think of even me, you know, you say, what would you have told your your younger self? And you're like, Would I have even listened? I know I think I have that too. And and it's like I I naively think too, like having kids, like, now like I went through that as a kid. Like I'll just tell them how it is. And like they don't have to figure they don't have to do the dumb thing. And you're like, that's right, that's not how that actually works. Sometimes you gotta do the dumb thing and figure it out yourself to like, right. And then you think, I can tell somebody this. Yeah. It but will they listen? Yeah. That's a harder harder. speaker-0: That's what's so tough. And I feel like it wasn't until I became a parent and saw like I feel like nothing is more fun than parenting, but like having kids, but nothing is more humbling than that too. Cause like all I like I see my kids and I'm like, man, they're just like unfiltered versions of me. You know what I mean? Like I see how like especially my youngest Baron is so similar to me personality wise. And like he's he's like gonna do what he's gonna do. He Is totally okay with making mistakes to where we can't even hardly teach him how to swim because he's like drowning, but he like doesn't want help. speaker-1: Don't help me. speaker-0: I'm like, buddy, you're too you can't be in there, you can't be in the deep water yet, you know? And and so I I'm like, I see that and I'm like, man, I am so much that way where I'm like, you know, I'm so I I need to get better at like taking advice and and like speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: just not being so hard headed and stuff like that. But it's like, you know. On one hand, it's like sometimes you need that mentality and other times you don't. But like, yeah, I just feel like I I'm definitely somebody who leans more toward the I'd rather I'd rather try and fail. And like I'm totally okay failing. I wanna do it my way. I wanna like fail and learn and get better. But it's like you don't necessarily need to fail if someone else has been there and is like, dude, I know exactly what you're gonna do. Just listen for a second, you know? speaker-1: I just heard something that the the difference between knowledge and wisdom is knowledge is knowing that a tomato is a fruit. And then wisdom is knowing that it doesn't belong in a fruit salad. Like speaker-0: that's a good one. speaker-1: that. So you can

apply that in a lot of things 'cause like you can have that knowledge, like I shouldn't do this. Yeah. And then realize like knowledge is or the wisdom in that is knowing like when not to do that. Yeah. Or when to, you know, disregard that and go all in. speaker-0: Sure. speaker-1: And that's the that's the hard part. speaker-0: It is, yeah. Hard to find that balance. speaker-1: It's always easier after the fact. Yeah. Kind of wrapping up here. you know, looking at the last thing, we I think you just gave us a lot of great advice, but we wrap up with what's called the toolbox takeaway. Sure. Section where if you have some sort of scripture or words of wisdom or a book that you you can recommend to our listeners that that helps you maybe every day or has been a really pivotal in your life. speaker-0: Sure. well yeah, just another plug for that book, Ruthless Elimination of Hurry. I can't remember the name of the author. whether you're a business owner or not, I think it's really good to read that book. something that it really touches on is that like time is a currency. And like, you know, you might want to build a certain life or obtain a certain thing, and it's like Instead of looking at life in terms of like that's gonna cost me $2,000, like that's gonna cost me how many hours of my time? And like, is that the right way to spend my time? Is that where my priorities lie? And so something that I've been trying to get better at, like having on my mind more is like looking at everything as a time dedication rather than just like a financial dedication. because like time is so important with your family and you know. w whatever you like to do and rejuvenate and stuff like that. So making sure you're giving giving yourself space for that. But I guess, you know, I th when you had asked me this question earlier too, like you know, I had said like one I I can't I can't answer it one way and I kinda gotta break it into part into two different ways. Yeah. so something that was really helpful for us on the personal side of be being a business owner is having what we call our self employment contingencies. And so, Danielle and I sat down and we were like realizing that we weren't exactly where we wanted to be and that like I was working too much and we didn't feel like it was like we were where we wanted to be financially and stuff like that. And we were just like, well is this working? Like what do we gotta do differently? And so what we did was we sat down and we came up with a list of like stuff that we agreed on that has to be like these contingencies have to be met if I am to become a be a business owner. I can't I actually brought them with me today too, but like one of them is business growth can't come at the compromise of like, well, if I wanna purchase that thing for my company, I will work extra time, extra hours, extra weekends so that I can earn the money to pay for that. Like business growth has to come after we have a good savings account. Our goal is to have six months of our living expenses in our savings account so that if tragedy were to strike like it did this summer for us, we have we have flexible, you know, finances there. and so like business growth can't come at the expense of you know, personal finances suffering. We have to have our our bills paid for. We have to have like a a steady income stream coming from the business. that can't be compromised. you know, our operating capital, like I have a certain amount of dollars in my business checking account that I I don't let it dip below so I can make sure that I have money to pay all my business bills and stuff. And I can't use that for business growth. Like all these other things that we like agreed on were smart moving forward. And what that did for us was it provided a lot of clarity and relieved the tension between us because I'm high risk and she's moderate risk. Right. And so I've put our family in like tough spots when I'm like, this is a great opportunity, and we jump on it. And then it's like, I gotta work to be able to make that money back or or whatever. And so what it's done is Danielle can kind of sit back and be like, All right, well, we agreed that like you you should be allowed to pursue growth growth for your business as long as like our personal life is stable and like the way that we want it to be. So, like, go for it, you know? And so then, like, I have like she's on my side. We're not like, you know, at each other's throats about it and things like that. And so we can, yeah, we can just have like something that's like a basically a non-interested third party that keeps us both accountable, right? And so we like make decisions measuring against that, and it changed everything about how we move moving forward. so I would tell anybody, like, you know, take something like like that, you know, make it fit your family or your situation or whatever, you know, whatever. It doesn't have to look exactly like it does for for us, but like have something that helps guide your decision making. Because if you're just gonna make decisions responsively, like responding to anything that's around you, it's gonna be really hard to be proactive and like have a actual plan. And then on the the business side of things, I think that the the best takeaway that I could give is like f figure out a good mission for your company. You know, what's your company's goal? What are you actually trying to pursue or achieve here? And run your company and make your decisions aligned with that. I mean, it's a really like honestly a really basic business principle. Like if any if anyone's gone to business school or anything like that, they're gonna talk about it. It sounds really generic, but it's so I think it's so wise. 'Cause speaker-1: And probably the the most difficult part about that is that it requires you to stop speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: and think. speaker-0: And sometimes say no to things that are can be masked as an

opportunity or even just objectively a good opportunity. But if it's not in line with your company's vision, then like is it it's likely not worth pursuing. And a company's mission can change and evolve over time, you know, as business grows and stuff like that. But at the bottom line, I think you need to have something to measure against because Otherwise it's just too easy to say yes to everything if you're a high risk, yeah, opportunistic person. And then you can get into trouble. speaker-1: Well, because you can see so many opportunities out there. Like, hey, I there's a need for somebody to paint lines and parking lots. Yeah. But if you do that, that's gonna cut into the time you can do inspections. Right. Yeah. Or like, hey, I could sell ice cream too. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Right. Inspections and ice cream. Exactly. Like it's super profitable, high margin, whatever. Yeah. But like, does that align with what you're trying to do in the direction you're trying to go? Yeah. And and then even touching back with, you know, being on the same pages. you know, a spouse or a a business partner. Yeah. I mean, in in small businesses, a lot of times your spouse really is your business partner. Absolutely. And speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: and 'cause that's directly impacting your family, your finances. But it gives each of you permission to one, if you have that standard you're living up to, like, hey, Danielle, you have permission or you're you can be trusting of Walker because he's going to hold this, yeah. This line. And then Walker, like you can Grow this business because you know that you're meeting these requirements that you've agreed to. Everybody's on the same page. And then you don't even have to have that tension or conflict. Like super easy. You don't even have to hardly think about it. Yeah. You don't have to say, Well, does that mean how many weekends and nights and later nights? And or maybe we're not gonna go on vacation. Yeah. But really it's it's no no, it makes sense. I can just go do this. Yep. It's in alignment with the direction you're trying to go. speaker-0: For sure. speaker-1: Yeah, th those I really like. Challenge you guys to to send something like that if you're in and if you have a business. Walker, where can people find you? speaker-0: Yeah, you know, I'm not super active on online, but I do have I do have a Facebook page for my business and a website. Yeah, sure. Okay. speaker-1: We'll post those links below and and so you guys can find that. Yeah. And if you have questions you can always just reach out, give a call and yeah, septics are important, guys. They are. You're gonna wanna make sure they're they're working. speaker-0: Yeah, not a fun thing to spend money on, but it's important nonetheless. speaker-1: Yeah, it's it's well worth that when when you go to flush the toilet or take a shower. Mm-hmm. That needs to be going to the right place. speaker-0: Yep, for sure. speaker-1: Well again, Marker, thanks for stopping by and sharing some insight and we'll we'll talk soon. speaker-0: Cool, that sounds great.