KOPYA NG SALIN 🔗
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We're welcome to the show, Emily Swallow.
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How's it going?
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I'm very happy to be here.
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Excited to talk to you.
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Great.
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So how did you first get the pass as the armorer in The Mandalorian?
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Well, um, I audition for about a hundred different things a year.
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And if I'm lucky, I get one or two of them.
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And this was just another audition that I had.
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It was one of the few parts, I guess, that they were auditioning because, you know, John had so many fabulous people that he'd worked with in the past that he wanted to work with again.
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And it was very vague, the description for it.
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It was, it just said that she was a Zen-like leader of a group of people in hiding and that you would never see her face, but it didn't say why.
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So I took that very little amount of information and um created my own world around it and went into the casting office.
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And uh during the course of the audition, the it was just me and and the casting associate with the camera, Jason Stamy, and uh he said, you know, they're seeing a lot of older British women for this part.
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So would you do it with a British dialect?
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And fortunately, I've done a lot of that in various theater roles and in Castlevania, so I was prepared.
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So yeah, we just we did it that way a few times, and he gave me a little bit of direction and it felt fine.
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You know, I knew so little about it, I didn't know if I'd like nailed it because I didn't really know what it was.
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And then I got a call a few weeks later saying that they would love to use me, and they weren't quite sure what the part was yet, but would I be interested?
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And I thought, well, yeah, it sounds like an adventure, and it had amazing people involved, and it was a chance to create something new in the Star Wars universe.
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So I said, Yeah, I'm game for that.
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And here we are.
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Yeah, and your character has a very distinctive voice, doesn't she?
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She does, yes.
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She is whenever I am inhabiting her space, I get to speak much more calmly and much more slowly than I normally would, which is good for me.
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She's very calming.
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Um, because I, in my natural state, am just very, I gesture a lot and I'm very animated, and my voice goes all over the place.
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And so it it's been a real exercise in trust and restraint and really, you know, having faith that I can communicate what needs to be understood without pushing so hard, which has been a really lovely thing to explore.
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Definitely for this character.
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It feels right for her, but it also, you know, I always get a little bit of life lessons from my characters, and that feels like something that I should apply to life as well.
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Just don't, you know, don't feel like you have to push everything.
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With the actual costume, I mean, did you have any idea what it would look like?
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Did you see a drawing before um you were on set?
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Or before I was on set, yes, but um not until quite a ways in.
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And they I had several fittings and they like made a cast of my torso before I ever knew what it was gonna look like.
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And then in one of those fittings, I think they just didn't realize because what happens with these projects, they're everyone's under so much secrecy, you're never sure who knows what.
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So they were sort of assuming I knew what we were doing together, and um I did not.
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And so then someone showed me a sketch and it just it took my breath away because I had no idea that it was so I mean, it's so regal and it's so um kind of primal with the fur.
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And I personally think that I I have the best Mandalorian armor.
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I really I dig her style.
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So even though it's not the most comfortable thing to wear, it is absolutely worth it.
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Yeah, and when you first are introduced to your character, she's doing the armor, isn't she, for the Mandalorian.
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I thought that was a really good scene.
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She has to make a lot of armor.
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It seems like it's just her around there, so she keeps busy.
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And what were some of your favorite scenes as the character?
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Oh gosh.
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Tricky question.
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Well, I mean, it ranges everywhere from I mean, I remember in season one just having the delight of getting to interact with Grogu at the end of the season and tell Dinjarin, okay, this is your mission now.
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You're in charge of this guy and you got to take care of him.
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That was very satisfying.
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I love also that first the first time we ever see her fight against the stormtroopers, because you don't expect that.
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I think everyone sort of thought, well, even though she's a
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Mandalorian and the Mandalorians are warriors, it seems like she's more of a pacifist.
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And I think that that moment showed so much power, both because of the what she was able to do, but also realizing that she keeps that in, you know, she doesn't just go off on people as soon as she's triggered.
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And I think that that really speaks to her strength as a leader.
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And then I I really enjoyed in season three the scene between that Katie and I shared between Bo and the Armorer, where I told her to remove her helmet because it's it's such a subtle scene, you know, there's not a whole lot going on, but it's so important and it's such a moment between the two of them.
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There's so much riding on it.
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You wonder, and she and I talked about it, you know, neither of them really knows whether they can trust the other one.
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And so they're really taking a chance and and kind of embarking on the next part of this journey together, and I love that.
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I just thought it was so so beautiful that they were willing to trust each other that way.
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Yeah, and your character really grew, didn't it?
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Because in the first series, you had a few episodes, but then um by the third series, your character was in it a lot, wasn't it?
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Wasn't she?
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Yeah, and then honestly, it made me kind of nervous because I feel like she's a character who benefits from a lot of mystery, you know.
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And so when I of course I was thrilled that they were going to use me more in season three, but I was also nervous about it because I thought, well, what if what if we see too much of her and what if it makes her less interesting?
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But I John and Dave are such incredible, brilliant storytellers, and I think that they found the right calibration, and it was and I was obviously very happy to get to do more.
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And what's that like when you film on the set of Star Wars for people who don't know what's it like?
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Yeah.
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I mean, I don't know where to begin.
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What's my frame of reference for someone who's just never been on any kind of set at all?
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Or well, how does it differ from sets that you have been on, for example?
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Well, definitely the tech element plays a much larger part into it.
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And because of the scope of the show and the amount I mean, it feels to me like filming for anything is always rushed.
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Like it's amazing to me how long it can take to get a project off the ground.
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And then once you're going, it's like hurry up and get it done.
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So organization is very important.
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And what really impressed me because we were at most most of the time, we were shooting two episodes at once.
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And there were two different camera crews.
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Um, we would go back and forth between sets.
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We were shooting the season out of order, which is not unusual, but the tech element is definitely different.
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And what was so helpful, and again, it just speaks so much to John and Dave as storytellers and as good team captains, I think, is that every day started with us sort of having a little putting our heads together, saying, What's the story that we're telling today?
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So that we didn't get lost in the hours of having to wait for the volume when it had a glitch, or you know, how long it takes to get people in special effects makeup or get them in armor.
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And with the volume, it is much easier to get caught up in the world because you have so much of it available around you as opposed to a green screen where that's not being projected on there till afterwards.
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But it's still, you know, it's it can be pretty disorienting.
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And so it's so helpful to know.
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I I just never doubted that everyone around me was totally focused, totally generous and giving.
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Um, and that we we are we all were trying to hold on to the heart of the story, no matter what fancy tech elements were happening, no matter what like imaginary thing we were having to watch fly through the air.
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And everyone had a good sense of humor about it, even when there were technical mishaps, because there were some days when there would be a glitch with the volume with the computer, and so we'd just have to wait for several hours and hope that it was going to get resolved.
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And, you know, everyone's wearing their armor, and we we definitely made up a lot of stupid songs and a lot of alternate scenarios for these characters.
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Um, and it it's just such a I love everyone that I got to work with so dearly, and I just I'm in awe of how much heart and effort and skill everyone was willing to put into it.
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And what's it like wearing the armor?
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What's it like wearing the helmet?
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It's very awkward.
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You can't see much.
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You know, you can't see peripherally, you can't really see down.
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And we realized quickly that you couldn't, because the the helmets draw so much attention, you can't really like glance down to see where you're going because it looks like a huge gesture.
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So I would definitely, when I got to the set, I would, without my helmet, you know, make sure I walked around, sort of had a good feel for how far apart everything was, and then I just did my best once I put it on.
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Um, and my armor is definitely not the heaviest or the most cumbersome, but it's not super free in terms of um allowing movement.
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And I I know like on days when I had to hammer a lot, that would get really uncomfortable because it just didn't, everything would chafe.
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And but everyone had such a good good sense of humor about it, even when they were uncomfortable, partly because I think it all of the the armor looked so magnificent.
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So we knew no matter how we felt, we looked good, and you know, vanity helps in those situations.
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Yeah, I definitely I agree with you actually.
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I think your helmet is probably the best Mandalorian helmet.
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Well, thank you.
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Yeah.
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So you were also in the FET series as well, uh briefly for one episode.
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That was good.
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That was a good episode.
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Yeah, I was excited about that because I wasn't in season two of Mando at all.
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And then they called me, and once again, it's it's so you never know exactly what they're calling you for.
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And it sort of felt like it was the next season of Mando, but I hadn't heard anything about that happening, and I didn't have a script.
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I just knew they wanted to use me for something.
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So Brendan Wayne, who is like the main one who's in Dinjarin's armor, he's always been my inside source.
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So I I messaged him and I was like, What's going on?
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And he said, Well, you're gonna be in an episode of the Book of Boba Fett.
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And I was like, Oh, okay.
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I still don't really get it because I don't know why I would be, but great.
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Um, so yeah, that was, I mean, it sort of feels like that was uh an episode of Mando inserted into the Book of Boba Fett, but I loved that one because I loved all of the lore that I got to uh communicate.
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And my theater background really came in handy for that because it was, you know, the armorer sometimes speaks in these very long and sort of uh ornamented passages when she's telling stories of the songs of Eon's past.
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And so to be able to break down that text and make sure I knew like what all the
images were and communicated in a way that didn't just stop the action or that didn't just get lost in all the details, that was definitely helped by all the Shakespeare that I've done and you know all of that text work.
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So that was gratifying too, to say, like, oh wow, I never knew when I was doing gads of Shakespeare plays that it would come in handy for Star Wars of all things.
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Oh, it definitely did.
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And yeah, he has to go to the wells, doesn't he, or Mandalore um in the third series.
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Yeah.
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I mean, your character does play a big role in it, really, um, for him, the main character.
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Well, yeah, I feel like she's she's definitely sort of his Yoda, you know, she's the one mentoring him.
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And I love the way she does guide people.
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I think she's one of the best kinds of mentors because she doesn't shove you along your way.
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She knows that it's more valuable for you to figure out what the way is as you are going.
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And sometimes that means taking missteps.
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You know, people were so mad at me after that episode of the Book of Boba Fett when I told him he had to go bathe in the the living waters, and they were like, Why'd you do that to him?
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That's so unfair.
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I was like, look, the rules are the rules.
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He knows what the rules are, and it could be that there's something on that journey that's going to be valuable for him.
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And of course there was.
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So I I do, and I I love, I love how their relationship deepened and how it felt like in season three they were more friends, and it wasn't quite as much of her being in a position of authority over him.
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He always deferred to her still, but I think he had earned a lot of her respect, and that was that was really enjoyable to to map out and to explore.
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This is the way.
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And what's it like when you go to conventions and comic cons and you meet the fans?
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Oh, it's wonderful.
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It's uh, I mean, my previous experience with a very passionate fandom is from Supernatural, and that was such a life-changing experience, and they are so invested and so generous.
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But you know, Star Wars has been around for almost 50 years now, and so that fandom is even vaster, and I think it it's just represented by every single age and nationality and demographic, and hearing how these stories have helped people at different times in their lives has just been such a gift, and hearing the impact that that the armorer especially has had on people, especially when I I get to meet young girls and young boys who are inspired by her and who see her as somebody to admire, that just means so much to me.
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And it's such a blessing, and it's so and it's also gotten me, it's given me a chance to travel all over the world, which is incredible.
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And I get to meet people from every single corner of the United States.
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I've gone to most of the continents, and just getting to experience that variety of humanity is really, really cool.
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Yeah.
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Uh do you think there'll be a fourth series of The Mandalorian?
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I honestly don't know.
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I hope so, but I have no idea.
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Have you seen the film?
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I have, yes.
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I went to the premiere here in LA.
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Nice.
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Yeah, I saw it too.
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It was good, wasn't it?
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I really enjoyed it.
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Yeah, I thought that they they scaled it up nicely for the big screen.
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And I mean, I've always I I'm so glad that that the series was on streaming and you could watch it at home, but it already feels like such a it feels like something that's made for a a big screen.
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So it was really fun to get to watch it in community that way and hear everybody cheering together.
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And I loved it, yeah.
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Definitely.
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And you've said about some of your favorite scenes.
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Do you have a favorite line that your character says?
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Well, obviously, this is the way is right up there.
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And I'm so glad that I have a catchphrase that is useful in many situations and easy to write, because I I write that on a lot of Funko Pops.
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Um, but one of my favorite things she says is uh we all begin as raw ore.
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We refine ourselves through trials and adversity.
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And I just think there's so much wisdom in that, and it's such a reminder that even when we're going through trials, there is good coming from it, and that life was never guaranteed to be smooth sailing all the time.
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And sometimes I think we benefit even more from the challenges than we do from the the times when it's smooth sailing.
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So I I do really enjoy that one.
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But yeah, she says a lot of pretty smart things.
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She's a smart lady.
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Yeah, she is.
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And um apart from Star Wars, what are some of your other favorite roles that you've done?
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Definitely Amara in Supernatural.
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Again, somebody who I mean, I loved the arc that she had because she started out as sort of the baddie of the the season, but you could understand why she acted out the way she did.
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I always tell people, I do not condone smiting people and sucking their souls, which is what she did.
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But I can understand why she didn't know how to handle her feelings because she'd been hurt and she felt misunderstood and she felt like nobody was really listening to her.
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And that's something that I think many of us can relate to at some point.
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And then I love that from that she she really grew and she was willing to make herself vulnerable and take a chance on trusting people.
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So I was so grateful that they gave her that journey.
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And I mean, I've I've just gotten to I've gotten to play so many great characters.
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Some I mean, some of my favorite things have been on stage.
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I did a couple of off-Broadway shows last year and uh got to tackle uh a role that's usually played by a guy in Richard II, one of Shakespeare's plays.
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Um, and that was tremendously gratifying.
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And uh earlier last year I did a uh new adaptation of a Molière play called The Imaginary Invalid, that was just ridiculous slapstick and idiocy.
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And I love that because I I get to play very strong, grounded characters, and I enjoy that, but I I just love the absurdity of people.
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And so I love doing comedy and getting to find sometimes what that line is between like somebody being very put together and very powerful, and then suddenly just falling apart, and the humor that's in that and the tragedy that's in that.
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I'm always I mean, I feel like my favorite parts are always like just whatever I'm doing at the moment, because I love to be working.
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Yeah.
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And with the armor, was there a moment where perhaps the helmet would have come off at some stage?
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I don't think so.
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I mean, look, I'm sure if they ever do it, I bet they'll have a great reason.
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But I kind of hope they don't simply because I mean there's there's two parts to it.
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As an actor, I'm sure it would be better for my career if I took off my helmet, but I think for the character, it doesn't serve the story because I think I don't know what we gain by attaching a person to this character who feels like she represents more than any one person.
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And I think there would be that momentary, you know, flicker of excitement of oh, that's what she looks like.
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But then what?
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Like who cares?
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I mean, unless they're gonna take it down some important backstory, which they might, I think it it just serves the character more if we don't know what she looks like, because then I think she's able to stand for so much more.
00:18:32.000 --> 00:18:34.000
So that that's where I've been with it.
00:18:34.079 --> 00:18:36.960
I and I honestly don't know if they will ever have her do it.
00:18:37.200 --> 00:18:41.119
No, but like you say, it adds a bit of um mythicalness to it, doesn't it?
00:18:41.200 --> 00:18:43.359
If you don't know what they look like underneath.
00:18:43.599 --> 00:18:45.200
But it's been lovely to speak to you, Emily.
00:18:45.279 --> 00:18:47.759
It's been great to see about the Mandalorian.
00:18:48.079 --> 00:18:49.599
I'm excited to come to Wales.
00:18:49.839 --> 00:18:51.759
I know that it's August 8th and 9th.
00:18:51.839 --> 00:18:52.160
Here we go.
00:18:52.319 --> 00:18:54.720
Comic-con Wales in Newport.
00:18:55.200 --> 00:18:57.759
And let me tell you who else is gonna be there.
00:18:57.920 --> 00:19:00.319
The Monopoly Comic-Cons are always great.
00:19:00.400 --> 00:19:04.319
And for anyone who's never been to a Comic-Con, it's just a great chance to go.
00:19:04.480 --> 00:19:16.319
I mean, first of all, I think it's a fantastic opportunity to meet other fans, and people build incredible cosplay, but you can meet different actors from your favorite shows and have conversations.
00:19:16.400 --> 00:19:18.400
You can get autographs, you can get photos.
00:19:18.559 --> 00:19:22.960
It looks like several of the ladies from Supernatural will be there, which I'm excited about.
00:19:23.039 --> 00:19:27.680
There's some wrestlers, Jamie Bamber from Battlestar.
00:19:27.839 --> 00:19:29.680
I worked with him on another show.
00:19:29.920 --> 00:19:32.160
Some great voiceover artists.
00:19:32.480 --> 00:19:35.359
But yeah, that's happening August eighth and ninth.
00:19:35.599 --> 00:19:35.839
Great.
00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:36.960
Well, we look forward to that.
00:19:37.039 --> 00:19:38.160
It's been lovely to speak to you.
00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:39.039
You too.
00:19:39.200 --> 00:19:40.079
Thank you so much.