KOPYA NG SALIN 🔗
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Welcome to Permission to Kick Ass, the show that gives you a virtual seat at the bar for the real conversations that happen between entrepreneurs.
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I'm interviewing all kinds of business owners, from those just a few years into freelancing to CEOs helming nine-figure companies.
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If you've ever worried that everyone else just seems to get it and you're missing something or messing things up, this show is for you.
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I'm your host, Angie Coley, and let's get to it.
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Hey, and welcome back to Permission to Kick Ass.
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With me today is my new friend, Kimberly Jarman Say hi, hi guys, I'm so happy to be here.
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We already spent a good amount of pre-recording time talking about our respective cats, which makes me incredibly happy for this conversation.
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So Kimberly has a new kitten addition to the family and, as usual, stella is sitting at my right hand preparing while we record this.
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But anyway, cat rants aside, please tell us a little bit about your business.
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Yeah, so I'm a performance coach for women.
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I help them, which that means I just help them perform at their highest potential, and we do it through neuroscience-based mindset work and neurochemically biohacking, like optimizing their neurotransmitters and their hormones so they can think at a higher level to reach their goals at a faster rate and avoid that burnout and chronic stress.
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I like that.
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That makes me curious, because I've heard a lot about biohacking and all of that stuff.
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I don't think I've ever heard about it from a woman's perspective.
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It's definitely usually dudes, and no shade or hate to you dudes.
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We just have different bodies, we have different hormones, so we need different solutions.
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Yeah, and I think also when you like hear the word biohacking out there in the wild west of the internet, you're talking a lot about like supplementing with, like a supplement or doing like a cold plunge right Like I'm talking about literally testing your neurotransmitters or hormones and going in and taking specific foods or specific supplements to target those, to optimize their levels.
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Can you tell me more about that?
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I'm just curious about this process.
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Yeah, so kind of to back up and like, why do I do this, why do I value this?
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So my business partner is a licensed naturopathic doctor.
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Her and I have a podcast and I was really obsessed.
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I was in a coaching the community.
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Like the lineage of coachings I came out of they're very seven, eight figure earners, right, and so I was like, okay, like this is possible.
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And so I started obsessing about entrepreneurs that are really successful, like Elon Musk, and so we were doing a podcast episode over that and I was like what makes, now that I know the model and I know how the human brain works and what like drives our actions and how we create results, like what makes Elon different?
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And Dr Carmen, just so casually, was like, oh, it's serotonin.
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Like, when our serotonin is in like this, like ideal window, it's so like it's so much easier for us to experience self-confidence and rejection resilience.
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When it's outside of that window, like rejection or value resilience whatever you want to call it is devastating for a lot of people.
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We're like Elon, you know, like what is the 100 million dollars per rocket that he sends up?
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Like, and he sent up what?
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Like we're almost like a 10 or something that have exploded.
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And and he's like, okay, this sucks, but let's go problem solve for this Right, just like that is the skillset to be a successful entrepreneur is like a the self-confidence, the belief, and B the rejection resilience.
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So I was like, oh wait, like this is a serotonin thing, like I've never heard of this.
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And so then we started chasing.
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I started chasing that rabbit trail and I was like, oh well, this is how, if our thoughts, our beliefs, if you will drive our emotions chemically, create our emotions, our emotions drive our actions and our actions create the results in our life, then we have to go back up to the belief line, the thought line, because that's where the waterfall starts.
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Right, if that's where my results are coming from, then why don't I just biohack my brain to get it to perform at a high level, where I can create self-confidence faster and easier, where I can have rejection resilience a lot more easier and instead of having to like, do a ton of mindset work to like it's just like a slow climb Right.
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And so when we got into that, it was like, okay, how do we do this?
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So we it's like you start with testing, like we do a urine and saliva test.
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We send them their home, we test it and measures all of their neurotransmitters, how much they're actually utilizing their hormones, because this is a whole system, right, like we can't isolate out just the neurotransmitters, because the hormones influence the neurotransmitters.
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Load full transcript
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So then we're testing those.
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Where are they at?
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How are they impacting each other?
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Now then?
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Because the human body, from a naturopathic perspective, is always trying to move back into health.
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It's always trying to heal itself.
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Right?
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That's very different than allopathic medicine, conventional medicine, which is symptom management, right?
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Naturopathic medicine is like the body has everything it needs to heal itself.
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First, we got to get out of its own way.
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Second, we have to give it the micro needs, trans and needs to create the building blocks for the cells to create the things it needs to to function at an optimized level.
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Wow, this is fascinating.
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I listened once upon a time when I was driving into work to another doctor.
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I remember the name of his program.
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It was fascinating.
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I know what to do, so why don't I do it?
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It was this whole like it was CDs back when you would like pop a CD in and drive on your commute, right.
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So I'm listening to this like eight series CD set, and he was talking a lot about this, about cortisol levels and adaptogens and all of these chemicals and these cells and these things that are happening in your body and what happens when they get out of balance.
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So I've always been a little bit fascinated by this Like was this something that you always knew you wanted to go into, or was it that meeting that really inspired you down this path?
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No, I will try to make this story as short as possible.
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Tell us the full story.
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It's all good.
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Coaches typically coach what they needed, coaching on, right, like we end up coaching our past selves.
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Right, my past self was very driven, but she was also like she was kind of lost.
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Like I went into higher ed because, like I, that's what I was supposed to do.
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I was supposed to get a full-time job and I needed to provide for my husband's dream, ex-husband's dream and I was miserable working for other people.
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I hated it and I was doing like my master's degrees in counseling and part of grad school was that we went.
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We had to go to therapy to experience it from the client side.
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When I get in there, I dig in and I'm like, oh, I do have a lot of trauma.
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Right, I kind of knew I did, but I had like religion was a coping mechanism for me and for my younger self to like get through the trauma.
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So like it was kind of bypassing that stuff for me.
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But I stayed in therapy for 10 years, my friend.
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Okay, I went through six different therapists in those 10 years and I was still struggling with depression and suicide radiation.
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Then we hit 2016.
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I lost everything in a natural disaster, got a divorce like got, of course.
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I had PTSD diagnosis slapped on me, right.
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So I was tail spinning and I ended up in the psych hospital in 2000,.
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January 2016 for suicide.
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And I get out of the psych hospital and I'm like, look, no one's coming to save me.
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No God, no human.
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If I want a different life, this is all on Kimberly, it's all on me.
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So I got to figure this shit out and therapy isn't working for me, obviously.
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I've been in it for 10 years.
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I'm an eight therapist Now.
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This is not working.
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So then I just started doing my own work of, like, reading books, and that's when I found coaching, went into the coaching world, learned the model that my thoughts were creating my emotions and my emotions were driving my actions and my actions were creating the world.
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I had never heard that, ever.
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Never heard it in grad school, I never heard it in therapy, and it was like what?
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So then I'm in like this cohort with all my like other classmates, you know, in the coaching world and like I could see some of them were making more progress than me, faster, right, and I was still um, I really wasn't dealing with depression anymore.
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But there was still a little bit of anxiety hanging around and I was like I'm coaching, I'm getting coached every week, I'm coaching myself, like, what?
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Like why is something still so hard for me, still versus other people?
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And so when Carmen and I had that conversation about Elon, it dawned on me I was like this is the problem.
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This is what I have struggled with all my life, because a little bit of the backstory is I've struggled with suicide ideation since I was 13.
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Do you want to guess what also happens around that time for females hormones.
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I started my period, right, that was my first period.
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So you look at,
like, my timeline, my lifespan, I'm also infertile.
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So then we started digging into hormones and I like I'm estrogen dominant.
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That means that my body doesn't produce enough progesterone.
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Well, well, guess what Progesterone is?
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What goes to cortisol and the sex hormones, and estrogen is associated with dopamine.
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So my body is like not, and estrogen dominance is associated with suicide ideation and depression and infertility and PCOS and endometriosis, right?
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So it was just like this aha moment for me.
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I was like this is why the mental health system is broken Like you're either I'm going in and I'm talking about my past and I'm leaving cycling the same shitty thought loops that are creating my reality, or they're trying to mend me up.
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And I had that's a whole nother conversation about SSRIs, right, and I'm still circling these shitty thought loops, like this is why it's broken.
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Like we have to help people, like new thought processes and new beliefs, but we also have to help their body have the neurochemicals available to be able to think and show up in the way they want to, because, side note, too much serotonin creates an anxiety state in the body.
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Too little serotonin creates an anxiety state in the body.
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So I think that's a very, very long answer to your question.
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But like, no, this isn't what I dreamed of.
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This was me trying to solve my own problems.
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Yeah, I think that's.
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That's fascinating.
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I think a lot of us wind up in business for that reason, like we're trying to solve some sort of problem, um, or we wound up like helping somebody solve their problem and realize that we were good at something and also not good at being employees, and then a business was born.
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I wanted to circle back to a couple of things that you said, like doing what you're supposed to.
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I feel like that's a common theme in these conversations.
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I followed all of the steps I did.
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Everything that I was told leads to happiness, leads to success, leads to fulfillment.
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And I wound up getting screwed over.
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You wound up in the hospital, I wound up living out of my car.
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Like a lot of us have this story of I'm doing the things that I'm supposed to do.
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Why am I still not happy?
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And it could be a lot of this.
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Like the
mental models are not in place to support you where you're at, there could be imbalances and things that are happening within your body that you don't entirely understand.
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And without that perspective and that holistic sense right, you have no idea what's going on.
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We're only just now starting to really talk about that holistic approach to all of this and how different levels of chemicals in your body impact different actions and different mindsets.
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And that leads me to the thing that I had a similar breakthrough on thoughts leading emotions right before I wound up living in my car because I'm running out of money.
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I'm living in Los Angeles at the time a very expensive city and I know that I'm going to lose my apartment and I don't know what to do next.
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So I'd be waking up at two o'clock in the morning, three o'clock in the morning, fully awake, you know, from dead sleep, fully awake, mind racing, thoughts, worries, right.
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And I instinctively developed this.
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I later learned it was kind of a meditative practice, but I would just say I don't have to think this right now.
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This is not actually helping me.
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The thing that would help me right now is rest.
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So I'm just going to breathe deep, strength, peace, faith in myself, and I would just focus.
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Every time my mind started racing, I would focus on those three things and breathing, and eventually I would nod off and wake up in the morning well rested.
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And that's, I mean, that's what anxiety loves to convince you that I need to solve this right now.
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And until I have a plan like this is not going to work.
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This is not going to work.
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I'm going to freak out, but, to quote one of my favorite lines from a Ryan Reynolds movie, of all things, worry is like a rocking chair Feels like you're doing stuff, but it doesn't get you anywhere.
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Yeah, this is fantastic stuff right and we hit like 32, 33, 34.
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And I'm like we're finally at a place where we can stop for a minute and like, look at our lives and be like that this is it Like, this is it?
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No, I have so much life ahead of me.
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This is not going to be what it is for the rest of my life, because I did what I was supposed to do.
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I did what society told me to do.
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They told me to go to college, they told me to get the degrees.
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They told me to go get the full-time job, get married, have the kids.
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Did it Cause I was expecting that this is what was going to make me happy, right, and I'm not.
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And that's what was like.
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I was so disillusioned.
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I was like this is not, like, this cannot be it.
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And I would sit at my desk and be like I know I'm meant for more.
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I was like I know I'm meant for more.
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I know I have more potential than this.
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This is not how I'm going to spend my life doing this, but I think so many women either go into careers because that's what they're supposed to do or because it's the safe option.
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I can't tell you, because I worked in higher ed.
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I cannot tell you.
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I could predict it.
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You could predict it down to the T of the percentages of girls that would come into higher ed.
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So about 11 years ago, 12 years ago, they would come in and you would know.
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Let me guess, you want to be a teacher, right?
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Then we had a shift, and so about I don't know, 10 years ago, they're coming in.
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I want to be a nurse and it's like it's the safe choice.
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I guaranteed a job and money, right.
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Well, your safe choice and what you're supposed to do.
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You're going to find yourself in 32, 33.
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Like, what the hell am I doing?
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Yeah, I used to always be jealous of those folks that had a plan and had such certainty for their lives until I realized exactly what you just said.
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They had a plan and they had certainty based on certain pressures or external expectations and guidelines on how to be happy.
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And they would wind up getting to the same place as me eventually, like where the hell am I going?
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What the hell am I doing?
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What even is my purpose here?
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And I don't say that in the depressive sense, but just that crisis of I don't know faith of purpose that we all have at one point, or sometimes multiple points in our lives, of like what even is this?
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Why am I here?
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What am I meant to do, god?
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It would be nice if somebody just came along and gave me a cheat sheet or an exercise or something.
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But you know, we just don't have the self-confidence at that point right, like we don't, especially as women, and I don't think we start developing like.
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From my coaching perspective,
self-confidence is four components trusting ourselves, believing in ourselves, your own back and being willing to fill all the emotions.
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Right, we haven't developed that in our twenties and it's like we start hitting our thirties and we got enough of like life bitch slaps underneath us.
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They're like all right, all right.
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I see you Like I got a little bit more confidence now to kind of stand up and be like I'm not doing.
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This little bit more confidence now to kind of stand up and be like I'm not doing this, no, yes, yes.
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Well, that's.
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It's so funny, like I think a lot of us, male and female, everybody we've been told that, like showing emotions is somehow weak, is somehow not strong.
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If you melt down, if you get too, if you've been pushed too far, if you know you have some sort of reaction that is not just straightforward, buttoned down and closed off, you can't see what I'm feeling, that you're somehow weak and I actually think that that leads to a lot of the health crisis and mental health crises that we face is pretending like those things don't exist and like we could.
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Just I talked about it in my book a little bit.
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It feels like we ever had one of those boogie boards or a beach ball or something, and you were in the pool and you were trying to hold it down under the surface of the water and eventually that thing pops out and uppercuts you straight in the face.
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There's science to back that.
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Like well, we resist, persist, like there are chemical reaction and energetic reaction inside your body that you can either process out or you can choose to store that, suppress it, resist it and it's gonna.
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It's just gonna like I don't know if you've read the body keeps the score, like it's gonna store in the body, you know, and it's like research.
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Um, I think doctor I can't remember his name he published research showing that emotions, if we will process them, when what that means is if we like, let's say shame, let's say shame comes in my I have a thought about shame or whatever it comes in my body, I fit with it and I like, I acknowledge, like, oh, this is shame and I feel it in my body I feel it right, here, right, and we sit there, we acknowledge it and we breathe through it and we allow it.
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It takes 90 seconds for that energetic reaction to dissipate yes, we're so uncomfortable with allowing it yeah, no, we gotta go distract from that.
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We gotta go get on netflix now.
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We gotta go scroll social media.
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Gotta go eat, gotta go vape, whatever your vice is
right because we want to get out of that emotion, sister.
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It's running in the background.
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Then, yes, and remember, your emotions drive your behaviors yes, oh my gosh, the the chuckle came from.
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When you said it's running in the background, my brain instantly imagined this like this meat computer, right, that's driving our little skeleton suit.
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And how often we've got programs running in the background of our actual computers that are just taking up bandwidth and energy and slowing things down and forcing a crash when the computer is overloaded and can't handle all of this.
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So I just got this instantaneous mental image of that and was like that's funny.
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It's so funny how timely all of this stuff is.
00:19:33.993 --> 00:19:37.779
I was scrolling through TikTok this morning and watched this wonderful creator.
00:19:37.940 --> 00:19:52.202
He specializes in helping young boys and young men process their emotions and he gave this young boy a medicine ball, a weighted ball, and he put something on the ground and he said this is your hopes, your dreams, your future.
00:19:53.006 --> 00:19:55.234
What is holding onto this anger going to do to it?
00:19:55.234 --> 00:20:01.298
And he has the boy hold the medicine ball right over this thing, his future, right?
00:20:01.298 --> 00:20:05.528
What are you going to do to your future if you keep holding on to this anger?
00:20:05.528 --> 00:20:07.540
Right, you're going to destroy it, you're going to explode it.
00:20:07.540 --> 00:20:23.329
You're going to drop this anger on it and everything is going to be destroyed, right, and that's not to be catastrophic or thinking, but these things, when we don't deal with them, when we don't acknowledge them, when we refuse their existence, when we don't allow them, they do blow up and center everything in our lives.
00:20:23.329 --> 00:20:30.076
And so it was so just gratifying and I got a little bit teary eyed seeing this little boy struggling to hold this weight and he goes.
00:20:30.076 --> 00:20:31.063
I have to put it down.
00:20:31.063 --> 00:20:38.727
And he put it down on the ground and I was like, oh, that feels like it healed something in my, my inner chest.
00:20:39.496 --> 00:20:44.027
Yeah, you know, I love like digging into, like the science behind emotion, so like anger.
00:20:44.027 --> 00:20:52.616
Anger is an emotion that says something unfair has happened to me and because of the chemical reaction from anger.
00:20:52.717 --> 00:21:37.705
It moves us to action, to right the wrong, yes, but if we don't close that loop like I don't really necessarily love the idea of like letting it go, because that is, it's a highly charged anger is like I like the idea of acknowledging it and then moving it out of the body with some kind of like movement, right, like going to a crossfit workout, you know, like intentionally, I'm doing this to move this emotion out, so then I can move back to my prefrontal cortex, which that's where critical thinking is, that's where logical thinking is, that's where thinking about goals and dreams all of that lives in the prefrontal cortex, right.
00:21:37.705 --> 00:21:45.516
But when we're like in anger and shame, like we're down there in the primal brain, and the primal brain is all about survival, that's it.
00:21:45.516 --> 00:22:01.903
It's that nervous system like fight, fight, fight, fight, fight, fight, fight, fight, freeze and fawn response, right, and it disconnects you from the prefrontal cortex because it's all about survival at that point.
00:22:01.903 --> 00:22:03.320
So that's what I want to circle back to.
00:22:03.320 --> 00:22:16.017
Like I chuckle when people like oh, you know, like those people like that have some like neurochemical things going on and like it's almost as if like there's like the elite that don't like there's this group of people that are not even at it.
00:22:16.116 --> 00:22:25.682
But like I've been doing this for a while and I can't even remember how many tests we have and I've I've coached men, so I have some men's samples on this right.
00:22:25.682 --> 00:22:30.577
Not one of them have come back in normal ranges and you want to know why.
00:22:30.577 --> 00:22:33.383
No one is the exception to the rule in this.
00:22:33.383 --> 00:22:41.018
Stress throws off all of your neurochemicals and your hormones, so no one is exempt to not being chemically balanced.
00:22:41.018 --> 00:22:48.001
I'm sorry, I know that breaks some people's hearts because they want to believe that only the mental or neurochemically imbalanced.
00:22:48.001 --> 00:22:48.943
Not true.
00:22:49.525 --> 00:23:08.505
If you experience stress on a pretty regular basis, I can guarantee you that you are not neurochemically balanced that's such a good point to make, because I feel like we create this mental dividing line between like good and bad, or successful and not successful, worthy and unworthy, based on some of these things.
00:23:08.505 --> 00:23:18.017
And then there's this societal capitalistic pressure to perform, earn your place in the world, do, do, do and like.
00:23:18.017 --> 00:23:30.580
We place a lot less value on being being a good human being, a good partner, uh, communicating with people, this innately human stuff that you don't really see happening elsewhere in the in the world.
00:23:30.580 --> 00:23:49.880
And then we feel this pressure of like, oh my gosh, I'm gonna get fired, and not to belittle anybody's job or the intensity of your feelings, but like, if we can zoom out right, if we can decenter ourselves from the universe I say that with all the love I have, because I can get this dramatic too right, does this really matter in a hundred years?
00:23:49.880 --> 00:23:52.567
Does this really matter in 50 years, in five years?
00:23:52.567 --> 00:23:55.401
Right, it feels life or death right now.
00:23:55.442 --> 00:24:10.803
And that's tripping us into this stress state where, you know, the the the lower the primal brain, like you said, is going I'm going to die, I'm going to die, I'm going to die, I'm going to die when the more intellectual brain realizes I might lose my job over this, but I trust myself.
00:24:10.803 --> 00:24:16.398
Right, there's that old um uh analogy of the bird doesn't trust a branch that it's sitting on.
00:24:16.398 --> 00:24:18.001
It trusts itself to be able to fly away.
00:24:18.001 --> 00:24:20.285
That's good.
00:24:20.285 --> 00:24:27.842
That's one of my favorites and that's I really want to get more humans, and especially more entrepreneurs and more creatives, to trust that.
00:24:27.842 --> 00:24:30.954
I don't trust this job to hold me up.
00:24:30.954 --> 00:24:33.500
I trust myself to lift myself up.
00:24:34.303 --> 00:24:36.047
That's where you find emotional freedom, right.
00:24:36.047 --> 00:24:38.378
That's where you find the freedom that we're all seeking, seeking emotional freedom.
00:24:38.378 --> 00:24:38.958
And that's where you find emotional freedom, right.
00:24:38.958 --> 00:24:39.788
That's where you find the freedom that we're all seeking emotional freedom.
00:24:39.788 --> 00:24:43.846
And that's like I don't advertise in my coaching program.
00:24:43.846 --> 00:25:04.188
I'm like we're gonna heal your relationship with yourself because nobody's like, yes, I'm gonna pay thousands of dollars for that, but that is like the ultimate end of the day, work right Is like we're healing your relationship with yourself so you can trust yourself more than anyone and you can believe in yourself more than anyways.
00:25:04.208 --> 00:25:17.909
Because when we have that like just neutralizes the world, like when I could develop that skill set of like trusting myself and believing myself in my own back right, most things are just I have.
00:25:17.909 --> 00:25:18.971
I have stress resilience.
00:25:18.971 --> 00:25:26.855
Now my brain isn't constantly receiving things as stressful because it always has this background thought which I thought it too.
00:25:26.855 --> 00:25:29.021
I can always figure it out.
00:25:29.021 --> 00:25:32.049
I'm a human that will always figure it out.
00:25:32.049 --> 00:25:36.344
So, like things just don't seem like that big a deal.
00:25:36.344 --> 00:25:50.807
But I've intentionally done the work to create that stress resilience, to retrain my brain to like okay, not everything is a threat, not everything is full, everything's figureoutable, right that is not my quote.
00:25:51.670 --> 00:25:55.078
I think I heard that first with Marie Forleo, but I've totally stolen it myself too.
00:25:55.078 --> 00:25:56.101
Everything is figureoutable.
00:25:56.903 --> 00:26:03.164
But when we live especially if you come from trauma right we live in chronic fight or flight.
00:26:03.164 --> 00:26:06.203
Our nervous system is chronically dysregulated.
00:26:06.203 --> 00:26:13.902
And when our nervous system is chronically dysregulated, then we're living in our limbic and our primal brain and things just become harder.
00:26:13.902 --> 00:26:17.622
I'm not saying that people can't create success without coaching or without my type of coaching.
00:26:17.622 --> 00:26:20.336
I'm not saying that people can't create success without coaching or without my type of coaching.
00:26:20.336 --> 00:26:22.502
I'm not saying that people do it every day.
00:26:22.502 --> 00:26:28.098
But my mission is like let's create success from a place of like.
00:26:28.098 --> 00:26:43.722
I desire this and I'm doing this because I desire it and because I want to contribute, not because I'm trying to prove myself and prove my worth, because that is where hustle energy comes from, that's where graspy energy comes from and that's where grindy energy comes from.
00:26:43.722 --> 00:26:56.662
And with an entrepreneur specifically, I think the percentage is like 70 to 80% of women that are entrepreneurs that hit burnout, receive an autoimmune diagnosis.
00:26:57.525 --> 00:27:04.097
Wow, that's terrifying.
00:27:04.097 --> 00:27:05.624
I mean I don't know how else to process that.
00:27:05.624 --> 00:27:12.509
That is really scary, because I think that that's serious enough to respect and to honor about ourselves.
00:27:12.509 --> 00:27:29.616
That, as we're out there hustling and grinding and seeking this external validation which nine times out of 10 arbitrary statistic I just made up right Never actually comes right, they don't give us the praise, they don't give us the awards, they don't tell us we've done a good job and yet we're constantly striving for that.
00:27:29.616 --> 00:27:35.377
So, like, at what point do you develop the internal fortitude to say I did a good job?
00:27:35.377 --> 00:27:37.843
I'm really proud of that work.
00:27:37.843 --> 00:27:41.916
I saw how that person reacted to this and that makes me feel good.
00:27:42.818 --> 00:27:50.160
Even if you were to get it honestly, as many female entrepreneurs as I've been around and worked with, it's never enough.
00:27:51.702 --> 00:28:03.845
It's about a seven, eight hour I'm making up a number right, less than 24 hours of like oh, I made it, I hit that six figure, I hit that seven figure, I hit whatever.
00:28:03.845 --> 00:28:04.951
It is Like I made it.
00:28:04.951 --> 00:28:13.817
And then, within 24 hours, we are already moved on to like feeling back to how we felt before and it's like okay, what's now?
00:28:13.817 --> 00:28:15.179
We have to like level up again.
00:28:15.179 --> 00:28:16.661
What's the next goalpost?
00:28:16.661 --> 00:28:30.229
And it's this chronic chasing, chasing, chasing that you'll spend your entire life doing, Unless you've learned how to heal your relationship with yourself and be your own validator.
00:28:31.438 --> 00:28:32.795
Well, it's interesting To me.
00:28:32.795 --> 00:28:50.842
This ties back to
imposter syndrome, which, you know, a lot of people tend to assume that that's reserved for people on the beginning or the growth stage of their journey, and I've been, fortunate enough, like I've been in the room, like you said, with seven, eight, nine figure entrepreneurs and beyond and I was I was shocked.
00:28:50.842 --> 00:28:51.903
I was shocked.
00:28:51.903 --> 00:28:56.359
I'm sitting there, my overachiever self, with my notes, ready to learn the secret.
00:28:56.359 --> 00:28:59.777
I finally got into this room and the secret is there is no secret.
00:28:59.777 --> 00:29:07.527
You encounter the same human problems in an upward spiral until the day that you die, right, it's the same issues that demand to be dealt with.
00:29:07.527 --> 00:29:16.715
It's a new level that is forcing you out of your comfort zone, which, by its very you know that existence of stepping out of your comfort zone.
00:29:16.715 --> 00:29:18.920
You feel like an imposter, like any day.
00:29:18.920 --> 00:29:24.135
Somebody is going to figure out that you've tricked your way all the way and it's going to come crumbling down Right.
00:29:24.135 --> 00:29:41.037
This actually came up recently in a LinkedIn thread Shout out to Stuart, if he's listening where he was talking about imposter syndrome, and I told him the funny thing about imposter syndrome is everybody, every single person out there that I have spoken to, experiences this constantly, chronically.
00:29:41.136 --> 00:29:43.568
They don't ever feel like they've gotten to a level where it's all right.
00:29:43.568 --> 00:29:51.202
I know what I'm doing and I'm sure that there are folks out there I haven't met them personally, but the majority of people seem to go I don't know.
00:29:51.202 --> 00:29:53.387
I don't know that I ever feel comfortable.
00:29:53.387 --> 00:30:02.549
And I told him I worked with a pretty big name, somebody that arguably had a very established business that one day he said we were doing a new launch.
00:30:02.549 --> 00:30:04.060
It was a new strategy.
00:30:04.295 --> 00:30:07.325
We were fairly confident it was going to work because he has a long, proven track record.
00:30:07.325 --> 00:30:13.142
But he just threw out there like this is the one, this is the one that I can't pay the mortgage and I can't afford the team.
00:30:13.142 --> 00:30:20.181
And I was like, oh my God, like I'm the head of your marketing team, and now I'm suddenly very scared.
00:30:20.181 --> 00:30:23.265
And he goes no, no, this is just, it's morbid humor.
00:30:23.265 --> 00:30:27.726
Right, the mortgage is paid off and we've got enough in capital reserves to pay the team.
00:30:27.894 --> 00:30:34.844
But like every time going into a launch like this, when we're especially when we're doing a new offer, I just feel like we're going to lose everything.
00:30:34.844 --> 00:30:36.428
It's going to fail.
00:30:36.428 --> 00:30:41.397
And then I told you know, in this LinkedIn conversation.
00:30:41.397 --> 00:30:55.278
I think the cool thing about that was it gave me the opportunity to recognize we all feel that fear, but some of us let us let it stop us and some of us feel the fear and do the damn thing Anyway we just keep moving on right, like it's just one step in front of the other, one step in front of the other.
00:30:57.122 --> 00:30:59.126
I remember my first coach was Brooke Castillo.
00:30:59.126 --> 00:31:05.278
I don't know if you're familiar with Brooke, right, extremely successful in the coaching world, I think like what?
00:31:05.278 --> 00:31:08.310
$56 million last year or something, especially in her business.
00:31:08.310 --> 00:31:19.384
I remember her telling me like Kim, look like the human experience, it's 50-50, right, she's like at a million dollars, still 50-50 for for me.
00:31:19.384 --> 00:31:22.556
When I hit 25 million, still 50, 50 for me.
00:31:22.556 --> 00:31:24.901
Here today, still 50, 50.
00:31:24.901 --> 00:31:30.278
So like you, just still, like I'm still I have a human brain and I experience the human experience.
00:31:30.278 --> 00:31:32.923
I experience all the things that all of you do.
00:31:32.923 --> 00:31:42.588
The money never fit, like no matter my level of success or money, like I'm not, not exempt from it, and I was just like okay.
00:31:43.471 --> 00:31:45.734
I love that, not exempt from it.
00:31:45.734 --> 00:32:05.472
And I think that applies to so many pursuits and so many vices that we use to try and feel good enough, right, the right relationship, the right job, the right status, the money, the car, whatever we're using to try and feel like enough, you know it's, it's not going to feel like enough until you address that relationship with yourself, like you said.
00:32:06.473 --> 00:32:09.017
I, I had a coach one time, I think it was.
00:32:09.017 --> 00:32:20.460
I had a coach one time I heard her say to a group of people she was like um, entrepreneurship is signing up for a lifetime self-development course.
00:32:21.886 --> 00:32:28.278
I laughed because that is, that was like well, the biggest realization to several years into me.
00:32:28.278 --> 00:32:33.317
Like I didn't sign up for personal development, I wanted to make money, damn it.
00:32:34.285 --> 00:32:54.955
Yeah, and with each new level becomes a new self-development like lesson, like it's just you either choose to do the self-development work and you sign up for entrepreneurship and, like I'm in for doing self-development and like constantly having to look at like these blinders and these insecurities and these wounds from childhood, or I choose not to do it and that's totally fine too.
00:32:54.955 --> 00:32:59.296
But my businesses are going to be successful as an entrepreneur if I don't do the inside work.
00:32:59.684 --> 00:33:05.195
You know the thought that popped into my head when you were saying all of that is are you familiar with Carol Dweck and mindset?
00:33:05.195 --> 00:33:18.046
Oh God, I was so fortunate
one day to have a mentor who flat out said, like he's listening to me, talk, complain, bitch, before being honest about these circumstances that I feel totally stuck in.
00:33:18.046 --> 00:33:26.297
And that was when I was transitioning out of my corporate job to freelance for the first time and he just casually and very lovingly threw out you know what?
00:33:26.297 --> 00:33:29.894
I think a good book for you to read would be Mindset by Carol Dweck.
00:33:29.894 --> 00:33:35.422
And I, you know, was in that phase of learning and growth where I was like, yes, I'm taking this recommendation.
00:33:35.422 --> 00:33:41.991
I got the book that day, I read through it and when I got to the end I was like, oh, I see what you were saying.
00:33:42.471 --> 00:33:47.218
That was a roundabout way of saying you're stuck in a fixed mindset, which is very much.
00:33:47.218 --> 00:33:48.598
I'm the victim.
00:33:48.598 --> 00:33:52.412
There's all these things out there that I can't control, that are working against me.
00:33:52.412 --> 00:33:54.560
I'm not responsible for this situation.
00:33:54.560 --> 00:34:07.558
I'm in Whereas somebody and that's a very rigid place to be, and we all know when you are very rigid, that's when things break in a very big way Whereas a growth mindset is a lot more flexible.
00:34:07.558 --> 00:34:10.777
It doesn't look to take ownership of an entire problem.
00:34:10.777 --> 00:34:15.893
Right, I'm not looking to blame myself for things that happen, but I'm also looking for my peace.
00:34:15.893 --> 00:34:25.951
And what's the part of this that I can control and what can I learn from this particular situation that I'm in that I can take and make my situation better, moving forward?
00:34:25.951 --> 00:34:31.936
Right, one of these is very victim, very stuck, very doesn't see the opportunities right in front of their face.
00:34:31.936 --> 00:34:34.753
Because, you know this, this door is not open.
00:34:34.753 --> 00:34:42.077
And one is very open to possibilities, including maybe I'm wrong about this, maybe I could do something differently, even if it's uncomfortable.
00:34:43.306 --> 00:34:44.429
It's like you're not alone, alone.
00:34:44.429 --> 00:34:48.047
That's like, in my opinion, the majority of I can only speak.
00:34:48.047 --> 00:34:51.536
I'm I've only lived in the us, so I will only speak of the us.
00:34:51.536 --> 00:35:11.875
It's the majority of us mindset, like that's what we have been conditioned to believe, that's what's been taught generation after generation, and like I'm not throwing shade to anyone, it's just that's the cultural mindset that we are brought up in is very much that mindset.
00:35:12.615 --> 00:35:19.117
Yeah, I described it similarly with people that I've coached as as a filter.
00:35:19.117 --> 00:35:25.668
Right, if you have come up as an employee which most of us in the States have, right, the whole education system.
00:35:25.668 --> 00:35:31.434
I'm not even going to go into that rant about how we're basically indoctrinated to be good workers, follow all the rules, get an?
00:35:31.434 --> 00:35:33.635
A right, that's a rant for another day.
00:35:33.635 --> 00:35:54.244
But, like, you're brought up to be a good worker to follow all the steps to get your paycheck, so that's the only filter that you have to solve problems when you go out on your own as an entrepreneur unless you happen to be raised in an entrepreneurial family or you took some sort of entrepreneurial classes that challenged that kind of thinking, right?
00:35:54.244 --> 00:35:58.394
So you can't beat yourself up for only working with what you know, because that's all you have.
00:35:58.394 --> 00:36:00.266
Like, how do you expect yourself to know what you don't know?
00:36:00.266 --> 00:36:00.827
Right?
00:36:01.068 --> 00:36:07.318
You don't, we don't know what we don't know and we, and if we don't know what we don't know and we, and if we don't know what we don't know, then we can't ask the questions that we need to ask.
00:36:07.318 --> 00:36:21.126
And I think that's why it's so, so important to have like mentors and or coaches, like cause they're going to help you be able to, like start seeing what you don't know, to start articulating the questions that you need to be asking.
00:36:21.126 --> 00:36:22.769
That's my personal experience.
00:36:23.391 --> 00:36:37.751
Yes, no, I totally agree with you on that, and I think it also ties into people who are in the newer stage of entrepreneurship who can often follow into this trap of I don't have enough expertise, especially in comparison to somebody else, like you brought up Brooke Castillo, right?
00:36:37.751 --> 00:36:39.237
Yes, we're both raising our hands there.
00:36:39.237 --> 00:36:41.525
Brooke is an amazing coach.
00:36:41.525 --> 00:36:44.653
I knew about her by reputation long before I followed her stuff.
00:36:44.653 --> 00:36:50.092
If I fell into a trap of going well, what kind of coach am I in comparison to her?
00:36:50.092 --> 00:36:57.978
I could super easily just get stuck in this anxiety spiral and just never feel good enough when the power comes from.
00:36:57.978 --> 00:37:00.753
Adjusting that mindset and thinking okay, what are my strengths?
00:37:00.753 --> 00:37:08.737
What's really good about the work that I've done, what have people said about me that makes me feel really good about my approach, and how can I keep getting better?
00:37:08.737 --> 00:37:10.967
Like none of these things are mutually exclusive.
00:37:10.967 --> 00:37:12.530
They all work together.
00:37:12.530 --> 00:37:16.367
That's what makes it super complicated to be human and be in business.
00:37:16.728 --> 00:37:32.052
Yeah, and you know, what's interesting on that is like I for some reason, I always I think maybe because I had a background in counseling I just always had this belief that I was like I'm a damn good coach, like put me head to head with Brooke and like I will hold my own.
00:37:32.052
--> 00:37:42.708
Where my gap was was in my belief in being a business woman, and that's where I fell into the not trusting myself, not listening to me.
00:37:42.708 --> 00:37:55.833
And like looking at these other like, let's say, business coaches that were making millions of dollars and thinking like this way, like they've done it, they've made the money, like they're better business women than me I have to replicate their way.
00:37:55.833 --> 00:37:58.713
And like I get into doing that right.
00:37:58.713 --> 00:38:10.731
And then it's like the business that I own is miserable because I built it like somebody else's business and it's not an alignment I didn't take into like consideration.
00:38:10.793 --> 00:38:20.688
Like I don't know if you're familiar with the Enneagram, I like it, but like the coach that I was following, which a lot of coaches do, like she's an Enneagram three.
00:38:20.688 --> 00:38:22.753
Well, I'm an Enneagram eight.
00:38:22.753 --> 00:38:24.958
We have very different personalities.
00:38:24.958 --> 00:38:34.764
There's no way I was ever going to be able to replicate what she did, but, yeah, I was using it as evidence for a couple years as to why I was not a good business person.
00:38:34.764 --> 00:38:37.746
I was never going to make it and I was just like.
00:38:37.746 --> 00:38:48.012
I guess that's part of the entrepreneurial journey is like that like growing and developing and like starting to see things a little bit more clearly and building that trust in yourself.
00:38:48.773 --> 00:38:54.693
Yes, and giving yourself permission to examine your own wants and your own needs, right?
00:38:54.693 --> 00:39:00.835
A lot of us don't know what we want and we're too scared to ask for what we want, so we just create this.
00:39:00.835 --> 00:39:05.070
Okay, well, that that seems like it's good enough to aim for and we don't examine that critically.
00:39:05.070 --> 00:39:06.853
Why am I going for that?
00:39:06.853 --> 00:39:08.840
What do I hope to achieve from that?
00:39:08.840 --> 00:39:13.592
I was on a networking call this morning where they asked that and it was like what do you want?
00:39:13.592 --> 00:39:15.045
What's your bigger vision from the business?
00:39:15.045 --> 00:39:17.070
And it was interesting.
00:39:17.092 --> 00:39:24.217
It was fascinating to me to see how many people the bigger vision for their business was tied to a lot of self-worth stuff.
00:39:24.217 --> 00:39:32.530
I want to be the first millionaire in my family.
00:39:32.530 --> 00:39:34.998
I want to retire my spouse oh, that's right, yes, and they're talking about all of that stuff.
00:39:34.998 --> 00:39:39.391
And then the host of this call says, okay, I love that, and how does this tie to your business?
00:39:39.391 --> 00:39:42.197
I mean, I understand that as a goal, but like what?
00:39:42.197 --> 00:39:53.413
Your customers aren't going to support you and being the first millionaire right, like that's, that's not the big vision, that's what you hope to get out of the big vision, but like why, what to what ends?
00:39:53.413 --> 00:39:54.695
How does this help you?
00:39:54.695 --> 00:39:56.907
How does this help the world Right?
00:39:56.907 --> 00:39:59.675
And got us to think deeper, beyond our personal wants.
00:39:59.675 --> 00:40:00.396
I don't know.
00:40:00.396 --> 00:40:01.038
I just love that.
00:40:01.925 --> 00:40:03.369
I knew I had a bigger desire.
00:40:03.369 --> 00:40:08.612
Like I knew the mental health system needed to be challenged, because I, in my opinion, it's not working.
00:40:08.612 --> 00:40:16.077
I mean, another number I can throw out there is we went from 22 veterans suicides a day three years ago to now we're at 31 a day.
00:40:16.077 --> 00:40:17.907
Again, it's not working.
00:40:17.907 --> 00:40:19.331
I, that was like it's.
00:40:19.331 --> 00:40:22.347
I started my business and I knew that was like the vision.
00:40:22.347 --> 00:40:38.938
But there was a lot of me trying to prove my self-worth and like I want to be in first millionaire, I want to be the first entrepreneur, I want to show my niece what's possible, Right, and it let me earn out because I was just constantly in like grindy, like graspy energy.
00:40:39.905 --> 00:40:44.452
Oh, I, I totally get that and I I remember being pushed at a business event last year.
00:40:44.452 --> 00:40:45.947
Shout out to Donnie and the badass business summit.
00:40:45.947 --> 00:40:46.289
Totally get that.
00:40:46.289 --> 00:40:47.454
And I remember being pushed at a business event last year.
00:40:47.454 --> 00:40:48.478
Shout out to Donnie and the Badass Business Summit.
00:40:48.498 --> 00:40:51.934
But I was at a point where I wanted to burn my business down and pivot hard and he caught that.
00:40:51.934 --> 00:40:55.427
I didn't really want to do that, but that's what I thought I wanted to do.
00:40:55.427 --> 00:40:58.996
I thought that would be easier than facing myself and what I wanted.
00:40:58.996 --> 00:41:00.507
And he pushed me.
00:41:00.507 --> 00:41:04.313
And he pushed me and he asked me why do you do what you do?
00:41:04.934 --> 00:41:27.226
And I, like, I started tearing up and I said because I don't want a single other creative person going to their grave thinking that they weren't good enough and like, especially as it pertains to people who are trying to make a living in the arts, who produce clothes or music or fashion or something that inspires the world, that exemplifies what it means to be human.
00:41:27.226 --> 00:41:34.550
What other species do you know that creates art, that just creates, to create stuff because it's beautiful and it's inspiring?
00:41:34.550 --> 00:41:36.534
Right, you can make a business of that.
00:41:36.534 --> 00:41:39.728
That's worthy and you can learn business.
00:41:39.728 --> 00:41:42.014
Business is a skill, just like we talked about.
00:41:42.014 --> 00:41:43.626
It's a skill and it's self-development.
00:41:43.626 -->
00:41:49.175
It's like 90% self-development and 10% skill, but you can learn it and use your art.
00:41:50.016 --> 00:41:54.251
yeah, I'm getting all verklempt yeah, I mean, I think that needs to be talked about more.
00:41:54.251 --> 00:42:00.449
Right, like all these are skill sets, just acquired skill sets.
00:42:00.449 --> 00:42:19.115
And I think one time it's funny, my massage therapist shout out to Kara, like I mean she was my former client, I had coached, so she was ninja and me and like using my coaching against me as she's massaging I was struggling with like worthiness.
00:42:19.115 --> 00:42:24.820
And she was like look, kim, like you are an incredible coach, but it's not because you went through these coaching programs.
00:42:24.820 --> 00:42:35.097
It's not because you went through these coaching programs, it's not because of your master's degree, it's innately who you are and those things enhanced.
00:42:36.045 --> 00:42:36.246
Those.
00:42:36.246 --> 00:42:40.657
Are you investing in that skill and bringing it to the surface and honing it?
00:42:40.856 --> 00:42:51.947
Right, cause I had this idea that like I was great because of the coaching programs, I was great because of my master's degree, not because of who Kim was, and she was like no, that was like that's innately you.
00:42:51.947 --> 00:42:54.452
Those things just enhanced who you are, that's it.
00:42:54.452 --> 00:42:55.735
But those things were you.
00:42:55.735 --> 00:43:03.090
And then I also look, you know I have a lot of trauma and so like there's certain things that I show up in the world, behavior patterns from it.
00:43:03.090 --> 00:43:07.063
Um, and then I ref reframed that too.
00:43:07.143 --> 00:43:16.413
I was like okay, trauma didn't create these behavior patterns, these behavior patterns were already like Kim, it just intensified those things.
00:43:16.413 --> 00:43:28.797
Right, and I could like kind of like put myself back together and see like oh, I am, like who I am is like unique, you can't replicate Kim.
00:43:28.797 --> 00:43:48.217
And no matter what happens in my life, whether it's trauma or like investing in things, it's just an intensification or an enhancement of things that already lie beneath, they're already in a of who I am, and that really helped me like overcome that, like worthiness, enough stuff.
00:43:48.217 --> 00:44:02.027
Cause it was like like it can never be earned, it can never be taken away from, like this is just like the innate soul DNA of me, that life either just like, enhances those things or intensifies not.
00:44:02.027 --> 00:44:03.530
It doesn't add to or take away.
00:44:03.530 --> 00:44:05.836
I love that you are the special sauce.
00:44:08.547 --> 00:44:20.532
You are the thing that makes your business, that makes your approach, that makes your perspective needed in the world, so desperately needed, Even if you feel like you're saying the same thing thousands of others have said before you.
00:44:20.532 --> 00:44:43.175
Your unique take, your unique perspective, that thing that makes you you is what's going to make it resonate and connect with the right person, and that's what I love about doing all this work and having these conversations like ah, I want to keep going for like five more hours because I feel like we could rant about some really good stuff, but instead I'm going to say, hey, we're going to sign up for a part two and, please, you've been a fantastic guest.
00:44:48.925 --> 00:44:50.809
So tell us a little bit more about your business and how we can work with you.
00:44:50.809 --> 00:44:54.521
Well, you can find me at KimberlyJarmonCoachingcom or Instagram at Kimberly Jarmon Coaching or TikTok at Kimberly Jarmon.
00:44:54.521 --> 00:45:01.074
So that's kind of where I hang out and about my business.
00:45:01.074 --> 00:45:13.257
Yeah, Like I just love working with those women that just know they're meant for more and they kind of want that help to like believe in themselves, build that self-confidence that rejects from resilience, and they want to.
00:45:13.257 --> 00:45:14.320
They know what they want to do.
00:45:14.320 --> 00:45:18.516
They may not be able to be really clear on it, but they know they want to make an impact.
00:45:18.998 --> 00:45:20.322
Amen, amen, amen.
00:45:20.322 --> 00:45:24.231
I'm going to make sure that there are clickable links in the show notes so that they can easily check you out.
00:45:24.231 --> 00:45:26.715
And thank you, just thank you again.
00:45:26.715 --> 00:45:28.018
This was such a great conversation.
00:45:28.018 --> 00:45:31.672
Yeah, thanks so much for having me.
00:45:31.672 --> 00:45:33.494
That's all for now.
00:45:33.494 --> 00:45:39.721
If you want to keep that kick-ass energy high, please take a minute to share this episode with someone that might need a high-octane dose of you can do it.
00:45:39.721 --> 00:45:46.635
Don't forget to rate, review and subscribe to the Permission to Kick-Ass podcast on Apple Podcasts to rate, review and subscribe to the Permission to Kick Ass podcast on Apple Podcasts, spotify and wherever you stream your podcasts.
00:45:46.635 --> 00:45:49.539
I'm your host, angie Coley, and I'm here rooting for you.
00:45:49.539 --> 00:45:55.291
Thanks for listening and let's go kick some ass.