Jakson EP07 The Final Chapter - Steve Garrigan on Kodaline's Farewell, Anxiety & Life on the Road täydellinen litterointi

you comprehend all of that? 00:04:52.000 --> 00:04:56.560 Like, was there a moment where it started to sink in, or are you still processing the whole thing? 00:04:56.879 --> 00:04:59.360 I'm still processing the whole thing. 00:04:59.360 --> 00:05:10.639 I feel very, very lucky and I mean just kind of blessed to to be able to do what I do, to be a musician, to write songs, uh, you know, to play in the band. 00:05:10.639 --> 00:05:12.240 Yeah, it's it's incredible. 00:05:12.240 --> 00:05:13.680 It's a dream job. 00:05:13.680 --> 00:05:17.759 When I look back, it still just baffles me. 00:05:17.759 --> 00:05:19.600 I have to pinch myself, to be honest. 00:05:19.600 --> 00:05:34.160 It's hard to comprehend, and it's har even harder to put into words, because if I did go back to like teenage me and said I'd be doing what I'm doing today, he definitely would have just laughed and said, That's impossible. 00:05:34.319 --> 00:05:36.879 So but you've proved him wrong. 00:05:36.879 --> 00:05:44.800 Sometimes the impossible is possible, it just takes a lot of hard work to make it happen, and I suppose luck as well. 00:05:44.800 --> 00:05:45.839 It takes a bit of luck. 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:48.560 I think it's it's a combination of both. 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:56.079 Like I remember when I said, I'd love to be a musician, I wanna write songs, you know. 00:05:56.079 --> 00:06:00.079 I wonder could I get a record deal, I wonder could I get a publishing deal, all this stuff. 00:06:00.079 --> 00:06:09.360 And when I said that to my parents, obviously they didn't react very well initially because they're like, Well, that's not a real job. 00:06:09.680 --> 00:06:11.040 How are you gonna get a house one day? 00:06:11.920 --> 00:06:14.560 Um, how are you gonna pay a mortgage etc? 00:06:14.560 --> 00:06:19.199 Which is sensible and that's the right way to go about it. 00:06:19.199 --> 00:06:23.920 But I just had this kind of I wrote songs every day. 00:06:23.920 --> 00:07:01.120 Any chance I got to rehearse and play with the band, like I do that and we do that together, and it was the only thing on my mind, first thing in the morning and last thing at night, and then music as well, also writing songs on a personal level just felt good for me, and I did go through a very dark like point when I was like 19 for quite a few years, but music was kind of the thing that kept me afloat as well, so it was the only thing I felt I was good at as well, which is kind of sad, but um I mean I was obsessed, and I think that also helped. 00:07:01.600 --> 00:07:09.759 I think you said at one point like it wasn't really a choice, it was a it was a necessity to like create music and express yourself that way. 00:07:09.759 --> 00:07:18.959 And when you say like the hard time when you were 19 and a few years after that, you're talking about like panic attacks and anxiety, and they kind of hit you out of nowhere, didn't they? 00:07:19.360 --> 00:07:21.360 Yeah, it's odd. 00:07:21.360 -->

00:07:30.160 When you're creative in any way, or if you have a love of doing something, like I think it's just in you to be creative. 00:07:30.160 --> 00:07:39.920 If you're a creative person, you you'll just do it, or you'll find an outlet, whether that's art, painting, you know, music, you'll find an outlet and you'll just do it. 00:07:39.920 --> 00:07:46.639 It's like an urge uh or an itch that needs to be scratched, and I think that was in me from a very, very young age. 00:07:46.639 --> 00:07:53.120 I really started to take it seriously when I when I was going through a tough time because it did help me. 00:07:53.120 --> 00:08:01.519 And there is a thing, you know, music therapy, subconsciously or whatever, I might have been just doing that, you know, because it made me feel good. 00:08:01.519 --> 00:08:08.000 And I was writing songs and some were bad, and they got better the more I did it. 00:08:08.000 --> 00:08:15.519 But yeah, I was very anxious and I was very shy, and I was very kind of sad. 00:08:16.160 --> 00:08:17.600 You were very hard on yourself as well. 00:08:17.600 --> 00:08:19.360 You weren't really giving yourself a break. 00:08:19.360 --> 00:08:24.079 Instead of giving yourself compassion, you were really tough on yourself. 00:08:24.480 --> 00:08:34.240 Yeah, I mean, I think it was the time as well that I grew up because it was nobody spoke about mental health or anxiety, panic attacks, depression, things like that. 00:08:34.240 --> 00:08:46.240 Anything about the head, if you said you had a problem or something, especially being a man, the answer would usually be just just suck it up and they think you were weak or something. 00:08:46.240 --> 00:08:51.519 Yeah, they they kind of they bully you, you know, especially in an all-boys' school and stuff like that. 00:08:51.519 --> 00:08:58.879 Like I was in a great school, but just the general mentality surrounding mental health at the time was zero. 00:08:58.879 --> 00:09:04.080 So you just didn't talk about it, and if you did, you'd be kind of you'd be laughed at or mocked. 00:09:04.080 --> 00:09:05.039 It was horrible. 00:09:05.039 --> 00:09:10.639 So I didn't say anything and I didn't talk about it, which is the exact wrong thing to do. 00:09:10.639 --> 00:09:15.200 But luckily I had music as an outlet, and for me that was my voice. 00:09:15.200 --> 00:09:37.600 So I remember I wrote a song, the first song I wrote that actually felt like a real song, and I used to listen to a lot of other songs, like big well-known songs, and I remember listening to them and then listening to my own song that I had written, and I was like, I think this is potentially as good as this. 00:09:37.600 --> 00:09:43.120 Like it stood up, it didn't f sound weird when you like listen to one and then listen to the other. 00:09:43.519 --> 00:09:44.799 That song was High Hopes. 00:09:45.039 --> 00:09:46.639 Yeah, it was High Hopes. 00:09:46.639 --> 00:09:51.200 It was it's become one of Codeline's big songs. 00:09:51.200 --> 00:09:55.759 But for me, it was the first song that I wrote that actually felt like a real song. 00:09:55.759 --> 00:09:57.120 And it came from a real place. 00:09:57.120 --> 00:09:59.200 It was about hitting rock bottom. 00:09:59.200 --> 00:10:03.679 For me, that was you know, anxiety, panic attacks. 00:10:03.679 --> 00:10:06.639 I really felt like my world had turned upside down. 00:10:06.639 --> 00:10:19.200 But something in me was saying, You gotta stay positive and you gotta keep going, you know, because the world keeps spinning regardless of what happens or what choices you make. 00:10:19.200 --> 00:10:20.320 So yeah. 00:10:20.320 --> 00:10:28.240 For a 19-year-old it was pretty heavy, but uh I mean there's staring at the barrel of a gun is a metaphor in the a lyric in that song. 00:10:28.240 --> 00:10:31.120 And that's for me is just you felt hopeless. 00:10:31.279 --> 00:10:33.600 But yet you weren't you were writing about high hopes. 00:10:34.000 --> 00:10:37.039 I mean, that that's almost I hate to say it, but it was almost literal. 00:10:37.039 --> 00:10:40.639 That's how low and sad I was at the time, you know. 00:10:40.639 --> 00:10:49.519 But that song perched me up and gave me a bit of momentum and encouraged me to keep going. 00:10:49.519 --> 00:11:01.919 And then I started writing more and more and more, and then songs like All I Want, um, which is our biggest song, and you know, uh the record just started appearing, and then it was incredible as well. 00:11:01.919 --> 00:11:12.480 Like the band like myself and Mark and Vini, I think we always had like we didn't know that it was gonna happen, but there was a belief there that it would or could. 00:11:12.480 --> 00:11:18.000 I mean, it was highly unlikely, but but we did have that small belief, and that belief grew. 00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:22.720 I think that the more we worked at it and the more we tried and the more songs we recorded. 00:11:23.039 --> 00:11:27.440 You had your first one of your first big breaks was you're a star. 00:11:27.440 --> 00:11:31.759 You're a star We're not doing that again. 00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:38.720 But it was that was one of your big breaks, and I suppose it gave you a taste of what could be. 00:11:38.720 --> 00:11:42.559 But it was still difficult along the way. 00:11:42.559 --> 00:11:47.360 I mean, you've spoken about before, you know, how you would have sent your songs to people and they were rejected. 00:11:47.679 --> 00:11:47.840 Yeah. 00:11:48.080 --> 00:11:50.559 Which then stemmed you into happened. 00:11:50.559 --> 00:11:59.360 Which stemmed into you, like them posting tapes and recordings and Ronan Keaton's mailbox just wanting to be heard and seen. 00:11:59.600 --> 00:11:59.840 Yeah. 00:12:00.159 --> 00:12:04.159 You talked about like performing to people in pubs and no one giving. 00:12:04.559 --> 00:12:04.960 No one listening. 00:12:05.120 --> 00:12:06.399 No one yeah, no one caring. 00:12:06.399 -->

00:12:10.960 How did you keep going when when these farriers were constantly in your way? 00:12:10.960 --> 00:12:13.440 And how did you get that first break? 00:12:14.000 --> 00:12:17.600 Well, Yoris there in itself was a huge thing for us. 00:12:17.600 --> 00:12:27.840 Like we weren't going to s well, I wasn't going to school because of it, you know, and every Sunday we were on TV, we kind of had this 15 minutes of fame thing. 00:12:27.840 --> 00:12:34.159 And you know, I I was quite a shy, introverted guy, so that was a bizarre experience. 00:12:34.159 --> 00:12:35.440 And but it was amazing. 00:12:35.440 --> 00:12:38.320 It also gave us kind of a look at the music industry. 00:12:38.320 --> 00:12:44.559 We got quite a lot of gigs from it as well in pubs and paying paid gigs, which was crazy for us. 00:12:44.559 --> 00:12:50.000 We had a kind of a snapshot of what the music industry is like, but as quick as it came, it was gone even quicker. 00:12:50.000 --> 00:12:52.159 And then I was back repeating my leave and certain. 00:12:52.159 --> 00:12:53.039 That was very difficult. 00:12:53.279 --> 00:12:54.399 That must have stung, yeah. 00:12:54.559 --> 00:12:56.159 Yeah, that was that was tough. 00:12:56.159 --> 00:12:59.759 I reacted badly to that, it made me very anxious. 00:12:59.759 --> 00:13:06.960 For some reason, I had this internal dialogue I had going on was I have failed, I'm a failure. 00:13:06.960 --> 00:13:12.399 Which I've learned is called catastrophic thinking in therapy. 00:13:12.399 --> 00:13:22.399 But yeah, that was a conclusion I had come to, which was not true, it was very irrational, but that didn't help, and it made me very anxious and it made me feel very bad. 00:13:22.399 --> 00:13:28.960 And then it lots of things kind of ended up in me having multiple panic attacks and feeling very bad. 00:13:28.960 --> 00:13:34.159 Yes, well, the first break came along, it was actually a couple of years after that. 00:13:34.159 --> 00:14:01.360 Because of Eurostar, I think Roland Keaton had heard about us, and at the time we had a different uh bass player in the band, and he worked in the airport, and Roland Keaton happened to be going through the airport, and we managed to get a CD, a demo CD to him, and he was awesome about it, and he reached out to us and he lived in Mallahoide and he let us use his studio for free, which was incredible. 00:14:01.360 --> 00:14:19.679 So, any chance we got myself and Mark would go over there and um use the studio, or if we had demos and stuff like that, I would go over and drop it in his mailbox with like a note about the songs, and that went on for a few years, just annoying him. 00:14:20.559 --> 00:14:21.919 Would you ever go away though? 00:14:21.919 --> 00:14:23.759 But regretful he gave you a chance. 00:14:24.240 --> 00:14:29.919 Yeah, but then eventually like he introduced us to somebody, and then they introduced somebody. 00:14:29.919 --> 00:14:37.120 A label came over, listened to us, had no

interest, disappeared for like five years, then came back and then signed us. 00:14:37.120 --> 00:14:41.360 But the whole time, like I was just writing, writing, writing, writing. 00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:43.039 Music was the first thing on my mind. 00:14:43.039 --> 00:14:51.360 I said it before, first thing in my mind in the morning and the last thing at night for years, and it just for many reasons. 00:14:51.360 --> 00:14:58.159 I loved it, but I also felt like there's gotta be a way to make this work, and it also made made me feel good. 00:14:58.159 --> 00:15:13.039 It's funny about Ronan because we didn't see him again for a few years, but then we were special guests on The Voice of Australia, and he was a judge, and afterwards he came up and he was like, guys, and uh it was just so weird. 00:15:13.039 --> 00:15:16.399 I mean, even for him, like that must be bizarre, you know. 00:15:16.559 --> 00:15:18.000 But that's a cool story. 00:15:18.320 --> 00:15:19.360 Yeah, it is cool. 00:15:19.360 --> 00:15:20.559 I mean, yeah. 00:15:20.960 --> 00:15:30.720 And it just shows the importance of having someone who believes in you, no matter like what it what field you're in, having someone who believes in you really does make a difference. 00:15:31.120 --> 00:15:32.080 Massively, yeah. 00:15:32.080 --> 00:15:40.320 I mean, I didn't know anything about the industry, I didn't know anything about deals, managers, uh, bookers, anything like that, you know. 00:15:40.320 --> 00:15:45.759 And he actually grew up very close to where myself and Mark and Vinnie grew up as well. 00:15:45.759 --> 00:15:51.120 So we were thinking, I mean, well, he knows he's done it. 00:15:51.120 --> 00:15:53.519 We owe a hell of a lot to Ronan. 00:15:53.519 --> 00:16:00.960 And there was a couple of other people along the way as well who just opened doors and kept with us. 00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:08.000 Um, like Phil Phil McGee is the Irish producer, he's one of my best mates, one of the band's best mates as well. 00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:10.240 He has been there as well. 00:16:10.240 --> 00:16:13.200 He grew up in the same estate as me and Mark. 00:16:13.200 --> 00:16:14.960 He had a huge impact. 00:16:14.960 --> 00:16:18.480 We were very lucky to just be surrounded by great people. 00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:23.200 Like our the first producer on our record, Stephen Harris, as well, was incredible. 00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:27.919 I remember first meeting him, I couldn't even speak because of what he had done. 00:16:28.000 --> 00:16:29.679 Like he's got a Grammy to his name. 00:16:29.840 --> 00:16:30.480 Yeah, he's a Grammy. 00:16:30.480 --> 00:16:39.519 He's worked with like U2, Dave Matthews and Santana, and yeah, I mean, I froze uh the first time I met him, and we didn't do anything. 00:16:39.519 --> 00:16:40.720 I couldn't even sing. 00:16:40.720 --> 00:16:45.120 But then we came back a few years later and had songs, and I was more confident. 00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:48.000 And I mean, we

still meet some great people. 00:16:48.000 --> 00:16:50.480 It's kind of like the domino effect, you know. 00:16:50.480 --> 00:16:52.879 It's it's not an easy industry as well. 00:16:52.879 --> 00:16:58.320 I feel very lucky and incredibly grateful to be doing what I do, you know. 00:16:58.320 --> 00:17:00.000 I'm obsessed with songwriting. 00:17:00.240 --> 00:17:04.240 I can attest that you're obsessed literally any hour of the day and night. 00:17:04.240 --> 00:17:16.240 You are either at the piano or by the guitar or like humming a melody or just pulling over on the side of the road to like write lyrics in your notes up. 00:17:16.240 --> 00:17:18.240 I mean, it can be a little annoying at times. 00:17:18.559 --> 00:17:21.839 I can imagine it's weird from from your point of view, yeah. 00:17:21.839 --> 00:17:24.720 It's I I just love it, you know. 00:17:24.720 --> 00:17:26.799 Writing songs is wild. 00:17:26.799 --> 00:17:32.319 When you meet another songwriter, I'm like, ah, you're like me, you know. 00:17:32.319 --> 00:17:34.079 You do what I do. 00:17:34.079 --> 00:17:42.319 But I think it's it's a certain way of being, um, and you're either like that or you're not, you know. 00:17:42.559 --> 00:17:42.720 Yeah. 00:17:42.960 --> 00:17:45.519 I have some great friends who are songwriters, and they're the same. 00:17:45.519 --> 00:17:53.519 They just they're kind of always on age waiting for that, you know, waiting for that next song, and you never know when it's gonna come, you know. 00:17:53.519 --> 00:17:56.480 Actually, there's a song on this album inspired by a movie. 00:17:56.480 --> 00:18:01.279 I watched uh Eternal Sunshine of The Spotless Mind, and then I just was like ran. 00:18:01.279 --> 00:18:06.400 I mean, I ran to the piano straight after, and I just wrote this song kind of about that. 00:18:07.039 --> 00:18:08.000 What's the song? 00:18:08.240 --> 00:18:09.519 It's called The One For Me. 00:18:09.519 --> 00:18:10.960 Uh I wrote it a few years back. 00:18:11.839 --> 00:18:14.160 I was about to start humbling it then, humming it then. 00:18:14.160 --> 00:18:17.839 This is the thing about being the partner of someone who's creating an album. 00:18:17.839 --> 00:18:22.000 You know that album inside out by the time it ever gets released. 00:18:22.000 --> 00:18:27.519 Like we were you were even going through like the song list for the album a while back, remember? 00:18:27.759 --> 00:18:28.160 I knew it. 00:18:28.559 --> 00:18:32.160 Yeah, and you were saying each title, and I was like huming, and it was almost like a test. 00:18:32.160 --> 00:18:34.400 I was impressed. 00:18:34.720 --> 00:18:40.480 Well, yeah, I mean, a lot of people don't see how much goes into making music as well. 00:18:40.480 --> 00:18:49.920 You see it because because of me, but um like mixing, mastering the recording process, writing the song is the first part, you know. 00:18:49.920 --> 00:18:57.279 Like it's it's a long process, and a lot of a lot of sweat, blood, and tears goes into it, goes into every song. 00:18:57.279 --> 00:19:07.279 And I really like to hone in and just you know, make sure it's right for me because I want to be able to stand behind everything that's released, you know. 00:19:07.279 --> 00:19:22.640 We're very, very lucky as well that we get to work with great mixers and mastering engineers and producers, just great people that we've kind of met over the years. 00:19:22.960 --> 00:19:24.720 It's awesome, you know. 00:19:24.720 --> 00:19:26.480 But a lot goes into it. 00:19:26.640 --> 00:19:27.440 It's a lot. 00:19:27.440 --> 00:19:32.319 And music now these days is so disposable and it's so saturated. 00:19:32.480 --> 00:19:35.200 There's just is that controversial of you to say? 00:19:35.680 --> 00:19:42.480 Uh no, not really, because I don't know the exact figure, but like how many songs are released a day on Spotify? 00:19:42.480 --> 00:19:43.119 You can look that up. 00:19:43.680 --> 00:19:44.720 Hundreds of days, probably. 00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:46.000 Probably millions. 00:19:46.000 --> 00:19:46.640 Millions. 00:19:46.640 --> 00:19:48.160 I don't know, maybe a million. 00:19:48.160 --> 00:19:48.559 I don't know. 00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:51.039 Do you think AI has something to do with that? 00:19:51.440 --> 00:19:56.480 Yeah, well, AI is just another thing to throw in the mix there. 00:19:56.480 --> 00:19:58.480 That old curveball. 00:19:58.480 --> 00:20:10.319 Let's not go down that rabbit hole, but it's so disposable, but at the same time, it's art, and for me, like I put so much into it, you know. 00:20:10.319 --> 00:20:16.240 And I know that there will be people who'll just press play and then three seconds they'll skip. 00:20:16.240 --> 00:20:17.839 That's just the way it is, you know. 00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:21.759 I think it's harder now than it was even five years ago, ten years ago. 00:20:22.160 --> 00:20:26.480 It's probably more meaningful though when it does connect because it's cut through the noise. 00:20:26.880 --> 00:20:27.519 True, yeah. 00:20:27.519 --> 00:20:40.240 Look, I mean, look, we're very lucky that we have an incredible fan base and they're very loyal and they really love what we put out and what we do, you know, and they stand behind us, which is incredible. 00:20:40.240 --> 00:20:43.759 So we're lucky, you know, in that sense. 00:20:43.839 --> 00:20:45.920 But um Well you don't take it for granted either. 00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:46.960 No, not at all. 00:20:46.960 --> 00:20:48.720 I mean, we'd be nowhere without them. 00:20:49.039 --> 00:20:52.079 Are the fans what kept you going during the tough times? 00:20:52.079 --> 00:21:05.039 Well, obviously the music kept you going too, because it was your release, but when you're touring and you're experiencing anxiety and panic attacks and you're internalizing it and you're not communicating it, like what kept you going? 00:21:05.039 --> 00:21:29.599 I know that you're a very resilient person, but outside

of yourself, what kept you going to I mean you've done some mad stuff when you haven't been feeling the best, like performing with sunstroke, touring and performing with pneumonia when you should really have been in bed, a bronchitis, like you very rarely let that get in the way. 00:21:29.599 --> 00:21:37.359 There was one time when a panic attack stopped you in your tracks and you had to cancel a show, and you very quickly like put on the show again to make up for it. 00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:39.279 But what kept you going? 00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:46.799 I think I I have this thing, I have this resilience that I'm very lucky to have. 00:21:46.799 --> 00:21:48.559 I don't know where it comes from. 00:21:48.559 --> 00:21:59.759 Because even back when I was you know a teenager and going like or when I had my first panic attack, and there was always something there that kept me. 00:21:59.759 --> 00:22:04.960 Going and I don't know what that is, and I don't know where I got it, but I'm very, very thankful for it. 00:22:04.960 --> 00:22:09.200 And with touring, you know, you're kind of just thrown into it. 00:22:09.200 --> 00:22:16.480 There's no rule book for touring, and especially when you're young, partying and you know, everything is there for you. 00:22:16.480 --> 00:22:18.720 It's very easy to self-combust. 00:22:18.720 --> 00:22:22.000 Um I just kind of kept going. 00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:24.799 I think adrenaline does a lot for you. 00:22:24.799 --> 00:22:29.279 There was times where I did like nine gigs in a day, I remember South by Southwest. 00:22:29.279 --> 00:22:39.519 Uh it's a festival for up-and-coming artists in in America, and I did like nine shows straight off the plane, no sleep. 00:22:40.000 --> 00:22:41.440 It was crazy. 00:22:41.440 --> 00:22:46.240 And I look back at them now and like my voice like stayed in good shape. 00:22:46.400 --> 00:22:47.599 It was really, really good. 00:22:47.599 --> 00:22:50.240 And I have no idea how I did that. 00:22:50.240 --> 00:22:52.079 I d I don't know. 00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:57.440 But uh yeah, I did a show in Italy where I had bronchitis and then it turned into pneumonia. 00:22:57.440 --> 00:23:04.960 And then in Australia, I got sunstroke, did the gig, and then afterwards I went to a hotel room. 00:23:05.279 --> 00:23:06.480 And didn't move for two days. 00:23:06.799 --> 00:23:08.079 Yeah, in a dark room. 00:23:08.079 --> 00:23:10.400 That's what you're supposed to do, and just drink loads of water. 00:23:10.400 --> 00:23:12.880 But an ambulance brought me to the hotel. 00:23:12.880 --> 00:23:13.839 It's crazy. 00:23:14.079 --> 00:23:15.519 The glamour of it all, huh? 00:23:15.680 --> 00:23:17.039 Yeah, I mean it's it's wild. 00:23:17.039 --> 00:23:20.400 People don't see the that the gruelling side. 00:23:20.400 --> 00:23:21.440 Yeah, it's tough. 00:23:21.440 --> 00:23:21.920 Like it. 00:23:21.920 --> 00:23:23.680 I'm much better now. 00:23:23.680 --> 00:23:25.359 Like, I look after myself. 00:23:25.519 --> 00:23:36.799 I think really it's kind of sad, but I was so anxious and I was so awkward everywhere except music. 00:23:37.039 --> 00:23:48.480 So, like talking to people, I was usually very shy and nervous, and like I just I had this secret, and it was that I was how do I explain this? 00:23:48.480 --> 00:24:10.240 I thought I was broken because I had this these panic attacks and I was ashamed of them and you know, depression and stuff, and I didn't want to talk about it because I felt like if I talked about it, people would judge me for it and they wouldn't support me, and it would just make me weird, weirder than I already was. 00:24:10.240 --> 00:24:15.519 Now that was all completely irrational, but that's what the conclusion I had come to in my head. 00:24:15.519 --> 00:24:24.720 So everywhere I went, I just felt really bad and sad and low and awkward, and I had to try really hard all the time. 00:24:24.720 --> 00:24:28.880 The only time I didn't have to try was music. 00:24:28.880 --> 00:24:37.839 So I would look forward to the gig and I would look forward to singing and I would look forward to writing a song, and anything outside of that was hard. 00:24:37.839 --> 00:24:50.480 So it was weird, you know, and then I was just very, very fortunate as well and lucky that it worked out because then I grew up touring, you know, from twenty-three onwards. 00:24:50.480 --> 00:25:09.680 Like relentlessly touring and gigging and recording albums and stuff, and then I'm only really kind of I only in the past few years I've actually started to look outside of music and you know, I found fitness and like you know, I like audiobooks and stuff like that and learning, you know. 00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:11.519 I think that made me very sad. 00:25:11.519 --> 00:25:19.680 I'm literally like my lives are literally watering because the fact that everything was hard, but the music. 00:25:19.680 --> 00:25:20.480 Ugh. 00:25:20.480 --> 00:25:22.880 Yeah you've never said that before. 00:25:23.279 --> 00:25:23.599 Yeah. 00:25:23.920 --> 00:25:24.960 Like that to me. 00:25:25.359 --> 00:25:29.359 I don't think I've ever said that to anybody, but that's just I'm literally crying. 00:25:29.359 --> 00:25:30.640 Yeah, I know, yeah. 00:25:30.640 --> 00:25:33.440 It's uh Yeah, but you cry at like music. 00:25:33.839 --> 00:25:39.119 No, but I mean I don't normally cry when you Yeah in this type of conversation. 00:25:39.440 --> 00:25:44.400 Well, it it was really hard though, but I was lucky I had music, you know. 00:25:44.720 --> 00:25:48.160 Do you remember the first time you told me about your anxiety? 00:25:49.359 --> 00:25:52.880 No, but we've had some very funny moments. 00:25:53.039 --> 00:25:55.519 I mean I mean this wasn't a funny moment. 00:25:55.519 --> 00:25:57.440 We went to see Ed Sharon. 00:25:57.440 --> 00:25:58.079 Do you remember the night? 00:25:58.720 --> 00:26:00.000 Yeah, no, that was wild though. 00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:00.480 That was

crazy. 00:26:00.799 --> 00:26:02.160 And the three arena I'm talking about. 00:26:02.400 --> 00:26:07.839 Yeah, and I remember, and he had an after party, and then I I had to leave because I just ran away. 00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:10.880 And I thought you were running away because you didn't want to be with me. 00:26:10.880 --> 00:26:13.599 I was like, oh no, I'm crapping his style. 00:26:14.319 --> 00:26:15.680 You're kind of weird though. 00:26:15.680 --> 00:26:17.839 I just didn't want to say it, you know. 00:26:17.839 --> 00:26:19.119 I was keeping around. 00:26:19.440 --> 00:26:22.880 But we were standing outside Brooks, wasn't it? 00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:30.160 I don't know, you were really deep into a panic attack and you were like, uh, I have this I have this thing, these really bad panic attacks. 00:26:30.160 --> 00:26:33.359 It's okay if you don't want to like hang out or whatever. 00:26:33.359 --> 00:26:34.400 I was like, what? 00:26:34.400 --> 00:26:36.799 Why wouldn't I want to hang out? 00:26:36.799 --> 00:26:40.000 You know, just because you have anxiety and panic attacks. 00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:42.079 Like to you, it was like an earth-shattering thing. 00:26:42.079 --> 00:26:44.559 It is that you thought that I would push you away. 00:26:44.559 --> 00:26:54.079 And then to me, uh I I think you were pushing me, you were pushing me away because you were anticipating that I would push you away because of your anxiety. 00:26:54.319 --> 00:26:58.000 So Yeah, but I had no self-it's that catastrophic thinking. 00:26:58.000 --> 00:27:08.480 I think I think like I yeah, I as I said, I had come to the conclusion in my head that I was broken, and that if people found out I was broken they'd reject you. 00:27:08.480 --> 00:27:10.960 It wasn't even a fear of rejection. 00:27:10.960 --> 00:27:14.559 Like, I mean uh rejection is a part of life, you know. 00:27:14.559 --> 00:27:44.799 I look, I've been in therapy for like so many years now, and I go like every week, pretty much every week, sometimes every second week, but like I've learned so much and I I about myself and I'm finally feel like I feel like I know who I am and I'm confident in who I am and um I I actually enjoy things outside of music now as well, which is sounds normal, but that's a big deal for me. 00:27:44.960 --> 00:27:47.759 I like fitness and you know I look fitness. 00:27:47.920 --> 00:27:49.839 I look after myself, I don't drink, I don't smoke. 00:27:49.839 --> 00:27:50.480 I don't know. 00:27:50.480 --> 00:28:00.880 I love learning and I'm fascinated by life and by people and stories and you love psychology and philosophy and philosophy, and I I'm obsessed. 00:28:00.880 --> 00:28:05.920 Like I listen to audiobooks and every day in the gym and stuff, just different things. 00:28:05.920 --> 00:28:07.440 I'm I'm obsessed with learning. 00:28:07.440 --> 00:28:11.599 Yeah, and it all inspires music, it all comes back to music still. 00:28:11.599 --> 00:28:26.000 I think fitness helps my music, helps me sing, and my stamina, and then you know, reading and and watching movies and being fascinated by people and uh and all that that all helps songwriting as well, you know. 00:28:26.000 --> 00:28:41.440 So in a weird way it still all comes back to to music, but I'm just in a better place, and maybe that just comes with age as well, um, because a lot of people would say, I'm young, we're young, but I think we're somewhere in the middle, and that scares the crap out of me as well. 00:28:41.440 --> 00:28:51.279 I'm more aware of the passing of time now and how important it is to appreciate what you've got, you know, because you don't know what you've got until it's gone. 00:28:51.279 --> 00:28:54.000 That's like that new code line song. 00:28:54.000 --> 00:28:56.720 Uh when you're on the young, that's the tagline, you know. 00:28:56.720 --> 00:29:03.440 So if people were to take a message from it, it would be just, you know, appreciate what you got, take stock. 00:29:03.839 --> 00:29:06.640 Well, speaking of the single, we it leads into the album. 00:29:06.640 --> 00:29:10.640 What can fans expect of the album? 00:29:12.160 --> 00:29:14.240 Well, it's our final album. 00:29:14.240 --> 00:29:17.440 Uh I spent a lot of time on it. 00:29:17.440 --> 00:29:21.680 And I've got to work with some great people as well. 00:29:21.680 --> 00:29:26.160 I feel very fortunate to be able to have done that. 00:29:26.799 --> 00:29:28.480 What kind of sounds are we? 00:29:28.480 --> 00:29:30.400 I mean, I know what kind of sounds. 00:29:30.640 --> 00:29:31.279 All the sounds. 00:29:31.519 --> 00:29:32.160 Great sounds. 00:29:32.400 --> 00:29:32.880 Great sounds. 00:29:33.200 --> 00:29:34.000 Amazing sounds. 00:29:34.319 --> 00:29:35.839 Wait, Liaaries, sounds. 00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:39.519 No, but is there a song that you're really excited for people to hear? 00:29:39.519 --> 00:29:41.119 Like a first single aside. 00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:44.000 Like, do you have some some standouts? 00:29:44.559 --> 00:29:48.880 Every song for me is means something, and every song has its own song. 00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:51.039 Oh, but is there a standout or two? 00:29:51.519 --> 00:29:53.039 It depends what mood you're in. 00:29:53.039 --> 00:29:55.759 Like, I I obviously love Without You. 00:29:55.759 --> 00:29:58.559 That's our wedding song from last year. 00:29:58.559 --> 00:30:03.839 You know, so it's our wedding song, so that's obviously gonna mean a lot to me. 00:30:03.920 --> 00:30:05.599 And it's a beautiful song. 00:30:05.599 --> 00:30:06.640 Thank you for writing it. 00:30:06.960 --> 00:30:15.200 I mean, the last time I wrote a wedding song was for Phil, and that was the one, and that's become a lot of people's wedding song now, strangely enough. 00:30:15.200 --> 00:30:28.880 But uh on this album, there's Without You, which I wrote for for us for our wedding, and then also there's All I'll Ever Need, which is a song I wrote for a friend's wedding a few

years back. 00:30:28.880 --> 00:30:30.000 So there's two on it. 00:30:30.000 --> 00:30:34.000 But but but the song itself, but the album itself is full of highs and lows. 00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:36.640 There's some really uh sad songs. 00:30:36.640 --> 00:30:44.880 There's a song called Save You Now, which like I wrote uh two years back, going through a bit of a dark point. 00:30:44.880 --> 00:31:03.279 I was uh not struggling, but uh I was just gone through a bit of a dark point, and I wrote this song, and it's just a vent, uh, but the vocal is really powerful, and I think it's a really powerful song, and uh it's beautiful, it's quite dark, which I like sometimes. 00:31:03.279 --> 00:31:07.039 Um but then there's also poppy songs and stuff. 00:31:07.039 --> 00:31:11.119 The first single is quite it's quite pop, but it's emotional. 00:31:11.119 --> 00:31:29.279 Um and then yeah, I mean there's some indie songs, and it it's it's cool, it's very scary releasing something, and I don't think that'll ever change, but I've always made it a mission of mine to be able to stand behind a record, an album. 00:31:29.279 --> 00:31:34.240 I want to be able to look myself in the mirror and be like, yeah, okay, I I'm proud of this. 00:31:34.240 --> 00:31:45.519 And it's a high bar because you know, our music has reached people all around the world, and you know, we've had success, so the bar just seems to be getting higher. 00:31:45.519 --> 00:31:48.079 Um, so it's it's easier said than done. 00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:50.000 But but I'm proud of this record. 00:31:50.000 --> 00:31:50.720 It's been cool. 00:31:50.880 --> 00:31:57.200 I won't go into Music Speak because you'll be like No, I love Music Speak, it's my favorite type of speak. 00:31:57.200 --> 00:31:57.920 Oh, yeah. 00:31:58.160 --> 00:32:03.279 You know, because you you're just it's funny because you'll just listen to three seconds and you're like, no, I don't like it. 00:32:03.279 --> 00:32:03.680 Skip. 00:32:03.680 --> 00:32:04.319 But that's cool. 00:32:04.720 --> 00:32:05.440 I do not do that. 00:32:05.599 --> 00:32:07.039 No, well, you do No, I don't. 00:32:07.039 --> 00:32:18.079 I mean, look, there's been times, remember when I was writing I like wherever you were, yeah, and I wrote that song about you for you, and then I was finishing it. 00:32:18.079 --> 00:32:20.079 Well, in fairness, it was like 3 a.m. 00:32:20.079 --> 00:32:33.200 We had a little keyboard in the room and you were sleeping, trying to sleep, and I was like, finishing the song and uh asking you questions about it, and you're like, Yeah, whatever, just just yeah, just well, I was up at 6 a.m. 00:32:33.359 --> 00:32:33.680 for it. 00:32:35.039 --> 00:32:36.799 Actually, in fairness, no, I was totally wrong. 00:32:37.039 --> 00:32:38.799 I don't think my boss would have appreciated. 00:32:38.799 --> 00:32:40.400 Sorry, I'm not fucking listening. 00:32:40.400 --> 00:32:46.559 My husband desperately needed to know if if a certain word needed to be changed in the song at 3 a.m. 00:32:46.559 --> 00:32:49.599 and I was the only person there that could help with that. 00:32:49.599 --> 00:32:52.480 Um no, I'm not a skipper really with songs. 00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:55.839 I do give songs a chance, but I definitely know what I like and what I don't like. 00:32:56.079 --> 00:32:56.319 Yeah. 00:32:56.319 --> 00:32:59.440 Um I mean it it r it really helps. 00:32:59.440 --> 00:33:12.400 Like because when I write a song or demo a song and then I play it for you, like I playing it for people who aren't as attached to it is such an important experience. 00:33:12.400 --> 00:33:14.720 I think you hear things as well. 00:33:14.960 --> 00:33:18.079 Um you're gonna just praise my my taste in music. 00:33:18.640 --> 00:33:19.599 No, I like your taste. 00:33:19.599 --> 00:33:20.319 I think well. 00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:21.519 I don't know if you like my taste. 00:33:21.839 --> 00:33:23.279 No, I don't like your taste at all, no. 00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:27.680 My taste in music would be questionable. 00:33:28.160 --> 00:33:38.240 No, I think you like popular music, you know, and and that kind of, you know, with melodies and stuff, you know, if a song doesn't hit and it doesn't I don't know. 00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:43.839 I think it's really important to show people music that you've made and just gauge their reaction. 00:33:43.839 --> 00:33:54.319 Like I've often shown music to friends as well and stuff like that, or my dad, and um, and then I'd hear something that I didn't hear before I played it for them. 00:33:54.319 --> 00:33:57.119 And then I'm like, oh actually, yeah, maybe I should change that. 00:33:57.839 --> 00:34:04.400 Do you have any standout like gigs or performances from over the last 20 years? 00:34:04.400 --> 00:34:08.639 Like might be like a little intimate, like Radio One lounge moment. 00:34:08.639 --> 00:34:12.000 It could be like the first time you played in Glastonbury. 00:34:12.000 --> 00:34:17.599 Like, is there a standout moment that is special to you? 00:34:17.920 --> 00:34:19.840 We've done some incredible stuff. 00:34:19.840 --> 00:34:23.679 I mean, Marley Park selling that out, 38,000 people. 00:34:23.679 --> 00:34:25.119 That was wild. 00:34:25.119 --> 00:34:33.360 But I mean, there's just so many playing in Asia, like Asia, we have incredible fans over there. 00:34:33.360 --> 00:34:42.400 Like, we're going over now for a farewell tour, and we're adding shows, you know, venues are being upgraded and it's selling out, it's incredible to see. 00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:58.239 And when when I go over there, like it's one thing hearing people sing back a song, but when there's a language barrier and they're still singing back every song, and I mean every song in the set, like it's not just one song, it's every song. 00:34:58.239 --> 00:35:00.400 It's it's incredible. 00:35:00.400 --> 00:35:09.679 I mean, it's really, really hard to put into words, and it's hard to describe

what that feels it's just hard to put into words, it's mind-boggling. 00:35:09.679 --> 00:35:10.480 I have to pinch myself. 00:35:10.719 --> 00:35:13.039 It must be even weirder for your parents. 00:35:13.679 --> 00:35:24.559 Yeah, I mean, I've often taught that as well, because when when you're in a band or you're a touring artist or whatever, you kind of get caught in your bubble. 00:35:24.559 --> 00:35:26.800 And it is like it's a job at the end of the day. 00:35:26.800 --> 00:35:29.920 So, like you're doing a show, and I'd have my routine. 00:35:29.920 --> 00:35:45.679 Like, I'd get up, I'd go to the gym, and then I'd do a sound check, and then I'd maybe do some interviews, and then I'd usually go for a power nap as well, half an hour before every show, and I just get into this kind of thing, this routine, and then I could be in whatever city. 00:35:45.679 --> 00:35:46.639 Yeah, it's your number. 00:35:46.639 --> 00:35:49.679 Yeah, and then I just do the gig and I do it the best show I can. 00:35:49.679 --> 00:35:50.880 Vocal warm-up. 00:35:50.880 --> 00:35:54.320 Yeah, that's my way of doing it now. 00:35:54.320 --> 00:35:55.679 A day is very boring. 00:35:55.679 --> 00:36:05.119 But when your parents dip in, yeah, but my parents are kind of just like stepping in and going, holy shit, from the outside in, like it's crazy. 00:36:05.119 --> 00:36:10.960 Like in like Bangkok, you know, playing to thousands of people, and they're all singing back your songs. 00:36:10.960 --> 00:36:12.880 Like, that that must be wild. 00:36:13.440 --> 00:36:18.079 Your dad is always very good for like sitting back and watching the crowd as well, which is very sweet. 00:36:18.079 --> 00:36:24.559 Like, he loves seeing how your music is received and like the joy and sometimes sadness on people's faces. 00:36:24.880 --> 00:36:28.880 I've always valued his opinion massively in terms of the music as well. 00:36:28.880 --> 00:36:47.119 I remember we were in a rehearsal room years ago, and we played, he was one of the first people we played All I Want, and we we played it live for him as a band, and it was just us and him, and then he stood up at the end and put his hands in the air and was like, Stadiums, you know. 00:36:47.119 --> 00:36:51.519 But like, I mean, that was incredible encouragement. 00:36:51.519 --> 00:36:53.519 We were nothing at the time, you know. 00:36:53.519 --> 00:36:55.760 Like, I think that's very cute. 00:36:55.760 --> 00:36:56.880 We were all working. 00:36:56.880 --> 00:37:05.039 I think Mark was working in a call center, and I was gigging in a bar, you know, at the weekend and in college, but not really in college. 00:37:05.039 --> 00:37:09.760 And Vinny was working in Dixon's, I think, in the airport or something like that. 00:37:09.760 --> 00:37:13.920 Computer shop or something, but or the uh electronic shop. 00:37:13.920 --> 00:37:19.119 But uh yeah, um for my dad's say that was very delusionally optimistic. 00:37:19.119 --> 00:37:24.000 But uh, but it was brilliant, and you know, he's still kind of like that. 00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:28.400 He's really encouraging, but and he does have a good ear for music. 00:37:28.400 --> 00:37:30.159 He's really helped. 00:37:30.159 --> 00:37:35.920 I mean, my taste in music is from is what he kind of gave me growing up, you know. 00:37:35.920 --> 00:37:42.159 For all the parents in the band, uh, it's it's must be must be incredible. 00:37:42.159 --> 00:37:44.719 I mean, you know, we don't have any kids. 00:37:44.880 --> 00:37:50.639 I was gonna say, imagine having a mini us and then they're doing something on this platform. 00:37:50.639 --> 00:38:02.880 It wouldn't be as weird for you because you'd have an idea of what they're experiencing, but imagine having no experience of that world and then all of a sudden your son or daughter or is is Yeah, I know. 00:38:03.039 --> 00:38:11.119 Like my like my my mom, you know, she was uh a prime school teacher, you know, and my dad worked in um uh St. 00:38:11.119 --> 00:38:12.559 Brendan's, you know. 00:38:12.559 --> 00:38:22.480 So they have yeah, very different worlds, and then I like even the idea of music as a job was not really doable. 00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:29.760 They were always like, be sensible, stay in college, or go to college, try to go to college, you know, get some sort of degree. 00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:31.679 A backup plan is always important. 00:38:32.000 --> 00:38:34.559 It's smart and it's sensible, and they were right. 00:38:34.960 --> 00:38:37.360 But I can't imagine you as a lawyer though. 00:38:37.360 --> 00:38:39.360 That's what you were studying to do. 00:38:39.760 --> 00:38:44.960 There were times though where like they um I I was I was an absolute nightmare. 00:38:44.960 --> 00:38:56.559 Like just kind of do no, like I I would have just been from the outside in, I could have just looked like a drifter or like someone who had no head in the clouds. 00:38:56.559 --> 00:38:59.039 Yeah, head in the clouds, you know. 00:38:59.039 --> 00:39:02.639 Um but then it all clicked, luckily. 00:39:02.639 --> 00:39:05.760 And you know, I'm very lucky for it. 00:39:05.760 --> 00:39:08.320 I think just keep going. 00:39:10.400 --> 00:39:14.960 What are you most excited about for the next chapter? 00:39:15.519 --> 00:39:19.119 Well, I'm very excited about this final album. 00:39:19.119 --> 00:39:26.159 I really hope that the our current fans love it, and I hope new people love it as well. 00:39:26.159 --> 00:39:27.599 I hope it travels far. 00:39:27.599 --> 00:39:31.599 I'm very excited about this final tour, tour in the world. 00:39:31.599 --> 00:39:38.719 We're going all over Asia, Australia, Europe, and hopefully we might do some more. 00:39:38.719 --> 00:39:45.920 It's a little bit up in the air, but but yeah, and then after that, you know, I'm looking forward to continuing music. 00:39:45.920 --> 00:40:15.039 I've written songs for some other people, and I I want to continue doing that or

do that more, and I also want to do like solo stuff as well, fully solo stuff, and I'm always writing and hopefully yeah, just living and enjoying the moment as much as I can and staying healthy and continually working on myself, learning more, growing. 00:40:15.039 --> 00:40:20.480 That's kind of it, you know, making the most of the time that uh I've got here. 00:40:20.480 --> 00:40:26.239 And uh annoying you, forgetting to take the bins out, not cleaning the kitchen. 00:40:26.239 --> 00:40:27.599 I do clean the kitchen. 00:40:27.840 --> 00:40:28.159 Do you? 00:40:28.480 --> 00:40:29.360 I do clean the kitchen. 00:40:29.679 --> 00:40:30.079 Do you though? 00:40:30.239 --> 00:40:30.800 Do you though? 00:40:30.960 --> 00:40:31.360 Do you though? 00:40:31.679 --> 00:40:32.639 I do clean the kitchen. 00:40:32.880 --> 00:40:38.320 I think your version of cleaning the kitchen and my version of cleaning the kitchen, like in most households, I know I'm quite clean. 00:40:38.320 --> 00:40:38.800 It's different. 00:40:38.800 --> 00:40:49.039 I'm not saying you're dirty or messy, but I think in a couple there's always one who has another a different understanding of how they like to keep their space. 00:40:49.039 --> 00:40:52.559 I can get very stressed if things are even a tiny bit untidy. 00:40:52.559 --> 00:40:55.280 You'll you'll yeah, you too. 00:40:55.280 --> 00:40:59.760 You'll always know if I'm stressed because you'll come downstairs and I'm just like furiously cleaning out of nowhere. 00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:00.559 Oh yeah. 00:41:00.719 --> 00:41:02.000 And it's already clean. 00:41:02.480 --> 00:41:06.960 With the hoover and an angry, not an angry hood, just like just like a focused face. 00:41:07.199 --> 00:41:12.400 What do you call that when the mouth's like no, a downturn, upturn, downturn smile. 00:41:12.400 --> 00:41:15.840 Um no, I just get very, I don't know, laser focused. 00:41:15.840 --> 00:41:16.880 And I just started seeing it. 00:41:17.119 --> 00:41:21.679 No, if it if it was if it was an emoji, it would be, do you know the one with the line? 00:41:21.920 --> 00:41:22.559 Oh, the line. 00:41:22.559 --> 00:41:23.679 Yeah, it'd be that face. 00:41:23.679 --> 00:41:24.079 Really? 00:41:24.320 --> 00:41:25.760 And and a and a hoover, yeah. 00:41:25.760 --> 00:41:27.760 Well but I mean I do the same. 00:41:27.760 --> 00:41:31.760 I get very kind of I think your environment is really important. 00:41:31.760 --> 00:41:41.360 When you when you have like even my car, like it when it's dirty, I'm a little bit I don't know, a clean environment, a clean room and stuff for me. 00:41:41.360 --> 00:41:43.039 Some people are the complete opposite. 00:41:43.039 --> 00:41:44.880 And I used to be the complete opposite. 00:41:45.119 --> 00:41:45.360 Yeah. 00:41:46.159 --> 00:41:47.360 Now I'm quite organized. 00:41:47.360 --> 00:41:49.920 Like, I mean, like my wardrobe was very organized. 00:41:50.239 --> 00:41:54.079 I remember when we met and I saw your suitcase, I was like, seriously. 00:41:54.320 --> 00:41:55.760 Yeah, it's just a ball of clothes. 00:41:56.000 --> 00:41:56.880 Oh my goodness. 00:41:56.880 --> 00:41:59.360 I was like, okay, I don't even know where to begin. 00:41:59.360 --> 00:42:04.400 And that and the frustrating part is like I would and this was really early in our dating years. 00:42:04.400 --> 00:42:10.079 I would I would rearrange your suitcase and then within like one second it would be Yeah, but the thing is, right? 00:42:10.480 --> 00:42:14.400 With touring and suitcases, that's a whole other podcast episode. 00:42:14.400 --> 00:42:14.800 Okay. 00:42:14.800 --> 00:42:18.800 It's really difficult to figure it out. 00:42:18.800 --> 00:42:20.079 Yeah, because when you're okay. 00:42:20.079 --> 00:42:21.599 No, it is. 00:42:21.599 --> 00:42:22.880 It's very hard. 00:42:22.880 --> 00:42:26.000 What I've learned is you have to underpack. 00:42:26.000 --> 00:42:38.480 You can't overpack like like when you're going for like two months, you know, six weeks at a time, and you know, you have to get your touring stuff, and then there's all this stuff. 00:42:38.480 --> 00:42:40.800 Like you have to be very organized to the day. 00:42:41.440 --> 00:42:46.559 Very curious to see what you're like when you're packing up for your for your big tour now in the next few months. 00:42:46.800 --> 00:42:47.119 Yeah. 00:42:47.280 --> 00:42:48.960 I mean You might be a little rusty. 00:42:48.960 --> 00:42:51.280 You might you might underpack to an extreme. 00:42:51.599 --> 00:42:52.400 I probably will. 00:42:52.400 --> 00:42:56.400 I mean, I still travel quite a lot, like, and I not for six weeks at a time. 00:42:56.400 --> 00:43:08.079 Yeah, not for six weeks at six weeks at a time, but like I do kind of know what I'm gonna wear and like wash, you know, I pack so it's it all fits in everything I'm using. 00:43:08.400 --> 00:43:17.440 It is a it is a black and white version of you now, I have to say, these days when it comes to packing and yeah, I mean I I just changed the system. 00:43:17.679 --> 00:43:18.960 I'm a lot more disciplined, yeah. 00:43:18.960 --> 00:43:21.679 But yeah, jeez. 00:43:21.679 --> 00:43:36.320 There were times where like back in the day I'd overpack, I think my suitcase burst one time and I was just dragging it through London, like with the wheels gone off it, and it was like after after a two-month tour on the road, it was a disaster. 00:43:36.719 --> 00:43:44.000 There's always little tour hacks and secrets, and I remember my my favorite headline about Coteline ever was that uh back in the day. 00:43:44.000 --> 00:43:44.960 Sock and roll. 00:43:44.960 --> 00:43:46.159 Yeah, sock and roll. 00:43:46.159 --> 00:43:50.960 One of your touring hacks was just like because you're constantly moving from place to place, yeah. 00:43:50.960 --> 00:43:54.079 Was like to throw away your socks, so you'd buy like really cheap. 00:43:54.079 --> 00:43:59.679 I mean, it sounds so

wasteful now, but you would have bought like really cheap like a euro for like two euro for. 00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:00.480 Seven pairs. 00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:01.039 Yeah, exactly. 00:44:01.039 --> 00:44:06.480 And then you'd throw away because like laundry and things like that would be hard sometimes to get sorted. 00:44:06.480 --> 00:44:10.079 And you made the paper sock and roll was the headline. 00:44:10.079 --> 00:44:11.280 So funny. 00:44:11.599 --> 00:44:16.079 I I think like I just enjoy things more now. 00:44:16.079 --> 00:44:21.760 I actually enjoy going out and like looking after or like ironing and stuff. 00:44:21.760 --> 00:44:22.719 Like when I'm away. 00:44:22.719 --> 00:44:23.840 No, believe it or not. 00:44:23.840 --> 00:44:24.559 No, I wouldn't. 00:44:24.960 --> 00:44:26.079 Okay, no one can see my face. 00:44:26.079 --> 00:44:30.480 But he said ironing and I'm like, I've never seen you iron in my whole entire life. 00:44:30.800 --> 00:44:42.800 When I'm away, like if I'm in, you know, staying in a hotel or something, I'll I'll just have the first thing I'll do is I'll get into the hotel and then I'll take all my clothes out and put them in the wardrobe. 00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:52.320 So if I'm there for a week or whatever, I'll have everything lined up and make it as home as possible because that way it feels how times have changed. 00:44:52.320 --> 00:44:53.440 I know, yeah, it's wild. 00:44:53.440 --> 00:44:56.880 I used to just fall through the door and then pass out on the floor. 00:44:56.880 --> 00:45:02.239 And then I'd just roll over and get up and drag my suitcase back onto the bus, and then I'd be on stage. 00:45:02.239 --> 00:45:04.239 There was one time I remember years ago. 00:45:04.639 --> 00:45:05.760 Was this the Metallica story? 00:45:06.079 --> 00:45:07.440 No, I well, that was in Japan. 00:45:07.440 --> 00:45:13.519 No, but there was a one time we were doing a gig UK one time. 00:45:13.519 --> 00:45:18.239 The lads went on stage, and or they were just about to go on stage. 00:45:18.239 --> 00:45:24.079 It was like two minutes, and the entrance music had started, and then the tour manager came running in. 00:45:24.079 --> 00:45:25.760 He was like, Where the hell is Steve? 00:45:25.760 --> 00:45:26.239 What the hell? 00:45:26.239 --> 00:45:28.719 And I was in the shower eating a sandwich. 00:45:28.960 --> 00:45:29.760 Oh god. 00:45:29.760 --> 00:45:30.880 Steve. 00:45:31.280 --> 00:45:31.760 Yes. 00:45:31.760 --> 00:45:34.239 Eating a sandwich in the shower. 00:45:34.400 --> 00:45:35.199 What were you thinking? 00:45:35.440 --> 00:45:37.840 Because I I don't know, I'd slept and then I had. 00:45:38.159 --> 00:45:39.519 You were just on a different time zone. 00:45:39.760 --> 00:45:44.719 Yeah, but like I was kind of I need to eat and I also need to shower, and then so I did both. 00:45:44.719 --> 00:45:48.480 And then I got Is that door manager still your door manager? 00:45:48.480 --> 00:45:51.440 No, that was that was that was the No wonder he gave up. 00:45:51.440 --> 00:45:52.639 I wouldn't blame him. 00:45:52.639 --> 00:45:53.920 That was Lewis. 00:45:53.920 --> 00:45:58.239 He was actually he's he was awesome, but yeah, uh yeah, I don't blame him. 00:45:58.239 --> 00:46:01.280 Uh no, we have we have Neil now, and he's amazing. 00:46:01.280 --> 00:46:02.880 He's been with us since the very beginning. 00:46:03.360 --> 00:46:05.920 This world also comes with some really special moments too. 00:46:05.920 --> 00:46:10.719 Like you're one of the few lucky ones that get to meet your heroes along the way as well. 00:46:10.880 --> 00:46:11.119 Yeah. 00:46:11.280 --> 00:46:14.800 And I know you have some really great stories of meeting some of your heroes. 00:46:14.800 --> 00:46:16.320 Do you want to share one or two? 00:46:16.719 --> 00:46:23.280 Yeah, I mean, it is crazy that we've got to meet so many superstars. 00:46:23.280 --> 00:46:32.559 Do you know when someone's famous, but then they're so famous that when you see them, or if you do get the opportunity to see them, you're like, oh my god, they're a real person. 00:46:32.559 --> 00:46:34.639 Like that's did you have that moment? 00:46:34.639 --> 00:46:36.000 That's a different level of fame. 00:46:36.000 --> 00:46:37.519 Yeah, I've had it a few times. 00:46:37.519 --> 00:46:49.519 Uh there was one in South Korea, we were playing a show in Seoul, and um I remember walking into the gym, and so you had to walk through this pool. 00:46:49.519 --> 00:46:56.639 It was odd because the pool was there, and then you walked through the pool and into the gym. 00:46:56.639 --> 00:47:07.920 And I was walking through the pool, and there's this guy there with his leg over his head, and he was like shredded, and he was doing this crazy yoga, and he was like old-ish, but looked incredible. 00:47:07.920 --> 00:47:15.760 Um, and uh, I just kind of like walked by him, you know, and you're like trying to there wasn't a lot of space, so I was like, Oh, sorry, cool. 00:47:15.760 --> 00:47:17.280 But uh but that was Sting. 00:47:17.280 --> 00:47:24.639 Uh we were supporting Sting at that show uh later on that day, and then we got to meet him as well after the gig. 00:47:24.639 --> 00:47:28.400 The guys got to meet him over a glass of wine or something in the lobby. 00:47:28.400 --> 00:47:39.760 But yeah, that was bizarre um to be greeted by Sting doing yoga uh half naked uh first thing in the morning in Korea, South Korea. 00:47:39.760 --> 00:47:57.519 I we got to meet Bono and U2 on a couple of occasions, and I'm a super fan of U2 and and Bono, and every time I feel like I try and talk to him, I just mumble, and I'm like a fangirl, and I always make a fool of myself. 00:47:57.519 --> 00:47:58.480 That's how I feel. 00:47:58.480 --> 00:48:12.639 But um But yeah, we we I think I wrote a letter to him originally just saying thanks for inspiring us and all this, and we managed to get in and watch them rehearse and and that was

unbelievable. 00:48:12.639 --> 00:48:18.960 Actually, the craziest one was in LA at a party that we played at. 00:48:18.960 --> 00:48:22.400 It was in a back garden. 00:48:22.400 --> 00:48:23.760 Bill Lawrence, yeah. 00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:25.039 The creator of Scrubs. 00:48:26.880 --> 00:48:31.760 And his wife were having a charity thing in the garden. 00:48:31.760 --> 00:48:36.000 And I remember I played with the Dipsy Chick, and that was surreal. 00:48:36.000 --> 00:48:41.280 There was loads of people at the party, loads of actors and producers and directors and musicians and all. 00:48:41.280 --> 00:48:45.360 So everywhere you looked was somebody really super cool and super well known. 00:48:45.360 --> 00:48:47.679 But I was cueing for the toilet. 00:48:47.679 --> 00:48:51.360 They had these portalous portalous in the garden because it was like a mini festival. 00:48:51.360 --> 00:48:57.039 And I was coming out of the portaloo, and then I just like walked into Tony Hawk. 00:48:57.039 --> 00:49:00.400 And it's like, what the hell? 00:49:00.400 --> 00:49:02.320 I'm like, he's a real person. 00:49:02.320 --> 00:49:12.400 Funny story, like, we actually bonded and kind of met skateboarding before we played music together, like me, Mark, and Vinny in the band. 00:49:12.400 --> 00:49:16.159 So skateboarding was always a big part of our lives growing up as well. 00:49:16.159 --> 00:49:18.639 So to see Tony Hawk, it was incredible. 00:49:18.639 --> 00:49:25.119 And he said he listened to our music and he was gonna go home and listen to it more, and he loved Ireland. 00:49:25.440 --> 00:49:28.000 Did you geek out and tell him how much he meant to you? 00:49:28.239 --> 00:49:30.880 I should have stayed there and spoke to him. 00:49:30.880 --> 00:49:35.679 I just kind of like was in absolute shock and awe. 00:49:35.679 --> 00:49:42.960 I was like a deer in headlights, and I said, Oh my god, Tony Hawk, I freaking love skateboarding. 00:49:42.960 --> 00:49:48.480 I've completed all your games, his Tony Hawk pro skater games on the PlayStation. 00:49:48.480 --> 00:49:56.079 And I said, We we we used to skateboard together before we even played music, and then I just walked off. 00:49:56.079 --> 00:49:58.639 I think he was still talking, and I just walked off. 00:49:58.800 --> 00:49:59.599 Why would you do that? 00:49:59.599 --> 00:50:02.480 I don't know, because I know it's the awkwardness in you coming out. 00:50:02.719 --> 00:50:05.119 Yeah, I was super awkward, but that was for real. 00:50:05.199 --> 00:50:15.360 Like, because I remember that party because I was privileged enough, privileged enough to be there, and it was so funny because you were, you know, you were sound checking and then obviously we left early. 00:50:15.360 --> 00:50:19.760 No, but you were sound checking and you were waiting to perform and all these things, like you were busy. 00:50:19.760 --> 00:50:26.239 So I was just kind of like wandering around my own this like Hollywood party,

and I'm like, oh my god, it's Cindy Crawford. 00:50:26.239 --> 00:50:30.719 There's Mini Driver, there's literally all of the house of Scrubs. 00:50:30.719 --> 00:50:32.719 And uh super cool. 00:50:32.719 --> 00:50:34.960 It was a very strange scenario to be in. 00:50:34.960 --> 00:50:37.599 But we left as soon as you were done and we went to the cinema. 00:50:38.159 --> 00:50:38.960 I know, yeah. 00:50:39.199 --> 00:50:41.760 That's kind of dynamic. 00:50:41.760 --> 00:50:47.599 Not because we're not grateful to be there, but because it's almost too surreal to be a part of it. 00:50:47.599 --> 00:50:52.480 So it's like you normalize the moment by doing something really normal, like the cinema afterwards. 00:50:52.719 --> 00:50:57.920 Yeah, I've always been um I've always kind of shied away from those things. 00:50:57.920 --> 00:50:59.280 Uh I've always left early. 00:50:59.280 --> 00:51:02.079 Or not gone if I if I didn't have to. 00:51:02.400 --> 00:51:07.840 Another LA experience, there was uh a One Direction party or something. 00:51:07.840 --> 00:51:12.800 And you chose to go to McDonald's with me instead of Schmoozin at the party. 00:51:13.039 --> 00:51:13.360 Yeah. 00:51:13.840 --> 00:51:15.440 It was like, gosh, he must really like me. 00:51:15.599 --> 00:51:21.920 It was Nicole Scherzinger and a few others, and uh yeah, we went to McDonald's. 00:51:22.320 --> 00:51:24.079 I had some fries instead. 00:51:24.320 --> 00:51:24.880 Yeah. 00:51:25.119 --> 00:51:25.840 Oh gosh. 00:51:26.000 --> 00:51:31.840 I feel like at that time though, as well, you uh I was really, really burnt out though. 00:51:31.840 --> 00:51:33.039 You were really burnt out, yeah. 00:51:33.039 --> 00:51:37.119 I was so tired and I didn't have the social battery. 00:51:37.119 --> 00:51:37.519 Yeah, yeah. 00:51:37.519 --> 00:51:39.760 Like my social battery anyway is tiny. 00:51:39.760 --> 00:51:46.400 To be honest, I need I'm the type of person who goes to something like that and then I have to go home and I have to. 00:51:46.400 --> 00:51:49.440 I need I like being alone. 00:51:49.440 --> 00:51:50.639 I'm comfortable in my own. 00:51:51.119 --> 00:51:54.320 I mean, that's also why we didn't really have a day two of for our wedding. 00:51:54.320 --> 00:51:57.920 Because we we knew that we would be just like our social battery. 00:51:57.920 --> 00:52:01.599 Like, we literally, I think, were like sleeping for like two or three days. 00:52:02.000 --> 00:52:02.239 I know. 00:52:03.039 --> 00:52:03.920 Like, what just happened? 00:52:04.239 --> 00:52:06.000 I like I'm low-key. 00:52:06.000 --> 00:52:07.199 Like, I you are low-key. 00:52:09.599 --> 00:52:17.519 But I remember back then really having to like um be like, no, Steve, I think this I think this is an opportunity that we should definitely not just go to the cinema instead. 00:52:17.840 --> 00:52:18.719 You're right as well. 00:52:18.880 --> 00:52:28.000 And I think sometimes that was because your social anxiety was like high, or yes, on top of that, you're also burnt out, but it's important as well to do that stuff. 00:52:28.159 --> 00:52:36.800 I'm I realize it now, you know, to to like meet people and network and stuff, especially in like the music industry or creative industries, you know. 00:52:36.800 --> 00:52:39.280 I'm only kind of learning that now, which is very funny. 00:52:39.280 --> 00:52:52.559 You know, I've somehow managed to to get through it all, but you know, that's also it's because I was in a band, you know, so like um I could kind of step away and they'd talk to people. 00:52:53.039 --> 00:52:54.239 Well you were only young. 00:52:54.239 --> 00:52:55.760 You were only learning. 00:52:56.559 --> 00:52:59.519 You're going back to the single you had your training wheels on. 00:52:59.519 --> 00:53:01.599 And I still have them on. 00:53:01.840 --> 00:53:03.360 Would you do anything differently? 00:53:03.760 --> 00:53:05.440 Would I do anything differently? 00:53:05.440 --> 00:53:07.679 I wouldn't be so hard on myself. 00:53:07.840 --> 00:53:08.159 Yeah. 00:53:08.400 --> 00:53:15.119 Because I mean it's good to push yourself, you know, but there's a healthy way to do it, and there's an unhealthy way to do it. 00:53:15.119 --> 00:53:18.400 And I was doing it definitely in an unhealthy way. 00:53:18.400 --> 00:53:24.960 I was beating myself up and I was dragging myself down, and you know, therapy has helped massively with that. 00:53:24.960 --> 00:53:30.320 And so if I could give myself uh one bit of advice, it would be don't be so hard on yourself, you know. 00:53:30.320 --> 00:53:33.840 Give give yourself a pat on the back, you know, at times, you know. 00:53:35.039 --> 00:53:43.519 I think over the next few months you'll definitely have a chance to give yourself a pat on the back as you wrap up this massive and have panic attacks every day. 00:53:43.519 --> 00:53:45.679 No, this massive chapter. 00:53:45.679 --> 00:53:53.360 And uh yeah, just really get to appreciate and go down memory lane in a in a lovely way as you wrap up with the Codaline chapter. 00:53:53.360 --> 00:53:56.320 And yeah, it's a big yeah. 00:53:56.320 --> 00:53:57.360 It's a big year. 00:53:57.760 --> 00:54:01.599 No, I look, it's it's it's a big year, it's a long time coming. 00:54:01.599 --> 00:54:02.880 I'm really excited about it. 00:54:02.880 --> 00:54:08.800 I'm excited to hear people singing songs and you know, to hear new songs as well. 00:54:08.800 --> 00:54:10.800 So I think it's gonna be great. 00:54:11.039 --> 00:54:14.639 You know, it's bittersweet, but like it's gonna be awesome. 00:54:14.639 --> 00:54:16.320 I'm really looking forward to it. 00:54:17.280 --> 00:54:30.719 Well, thank you for this lovely chat and for agreeing to do that Pablo Escobar reel with me, which I have got some comments, and people are very shocked that I managed to get it to lip sync to a viral reel. 00:54:31.199 --> 00:54:33.039 I'm not even on TikTok. 00:54:34.079 --> 00:54:35.119 You're on Instagram. 00:54:35.440 --> 00:54:40.639 I am on Instagram, but I I jump in and I'd absolutely, but yeah, I mean it's a bit of fun. 00:54:40.639 --> 00:54:42.079 It's a bit of fun, yeah. 00:54:42.079 --> 00:54:42.400 Yeah. 00:54:42.400 --> 00:54:45.119 I I'm surprised that you actually got me to do that as well. 00:54:47.519 --> 00:54:51.760 And I'm surprised that this actual podcast came together in the end. 00:54:51.760 --> 00:54:53.039 Here's a little fact. 00:54:53.039 --> 00:54:58.239 We recorded this the first time around, and then the file didn't save. 00:54:58.239 --> 00:55:02.400 I managed to resurrect it, and then there was something off with the sound. 00:55:02.400 --> 00:55:18.000 And if it had been anyone else, I would have been crying, crying because, well, all that time and effort, but we were able to sit down again and record the interview again, and uh yeah, I hope you enjoyed it. 00:55:18.000 --> 00:55:25.119 If you did enjoy this chat, I would really appreciate if you could leave a comment or a review or send me a DM. 00:55:25.119 --> 00:55:35.199 I love hearing from you and um hearing what you think helps me be able to build an even better podcast as the episodes go on. 00:55:35.199 --> 00:55:38.480 I'll be back again next week with another great guest. 00:55:38.480 --> 00:55:41.920 In the meantime, go off and enjoy Codoline's new single. 00:55:41.920 --> 00:55:43.199 We were all new. 00:55:43.199 --> 00:55:44.960 See you soon!