Jakson Stubby Talks Transformation | Episode 6: Richard Reid täydellinen litterointi

because you know who wants to be late for a meeting, right? So let's assume you're gonna get there on time So it's knowing why you're there understanding why you're there what your client is requiring from you that is really key because the fundamental level that doesn't ever change the technology around what we do ⁓ it absolutely is gonna, as use your word, is gonna move ahead at a rate of knots. But the reason why you're there will never change. And I ⁓ that's a consistency in my eyes. Dave Stubberfield: Mm. Yeah, it's really interesting. I think for me, I can resonate a lot with that as well. I speak to people in workshops and you can see a different mindset between individuals who are there kind of, right, I've got to be there for nine o'clock, so I will get there for 8.59 and that's on time for them. you of, ⁓ different mindset people would be like, well, what if the train's late? What if there's an accident on the roads? How are you going to mitigate that? And they go, well, I just phone ahead and say, going to be late. But the mindset of other people is how can you kind of say, I'll be there half an hour early and I'll make sure that I'm there on time. And like you said, knowing your techs, that could give you a chance to go through some notes. It could give you a chance to look at an idea that you can bring to the meeting. I think that's a great approach to take. So just kind of sticking on that kind of trend, I guess, when you look back through your career, what's one moment or something that shaped your approach to leadership more than anything else? Richard Reid: Mm. Alright, so I'll go back a long way, okay? Before, I mean when I literally was a teenager, I had a friend of mine, of my friends, because I'm tall, most of my friends, and I've always looked older, which is a curse rather than a at this age, but ⁓ what basically meant was most of my friends were older, and I had a friend of mine. Dave Stubberfield: Hahaha. Richard Reid: who had his father was probably when I knew him was in his 70s, really wise guy and he sat down with me at one point. My parents were getting divorced, it was a tough time. Anyway, so he was talking to me and he said to me, look, he said, you'll go through your life and you will meet people. He said, you'll learn from these people. And all of sudden you'll see someone do something and you'll think to yourself, you know what, I like that. Just take it for yourself. He said, what it will do, it will help around you as an individual. that's always stuck with me, you know, for almost 40 years ago. And what it's meant is I have gone through my life with like, it's like every day to school day, I've gone through my life learning. Every day I'm looking, where can I learn from? Can I learn from Dave Stubberfield? Can I learn from you? Can I learn from you? What do you do that? I don't already do what I don't know that I can use to myself and that's that's that's been a lesson that I've learned, you know in terms of

how to be as a human being Okay in terms of leadership, there's there's all types of things I could turn around to you and say in terms of lessons is learning to listen Okay, a lot of people a lot of leaders a lot of people that in a position of power doing that Okay, and most people will follow you because most people always look to someone in authority. They'll just do it Okay, they might gripe along the way but they will do it but they'll they'll might gripe whether you're right or you're wrong They'll just go to just but they will go along with it. But when you're wrong, it really hits home hard From my perspective just listen learn what your your group around you are saying you don't always have to be right You don't always have to be right Dave Stubberfield: Okay. Totally. Yeah. Richard Reid: Someone is going to be and if your project is the most valuable part of what you're doing, which it should be Then it doesn't matter where the idea comes from. You're going to go and stand in front of it So understand, know, you have your team there for a reason you your team is reporting into you for a reason So listen to them Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it's so true. I did a workshop years ago and this was on the back of talking to a senior leader who said, I've an idea. I know where the process needs to be and this is how we're going to do it. I was like, okay, brilliant. Have you asked your team what they think it should look like? Because these are the ones that actually do it day in, day out. And you're like, no, haven't done that. That's a great idea. So I kind of facilitated a workshop ⁓ and I we did ⁓ two three day event. And at the end of it, said to this senior leader, said, is this the process that you envisioned? And he went, yes, but I didn't think about X, Y or Z. And I said, brilliant. So if we'd have gone ahead with your plan, those gripes that you mentioned, people would have gone, ⁓ we've not thought about this. Would the team have been brave enough to speak up about that? Don't know. But you've kind of got the ability to give people a voice. He's listened with both of his ears and gone, okay, yeah, I understand why we need to do that now. And it just changes that perspective. X, Y, Z things for him became... critical for him to learn more, know more about it and go, right, why is this important in the wider process? So, so key, I think for me, individuals and teams is ⁓ important, but it goes beyond just saying you're empowered to go and do stuff now. You have to kind of give people a safe space and environment and show them what that kind of looks like. When last, ⁓ sorry, Richard Reid: Absolutely. And it's respect as well. You get respect. empowering or enabling someone to go and do what they need to do is a right thing to do. no one's gonna get it right all the time. And people are gonna fail. But what Winston Churchill say? Failure isn't Success isn't final. And it's true. You can't learn you make a mistake. Dave Stubberfield: Totally. Totally, totally agree. Richard Reid: The mistake isn't the issue, it's how you deal with it. Look, how companies respond when I make a mistake is really key to the client because it's going to happen. The industry I'm in, it happens all the time. Okay, from client side to wild side, it doesn't matter, but it's how you deal with it. That's the first thing. And the second thing is the takeaway. What have you taken away from that? What have you learned? Dave Stubberfield: Yep. ⁓ Hmm? And do you know what, you just hit kind of on the whole premise of this podcast, right? It's the success stories, the case studies that are out there, they're all shiny, sunshine and rainbows and everything's good news. The challenges, the learnings and the things we could have done differently, they're never in those case studies. But people have got those stories that they hold onto. And it's like you said, it's taking action on them and learning from those potential failures that you can go, that's where we're gonna improve and what we're gonna do differently. I think if we'd have starting this conversation and say, Rich, what have you not changed in your life and why are you still the way you always are, that would potentially be a short career because you've constantly got to adapt and grow again, technology constantly changing. You to keep up with the times sometimes and learn, like you say, from those failures, which is really, really interesting. Last time we spoke, you mentioned a military approach that you shared with me. Richard Reid: Hmm. Dave Stubberfield: And I love that. Can you just share with everyone kind of how you've kind of applied that? words that stuck with me is taking that hill ⁓ that stuck with me since we last spoke. Richard Reid: All right, so I was given a book, must have been years ago, and I it, and it was like, was, I suppose is probably a too strong a word, but it was a light bulb moment, put it that way. ⁓ And the is Extreme Ownership. It's written by two Navy SEALs that came out and then ⁓ went into business, ⁓ they used what learned ⁓ in military, in SEALs. in business, okay? And if you think about it, if it works when you've got bullets flying over your head and things blowing up around you, it really should work when you're in business because these are survival skills. And what they did, this book was broken into, think it 12 chapters and each chapter's broken into three elements. So the first element is something that happened in Afghanistan or Iraq. Then there was a debrief, which is really, really important. And then there was, what's the lesson learned? Okay, and what I mentioned to you, one things they talked about was decentralized command. Okay, now decentralized command basically means that Dave Stubberfield: . Richard Reid: Everyone has got a layer beneath them because you can only manage so many amount of people you can only take a certain amount of information in at any given time I don't know

about you, but I mean I probably get between 60 and 80 sometimes 100 emails a day It's it's you're at your limit on what you can do because if you think about it takes them a couple of minutes to read and respond Okay, you're talking almost four hours a day that you're responding to emails and know, eight, 10 hour working day, you you're talking about almost half of it. So it's learning how to one, deal with the team you've got, okay, empowering that team to go and do what they should do, to be self-sufficient, you know, give them the tools to do the job, okay? So the point, let's say the example I gave to you is, is saying, Dave, I need you to take your team, go and take that hill over there. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. Richard Reid: Radio in when it's Okay. What you want is Dave to go and take that hill. Okay, if he comes across something, look, I've got a blockade here. Can you do an aerial strike on this so we can get through? Yeah, great. Because you're updating and you're saying, need some help. But what you don't want is someone coming back every five minutes saying, how do I do this? Do go left? Do I go right? Do I go straight? mean, I wait here? Should I go? You don't want that. Okay. But you teach in the military, they teach that being self sufficient, being able to think for yourself. Because what happens if your line of communication gets cut off? Dave Stubberfield: . Richard Reid: Okay, you just sit there. You're not an ant. You've got to go forward. You might not be able to go back. So you just have to be able to think for yourself. And I took a lot from that. And what I did, that book, I gave to everyone, I bought a copy for everyone in the company and I made them all read it. And there were seven people that got it. And they became my management layer because they understood. Dave Stubberfield: . Ready. Richard Reid: the benefits of decentralized command. There was another section in there which was really good. There was two actually. SEALs have what they call Hell Week, which is basically, I can't remember, it's like five or seven days where they literally, they don't sleep, they just do one exercise after another. And one of the examples they gave, they have boat teams. They had six boat teams and they had, they basically go out and it's a race, whoever's best. There are two teams they selected, one, number one and number six. Number one was constantly winning, number six was constantly losing. The guy, the leader in six was blaming his team. Obviously one didn't have anything to, had a problem. The instructor switched the leaders around. And what happened was the team that was losing started to win because they had the instruction. from a leader who knew what he was doing and team six or team one carried on because they'd already learned. The decentralized command bit had already taken on. If the guard was giving them the wrong command, they weren't listening to it they just went. So it showed you how the correct leadership really

does make a difference. And the other thing they did, which was really good, they talked about how can I help you help me? Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yep. Richard Reid: which is, if you think about it, it's actually really, really good. If I need something, all right, Dave, what is it I can do for you to help you to help me get what I need back in return? And it's very simple, but it's very, very effective. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yep. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I see that quite a lot. In some of the LinkedIn messages I get that come in, it's kind of I'll scratch your back, Dave. And if you can kind of get the theme and the vibe of where people are going and applying it to business, I think they are very, very kind of pivotal things to live by. I see so, so often leaders, leadership teams that are. I don't want to say micromanaging, but they are too in the weeds and they are that they got potentially techie people that were promoted into leadership roles. So they're trying to keep up with the technology maybe, but that could be their passion. And they're not leaders in that sense of it. They're leaders in the technology, but not people leaders. And they're not leading the team effectively. So that's really interesting. I just want to pick up on one word you mentioned there. We've mentioned it a couple of times already, and that's empowerment. do you think the biggest mistake is that leaders make when trying to empower people, but it's not working or they're still controlling things, what do you think the biggest mistake might be? Richard Reid: I think it's understanding your team. ⁓ worse than having the wrong person in the role. They be really good at what they do when you just touch on it, when you're saying you have engineers that become, that move a leadership role. And there's nothing wrong with that. And if you have the ability to do it, great. But engineers by and large have got an engineer's mindset. And that is very much into the detail, looking down, focused. Whereas as a leader, you need to be able to step back. not be so detail orientated because that's what your team is for. Your team will feed you that detail, you then make a decision on they've told you, ⁓ you have to have a more of a holistic view on what's going on around you. And I think part of that is the same thing. If you've got the wrong person in a role, no matter how much you empower them, they're going to fail and you're doing them injustice by leaving them there. Dave Stubberfield: Thanks. Richard Reid: Sometimes, be kind is probably wrong, but sometimes what you need to do ⁓ reorientate your team. It's trying to put a jigsaw puzzle together. When you put a jigsaw puzzle together, ⁓ they need to line up, otherwise ⁓ it doesn't work. It's the same thing with your team. Your team needs to be like that. They need to fit in just right. So it's having the right people in the right role is very, very key ⁓ to sure you can empower people. Look, it's also very overused word. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. ⁓ Richard Reid: empowerment, empowerment. We live in a world now with AI, AI will empower you, it's an enabling tool, blah, blah. And yes, it is. But the right hands, I think it comes down to that. You want to promote someone's ideas, yes, but you want to promote them in the right way. It's the right ideas you're promoting, not just because you like someone. ⁓ How ⁓ stories you heard of people failing upwards? Dave Stubberfield: Mm-hmm. ⁓ hands out. Richard Reid: The road is littered with them and the problem is You don't realize what that actually does to productivity, what that actually does. When you've got someone that isn't, I use this expression lightly, but isn't fit for purpose in a role, what happens is they create more chaos than anything else and you don't get done what you need to get done. And sometimes it can take years before something is actually done about it. Whereas you put the right person in the role, take ego out of the equation. Just look at the very basics. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. Yeah. Richard Reid: Are you right for that? Can you do it? Show me you can do it. Job's yours. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah, yeah, totally. You just reminded me of something I employ quite a lot is a skills matrix. And it's great to understand the skills of a team or a department or an entire organization to see which people, which individual has got the right skills. So let's take Excel, something very, very basic. might have someone that is expert, loves it, loves spreadsheets to death. I mean, I'm a bit of a nerd when it comes to spreadsheets, but you have to have the right people that can train and then teach other people. So if they're the expert and you need to go to them for advice, you want someone that's going to give it to you, not just kind of spoon feed them, but kind of, okay, here's how you can learn along the way as well. That person might be an expert. They might not be the best trainer, teacher, coach. So it's finding the right people that can deliver what you need to in that moment in time. And again, could change from day to day. Just because someone's an expert doesn't mean they're gonna be the best leader doesn't mean they're gonna be the best trainer so it's having that kind of context that goes with the skills matrix to say Yes, we might have the gaps the opportunities here But how are you gonna actually empower people to go and learn and equip themselves to make them? I guess as best capable as they possibly can I think for me kind of adding on to that is There's a trust element, right? It's Richard Reid: Absolutely. Dave Stubberfield: I think when leaders say, right, we're going to empower you to do this and they could do the right things. They could give the time, right environment. but if people don't feel that this is safe environment to talk up and speak and they don't trust where that information might be going, people are going to remain silent and they're not going to kind of put themselves out there

because they think their neck might be on the line, right? Richard Reid: Look, you're absolutely right. Let me say this to you, okay? is also then down to a leader to challenge. ⁓ you sit in a group, you're having your Monday morning meeting, okay, and ⁓ feel that someone isn't speaking up, highlight it. Not in a bad way, I'm talking about, you don't want to dig someone out, but say, Dave, do you think about that? What are your thoughts on that? Say what you want to say, fine. I I always just say to people, say whatever you want. I don't care, you can swear, you can jump up and down. As long you're not swearing at me, do whatever you want, okay? Because I want an answer. I want to understand, okay? And that is giving someone the space to feel, one, to feel safe, and two, to say what they want to say. Because you're right, there are people, like, you and I are confident, we can sit, we can talk, we can stand on a stage and we can have a conversation with people. know, that's, it's in our temperament. is who we are as people, but not everyone's like that. Okay if you're if you're more More an introvert Okay, you know you need to be dealt with ⁓ slightly to say someone like you and I who I would say more confident in their abilities of Speak and say what they want to say that again is down for someone in a leadership position to understand his team Understand where the strengths and weaknesses are now an introvert. Okay, someone I mean if you've ever done a disc Dave Stubberfield: Hmm Yeah, yeah. Richard Reid: ⁓ I came out as a DI, okay? ⁓ But you've obviously got S and C. Now, S and C are more aligned to say maybe more of a back end administration role, which is great because every team needs that. Dave Stubberfield: That doesn't surprise me. Yep. Yep. Richard Reid: You you go back to the military, you you've got people that are going to be able to, you know, hold a gun to fire and shoot and you've got someone else on the radio that's going to, you know, that can communicate, you know, might want to shoot. the thing is you divide your team up into areas that actually work. Going back to the jigsaw puzzle, a Swiss, you know, take a, I didn't really call me analogy, but take a Swiss watch, okay. It's a precision instrument. Take one cog out, put the wrong cog in. It will not tell the time. But when all those cogs are all lined up in the right place at the right time, they just work. That's what your team needs to be. And that is very encumbered upon a leader to make sure he has his right people in the right place at the right time. And if things change, being able to pivot and move to adapt to what's going on around. mean, another quote from this book, which is getting a lot of love is, revise, adapt, overcome. You touched on it earlier. It's true in business. have in life, revise, adapt, overcome. If you are static, Dave Stubberfield: Mm. Richard Reid: If you are rigid, you'll snap. But revise, adapt, overcome. Revise the situation, adapt to it, overcome it. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yeah, no, absolutely. mentioned in there, kind introverts and disc profiles. Years ago, said to me, ⁓ Dave, I'm an ambivert. And I went, ⁓ okay, what's that? I'm an introvert I'm an extrovert. And I was like, okay, this sounds a little bit like me. So I'm happy to go out there, go on stage and talk to people and run sessions, workshops, training. But if you flip the kind of the roles there and I'm in a workshop, I might be less in... sort of, I might be less kind of interested. Yeah, I can't think of the word that I'm trying to get out here, but kind of, I guess kind of the imposter syndrome kind of goes, oh yeah, maybe that's not a good idea. So I'll keep quiet on that. And I would probably not speak up. I wouldn't feel like I've got kind of the authority in the room potentially. Richard Reid: Full screen. Dave Stubberfield: What I do when I'm running these sessions is I give people a post-it note. So a question that I might be asking, it's kind of single brainstorm. What do you think you could improve as an example? And then we go around the room and we would share these ideas. So the dominant voices that might go, if I just said it out loud, someone might go, yep, this is what we need to do. And the silent people might go, yeah, okay, we'll go with that. And they don't get their views across. The post-it note for me is kind of a great way of saying we've all got a voice here. And there might be 20 of us in the room. We might have some very similar trails of thought, but you've got diverse thinking there straight away that you can go, yeah, didn't consider that. And again, a ⁓ profile, we've got different ways of looking at scenarios and things. And that for me is kind of a great way. So yeah, I'm an ambivert. So yeah, happy to get up on stage and ⁓ the crazy stuff. But at the same time, ⁓ me in the right environment. I would just kind of become a bit of a ⁓ and not say anything. Which is really really interesting. I kind of self examine myself quite a lot Richard Reid: All right. Let me help you with that. from perspective, standing on takes a lot of courage. I think ⁓ the biggest fear have is public speaking over death. It's crazy. So when you're standing on that you own it, that's you. ⁓ Dave Stubberfield: Yep. Richard Reid: you're talking about a subject matter you know about, you're talking confidently, so it doesn't matter. It's like you and I are having this conversation now. It's not scripted, we haven't spoken, we spoke last week, but this is a very off the cuff conversation about leadership. Okay, we're both able to talk on it because we both understand it. But when you're in an environment that takes you outside of your comfort zone, Okay, and you maybe don't know so much about it. You're then not so sure about how you answer it. Okay, and look, one thing I've learned over the years, okay, because I think a lot of people have that in them. don't think it's, I think people maybe don't admit it,

but a lot of people have that in them, how you frame a question when you ask it. Okay. Dave Stubberfield: Mm. Richard Reid: Now, look, I get it sometimes. If I'm in a focus group or we're talking about stuff, okay, and I'm not leading it and I'm not sure, look, I'll just say, look, I will frame in a way that I feel comfortable saying it. So look, this might be a really stupid question and I'll throw my hands up if it is, but can I just ask you? So in my mind, what I've done is I've framed it so that I've already alerted people I could be asked, is I'm really stupid. I know it might be stupid, but I still would like to know the answer. That's how I frame it. Okay. And look, Dave, you're an intelligent guy. So most things that come out of your mouth are gonna be, it's not gonna be stupid thing. That's it. And it's the same for everyone. I think, look, imposter syndrome, we all get it. mean, look. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. You Yep. Richard Reid: I've done things in the past that, you know, I've been called up on stage to talk about something without any warning whatsoever about a subject matter I have very little knowledge of. And I loved it. I loved being put under that pressure. To me, it was like, I love this because I have very little, I have no margin here. I just got to go and do it. But you know how you do it? You just be yourself. Just be yourself. Dave Stubberfield: Yep. Yep, yep, totally. Richard Reid: I'm going to diverge it a bit, I'm come back. Too many people wear a mask. Okay, they put this mask on, they get every day to put this mask on and believe me, I've done it. And they go and do what they need to do. Take it off. Just be you. Be the real Dave Stubberfield, be the real James Smith. Just, makes such a difference. Because then you allow yourself to grow. You know, one of the things I used to say to ⁓ team, you know, that we all get pressure. I used say, Dave Stubberfield: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, totally, totally. Richard Reid: Diamonds are formed under pressure, but glass cracks and you've got to decide where you are. Dave Stubberfield: Absolutely. Yeah, no, that you're spot on. And I think for me that I asked the daft questions when I'm running training sessions and workshops, because I'm trying to get to the nub of what the problem might be. So I would say, I don't know what you guys do. So here's a daft question. Why'd you do it like that? yeah, it's a good little sort of mindset thing there. And I think sometimes when you're on the other side of it, you kind of go, okay. But I think if you kind of frame it like that, that's interesting. Richard Reid: Yeah. Dave Stubberfield: I'm going to pivot a little bit now. So been, you running your own company ⁓ and now moved into a business. ⁓ That's of a group of businesses for you personally. What was the biggest cultural adjustment to that? Richard Reid: If I'm being honest, go from being someone that's permanently able to make decisions to being able to have that level of flexibility,

but ⁓ it with the territory. You just have to, again, revise, overcome. ⁓ The situation going to change. There are certain traits that you never change. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. Richard Reid: It's what helps you, me and everyone else move ourselves forward and I would never change that. But you have to be, for me, I had to look at it as, fine, listen, you've done this, you need to accept things are going to be different and this is how they're gonna be different. So accept it. Know that you're gonna have to revise, you're gonna have to adapt your outcome in terms of how you operate, how you liaise with people and move forward. Dave Stubberfield: Okay, so on that then, founders or business owners that might be going through a similar journey, ⁓ through an acquisition, who realize how much they need to adapt and overcome, what's your biggest bit of advice for them? Richard Reid: say ego at the equation. Dave Stubberfield: Boom, just like that. Richard Reid: Yeah, just take it out of the equation. It's so easy because Look, you can look at it The it's my baby. This was mine. Well, I don't want to do it that way. Why should I do it that way? But you've made that decision To do what you're doing. So you have to accept that things are going to change Look, just change your mindset. Look at it Take if you take the ego away, you're not defensive Okay, and the problem is when you've got both of those in play, that's when you get friction. Because you're doing that and you don't need it. many people, so much could be done so much easier, so much quicker if that wasn't part of the equation. And look, it's easy for me to sit here and say, ⁓ yeah, just ⁓ your ego. ⁓ worry about it, you'll be fine, it's all good. But takes a long time. ⁓ I'll the first to admit, it took me years. Dave Stubberfield: Yep. Hmm. Richard Reid: I say ego, I don't talk about, ⁓ don't mean like, ⁓ look at me, I'm great, I'm fantastic, and therefore you've to do what I say. I don't mean that. I just mean the ego that pushes you forward. The ego that turns around and says, no, that's wrong. No, you shouldn't be doing it. Someone shouldn't say that to you. It's that ego I'm talking about. It's more the internal, not the external. If you can master that, truly master it, Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Richard Reid: and not be a hostage to it, you are gonna be so much better in terms of how you do things. And there's a saying, he's dead now, but there's a, I don't know what you class him as, I suppose a thought leader back in the day, a guy called Wayne Dyer. Wayne W. Dyer, think his name was, really interesting. A little bit out there, but great books. one of his sayings was, when you change the way that you look at things, the things you look at change. And it is so obvious and so true. Dave Stubberfield: Mm. Richard Reid: you look at something from a perspective of, he's coming at me, therefore I'm going to defend myself, as opposed to, well look, the guy's got genuine questions, he's entitled

to have an answer, let me answer them. ⁓ coming at you is exactly the same. All you're doing in your mind is reframing how you're looking at it, how you're taking in that information that's been put to you. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah, it's so true. I think for me again, process mapping is the one where I go, why'd you do it like this? And the general answer is we've always done it this way. And I'm not there to say you should do it differently. It's kind of taking people a step back and going, could you do it differently? What could you do differently? And throwing ideas out there to help get them thinking about it as well. These guys are the experts in what they do. I'm not going to tell them what they should do and how they should do it. I can see the bottlenecks, the kind of barriers and the blockers that prevent them from doing great work. So how can we make their lives easier for one and take out the things that are causing them pain? They know the answer to that. And it's, think, again, leaving that ego at a door rather than saying we do it like this because of X, Y, Z reasons and da, da, da, da, is a long winded way of saying we've always done it this way. That's the... you need to talk to people on a human level and to say, no one's digging you out here. No one's saying this is wrong. It's how can you do it better? kind of, yeah, leaving that ego at the door is massive, a great piece of advice. So sometimes acquisitions can really look quite straightforward and simple from the outside looking in. The reality is that kind of hard work, integration, onboarding, it takes a great deal of time and effort. What do people underestimate most, do think, when it comes to kind of that on boarding and integration. Richard Reid: When you go, mean, we just purchased another company. when you move into a larger organization, it's a tidal wave of information that's thrown at you ⁓ at once. And a case of ⁓ managing Okay, there's different cultures, different mindsets. You know, when a company is bigger, okay, when you go from 40 people to 400, you've got a totally different mindset, compliance is different. The way audits are done, processes are different, because they have to be, because you've got so much to manage. can't do things. like maybe I would have done in the past, say, know what, okay, sit and talk to the guys, Mark, you know what, you're right, just do it. Just run with it, let's just do it, and just see where to, just shake the tree, see what falls out, and we'll go from there. Can't do that. Because more, ⁓ there's more process to take into account, and two, as smaller company, you can take the gamble. As a larger company, can't because it can have such a detrimental effect. So it's a case of just understanding what you're moving into. Take the time to learn the culture, I think, would be one thing. know, ⁓ look, it's I don't work from the head office environment. Therefore, I don't see all the people all the time. But for people that are going to be absorbed into that environment, meet the people, understand, know who you're working with, know who your colleagues are and don't fear anything. People fear change. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm Yeah. Totally, totally. I think for me, it's kind of that onboarding is twofold, right? If you're the one being acquired, you wanna be bought in with an arm wrap around you and that warm fuzzy feeling to make you feel like everything's gonna be okay. And it's going to be okay, but you want that reassurance. And on the flip side of that, if you are the organization acquiring, you wanna be providing the best onboarding experience going. You don't wanna have people feeling ostracized that they are kind of this. Richard Reid: Yeah. Dave Stubberfield: this company that sits on the outskirts and they're not involved in the kind of the nucleus of the bigger company. it's a real kind of, I say it's a tough thing to crack because like you just said, you've got to understand the cultures and how these two organizations work and kind of mesh them together, like you said. Richard Reid: Yeah, look, things are going to change. That's a prerequisite. It might not happen straight away, but they will change. it's knowing that, one, not fearing it, as we just said, and two, knowing you can move forward with it. people become all of a sudden, you turn around to someone and say, all right, by the way, we just bought your company. Welcome to the new world. Okay, it's like, is my job safe? It's the first thing that comes out of their mouth. Okay, bye. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yeah. Richard Reid: your jobs are safe. They're just saying that now, I don't know if they mean that. But looking at it from the other side, they bought a business with clients, the clients have contacts within the business. What's a client gonna think if a business is acquired and all of a sudden everyone disappears? So what I'm saying is, sometimes, again, this is where ego comes in. What about me? What about me? Dave Stubberfield: Yep. Yep. Richard Reid: As opposed to looking at the bigger picture, well, hang on a second. Yeah, all right. There's not, maybe I'm not, I don't feel as certain as I did five minutes ago, but these clients know me. They understand who I am. And I understand them more importantly. Why would a business that's acquiring us want to lose that continuity? Because they still have the potential of losing the client. They've just got to pay whatever they pay to buy a business and find that their clients start leaving. Dave Stubberfield: and Richard Reid: So it's thinking that way as well because look most business, I can't talk in general, I can talk in general so I can't talk in specifics, but when you buy a business you're buying that, you're literally doing that, you're buying that business, you're buying that client base and you want to grow it, you don't want to it diminish, therefore you want that continuity, you need that continuity. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah, totally. I

think for me again, it's, it's how do you approach that as well? Every scenario is going to be different. Yes, you can have a playbook of kind of best practice what we should do, but it could be that acquisition has happened out of necessity. could be that it's come with a lot of challenges. ⁓ could be you're after the IP or the technology and it's okay. What do we, how do we sort of navigate this? ⁓ you're right. Those people are Richard Reid: Yep. Dave Stubberfield: going to be thinking about themselves primarily? Am I safe? Is my role safe? And how do you get people on board to the bigger picture? do you get them to see this is why you might have been acquired? This is why we're going in the direction we are. And it's, again, it's that warm, fuzzy feeling to say that, like you say, change is inevitable. But how do we kind of adapt and overcome, we've said, ⁓ that we kind of take things to the next level. ⁓ see a lot of acquisitions that go horribly wrong because ego isn't left at the door. The leader of the bigger firm will come in and kind of stamp his authority or her authority down. And that's going to rub people up the wrong way. I've seen it where the business has acquired, the leader there, the CEO, the person whose baby it was, go, no thanks, and walk out the door. And that's scary. because you've just lost the person who created this. And that's the person who probably loves it more than anyone else. And they've just walked away from it because of the way they've been treated. And it's so, so critical at that point. think me, that kind of, that, transformation that's when it becomes personal, professional business. That's when in that environment, it all merges into one because change is affecting so many different things there. So guess for me, the next question is. What's most important in the first 90 days of an acquisition? Richard Reid: safe for people to feel included. to be part of the journey on what the change is going to be. I how we are as a company. ⁓ like to say we do it really well. You on a business, you go there, you introduce yourself to the team. ⁓ You the time to do that ⁓ and look, I know C-suite went to, we bought a set of business people recently, they go there, they took the to spend time with the people that are in the business to reassure them because ⁓ like we said, people feel, what about me? They then have constantly gone back and forth and back and forth. They're part of our sales call now on a weekly basis. they feel that, okay, yes, we've been taken over, but we're now just part of something bigger. Business as usual, we carry on doing what we're doing. so my perspective was when we SEC eyes, I've got a bigger base to play with now. I've got. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yeah. Richard Reid: Hospitality on this side. I've got this. I've got in-building networks on this side. Great. I've got more clients. This is great. That was my point of view. And really, if you think about it, if they thought about it, it should be the same thing. All okay, we've got a bigger filter plane now. I've got more resources available to me. I can go and sell Sainsbury's or whoever. Tesco's this because we got this in our portfolio. I've got something else to go in. I've got something else to keep me there, keep it sticky with the client. And that's really important. That for me would be my advice. Look at the positive, don't look at the negative. Too many people look at what they don't have and not what they do have. Look at what you have. Look what you're doing. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Totally. Yeah, no, absolutely. And I think again, it's the the thing that comes into my mind is the bigger sand pits playing is like you just said, ⁓ walls of that office have just grown exponentially, potentially. And it's you've got so much more opportunity. And that could be career progression. That could be opportunities to ⁓ new people. Also, it could be untold different things that come into play at that point. Yeah, it's just massive. OK. Richard Reid: Yeah. Thank you. Dave Stubberfield: So you've got two grown up children. do you feel that fatherhood has shaped the way you lead? And I guess how you view success as well. Richard Reid: biggest success I'll ever have is having my children. Because it just is, because you're bringing life into the world, your children are your legacy, they're what you leave behind. So that I would say. In terms of how I, as a parent, I'll you this little story. So when my son was about 11 years old, he just secondary school, ⁓ and I going with him, and he was really miserable, and I said, what is it? Damn, what is it? Dave Stubberfield: Love that. Richard Reid: And he's like, took me a while to get into robot, and I pulled over, I said, what is it? Basically, he at school with kids that had older brothers or sisters, and they were talking about stuff, he had no idea. And they were like joking around, and he didn't understand what they were saying. So I said, you know what? ask me anything you want to ask me, again, swear, say whatever you want to say, okay, and I will answer it in a way I feel you can understand. And we did, most of it was around sex, know, usual 11 year old boys. So I sat and we spoke, must have been for a good half an hour, 40 minutes, and I can't tell you exactly what was in the conversation, it was too long ago, but what it did, changed my relationship with him. It took it more to a guiding role. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. Richard Reid: as opposed to just being a parent. And I think that is where it's key with leadership as well, is you guide. you're leading a team, if having to do all the work for them, then either your ego's in the way or they're not good for what they're doing. They're not fit for purpose. If you've got a team where you can guide them, again, going back to decentralized command, you don't have to watch everything they do. And I think that's the lesson that I learned by being... ⁓ Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yeah.

Richard Reid: open with my kids by allowing them to go and do what they needed to do. It allowed, learned how the best way ⁓ get a response out of people, because again, you create a space for people to feel safe. You turn around and say, look, kids, you're gonna mess up. You're gonna do something ⁓ it's gonna be wrong. And it could be on various different levels. But we're your parents, I'm your dad. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. Richard Reid: I will be there and will always get through this together. ⁓ And that's it. And it's the same, you can apply the same approach in business. Being and demonstrative is not always the right way. But I mean it as far as being open to listen to your team. ⁓ Someone to you, ⁓ someone come to you and say, look, I'm really struggling at moment. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yep. Richard Reid: you know, my parents, my father's ill, my mother's ill, I've got a problem here, my son or daughter have got X, Y, Z, you know, they might need to someone to talk to, you know, and you give me 20 minutes, half an hour of your time, just even as a sounding board. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Yeah. Richard Reid: more valuable than you turning around to them and saying, there you go, there's an extra five grand on your wage packet. I'm using it at a very high level, but to know that that person has got the ability to just speak to you, I'm not saying you take on everyone's problems, and I'm not saying you get involved, but just to listen to someone, maybe give them a little bit of advice, I think is valuable. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah, so true. You've just kind of sparked a memory in me. So I was sitting down with what would it been at the time, managing director maybe of a department of a group. Me and my other half had had two miscarriages at this point. We were kind of exploring the IVF journey and what that might look like. And he took the time to have a chat with me about it. He could have just gone, Dave, I'm sorry to hear that. What did you want to talk to me about? Because I'm a very busy person. I would say the majority of that meeting, which was half an hour, we were talking about me. And that was just so powerful for me because one, I respect that person now so much, but two, he cared and he was asking genuine questions. And that for me will stay with me for as long as I live because that is just, that's a great leader right there. Richard Reid: Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so just as an aside, I love mentoring people. love giving back. I wouldn't say, I'm not sitting here saying I'm the world's greatest leader, because I'm not, by a shot, but we've all got our battle scars and lessons that we've learned on our journey. And I'm currently mentoring a 15 year old kid and he's someone that wasn't responding. and I've done ⁓ I'm two tracks together. I'm teaching physical activity as in learning how to box and things like that but also giving him life lessons in between. So he understands and I've seen in the last month how all of a sudden he's starting to respond. You know, I say to him, I want you here for 9.30. He gets here dead on the dot if not earlier. Right, we're going to do this. mean, on Saturday I was training with him and I pushed him really hard and he did it. He took everything. And it made me think actually that there's a bit of tough love involved in this. not, you know, so because I want him to respond. I want him to push himself. And I thought to myself, you know what? If more people took more time with people of that age, they would be so much better as they get older. Because we've got social media. Social media has basically put people, put kids and adults in silo. I how many times do you get on a train and you see this? Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. constantly, ⁓ Richard Reid: ⁓ yeah, I say most people have got their heads down, okay? They can answer, they can get very leery on a text or a message or whatever, but put them in the real world, it's like, can't speak, because they've forgotten the art of conversation, you know? ⁓ it's getting worse and worse. So ⁓ said to this kid, I said, look. Dave Stubberfield: Yeah. Richard Reid: When you come to me, I said, you come to me with questions. You ask me things. I said, I'm going to teach you the art of conversation. said, because when you get to 25, OK, and all of your peers are sat there like, uh, what? You're going to be like, well, how do you do this? Tell me about that. Tell me about that. You are going to learn to ask questions. You are going to learn to be curious. Dave Stubberfield: Totally, that's the word I was gonna use is being curious, absolutely. Rich, this has been amazing, mate. I'm gonna end our podcast on three rapid fire questions if you don't mind. one habit that you won't compromise on. Boxing, brilliant. I think for me that's the discipline that comes with everything you've just mentioned there, ⁓ One that's taught you the most. Richard Reid: Thank you. Boxing. ⁓ my God, I've got so many. people, trusting the wrong person. Dave Stubberfield: Okay. Yep. thing that leaders don't talk about enough. Richard Reid: themselves in terms of their emotions. They don't let go, they hold Let else feel your human side. ⁓ Let know you're not, as I've often been called, a robot. Let them know that there is a softer side, but a side that there's a humane side to you. Dave Stubberfield: Hmm. Yeah, brilliant. that's been so insightful. Some real nuggets of wisdom there as well that people can take away, I'm sure. ⁓ It's an absolute pleasure having you on the podcast today. Thank you so much. Richard Reid: Thank you for your time. Thank you