Jakson Bringing People Together: Purpose, Influence and the Path to Excellence with Barry Moline täydellinen litterointi

question that that is, you know, sort of workplace appropriate. 00:05:49.649 --> 00:05:56.370 Uh, you know, what's a food that uh that brings back a memory from a childhood? 00:05:56.370 --> 00:05:59.490 We don't want to know what the memory is, we just want to know what the food is. 00:05:59.490 --> 00:06:02.529 And somebody will say, Oh, it was my grandmother's fruitcake. 00:06:02.529 --> 00:06:04.209 And then you just stop there. 00:06:04.209 --> 00:06:16.129 And the goal of that exercise is not to have that long conversation, but at a break later or in a private conversation later, you say, Hey, tell me about that fruitcake story. 00:06:16.129 --> 00:06:17.889 You know, what's up with that? 00:06:17.889 --> 00:06:25.569 And and that way it evokes both a memory, a personal memory, but it also evokes a conversation that we can have later. 00:06:25.569 --> 00:06:31.810 Or, or even something like, What are you, what music are you listening to, or or what are you streaming these days? 00:06:31.810 --> 00:06:37.329 And you just say the name of the of the show, and then you move on. 00:06:37.329 --> 00:06:40.050 And and then people will talk about it later. 00:06:40.050 --> 00:06:42.849 And then when they do that, they're getting to know each other. 00:06:42.849 --> 00:06:51.009 And and I know right out of the box, um, I I have a list of these on my website, so we can leave those, have those in the show notes. 00:06:51.329 --> 00:06:52.129 Oh, that's great. 00:06:52.129 --> 00:06:53.969 Yeah, definitely we're gonna share with our audience. 00:06:53.969 --> 00:07:04.930 And I think creating, I mean, these icebreakers will bring people together, they connect, they get to know each other, and that's a great way to start collaborating and and to know the interests of the other person and connect to him. 00:07:04.930 --> 00:07:09.009 So, very like you you've worked for many years as a CEO. 00:07:09.009 --> 00:07:12.529 What have you learned about the role of shared purpose in bringing people together? 00:07:12.529 --> 00:07:14.290 And you've started alluding to that, right? 00:07:14.290 --> 00:07:22.849 There's something that they will be working all towards the same direction, but we see a lot of priorities um that are different in organizations, right? 00:07:22.849 --> 00:07:24.449 We see competing priorities. 00:07:24.449 --> 00:07:25.969 How do you bring people together? 00:07:25.969 --> 00:07:28.769 How do you bring different perspectives together? 00:07:29.569 --> 00:07:38.930 Well, the once we've we're working on the first role of of bringing people together and getting them to know each other. 00:07:38.930 --> 00:07:41.250 And and it's a constant process. 00:07:41.250 --> 00:07:47.170 You know, you you always have to remind people we're working together and and let's get to know each other. 00:07:47.170 --> 00:07:52.689 Uh what once you have that, now you can talk about your shared purpose. 00:07:52.689 --> 00:08:00.610 So it's a leader's job, again, not to force people to work together, but to invite them in to work together and get to know each other. 00:08:00.610 --> 00:08:05.329 And then it's a leader's job to to tell them what we're doing. 00:08:05.329 --> 00:08:14.050 And that purpose, it can, it can be big and broad, you know, we're here to save the world on this issue, right? 00:08:14.050 --> 00:08:17.889 Or we're here to supply the world, you know, with this product. 00:08:17.889 --> 00:08:21.170 And that's gonna, and that's our role in this world. 00:08:21.170 --> 00:08:29.409 Um, but it's um, I think more than anything, it's it's just what are we doing on this particular project? 00:08:29.409 --> 00:08:38.930 If if we have a uh a project where we're where we're trying to, let's say, um, you know, organize a conference, okay. 00:08:38.930 --> 00:08:47.250 A conference isn't saving the world, but it is bringing people together on issues of the day or whatever issues that we're we're working on. 00:08:47.250 --> 00:08:49.570 And we want that conference to go well. 00:08:49.570 --> 00:08:53.090 We want the workflow, people to register for the conference. 00:08:53.090 --> 00:09:00.290 We want, you know, the speakers to to speak well at the conference, you know, we want networking to happen at the conference. 00:09:00.290 --> 00:09:04.129 We want the the shrimp and the crackers all to show up on time. 00:09:04.129 --> 00:09:11.010 We all those things involve a network of people doing things, you know, at the right moment. 00:09:11.010 --> 00:09:15.570 And so you it requires a team to put all that together. 00:09:15.570 --> 00:09:21.250 If our goal as a team is to put on a great conference, well, we know now we know that purpose. 00:09:21.250 --> 00:09:28.050 And then we divide up the roles of that, of you know, what has to happen to make the conference a success. 00:09:28.050 --> 00:09:33.650 Somebody's in charge of catering and someone is in charge of registration and someone's in charge of speakers. 00:09:33.650 --> 00:09:38.050 So we're all working together and and we know the pieces of the puzzle. 00:09:38.050 --> 00:09:43.490 And we're yeah, and now we we know that we want to put on a great conference. 00:09:43.490 --> 00:09:48.450 And and because we know each other, we understand our purpose, you know, we can work on that. 00:09:48.450 --> 00:09:55.250 And and if it requires two or three people to work on catering together, but one person is a lead, you know, we're all gonna do that. 00:09:55.250 --> 00:10:04.770 And then whenever when we need help finding speakers, then maybe those three people will work together on you know on finding speakers, you know, with a different person in charge. 00:10:04.770 --> 00:10:14.930 But the point is that we know what our roles are, we know what our tasks are, we we like the people that we're working with, and or at least we can tolerate them. 00:10:14.930 --> 00:10:18.530 And and then you know, and now we know what we're doing.

00:10:18.530 --> 00:10:23.810 So we can either be big and broad or can be targeted to this particular project. 00:10:23.810 --> 00:10:26.530 But it's a leader's job to say, here's what we're doing. 00:10:26.530 --> 00:10:29.410 Let's go do this and let's go put on a great conference. 00:10:29.730 --> 00:10:39.730 So it means the leader will be setting really the direction for the people, giving them clearing their expectations, uh, making sure expectations are clear for everyone, making sure that everybody knows their role. 00:10:39.730 --> 00:10:44.610 So that helps people to really perform better if they are put to work together. 00:10:44.610 --> 00:10:48.370 Uh, but sometimes people have challenges on projects, right? 00:10:48.370 --> 00:10:50.290 Whatever is small or big is a project. 00:10:50.290 --> 00:10:56.210 Sometimes people differ in opinions, sometimes they one person would challenge the assumptions. 00:10:56.210 --> 00:11:07.250 How do you think the leader can constantly um create the trust needed uh for people to, regardless of these challenges, have the best behavior and still work together, right? 00:11:07.250 --> 00:11:15.250 We see people sometimes they get annoyed and leave, uh, even if they are paid to do the job, but they might really go to that extreme. 00:11:15.250 --> 00:11:21.490 So, what how do you think what should the leader do to create that trust, to keep that trust running? 00:11:21.890 --> 00:11:27.650 Yeah, well, that is um uh that's a you know a continuing question. 00:11:27.650 --> 00:11:29.650 Well, so your question is about trust. 00:11:29.650 --> 00:11:34.930 Um, but there's another element in there, and sort of, you know, what do we do with with disagreement? 00:11:34.930 --> 00:11:44.610 You know, first is we want our groups or our task groups, we want them to do their best at trying to resolve their their disagreement. 00:11:44.610 --> 00:12:00.210 And and if they can't, if they truly cannot, and they need an arbiter, they need you know a referee, uh, then then that's the role for of that leader to come in and and say, you know, let what's the budget? 00:12:00.210 --> 00:12:01.810 Should we get shrimp or chicken? 00:12:01.810 --> 00:12:06.290 You know, we don't know, we really want to get shrimp, but we don't have the money, you know, whatever that might be. 00:12:06.290 --> 00:12:21.570 I know that's kind of a silly example, but still the point is that uh if if there's a disagreement in the group, then and they truly cannot come to a conclusion, then you know, it's appropriate for a leader to to step in at that moment. 00:12:21.570 --> 00:12:24.050 But your question truly is about trust. 00:12:24.050 --> 00:12:39.810 And and trust is kind of an interesting um uh phenomenon in that in that you you can be trusted to always do the wrong thing. 00:12:39.810 --> 00:12:43.330 Uh you can be trusted to always do the right thing. 00:12:43.330 --> 00:12:46.850 You could, you know, trust is a is a reputation kind of

thing. 00:12:46.850 --> 00:12:48.930 It's it's based on your behaviors. 00:12:48.930 --> 00:12:56.850 So like I know somebody that we could always trust to do the thing that would be best for him. 00:12:56.850 --> 00:13:00.370 And and yeah, I like this. 00:13:00.370 --> 00:13:01.090 Yes, absolutely. 00:13:01.090 --> 00:13:10.530 Even if it wasn't, yeah, even if it wasn't the best for everyone else or the best for the organization, we always knew that he was going to be thinking, hmm, how can I benefit from this? 00:13:10.530 --> 00:13:11.810 Yeah, he was predictable. 00:13:11.810 --> 00:13:13.650 And we and we could trust him. 00:13:13.650 --> 00:13:14.210 Yeah. 00:13:14.210 --> 00:13:21.970 Now, that doesn't mean we relied on him to do everything because we knew he was always going to do the thing that benefited him. 00:13:21.970 --> 00:13:26.610 Um, but we still could, you know, trusted him to do that. 00:13:26.610 --> 00:13:29.970 So, so trust is is really about behaviors. 00:13:29.970 --> 00:13:40.129 It's it's about uh a you know, watching somebody and seeing what behaviors they elicit over time, and those are the behaviors we can expect going forward. 00:13:40.129 --> 00:13:43.810 So um, you know, how do we develop trust? 00:13:43.810 --> 00:13:53.330 We we we watch other people, we look at the at the reps, you know, we we see, you know, time after time, is this what they do? 00:13:53.330 --> 00:14:02.129 And and uh the majority of people want to do the right thing, you know, that we we see them trying to do the right thing. 00:14:02.129 --> 00:14:15.090 Um, but nevertheless, if we want to be trustworthy, and that's all we can do in terms of our behavior, we can talk about this with our colleagues about what is trust. 00:14:15.090 --> 00:14:23.650 But if we want to be somebody that people can say, I trust Barry with this project to go and do the right thing, right? 00:14:23.650 --> 00:14:26.129 Then it's done through our behavior. 00:14:26.129 --> 00:14:41.650 We have to be the one who who shows that behavior, who, when given a project, you know, looks around for what's the best for this group or what's the best for our purpose, and then go down the road of trying to do that. 00:14:41.650 --> 00:14:46.290 So uh I think trust is also good to talk about. 00:14:46.290 --> 00:14:59.170 Uh it's it's you know, what it when something needs to get done is is is just asking people what do we need to do and having that conversation and then taking that action and going down that road. 00:14:59.170 --> 00:15:04.850 But ultimately it comes down to behavior and are we consistent in our own behavior? 00:15:05.410 --> 00:15:23.650 Yeah, and I remember a couple of years ago we were having training, and the guy said, if you want to trust people based on two things, their competence, whether they have the expertise and to do whatever they are asked to do, and their attitude and their behavior, and and how they are present for others or not, they're present for themselves or for others. 00:15:23.650 --> 00:15:24.770 That's really very important. 00:15:24.770 --> 00:15:28.050 I think I I like the distinction you made here, Barry. 00:15:28.050 --> 00:15:35.410 And what um sometimes people behavior also helps maybe creates more silos, right? 00:15:35.410 --> 00:15:41.090 Because they distend themselves, they create silos between uh different groups in the organization. 00:15:41.090 --> 00:15:56.290 When it comes to the leader and influencing the group he's working with, what advice would you give the leader to really break down silos and make sure that there's more collaboration between departments, between functions, between groups or individuals? 00:15:57.570 --> 00:16:10.690 Silos are tough because if we think about purpose for a second and we go back to the accounting department versus the marketing department, okay. 00:16:10.690 --> 00:16:19.170 There are definitely two different kinds of people that work in those departments and they have different goals, different, different missions within the organization. 00:16:19.170 --> 00:16:31.570 Of course, we have a broader purpose, we're all trying to launch this product, but nevertheless, the accounting people are making sure that all the numbers work and the marketing people want as many eyeballs on the product as possible. 00:16:31.570 --> 00:16:43.490 So they have they they have you know different things that they're focused on when it comes to the outcome uh and or at least the tasks to get to an outcome. 00:16:43.490 --> 00:16:45.730 And they don't speak the same language. 00:16:45.730 --> 00:16:51.730 You know, the accounting people are talking in numbers, and the marketing people may be speaking in words and images. 00:16:51.730 --> 00:16:59.970 So uh, you know, we know that ultimately they have the big goal, but they have their teams. 00:16:59.970 --> 00:17:10.769 And within their teams, their leaders, their head of marketing, their head of accounting, they're saying that we are a team. 00:17:10.769 --> 00:17:16.210 We're the accounting team, and we've got a great purpose to control costs. 00:17:16.210 --> 00:17:29.490 And the marketing people are saying, we're a team, and we've got a great purpose to get as many people to see our product and to get and to increase sales or whatever we want to do for the organization so that people see us. 00:17:29.490 --> 00:17:33.889 And we don't care about money, we just want to be seen. 00:17:33.889 --> 00:17:41.809 So within the organization, they kind of have different, you know, purposes and different leaders that are driving them. 00:17:41.809 --> 00:17:48.210 And they're on team marketing, they're on team accounting, and they're they're gonna have friction, right? 00:17:48.210 --> 00:17:54.369 So the only way to get them together, and I've had this experience before, is to get them together. 00:17:54.369 --> 00:18:01.009 I mean, it goes back to the first thing we talked about, which is that uh, you

know, helping people get to know each other. 00:18:01.009 --> 00:18:04.210 Uh, and and it sounds easy, right? 00:18:04.210 --> 00:18:27.649 You know, get everybody to go bowling or whatever, but sometimes it's just sitting down with individuals and getting people in a meeting to talk about what's your goal in accounting and what's your goal in marketing, and just have a conversation about how when we've got an issue where money is tight, but we still need more eyeballs, what what can we do? 00:18:27.649 --> 00:18:29.490 Do we do we spend more money? 00:18:29.490 --> 00:18:32.689 Well, no, the accounting department won't let us spend more money. 00:18:32.689 --> 00:18:37.169 Um, what are there other ways to go out and get eyeballs that don't cost as much money? 00:18:37.169 --> 00:18:38.929 Now we're brainstorming. 00:18:38.929 --> 00:18:57.889 But still, the point is the only way to do it, the only way to get through it is to get people together, to talk about what their departments do, what their goals are in their departments, and then talk about some of their big problems and how they can brainstorm together to get them done. 00:18:57.889 --> 00:19:06.609 You you may not come to a great solution, uh, but helping people get to know each other. 00:19:06.609 --> 00:19:16.769 Now, I I will say this that in my two CEO jobs, I came into each one of them, and the they didn't tell me this when when they hired me. 00:19:16.769 --> 00:19:18.289 The board did not tell me. 00:19:18.289 --> 00:19:25.490 They didn't tell me that in each case the organization had major problems where people were not getting along. 00:19:25.490 --> 00:19:31.809 And and that I've I felt a little betrayed each time. 00:19:31.809 --> 00:19:37.809 I felt a little betrayed because I mean it wasn't like I'm out of here, you know, you guys lied to me. 00:19:37.809 --> 00:19:40.450 Um, but they it wasn't quite like that. 00:19:40.450 --> 00:19:46.129 But there was um, you know, I did have a reputation for helping people come together. 00:19:46.129 --> 00:19:53.730 And I very quickly analyzed the situation each time and said, like, whoa, these people don't like each other. 00:19:53.730 --> 00:19:55.009 Like, what is going on? 00:19:55.009 --> 00:19:55.409 Wow. 00:19:55.409 --> 00:20:02.210 And you know, it was the the legal department and the and the communications department and the and the accounting department. 00:20:02.210 --> 00:20:04.689 It was everybody was doing their own thing. 00:20:04.689 --> 00:20:12.689 And that's the problem, is that their previous leader was just letting every department do its thing, and then they were they were there was a lot of friction. 00:20:12.689 --> 00:20:17.730 And uh ultimately what I did was I I I listened to everybody. 00:20:17.730 --> 00:20:21.009 I had private meetings with everyone, I listened to their their issues. 00:20:21.009 --> 00:20:23.250 I just let them talk, let them be heard. 00:20:23.250 --> 00:20:25.809 I didn't try to identify any solutions. 00:20:25.809 --> 00:20:31.649 And then I just started to get different departments together in different ways. 00:20:31.649 --> 00:20:39.009 And and in my head, I I thought to myself, you know, it's gonna take about six months before we really notice a difference. 00:20:39.009 --> 00:20:46.849 It's not gonna be solved in six months, but it'll take six months before everybody will will begin to know and be comfortable with everyone else. 00:20:46.849 --> 00:20:56.450 And then after about a year, people will say, huh, well, you know, things are a little bit different here than than they were, you know, a year ago, before Barry came along. 00:20:56.450 --> 00:21:03.889 And I thought to myself, you know, after 18 months, people will have forgotten what life was like beforehand. 00:21:03.889 --> 00:21:18.129 But even still, it's a continuous process of making sure that that people understand the various departments, understand everybody's goals, everybody's friction and everybody's restrictions, their limits. 00:21:18.129 --> 00:21:23.089 And once they do, then they can say, well, we we don't have unlimited money. 00:21:23.089 --> 00:21:26.450 Uh, I understand why accounting needs receipts for everything. 00:21:26.450 --> 00:21:36.210 So we'll do better at getting receipts, and maybe they'll be better at helping us identify ways where we can maybe push the limits on how much money we have. 00:21:37.009 --> 00:21:40.929 And this is a great example, and I think you have a lot of experience in this, Barry. 00:21:40.929 --> 00:21:45.409 But we when we we met in preparation of this podcast, we spoke a little bit about influence. 00:21:45.409 --> 00:21:49.089 Now you were in a position where you were able to influence the opposition. 00:21:49.089 --> 00:21:52.289 People naturally will be listening more. 00:21:52.289 --> 00:22:08.689 If people are not in in um um that doesn't have the authority or the influence to um influence people uh and their behavior, what recommendation, what advice would you give them to be able to do that without authority, without power? 00:22:09.089 --> 00:22:11.009 Yeah, that that's a good question. 00:22:11.009 --> 00:22:26.369 It's a hard question to Uh to get through because we tend to think of influence as I have an idea, I have a direction, and I want you to come to my side. 00:22:26.369 --> 00:22:27.169 That's it. 00:22:27.169 --> 00:22:32.929 I'm I I'm gonna you know force you to think like I do. 00:22:32.929 --> 00:22:35.250 And and that just never works. 00:22:35.250 --> 00:22:44.689 Ethical influence, and and but I mean there's ethical influence, and then there's I I don't know what you would call on the other side, sort of manipulative influence, right? 00:22:44.689 --> 00:22:45.329 Yeah. 00:22:45.329 --> 00:22:53.169 Where I uh well, let's talk about what ethical influence is, and it'll be pretty clear uh the direction that we need to go. 00:22:53.169 --> 00:22:55.970 And ethical influence has

three parts to it. 00:22:55.970 --> 00:23:01.649 First is that it has to be um, you know, real, it has to be factual. 00:23:01.649 --> 00:23:11.970 And and I know these days we can argue over facts, but if if there was a car accident, if we're watching a car accident, we can agree there was a car accident. 00:23:11.970 --> 00:23:13.490 That's a fact, okay? 00:23:13.490 --> 00:23:15.569 Two cars hit each other. 00:23:15.569 --> 00:23:23.089 We might disagree on the speed of the cars, or were the cars going head on, or was it 90 degrees or whatever? 00:23:23.089 --> 00:23:25.889 But even still, we can agree there was a car accident. 00:23:25.889 --> 00:23:27.569 So that's a fact. 00:23:27.569 --> 00:23:31.250 We need to focus on the things that we agree on are facts. 00:23:31.250 --> 00:23:36.049 The second element of ethical influence is that it has to make sense. 00:23:36.049 --> 00:23:44.049 You know, whatever, if I'm trying to to convince you to do something, you have to say, well, I'm not sure I agree, but I can see how that might work. 00:23:44.049 --> 00:23:47.970 Okay, you know, I I can imagine, you know, it's within the realm. 00:23:47.970 --> 00:23:58.849 If I was telling you, uh, just put on this backpack and we're gonna fly to the moon right now, when you know, when I when you pull on this string, you know, that doesn't make sense. 00:23:58.849 --> 00:23:59.490 Yeah, right. 00:23:59.490 --> 00:23:59.970 Okay. 00:23:59.970 --> 00:24:09.329 So um, but whatever it is, we can say, well, well, you know, I'm not sure I agree, but I can see how that could work, you know, under certain circumstances. 00:24:09.329 --> 00:24:31.089 But the third one, which I think the third element of ethical influence, which I think is the most important, is that if I'm trying to convince you of doing something, is this something that I would uh try to convince my family to do, my parents, my spouse, my children, my grandparents, my friends. 00:24:31.089 --> 00:24:41.809 Is this something that people who are gonna see me tomorrow or next week after they've tried it, after they've done it, are gonna say, oh, Barry, I did that. 00:24:41.809 --> 00:24:46.529 And hopefully it worked, you know, or hopefully it was good advice, right? 00:24:46.529 --> 00:24:49.730 And or something that you would do yourself. 00:24:49.730 --> 00:24:58.289 So you want to be making recommendations to others or bringing people to your side for things that you would do yourself. 00:24:58.289 --> 00:25:13.409 And when you have all those three things together, when it's true, when it makes sense, and when it's clearly something that from your core you believe and you would want other people to do it as well, then it's ethical. 00:25:13.409 --> 00:25:13.889 Okay. 00:25:13.889 --> 00:25:18.049 It still may not be something that is successful, but at least it's in that direction. 00:25:18.049 --> 00:25:26.369 And now from there, you if if somebody that now they can see Barry is putting all the

cards on the table. 00:25:26.369 --> 00:25:32.450 Whether I agree or disagree is something else, but at least I can see that he's being straightforward with me. 00:25:32.450 --> 00:25:37.250 And if I agree, then then we're gonna, you know, do this thing together. 00:25:37.250 --> 00:25:40.529 But at least he's giving me the opportunity to agree or disagree. 00:25:40.529 --> 00:25:42.929 And of course, that feeds into trust as well. 00:25:42.929 --> 00:25:46.289 I trust Barry because Barry is being straightforward with me. 00:25:46.289 --> 00:26:03.329 And I think that the opposite of those elements, if it's not true, if it's like, wait, that doesn't make sense, you know, and and if it's not something that you would do, if not something that you would recommend for some for for yourself, then that moves into the realm of manipulation. 00:26:03.329 --> 00:26:08.609 So whatever we're doing, we want to make sure that it's a good idea. 00:26:08.609 --> 00:26:19.490 And and when you follow those three elements, you can pretty much guarantee that at least from your side, from your heart, that people are gonna understand and believe you. 00:26:19.970 --> 00:26:25.490 You did not mention transparency and honesty in what you said, but I think this is what you alluded to. 00:26:25.490 --> 00:26:27.329 Uh, I I like the message here, Barry. 00:26:27.329 --> 00:26:29.730 I've been struggling myself also with manipulation. 00:26:29.730 --> 00:26:43.409 I feel like we are in a world where honesty, transparency sometimes are in becomes a liability rather than really helping you get along with people, especially when you have people who don't really are not on the same um level. 00:26:43.409 --> 00:26:52.689 I like your message here to to our audience is that it's it's important to create those relations by being straightforward, being giving the good advice. 00:26:52.689 --> 00:27:04.450 Sometimes we see a lot of personal interests, and this is where I think things really go wrong, and people feel the manipulation because yeah, personal agendas come in the way most of the time, unfortunately. 00:27:04.450 --> 00:27:06.769 I I like what you what you said here. 00:27:06.769 --> 00:27:16.529 And Barry, if if I go back to the relations and how people need to create that collaboration and have influence on each other, I would say, through their behavior. 00:27:16.529 --> 00:27:19.250 Uh, we come close to the end of the episode. 00:27:19.250 --> 00:27:28.210 What would be the most important principle that would bring people together in all this and make them perform better together rather than getting distant? 00:27:28.210 --> 00:27:32.769 What is it the one thing you feel is really makes moves the needle, as we say? 00:27:34.049 --> 00:27:39.809 I think that it's important for a group of people to talk about excellence. 00:27:39.809 --> 00:27:47.329 And if we say, if we agree we want to be an excellent organization, then let's talk about it. 00:27:47.329 --> 00:27:51.649 Let's say, uh, is this something that we all agree that we want to do? 00:27:51.649 --> 00:28:02.369 And when everybody says, yeah, yes, this is it, like, okay, so what do we need to do in this area to be excellent and in this area and in this area and in this area? 00:28:02.369 --> 00:28:12.929 And then when we when we talk about it um, you know, sincerely, when we are intentional about it, then we're holding each other accountable. 00:28:12.929 --> 00:28:29.649 But I really think it's important for us to uh you know just to talk about it openly and to say this is our goal, and and not just to have it come down from you know on high to say, you will be excellent, but rather to say, is this something that we want to do? 00:28:29.649 --> 00:28:35.169 And and when everybody agrees, yeah, then then we can define the path to get there. 00:28:36.049 --> 00:28:39.329 I have one last question for you now as you're saying this, Barry. 00:28:39.329 --> 00:28:44.689 Why pe why leaders don't spend time to get these things right? 00:28:44.689 --> 00:28:45.970 Is it hard? 00:28:45.970 --> 00:28:51.649 Is it just intention maybe that lacks, or is they don't necessarily care enough? 00:28:51.649 --> 00:28:56.929 Why most people don't spend this little bit more time to do it right? 00:28:57.329 --> 00:28:58.369 Yeah, great question. 00:28:58.369 --> 00:29:07.250 The reason why is because we're busy and we're we're all running and doing the tasks that we're supposed to be doing just to get our job done. 00:29:07.250 --> 00:29:21.250 When in fact, if we took 10% of our time and and focused on the team and making sure that the team functions, then we can let the team go and do its own thing. 00:29:21.250 --> 00:29:31.730 So it's you have to actually take the time, carve the time out to build the team up, and then the team can go off on its own and and get stuff done. 00:29:31.730 --> 00:29:42.769 So the hard part is recognizing that if we actually divert our attention for just a short amount of time and develop our team, then our team functions better on its own. 00:29:43.169 --> 00:29:49.809 I like this advice, and I do hope that people will start really trying to give that little time to make sure that things are right. 00:29:49.809 --> 00:29:51.649 And I come from equality background. 00:29:51.649 --> 00:29:55.970 We say design the system right and then things will go in the right place. 00:29:55.970 --> 00:29:58.769 But uh, Barry, thank you very much for all your insight. 00:29:58.769 --> 00:30:11.250 Thank you for sharing your experience and for reminding us that excellence is not created by systems alone, it depends on people understanding why their work matters, trusting one another, and being influenced toward a shared purpose. 00:30:11.250 --> 00:30:15.889 Do you like to share anything else uh with our audience before we wrap up this session? 00:30:16.369 --> 00:30:29.089 Uh well, the only thing, Nancy, yeah, the only thing is that you can get those 30 workplace appropriate um icebreakers at my website, barrymoline.com slash resources. 00:30:29.089 --> 00:30:32.929 Uh it it's a it's a great way to get started doing icebreakers. 00:30:33.329 --> 00:30:33.889 That's great. 00:30:33.889 --> 00:30:40.609 And we're gonna share all these lines, I mean the links on the on the website, uh, the excellence foresight podcast uh website. 00:30:40.609 --> 00:30:42.210 So thank you very much, Barry. 00:30:42.210 --> 00:30:43.649 Thank you for being with us here today. 00:30:43.649 --> 00:30:47.169 And to our listeners, thank you for joining us on the Excellence Foresight Podcast. 00:30:47.169 --> 00:30:55.569 We hope today's conversation gives you a practical reason to look again at how purpose, connection, and influence are shaping excellence in your own organization. 00:30:55.569 --> 00:30:57.649 Till next time, tune in. 00:30:57.649 --> 00:30:58.450 Thank you.