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Hannah, Atonement, and the Lovely Bones. Chas: I don't agree I don't understand Hannah like you were saying. I I don't understand how that Teresa: Mm. Chas: is still up there and no no little women and no ladybird. Teresa: Hmm. Chas: Like are people okay? Are the movies really back? Has Nicole Kidman been lying to me for, you know, six years? I I just I find that really perplexing 'cause A, Oscar knobs are usually Teresa: Mm. Chas: not always, but usually most known for. And these are Hannah happened a while ago. And so I I guess I kind of agree, but yeah, it it's really strange. Teresa: It was a long time ago. Yeah. Yeah. I was surprised to see Hannah. I was surprised as well to see Hannah and and at first the Lovely Bones, but then I remembered, because that's also quite old at this point. but I remembered then that Stanley Tucci was nominated for his work as the neighbor killer, serial killer, in the Lovely Bones, which I thought I had watched, but I rewatched for this podcast episode and I'll tell you, if I had watched that film before, I think I might have fallen asleep before it starts getting really trippy Chas: Ha ha ha Teresa: because I I had read the novel it was based on, and I did not remember most of that. And most importantly, my the takeaway I had this time watching it at this point was this is like it's totally all over the place, right? It's one part serious, you know, child murder crime thriller, I guess. And then one part like I don't know, Christian magic realism, fantasy, like very, very strange. so I and you know, Peter Jackson directed this. So when I when I saw that, I was like, Well, maybe I'm not as surprised as I thought I was, but yeah, yeah, I'm surprised that's still in there except for it's you know, Tucci's nomination. I I will say when my when the book was new, my mother was working in our junior high school library part time and I know she said they just couldn't keep it on the shelf. Like they had multiple copies stolen. I think because, you know, the the girl in the story is about the same age as junior high girls. And so I think there was just like a morbid fascination with it, even if they weren't maybe ready for it, ready for the the overall you know, contents of that novel. But they did have it in our junior high library. So then I was like, maybe I should read this book. And then of course the movie adaptation came out as well. And Hannah Hannah is also based on IP. I think it was a comic book adaptation. I do really like it. And that's for second time working Chas: Mm-hmm. Teresa: with Joe Wright, who also directed Atonement. So maybe that's why that's still hanging out in there. But but yeah, I I am surprised to see that those are still there. Chas: It could be. I mean, I I feel like I understand the Brooklyn and the Atonement being there, but yeah, Hannah and I've never read The Lovely Bones, I have to say. So I I don't know if it's very if the movie's very different from the book, but it does seem like, you know, I agree with you. It's an identity Teresa: Mm. Chas: crisis of a film. Like there's three or four movies in there and I think maybe one of them is pretty decent, but you know, our our Friends over at this had Oscar Buzz have more deep lore with the lovely bones than we do. Teresa: Yes. Yeah, I think the only significant difference that I that really is glaring to me from the novel to the film is that the novel also includes a sexual assault before the murder. And I think Chas: Hm. Teresa: as I recall it it is narrated from the child victim's point of view. And they they've significantly softened that in the film versions of all murders of women of different ages. So, which I I suspect is another reason they couldn't They couldn't keep it in stock at the school library as well. So 'cause people were just like, What is this book? Yeah. Chas: right, exactly. You know, it's it's interesting. She's I noticed doing research for this episode that she's done a lot of she's been in a lot of films based on books or or plays or graphic novels. There's a lovely bones, bones, Teresa: Mm-mm. Chas: there's city of Ember, Little Women, obviously, Atonement Brooklyn. On Chesle Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: Beach, Faux and The Outrun. Those are books or and then there's a seagull, obviously. So she's definitely a reader, we can assume, because that is a huge chunk of her her filmography is books. Teresa: We we love a literary queen. I didn't realise Outrun was also based on a on a was it is that a play adaptation or novel, do you know? It's a book, okay. Chas: No, it's a it's a book. I didn't realize it's a I think it's a it's based on a nonfiction, I wanna say memoir or biography. I didn't realize that either, when I Teresa: Okay. Chas: saw it and until I started doing research for I can believe it though, like that I mean, spoiler alert's one of my favorite Surtia performances, but very criminally underseen, underwatch movie, Teresa: Mm, we'll get into it in a minute. Chas: yeah. But yeah, so that's Teresa: Absolutely. Chas: That's also a book, as well. So she's definitely definitely a reader, which I think is one another reason I really I really love her as an actress. Teresa: Yeah. Well do we want to talk through the Oscar nominated films? like maybe in in time order here, I guess, and see what we think about them. Chas: Sure, sure. mm hmm. Teresa: So I know I know we already talked about atonement a little bit, but yeah, go go ahead, take us away here. Chas: I you know, I l I don't dislike atonement. I I I mean my whole thing, you know, I d I guess we'll get into it. I don't underst kids being nominated for Oscars is just a no for me, like most of the time. and kids in film in general is also a no for me most of the time. I feel like there's there's just Teresa: Tell us tell us more, Chess. I'm fascinated. Chas: you know, I I know we're dating back if we're talking about Oscar history, we're going back to Judy Garland, Shirley Temple. There used to be

something called the Juvenile Awards. let's bring that back because Teresa: Ow. Chas: I mean that's that's fine. Let's have a little separate category like a kids' table for the kids. Like they don't need to be nominated Teresa: Mm. Chas: against Meryl Streep. Like that's I I don't understand that rationale. And Teresa: Ha ha Chas: Trixie and Katia have who are, you know. also people I love and admire. They have this they also don't like kids in films. They have this joke where kids should just be referred to off screen. Teresa: Mm. Chas: like the sixth sense, like he told me he sees Teresa: Mm mm. Chas: dead people, you know, that kind of thing. So I I agree. Teresa: Sure. Chas: A kid a kid usually takes me out of the movie. I mean there are some exceptions, like Anna Packlin, who was also nominated and won at the age of thirteen for the piano. Like that's a great performance. But Abigail Breslin and Little Miss Sunshine, Hailey Joel Osman, I mean what What are we doing? Like I I just is i it's not quite child labor and it's not Yeah. For for my yes, my cocaine Teresa: Rosalind didn't make you want to wear wear bloomers and do a dance. Do do a sexy dance at the the talent competition. Chas: addicted grandfather and colorblind brother. I I used to love that movie, by the way. It it definitely is a a time capsule of indie film, but I Teresa: It still has it okay, I still I still refer to the part where when Steve Carell's character has to explain that he is the most preeminent Proust scholar and that the what Chas: Mm-hmm. Teresa: the MacArthur Grant genius grant went to someone who's the second most preeminent Proust scholar. Chas: Right. Teresa: I I work in higher ed so this speaks to me like very deeply how hurt people get about their their work not being recognized. And I don't know, I still think it's really funny. Chas: I can imagine. Yeah, some some sort of trauma PTSD. I I I love that movie. Teresa: Mm. Chas: I own it. It was you know, the Sufion Stevens Chicago song. It's like how I got into Sufi on Stevens. So I I have a soft spot for the film. I just don't know that I needed Teresa: What? Chas: Abigail in a little frilly dress, like sitting there waiting to not win an Oscar. I just Teresa: Sure. Chas: but that's just me. I know there's, you know Teresa: Sure, sure, sure. Chas: There's the paper moon of it all and Tatum O'Neal. And like I I understand. I I get it on some level, but like as a viewer and as an Oscar obsessive, I I just see kids as part of like a separate conversation when it comes to film and talent. I feel like emotional kids have this or excuse me, kids have this emotional intuition that you lose as an adult that you kind of have to get back as a skill a as an adult actor. And it's like, well, I mean, you can make a kid cry pretty easily, trust me. So I just feel like This is Teresa: Are you speaking from experience here? Chas: this I promise this episode isn't me hating on kids or is it. I just feel that l like I said,

let's bring back the juvenile awards. Let's let's give them their like we have the indie spirit, let's have like the, you know, kid awards and they can all color together or whatever. Like I feel like that's more interesting, but that's just me. but I as far as atonement, I feel like Search is great. Oscar worthy, Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: I don't know in terms of nomination, but probably my least favorite of her all her Teresa: Mm. Chas: nominations, which sounds cruel considering she was a literal child. but Brooklyn is a film I I I feel kind of mid about as well. Like it's gorgeous, it's lovely, great gowns, beautiful gowns, but it's costume design is Teresa: Sure. Chas: what I remember more than the performances. I know you you recently watched it. If I don't know what what were your thoughts? Teresa: Yeah. Yeah. So Brooklyn was brand new to me for this. I mean I knew what it was, but I hadn't watched it because Chess was really mad that I said this over text, but it seemed honestly just too boring to even watch before. and I enjoyed watching Chas: Ha ha ha. Teresa: it. I you know, this is her first, you know, quote unquote adult nomination, right? But when I was watching it, I felt like it belonged to the historical dramas of the nineties. and our weird obsession that the whole US Chas: Mm. Teresa: and film industry had with Ireland at that time. Chas: Mm. Teresa: like if you had told me that it'd come out in 1998, I would have believed you just as easily. and I was a good part into watching it before I realized a friend of mine had spoiled the ending for me. I I had like completely blanked it. And so about 20 minutes before the end, I was like, no, I I remember now someone telling me how this ends. And I I mean. The film is old enough. I don't think this is a spoiler, but Chekhov's relative is just waiting there to spoil her trip home to Ireland. So, but yeah, the costume Chas: Mm. Teresa: design is gorgeous. I mean, it's all full of gorgeous people. And it's very, it's very slow and meditative. To back up to atonement for a second, I was gonna say, you know, she's in basically half the film, and then her adult, or adult or older version of her character is played by Ramalagaray. Chas: Right. Teresa: and that finishes out the film. And I I will say, impressive performance for a child and it is her character's actions that kick off basically the rest of the film, right? It's about a Chas: Right, right. Teresa: misunderstanding that then, you know, cascades into disaster. but sometimes I, you know, what I think of is at the end rather than at the beginning, because of course her character her version of the character doesn't carry through to the end. And so I think I don't think she was ever going to win because that's not what was left in people's minds, you know, when voters Chas: Mm-hmm. Teresa: were reviewing the film. So so yeah. So I'm I'm not surprised she didn't win for Brooklyn. That was the year that Bree Larson won instead for Room, I

believe. Chas: Hmm, yeah. Teresa: which was yeah, yeah, a very, a very strong performance. And I think was the favorite all along. So but then just two years another Chas: Another kid in the locked in the room. Teresa: another kid in the mix. yeah, but then just two years later she has Ladybird. and personally, I feel like this is the role she probably should have gotten her Oscar for. it was her breakout adult role. It was a breakout first-time film for Greta Gerwig. She's working with Timmy St. Chalamet again. but this year, Frances McDormand wins her second for three building or three, sorry, three billboards outside Ebbing, Missouri, which is Chess's Chas: Ugh No. Teresa: absolute favorite Martin McDonough film. Chas: I hate that film so much that like I don't even care if this is spoiler. When the fire or whatever happened in the general store or whatever was going on, I just started laughing out loud in the theater. And I'm usually very quiet and I'm very strict about theater etiquette. I have my seat, you don't talk during previews, like sit don't sit next to me if there's like other seats. I was laughing so hard that someone actually didn't did this sh to me. And I was like Teresa: Do they shush you? my goodness. Chas: Y yes. And I I was like fine, but like you can't be taking this seriously. This is like Bozo the clown behavior. Like I I I I won't go there. I hate this movie. She didn't deserve it. Lady Bird should have Sertia's first Oscar the End. Teresa: Yeah, yeah. I mean, my notes are like, well, Francis has already won one. She won a third from No Manland in twenty twenty. Like maybe maybe two would been enough. 'cause Chas: Yeah. Right. Teresa: yeah, I d I don't really think of that film at all. I only watched it somewhat recently and it was it's fine. It's deeply fine. yeah, that's really all I can say about that. but then but then we reach I think the crowning achievement where it starts to feel maybe like a little overdue. Yet another two years later with little women. Chas: Mm-hmm. Yeah, Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: I mean, Lady Bird is one of my favorite films, and I I love it. I love I could listen to Greta and Sertia talk about Lady Bird forever, so I'll just say that. And she should have won, deserved nomination. The relationship between and Lori Metcalf. I mean, Lori Metcalf is perfection in everything she's ever done. She's incredible on stage, obviously. Tracy Letz is the father. I mean, like Sertia had titans of Broadway American theater playing her parents and it was just incredible. And so I love that film. I loved the realistic relationship she had with her parents. you can tell that movie means a lot to Greta, and so does Little Women. and I know in Sertia's Vanity Fair, where she was looking back at her most well known roles or nominated roles, she talked about how she had so much energy playing Joe onset. And she was so excited just constantly because it meant so much to her to play Joe March and that shows and the performance. I mean, I won't turn this whole podcast into a little women, you know, diatribe, but the speech, the speech she gives in the attic about women, I mean, I can't watch that without crying. That's her Michael Solbarg, you know, monologue at the end of Call Me by Your Name, as far as I'm concerned. And Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: I love it. I love the proposal scene on the mountain or hilltop with Timmy or with the Lori, who, you know, as a Little Women 1994 stan, I was a little nervous because I love Christian Bale as Lori in that film. But Timmy was wonderful Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: and the whole cast. I mean, the whole cast, but that scene when you know Greta had s switched their quote unquote gendered clothing and Serge's dress a little more masculine, Timmy's dress more feminine, they do a ring exchange. I just like head explode emoji. Like I have never thought about little women in quite that way, but I had subconsciously and Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: Greta woke it up. And so I I would love to see I would I would love to live in a universe where Cersei has one for Ladybird and Little Women, if I can speak my truth. Teresa: Mm, wow. So basically almost back to back wins then. Chas: Yeah, I mean, there's people who have, you know, been nominated back to back, won back to back. And I feel like if Ti if Timmy if Timmy Teresa: That's that's true. That's true. Chas: can get nominated for a complete unknown and Marty boring Supreme, then I mean he didn't win, thankfully, for either. But I I feel like I feel like if I had to choose if I had to choose, I would choose Lady Bird as the win for optics, but for like personal sentimental reasons, having her win is You know, Joe Marjo and and Winona was my favorite Joe for for decades, obviously, but Sertia gave me a whole new outlook on that character and yeah, I would have loved for her to to have won. Teresa: Yeah, it's interesting because at the time, so I I saw that when it was in the theaters, Little Women, and as I recall it, Florence Pugh was getting kind of more buzz, I think. Like it was almost a foregone conclusion, like of course Sears was gonna pull this Nom playing Joe, but but Florence's performance made Amy seem like a human for once, where she's just normally kind of in the background. so Chas: Yeah. Teresa: her pulling her first Academy Award nomination in the supporting category. maybe kind of over shattered things and then ultimately Searsha lost to Renee Zellwagger who was also probably overdue for her performance in Judy. So but I I really liked the film the first time I saw it. I rewatched it prepping for this episode. I still really liked it. I had to tap out a few times because it gets like too emotional. I was like I'm feeling like I'm gonna cry here, which I knew is the point. but but something that Chas: Right. Teresa: also occurred to me was we had Quite a spade of films in the late 2010s about women authors. So alongside little women, we also had Colette starring Cure Knightly.

And then also Chas: Mm, mm-hmm. Teresa: in my in one of my top top films probably of that decade, Can You Ever Forgive Me with Melissa McCarthy? And my my questi Chas: Yes. love that film. Teresa: my question that I the question I wrote to myself was, is Joe March Lee Israel's spiritual mother? Chas: my God. I love that. I love that. my God. Love that film. Love that book. Richard E. Grant Oscar nomination. So deserved. Teresa: so deserves. Chas: I I love that. That is a great question. I think I could see that. I mean, that is a that would be a great double feature. Little Women 2019 and Can You Ever Forgive Me. Teresa: Yeah. Yeah, just write right one in a row actually. And Colette is also about have you seen this film? Do you know this? Chas: I have I actually love Colette. I love Colette the author and I loved that film. so yes. Teresa: Okay. Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. yeah, I mean also about you know, a woman who had to publish under her husband's name because you know, gender norms was not allowed at the time and you know, fighting for women's freedom. So so yeah, I think I think all these three things seem seem very linked and there was just something in the air, I think, in the late twenty tens that that brought all those to the to the table. So exciting. Yeah, well I guess I think we've kind of hinted at this already, but is there are there particular performances or films that you consider more memorable or that you think about more than others? Chas: So obviously Ladybird and Little Women are the two. but I would say the Out Run, which w I briefly we briefly talked about earlier, saw that in the theater. Criminal Teresa: Uh-huh. Chas: criminally underseen, like I said, and I think it's streaming now on maybe Hulu. if people want to check Teresa: Mm-mm. Chas: it out, but it's it's great and incredible. emotional performance, her characters dealing with addictions and mental illness. She returns to her family's home or farm to sort of recuperate. And it's just a really I it's so it's such a perfect role for her. I mean, when I when I watch Sersha, I never see Sersha. I see her characters and she just really embodies the the role in the outrun. And so those are my top three. I will give an honorable mention and this is gonna be a hot take I think. To Mary, Queen of Scots. Teresa: okay. Chas: it is a campy hot Teresa: Tell us more. Chas: mess. I mean, that movie is it's it's it's directed by a woman, Josie Rourke, who I'm not super familiar with, but it is co-written by Bo Willimon, who wrote Severance, House of Cards, excuse me, and Andor. which is a crazy, crazy roster of writing, and it is not a good movie. And Margot and Sersha are not good in it. But Teresa: Mm. Chas: I love this movie because there's this scene where Margot plays Queen Elizabeth, then Sersha plays Mary, Queen of Scots, obviously, and like Mr Margot's face is melting. Like she looks kind of like Caesar Romero's The Joker, where you could see a mustache, and and they're like walking in between bed sheets inside a castle. That are hanging out to dry, but they're inside. And they're like doing these monologues and dialogue. And it is the craziest thing I've ever seen. And I need drag I need two drag performers, whoever you are. This is a call to reenact this. Because it's incredible. It's incredible. I think I think my takeaway is everyone should watch Mary Queen of Scots and know that it isn't a good movie, but you will absolutely have a blast watching it. So I think that would be my top. Teresa: I like it sounds like it could be ripe for a a get ready with me video of a queen beating their face and saying these terrible monologues at the same time. Yeah. Chas: yeah. Don't don't go into it expecting like Kate Kate Blanchette as Elizabeth or like, you know, the crown or like Princess Diana. Like there's no real like consideration for history or acting, but it is it's a drag show. It's amazing. It's amazing. Teresa: This this is amazing because of course both of these performers have also worked with Greta to much more successful outcomes in subsequent films. So well well, I was Chas: Yeah, absolutely. so what about you? Teresa: also gonna throw yeah, I was also gonna throw in the outrun. I watched that on an international flight last year, which it was a rough sit for a plane, but I think it was to me it felt like playing a little bit against type for Circia's career because I won't say she's played all nice young women. I mean obviously Hannah is a, you know, a covert murdering operative that's been created by the government. But but I think it was the first time I felt both scared of and scared for her character, if that makes any sense. and yeah, very, very underseen. I feel like There was a little bit of early Oscar buzz, and then it just faded pretty quickly. and also Chas: Mm-hmm. Teresa: I will note there was a little bit of cross casting with slow horses. So one of the person who plays the the therapist in the outrun, Naomi Worthner. I hope I'm saying your Chas: Mm. Teresa: name right. I'm sure you're listening, is also in Slow Horses as an archivist. And course, Slow Horses stars Serge's husband, Jack Louden. but the other thing, the other film that I think of a lot that I don't think anyone hardly saw or thinks of is Byzantium, which is another Neil Jordan vampire film. Neil Jordan, Chas: Yes. Teresa: of course, directed interview with the vampire 1994 with Tomstadt and he shall not be named. but Byzantium is about two lady vampires in what I I think is Blackpool. It's like a seaside English town. Chas: Yeah, I think it is. Teresa: Yeah, and it and this yeah, the story is maybe a little weak, but the visuals are great. Sertia's great. I put it up there with, you know, something like Let the Right One In, the Swedish version. I have issues with the American ones and the TV adaptation. Chas: Ooh, me too, me too. Teresa: in in terms of like yeah, in terms of childhood vampire stories. she's again like still a

tweenager, I guess. when she was in this film, it's quite old now. but yeah, I feel like hardly anyone saw it and It's kind of in that middle period between her first nomination and then like more of her adult roles coming in. So I say it's worth going back and checking out. if if for nothing else than to compare it with Jordan's work on another vampire story. Chas: I love that. I love that selection. That was close for me as well. I'm so glad you mentioned it. Teresa: Yeah, definitely. So it sounds like we we're pretty in sync about the things that she's been nominated for. Is there anything else we think she should she should have been nominated for besides the outrun, maybe? Chas: You know, I I don't think so because I mean I've seen like I've seen On Chesul Beach, which is really I mean it makes it it's like what if Atonement in Brooklyn, but on Chezel Beach, like it almost feels like the same movies to me. Like I it it's Teresa: Okay. Chas: another gorgeous, gorgeous film, Sepiatones and like great costumes and I couldn't tell you much of what it was about, based on a book and I saw it as, you know, Sertia Homework and I also saw The Seagull, which came out the year after. Again, just sort Teresa: Mm. Chas: of so I wouldn't agree with that. and then there's the film. Have you seen the film she did with Kate Winslet, the lesbian period piece drama? Teresa: Ammonites? Chas: Ammonite, yeah. It's have you seen that? Okay. Teresa: I have not. I have not. Chas: It is so boring that I almost turned straight. It is a really unfortunately boring film. Francis Lee directed it. He also directed God's Own Country, The The Yorkshire Teresa: Mm. Chas: Brokeback Mountain with Josh O'Connor, which is a great movie. I love that movie. I love that movie. Teresa: Okay. Chas: a must see this movie, not so much. you really yeah, Teresa: what a shame. Chas: it's kind of it's kind of hard to make lesbianism with Cape Teresa: I'm not missing any. Chas: No, no, not at all. It's it's not very good. The I will say I have a soft spot for Blitz, where where she with Steve McQueen as the director. Teresa: Mm, okay. Chas: it came out in 2024. She it feels it was an Apple, I think it's an Apple movie. it feels like weirdly Teresa: Hm. Chas: a victim of COVID and streaming, even though it came out in 2024. But she plays a single mom during the Blitz Teresa: Mm, mm-hmm. Chas: or single woman during the Blitz with a kid. She that she has as a co star and his performance is great. Unfortunately don't remember the actor's name. I don't remember kids' names, mo sorry. it's not a bad movie and I feel like it got a little ignored, a little victim of streaming, but Blitz is is worth checking out as well. Teresa: Okay. Yeah. What I was gonna say about the about Ammonite and Kate Winslow was it's unfortunate that that film was so dull because one of Kate's earliest roles was in Heavenly Creatures directed by Peter Jackson, which is of course a lesbian teenage coated lesbian coated teenage story about girls who team up to kill their one of their sets of parents because they're so obsessed with each other. So it feels like it could have tied in well there, but it sounds like a missed opportunity. Chas: For sure. Yeah. I mean, there's there's also the movie Foe that she was in in twenty twenty three with Paul Mescal, who's, you know, spoiler alert, also playing Paul McCartney to her Linda McCartney in the upcoming Beatles quadrilogy. Teresa: Mm. Chas: which we can talk about in a bit. But Teresa: Mm-hmm. We'll we'll get into it. Chas: yeah, the Foe is not a good movie, also based on a book, and I just I it's a very very confusing choice to me. What's I I just it came out right before the outrun and I was starting to get a little worried because we had had, you know, after Little Women we'd had the boring lesbian drama. We'd have see See how they run and then faux and I was kinda like, what's going on? So the Outrun really was a redeeming project, I think for Sersha. Teresa: Yeah, definitely. And then you I think just saw her most recent Bad Apples last night, yeah? Chas: Yeah, I saw Bad Apples. this is a definitely, you know, a chass movie because it has not just Sertia but Jacob Anderson who is currently playing Louis in the interview with the Vampire TV series on AMC Plus. so I was very happy to see him in a film and getting more work as well. And they have great chemistry together. I don't really know or wanna say too much, I guess, since it's probably not released anywhere, maybe the UK and New York and LA, but Teresa: Yeah, it's definitely it's definitely not in our market yet, I'll say that. So we're in we're in a release backwater here. Chas: Yeah, so it it's great. It's a small little film. it's I I really enjoyed it. I really enjoyed it a lot. So I think the the sort of the trajectory of the outrun, Blitz and Bad Apples now, being her most recent works that are out, I feel really good about and I had a great time and I I loved watching her with Jacob. I hope they do more work together in the future. Teresa: Awesome. Yeah, I I only read the log line of that film because like I said, it wasn't it's not out yet here, but it seems a bit weapons adjacent. Chas: Yeah, yeah, that's that's a good way of looking at it. That's a really good yeah, I could see that. I could see that. Teresa: Okay. Okay. Well I will look for it 'cause loved weapons and obviously I think a lot of other people did too. Yeah. do Chas: Yeah, me too. Yeah, I wanna be Aunt Gladys when I grow up, as if the rest of this episode hasn't given that indication. Teresa: I think you're already a GLAS status in my mind, so Chas: I am. I just need the red hair, yeah. Teresa: Well, do we think I so having been nominated so early in her career, do we think what do we think about the impact of that nomination at age thirteen on the rest of her her work? Chas: It's interesting because, you know, we a lot of or oftentimes you'll see a a kid get nominated at a certain

age, you know, and then not ever get nominated again, or even win at a certain age Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: and not get nominated again. But that wasn't the case with Sertia. So I don't feel like it did anything to harm her career. I don't feel like that obviously she kept working and working successfully. I think she has a really strong family. She has a great network and supportive people around her. And so I I don't think it had a negative impact, which is really impressive. And not only did she keep working, she kept getting nominated. I mean, obviously there's a gap there between Atonement and then Brooklyn, Lady Bird and Little Women. But I think that she kept working consistently in between the the first nomination and then Brooklyn, and then she kept working after. And I really think that it was a net positive for her. I mean, and that's kind of rare. you know, to be nominated that young and especially when, you know, twenty is considered young for for male actors and twenty one and th they don't always go on to have other nominations until they're maybe in their forties or fifties. So I I Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: I th I see it as a net positive. I really do. Teresa: You know, I do too. I feel like maybe it r resulted in a bit longer tale of her playing younger than she actually is for a while. but what I think it did give her was the ability to probably to pick projects that she wants to work on more than other young women actresses at this point in their careers. for example, she hasn't been Or not yet. She hasn't been locked into any multifilm IP contracts. You know, her fur her it seems like her lane has been pretty firmly historical as an Oscar Bate up until now, I would say. Chas: Yes, I agree. What she's doing now is really interesting and I'm super curious to see where it goes from here. I mean, she's still young, she's still very young. So her career seems really long. Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: She's been working, you know, since she was thirty well before she was thirteen. So but I I feel like she's deliberate and I feel like she's she's very intentional in the same or similar way to me is in terms of of choices. Teresa: Yeah. I mean I I was kind of I I think we know Oscar loves a suffering woman or a like a major transformation type of role. So I I was surprised she didn't get a nomination for the Outrun, except that I think just hardly anyone saw it. So yeah. Chas: Mm. I agree. I mean, that's I I t I completely agree. I hope it's not a case of, you know, the Academy waiting for her to age up or, you know, play some long suffering mother or something. Like I really hope that's not the case. yeah. Teresa: Yeah. Well we'll if we look forward, what is coming up on searches docket here? Chas: Well so she has Bat Apple, so I guess that's technically what's coming up so that people can kind of keep an eye out for. I highly recommend it. And then she has the Beatles quadrilogy coming out in Teresa: The Beatles. Tell tell us about this, in case

folks somehow don't have not seen the wigs online about this. Chas: wig, wigged at the gig. oof, so it's it's a sorry, I can't e I can't even say this with a straight face. Teresa: Ha. Chas: it's a Sam Mendy's project. And I to be clear, Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: I love s a lot of Sam Mendy's films. I mean, I love Revolutionary Road, the Kate Winslet and Leo recoupling after Titanic, but it's allegedly coming out in twenty twenty eight. And so it's my understanding is that it's gonna be four films, and I don't know if they're gonna all be released in one year or over time, but they're all being filmed right now, it seems like together. And one Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: is about Ringo, one's about John, and then George and Paul. And Sertia is playing Linda McCartney. so my understanding is that Maybe she'll be in all four films. I mean, they they obviously their lives intersected during the Beatles and after. I'm really curious. I don't know, because Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: Linda was a huge part of his life, starting at like towards the end of the Beatles of Paul's life, and then she was in Wings, but this all takes place like post-Batles. I honestly have no idea what to expect. Teresa: Hm. Chas: I wanna I wanna say I'm a huge Beatles fan. I mean, I I'm a I I love them. and I am in no way excited for this project. Teresa: Yeah. no. yeah, I Chas: It feels like the Marvel location of of the Beatles and I don't really know what to think about that. Teresa: Yeah, you know, the more I hear about this, the the thing I'm reminded of was the James McAvoy Jessica Chastain projects from I don't know, 10 or 12 years ago, the disappearance of Eleanor Rigby, which is three films that tell the story of the dissolution of these people's relationship from his, hers, and theirs perspectives. And I think I only watched part of the first one and it was so boring, I never wanted to watch the other ones. I think we if you're gonna tell multiple points of view in the same film, I think it can be done. I mean, obviously The Last Duel does this, Chas: Mm-hmm. Teresa: very underseen because of when it came out, I think. but you know, I think there's d ways to tell this story, and all anyone seems to be talking about, at least right now, is the wigs and other things. So not the actual meat of these movies. the the other thing it reminds me of is like, you know. the the gospels, right? Like like we have four perspectives on the same thing written by, you know, a couple of different disciples, right? So Chas: It's like Teresa: maybe that's a maybe that's a bad analogy. I don't know. Chas: No, it isn't at all. I mean, it's you know, there's two surviving Beatles, but there's definitely a lot of interviews and and books on the record from for the all four perspectives. But I I mean, I I don't dislike Teresa: Yeah. Chas: the casting. I mean, I really I I think it's fine. I think that it makes sense. I'm just worried that these the these actors, including Sertia, are gonna be tied up for

the next, you know, year or two like Marvel or D C, you know, that Teresa: Yeah, with with promotion and everything. Mm-hmm. Chas: What is she gonna work on, you know? Right. So and I don't know what the appetite is for four Beatles films. I mean, I'm gonna see it, mm me and the boomers, but I I'm just really curious what what the audience is gonna look like for these movies. Teresa: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I think I yeah, it's hard for me to say how much the the younger generations really care about the Beatles, right? It feels very like Boomer is older Gen X or like, you know, the Beatles are the best band that ever existed and ever will exist. I mean, obviously Peter Jackson's a big fan, right? He swaced together the documentary that was on Apple a few years ago, Chas: Which is great. Mm-hmm. Teresa: which is great. I mean, it's it's definitely worth watching. but yeah, lightly fictionalized. I don't know. I don't know. So yeah, what what else Chas: I think that's Teresa: is on the horizon? Chas: I mean, I would just say that's kind of the point. Like we have we have the Lost Tapes, we have, you know, the Let It Be sessions. Teresa: Yeah. Chas: And with biographies or films that are bi about real people, it's like there is this belief sometimes that if you condense it and do one moment in time, maybe it's better or more cohesive or coherent for the audience. But if they're I mean, are they doing the Beatles from like Teresa: Mm. Chas: I think from like Liverpool through like Abbey Road. I mean, that's technically only about ten, twelve years, but that's a long time and a lot happened and they really changed American culture and music. So I have no idea or you know, world music. I I just I don't know. I'm really curious what Sertia's gonna do. Is she gonna be Linda with her camera and like having the faux British accent before Madonna and you know, hanging out on a farm in Scotland and being vegan? Like I'm not really sure what's yeah. Teresa: That's right, 'cause I Yeah, 'cause Linda was American, yeah. Linda Eastman. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Chas: Yeah, from the Eastman. So she's they married in sixty-eight, I think. So I'm I'm all I'm I'm gonna see it, Love Sersha, but I think that's the what she has coming up. And then there's there's a film, Three Incestuous Sisters, that has has Teresa: okay. Chas: no real has no release date on IMDB. And it's also it's filming with Josh O'Connor, Dakota Johnson, Jesse Buckley, Isabel Rossellini, and Mick Jagger. Teresa: Wow. That's that's a lot of names in that cast. Chas: Yeah, so I feel like it's also based on a novel of the same name and it follows three sisters. It seems like living in isolation whose relationship is disrupted by the arrival of a lighthouse keeper son. I'm guessing played by Josh O'Connor, not Mick Jagger. maybe he's the lighthouse keeper. I don't know. But that's that's kind of what we have. Teresa: Maybe he's the lighthouse keeper. I was gonna say I I would l I would let I would let Joshua Connor interrupt my work any time, but yeah. Chas: yeah, absolutely. I yeah, I mean the titles title is sounds interesting to me, but and the Josh O'Connor of it all and but I'm I'm guessing the sisters are probably Sersha, Dakota and Jesse, but the rest is a mystery. So that's really it in terms of what what she has coming up. So I I think that she's gonna be pretty busy with Sam Mendy's project for a while. Teresa: Yeah, it sounds like it, right? Well we'll have to keep our eyes out for these for sure. let's see. Well, so I she's definitely worked with several directors again over and over. do we think she might repeat directors who led her to Oscar nominations again? Chas: I don't know. What do you think? Teresa: I think definitely, yes. So so just to recap here, that's been Joe Wright, who directed Atonement and Hannah, Greta Gerwig for Lady Bird and Little Women, and then Wes Anderson for the Grand Budapest Hotel and the French Dispatch. so I could see her probably working with any of those folks again. and I I mean it feels like, well, I don't I don't I guess do we count this the Beatles project as being multiple times with the same director since it's multiple films? Chas: I mean this is a n Teresa: Or is that all just one project? Chas: it's what I mean, yet another question about this mysterious project. Teresa: Yeah, yeah, definitely. How about you? Chas: you know, I I would love to see her work with Wes Anderson. I mentioned earlier, I know she did have a cameo in the French Dis Dispatch and in addition to Grand Budapest Hotel. And I think that I would really like to see her. I think she's gonna work with Greta again. They just seem to have a really special relationship and I know that Greta wanted to find a place for Timmy and Sersha in Barbie, which would have been Teresa: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Chas: really great. I mean, I would have loved to seen that. But I think, you know, maybe people she hasn't worked with. I think Luca could be interesting, tying back to Timmy a little bit. and I Teresa: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Chas: I I really think, you know, when I think of Sersha, I think of actors I'd love to see her work with as well. And I think Robert Pattinson Arbats, I think they could have an interesting Teresa: okay. Yeah. Chas: dynamic. I know that takes it back to Timmy and the King and and but I think But I was thinking also I don't know if he's really acting a lot anymore, but Donald Glover. Something about I think Donald Glover and Sersha like get up to something really fun. Teresa: Interesting. Yeah, I think they could too, for sure. Chas: Yeah. Or, you know, like we we talked about weapons. If she did like horror, like I would love that. I mean like true horror, that would make me happy. Teresa: I was I was gonna say that because she's had a few things that have been sort of horror adjacent, I think, but not not like fully genre. Yeah, that was the question I had written down too. Like, what would we like to see her in you know, next

possibly? and I one comment I had was it could be interesting to see her working opposite of Timmy again now that the two of them are in kind of different life phases than they Chas: Mm. Mm-hmm. Teresa: were previously. I know they're probably still very good friends, but it would just be interesting. and then my next question was, do we think she might ever do like a prestige T V series? 'Cause that's certainly not not a step backwards anymore the way it I think used to be for, you know, people who are known as film actors. And obviously her her husband Jack Louden has been on slow horses, as we previously mentioned. So I think I think that proves you can have a a nice career and he's being considered for the next James Bond apparent allegedly, allegedly. We don't know anything. so yeah, so what I guess what kind of T V series and would she ever work with Jack on film was a question I had. Chas: I think she would. And I think sh I could see her doing prestige TV. I don't I I don't think it's Teresa: Mm-hmm. Chas: really something that's off the table for her. She seems really open to it. just she seems like an experimental actress in general. I mean, I could see her doing theater, doing more theater, and she's done theater in the past. But but yeah, I could see her doing TV working with Jack. I have not seen Slow Horses, so I know I I'm behind on the world. I know the show's great, Teresa: Mm. Chas: but but I would love to see them Teresa: Yeah, season six just just started dropping, so it's high time. Yeah. Which I which I believe will be the final season, so yeah. Yeah, it's really good. I Chas: okay. Yeah, I know. I I gotta prioritize that. okay. I know was nominated for some Emmys. Teresa: Yeah, I generally I mean spies is one of my favorite genres. but they're like Chas: Mm. Teresa: you people probably know there's this they're like fuck up spies from from MI five. So and also Kristen Chas: Mm-hmm. Teresa: Scott Thomas is in it, who I also love, as the Chas: Me too. Teresa: the frosty lady lady spy chief. and Gary Oldman is just disgusting and wonderful. So Chas: Yeah. Teresa: yeah. Chas: Okay, you've you've convinced me to watch it. Yeah, and I I agree that she and Timmy will would work together. I mean, they did the BFI interview in twenty twenty five with Rebecca Ford, so pretty recently, when Teresa: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Chas: he was on an Oscar campaign and they talked a lot about their career. I mean, they all they're always wonderful to watch together. If people haven't seen the Graham Norton interview from twenty nineteen, when they were promoting little women, I would highly recommend that as well. It's they're just wonderful. I I I th I think they're genuinely friends and I would love to see them s work together again. Teresa: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. Well, cool. Well, what what else should we talk about when we were talking about Mr. Shahir? Chas: you know, I think one of the things that we can talk we can jump to is her endorsements. I know with Timmy we talked a little bit about his multiple endorsements and and Sertia really hasn't had many. she's definitely Teresa: I see that, yeah. Chas: yeah, she was Calvin Klein's she was a face of Calvin Klein's twenty eighteen Women in Scare Quotes Fragrance by Rafe Simmons. I don't I I can't pretend to understand. I don't remember this at all. I have like wormhold, like memory hold this. It's just like I don't remember this at all. Teresa: Mm. Chas: but Teresa: Yeah, I don't either. I mean, I know, I know cosmetics and fragrance is often the typical get for Lady Stars. This seems maybe a little low rent. I Chas: Yeah. Teresa: you know, I'm sure they paid nicely, but Calvin Klein's like pretty mid-tier. but then I do see that she stepped up to a Louis Vuitton brand ambassadorship in 2024, which I think Chas: Yeah. Teresa: is probably a little more lucrative and a little more high-end. Chas: Yes. Teresa: kind of stuff. Chas: Yeah. Teresa: So yeah. But yeah, real relatively relatively little brand work, it seems like, for someone of her stature. Chas: Yeah, I I think I think brand ambassador means if the heated rivalry guys have taught us anything is free clothes and free stylists. And you know, I'm not mad about that. I Teresa: Mm. right. Freestyling. Chas: mean, YSL y you're going to jail for crimes committed against Connor story, but that's another topic. I yeah, it's about yeah, that's my fashion podcast. Teresa: That's the other podcast. Yeah. Chas: I did we talk about what type of role it will take to win an Oscar for her? I know we might have touched on it briefly. Teresa: Yeah, I mean I was like I was saying, I think like I said, I I thought the the outrun was going to be another nomination and possibly Chas: Yeah. Teresa: a win, but I feel like we might go into a Seertia drought at this point for a while. until I mean, unless they they do some sort of, you know, well well, multifilm franchises often don't get acting nominations or not when they should. so I I Chas: Yeah. Teresa: don't have a lot of hope for the Beatles project in that. yeah. I I think Chas: Well, yeah. I was gonna say I'm gonna go out on a limb and say I don't think she's gonna be getting an Oscar nomination for her role as Linda McCartney, but you never know, I guess. Teresa: No. You never know. I yeah, I I feel like sh at this point it'll be a while until we see something. And it's gonna have to be her playing probably against type. So either like a villain or Chas: Ooh, yes. Teresa: yeah, just something that's not just like, you know, a nice girl in a historical drama Chas: All right. Teresa: kind of a a role. So something something grittier or dirtier at this point, you know. Chas: S like I I would love like in maybe fifteen years for like a Tony Collette hereditary type of moment for Sertia. Teresa: yes. Yes. Absolutely. Absolutely. Just Chas: Who, Teresa: losing it, right? Chas: yeah, Tony should have been nominated for that. But I think

we're seeing, you know, horror coming more into the awards chatter and and discussion. But yeah, so I would love to see something Teresa: Mm. Mm-hmm. Chas: like that from Surcha. I really think she's capable of anything. I have, you know, she's one of the few actors I have ultimate faith in and I trust her, even though there's been some mishaps and we're kind of in a no man's land right now. I really do feel like she has great. intuition about herself and and the projects that she works on and and the directors. I I really feel good about her as an actress. Teresa: Yeah, about her potential to win at some point. Yeah. Chas: Yeah. Teresa: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. well what would what would her astrology say about her chances and her career, do you think? Chas: You know, she is an Aries and she shares a which not shares, but she has a birthday really close to a mutual friend of ours. And it and it looks like, based on the notes you added, that she shares a birthday with Claire Danes, as you called Cryface Queen. so that's awesome. I April twelfth. Yeah, exactly. And the beast in me, speaking of Emmy, she was Teresa: We've all seen Homeland, we know. Come on. April twelfth. It's the it's the same Chas: yeah. Teresa: Yeah, yeah, that's the twelfth is the same day as my birthday, so I'm always able to remember it. But yeah. Not April, different month. That's how I can keep this in mind. Yep. Chas: okay. Yeah, so she's right. Yeah, she's she is a typical, and I shouldn't say typical, but she's a fiery Aries. She's, you know, she's very driven. She's very energetic. She talked about having energy on the set of little women and what really she's she's clearly very hyper focused. And I think that she makes an amazing air. Every Aries woman I've known has that in common. They're very driven, they're very motivated. They're they know what they want. Aries men can't say always say the same thing. Pedro Pascal is an Aries, by the way. But I I feel like Sertia is she she, you know, checks all those boxes as a fire sign. I get along really well with Aries women, so I feel like I would get along well with Sertia. But I think it really informs her career. She she takes chances, she's but she also can hyper focus and really dig in. So Yeah, she's a she's a great Aries woman. I mean, I don't know what she's like in her personal life. She keeps a lot of that private and she's married with the kid now and but yeah, she's she's a she's a great Aries. Teresa: Yeah, definitely. Definitely. well, I think that brings us mostly to the end of our discussion here. But do we want to throw in any kind of pop culture recommendations before we leave the listeners today? Chas: Yeah, you go first. Teresa: Okay. Well, I have to give a shout out to one of my favorite Instagram accounts. it's called ShowBits, and that's at SHOW underscore bits B I T S. it is a cartoon account that combines cartoons mostly of like Gen X, like nineties rockers, with just funny situations and some

of their vocals to back it up. So And a recent example that had me laughing harder than I've laughed in a long time, like for real out loud, was Maynor James Keenan of Toole, assembling IKEA furniture. So he's just there's a little cartoon of him just sitting on the floor in a pile of wood, basically. And of course the lyrics are I know the piece is fit from Schism. Chas: That is awesome. That's awesome. Teresa: So definitely check it out. Definitely check it out. It's always awesome. And I actually have to correct a pop culture thing that I said in our last episode when I was talking Chas: Hm. Teresa: about the Olympic figure skating and Henry V. Paul Wiley won the silver medal in 1992 skating to the music from the Kenneth Brana Chas: Hmm. Teresa: Henry Fifth adaptation. Not gold in 94, as I said, it was Viktor Petrenko who won gold in ninety-two. But either way. Paul Wiley still did have the skate of his life unexpectedly, because people thought Todd Eldridge was going to be the winner for the men from the US. And it just did not happen. So yeah. Chas: Mm. Teresa: How about you? What's going on in your pop culture life? Chas: Would like to shout out another podcast. it is a podcast, I believe I introduced you to Teresa, Overinvested. it is hosted by, Teresa: Mm mm, yes. Chas: yeah, it's hosted by Gabia Baker Whitelaw and Morgan Lee Davies. however, I think Morgan's been on leave except for their Patreon. She's I think suffering from symptoms of long COVID. So they have two other rotating co-host guests basically. but This is a film podcast for the most part. They do talk about some television and one of the things they talk about is the interview with the vampire and now the vampire Lestat TV series. Teresa: Yes. Chas: So that is worth checking out if you're a fan of the series. Also, their most recent episode on the Odyssey I found really interesting. Morgan was actually back for that episode. They talked a lot about the Emily Wilson of it all. And I believe Morgan is either a classics major or has a lot of experience and background with classics. So that was really nice to hear her perspective on that. And then Gavia has a Tumblr, if you guys know what Tumblr is. But it is it is costume design focused and it's the the handle is hello tailor t-a-i-l-o-r and it's great it's history of costume design current costume design and film i believe she has a post about brooklyn the searcha film i could be wrong but it is wonderful if you're into costume design if you are just curious about you know, the costumes in your favorite TV short movies, Gavia's Tumblr's great. So kind of a dual pop culture endorsement. So overinvested podcast and then Hello Taylor on Tumblr dot com. Teresa: Taylor. Yeah, I haven't looked at Tumblr in quite a long time, but I love that handle. being a a sewist myself, that's a good wordplay. So I'll have to look that one up for sure. Well, should we tell the listeners who we're gonna be talking about in our next episode? Chas: We are, and you know, it's it kind of ties into Searcia because this person directed and wrote and co-produced one of the films we didn't mention that Sersha was in, and this and this person Teresa: Which one was that? Chas: directed the film Lost River by Ryan Gosling, and that's who we'll be covering on the next episode of Always a Bridesmaid. Teresa: okay, that's who the Oscar didn't go to next. I I can't say I've even heard of that film, but maybe I'll have to catch up on that before we do our next recording. Chas: You know, I had not either and it looks like his one and done directorial debut and that's Teresa: Mm. Chas: you know, something for next time. But yeah, what Teresa: You know, I was gonna say another connection to Search for though is apparently he was originally cast as her father in the Lovely Bones and after gaining a whole lot of weight, had quote Chas: that's right. Teresa: creative differences with the production team and left or was fired from the production. So Mark Wahlberg took over. So I was really not able to watch Lovely Bones recently on my rewatch to to even like see Mark Wahlberg clearly because I was like, what if this had been Ryan Gosling? Like I feel like I Chas: Yeah. Teresa: don't know, it might have been better, but maybe not, because the whole thing is just all over the place. So okay. We'll be back to talk about our our favorite Ken soon enough. Chas: Bye. Teresa: Bye guys.