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Tanner: Welcome back to Who Is This For? we are talking about Sweeney Todd, the Demon Barber of Fleet Street, directed by Tim Burton in 2007. I chose this as a pretty easy bounce off of our conversation last episode, about Nightmare Before Christmas. today we talk about Sondheim the adaptations of his work on film and stage that have shaped musical theater for the last several decades. We talk about horror musicals as a concept, as a genre, and we talk about how we were able to laugh at this musical while also shielding our eyes from the grotesque events happening on screen. So stay tuned as we ask, who is this for? All right, Elyse I wasn't sure how you were gonna do it this one because I know you've seen the stage adaptation. I never thought that you would be able to do the movie version.
Elyse: What do you mean you accurately predicted that I was like this for about three the last third
Tanner: Ha ha
Elyse: of the movie?
Tanner: Yeah, you and Violence famously don't get along, and this movie wears it on its sleeve, literally at times.
Elyse: Literally.
Tanner: Actually, before we do this, Let's do our speed run exposition Do you wanna make a bid? do you have a thought on how quickly you could summarize this movie?
Elyse: I have no idea. Let's go with twenty-three seconds.
Tanner: Twenty three. my god. I would need in a minute. This is all you, friend.
Elyse: Are you ready? no,
Tanner: Do you need a minute to collect yourself?
Elyse: I'm gonna go. Just gonna go for
Tanner: Okay.
Elyse: it.
Tanner: Okay, let me let me pull up a stopwatch. Okay, friend. Ready when you are? Yes.
Elyse: Barber Ready? Go. A barber in London is sent away to Australia after a mean judge lusts after his wife. He comes back fifteen years later and is seeking revenge. He finds out that his wife is dead and that his daughter has been taken prisoner by this mean old judge and has decided that he wants to kill him. Meanwhile, he's living above a pie shop and the lady who owns the pie shop is in love with him. No Yeah.
Tanner: Okay, we got it. You need to borrow some time.
Elyse: that was my that was my guess for my first act. Like that's all. I w twenty three seconds per act is what I was going for.
Tanner: you know, so fair, how I didn't infer that. I don't know. But
Elyse: I'm not sure. You know me so well, you would think.
Tanner: All right, give me act two. We got twenty three seconds. What are we what you
Elyse: You ready?
Tanner: doing? Ready? Mrs. Lovett go.
Elyse: So the lady who owns the pie shop is in love with the barber and is trying to get him to not kill people, but you know, since he's gonna kill people, she decides why not make pies? So they start making pies out of all of the people that Sweeney Todd kills while he's waiting for the judge to come to his store. The door the judge finally shows up, Sweeney gets his revenge, but he also in the process kills his wife who surprised was already was still alive. The end.
Tanner: Pretty damn good.
Elyse: Did I do it? well, I was gonna say and then he, you know, he and Mrs. Lovett die at the end. But I got nervous about the time.
Tanner: They do they do no that's the whole point, right? they do both die. he kills her and
Elyse: What?
Tanner: a child kills him. There are two other characters that that feature here. That is Anthony, who is this wide-eyed optimist who falls in love with Joanna,
Elyse: I also forgot the Beadle who everybody forgets.
Tanner: Beade's kind of a a a vibes character. I don't know that he's super integral to the pro the plot, but
Elyse: That's true.
Tanner: coming back to your reaction to this, which did you see first? The movie or the play?
Elyse: Well, I knew that this story featured a lot of blood and as you said famously, Elyse plus Blood does not work. So I avoid any and all media that contain a lot of violent scenes because to me I just shut down. So it's not really something I seek out. my best friend is obsessed with Josh Groban and spent the better part of twenty twenty three begging me to go to New York to go see him as Sweeney Todd. And my answer continually was, but there's blood in that show and I can't do it. She eventually convinced me I got to see Josh Groban and Annaleigh Ashford on Broadway. literally their closing weekend. So I mean I I waited till the buzzer. but that was my first my first time watching Sweeney Todd of any kind was on stage with, I would say, peak Sweeney. So, you know, it it's only downhill from there, right?
Tanner: so how did you do with the blood in the onstage performance?
Elyse: Theatrical blood I can do, apparently. Film blood is too real.
Tanner: Do they have Do And then how did you
Elyse: How did you come to the story?
Tanner: I came to it with great reluctance. My my partner, Norman, tell me whether you think this is a red flag. This is one of his favorite movies, and he wanted he wanted to watch this together, I think, during our first year of dating. And it's one of the few movies that I've also had to watch through with like with my my eyes covered. I I think normally not a squeamish around violence, especially film violence. And this is in this film at least, it is It's almost cartoony, right? It's it's Quentin Tarantino like the blood is actually ruby red, It is it is exaggerated. You can see the prosthetic use in there. Like the the necks are extra thick. Like it is
Elyse: I wouldn't know, man. I don't look.
Tanner: And yeah, I had to I had to look away. And I I think it's the tension build. I think it's the lead up. It's the amount of time the the actors spend like with their necks out and you never know exactly when the moment's gonna be. now that I know exactly when it's gonna happen, and I've seen this probably three or four times. I've I've done much better. And simply by sheer force of will. I I had to be able to see I've seen say I've seen all of the nine throat slit in this movie, because there are nine. I looked it up. But yeah, there are
Elyse: You counted?
Tanner: there
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are nine throat slit in this movie, and I needed to be able to s
Elyse: It's like nine too many.
Tanner: Yeah, do you think violence serves a purpose here? Is this useful violence?
Elyse: I mean, Sondheim famously uses kind of dark situations and makes them comedic for a reason, right? To elicit a response from the audience. one minute kind of freaked out that this man is literally going on a murdering spree. And the next minute we're laughing along with his insane song with Mrs. Lovett about listing all the types of people we can put in pies. But the medium that this originally came out in were like you know, Penny Dreadfuls back in the mid 19th century. in England, so like they were salacious stories that were being published week to week
Tanner: It is kind of a constant in human nature, though, right? We consistently tell one another dark stories, especially in childhood, right? I assume most listeners who call their moms on a regular basis get regular reports on the most macabre things that are happening either in the community or in the world. because it is it is an object of fascination that we return to, right?
Elyse: it's fascinating to see the change between the Penny Dreadfuls when the character Sweeney Todd was just a an evil ne'er dwell who was, being sought after by law enforcement. And so this person who's pure evil is going to eventually get captured because that's how stories work. Out in the Western world. And sometime after seeing a play by Christopher Bond, I think that's his name.
Tanner: Yeah, that's that's the one.
Elyse: added this element of like a revenge story for like adding a backstory giving making him a sympathetic character. And that is fascinating that that you can write a character who literally is murdering people right before our very eyes. And we still have this feeling of like, well, I mean he's just like really sad because his wife is gone and Judge Turpin is so icky and like so re repulsive that like you kind of root for Sweeney, right? Like that's that's what Sondheim is trying to do is hold a mirror up to us and show us that like, yeah, you think that you're above this person, but like, if you're in the same situation, would you do the same thing? And he wants you to ask the question.
Tanner: Judge Turpin, by the way, played by the late, not just great, phenomenal Alan Rickman, giving
Elyse: I mean Judge Turpin is icky, but Alan Rickman cannot be icky. And that's what that honestly, that is like the hardest part of the movie for me is watching this man who I adore depict a character who is just so spine tingly repulsive.
Tanner: I actually thought that was an interesting choice because Sondheim usually specializes in ambiguity, right? That is his he likes to trap his protagonist between a rock and a hard place. And in this case, he chose to make one of those his villain, who was i d almost a personification of pure evil and primarily the outgrowth of privilege, right? he's almost an unchecked power that is
fully corrupted.
Elyse: yeah. He's got like Claude Frollo vibes from Hunchback in Notre Dame, right?
Tanner: How do you feel the movie stacks up against the stage performance
Elyse: Yeah, well I mean, as we've discussed, I'm a bit of a theater snob. Like I prefer I know, shocking. I prefer the stage production most of the time. Musical adaptations kinda stress me out a little bit, especially in recent years. And so, I get a little frustrated with people insisting on adapting shows to make them realistic. I'm like, well, this was written for the stage. It doesn't need to be realistic. I reverse
Tanner: Did you
Elyse: course completely when it comes to Sweeney Todd. This adaptation is the best. It is
Tanner: I did not expect that at all. Okay.
Elyse: It is the gold standard. It is fabulous. I mean, Johnny Depp and Helena Bonham Carter act their little tushies off they are fantastic in these roles. I really wish we had stronger singers. So like that's my one critique. But otherwise,
Tanner: I
Elyse: Tim Burton got it. He got the he got the assignment and he knocked it out of the park in my opinion.
Tanner: Did you know that Steven Sondheim considered this his favorite film adaptation of his entire ouvre
Elyse: I'm as smart as Steven Sondheim
Tanner: You are as smart as Steven Stanheim. You've got equally strong taste, yes.
Elyse: That's right. I definitely believe that to be true.
Tanner: yeah. this was his favorite. Because it was not a direct stage adaptation, Tim Burton didn't choose phenomenal singers to portray the work. which is fascinating because Sondheim is so difficult to sing. or if that's mercy.
Elyse: I mean, I don't think it's fair to have Johnny Depp sing Epiphany. I mean, they do a good job of trying to like make the song what it needs to be, but like that song is so freaking hard. And then when you hear Josh Groban sing it, it's like the way it was meant to be sung and you're just like My heart is just full while this man is singing they all deserve to die. Like I don't
Tanner: Ha ha.
Elyse: know why the song hits me. yeah.
Tanner: There are few lines that Depp does hit better now that I've heard the Groban v versions. There's this is piss. Smells like piss. Like that that is that's one that Johnny Depp has left indelibly in my mind.
Elyse: Yes.
Tanner: And the other is really living it just before he throws her into the into the the furnace. he just he nails.
Elyse: I'm not watching that part.
Tanner: He nails those so well that they are indelibly in here and now nobody else can do anything with that. But otherwise you are correct
Elyse: So wait, what do you think of this film adaptation?
Tanner: No, I mean I started with the film and then moved to the the theater, right? So one thing that I did not realize and actually surprised me when I when I got to the signature theater adaptation of this was just how much of an ensemble piece this normally is. The by the sea adaptation was far more comedic. I mean, it still was in the Tim Burton version, but it had a it had a sadder longing element to this. I saw Miss I saw Mrs. Lovett as less unrequited. She's still unrequited in both, but She had more agency. She had more personality ev of her own in the the theater adaptation. and that I liked. I actually really appreciated the Mrs. Lovett aspect even more on stage. but I think the movie really gets the gothic horror piece right. And it feels brooding, it feels Angry, it feels ruthless in a way that the stage adaptation can't. In a stage adaptation, you're with a bunch of other people side by side who when you're scared, you you're fully armed. You know what I mean? You're like, we can take them. If these if these characters are the are the threat,
Elyse: Ha ha.
Tanner: we can take them. it lowers the risk factor, whereas you watch Sweeney Todd alone at night and you're like, the world is coming to get me. I am I am I am alone. and scared and again a in a dark, cruel world. and the intended effect is far more is is far more resonant. And so I I really appreciate just how just how deep into the mind that the film adaptation is able to get. I for a while Hated the Anthony Joanna romance. I at first thought it was like they get to walk out unscathed. They they almost live in their own little side quest. And yes, Joanna goes through a horrible thing, but they don't lose their innocence in the same way. They don't get any real like wisdom or insights. But then I was kind of like, that innocence feels important As the counterweight to The sheer depths of rage they are important foils, I felt. And so I I don't know. How did you feel about the Anthony Joanna romance? Because I I had complicated feelings and I flipped.
Elyse: Do you know Do you know Anthony's last name? The character's name is Anthony Hope.
Tanner: Did that even come up in dialogue or is this just in the credits?
Elyse: I don't know, but it was in everything I've read.
Tanner: Okay.
Elyse: And like Joanna is her as sideways, the YouTuber will point out. Her theme is a little tinged with the Deus Irae which is the Day of Wrath theme that Steven Sondheim used to build all of the character themes in this show. It's basically the Dius Irae is used in music to represent death and Sweeney Todd's like song is the straight Deus Irae And then You have twinges of it in all of the other themes except Antony's. And that's because Antony does not he actually he rescues Sweeney from the sea. He rescues Joanna from Judge Turpin. He is a rescuer. He is the hope. He is the the light in the show. And you like Joanna even because she is locked in a room for sixteen years and Judge Turpin wants to marry her even though she's a child and it's really, really creepy. her theme is tinged with the Deus Irae And actually the character on stage, she kills Mr Fogg, the guy who runs the insane asylum that she's trapped in. So she actually does commit murder on stage in the show and Anthony is the only one that does not. And so you've got this, he's
the only character that makes it out. Innocent, I guess.
Tanner: Yeah, that's fascinating. Does he have to I'm trying to think, does he have to make any hard choices? He always has to make brave choices, but is he ever forced to choose between hard outcomes? Or does he just kind of stay locked in on we are escaping, I will rescue you, we will escape and go? And is that the is that his character arc?
Elyse: think that's his role. I can't think of him being faced with I mean, like Judge Turpin tells him not to come back and he does anyway. Like you're right, that's like a brave choice. It's not like a moral choice. Well maybe it's a moral choice. I don't know. How would you answer that question?
Tanner: Yeah, I'm I'm yeah, I'm picturing a scenario that to me would have felt more Sondheim in the long run, which would have been he can either escape or Joanna gets to escape kind of a thing. Like, you know, he is somehow captive
Elyse: I see.
Tanner: and Joanna something it's tragic and that would be awful and that would mean there was no hope left in the musical. But one of the reasons I like Sondheim, even if I wrestle with Sondheim, is I am always having to chew on the ambiguous elements of life Sweeney Todd is one of the least difficult Sondheims I have ever spent time with, which is fascinating. It takes me to a bleak and difficult place of the human mind, but it has a pretty clear path out. and that is. hopefulness, that is resolve, that is letting go of revenge motif. That is, you know, there are the it is fairly clear that there is a moral to this story. Sondheim usually is more ambiguous than that.
Elyse: the Puritan streak in me is like, why would you write a musical about cannibals and murderers? Like this seems like a bad idea. But it's so beautiful.
Tanner: Did you did you appreciate even more the Schmigadoon good enough to eat in retrospect?
Elyse: Yes. I don't know man, culture does not like Shmigadoon season two, but it is one of my favorite seasons of television.
Tanner: Does culture not?
Elyse: They like the first season, but they don't seem to like the second season. And I I'm obsessed with the second season.
Tanner: in the wicked wisdom of the Shmicago writers, they decided to fuse Sweeney Todd and Annie. And so the victims that were going to be baked into pies were orphans in this. And they made good enough to eat, which is just one of the best
Elyse: Just brilliant.
Tanner: sequences put to television history. anyway. So where does this fall in your relationship to Sondheim? Like how has this shaped your relationship to his work, what he brings to musical theater?
Elyse: my first Sondheim show was, like most people, Into the Woods. It was my on-ramp, as it were. And unfortunately for me, my first exposure to Into the Woods was actually the film adaptation. I don't think that movie, unlike this one, seemed to get the assignment. not understand that Sondheim was giving all of these selfish people their happily ever afters and then slowly taking them away and like revealing the the the hidden underbelly underneath like into the woods is one of the most profound shows that I have ever had the privilege to listen to and that was my entree point and then from there I've you know seen company and I'm hoping to go see Merrily we roll along very soon. And so I have listened to several of his shows but I'm still working my way through his songbook.
Tanner: Which have stayed with you the longest?
Elyse: Honestly, I've probably done the most homework on Sweeney Todd. And I think it's 'cause I often, when something scares me or freaks me out or feels very like like magnets were pulsating away. Like when it kind of gives me that like I'm so interested in this but I don't know why. I will dig deeper. And so for me, Sweeney Todd was that it was really hard show for me to watch. but I've wanted to learn more and I I I just keep digging and I found a video of Sondheim teaching "My Friends" to This gentleman, I it must have been in the 70s, I'm not sure, and the just the insights this man brought to every line in that song, and teaching someone how to act his way through a scene where he's basically singing a love song to Razors, like insane. This man's genius is like beyond.
Tanner: he's such a fascinating character because I think he from what I understand, the critics tended to see him as a cold cynic. And I can see why that comes through. His lyrics are meticulously sharp and always t tinged with some level of bite or hopelessness at times. And He always pushed back that he was indeed a romantic. And I think he was always trying to reconcile with how the world disappoints a romantic, right? How you come into any given scenario with hope and expectation and how you quickly run up against the hard realities of life and have to learn how to metabolize that and turn that into something meaningful. So I love songs like I Know Things Now and Into the Woods. Being alive, I've actually struggled with from company, because I know that Sondheim wanted it to be darker. he wanted it to be much bleaker for Bobby at the end. And he punched it up because it didn't test well. And that's really hard for me to know that such a profound and bittersweet song was going to be just bitter. And instead he compromised because the audience's tastes were just a little too sensitive. I don't know what the right word is there. But
Elyse: We want hope, Tanner.
Tanner: we want hope. We do, we do, but sometimes we
Elyse: We want Anthony Hope
Tanner: want Anthony hope. Which is again, I think his self-confession that he is a romantic really shows here. I think the fact that we get Anthony Hope to balance out this very bitter pill is an important insight. And so yeah, I
Elyse: And like look at the like the deep romanticism that exists in Mrs. Lovett, right? She lives below this Barber, who she describes as beautiful, she is envious of this woman who is married to him. And when, you know, the woman who's married to him
has things befall her, and like Mrs. Lovett has the opportunity to step in and see a future with the barber, she takes it, and then she's like, Well, he only gets excited or like happy when he's talking about killing people. Like, I can get on board with this. And like the only time they have like this romantic feeling song is a little priest, right? Like when she's buying into his vision, and then when she's expressing her heart to him in By the Sea, and she's singing about how like we can go get married and just like live our lives. And he's just not present for it. He's barely listening. And that's very purposeful. It's like Sweeney is so consumed with his vengeance that this woman who is willing to murder for him, or rather use his murdered victims to create pies and, you know, have a little income for herself. she is willing to like still have these hopeful thoughts and he can't join her there. And it's just like it's a very sad thing.
Tanner: Yeah. Did you do any research on the the politics of this movie? Do you think this movie has any politics?
Elyse: I mean I assume it has politics, but no I did not. Please tell me.
Tanner: I I guess the read is that it it is a reflection on how late stage capitalism crushes people and how it crushes people's souls. I think the lyric is it basically someone always has their foot on another person's neck. You're either the one with the foot on someone else's neck or the one with the the foot on your neck. And therefore we all deserve to die. Even you, Mrs. Levitt, even I. it is this nihilist approach to
Elyse: Yeah.
Tanner: If there's no way out, then just kill The makeup and the wardrobe are doing a lot of work here. there's a lot of leather, which was interesting. There was a very
Elyse: Very steampunk.
Tanner: steampunk, very classic pallid from Tim Burton. And then I don't know.
Elyse: Did you count the number of jackets that Johnny Depp was wearing when he went
Tanner: I should have
Elyse: to the market? He was wearing like six layers. Sir, what are you doing?
Tanner: Yeah. These are I'm going through some stray questions right now, but did you recognize the actor who played Anthony, do you know what else he does that is particularly famous?
Elyse: I had to look this up. He was in Stranger Things.
Tanner: Yeah, Vecna. Which they have to digitally alter his voice for that, I would s assume, or his range is just wild. But yes.
Elyse: I mean to go from our only character that represents hope in Sweeney Todd to being Vecna on Stranger Things? Intense.
Tanner: Phenomenal. Why don't we dig into a bit of the who is this for? Because I actually am still I I don't know that I have my answer teed up for this right now.
Elyse: I mean I I would assume the Venn diagram of Tim Burton fans and
Tanner: Ha.
Elyse: musical fans overlaps and that's probably who this was for.
Tanner: I think the over I th I think you're very right about the musical fans, right? Because the So first of all, Sondheim started out seeing Christopher Bond's version, which was sort of a pub theater situation, best I can tell. He loved the the campiness, the corniness of it, and the the way that people who were drunk and eating could engage with it. And so there was there's a pulpy factor here that I think makes its way into the film. and then I don't know what got sondheim to this challenge, but he wanted to scare his audience. He wanted to see if he could use musical theater as a vehicle to actually scare an audience because Horror musicals were not really a thing when yes
Elyse: You don't say
Tanner: Tim Burton was not the first choice for this movie and the early versions of the script.
Elyse: Which blows my mind
Tanner: How did no one think, you know who has to do this? Tim Burton. 'Cause was it was it was Sam Mendez, I think was the Yeah,
Elyse: What? literally cannot believe that.
Tanner: Yeah, because then I think he left the project just because he got attached to Jarhead. and decided to move on. but then they brought in Tim Burton and it ended up running up the cost because Tim Burton indicated that he was going to continue With this as a musical, which I think was always a bit in question because musical films don't always make a lot of money. and the he was uncompromising on the gore. And so I think the overall cost was about fifty million dollars. And this is one of the first iterations of marketing materials that were very shy about the musical element of this. It was advertised for the first three quarters of the first trailer as just pure Tim Burton horror. And then there's Johnny Depp singing nor to near the end. So it wasn't total hide the ball, but it was it was shy. You could tell it was very shy about the fact that this was a musical. Yeah, I think it is I think you're right about it being for a crossover of Tim Burton lovers and musical theater fans. And I I don't know what that intersection what that cross section of people is doing. I don't know who these people are. I don't My partner's one of Norman's one of
Elyse: Well and I'm just con I'm just confused as to like how this got made because like that cross section cannot be very big. And then who is stumbling into this movie who has no point of reference for Sweeney Todd? And if they are, are they mad that they're singing the whole time? Like
Tanner: There were walkouts. There were walkouts for sure. I do think I do think the material sells itself. I do think there is a there is a again that fascination with the macabre that draws people in. They're like, what is this about? That's crazy. I gotta see this. And that's sort of who I think it's for, right? I do think that's why I mentioned Sonnheim's starting point, which was a pub like a pub performance. because I think there there's a populism to this that just kind of lets people explore the like, what the hell is this? I gotta I gotta check this out. And that's who I think it's for. The question originally, that's who it's meant to draw into the theaters.
And then does it engage or stimulate that person intellectually or emotionally? I don't know. That part I'm not positive. That one feels almost exclusively for the musical theater fan.
Elyse: you read Roger Ebert's review and it is delightfully like he's like gleeful talking about this movie. And when people sit down to watch it, I think they are charmed by it. But it getting them to watch it, I'm not sure how the marketing team did that. I would say my favorite musical for most of my life was Les Miserables and that is from a similar era to this musical. Came out in the eighties and that one is a very hopeful story. It is Jean Valjean goes to prison and is wrongfully imprisoned for twenty years and he gets out and he's like about to take the path of going back into prison and just living this convict life. And he is shown extreme mercy from a bishop who gifts him the silver to restart his life. That is like the anti-sweeney Todd And yet I love both shows and so it I was g I was trying to think about like what about these shows speak to me and why do I love them so much and w they're so different. And I actually started to realize they're actually very similar. in the characterization and then you've got like the pretty blonde girl who a boy walking by falls in love with her. That is Cosette and Marius Marius. That is not just Anthony and Joanna. You've got like I mean Sasha Baron Cohen Monsieur Thenardier is essentially Pierre Pierelli. Like it is uncanny. And that's something that I have never ever seen until this watch through.
Tanner: at you. I guess one other area, this is where I do think Sweeney Todd is so effective in eluding me, I read an article from the mid-2000s about Sonnheim's waning influence. sorry, the mid-2010s about Sonnheim's waning influence. basically said that. Sondheim was popular during his era because he was responsive to the rise of psychotherapy and the sort of Freudian-Jungian model of the person and the struggles that we go through in trying to navigate life and the patterns that we are inclined to repeat until we learn a hard lesson. And then is the hard lesson really all that much better in the first place? And their argument was like that age is is starting to come to a close. We're moving into a more neurological way of seeing the world, in a neurochemical way of seeing the world. And it's harder to blame these id-like forces underneath the surface and all of that. So he gave a very psychological argument for why Sondheim was genius for his time. He was responding to the psychoanalytic wave of the day. And is now on his way out. But around the time of his death, The Atlantic released a piece that basically says Gen Z loves Sweeney Todd and they love Sondheim I think he packed more wisdom into a single couplet than I have seen in entire philosophy books. I have a hard time answering who he's for because I think he's just so difficult to take on.
Elyse: He's for everyone.
Tanner: He's for everyone, but there's so many people who are gonna hear a bar of his music
Elyse: I know.
Tanner: and shut down. and so I do
Elyse: My favorite Sondheim anecdote actually came from
Tanner: Yeah.
Elyse: when I saw Into the Woods in on the stage. these two teenagers were sitting behind me, and one of them during intermission is explaining to her friend this show. She's like, Isn't the first act so amazing? It was so good. The second act is really weird, and I don't really understand what's going on. And I'm like, second act is the whole point and
Tanner: You missed. That's that's
Elyse: I was like I was like I'm not gonna jump in. I'm not gonna like Sondheim explain to you I'm like so yes
Tanner: It didn't
Elyse: Sonnheim's not for everyone but
Tanner: No, I think it is for someone who is inclined towards self-reflection, see it. shall
Elyse: It's so good. Well, we're gonna have the pleasure of like going to see Follies this year. And I love to see that in the wake of Sondheim's passing that his shows are getting this new life. And actually, contrary to the article you read, I think that he is just as relevant today as he was when he was writing.
Tanner: Agreed shall we letterboxed?
Elyse: We should letterboxed.
Tanner: let's see here. one of these might answer the question. Who is this for? I have three. They're all very short, so they're all great.
Elyse: Well, I'll go first because mine is probably one of your three.
Tanner: It might be.
Elyse: All it says it's from Aaron. It's four stars. R-I-P, Roast in Pies.
Tanner: Yes.
Elyse: I can't All right, read your letter boxed reviews.
Tanner: Okay. This one is from Ali Bug. Five stars. It's a rewatch review. I wish someone would look at me the way that Sweeney Todd looks at his razor. There's that one.
Elyse: Accurate.
Tanner: four stars from Nikki s Nikki KC98. Four stars. She really went and put herself in a situationship That is, I assume Miss Levett
Elyse: Yeah.
Tanner: and then this is the one that I think sort of answers our question today. It is from Soph. Four stars. Horror and a musical? A bisexual's dream. So maybe that was the answer. I don't know if us
Elyse: We were so daft.
Tanner: We were so daft. It wasn't for us that was serious.
Elyse: Although we both love it. Even if I did watch most of it like this.
Tanner: I guess as a gay and a straight we make both halves of the coin there. We
Elyse: We become
Tanner: bec good.
Elyse: Is that how people describe us? A gay and a straight. Is that our subtitle?
Tanner: Yeah, I think so. that concludes this episode of Who Is This For? Again, feel free to subscribe, like. I don't really know what we want, but do any of those things at one of our handles at Whois This For Pod.