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WHOA.
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It's a Short Time Wrestling podcast.
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You know, every time I do a show and it's
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been a while, I always say it's been a while.
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So if you are unfamiliar and this is popping through
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your feed, you're just finding it. My name is Jason Bryant.
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I'm the host of this the Short Time Wrestling Podcast.
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Started it back in twenty and fourteen, so we're coming
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up on twelve years. A short time, and it has
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been a up and down world of podcasting because back
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when I started this show, it was really one of
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the few out there. And it started back in two
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thousand and eight when Kyle Kleinman and I were brought
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to Minnesota to work for the late J. Robinson and
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his Media Sports Productions outfit, which created Wrestling Full one one,
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which was a great year in setting a lot of
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innovation out there. The technology wasn't there with us. But
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one of the groups that's really benefited from technology and
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implementation of SET technology has been Flow Wrestling and Flow
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Sports with its library of verticals across numerous sports, especially
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recently with the college sports with Flow College and a
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lot of the small college conferences and medium sized conferences.
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And you've got wrestling conferences and hockey conferences that have
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jumped on with Flow Sports. As a new hockey guy,
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I know I can watch a ton of ahl ECCHL
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college hockey on flow Sports, a lot of the junior leagues.
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When wrestling is in a lull, I can pull up
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a game and watch like the British Columbia Hockey League
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for juniors. So it has created an environment for sports
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fans outside of the sport of wrestling. If you're unfamiliar,
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I do have to give them a little glaze here
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because there's a lot of stuff there on flow Sports.
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Today on the show is my interview with Christian Piles,
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Senior Content director at Flow Wrestling. Chris has been forward
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facing on a lot of this stuff over the years,
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been over a decade at Flow Sports. So we're going
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to sit down and talk to him at the nd
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OFBCA convention about things Flows doing, things FRL is brought
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to the rest in community and just checking the boxes
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and answering some questions about what exactly are they doing
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and what does the rest community need to know? And
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as I told Christian after the interview, this might have
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been the longest conversation him and I had with each
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other just face to face because we've always been around
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each other. We've always had conversations, We've had phone calls,
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we've had texts. You know, I've been in the chat
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on FRL. We've traveled the world and been in the
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same place as a lot of times. But from an
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interview perspective, this is the first time I've actually sat
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down to interview him and talk about some of the
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stories that led him to Flow, some of the things
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the Flow are doing now. So here's Christian Piles from
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the NDOBCA convention. We will have a number of shows
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from the convention, including one with the New Hill College
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coach Scott Tisher coming up and some of the session
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breakouts with Mike Moyer, Hella Marulis, and Brandon Slay. So
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keep an eye on the Short Time feed for that
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coming up. But we'll kick off the convention coverage from
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the first weekend in August in Baltimore with Senior Content
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Director Christian Piles of Flow Sports And as always, I'd
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like to thank you for spending your time with me
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because you've always got time for Short Time NWCA Convention
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with Christian Piles of Flow Wrestling and Flow Sports, Senior
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Content Director, host of Flow Wrestling Radio Live, which we
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will still forever disagree it's not Radio Christian.
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But we're already starting.
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We're starting with this no but for real Flow Sports.
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Here.
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You got the booth behind us, right, We've got the
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tech team with the h they're showing out
Load full transcript
the new
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technology that they've got being able to stream events from
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your phone and iPad.
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Before we get into what's what's.
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Going on the content side, talk about.
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What Flow has been doing on the innovation side that
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that people may not know from behind a curtain.
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Yeah, it's funny. I was like, man, he's probably gonna
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be asking me about this stuff and the way the
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way the team works, Like I'm lucky enough, I'm on
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the content team, so we're like we're focused day in
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day out on like how can we get fans to
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engage with the sport of wrestling. How can we you know,
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serve those die hard wrestling fans, those new wrestling fans.
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But it's funny, I was talking with what they're doing.
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It's it's it's I was thinking, it's almost like full
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circle because I'm sure you remember like when Flow started out,
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even before I worked there it was like a self
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Uh you could just upload anything. There's like old ufcs
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that were just like she was just like it was
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just like YouTube but Flow wrestling and so now you
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know Pure Fight mentioned, Pure Fight mentioned right. Yeah, Actually
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it created a lot of work for us. We had
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to take so much of this stuff down because these
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people were just upload like Olympic matches and all this stuff.
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But anyways, my point being, now we got it. This
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a new like self streaming thing that is just like
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so cool. That's gonna enable you know, high school teams,
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teams and you know, youth wrestling the ability to very
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easily stream their events straight from their phone. We have
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a not only just and we think, you know, not
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only you can be able to you know, watch those matches,
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but we have this technology that has like AI that
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can zoom on the action. Don't ask me how that
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they were able to do that, but it's real. If
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you've watched Fargo, we had it. We've had it on
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a lot of events now and including Fargo, so that's
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obviously a difference maker and if if nothing else, it's
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a way for more people to watch the sport. But
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it can be a way for these these teams and
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schools to make additional you know money potentially you know
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how much. It's kind of based on on how well performance,
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but just a just a really a really neat thing.
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And we're, uh, I'm obviously like super excited about that,
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and the whole companies is really thrilled about that. And
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the next the flow Flow Flow Wrestling next gen obviously
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been great as well. So those have been the new
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like technological innovations. I would say that I can say
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I only know about and had nothing to do with,
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but I am just just thrilled to be a part
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of it.
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Going back to twenty thirteen, you know when you came
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in from you know, from time with the open Matt
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at the time on message boards vas for whatever's the
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old wrestling talk the days there when you know you're
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doing rankings and then all of a sudden, you know
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you're elevating into a higher leadership role from from rankers
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guild perspective, How hard was it for you to like
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to give up something like doing the college rankings?
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Well, yeah, I mean it was really hard, and I
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didn't do it for a while. I continued to do
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so I started the college rankings on Flow in twenty
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twelve really brought me in to do that, and I
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did with my friend Ben Golden, who was was awesome
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and really fun to do that with him. And then
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twenty thirteen I started full time at Flow and I
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continued to do them Spake and would have the exact
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day but Spade and Start till twenty seventeen. And so
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I moved into you know, kind of a leadership role
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in twenty sixteen, and then it's probably eighteen or twenty
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eighteen or nineteen before I gave him up. So that's
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an easy way to say. It was not easy at
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--> 00:07:16.279
all to do that. But my boss Ray is like,
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you just you can't be Yeah. I had a lot
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of mentorship from Ray that like said, this is not
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where you need to be spending your time. You know,
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we focus on other things and obviously Spay and now
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Kozak and JD do do an awesome job. I think
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like as you let go of things, like the first
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time you do it, it's always harder, and then the more
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I've done it, the more I'm like, oh, okay, yeah,
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now JD can do this for sure, and he'll he'll
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crush it. And so that's a lesson. I've guess I've
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learned over the thirteen or so years i've been at flows,
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like we've got a great team and they're so capable
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and probably in a lot of ways better than me.
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Technologically evolves you talk, we talked about it with next
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Gen and what's going on with the live streaming, but
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the technology with you know, podcasts were something that was
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kind of fringe, you know when when I was doing
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them and starting in two thousand and eight, and then
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FRL comes aboard and you know, you're you're infamous first episode,
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but the uh, the evolution.
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Of what your thing is? The second episode?
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Oh was it the second episode?
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Episode?
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Is that just preaching with CP? Was that that one?
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Or was that the the first episode? I just had
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been on the second episode, I took the call.
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Ah, Yeah, that was au We learned that one real quick.
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Yeah.
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Now, but the evolution of what FRL has become to
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the Flow brand, it's consistent. It's something that each morning
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people are up, they're watching it, they're involved in the chat.
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How much has FRL really become a core content piece.
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That is part of Flow Wrestling?
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Yeah, well it was. I don't know how to answer
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that exactly, but it does. I'm I'm flattered and humbled
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that it is that for for Flow and for the
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for the company as well, that it's kind of the
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flagship show for the whole company. And I think that's
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really a tribute to the the wrestling fans and how
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much desire there is for this content and how you
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know excited they are to hear and you know, there's
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it kind of reaffirms the initial missions like we want
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to grow these sports and make them bigger because there's
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these fans that they're dying for this content. They want
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to know more, they want to be plugged in, and
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I think FRL is kind of like it's the perfect
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thing for a wrestling fan. At that time in twenty fifteen,
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there wasn't a ton of that and I think, you know,
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it's gone through as you kind of eluded a lot
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of evolutions, I would say, but at its core, like
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you know what, I think, it's what wrestling fans are
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excited about, and that's what we kind of have have
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always focused on and that's but yeah.
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There's a couple of like eras of FRL.
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We go from the starting years and and there's the
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Willy years, then there's the the askering years, and then
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now through multiple studios and settings sometimes hallways, you guys
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have gotten really into a groove. You know, you're kind
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of like JD. Lee with topics. You're kind of anchoring things.
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But I do miss the guy on the couch. I'll
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be honest with me.
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I miss Bracky throwing strays from the couch.
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You think I don't miss what was What's been the
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most fun part about episode one, three and beyond and
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then working with Ben and then now with what.
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The show is today, Well, I think what what's what
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made FRL fun is what makes Flow fun is that
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we have a ton of autonomy and it's kind of
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like you have the freedom to try things and see
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what works, what doesn't work, what you like, what you
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don't like. And I think FRL like really is reflective
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of that. Like it was just me
and I was
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like and then Willie was kind of doing a podcast
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and then.
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Like overflow, it's like, wait, why don't we do this together?
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Because like we had a pretty obvious like connection at
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work and it's like, well, this would be this will
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work and we knew it would work, and it worked,
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of course, so that was really fun and it uh,
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I mean doing it with Ben was such a that
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was a real you got to remember Ben was he
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was my like, my favorite athlete of all time and
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someone I really revered on a personal level and didn't
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know at all, and you know, the idea that I
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got to do a show with him. For those years,
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the majority of the episodes of FRL have been with
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Ben Askrin and just what what he brought, the level
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of expertise, Like you lose something every every era loses something, right,
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like there's no it's like, how do you replace this?
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But there was no replacing Willie or Nomad or Bracky,
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and certainly there's no replacing band. But you you kind
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of you Just the main thing is you just got
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to keep it moving, keep moving forward. And I think
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what helps the current iteration is just like and what
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I tell people, like what it's like working at Flow.
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It's like we're very very close, We're really close friends,
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and that's not lost on me, and that makes the show,
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I think a lot easier to do. So yeah, that
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was I don't even know if I answered your question,
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but I'm done talking about that at least for now.
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Take take the historical drama out of the equation for
244
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a moment. How easy was it to get Willly on
245
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tilt on the show?
246
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You know what? You say that, but I've listened. I don't.
247
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Sometimes I'll go back and listen not for I forget what.
248
00:12:46.399 --> 00:12:48.799
I'll be trying to find, Like i feel like we
249
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talked about this, and I'm trying to find the episode,
250
00:12:51.360 --> 00:12:54.200
and then I'll listen to it. I'm like, oh man,
251
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I'm kinda I feel like I'm kind of getting thrown
252
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off my game. And maybe it was noticeable, but it's
253
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very noticeable to me. So I don't know. I listened
254
00:13:05.960 --> 00:13:07.879
to it, and I feel like it was I got
255
00:13:07.919 --> 00:13:12.320
thrown off more than he did. But yeah, obviously, uh,
256
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there's I would say there's. I think people would probably
257
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describe Willy as more volatile than me, and in a
258
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lot of cases that's probably true. But I would say
259
00:13:22.080 --> 00:13:25.080
in on the show and maybe in some other.
260
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He's not allowed to the studio. Now he's photobombing your interview.
261
00:13:28.240 --> 00:13:31.120
Oh yeah, I'm sure he is. I'd say I have,
262
00:13:31.440 --> 00:13:35.039
I've and this is a learned like I definitely I'm
263
00:13:35.080 --> 00:13:38.840
not anymore, but I definitely had my own volatility as well.
264
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That made it made I think a lot of people
265
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liked it, But what it was never what we were
266
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going for. We were never we never ever went into
267
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it like let's you know, like I think you see
268
00:13:53.799 --> 00:13:55.600
this a little and I don't know if they do
269
00:13:55.639 --> 00:13:57.679
it in barstool, but it seems like they might. Like
270
00:13:57.720 --> 00:14:01.559
it's almost like scripted to fight, like I never wanted
271
00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:05.200
to and he never wanted to, but it happened, and
272
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I don't, I don't. I didn't like it, And as
273
00:14:07.200 --> 00:14:09.840
I listened to it, I didn't like it much in
274
00:14:09.919 --> 00:14:12.440
the time, and now as if I hear like a glimpse,
275
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I'm like, you know, I was like, man, live, live
276
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and learn, right, live and learn for sure, absolutely, I'm.
277
00:14:20.360 --> 00:14:21.320
Talking about learning though.
278
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I mean, this is something where a lot of you
279
00:14:23.360 --> 00:14:26.879
guys came in not as media professionals. You guys are
280
00:14:26.879 --> 00:14:29.159
blessed to have guys like Andy Hamilton and Kyle Klingman
281
00:14:29.440 --> 00:14:31.399
who have gone through those reps in their career. You've
282
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got a lot of you guys are learning on the
283
00:14:32.759 --> 00:14:35.600
job with it. How have you guys personally evolved with
284
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covering the sport uh with with a non traditional coverage background.
285
00:14:39.840 --> 00:14:44.120
Well, I would say, I would say currently we have
286
00:14:45.480 --> 00:14:49.480
a ton of expertise on the
team, obviously Andy and Kyle,
287
00:14:49.559 --> 00:14:53.639
but I would put Tyler Meisinger and Connor Petros up
288
00:14:53.639 --> 00:14:57.399
there with anyone anywhere, uh, in terms of their expertise.
289
00:14:57.519 --> 00:15:04.679
And I think you know, the flow flow was and is.
290
00:15:05.240 --> 00:15:11.159
It's so much about the passion element, the fan element,
291
00:15:11.399 --> 00:15:15.759
and it feels like if you have enough energy and
292
00:15:15.919 --> 00:15:19.600
excitement and you want to do something like you can
293
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you can figure it out. And I'd say figure it
294
00:15:21.679 --> 00:15:24.080
out as kind of the word I would use. That's
295
00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:27.960
maybe that's a beata uh phrase. He he said, may
296
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we'll figure it out, figure it out, and it's like
297
00:15:30.399 --> 00:15:32.639
all right. I wouldn't say it was it's fake it
298
00:15:32.679 --> 00:15:34.799
till you make it, but it's like, all right, it's
299
00:15:34.919 --> 00:15:38.440
like this now, it's like this now, all right. If
300
00:15:38.440 --> 00:15:43.360
you are, if you are, if you have self awareness
301
00:15:44.080 --> 00:15:46.200
and you know what what good looks like, you know
302
00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:50.360
what bad looks like, I think you can progress progress, uh.
303
00:15:50.519 --> 00:15:54.559
And I think that's what we've done. Certainly Episode one
304
00:15:54.600 --> 00:15:57.519
and episode whatever we just did is they're pretty different.
305
00:15:57.639 --> 00:15:59.840
I think you're like thirteen five hundred and twenty.
306
00:16:00.080 --> 00:16:00.519
It's a lot.
307
00:16:00.600 --> 00:16:03.679
Yeah, twelve forty eight. So yeah, it's like it's a
308
00:16:04.759 --> 00:16:07.679
it's a it's a big change. But I think, uh,
309
00:16:07.840 --> 00:16:10.120
I think more than anything, that's been a huge advantage
310
00:16:10.200 --> 00:16:14.039
for Flow. It's like we don't come in, you know,
311
00:16:14.080 --> 00:16:16.600
with like a narrow band of like how it should
312
00:16:16.600 --> 00:16:19.080
be because we're all we're at that time, we're all
313
00:16:19.080 --> 00:16:22.000
figuring out and now we have you know, it's the
314
00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:26.399
most viewed wrestling channel in the world when you look.
315
00:16:26.279 --> 00:16:29.399
At what's coming up, what the content.
316
00:16:29.039 --> 00:16:31.679
Goals are, whether it be world championships, you twenty three
317
00:16:31.720 --> 00:16:34.360
is Fargo, or even high school state tournaments or you
318
00:16:34.360 --> 00:16:37.200
know those events that you guys staff the big ones,
319
00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:40.279
you know, the majors handing out the golden tickets. Where
320
00:16:40.279 --> 00:16:42.960
do you still want Flow to be that you're.
321
00:16:42.840 --> 00:16:50.320
Not at right now? I don't know. I mean there's
322
00:16:50.360 --> 00:16:55.120
like ten of us, so I feel like that's I mean,
323
00:16:55.440 --> 00:16:58.399
I've always said, like, not always said that. I don't
324
00:16:58.399 --> 00:17:00.279
know I would say that, but I have said like,
325
00:17:01.039 --> 00:17:02.759
and it's been said about full like one of our
326
00:17:02.799 --> 00:17:05.839
biggest weapons is our is our budget. Like we're we
327
00:17:05.920 --> 00:17:08.279
have to be really really smart. We don't have unlimited
328
00:17:08.519 --> 00:17:10.920
money to go everywhere we want, whenever we want, Like
329
00:17:11.279 --> 00:17:14.680
we have to be really thoughtful and prioritizing. Stay in
330
00:17:14.759 --> 00:17:18.160
murder hotels. Stay in murder hotels. Baby, that's right, dude.
331
00:17:18.359 --> 00:17:22.359
And I feel like, you know, obviously my my resume
332
00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:25.039
of staying in dumps is is uh, I put it
333
00:17:25.119 --> 00:17:27.759
up with anyone. But I'm telling you Kozak and Bray
334
00:17:27.799 --> 00:17:29.920
have have great promise and I think when it's all
335
00:17:29.960 --> 00:17:32.720
said and done, they they will surpass the murder hotel.
336
00:17:32.880 --> 00:17:37.119
They will stay in dumps. But but no, I think
337
00:17:37.160 --> 00:17:41.920
we're kind of we go, but we're we prioritize. I mean,
338
00:17:41.960 --> 00:17:44.680
I wish we could be at more, but it's uh,
339
00:17:44.880 --> 00:17:49.680
it's I would say our limitations are never you know,
340
00:17:50.039 --> 00:17:52.960
for lack of desire. It's just like we we just
341
00:17:53.000 --> 00:17:55.400
have to be smart and what is the what is
342
00:17:55.440 --> 00:17:58.480
the way with the team we have we can get
343
00:17:58.480 --> 00:18:03.960
the most people to see them most wrestling stuff, videos, articles,
344
00:18:04.039 --> 00:18:06.359
you know, short form, long form like how can we
345
00:18:06.400 --> 00:18:09.759
do it? How can we do it all? And you know,
346
00:18:10.519 --> 00:18:12.799
over time, I feel like we've we've been able to
347
00:18:12.799 --> 00:18:13.640
improve that a lot.
348
00:18:15.119 --> 00:18:18.319
Yeah, where do you think you've grown from twenty thirteen
349
00:18:18.400 --> 00:18:23.599
to today, whether it be personally, whether it be professionally,
350
00:18:23.799 --> 00:18:26.160
I mean as a parent, because we both are parents
351
00:18:26.200 --> 00:18:27.799
and kids are at the same age. So I know,
352
00:18:27.839 --> 00:18:29.680
I've learned a lot about myself in the.
353
00:18:29.720 --> 00:18:31.960
Last ten years especially.
354
00:18:31.960 --> 00:18:35.519
I would say, I mean, I've learned a lot. I mean,
355
00:18:35.519 --> 00:18:38.079
I think just the the anecdote I was given about
356
00:18:38.119 --> 00:18:43.240
old shows, I think, I mean, you've got to it
357
00:18:43.279 --> 00:18:46.240
was I mean, it was a it was a crazy place,
358
00:18:47.200 --> 00:18:49.400
and I'm dropped in there
and I'm like, I'm a
359
00:18:49.480 --> 00:18:53.400
sort of an intense personality myself, and like I'm kind
360
00:18:53.440 --> 00:18:57.720
of a confrontational person also, and so I just learned
361
00:18:57.759 --> 00:19:01.359
a lot about like leadership, how to work with people,
362
00:19:01.480 --> 00:19:07.240
how to lead people, how to be led. And I
363
00:19:07.279 --> 00:19:10.000
would say that's for me personally, you know, because someone
364
00:19:10.039 --> 00:19:12.599
who had I never I was a teacher, I never
365
00:19:12.680 --> 00:19:16.160
managed anyone to then you know, at a point I
366
00:19:16.200 --> 00:19:19.880
was managing across a bunch of different verticals and probably
367
00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:23.759
had you know, fifteen or more direct reports. You just
368
00:19:23.839 --> 00:19:25.799
learn a lot through that. It's a lot of hard,
369
00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:28.400
hard things and it was difficult, but it was a
370
00:19:28.480 --> 00:19:34.039
great experience for me. I Uh So I would say
371
00:19:34.079 --> 00:19:36.079
that I've definitely learned a lot. I think my own
372
00:19:36.160 --> 00:19:40.240
temperament is I'm most proud of it's improvement. I feel
373
00:19:40.240 --> 00:19:42.319
like as much as I've talked about this, like I
374
00:19:42.400 --> 00:19:44.880
sound like I was like crazy and I wasn't. But
375
00:19:45.000 --> 00:19:52.599
it's like for my own like personal uh, what's it?
376
00:19:52.680 --> 00:19:57.519
What's the word expectations? Like I you know, there's you're
377
00:19:57.599 --> 00:20:00.200
you're basically living this life. It's not just a ah,
378
00:20:00.400 --> 00:20:02.720
this is just like kind of everything I was doing.
379
00:20:02.839 --> 00:20:08.599
So I definitely learned to on top of that, like
380
00:20:08.759 --> 00:20:11.519
just time management, given time to my family. There was
381
00:20:11.559 --> 00:20:14.279
a time where I wasn't doing that. I felt like
382
00:20:14.319 --> 00:20:16.960
I couldn't do that. The job was really intense and
383
00:20:17.000 --> 00:20:19.759
I was remote, and I just felt like I just
384
00:20:19.799 --> 00:20:23.559
got to show them everything I've got every day and
385
00:20:23.599 --> 00:20:26.079
I'll just never stop. And you know, I missed both
386
00:20:26.079 --> 00:20:28.680
my kids' birthdays one year and like I'm on the road.
387
00:20:29.079 --> 00:20:30.920
I totaled it up with a one year and it
388
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:33.480
was I was gone three total months of a year.
389
00:20:33.519 --> 00:20:36.519
I was like, this is not this is not tenable.
390
00:20:36.559 --> 00:20:38.200
I had a four year old and two year old,
391
00:20:38.559 --> 00:20:39.880
and I was like, all right, this is not this
392
00:20:39.920 --> 00:20:42.319
is not good. So I've learned a lot in that
393
00:20:44.759 --> 00:20:51.119
Trust people trust your team. The importance of high or
394
00:20:51.200 --> 00:20:55.480
slow really
important. And I think that you look at
395
00:20:55.519 --> 00:20:58.880
the team we have and have had for this extended
396
00:20:58.920 --> 00:21:02.920
period of time, that's not easy to do. It's not
397
00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:06.079
easy to do anywhere. It's not easy even at Flow,
398
00:21:07.079 --> 00:21:09.240
and I think it's a tribute to the to their
399
00:21:09.359 --> 00:21:12.480
character and the people we have and kind of putting
400
00:21:12.519 --> 00:21:15.640
the sport first and you know, people with high character
401
00:21:15.720 --> 00:21:16.160
as well.
402
00:21:17.079 --> 00:21:19.359
Last serious question before we get to the fun stuff.
403
00:21:19.400 --> 00:21:25.559
Okay, when we look at moving forward, mission forward, future coverage, ideas,
404
00:21:25.640 --> 00:21:28.039
things are gonna get implemented, how much more can you
405
00:21:28.079 --> 00:21:29.720
guys get better?
406
00:21:31.559 --> 00:21:34.839
Man? There's all yeah, there's so much we want to do.
407
00:21:34.880 --> 00:21:37.799
There's so much. I feel like there's still so much,
408
00:21:41.359 --> 00:21:44.599
so much opportunity, there's so much great wrestling. There's so
409
00:21:44.640 --> 00:21:47.480
many stories. Every day I'm talking to someone and we
410
00:21:47.599 --> 00:21:50.279
get you know, we're lucky enough. People are just like, hey,
411
00:21:50.319 --> 00:21:54.160
this happened. What do you think we have? We're rife
412
00:21:54.160 --> 00:21:58.400
with opportunities, and you know, it's like for us and
413
00:21:58.680 --> 00:22:00.599
like for me and Bray, it's like, all right, how
414
00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:03.400
can we we think more about We know we have
415
00:22:03.440 --> 00:22:05.880
the team to go out and extecute basically any video
416
00:22:05.880 --> 00:22:08.039
project we want to do, it's like, how can we
417
00:22:08.079 --> 00:22:10.640
efficiently get to them as many of them as possible?
418
00:22:10.880 --> 00:22:14.079
So that's really the next The next thing is as
419
00:22:14.079 --> 00:22:16.240
far as I'm like, how can we get get to
420
00:22:16.279 --> 00:22:20.519
more with it with the team we have. But you know,
421
00:22:20.559 --> 00:22:24.359
we have some really cool series in the can that
422
00:22:24.440 --> 00:22:27.839
are that are gonna be great, like top high school wrestling,
423
00:22:27.960 --> 00:22:31.559
dual environments. I think we did one in Pukosa, Yeah,
424
00:22:31.920 --> 00:22:34.319
your alma mater. So we've got a bunch of those
425
00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:39.640
in the can. So that's and we we got some
426
00:22:39.680 --> 00:22:41.759
other things that are not done yet that are gonna
427
00:22:41.839 --> 00:22:45.799
we're we're working on. So there's I mean, you're asking me,
428
00:22:45.920 --> 00:22:48.839
what what can we still do? Man? I think I
429
00:22:48.920 --> 00:22:49.599
think so much.
430
00:22:49.680 --> 00:22:52.680
I think there's a ton still You
just touched on it.
431
00:22:52.920 --> 00:22:56.039
You and I are both from small towns in Virginia. Granted,
432
00:22:56.359 --> 00:22:58.200
yours is in the mountains. Mine is kind of surrounded
433
00:22:58.240 --> 00:23:01.519
by a major metro area. One of the things that
434
00:23:01.599 --> 00:23:03.160
I get had lunch with a buddy of mine from
435
00:23:03.200 --> 00:23:05.759
high school that I hadn't seen in twenty years, and
436
00:23:06.319 --> 00:23:08.680
people ask us when we get to go all these
437
00:23:08.680 --> 00:23:10.640
countries and see these cool things and go to the
438
00:23:10.680 --> 00:23:13.519
Olympic Games and countries. A lot of people can't spell
439
00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:18.000
what has been one of the most I guess fulfilling
440
00:23:18.039 --> 00:23:22.119
things about world traveling, which you've openly admitted to being
441
00:23:22.200 --> 00:23:23.559
kind of hesitant on some things.
442
00:23:23.599 --> 00:23:27.839
I definitely was, and just that's so, I mean, you
443
00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:32.400
gotta remember, I didn't fly, Like my flight to Austin
444
00:23:32.559 --> 00:23:35.640
for this job in twenty thirteen was was my first
445
00:23:35.640 --> 00:23:39.640
flight since like seventh grade, and I'd only flown two
446
00:23:39.680 --> 00:23:44.519
times ever. So I'm just I'm a total I don't
447
00:23:44.519 --> 00:23:48.160
know anything of how the world, okay, And so it's
448
00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:50.200
like maybe just a little small town like I don't
449
00:23:50.359 --> 00:23:52.759
I don't know what happens in Uzbekistan. I don't know
450
00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:56.000
what happens in you know, even Paris or whatever. It's like,
451
00:23:56.039 --> 00:24:00.519
I'm not going there. And Mark Flow shamed me one
452
00:24:00.920 --> 00:24:02.920
one time when I had told him I had actually
453
00:24:02.920 --> 00:24:06.240
never traveled abroad for Flow and He's just like, it's
454
00:24:06.359 --> 00:24:08.000
just like, what are you doing? You need to do this.
455
00:24:08.079 --> 00:24:10.599
It's like I was like, you're right, I do okay,
456
00:24:10.599 --> 00:24:12.359
And then I went, you know, I went to Paris
457
00:24:12.400 --> 00:24:13.359
and I've been I've.
458
00:24:13.200 --> 00:24:16.359
Been on quite a few now, was seventeen, your first
459
00:24:16.400 --> 00:24:21.200
international trip, no, no, later, I hadn't the twenty one Olympics.
460
00:24:22.480 --> 00:24:24.240
That was the first time you left the country just
461
00:24:24.279 --> 00:24:25.359
to go to the Olympics on.
462
00:24:25.319 --> 00:24:28.240
An empty plane in the middle of the pandemic. So
463
00:24:28.359 --> 00:24:31.440
that's what I wow. But I wasn't scared at that
464
00:24:31.519 --> 00:24:33.559
point in time. I was like, I've traveled so much
465
00:24:33.599 --> 00:24:35.279
around the country. I'm like, I'm not worried. I was
466
00:24:35.319 --> 00:24:36.759
really not worried. I can't be a
friend of Tokyo.
467
00:24:36.799 --> 00:24:37.960
You're stayed in the murder Hotel.
468
00:24:38.279 --> 00:24:42.480
I know exactly nothing can touch me. Now I would
469
00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:45.839
say this, I've gone n as many places to you,
470
00:24:45.920 --> 00:24:48.200
but everywhere I've gone, I've liked it, and I've liked
471
00:24:48.240 --> 00:24:51.279
the people, and I've I've had a deep appreciation for,
472
00:24:53.160 --> 00:24:56.200
you know, the opportunity to go, and it just it
473
00:24:56.240 --> 00:25:00.000
does feel very special, and it's definitely there's a lot
474
00:25:00.039 --> 00:25:02.880
lot of moments where I'm like, I cannot believe I
475
00:25:02.880 --> 00:25:05.079
get to do this Like that happens to me for
476
00:25:05.119 --> 00:25:07.279
sure a couple of times a month where I just
477
00:25:07.319 --> 00:25:09.920
probably say it out loud. But man, when you're at
478
00:25:10.319 --> 00:25:13.960
When I was in Albania for David's last match when
479
00:25:14.000 --> 00:25:17.279
I was in Tokyo. When Tokyo was like weird, I
480
00:25:17.319 --> 00:25:21.519
felt mad. I was like, I'm hearing David Taylor's Dad's
481
00:25:21.559 --> 00:25:25.519
not here, like this is this isn't right, this is wrong,
482
00:25:25.759 --> 00:25:28.519
like but I'm but at the same time, I'm like, man,
483
00:25:28.559 --> 00:25:31.000
I'm so glad I'm here to see Tamara Mensa Stock
484
00:25:31.039 --> 00:25:34.759
winning Gables, you know, win like and really what was
485
00:25:36.559 --> 00:25:40.200
maybe one of the greatest Olympic performances for Team USA
486
00:25:40.519 --> 00:25:43.559
and wrestling on the men's and women's side, And I
487
00:25:43.599 --> 00:25:47.440
don't know, you got to you gotta go back, So
488
00:25:47.720 --> 00:25:50.640
I mean that was really special. But every trip special
489
00:25:50.960 --> 00:25:53.839
you're going with the team. You're never really going by yourself.
490
00:25:54.319 --> 00:25:57.200
And so just imagine traveling for a week and change
491
00:25:57.240 --> 00:26:00.400
with a dear friend that loves dear friend ends that
492
00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:02.839
love wrestling and that crack you up and you crack
493
00:26:02.920 --> 00:26:07.960
them up. It's it's great. And then you know, but
494
00:26:08.079 --> 00:26:12.519
more than anything, like getting to there's something specially. You know,
495
00:26:12.519 --> 00:26:14.480
you go to NCAA's now there's so much media and
496
00:26:14.480 --> 00:26:16.200
you go it kind of anywhere. There's a lot of meeting.
497
00:26:16.240 --> 00:26:19.799
It's like, man, it's just me and Kyle Dake and me,
498
00:26:20.160 --> 00:26:21.960
it's like a meet a lord. It's like we're the
499
00:26:22.039 --> 00:26:24.559
only ones here. It's like, man, this is this is
500
00:26:24.599 --> 00:26:28.839
really cool. This is what an opportunity to, you know,
501
00:26:29.480 --> 00:26:32.920
have more people know about how incredible these these wrestlers are.
502
00:26:33.079 --> 00:26:38.160
As obviously they're amazing athletes, but they're very different people.
503
00:26:38.200 --> 00:26:40.880
And I think maybe that's bringing a full circle, but
504
00:26:43.039 --> 00:26:47.039
I think that's what drew me to my wrestling fanaticism
505
00:26:47.119 --> 00:26:53.000
more than anything, is the unique wiring of wrestling people
506
00:26:53.440 --> 00:26:55.759
and how I felt like sort of a commonality with
507
00:26:55.920 --> 00:27:00.440
like that in some ways, and even of it that
508
00:27:00.599 --> 00:27:03.400
was like whoa, that's even that's really extreme for me
509
00:27:03.440 --> 00:27:06.960
to even understand. But that's what I've always liked about it.
510
00:27:06.960 --> 00:27:09.559
It's like me and these are not freaking you listen
511
00:27:09.599 --> 00:27:13.920
to NFL and NBA interviews or baseball or it's like, man,
512
00:27:13.960 --> 00:27:16.759
these people are just are so boring to me, and
513
00:27:16.880 --> 00:27:20.640
like there's not many people if if, if the guards
514
00:27:20.640 --> 00:27:24.279
are down, these wrestlers are really really interesting people. So
515
00:27:25.200 --> 00:27:27.799
from being in a small place where I just you know,
516
00:27:28.000 --> 00:27:32.160
would not go anywhere to travel in the world, they
517
00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:35.640
I think Mark is it a Mark Twain quote, you'll
518
00:27:35.680 --> 00:27:38.079
correct me, but He's like traveling is the best education
519
00:27:38.279 --> 00:27:40.559
or something like that. It's like, man, it really is.
520
00:27:40.559 --> 00:27:45.119
You learned so much about about people and so yeah,
521
00:27:45.200 --> 00:27:48.359
it's it's really cool that being from a hometown of
522
00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:51.400
like ninety you know, one hundred people to you know,
523
00:27:51.640 --> 00:27:53.759
Tokyo and Paris is pretty cool.
524
00:27:54.920 --> 00:27:56.599
Yeah, you might have to get Spade to correct you
525
00:27:56.680 --> 00:27:57.640
on the Mark Twain quote.
526
00:27:57.680 --> 00:28:00.200
It's not gonna be me but out.
527
00:28:00.680 --> 00:28:03.319
Shifting back back to both both of us being for Virginia,
528
00:28:03.359 --> 00:28:04.799
you went to a single a high school or to
529
00:28:04.799 --> 00:28:06.920
double a high school. Our state tournaments were in the
530
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:09.839
same spots, right, notorious or.
531
00:28:09.920 --> 00:28:11.680
Infamous Salem Civic Center?
532
00:28:12.359 --> 00:28:15.440
What are if somebody says the word Salem Civic Center
533
00:28:15.480 --> 00:28:17.559
to you, what's the first thing that comes into your mind?
534
00:28:17.759 --> 00:28:22.400
I am nervous. To me, it's funny because I have
535
00:28:22.440 --> 00:28:25.039
a totally different perspective I think from you, just based
536
00:28:25.039 --> 00:28:26.960
on how you ask that question about the Salem Civic
537
00:28:27.000 --> 00:28:29.359
Center and this kind of maybe brings it full circle
538
00:28:29.839 --> 00:28:34.960
to me. The Salem Civic Center is is this giant
539
00:28:35.920 --> 00:28:39.920
event arena where you have the like this is I did.
540
00:28:39.960 --> 00:28:42.200
I hadn't gone to NCAA's before I had gone. I
541
00:28:42.200 --> 00:28:44.559
hadn't been to a you know, any major Like you
542
00:28:44.640 --> 00:28:47.319
go to the Salem Civic Center. It's like this place
543
00:28:47.400 --> 00:28:50.119
is big, there's a lot of people. It's like the
544
00:28:50.200 --> 00:28:55.519
mats are down below. I'm like it it's an intimidating thing.
545
00:28:55.559 --> 00:28:57.759
It was intimidating for me to just go there as
546
00:28:57.920 --> 00:29:01.920
a coach, and you know, it was intimidating the kids.
547
00:29:02.160 --> 00:29:06.000
Like that's how I think. I think I get nervous
548
00:29:06.039 --> 00:29:07.960
when I think about it. I think I have some
549
00:29:08.759 --> 00:29:11.279
it's it's it's mixed because like I've I've had some
550
00:29:11.319 --> 00:29:13.799
of the worst memories of my life there and just
551
00:29:13.839 --> 00:29:17.079
like I just lived and died with it. And but
552
00:29:17.119 --> 00:29:19.960
then I've had some great moments of where I saw
553
00:29:20.039 --> 00:29:24.279
kids make their dreams come true that I said I
554
00:29:24.279 --> 00:29:28.440
would help them, you know, reach and to see them
555
00:29:28.480 --> 00:29:30.240
do it and know when you know all the work,
556
00:29:30.319 --> 00:29:34.119
there's no club wrestling, and where I'm from, it's like
557
00:29:34.319 --> 00:29:36.440
I was the club coach. We were practicing year round,
558
00:29:36.519 --> 00:29:37.880
like that was the only way they could do it.
559
00:29:37.920 --> 00:29:39.759
So it's like either I go to the high school
560
00:29:39.839 --> 00:29:41.319
or they don't do anything. So it's like, all right,
561
00:29:41.359 --> 00:29:43.720
well let's do it. And so with with all that
562
00:29:43.759 --> 00:29:46.880
in the background, it's like at the Salem Civic Center,
563
00:29:46.960 --> 00:29:49.680
you got the guy winner about ping. Yeah, that's great,
564
00:29:49.680 --> 00:29:50.559
that's how you say it.
565
00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:54.359
And the same jock jam CD since nineteen ninety five.
566
00:29:54.559 --> 00:29:57.960
I hear you Dropped a Bomb on Me by the ojs.
567
00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:01.079
Do you know what that song? It's the Gap Gat band. Yeah,
568
00:30:01.240 --> 00:30:04.319
and I hear that song. I'm like, dude, I remember,
569
00:30:04.559 --> 00:30:08.359
this is so weird. I remember that song playing and
570
00:30:08.400 --> 00:30:12.519
my my, my brother had his semi final match against
571
00:30:12.559 --> 00:30:16.079
his kid from Radford named William Saunders, and I knew.
572
00:30:16.119 --> 00:30:18.680
I was like, if we beat him, will win States.
573
00:30:19.240 -->
00:30:23.720
And he had beaten us pretty bad, not pretty bad,
574
00:30:23.759 --> 00:30:25.960
but like it wasn't that close. A couple of takedowns
575
00:30:26.000 --> 00:30:26.920
to none. I was like, all right, this is the
576
00:30:26.920 --> 00:30:28.920
guy we gotta beat. I just remember watching him warm
577
00:30:29.000 --> 00:30:30.640
up and that song was playing. I remember watching the
578
00:30:30.680 --> 00:30:32.799
warm up he was doing. I don't know why I
579
00:30:32.839 --> 00:30:35.799
remember that, but I really do. We lost, but we
580
00:30:35.799 --> 00:30:40.000
were right there, so yeah. I have some insanely vivid
581
00:30:40.720 --> 00:30:42.960
memories of the Salem Civics Center. To me, it's a
582
00:30:43.160 --> 00:30:46.480
it's a very very special place and a great place
583
00:30:46.519 --> 00:30:50.880
for to watch wrestling. I watched Virginia Tech wrestle Iowa State. There.
584
00:30:52.039 --> 00:30:56.160
Kj's first year, so yeah, great, great memory. He's at
585
00:30:56.160 --> 00:30:58.759
the Salem Civic Center, all right. Keeping it on Salem
586
00:30:58.759 --> 00:30:59.119
for a minute.
587
00:30:59.119 --> 00:31:03.519
Even though you were they were your division, the Grundy side,
588
00:31:03.839 --> 00:31:06.079
because it was the whole town. We had to wrestle
589
00:31:06.079 --> 00:31:08.839
against them. They were our double A rivals. But you
590
00:31:08.920 --> 00:31:12.319
first walk in there and you see experience Grundy. We
591
00:31:12.359 --> 00:31:16.079
won't we won't experience Grundy proper anymore as it's consolidated.
592
00:31:16.119 --> 00:31:20.279
But yeah, explain that wall of people at the state
593
00:31:20.359 --> 00:31:21.359
tournament in Virginia.
594
00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:25.000
Well, it's kind of like I would say, like coal
595
00:31:25.039 --> 00:31:29.440
mining Iowa fans, like you've got I mean, I'm from
596
00:31:29.519 --> 00:31:33.000
the freaking country, like the country you drive your tractor
597
00:31:33.039 --> 00:31:36.960
to school day. We had like riverheads did that too, Yeah,
598
00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:40.319
but they're freaking they had long hair. Riverheads is freaking
599
00:31:40.920 --> 00:31:43.880
don't get me started. They were too pretty. We had
600
00:31:43.960 --> 00:31:47.640
the land. But I would say like I was like,
601
00:31:47.640 --> 00:31:50.640
oh there's another this like we're the JV country compared
602
00:31:50.640 --> 00:31:56.000
to like Grundy. But just like insane passion, you know
603
00:31:57.039 --> 00:31:58.759
a lot of them. I mean, it's just what I
604
00:31:58.799 --> 00:32:02.480
love about wrestling. It's like I've always said, like I
605
00:32:02.519 --> 00:32:05.119
want to I want to live in a place someday
606
00:32:05.559 --> 00:32:07.960
that loves wrestling. Like every time I go to Iowa,
607
00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:10.920
I was like, man, I want to be here. I
608
00:32:10.960 --> 00:32:14.119
just want to go everywhere and everyone is like into
609
00:32:14.160 --> 00:32:16.519
the thing I'm into. That's what drew me to Like
610
00:32:17.759 --> 00:32:20.200
message boards, It's like there's no one into I could
611
00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:23.400
Who could I even talk to about wrestling in Churchville? Nobody.
612
00:32:23.720 --> 00:32:26.440
So it's like, all right, there's there's the Internet, and
613
00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:28.680
there's flow wrestling, and there's the wrestling talk. All right,
614
00:32:28.759 --> 00:32:30.759
let me go be a spaz online. But there for
615
00:32:30.799 --> 00:32:31.279
a little bit.
616
00:32:32.240 --> 00:32:34.000
Uh, we've all been there.
617
00:32:34.160 --> 00:32:36.720
Yeah I was there, but I got out of it.
618
00:32:37.319 --> 00:32:40.680
But that was like, yeah, so anytime I have common
619
00:32:40.680 --> 00:32:43.240
out here, if you love wrestling, man, we're probably gonna
620
00:32:43.279 --> 00:32:43.720
get along.
621
00:32:46.480 --> 00:32:49.640
The Short Time Wrestling Podcast has been outfitted by Compound
622
00:32:49.640 --> 00:32:54.079
Sports where since ever since you need something, shirts, hats, gear,
623
00:32:54.160 --> 00:32:56.480
team where you need it, they've got it. Call up
624
00:32:56.519 --> 00:33:07.160
Cliff and the crew at CMP Sportswear dot com.