TRANSKRIBEERI 🔗
00:00:02
Speaker 1: There's this room at Hardy Correctional Institution, in a building where religious services are held. It's a tiny room, maybe five by eight feet, a closet, really, but the inmates call it the war Room.
00:00:15
Speaker 2: It's just where we do war spiritual warfare.
00:00:18
Speaker 1: The walls are cinderblock painted prison gray. There are two stools to kneel on during prayer, and thin wooden strips line the walls where inmates can thumbtack prayer requests jotted on index cards. Leo finds himself in the war Room one day in twenty sixteen, six years after his evident Sherry hearing. Despite the fingerprint evidence linking Jeremy Scott to Michelle's murder, the judge denied Leo's motion for a new trial. Leo's now been in prison for twenty eight years and he fears he'll never get out. And ever since his encounter with Jeremy Scott in the tunnel beneath the courthouse, Leo's been grappling with feelings he'd never known before. In the War Room, he contemplates that moment and how he'd stood there, just feet away from Jeremy, ready to take justice into his own hands.
00:01:18
Speaker 3: I had carried the wrongful mantle of the murder in my life for all them years, only to allow myself to be brought to a place where I could actually do it by this system.
00:01:32
Speaker 2: And I was feeling like a murderer, and I didn't want that.
00:01:42
Speaker 1: When Jeremy's prints were found in Michelle's car, Leo's lawyer showed him everything they had on Jeremy, including his criminal history and his psychiatric reports.
00:01:52
Speaker 3: And in the process of going through all of that, I began learning Jeremy's story, because we all have a story, right, and his story is miserable, and it's just a miserable story.
00:02:05
Speaker 1: Leo realizes that if Jeremy Scott is the person who killed Michelle, he isn't the monster he'd imagined. He'd done terrible things as a teenager, yes, but he was also a kid with a low IQ, serious behavioral problems, and a long history of abuse. Even knowing all this, Leo begins to worry that the anger that's building inside is going to destroy him.
00:02:32
Speaker 3: It was a bitterness that leads up to the war room. And I understood this. I'm a believer, and so from a spiritual sense, I believe that I'm saved.
00:02:45
Speaker 2: I know that my wife Michelle was saved.
00:02:47
Speaker 3: You'd saved in a little church or up the road here in Marlbury, and so she's delivered. The only one that's losing in this thing right now is Jeremy, who's never known the love of a mother, never known the love of a friend, never had a friend, and he's in prison for crimes he's committed, and everybody hates him.
00:03:05
Speaker 2: He's got an eighty IQ. He has no support, no nothing.
00:03:09
Speaker 3: And I said to God, I said, okay, if this is your will, this is all I ask, help me to forgive so that I can be free of that. Help me to forgive him, and then, if you would, you forgive him and let him know love for the first time in his life ever.
00:03:34
Speaker 1: Leo writes his prayer for Jeremy on a note card and tax it to the wall. Now other inmates coming to the war room will see the card and pray for Jeremy too.
00:03:47
Speaker 2: And I didn't think nothing else of it. I came out of the war room and went about my day.
00:03:53
Speaker 1: But a few days later, Chrissy comes to visit Leo, and she's got news. Chrissy tells Leo that Jeremy Scott has just confessed to killing Michelle.
00:04:13
Speaker 3: Do you my man?
00:04:19
Speaker 2: I have to have my feelt.
00:04:25
Speaker 4: Sru sorry list.
00:04:30
Speaker 2: In this vasty.
00:04:37
Speaker 4: Uclation Abrege despish to the world who holding stuff.
00:04:59
Speaker 1: To bone Valley Chapter seven, I lost it.
00:05:36
Speaker 5: Generally speaking, when you have someone who's been convicted of a crime, you have to move mountains to try and get that conviction overturned.
00:05:44
Speaker 1: This is criminal defense attorney Andrew Crawford. Scott Cupp has now become Judge Scott Cup and he's no longer permitted to represent Leo. Andrew read about Leo's case in a local newspaper and he wanted to help, so he picks up where Scott Cupp left off with Leo out of legal options. Andrew knows the only way he can get Leo's case back into court is with once again the discovery of new evidence, so he starts writing letters to everyone who'd been housed with Jeremy Scott in prison in case Jeremy had mentioned anything to them about Michelle Schofield. And he also writes to Jeremy, you know.
00:06:24
Speaker 5: By the time I wrote him the letter had nothing to lose, and I figured maybe he would say something.
00:06:32
Speaker 1: The letter that Andrew sent says, in part, I now represent Leo Schofield. If there is any further information you could provide me in helping to free this truly innocent man, I would greatly appreciate it. I await your response. Nearly a year passes. Then, in July of twenty sixteen, a letter arrives from Columbia Correctional Institution. It's from Jeremy.
00:07:00
Speaker 5: I was very surprised, and I was very puzzled. I didn't think i'd hear anything from him because he hadn't really talked to anybody else. And then opening up and reading the letter, after reading the tone of the letter, I could tell that he had something that he wanted to say, or something that he wanted to convey. What it was, I wasn't sure, and because of his extensive record, I wanted to be extremely cautious about it as well.
00:07:23
Speaker 1: Jeremy is being cagey in the letter. He tells Andrew he has information about the Schofield case that he's willing to die with if he talks. He wants to know what's in it for him. He wants to talk to Andrew one on one. Andrew sets up a phone call a few weeks later, but in the state of Florida, it's illegal to record phone calls without the consent of all parties involved, So Andrew decides he needs someone to listen in on the conversation and take notes. He walks down
Load full transcript
the hall of his office building and knocks on the door of another lawyer.
00:07:58
Speaker 6: And he came into my office and he said, hey, man, I got this call and I'd like to have someone present with me. I said, okay, you know, I didn't know anything about the case.
00:08:08
Speaker 1: This is Sean Costas. Sean practices family law. He's in the same building as Leo's lawyer, but he and Andrew don't really work together.
00:08:18
Speaker 6: I do zero criminal law, and I've never been asked to listen in on a call. So I grabbed my notepat so, yeah, I'll be in there, no problem. So we got into his office and I sat down at you know, Andrew's desk, and he's got two chairs situated, you know, little executive chairs there, and I'm sitting in one.
00:08:39
Speaker 2: He just said, just listen up.
00:08:42
Speaker 1: Andrew puts the phone on speaker and makes the pre arranged call to Columbia Correctional Institution. Jeremy picks up the phone.
00:08:52
Speaker 6: Jeremy got, you know, right to the point, like right off the bat, and I put it in quotes from my note. It says end quotes, got the wrong man in prison, end quote. And then he says I was present when she died. And then Andrew asked who killed her? And then the guy says it wasn't Leo. And then Andrew asked, you know who it was, and then he said, can't say it right now. And then as to Leo, he said he does not deserve to be there. And then he said I was present in the car. It was a rainy night, she was at a gas station. She gave me a ride, and then there was some hidden lake where she was murdered. And he also said I was jugged up bad that night. And then Andrew asked him what happened at this hidden lake and then he said he being Jeremy, said she was killed inside her car. There was no blood, and then he said there was a hunting knife or a compass knife. And then he said they don't like me talking to lawyers around here. And then Andrew asked Jeremy what happened when he got to the lake and then he said I lost it. I killed her. And then he said he would testify to it, and that he was willing to take a polygraph test. And then he said I'm sorry, man, And that's the end of my notes. You know, my impression of Jeremy was that he wanted to like come clean about it, and he was remorseful, as I recall, you know, he was upset that someone else was in jail or a murder that he committed.
00:11:04
Speaker 1: Jeremy Scott had just given a detailed confession to the murder of Michelle Schofield. A confession like this should certainly qualify as new evidence which could lead to a new trial for Leo, if not an outright dismissal of the charges against him. And there was one other thing Sean had in his notes. Did Jeremy say anything about a prosecutor?
00:11:29
Speaker 7: He did?
00:11:29
Speaker 8: There was.
00:11:32
Speaker 6: There was something. Yeah here it is It says prosecutor lied, But I didn't know what it meant. It didn't mean anything to me because I don't do any criminal law, but something about the prosecutor.
00:11:49
Speaker 2: Lied to him.
00:11:50
Speaker 1: We have a theory about what this means. We know that in two thousand and five, Jeremy had been brought to Assistant State Attorney John Aguero's office. Jeremy and Aguero had spoken at length without anyone else present, and the meeting wasn't recorded. Before the evidentiary hearing in twenty ten, Aguero testified in a deposition that he wasn't alone in his office with Jeremy Scott. He said that the cold case detective who was investigating Jeremy had been there with him, But this detective had written in a report that he was on vacation that week, and his report clearly states that Aguero admitted to him that he brought Jeremy into his office while the detective was away. So Assistant State Attorney John Aguero lied under oath about this meeting with Jeremy Scott. But we don't think that's the lie Jeremy's talking about. We've always been curious about what exactly went on behind closed doors. Maybe Aguero told Jeremy to talk about stealing the stereo a certain way, maybe he helped Jeremy with his testimony for Leo's evident Jarry hearing, or maybe he promised Jeremy something in return and never followed through and that's the lie Jeremy is talking about. Because Aguero didn't record the meeting or have anyone else present, Jeremy is the only other person who can say what happened behind that closed door. After Jeremy Scott confesses over the phone to the murder of Michelle Schofield, Leo's lawyer, Andrew Crawford immediately prepares an affidavit, a written legal document that details what Jeremy had said on the phone call. All Jeremy has to do.
00:13:47
Speaker 2: Is sign it.
00:13:49
Speaker 5: Jeremy sent an Affidavid back, which I was extremely puzzled by and said no. He wrote the word no on it.
00:13:57
Speaker 1: We have copies of this affidavit. On the line Jeremy was supposed to have signed his name are two big letters no. Without assigned affidavit. Andrew knows he has to try something else. He wants to send a private investigator to talk to Jeremy Scott to get the confession on tape.
00:14:19
Speaker 9: Everything's in my life is a home runner or a failure, or you're getting there, you know, so it's not never easy. Pasy.
00:14:29
Speaker 1: This is Pat McKenna. He's been a private investigator for thirty seven years and He's been involved in some of the biggest criminal cases in Florida. If you recognize his name, it might be because of his work with clients like oj Simpson and Casey Anthony. After reading up on Leo's case, McKenna agrees to visit Jeremy. He drives to the prison, where two corrections officers escort him into a meeting room.
00:14:56
Speaker 9: So two guys come get me, and they brought me into a room and they stay. I said, well, I really want to see this guy by myself. He said, oh no, you can't see this guy yourself. I said, why not? He said, this is a bad dude. He's in administration, confinement or the shoe or something. I forget what his status
was at that time. I said, I've seen I've been in prisons all over this country and around the world. I've been in prisons. I've met with some of the most dastardly criminals you can imagine. I really would like to be alone with the guy. I said, can't happen. We will stand at the door, but the door stays open while you're doing this. I'm still frustrated because I'm thinking this is not any good. I want to talk to this guy, and you never trust guards not to over here and then miss misstate what they just heard. But anyway, so I hear just clanging of chains and I'm sitting facing the doorway and here comes Jeremy and they had him chained like Houdini couldn't have got out of this stuff. I mean, his wrists were chained to his belt chain, came from the belt chain down to the ankles. They were chained together. So he basically just shoveled and jingled. And what was interesting was I looked at him, and he's got a mask over his face, like a white gauze thing. But it was kind of like I was thinking Hannibal lecture. This guy's got a mask on, but it wasn't like in the movie, but it was a full face mask. And I said, what's this all about? He said, well, he's a spitter. He'll spit all over everybody and fight and Karshi and all that. And he comes in. He goes, who the fuck is this guy? I go, Jeremy, it's Pat McKenna. I'm a private investigator. I have a letter from it. And he stops, take me out of here. I ain't talking to this Guy.
00:16:42
Speaker 1: Corrections officers lead Jeremy out of the room. Pat McKenna doesn't get the recorded confession he'd hoped for, but still Leo's lawyer, Andrew Crawford has the notes from the phone call with Jeremy and the sworn witness statement from his colleague Seank Justice, so Andrew files a motion with the court. He's hoping that even without a taped confession, this will be enough to trigger a new hearing. Andrew also notifies the State Attorney's office that Jeremy has confessed. They send two investigators to interview Jeremy at Columbia Correctional Institution, but they found out afterwards that their tape recorder had failed, so they try again. The state wants to get their own version of Jeremy's story.
00:17:32
Speaker 10: So it's Monday, March thirteenth, twenty seventeen. It's one thirty one pm at the State Attorney's Office and the deposition room before Jeremy, I want to talk to you again, just basically about the same thing that we talked about before.
00:17:52
Speaker 1: The interview does not start well. Jeremy's upset.
00:17:57
Speaker 2: You want me confess to everything over here?
00:18:00
Speaker 11: Man, ain't what's gonna happen like that, you know, and then nobody trying to.
00:18:04
Speaker 2: Help me get out.
00:18:04
Speaker 11: Ain't nobody trying to help me get no deal, Ain't no glad trying.
00:18:07
Speaker 7: To do nothing.
00:18:08
Speaker 2: Nobody trying to send me no money. Ain't nobody trying to do nothing? So why would I help somebody else? They ain't trying to help me.
00:18:14
Speaker 9: You're gonna make confess some pay me if you don't want to, maybe confess some leave me alone.
00:18:18
Speaker 4: That's the way.
00:18:19
Speaker 2: That's why I work.
00:18:20
Speaker 10: What do you mean pay you? I don't know that.
00:18:21
Speaker 1: What I mean is I told you the investigators try to get Jeremy to talk about what he told Andrew Crawford on the phone.
00:18:29
Speaker 8: Did you tell him anything that would make him believe that you were giving a confession?
00:18:33
Speaker 11: Nah, made no confessions unless I got another invest you got something put in my hand.
00:18:41
Speaker 2: I ain't that crazy. I know that much.
00:18:45
Speaker 1: Jeremy has been in prison for almost as long as Leo, now twenty seven years. His grandma, the only person he had contact with outside the prison, died in twenty twelve.
00:18:58
Speaker 2: And my grandma passed away. I am I don't has to do with this though, And you know sense going back to Pope.
00:19:02
Speaker 11: County and back then, if she was alive, I would love be here, got to get by visits, and now she did.
00:19:13
Speaker 2: I don't want to see nobody.
00:19:18
Speaker 1: At the time of this recording in twenty seventeen, Jeremy has no family contact, no visitations, no lawyers. He gets no letters and no phone calls from people on the outside, and he has no money in his canteen, which means he only eats what they're serving in the cafeteria. He can't buy anything like deodorant and can only use the state issued soap and toothpaste. On top of that, he's constantly getting in trouble in prison and placed under increased security similar to solitary confinement. It's a desolate place to be in physically and psychologically. And now Jeremy knows that he has information someone wants, it only makes sense that he would try to use it to his advantage. Maybe he can tell his story and get something out of it. Whatever the reason, Jeremy doesn't want to tell the investigators the same story he told Andrew. Instead, he returns to his previous story about how his fingerprints ended up in Michelle Schofield's Mazda. He says he used to steal from cars abandoned on I four.
00:20:30
Speaker 12: Well, now what you're.
00:20:30
Speaker 11: Talking about is we're now stealing a stereo system at the cars.
00:20:37
Speaker 2: That's what you're talking about.
00:20:39
Speaker 8: When you're taking stereo systems out of cars.
00:20:41
Speaker 2: Let's talk about that for a little bit.
00:20:44
Speaker 8: What what was what were you doing? You brought it up here?
00:20:48
Speaker 2: How many?
00:20:48
Speaker 8: How many cars would you take it?
00:20:51
Speaker 1: The investigators are pressing Jeremy for details. Who was he with, what car was he driving? What did he do with the stereo equipment he stole? Jeremy can't stick to one story. He's not sure who was with him. Might have been this guy Rambo, but probably it was his buddy Robert. But then Jeremy starts telling the story like he was
by himself, almost like he forgot he said Robert was in the car with him. He tells them he was in his friend Cheryl's car, but in an earlier statement he said he was in his girlfriend Jamie's car. But there's one thing Jeremy does admit to telling Andrew Crawford on the phone.
00:21:37
Speaker 8: So you during that phone call, you've never made any statements to facts of that case. That would lead him to believe that you were confessing to the murder of Michelle Schofield.
00:21:49
Speaker 2: And that's when I remember saying that.
00:21:54
Speaker 1: Jeremy says, I don't believe he did it, as in, I don't believe Yo Schofield did it, which of course doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Why would Jeremy think that unless he knew something about the murder or he knew someone who did. Then, toward the end of their interview, just when they're wrapping up, Jeremy tells them this.
00:22:20
Speaker 11: But as far as Michelle, as far as this cab driver and Simmy and.
00:22:27
Speaker 5: Whoever real estate trying to talk about, I don't.
00:22:30
Speaker 2: Know anything about it.
00:22:32
Speaker 1: Right out of the blue, totally unprompted, Jeremy brings up this cab driver. The investigators don't even know what to say.
00:22:41
Speaker 2: I don't know anything about a cat. There's a cab driver. Ah, some cab driver got shot and Simmy that's not related to the Schofield king. That's what I heard about it in prison.
00:22:58
Speaker 12: I heard my name.
00:23:00
Speaker 2: I don't know anything about a cab driver. Let's keep it to this.
00:23:02
Speaker 9: I don't know not.
00:23:07
Speaker 1: It sounds like Jeremy sort of laughs, says something like that's fine, trust me. I spent a lot of time obsessing over why Jeremy would bring this up. This has to be the same cab driver murder that Jeremy casually confessed to three decades ago, the same murder he told his girlfriend Jamie that he'd gotten away with, the same murder we think dan Odie was almost put to death for. And in twenty seventeen, this cab driver is still on Jeremy's mind. Is he trying to see if these investigators know about it, or if the state is going to charge him, or is it weighing on his mind like Michelle's murder seemed to be regardless, the investigators completely blow off this mention of a cab driver. They just laugh it off. They didn't even bother to ask any follow up questions. If they could have gotten Jeremy talking about the cabby murder, maybe he would have come back around to talk about Michelle. Or they just might have left the deposition room with a confession to a thirty year old unsolved murder. The investigators leave without any meaningful information about Jeremy's connection to Michelle Schofield and with no leads about Jeremy's possible connection to the murder of a cab driver. But what they do get from Jeremy was valuable. Jeremy had told the investigators he would confess to a murder if he was paid or if there was something in it for him. These kinds of statements cast doubt onto Jeremy's motives for confessing to Michelle Schofield's murder. Now the state can ignore the content of Jeremy's confession and attack his credibility instead. So the investigators did have something to bring back to the state attorney, and this time they managed to turn on the tape recorder.
00:25:15
Speaker 8: Hi.
00:25:15
Speaker 13: I'm Jason Flamm, CEO and founder of Lava for Good podcasts, Home to Bone Valley, Wrongful Conviction, The War on Drugs, and many other great podcasts. Today we're asking you, our listeners, to take part in a survey. Your feedback is going to help inform how we make podcasts in the future. Your complete and candid answers will help us continue to bring you more insightful and inspiring stories about important topics that impact us all. So please go to Lava for Good dot com, slash survey and participate today. Thank you for your support.
00:25:50
Speaker 14: Bone Valley is sponsored by Stand Together. Stand Together is a philanthropic community that partners with America's boldest change makers to tackle the root causes of our country's biggest problems, including the failed war on drugs that has criminalized addiction, fueled over incarceration, and shattered communities. By thirty five, Kelly Lingard was an executive with a fortune twenty it company. If you had asked her thoughts on addiction, she would have said that addiction was about making bad choices and irresponsibility. But after hearing the story of a woman in recovery, Kelly's perspective shifted. She began to understand that addiction was a problem of pain, not irresponsibility, as she discovered how difficult it is for people to maintain their sobriety in the long run. After watching too many women get sober only to relapse and die within days or weeks of completing a recovery program, Kelly knew she could use her business skills to make a difference. She left her career and started Unshattered with the mission of ending the addiction relapse cycle. Unshattered employees, women in recovery, training them to make premium handbags from upcycled materials, and providing them with a compassionate community that helps them continue their journey beyond sobriey to move toward healing and growth. It demonstrates a smarter way of treating addiction that moves away from criminalization and keeps people out of the system. Kelly Lingard is one of the many entrepreneurs partnering with Stand Together to drive solutions in education, health care, poverty, and criminal justice. To learn more about addiction and the War on Drugs, listen to the War on Drugs podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:27:41
Speaker 1: Andrew Crawford, Leo's lawyer, is hoping that a judge will grant Leo a new trial based on the evidence of Jeremy's phone call confession. An Evidentiarry hearing is granted and set for October twenty seventeen. It's just a couple weeks out when out of the lou Andrew receives another letter from Jeremy Scott. His
spelling and punctuation make it a little tough to read, but this is what it says. Here's Andrew reading it.
00:28:12
Speaker 5: Dear mister Crawford, I would like to make a statement. I Jeremy lyn Scott write this of my own free will. Mister Schofield did not kill Missus Schofield. He didn't have anything to do with it. I jeremylyn Scott, killed Missus Schofield that night. I can tell you everything, what kind of knife it was, and how the cops picked me up.
00:28:33
Speaker 9: But let me go.
00:28:35
Speaker 5: I can tell you stuff where they found Missus Schofield. Only the person that killed her would know. It's time to end all this. I won't talk to the state. They have made promises to me, but at the end it was all lies. You can hook me to that lie. That'll tell if you are lying or not. Everything I will tell will be the truth. Mister Crawford, this is my statement and my own hand writing spelling. Ain't two good. Hope to hear from you soon, Jeremy Elscott.
00:29:10
Speaker 1: This letter, with Jeremy's signature at the bottom signals something has changed. Andrew thinks this may be a sign that Jeremy is willing to talk. He asked Pat McKenna to go see Jeremy one more time. But what Andrew doesn't know is that Jeremy mailed out two more letters, one to the State Attorney's office and one to the judge that had been assigned to Leo's upcoming hearing. The two letters are slightly different, but they have the same general message. Jeremy says he is confessing to all murders in Polk County in the years nineteen eighty seven and nineteen eighty eight, and he's asking to be left alone and put back on death row. Andrew had no way of knowing this yet, and neither did Pat McKenna, who was waiting to talk to Jeremy in an attorney room at the prison.
00:30:03
Speaker 9: Just like last time, I hope they're not bringing this guy in, you know, just crazed or something. So in he walks. He's standing there. I'm sitting in a chair and I remember just saying, man, you look a lot better than you did the last time I saw you. And he still won't sit down yet, but he sees on the table in front of me, I had laid out a letter from Andrew, the letter that Jeremy wrote, and I had a tape recorder on the table too, and we got to talk and I said, I just I want to see if you'll talk to me about that case. He's I don't need to. I told I just told the judge yesterday and the prosecutors and everybody. I confess to everything.
00:30:49
Speaker 2: I go.
00:30:49
Speaker 9: You confess to everything? He said, yeah, Well I didn't know. He meant every murder that's ever happened in the county, just out of frustration, I guess. So I said, well, you know, we'll sit down, we start talking.
00:31:00
Speaker 15: Introduced Jeremy Scott. Jeremy, can you praise your right hand? You swear everything you're tell me is the truth and the whole truth, Sir.
00:31:12
Speaker 9: I was going to go through the whole all kinds of question, answered said Jeremy.
00:31:15
Speaker 12: I just wanted you to go ahead and just explain what happened that night with Michelle.
00:31:23
Speaker 9: This word's overused, but it became surreal for me. His whole body started to change, right, he was twitching a little bit, and he just hes quit looking at me, and he looked right at my dictaphone, my tape recorder sitting right there, and he was leaning over it, and I just it was like he was unburdening himself or something. He was like talking just like a foot away from my dictaphone there and I just kind of watched them.
00:31:47
Speaker 12: Early early year, nineteen eighty seven, I got released from prison not too long for I ran into Michelle. Apparently we had met Corynge or herb at a party. It was round Ralph February around midnight, maybe one o'clock in the morning or something, at a Texico station. I've been out drinking, popping peels all night, partying him.
00:32:25
Speaker 2: She asked me, was I laid on the.
00:32:26
Speaker 12: Phone and I said, no, I need a ride. I'm a little weary drunk.
00:32:33
Speaker 15: But she said I know you.
00:32:37
Speaker 12: I said, oh no, and but she asked me what I law. I said, I'm going Northcombing Road. There's trailers I'm known to sleep and trailers.
00:32:48
Speaker 2: You know, bandit houses and stuff.
00:32:51
Speaker 1: So Jeremy says that Michelle agrees to drive him to a trailer park on North Cumby Road, just up the street.
00:32:58
Speaker 12: Really, she hit me a rise going down and rain and I got my jacket on, you know, So we're going down North Calling Road.
00:33:07
Speaker 1: We go, they passed the trailer park where Jeremy used to live with his grandparents. Now Jeremy has another idea.
00:33:15
Speaker 2: You know, maybe I can get it late or somehow, you know.
00:33:20
Speaker 12: So I tell her to turn. All in the road is behind the little trees, is the lake, you know, and people go there all the time. Well we get there.
00:33:34
Speaker 9: Yeah, so I know nobody lives here.
00:33:37
Speaker 12: I said, no, It says where the people come and make out.
00:33:43
Speaker 1: Jeremy thinks maybe they'll have sex, but Michelle rejects his advances. She tells him she's married.
00:33:51
Speaker 2: You know, I'm married.
00:33:53
Speaker 5: Like, let's say great, you know.
00:33:57
Speaker 12: And I went in and reached in and grabbing my cigarettes and put out a joint.
00:34:02
Speaker 1: He says. He reaches into his jacket to pull out a pack of cigarettes and then a knife falls out of his pocket.
00:34:10
Speaker 12: Seven inch knife, maybe hundred knives. Uh, it's what you call where at the end of the hand where it has a thing where he knows you if you go east, west, north or you know something, help us. Yeah, goottle, honey, and I you know, not no big butcher knife, none of that stuff.
00:34:33
Speaker 13: Little, you know.
00:34:35
Speaker 1: So Michelle sees the knife.
00:34:39
Speaker 12: She she went to panty and started screaming hidden, you know, and I'm you know, the next thing I know, I
lost him, you know, And next time I know it you.
00:34:54
Speaker 2: Know, I done done stabber. You know, I don't know how many time or not, you know, And I'm.
00:35:01
Speaker 12: Like panicking now because I don't know what just happened.
00:35:07
Speaker 1: After he stabs her, Jeremy says, he pauses, sits in the car and has a smoke, you know, sit there for a.
00:35:16
Speaker 2: Few minutes in the car, and.
00:35:19
Speaker 12: Then it was raining outside and I started smoking, got out the car, went to the to the driver's side, open the doorman, you know, old by the lady, have some plastic, try to protect her for bean by the gators, snakes or whatever, you know, and I slay her down in the water.
00:35:48
Speaker 1: After he drags her body into the water, he says, he gets back in the car.
00:35:53
Speaker 9: After DA got in the car, went I die four.
00:35:58
Speaker 12: I guess I stole the car out, pull over to his side.
00:36:02
Speaker 16: He got the knife and got a towel of like.
00:36:06
Speaker 2: Paused to towel that was.
00:36:07
Speaker 13: In her car.
00:36:09
Speaker 12: Drive and drive it, you know, thank you for sault the car star willis.
00:36:15
Speaker 1: Then Jeremy leaves the stalled out car and walks up the exit to a little store.
00:36:21
Speaker 12: Car was there's a there's a dumpster and a little store store closed.
00:36:28
Speaker 2: I went out there up the hill.
00:36:31
Speaker 12: I know that after the knife and the towel in there in the trash, make sure it was, you know, in deep in there.
00:36:41
Speaker 1: As Kelsey and I listened to this, to this description of Jeremy walking up a hill to this little store, we can't help but notice the similarities between this and what we'd heard from Leo about the night he found the Mazda. Jeremy's description is so similar to the way Leo describes walking up a hill to the closed gas station to call police. There was only one store off that exit back in nineteen eighty seven, which means that if we believe both of these men's stories, Leo was tracing Jeremy's footsteps when he was searching for Michelle just forty eight hours after her murder, and Leo might have been standing just feet away from the murder weapon that Jeremy had dropped in the dumpster.
00:37:23
Speaker 9: There.
00:37:25
Speaker 1: Jeremy goes on, He says, he starts walking back towards Lakeland when he sees the Mazda again on the side of the road.
00:37:34
Speaker 12: That's when I realized, you know, I get a stereo system, and I took the figures out, and I and my fingerprints off the.
00:37:46
Speaker 2: Doors and stuff.
00:37:47
Speaker 12: Again, that's how my pump rint got on the windshield inside with the car. All I know is I went to the nearest jailer oncoming road and I.
00:37:58
Speaker 2: Was passed out the extor.
00:38:08
Speaker 1: Most of what Jeremy says matches what we know where Michelle's body was found and where the car was abandoned, the condition of the car having stalled out, the murder weapon which was never recovered, the equalizer and the speakers that had been stolen, and the car must have been wiped down because Michelle's prints were never found by crime scene technicians. Michelle was found fully closed, and the medical examiner found no signs of sexual assault, and the medical examiner also documented scrapes on Michelle's back that were consistent with her body being dragged after she'd been killed. But Jeremy says a couple things that differ from what we know. Michelle's last known location was Sparky's, which is an Exxon station, not a Texico, so he has the name of the gas station wrong. And if they met right after she made the call to Leo, it would have been closer to ten o'clock, not midnight, as Jeremy says. But Jeremy also says he was drunk and high, so it's not a huge leap to assume he might not remember everything in perfect detail, but the general circumstances seem to line up. It was already dark out and it was raining that night, and he says she was at a gas station payphone when he approached her, the last place Michelle was seen alive when she called Leo and said she was on her way. Jeremy's detail about covering Michelle's body with plastic also differs from what we know. There are no plastic sheets or tarps listed in the evidence logs, and Jeremy doesn't mention the plywood that was covering her body. But Jeremy's motivation for covering the body, what she says, was to protect it from the alligators and snakes.
00:40:04
Speaker 2: That might be in the water.
00:40:06
Speaker 1: This detail hints at one more thing we can corroborate, a sense of shame and remorse.
00:40:14
Speaker 12: You know, I didn't mean to kill Michelle school, y'all.
00:40:21
Speaker 2: I never tend to do any harm. I panted the night when she started hitting on me and I fell out of my jacket. It was meant for nobody. You know, I lived alone on the streets.
00:40:35
Speaker 12: I've been holding this confession for a long time. I don't know what Leo is guilty of.
00:40:49
Speaker 2: Whatever the state said he did in the other cases, I don't know. I knew. No, he didn't murge White.
00:40:58
Speaker 12: You might have did other things to work about.
00:41:00
Speaker 2: He didn't kill her.
00:41:04
Speaker 12: I'm going to take a line of tablement protect.
00:41:06
Speaker 6: Here all of this, and this is my statement, and.
00:41:12
Speaker 2: I will say it again on.
00:41:14
Speaker 12: A lit of port ram.
00:41:19
Speaker 2: Okay, thank you, I appreciate it.
00:41:22
Speaker 9: And that's uh. Out of this tape.
00:41:30
Speaker 2: You know.
00:41:30
Speaker 9: I come out of the jail and I'm as i'm walking out, I'm still thinking in my mind, holy shit, I can't believe this just happened. I can't wait to get out and call Andrew. I remember going out to my car and calling him up and said, uh, he just gave me a sworn, taped confession of the murder.
00:42:00
Speaker 7: That was like the best day ever. This is this one? This time is really it?
00:42:07
Speaker 9: Oh? This is it.
00:42:09
Speaker 1: When Chrissy, Leo's wife, first got the news that Jeremy Scott had confessed, she was flooded with emotion, as was Chrissy, and Leo's daughter, Ashley. Yes, you heard that correctly. Chrissy and Leo have a daughter. We should probably back up for one second to tell you the story. After leaving her visit with Leo one weekend back in the spring of two thousand, Chrissy got in her car and soon saw a woman she recognized walking on the side of the road.
00:42:44
Speaker 2: It was the.
00:42:44
Speaker 1: Girlfriend of another inmate. The weather was bad that day and this woman was pregnant, so Chrissy, being Chrissy, pulled over and offered her a ride. On the drive, Chrissy learned this young woman was struggling. Two of her children were already in foster care, and the young woman wasn't ready to care for another. So that's when the Schofields stepped in. Chrissy first met Ashley the day after she was born, and Leo held her in his arms during visitation just a few days later. At first, the adoption was informal. It took a few years for it to be finalized, but Ashley was Leo and Chrissie's from the start. Ashley is now in her early twenties. She says that as a child she was raised on this little patch of grass beside the visitation pavilion at Hardy Correctional and that's where Ashley and Leo are sitting on that same patch of grass the day Chrissy delivers.
00:43:47
Speaker 7: The news, and I said, Jeremy confessed, and we just all three of us just hugged and hugged and cried and cried and hugged.
00:44:02
Speaker 2: I couldn't do nothing but grab both of them and hug him.
00:44:05
Speaker 17: I mean, the guy confessed. I mean, we have physical evedents, we have a confession with the detail.
00:44:14
Speaker 2: I felt justice would finally the system would finally work.
00:44:19
Speaker 3: I always believed that right would right itself somewhere. It can't be so bad and so corrupt that they keep letting this go on and on and on. So I told I told Ashley, I said, Dad, he's coming home.
00:44:42
Speaker 7: This is it.
00:44:44
Speaker 2: It's over.
00:44:46
Speaker 1: The family starts getting ready for another day in court.
00:44:50
Speaker 17: Yep, here we go again to prepare for the new hearing. Sounds easy, like you just schedule hearing and you go, But no, it takes months and months and months and months and months and months.
00:45:05
Speaker 1: Things are going to be a bit different at this hearing. For one. John Aguero, the Assistant State attorney, he won't be there. John Aguero died suddenly in July of twenty seventeen while visiting his daughter abroad in Morocco. So the prosecutor with the old sparky tie clasp, the one who was there the day they arrested Leo, the one who tried to pursue the death penalty in Leo's trial even though he told Leo that he thought his father killed Michelle, The one who had the forensic evidence in Leo's case destroyed. This prosecutor who played such a huge
role in Leo's life the past twenty something years, he's gone, and in an odd turn of events, Leo finds himself mourning his prosecutor's death.
00:45:56
Speaker 3: I actually like Don Gurro, I felt, and listen, I don't I mean, I shouldn't say like, I may be wrong about this.
00:46:04
Speaker 5: I y.
00:46:05
Speaker 3: I believed early on that he believed in what he was doing, because the alternative is to think that he's doing it because.
00:46:15
Speaker 2: I don't count, he doesn't care about justice. That's not a good proposition for me.
00:46:21
Speaker 3: So I'm My fight was to prove my insence and then hopefully one day show him.
00:46:29
Speaker 2: And in this fantasy I have.
00:46:31
Speaker 3: Him admitting he was wrong, and then we can go about and being friends or at least associates. And so when he died, a part of me died with him, just because that opportunity is gone.
00:46:51
Speaker 2: And in my faith, he knows the truth now, you know, And and.
00:46:57
Speaker 3: I hope that him knowing that truth now is not a reason why he's not comfortable today.
00:47:07
Speaker 1: In John Aguero's last years as assistant state Attorney, he ran into some legal troubles of his own. In twenty eleven, he was arrested for domestic battery during an argument with his estranged wife. After a short retirement, the state attorney brought him back not to try cases, but to mentor up and coming prosecutors. One of those he mentored is Victoria Avalon. She's now representing the state at Leo's evidentiary hearing. Basically, she's the new John Aguero.
00:47:42
Speaker 2: State versus. Leo Schofield eighty eight cf. Two three four six A one.
00:47:48
Speaker 1: It's October twelfth, twenty seventeen. Just over a week ago, Jeremy Scott gave a tape confession to the murder of Michelle Schofield. Leo and his attorneys gather in a Polk County courtroom to present the new evidence. A phone confession, the one he gave to Andrew and Sean, a written confession, the letter he sent to Andrew Crawford before the phone call, and now a taped confession.
00:48:14
Speaker 2: Mister Schofield is entering the courtroom.
00:48:16
Speaker 17: Could we have appearances for the record please?
00:48:19
Speaker 1: Sitting next to Leo is Andrew Crawford.
00:48:22
Speaker 2: Andrew Crawford the attorney for mister Schofield.
00:48:25
Speaker 1: And another attorney by the name of Seth Miller.
00:48:28
Speaker 2: Mister Scofield.
00:48:29
Speaker 1: Seth Miller works for the Innocence Project of Florida and they're now representing Leo. Having the Innocence Project on your side can lend a lot of credibility in legal proceedings like this one. On the other side of the courtroom is Victoria Avalon, John Aguero's mentee, and seated beside her is Jerry Hill. Jerry Hill was Aguero's boss and now he's Victoria Avalon's boss. Victoria Avalon and Jerry Hill are the last defenders of a Guero's legacy, though of course, as representatives of the state, their official job is to pursue justice for Michelle Schofield. Each side is given the opportunity to give an opening statement before the judge. Andrew Crawford goes first.
00:49:17
Speaker 5: Based on the fingerprints which forensically link mister Scott to the homicide, as well as the subsequent admissions and confessions, and respectfully asked the court to grant mister Scofield.
00:49:28
Speaker 2: A new tribe.
00:49:30
Speaker 1: Andrew's opening is quick and to the point, he argues for less than three minutes, he's going to let the evidence speak for itself. But then Victoria Avalon stands and her opening statement goes on for nearly an hour.
00:49:46
Speaker 16: Judge, this case doesn't really present you anything new factually, other than the newly discovered evidence that they're putting on. Most all the facts that you are going to hear over the next couple of days has been debated endlessly for years.
00:50:02
Speaker 1: At its heart, Avalon's main point seems to be that Jeremy Scott is not a reliable witness and therefore his confessions have no credibility.
00:50:12
Speaker 16: Mister Scott isn't trustworthy, and I'll tell you why. Since the first time he's reached out to the defense in twenty sixteen, he's flip flopped three times.
00:50:20
Speaker 2: Who knows what he'll say today.
00:50:23
Speaker 1: There's no doubt that Jeremy can be a difficult witness. It's true that Jeremy confessed to Leo's lawyers and then denied it when the state investigators came to see him, and Avalon is saying that because of that, nothing Jeremy says can be believed.
00:50:39
Speaker 16: The one thing that all of us in this room, I think can agree on and will agree on, is that Jeremy Scott is not a reliable witness.
00:50:48
Speaker 1: And then she also goes after Leo's credibility.
00:50:53
Speaker 16: Yes, this was a circumstantial case, but that does not mean that we got the wrong man. We got the right man, a man who now will do anything to get out of the justice. The ten good men and women and true meet it out to him in nineteen eighty nine.
00:51:08
Speaker 1: She says that Leo, a man who has offered the chance to walk out of jail thirty years ago in exchange for testimony against his father, a man who turned down Aguero's second degree murder plea deal that would have freedom from prison decades ago. She says, this man, Leo Schofield, would do anything to get out of prison, and then she turns her attention to Andrew Crawford and Seth Miller Leo's defense. She asks the judge to consider their motivations.
00:51:39
Speaker 16: Evidence, who's looking for truth here and who's just trying to win? You will know it when you see it.
00:51:48
Speaker 1: After Victoria Avalon takes fifty minutes to go after just about everyone in the courtroom with her opening statement, it's time to call the first witness.
00:51:56
Speaker 2: Mister Miller, will you be calling the first witness? Yes, said Jeremy Scott leaves Scott.
00:52:02
Speaker 1: Jeremy's escorted to the stand. He's handcuffed
and wearing an orange jumpsuit, and most of the photos from the hearing his head hangs down. He looks exhausted and frail.
00:52:15
Speaker 2: Hello, mister Scott, I want to take you back to February twenty fourth, nineteen eighty seven, the day Michelle Schofield was murdered. Do you recall having an interaction with Michelle Scoffeld that night? I'm going a statement on record I say I say. Everything I say is on rig of court. I'm telling you, Joey, what I say in court is where's true. You'll answer the questions, Sir I got say the singer, you answer the questions, the singer will be done, sir, and I keep pulling me out of prison for this bullshit. Can I have him declared as the hostile witness? You're on there? Yes, okay, thank you.
00:52:53
Speaker 1: Declaring Jeremy a hostile witness means Leo's attorneys can ask him leading questions. It's the friends between asking where was Michelle Schofield when you approached her? And isn't it true that you approached Michelle Schofield at the gas station? Mostly they're yes or no questions, so it isn't ideal for eliciting spontaneous answers, and it's something the defense was hoping they wouldn't have to do. After he's declared a hostile witness, Jeremy is still irritated, but he maintains the story he'd given Andrew Crawford on the phone, and the story that had been recorded by Pat McKenna a week before this hearing.
00:53:33
Speaker 2: It's true that you stated in that interview that you approached Michelle Scofield at the gas station. That's what I said on or recorder. That's what I said, and that Michelle Scofield was using a payphone at the time that you approached her, yes, sir, And that you were high on drugs that night. I was drunk, went on drug out drunk here right off drunk, And that you were drinking thunderbird wine, hey, sir. And that wine usually makes you violent, doesn't it, Yes, sir, it does.
00:54:17
Speaker 1: His answers are brief, yes sir, no, sir, but ultimately he sticks to the story. He confirms that he had asked Michelle Schofield for a ride, but that he directed her to a makeout lake instead of the trailer park he'd originally asked her to take him to. He confirms that once they got back there, he pulled out a cigarette or maybe it was a joint, but that's when his knife fell out. He confirms it was a small hunting knife with a compass on the end, and that he'd taken it from his uncle's closet. And he confirms that when Michelle saw the knife, she panicked and started hitting him. He's cooperating, but barely.
00:55:00
Speaker 2: Did you do with the knife?
00:55:02
Speaker 11: Listen, man, don't go into allis I can't. It's all right, bad enough, it's all right, bad enough, all right. I spent thirty buck years. All right, that's there you go. I'm confessing to the murder man.
00:55:14
Speaker 2: I didn't do it. I'll take a polygraph test on that. I just had some more questions. I don't have no more answers. Johnnor you will direct him answer the question.
00:55:25
Speaker 12:
No matter what said.
00:55:26
Speaker 2: I haven't heard that. I don't care what you say. I haven't heard the question yet. Asked the question, and I said everything I had to say. Did you stab her with the knife? I told you I killed her.
00:55:45
Speaker 1: Jeremy confesses to killing Michelle. Then Seth begins to ask him about his interactions with Prosecutor John Aguero. Jeremy acknowledges the strange meeting, the meeting that happened behind hind closed doors without any witnesses or recordings made. Jeremy says that during that meeting, John Aguero had promised him help with parole in exchange for his testimony about the stereo theft. Aguero allegedly told him he had influence with the parole board and could make things happen if Jeremy quote stuck to the story he'd been giving.
00:56:25
Speaker 2: Did mister Guero help you come up with the testimony that you would give at the twenty ten evidentiary hearing in this case.
00:56:35
Speaker 11: Not really, he just stay to to, in fact, what I've been saying, because I've been telling the truth about my palm print.
00:56:44
Speaker 2: There's nothing different about that.
00:56:46
Speaker 11: In the stereo I did steal the stereo thing I deny it was Kofi, which was alive back then.
00:56:54
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Jeremy says, Aguero told you to stick to his story about taking the stereo equipment. That was the truth. All Jeremy had to do was leave out the part about killing Michelle. Seth hands the witness over for cross examination. Now it's the state's turn to ask questions. Victoria Avalon approaches Jeremy Scott.
00:57:22
Speaker 16: Mister Scott is man. My name is Victoria Avalon. I'm the prosecutor in case.
00:57:28
Speaker 1: I've tried a couple times to reach out to Victoria Avalon. We've exchanged a few emails, but she's made it clear that she prefers her cases to be argued in a court of law, not the court of public opinion, as she's called it. I never really expected her to sit down with us, but of course I had to try. In her last email, she told me it wouldn't bother me at all if you entirely ignored me in your reporting. And now, after listening to Avalon's questioning of Jeremy Scott, I know why she might want her work on this case ignored.
00:58:03
Speaker 9: Last week, you.
00:58:04
Speaker 16: Talked to the defense investigator, mister McKenna, didn't.
00:58:06
Speaker 2: You, Yes, ma'am.
00:58:08
Speaker 1: Avalon asked Jeremy about his medications and what he was on, if anything, at the time he spoke to Pat McKenna. Being transferred between institutions, and especially back to a county jail, can be incredibly disruptive. Any sort of medical or psychological treatment might not be continued from one facility to the next. At the time Jeremy gave his confession to Pat McKenna, he was off his meds and had been placed in a suicide cell. He's still off his meds. When Victoria Avalon asked Jeremy about his movements between institutions, and Jeremy's getting agitated. His transfers have been so frequent it's hard to keep them straight. And now he's back in the Polk County jail, where the conditions are terrible.
00:58:55
Speaker 2: Y'all call me up this again.
00:58:58
Speaker 16: I'm not calling, well, well, I'm here, and.
00:59:03
Speaker 11: I'm gonna beginning to kind of ja in incite seal in a cold floor, even with my fingers.
00:59:11
Speaker 2: Waiting to go back to my camp. Let's get back to my question, mister Scott. You gave two statements to.
00:59:19
Speaker 1: My investigators, Avalon grills Jeremy about all the times he'd previously denied killing Michelle Schofield. And as her cross examination goes on, she gets loud and more aggressive.
00:59:33
Speaker 16: But you're still never getting out and you know that, right you get down behind chain link.
00:59:39
Speaker 2: Right, objection has to answer to sustain.
00:59:44
Speaker 16: Your grandmother's dead rights the her eye of this, your grandmother's dead right, Yes she is when recently, when recently cover years, she's the only one on earth that cared about you, wasn't She got to answer out loud, Yeah, No one's sending you any money, correct, No, ma'am.
01:00:12
Speaker 2: This whole courtroom full of people, nobody's here for you. Ardly, No, ma'am.
01:00:20
Speaker 16: You can't even afford to buy deodorant, can you. No, ma'am, you gotta get money somehow, right, Yes, ma'am. Canteen ain't free, is it, No, ma'am?
01:00:33
Speaker 1: For you it seems that Avalon is doing whatever she can to go after Jeremy's credibility. It's as if she's saying, look, he's a pathetic person. He's unstable, and he'll do anything to get a little money or a little attention, even confessed to a murder he didn't commit. And she points out all the times that Jeremy has given inconsistent statements under oath. The judge will have to grapple with this. In order to accept that Jeremy Scott is telling the truth about Michelle Schofield's murder, he'll need to acknowledge that Jeremy has previously lied under oath numerous times. So Avalon is basically asking, how can we possibly know which version of Jeremy's story is the truth. She's saying, we can't, so Jeremy's confessions should be disregarded.
01:01:24
Speaker 16: You don't know he took the oath before he started testifying, didn't you, ma'am? He took the oath before he started testifying back in twenty.
01:01:32
Speaker 2: Ten, didn't you? Are you bashing me? That's not my question.
01:01:39
Speaker 16: My question is you took the oath today, and you took the oaths.
01:01:42
Speaker 2: Before you testify? In twenty ten.
01:01:44
Speaker 1: Right now, I just want to go back to mysel Jeremy just begged to be sent back to his cell, the same cell where he's sitting on a cold floor and eating with his fingers. He'd rather be there than here with Avalon. The judge tries to rein her in, Well.
01:02:04
Speaker 16: We ain't gotten started yet, that's Avalan, Yes, sir, that wasn't a question.
01:02:12
Speaker 1: Then Victoria Avalon starts
getting into specifics about the violent stabbing. She's asking Jeremy to demonstrate how he held the knife and whether he first stabbed Michelle in the face or in the chest. Jeremy says he was drunk and he doesn't know.
01:02:29
Speaker 2: You.
01:02:29
Speaker 16: Take a look at this, mister Scott exhal.
01:02:34
Speaker 2: Look at it. I got to see you before. See again. During the witness judge.
01:02:42
Speaker 1: Sustain, Avalon is holding up one of the photographs from Michelle's autopsy, one of the photos we saw in the evidence room. They're hard to look at, and Jeremy doesn't want to look.
01:03:00
Speaker 2: What you did to huff. I didn't hear that answer. No I did do it.
01:03:10
Speaker 1: No I didn't do that. Victoria Avalon lets Jeremy's response hang in the air and decides to wrap up her cross examination. Now, Seth Miller re examines Jeremy Scott, and he uses his time to clarify Jeremy's response to Avalon.
01:03:28
Speaker 2: You were in a haze when you killed Michelle Schofield. Is that correct? So? I mean you don't remember how many times you stabbed her? Correct? You don't remember every single time you stabbed her. Correct. You don't remember every location that you stabbed her in, Is that correct? You just know that you stabbed her, Yes, with that hunting knife with the compass on it. Correct. And you feel ashamed of doing it, don't you. Yes, that's why you want to look at the picture. That's why you gave that answer to Miss Avalance. That correct. I killed it.
01:04:12
Speaker 1: After the hearing, local reporters would fixate on Jeremy's words, not I killed her, but I didn't do that. This line, taken out of context, would come to define the hearing. One headline read quote inmate recants his murder story. Susie Shattlecatty, the Lakeland Ledger reporter who'd been covering the case for twenty eight years, also believes that Jeremy recanted.
01:04:43
Speaker 16: I mean it was it was subtle, but it was he crumbled like a cheap suit.
01:04:49
Speaker 1: Even after Jeremy confessed multiple times on the stand, a recantation was the lasting impression on reporters. But listening to the recordings of this hearing, it's clear to me that Jeremy Scott did not recant. Jeremy's words came after nearly two hours on the stand, two hours of standing handcuffed before a judge, answering questions and having his words and his life scrutinized, and that's when Jeremy is confronted by the picture from Michelle's autopsy. It was Victoria Avalon's final attempt to provoke him. This picture was taken after Michelle's body had been submerged in water for nearly three days. She was laid out on the autopsy table under the harsh lights. Her wounds had been cleaned, and the damage the knife had done was clearly visible. That's what Jeremy was seeing when he said, no, I didn't do that, But for me, it's something else. Jeremy says, his words at the end of the hearing that still haunt me.
01:06:03
Speaker 2: I killed it.
01:06:13
Speaker 1: Bone Valley is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company Number One. Our executive producers are Jason Flohm and Kevin Wordiskak. Kornhaber is our senior producer. Brit Spangler is our sound designer. Ruxandra Guidy is our editor. Fact checking by Maximo Anderson. Our producer and researcher is Kelsey Decker. Our theme song, The One Who's Holding the Stars, is performed by Lee Bob and The Truth. It was written by Leo Schofield and Kevin Herrick in Florida's Hearty Correctional Institution. Bone Valley is written and produced by me Gilbert King. You can follow the show on Instagram, Facebook, and Twitter at lava for Good to See