Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (00:01.198)
Hello everyone, welcome to a new episode of the Digital Nomads Daily Podcast. I'm so excited for today's episode because we have an amazing, inspiring entrepreneur here on the podcast. We met somewhat on LinkedIn, but then we really actually met, didn't really met, but then at Running Remote, we were looking at each other. I think you were standing in the staircase and I was there and we were like, okay, let's talk. Alexander, welcome, welcome to Digital Nomads Daily Podcast.
Alex (00:28.078)
Hello Nina, thank you very much for having me today.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (00:32.238)
So exciting. my God. Okay. So, we always start the episode with three quick questions and that's just for our audience to get to know you a little bit better already and kind of your nomadic entrepreneur remote work vibe. So my first question is how long have you been nomading or like somewhat being part of the nomad space?
Alex (00:54.734)
Yeah, it's actually been four years since I quit my last job, which was one week before the lockdown. So February 2020. And today my nomad life. So I live in Madrid, but my girlfriend lives in Lisbon. So I go to Lisbon quite a lot. I would go to London to work from there to see some friends. I actually have...
the luck of having friends in different cities across Europe, one in Marbella, some in Lyon, some in Paris. So, you know, I, because I, of course, work fully remote. I enjoy, you know, traveling and working from different places.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (01:25.198)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (01:37.678)
Yeah, love that. It's so interesting because like on the Digital Nomads Daily podcast, obviously we talk with digital nomads, but the space is growing and it's like changing so much. And these days, like you can have a home base and somewhat nomading. We had Q from on the podcast as well. He was more talking about corporate nomadism. Like there's so many different ways. So yeah, that's also why I love having.
maybe not the typical stereotype digital nomad here because I'm also not that nomad anymore. So I relate a lot to African.
Alex (02:08.398)
that's the thing. Digital nomads are not the typical tech guy from the beach in Bali. I think that's what a lot of people think, but most nomads don't move that much. I've actually remembered some stats, but there are some stats saying that nomads, most of them don't move countries. They move within the same country or with countries around, but not that many. So I think it's good to have this truth about nomads that is just not
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (02:21.934)
Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (02:38.35)
Yeah.
Alex (02:38.382)
living in Bali and walking from the beach because that is only true for a tiny part of the moment.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (02:42.03)
Yeah, exactly. And that's why I still love doing this podcast, because it's really amazing to see how I mean, it's all about, you know, like creating our own lifestyle that works for us. And that also changed over time. Anyways, we're going to talk a lot more about in the episode. So where are you talking from right now?
Alex (03:01.774)
But Jits, I mean, but Jits, yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (03:03.342)
Okay, and Madrid is your base, right?
Alex (03:05.742)
Yeah, it is my base for four years.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (03:07.95)
Wow, do you like recommend it as a nomad destination?
Alex (03:11.534)
I highly recommend it. Actually, a few weeks ago, Remote .com, the company, they released a ranking of the best place to work as a digital nomad. And Madrid was number one in the world. For me, the way I summarize Madrid is good people, good food, and good weather. And the tech scene is moving. There are a lot of like, you know,
coworking, bars, events, and I think for digital nomad that's what people are looking for. So yeah, 100 % recommend the JIT.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (03:51.214)
Right, amazing. I guess I should pay Madrid a visit one day. I hope I see you there then. All right. So my last question is, and this is something that people are really interested always in. And so as we know in the no -miss space, some people have like one income from their job, other people are nomadic entrepreneurs. There are folks that have multiple income strains. How is it for you? How do you make your monies?
Alex (04:17.102)
So my main income stream is from my startup jobgather .com. This is the company I started four years ago with my co -founder Juan. On the side, I don't have much time for that, but on the side sometimes I would do some freelance projects, mostly about sales, helping startups structuring the sales structure, coaching the sales team. Sometimes...
I did some short contract about more like recruitment slash HR, mostly like setting up. I wish I could do more of that because I really enjoy it, but I don't have much time because, you know, job gether is a full time job. And that's where, you know, most of my income.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (05:04.974)
Yeah. I love how honest you are about that because one of the big misconceptions about entrepreneurship, and I think specifically in a nomad space is that you can do so many things, so many different things at the same time. And I feel like there's this sort of like, in one hand, we're like really embracing the multi -passionate entrepreneurs, like Hannah Larsen calls it like a career portfolio, which I really love.
But then on the other hand, I think there is maybe some, yeah, some sort of like misunderstanding or misconception on how do you actually manage your time if you want to have a successful company or like agency or startup like you guys have built. So how is that for you? Like, and also in mind that a lot of people think I'm going to start my own business because that equals freedom, which...
I mean, in my experience, that is really not the case. So how has that been for you in your journey, like starting your company and then working your ass off?
Alex (06:08.718)
Yeah, no, it's a really good question because, you know, lately, especially, you know, LinkedIn, it seems that you have to start your own company to gain freedom and financial freedom. Yeah, right. The theory is nice, but in reality, it's really difficult. And, you know, at the end of the day, we're not hippies, you know, and yes, some people maybe don't care about money that...
that much, but still you have to pay your rent. If you want to travel, you have to pay your travels. You have to pay for your car, for whatever you need. And starting your own company doesn't always work. Actually, nine companies out of 10 fail on the first year. And every year, like 90 % fail every year. So if you want to become a nomad, you can also be a nomad and an employer at some time. You don't have...
to start your own business, to become free and to become a nomad. And I think that there's like a misconception that people have that, yeah, I'm just going to become a freelancer and charge 1000 euros per day and become rich and travel. And yeah, right. That's not really work that way. And so the way, so for me, my personal experience, so four years ago, I quit my job during lockdown.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (07:23.246)
Yeah, as long as it is. Yeah.
Alex (07:32.814)
I got introduced with someone called Juan, a Belgian guy who also just quit his job. And without really knowing each other, because we talked on Zoom like twice, we obviously couldn't meet because he was doing lockdown. We decided to start together, which was a big bet because normally you start a company with someone you know, you trust. We didn't have all of that. Of course, now we know each other, we met.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (08:01.486)
We hope so after four years.
Alex (08:02.41)
And we still work together. But yeah, so that's how we started. And at the time I moved from Paris to Madrid. And yes, it has been really, really challenging because for the first two years we didn't pay ourselves. So living with zero income. So luckily my job before, it was like a sales job with a good commission, I saved a bit of money. But of course for the next...
I mean, for the first two years of job getter, zero euro, you can just say goodbye to holidays, to clothes, to restaurants, to whatever you like to do, you can just say bye. After two years, we started to pay ourselves a little bit. Today, I mean, we're not rich, but we can pay the bills. And it's not for everyone. And I think if you start as a freelancer,
don't expect, you know, invoicing thousands of euros per day and become like really rich and have a great life. You know, Instagram is not a reality. LinkedIn is not a reality. What people say is always true. However, I think always push people to start something that could be starting with a side project if they want to, you know, and keep...
your permanent job, you know, then you have this, you know, where the security of an income every month, you start a side project. If you think that your start project starts to really pay off and you can make some money from it, why not quitting your job and going full time on a side project? But, you know, it's not easy, you know, I have no regrets, but I always like to say starting my company is the best decision of my life and the worst decision of my life.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (09:40.894)
Yeah. Amen to this. Yeah.
Alex (09:54.414)
You know, because yeah, I probably want to quit every day for the last four years. But at the same time, I realized how great it is. That just gave me so much learnings, freedom, connections. Like, you know, I wouldn't be in a podcast today with you if I didn't have my company. Having my company made me start, you know, publishing content on LinkedIn. It's really like a snowball effect. It's not for everyone and it's not easy, but I'm really
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (10:19.822)
Yeah, kind of.
Alex (10:23.662)
enjoyed a lot for years, you know, and it's not the end of it, of course.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (10:26.606)
Yeah, amen to this. Amen to this. Like I appreciate so much of what you just said. This like guys like listening to this, like you might even want to rewind this a little bit because it's like there's so many truths and so many golden nuggets. But the main picture that were under your sketching here is like, you know, like that there are some truths in like there's freedom and you can, you know, like financial skill and all of that, but you got to work like that's the essence.
And I think that what happening is now and like, I'm so allergic to this also, you know, like being an entrepreneur and trying to build my business. And this morning, even I was like, I want to quit. I cannot handle it anymore. And now I'm like super happy. Like it's very bipolar. So it's like, so yeah, so it's like, there's so much into it, but the core message you got to work. And, I also love what you said about having.
You know, the reality of like, you didn't pay yourself for two years. So you had to have something on like a back burner rate. And one of the things that I really, really despise is like, I hate this when people like, yeah, you just go nomading, you go to Bali, you need like a thousand bucks a month, and then you just live off your savings. Like that, it doesn't work like that. We have proven this a hundred times already on the podcast. Now, one of the things that...
I have so many more questions, but I would love to go a little bit in the practicalities. So you said, you know, almost every day you feel like, I want to quit, but then it's so rewarding for people that are going through these motions, these sort of like entrepreneurial motions where you have very high highs and super low lows. Like what are some of the daily sort of practices or things that have worked for you to sort of like keep yourself sane?
And also just, you know, keep pushing for the next day or for the next hour.
Alex (12:29.646)
I just lost you for the last 10 seconds. I don't know if it's my connection or yours. But I think now I'm back on. Yes.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (12:33.998)
Okay, I will ask the question again, and then we will just edit it. So, so my question was that, you know, like, how do you so what are some of these daily routines or things that you're doing, and applying your days to the live to keep yourself sane and to sort of push for the next day or even for the next hour, when you're going to these motions of massive high highs and super low lows.
Alex (13:00.526)
Yeah, it's an interesting question. I think for me, and again, you know, I might not apply to it, but for me, I really love what I do. And JobGather, the project, the mission, the vision that we have really resonates in me. And I really want that company to be successful. And I know that I need to give, and that's why I've been giving...
110 % in the last four years and I will continue to really give 110 % in it because I really want that to succeed. I really believe that, yes, in a way we can change the world in a way, you know, small space with what we are building. And also what really pushes me is, you know, by being active on LinkedIn, I have a lot of people like following me, you know, messages.
And some people say, you know, I love what you do, it's great. Sometimes they have questions, they want to change job, they want to change career, they listen to a podcast. And I have a big like imposter syndrome, but at the same time, I receive a lot of, of like good feedback that really, you know, push me to just carry on and okay, I'm not that bad in what I'm doing. And again, you know, my life today, we've dropped together.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (14:13.518)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (14:25.646)
is really gives me a lot of freedom, you know, to be with my daughter, to go to Lisbon to see my girlfriend, you know, to travel when I want to, to go to the gym at lunchtime if I want to, or at 3pm if I want to. So I really have, for example, I don't think you have to separate like personal life and professional life. I think it's always mixed. But for me, I really found the right balance between
working and my personal life, for example, you know, the week when I have my daughter, you know, I will not start working before 9 .30 because I'm with her in the morning and then I take her to school and then I need to come back and so on. And then from, you know, let's say five to nine, I'm not working because I'm with her, but then she goes to bed and then I'm going to work again. It works for me. Some people might think it's crazy, but it's working for me. And I don't mind working from nine to 11 when I have to.
If I have to work on a weekend, I work on a weekend. That's fine. So that's for me, it's enough motivation to just when I'm down, when sometimes you have bad news for whatever reason. OK, the bigger picture is there. And that really fits with what I want with my life today. That's enough for me.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (15:46.258)
Love it. So you say that you know that the bigger picture is there. So follow up question on this. How do you connect with this bigger picture? Is that because you have, I don't know, a vision board? Do you have your mission on your screen? State stated? Do you have it like like how do you connect? Because when you're really down, down, down, down, down, it's like, you know, it's there. But how do you connect in a?
with the purpose of getting a bit higher in the moods. So how do you connect with that bigger picture?
Alex (16:22.35)
So for me,
Alex (16:29.55)
I don't know exactly the question, and I know you can edit that, but what sort of answer do you expect in this? How do I connect with the bigger picture? I'm not sure I understand exactly what you mean with the bigger question.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (16:43.63)
Sure, no worries. Okay, so for example, I know also what my mission is, but I'm very, very low in moods. Like I just can't just connect with it. I can't just be like, yeah, this is my mission. Let's go. Again, like let's go behind this laptop, sit here for another hour and do it. So is there some sort of practice? Like, are you meditating? Are you going for a walk? Do you listen to a podcast? Do you have it on your wall written? Is it in a notebook? Like, what is the, like how?
Alex (17:03.63)
Thank you.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (17:11.246)
the actual how on connecting to this bigger picture.
Alex (17:14.414)
Yeah, now that's a good point. I, you know, when I, for example, almost every day, sometimes I feel, okay, I'm just, you know, against the wall. I don't know what to do. I don't know. I really try to disconnect. Before I used to live in a countryside, not anymore, but still where I live, they are parked around. When I can, you know, go just going outside, or for example, I've got a rooftop, just being in a rooftop for five minutes, just have some fresh air.
Ideally going to the park close to where I live without the phone. It doesn't have to be long. It can be 5 -10 minutes. It really helps to reconnect. Or it could be small things. I've got a lot of side projects with real estate, with other things. So I'm like, OK, I'm not really going anywhere with JobGatherer. Let's take 15 minutes and I'm going to work on something else. Or I'm going to start cooking, for example.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (17:43.79)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (17:56.846)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (18:14.122)
or I'm going to go to the gym. I really... It's hard and it's always been hard for me to disconnect, even when I was an employee before. But now I'm really knowing myself that, okay, I'm not going anywhere. Let's not force it. Let's take 15, 30, maybe even two hours sometimes. Let's do something. Let's just disconnect your brain from what you're doing because you're not going anywhere.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (18:30.894)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (18:43.214)
And every time when I come back, it's like, OK, fresh, like reset, and it's working.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (18:48.91)
Yeah. Yeah. So disconnect, reconnect by change of scenery that that works for you. Okay. I'm always like interested in like, but how do you do that? Like when it's happening? Because this is the stuff that we're all experiencing, right? And, and even like this is more focused on entrepreneurship, but I can even imagine if you are
Alex (18:54.258)
Yeah, yeah, that's what I think for me.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (19:11.982)
in a job that is in an office right now and you're really thinking about getting a remote job or just doing something different. And this question is constantly around you in your head, you're going to bed with it, you wake up with it. Like it's this fresh perspective, whether it's from nature, outside, rooftop, talking to people can be so helpful to, yeah, just to change your mood and just to keep going. Love it. I'm...
Alex (19:36.458)
Yeah. Yeah. There was a few years ago, I don't exactly remember, but they were saying the ideal time you should spend working per hour is like something like 48 or 49 minutes working and then 11 or 12 minutes break. Because your brain can't take so much work and need some break. And I really believe that. And that's why all the...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (19:53.486)
Mm.
Alex (20:04.59)
the tools with like focus time, it's never like eight hours. It's like an hour and a half and then 20 minutes break and an hour and a half and then, you know. So I'm really forcing myself to disconnect more. And when I see I'm just, you know, in front of the wall, okay, let's connect, do something else. And I come back into it.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (20:09.805)
Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (20:22.606)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Love it. I also noticed that in my Nomad journey, this has been changing a lot. Like, I feel like, okay, I'm not old, but I'm 34. And I feel like I don't have my 28 year old energy anymore. Like even even my 30 year old energy, I just don't have it anymore. So I feel like that I need either more time to get stuff done, or I need more breaks in between specifically like going outside and just
Like you said, even if it's just for five minutes, but in between client calls, I really want to have a 15 minute break because I just, before I would go like, boom, boom, boom, boom. And now I'm just like, whoa, okay, no, I, because otherwise on Wednesday I'm exhausted. Like I'm broken and I can't do anything on Thursday and Friday. So it's interesting how your energy is changing. And this is why I love entrepreneurship because it's really like the self -development journey on steroids. I'm so.
One of the other things I would love to chat a little bit more about is how have you been defining success for yourself and how do you currently define success? Because you mentioned that in the first two years you guys didn't really pay yourself. There's still a lot of growth. There's a lot of happening still. How do you keep track of that? And yeah, how do you design that?
Alex (21:42.122)
Yeah, it's funny because for me my definition of success changed seven years ago. Seven years ago I had my daughter. And I think for anyone with kids, I think it really changes you, you know, for the better. And before that, I was young, I was living in London, I was, you know, working in recruitment, I think I got good money and the objective was like, I'm going to get more money, I'm going to buy more of this and that and this. And...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (21:49.07)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (22:11.374)
since I have my daughter, now I really value time with her, time with my family. Because time, I mean, you can't buy time, you can't go back in time. And always, for example, with my daughter, I always think, okay, given the fact that she might leave home at 18, I know in Spain people live more like 35 years old, but I left home at 18, so let's say she leaves home at 18.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (22:36.878)
Yeah, I know that. Yeah.
Alex (22:40.27)
How many years left I have with her? Only 11. 11 years is nothing. So I better make the most of this time with her. Kids grow so fast. So for me, my main definition of success today is being able to spend time with the people I love. My daughter, of course, my girlfriend, my parents, my sisters, my nephews, my nieces.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (22:43.726)
Mmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (23:01.87)
Hmm.
Alex (23:09.166)
So for example, I tried to go more back to France. And that's for me the most important. We've seen that with COVID, things can go to shit really quickly. Without no one expecting it, you can lose your parents with an illness or something. My parents are getting any younger. They're like in their 70s. So for me, that's the most important today. And of course, like on a...
professional side, you know, I would say when you launch a company, first, you're like in a survival mode all the time, you need to survive. As I said, every year, 90 % of the companies die. It's been four years already. So we are, you know, like really surviving and still, you know, growing and we have around 20 people. So of course we want a company to grow, to exist, and we want our mission.
and vision to be transformed into an actual product that's working. And we want to, you know, our mission is to help anyone in the world find a remote job. And when we see millions of people connecting to the website, when we see so many feedbacks of people, you know, finding remote jobs, thanks to our platform, it's really, you know, it really...
gives you the right reason to wake up in the morning because you say, okay, I'm doing something that's actually working and that's actually changing people's life because people in, I don't know, Nigeria or people in Sweden or wherever finding remote jobs and being able maybe to move to the countryside to maybe a bigger house, spend more time with the kids because I've been experiencing that myself. You know, I'm not doing two hours commuting every morning.
I'm not going to an office every day because someone tells me to. For us, yeah, that's the definition of success, of course. So I really have these two parts, but today for me, the personal success is the most important one. And if tomorrow you tell me, jobgather becomes a unicorn, you earn a million euros per year, but you don't see a dot anymore, no, I don't sign for that.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (25:05.454)
Hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (25:16.718)
Love it.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (25:34.702)
Yeah, love that. Wow. All right. So let's talk a little bit about job gather. So I really love what you guys do. And one of the things that I really advocate for also in this podcast is yes, we have a lot of entrepreneurs, we have a lot of amazing like passionate entrepreneurs here on the podcast, but there is really something amazing about having a remote job and
I'm also for our listeners in my nomad journey, I have had for the first few years also a remote job. And just like you said, I had this job and then I had like just my side hustles and some of these things worked and some not, but at least I always had a remote job and I loved it. So I don't, I mean, I understand that like entrepreneurship and all of that super sexy and cool and it looks amazing, but it's like, it's not per se easier to be a freelancer because you need to, you know,
You need to find your clients. There's a lot of like admin stuff that you also got to deal with. And if you're very creative, I mean, that really sucks. There's just so many things that suck about being an entrepreneur or running your business, whether you're a freelancer or you want to do like a bigger thing. So remote jobs. So currently on LinkedIn, you see like it's a remote job, but then you still have to be in the office. There's like remote work from anywhere. Like, can you talk a little bit about like,
Alex (26:37.902)
Yes.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (26:57.262)
What, especially I've job gather, like what does it mean when a remote job is listed as a remote job? Like what does that mean?
Alex (27:04.558)
On our website, where we are really careful, and I know we have more than 99 percent of accuracy, is any job listed on JobGather is a remote job. That means no one will force you to go to an office. Some jobs are listed as remote and the company has no offices. But a lot of the roles listed,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (27:06.318)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (27:33.742)
The company actually have offices, but they don't force you to go. In some cases, you have the option. That's why we call remote first. You have the option to go, but you're not being forced to go.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (27:46.222)
Okay. And what is then the difference between work from anywhere and remote? Because sometimes it can also be remote, but then it's in the location, but then could people still travel or not? Is this specific for our audiences because they're usually also interested in living in another place.
Alex (27:59.278)
So for us, a big part of the work that we do when we aggregate offers is trying to understand, of course, first, if the role is actually remote, but remote from where Only 1.5 1.5 % of the remote roles listed are open from anywhere. That means the company might be American.
but they are able to hire people from anywhere in the world, whether you are in Japan, in Africa, in Colombia, wherever. This is only like 1 .5 % of the world's. And of course, these roles receive thousands and thousands of applicants in one day. For 98 .5 % of the positions, the role is limited to one country, two countries, five countries, one continent, but it's limited.
for legal reasons sometimes, but also for logistic reasons. And for example, if a company is hiring, I don't know, salespeople to work in the European market, they want people in a European time zone. Or in some cases, they say, it's for the German market, we just want people remote but in Germany. So in that case, if you are seeing a row listed as remote from Germany,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (29:23.534)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (29:29.582)
and you live in Spain, okay, technically if you're Spanish, you have the right to work in Germany. But if you're not willing to move to Germany, don't bother, don't apply. If the company wants remote from Germany, don't apply. Other cases, if you are from, I don't know, from the US and you don't have a work permit for Europe, don't apply, there's no point. You're just wasting your time and the company's time. So that's why we are really careful with
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (29:40.686)
Yeah.
Alex (29:57.486)
listing the right locations where the company can hire people from.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (30:02.83)
Cool. That's very clear. Can you talk a bit like explain what those like, like why it is that this is so difficult because so I see like both sides, right? I see a lot of people like, a company needs to be remote and blah, blah, blah, blah. But it's like, I understand that there are some sort of like limitations to that. But a lot of people on the job seeker end of this, they're like, yeah, why still going to an office? And there's a lot of frustration. But I think it would be
good to sort of explain to this a bit like why is this so difficult?
Alex (30:37.326)
Yeah, I think first of all, for a company to move to a remote or really flexible setup, it has to come from the top management and they first have to believe into having a really flexible company. They need to trust the people. And I think in a lot of cases, there's a lack of trust because if your people are working
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (31:03.086)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (31:05.774)
remotely from, I don't know, even from the same country, you will not see when they actually start working. You will not see if they're on the phone. You will not see them. And as a manager, if you don't trust your people, you can't have them remote because the actual point of being remote, of course, is having more freedom and is, you know, knowing that you are being trusted, you know, and that the company will actually...
You know, only check what you actually did. You know, the actual outcome of your work and not how many hours you worked or what time you actually started in the morning or how long was your lunch break. You know, because let's be honest, we adults, you know, we're not at school anymore. We shouldn't be judged. I remember, for example, in my job in London, it was not an official rule, but, you know, like a rule that...
we couldn't leave before our manager. So if our manager for some reason was leaving at, I don't know, 9 pm we were just pretending to work until 9 pm which just is silly, you know? And so first, yeah, I think overall, a lot of managers are bad managers. And when you become a remote manager, your bad management skills are even more obvious.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (32:33.646)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (32:34.702)
So I think a lot of managers don't want their team to be remote because they're just scared of being like, OK, now people will see how bad the manager is. So it makes them safer to have the people around to just be the police watching the people. So that's a big thing. And then there is a legal point of view.
What I'm seeing is companies, normally for many years, when they were hiring people, they were hiring people as permanent employee through the headquarters or through subsidiaries in countries. If a, I don't know, an example of a German company with a German legal entity, if they want to hire someone in Spain.
Today they have different options. Option one, set up an entity in Spain, but it costs money, time, and for one employee it's not really worth it. Option two, they can use an EOR like remote .com, deal, oyster, work motion, this sort of players, to actually have a contract with the EOR, and the EOR has a contract with the person in Spain. However, and let's be honest, there's a bit of a gray area.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (33:53.358)
through them, right?
Alex (34:00.526)
around that because that just didn't exist. So there is no law saying that you can't do it. But there is no law saying you can't do it. So some companies, especially big companies, they have legal departments. Legal departments are lawyers. Lawyers, if the law doesn't say you can't do it, they will say don't do it. The law doesn't say you can't do it, but it doesn't say you can do it. So I think there's a bit of a like...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (34:09.326)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (34:29.934)
limitation in a way because it's a bit of a gray area at the moment. So yeah, I think that's why we don't see much remote. And maybe last point, remote work was the easy target to blame all the problems at the moment. We see in the tech industry for the last two years, it's been difficult, less like fundraising. So of course, let's...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (34:35.502)
Yeah.
Alex (34:59.886)
like sales. yeah, it's because of remote work. That was the easy target. I think now people are realizing that was not just because of remote work, you know, bad management, like a lot of things. And again, one thing you need to understand is remote work doesn't affect just the way you work. It really affects the way you live. And I think it's such a big change in our lives.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (35:04.334)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (35:27.79)
that it might take one or two generations to really be like approved by everyone, you know, and maybe all these old managers, usually men, white, you know, or always the same sort of people, 50, 55 years old, maybe we're gonna have to wait for 10, 15 years until they retire to really see a change, you know. But what's happening is some companies really understood the power of giving freedom to people and they are just winning the war of talents.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (35:33.55)
Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (35:46.926)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Alex (35:57.358)
And actually have another issue, which is they receive too many applicants. But I know a lot of companies, they can open an amazing role and have five applicants in a month. Whereas remote companies can get 1 ,000 applicants in one day.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (36:11.309)
Yeah. Yeah, it's very interesting. Cool. Thanks so much for sharing that. I'm and I know that maybe for some listeners, it's like, yeah, but this, this is too difficult. It's maybe boring, but it's good to understand this because it's set expectations. And like you said, like you want to apply it in for roles that you can, that you actually make a chance, right? So let's talk a bit about these roles. So on the platform, so on JobGather, like what
Like what kind of roles can people find that like in terms of industries or is it just literally anything that is remote? You can find it.
Alex (36:45.102)
anything that is remote, anything. Today we have around 200 ,000 remote roles listed and we update and we add between 25 to 30 ,000 new roles every week. So it's always updated. In 2023, for example, we listed 1 .3 million remote roles on the platform. 2024 will be bigger because it's growing slowly, but it's growing.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (37:03.726)
Wow.
Alex (37:14.734)
And actually, to answer your point, yesterday, I actually did a post a few days ago on LinkedIn saying, I think it's probably harder to get a remote role than getting to Harvard. As I said, companies can easily, and I'm not lying, can easily receive 1 ,000 to 3 ,000 applicants in one day, which is insane. So now we are entering the phase two of job gathering.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (37:27.51)
I saw that, yeah.
Alex (37:45.006)
And what we, because JobGatherers is a remote, is a talent -centric platform. We work for the talents, okay? We know that it's really frustrated to apply to 200 positions a day and get zero feedback. But also, talent need to understand that companies which receive a thousand CVs a day, they physically can't do feedback. We actually, and I'm not gonna name,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (37:53.87)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (38:02.158)
Yeah.
Alex (38:12.526)
that company, but we talked to a company, they were saying they can check 500 CVs per hour, spending one or two seconds per CV. How can you actually show your worth in two seconds? It's just impossible. And it's adding like bias and you know, so it's really not something that's worth. And also, talents applying to 200 positions a day, it's just pointless. You know, you are just wasting your energy and you just end up, you know, giving up on that.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (38:23.054)
That's a lot.
Yeah. Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (38:40.366)
Yeah.
Alex (38:42.894)
So what we're actually building now is, so on JobGatherer, of course you have the list of all the roles, but you should also create your profile. So profile is of course with the LinkedIn, with your CV, but we also added like a brick of assessments. Like you can record yourself, like a short video. So we added a lot of bricks to really know who you are. And what we're actually developing now, and it will be released like really soon, is...
the ability to not showing you 500 positions of like marketing, you know, remote from the US is showing you only the roles matching more than 80 % with your profile. Now, maybe only eight or 10, but these roles will be the best ones for you regarding, you know, company culture, hard skills, soft skills, legal, like everything. And then if you apply through JobGather,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (39:16.302)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (39:27.086)
Hmm.
Alex (39:41.23)
you will also increase your chance of being seen because the company will see you are in the top 10. So what we want to create is stop volume, stop applying to 200 positions per day. As a company, stop receiving 1 ,000 CVs a day. Is apply to three or four per day because that's what really matches who you are, you know, your profile. And we are also showing the company that you are.
the best and the company should have an interview with you. We're really creating this global remote, like matching, you know, a platform that's going to serve the talents and the companies. And as a talent, you might be working open for new positions and we will push you the best role. you know, Nina, today, I don't know, HubSpot released that role for whatever position.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (40:12.174)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Alex (40:37.87)
That's matching 90 % of your, you know, that would be really powerful. And that's what we're building. But again, you know, we really want people to understand that we need to stop the volume, the quantity, and we need to aim for more quality.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (40:56.878)
Yeah, yeah. Amazing. my God, that's so exciting. Congrats on starting that. And I'm sure that you're going to help so many people. Like, what a time saver. I mean, right? Because it's also like a lot of people want to be remote because of the freedom. But if, if even creating this freedom is so suffocating already, it's like, it's really hard to push through. So it's like, it's, it's, it's a very, very nice development.
Alex (41:02.382)
Thank you.
Alex (41:16.366)
It is.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (41:22.894)
And guys, if you're listening right now and you're like, yeah, I'm actually looking for a remote job. We have a few episodes on the podcast with remote job coaches. So we have Michelle Coulson here on the podcast, Kristen Vera, you know, all these names. Juliana as well. So that's episode 37, 48 and 53, I believe. So there is like tips on how to find a remote job. Very practical tips. Really loved those episodes.
Alex (41:34.99)
Yeah, of course.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (41:49.902)
All right. So we're almost at the end of the episode. I have like one more question for all the entrepreneurial folks out here that are listening. If there's like, or even just being abroad, like, you know, if there's one thing that you learned from your journey of like living abroad, working abroad, being with like different people from all sorts of cultures, you know,
your startup life, all of this, what you have created, like what is the one big lesson that you would love to share on this podcast that can help other people to pursue their dreams.
Alex (42:26.126)
just you know really get out of your comfort zone in terms of where you work, who you work with, who you work for, travel. I've been lucky you know I've been traveling quite a lot in my life. I've been working with a lot of different people, with a lot of different nationalities, with a lot of different cultures.
Today, the company, we have people in India, in Madagascar, in Colombia, in Sweden, in Ukraine, like in many, many countries. And that really opened my mind. And I'm sure I'm here today working on such a big project with such a big ambition, also because I learned so much from all the people that I met in the last, you know, really...
20 years since I really traveled. And I would really recommend anyone to just do the same. Try to, yes, sometimes the easy option is to work at the company you were in for the last 15 years or with the same people. Get out of that. You will just learn so much. Yes, it might be challenging. Yes, it might be a bit harder. But you will just learn so much and you will grow so much as an individual.
And for me that really changed me and yeah, I really push anyone to just do the same.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (43:55.63)
Beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing that. All right, so we're almost done. A bit of a surprise for you, but I always ask my guests if they have one quick question for me before we end the episode. So, do you have a question?
Alex (44:07.374)
Quick question for you. I didn't expect that question.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (44:12.558)
you
Alex (44:17.422)
No, I would say because I think that would be quite interesting for people to learn. If you, you know, now looking back to your career, is there anything that you would change, you would have changed, or any mistake that you think you did, yeah, anything you would have done differently?
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (44:39.95)
Good question. I'm...
I think I would, and this is more like the self chatter. I think I would, I would more focus on believing in my potential and my, my gut feeling that is driving that potential rather than listening to other people keeping me because of their own like projections in, in a box. Like I've been told very a lot, like whether it was about negotiation on, on an hourly rate or.
work hours or projects or things like I just, I have not focused on working with myself, trusting my gut feeling, trusting my instinct and trusting me and my inner voice and more listen really to other people and maybe be, I've been a bit naive in that. And I think that it's been blocking me. So I've always had like only two years later, I could get the hourly rate I wanted because I've, I, someone told me, no, that's that's.
that that's weird. Why are you asking that? I was like, yeah, that's very weird. You know what I mean? It's like, trusting myself. And if someone tells like, this is not possible, not to take that for granted, but just be like, in their world, it's not possible. Does that mean that's not possible in my world? I can decide that but it's not up to someone else to decide.
Alex (45:45.902)
Yeah, no no, hamsters, yeah.
Alex (46:00.75)
Yeah, yeah, no, I fully agree.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (46:04.846)
Cool. All right. Well, thank you so much for joining. Just for people, if they want to get to know you better, if they want to follow you, what are all the links, the website, places where people can go, and then also the link of JobGatherer. I think that would be great as well.
Alex (46:18.35)
Yeah, I only use one social network, which is LinkedIn. Alex Hernandez, you can find me. I accept everyone, unless you're trying to sell me something that I really don't need. And yeah, if you have questions, just send me a DM on LinkedIn and I will reply to you. And the website is jobgether .com. Easy one. And that's where...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (46:43.79)
Okay, so not job together, it's job gather.
Alex (46:47.278)
Job get that, yes, exactly.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (46:49.742)
Alright, perfect. Alex, thank you so much for joining today. I really enjoyed this conversation. And yeah, I wish you also all the best for job. I think it's really epic.
Alex (47:01.454)
Thank you very much for having me. It was very nice to share my experience.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (47:09.07)
Cool! Okay, I'm gonna just stop the recording.
Hello everyone, welcome to a new episode of the Digital Nomads Daily Podcast. I'm so excited for today's episode because we have an amazing, inspiring entrepreneur here on the podcast. We met somewhat on LinkedIn, but then we really actually met, didn't really met, but then at Running Remote, we were looking at each other. I think you were standing in the staircase and I was there and we were like, okay, let's talk. Alexander, welcome, welcome to Digital Nomads Daily Podcast.
Alex (00:28.078)
Hello Nina, thank you very much for having me today.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (00:32.238)
So exciting. my God. Okay. So, we always start the episode with three quick questions and that's just for our audience to get to know you a little bit better already and kind of your nomadic entrepreneur remote work vibe. So my first question is how long have you been nomading or like somewhat being part of the nomad space?
Alex (00:54.734)
Yeah, it's actually been four years since I quit my last job, which was one week before the lockdown. So February 2020. And today my nomad life. So I live in Madrid, but my girlfriend lives in Lisbon. So I go to Lisbon quite a lot. I would go to London to work from there to see some friends. I actually have...
the luck of having friends in different cities across Europe, one in Marbella, some in Lyon, some in Paris. So, you know, I, because I, of course, work fully remote. I enjoy, you know, traveling and working from different places.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (01:25.198)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (01:37.678)
Yeah, love that. It's so interesting because like on the Digital Nomads Daily podcast, obviously we talk with digital nomads, but the space is growing and it's like changing so much. And these days, like you can have a home base and somewhat nomading. We had Q from on the podcast as well. He was more talking about corporate nomadism. Like there's so many different ways. So yeah, that's also why I love having.
maybe not the typical stereotype digital nomad here because I'm also not that nomad anymore. So I relate a lot to African.
Alex (02:08.398)
that's the thing. Digital nomads are not the typical tech guy from the beach in Bali. I think that's what a lot of people think, but most nomads don't move that much. I've actually remembered some stats, but there are some stats saying that nomads, most of them don't move countries. They move within the same country or with countries around, but not that many. So I think it's good to have this truth about nomads that is just not
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (02:21.934)
Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (02:38.35)
Yeah.
Alex (02:38.382)
living in Bali and walking from the beach because that is only true for a tiny part of the moment.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (02:42.03)
Yeah, exactly. And that's why I still love doing this podcast, because it's really amazing to see how I mean, it's all about, you know, like creating our own lifestyle that works for us. And that also changed over time. Anyways, we're going to talk a lot more about in the episode. So where are you talking from right now?
Alex (03:01.774)
But Jits, I mean, but Jits, yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (03:03.342)
Okay, and Madrid is your base, right?
Alex (03:05.742)
Yeah, it is my base for four years.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (03:07.95)
Wow, do you like recommend it as a nomad destination?
Alex (03:11.534)
I highly recommend it. Actually, a few weeks ago, Remote .com, the company, they released a ranking of the best place to work as a digital nomad. And Madrid was number one in the world. For me, the way I summarize Madrid is good people, good food, and good weather. And the tech scene is moving. There are a lot of like, you know,
coworking, bars, events, and I think for digital nomad that's what people are looking for. So yeah, 100 % recommend the JIT.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (03:51.214)
Right, amazing. I guess I should pay Madrid a visit one day. I hope I see you there then. All right. So my last question is, and this is something that people are really interested always in. And so as we know in the no -miss space, some people have like one income from their job, other people are nomadic entrepreneurs. There are folks that have multiple income strains. How is it for you? How do you make your monies?
Alex (04:17.102)
So my main income stream is from my startup jobgather .com. This is the company I started four years ago with my co -founder Juan. On the side, I don't have much time for that, but on the side sometimes I would do some freelance projects, mostly about sales, helping startups structuring the sales structure, coaching the sales team. Sometimes...
I did some short contract about more like recruitment slash HR, mostly like setting up. I wish I could do more of that because I really enjoy it, but I don't have much time because, you know, job gether is a full time job. And that's where, you know, most of my income.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (05:04.974)
Yeah. I love how honest you are about that because one of the big misconceptions about entrepreneurship, and I think specifically in a nomad space is that you can do so many things, so many different things at the same time. And I feel like there's this sort of like, in one hand, we're like really embracing the multi -passionate entrepreneurs, like Hannah Larsen calls it like a career portfolio, which I really love.
But then on the other hand, I think there is maybe some, yeah, some sort of like misunderstanding or misconception on how do you actually manage your time if you want to have a successful company or like agency or startup like you guys have built. So how is that for you? Like, and also in mind that a lot of people think I'm going to start my own business because that equals freedom, which...
I mean, in my experience, that is really not the case. So how has that been for you in your journey, like starting your company and then working your ass off?
Alex (06:08.718)
Yeah, no, it's a really good question because, you know, lately, especially, you know, LinkedIn, it seems that you have to start your own company to gain freedom and financial freedom. Yeah, right. The theory is nice, but in reality, it's really difficult. And, you know, at the end of the day, we're not hippies, you know, and yes, some people maybe don't care about money that...
that much, but still you have to pay your rent. If you want to travel, you have to pay your travels. You have to pay for your car, for whatever you need. And starting your own company doesn't always work. Actually, nine companies out of 10 fail on the first year. And every year, like 90 % fail every year. So if you want to become a nomad, you can also be a nomad and an employer at some time. You don't have...
to start your own business, to become free and to become a nomad. And I think that there's like a misconception that people have that, yeah, I'm just going to become a freelancer and charge 1000 euros per day and become rich and travel. And yeah, right. That's not really work that way. And so the way, so for me, my personal experience, so four years ago, I quit my job during lockdown.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (07:23.246)
Yeah, as long as it is. Yeah.
Alex (07:32.814)
I got introduced with someone called Juan, a Belgian guy who also just quit his job. And without really knowing each other, because we talked on Zoom like twice, we obviously couldn't meet because he was doing lockdown. We decided to start together, which was a big bet because normally you start a company with someone you know, you trust. We didn't have all of that. Of course, now we know each other, we met.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (08:01.486)
We hope so after four years.
Alex (08:02.41)
And we still work together. But yeah, so that's how we started. And at the time I moved from Paris to Madrid. And yes, it has been really, really challenging because for the first two years we didn't pay ourselves. So living with zero income. So luckily my job before, it was like a sales job with a good commission, I saved a bit of money. But of course for the next...
I mean, for the first two years of job getter, zero euro, you can just say goodbye to holidays, to clothes, to restaurants, to whatever you like to do, you can just say bye. After two years, we started to pay ourselves a little bit. Today, I mean, we're not rich, but we can pay the bills. And it's not for everyone. And I think if you start as a freelancer,
don't expect, you know, invoicing thousands of euros per day and become like really rich and have a great life. You know, Instagram is not a reality. LinkedIn is not a reality. What people say is always true. However, I think always push people to start something that could be starting with a side project if they want to, you know, and keep...
your permanent job, you know, then you have this, you know, where the security of an income every month, you start a side project. If you think that your start project starts to really pay off and you can make some money from it, why not quitting your job and going full time on a side project? But, you know, it's not easy, you know, I have no regrets, but I always like to say starting my company is the best decision of my life and the worst decision of my life.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (09:40.894)
Yeah. Amen to this. Yeah.
Alex (09:54.414)
You know, because yeah, I probably want to quit every day for the last four years. But at the same time, I realized how great it is. That just gave me so much learnings, freedom, connections. Like, you know, I wouldn't be in a podcast today with you if I didn't have my company. Having my company made me start, you know, publishing content on LinkedIn. It's really like a snowball effect. It's not for everyone and it's not easy, but I'm really
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (10:19.822)
Yeah, kind of.
Alex (10:23.662)
enjoyed a lot for years, you know, and it's not the end of it, of course.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (10:26.606)
Yeah, amen to this. Amen to this. Like I appreciate so much of what you just said. This like guys like listening to this, like you might even want to rewind this a little bit because it's like there's so many truths and so many golden nuggets. But the main picture that were under your sketching here is like, you know, like that there are some truths in like there's freedom and you can, you know, like financial skill and all of that, but you got to work like that's the essence.
And I think that what happening is now and like, I'm so allergic to this also, you know, like being an entrepreneur and trying to build my business. And this morning, even I was like, I want to quit. I cannot handle it anymore. And now I'm like super happy. Like it's very bipolar. So it's like, so yeah, so it's like, there's so much into it, but the core message you got to work. And, I also love what you said about having.
You know, the reality of like, you didn't pay yourself for two years. So you had to have something on like a back burner rate. And one of the things that I really, really despise is like, I hate this when people like, yeah, you just go nomading, you go to Bali, you need like a thousand bucks a month, and then you just live off your savings. Like that, it doesn't work like that. We have proven this a hundred times already on the podcast. Now, one of the things that...
I have so many more questions, but I would love to go a little bit in the practicalities. So you said, you know, almost every day you feel like, I want to quit, but then it's so rewarding for people that are going through these motions, these sort of like entrepreneurial motions where you have very high highs and super low lows. Like what are some of the daily sort of practices or things that have worked for you to sort of like keep yourself sane?
And also just, you know, keep pushing for the next day or for the next hour.
Alex (12:29.646)
I just lost you for the last 10 seconds. I don't know if it's my connection or yours. But I think now I'm back on. Yes.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (12:33.998)
Okay, I will ask the question again, and then we will just edit it. So, so my question was that, you know, like, how do you so what are some of these daily routines or things that you're doing, and applying your days to the live to keep yourself sane and to sort of push for the next day or even for the next hour, when you're going to these motions of massive high highs and super low lows.
Alex (13:00.526)
Yeah, it's an interesting question. I think for me, and again, you know, I might not apply to it, but for me, I really love what I do. And JobGather, the project, the mission, the vision that we have really resonates in me. And I really want that company to be successful. And I know that I need to give, and that's why I've been giving...
110 % in the last four years and I will continue to really give 110 % in it because I really want that to succeed. I really believe that, yes, in a way we can change the world in a way, you know, small space with what we are building. And also what really pushes me is, you know, by being active on LinkedIn, I have a lot of people like following me, you know, messages.
And some people say, you know, I love what you do, it's great. Sometimes they have questions, they want to change job, they want to change career, they listen to a podcast. And I have a big like imposter syndrome, but at the same time, I receive a lot of, of like good feedback that really, you know, push me to just carry on and okay, I'm not that bad in what I'm doing. And again, you know, my life today, we've dropped together.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (14:13.518)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (14:25.646)
is really gives me a lot of freedom, you know, to be with my daughter, to go to Lisbon to see my girlfriend, you know, to travel when I want to, to go to the gym at lunchtime if I want to, or at 3pm if I want to. So I really have, for example, I don't think you have to separate like personal life and professional life. I think it's always mixed. But for me, I really found the right balance between
working and my personal life, for example, you know, the week when I have my daughter, you know, I will not start working before 9 .30 because I'm with her in the morning and then I take her to school and then I need to come back and so on. And then from, you know, let's say five to nine, I'm not working because I'm with her, but then she goes to bed and then I'm going to work again. It works for me. Some people might think it's crazy, but it's working for me. And I don't mind working from nine to 11 when I have to.
If I have to work on a weekend, I work on a weekend. That's fine. So that's for me, it's enough motivation to just when I'm down, when sometimes you have bad news for whatever reason. OK, the bigger picture is there. And that really fits with what I want with my life today. That's enough for me.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (15:46.258)
Love it. So you say that you know that the bigger picture is there. So follow up question on this. How do you connect with this bigger picture? Is that because you have, I don't know, a vision board? Do you have your mission on your screen? State stated? Do you have it like like how do you connect? Because when you're really down, down, down, down, down, it's like, you know, it's there. But how do you connect in a?
with the purpose of getting a bit higher in the moods. So how do you connect with that bigger picture?
Alex (16:22.35)
So for me,
Alex (16:29.55)
I don't know exactly the question, and I know you can edit that, but what sort of answer do you expect in this? How do I connect with the bigger picture? I'm not sure I understand exactly what you mean with the bigger question.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (16:43.63)
Sure, no worries. Okay, so for example, I know also what my mission is, but I'm very, very low in moods. Like I just can't just connect with it. I can't just be like, yeah, this is my mission. Let's go. Again, like let's go behind this laptop, sit here for another hour and do it. So is there some sort of practice? Like, are you meditating? Are you going for a walk? Do you listen to a podcast? Do you have it on your wall written? Is it in a notebook? Like, what is the, like how?
Alex (17:03.63)
Thank you.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (17:11.246)
the actual how on connecting to this bigger picture.
Alex (17:14.414)
Yeah, now that's a good point. I, you know, when I, for example, almost every day, sometimes I feel, okay, I'm just, you know, against the wall. I don't know what to do. I don't know. I really try to disconnect. Before I used to live in a countryside, not anymore, but still where I live, they are parked around. When I can, you know, go just going outside, or for example, I've got a rooftop, just being in a rooftop for five minutes, just have some fresh air.
Ideally going to the park close to where I live without the phone. It doesn't have to be long. It can be 5 -10 minutes. It really helps to reconnect. Or it could be small things. I've got a lot of side projects with real estate, with other things. So I'm like, OK, I'm not really going anywhere with JobGatherer. Let's take 15 minutes and I'm going to work on something else. Or I'm going to start cooking, for example.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (17:43.79)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (17:56.846)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (18:14.122)
or I'm going to go to the gym. I really... It's hard and it's always been hard for me to disconnect, even when I was an employee before. But now I'm really knowing myself that, okay, I'm not going anywhere. Let's not force it. Let's take 15, 30, maybe even two hours sometimes. Let's do something. Let's just disconnect your brain from what you're doing because you're not going anywhere.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (18:30.894)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (18:43.214)
And every time when I come back, it's like, OK, fresh, like reset, and it's working.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (18:48.91)
Yeah. Yeah. So disconnect, reconnect by change of scenery that that works for you. Okay. I'm always like interested in like, but how do you do that? Like when it's happening? Because this is the stuff that we're all experiencing, right? And, and even like this is more focused on entrepreneurship, but I can even imagine if you are
Alex (18:54.258)
Yeah, yeah, that's what I think for me.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (19:11.982)
in a job that is in an office right now and you're really thinking about getting a remote job or just doing something different. And this question is constantly around you in your head, you're going to bed with it, you wake up with it. Like it's this fresh perspective, whether it's from nature, outside, rooftop, talking to people can be so helpful to, yeah, just to change your mood and just to keep going. Love it. I'm...
Alex (19:36.458)
Yeah. Yeah. There was a few years ago, I don't exactly remember, but they were saying the ideal time you should spend working per hour is like something like 48 or 49 minutes working and then 11 or 12 minutes break. Because your brain can't take so much work and need some break. And I really believe that. And that's why all the...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (19:53.486)
Mm.
Alex (20:04.59)
the tools with like focus time, it's never like eight hours. It's like an hour and a half and then 20 minutes break and an hour and a half and then, you know. So I'm really forcing myself to disconnect more. And when I see I'm just, you know, in front of the wall, okay, let's connect, do something else. And I come back into it.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (20:09.805)
Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (20:22.606)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Love it. I also noticed that in my Nomad journey, this has been changing a lot. Like, I feel like, okay, I'm not old, but I'm 34. And I feel like I don't have my 28 year old energy anymore. Like even even my 30 year old energy, I just don't have it anymore. So I feel like that I need either more time to get stuff done, or I need more breaks in between specifically like going outside and just
Like you said, even if it's just for five minutes, but in between client calls, I really want to have a 15 minute break because I just, before I would go like, boom, boom, boom, boom. And now I'm just like, whoa, okay, no, I, because otherwise on Wednesday I'm exhausted. Like I'm broken and I can't do anything on Thursday and Friday. So it's interesting how your energy is changing. And this is why I love entrepreneurship because it's really like the self -development journey on steroids. I'm so.
One of the other things I would love to chat a little bit more about is how have you been defining success for yourself and how do you currently define success? Because you mentioned that in the first two years you guys didn't really pay yourself. There's still a lot of growth. There's a lot of happening still. How do you keep track of that? And yeah, how do you design that?
Alex (21:42.122)
Yeah, it's funny because for me my definition of success changed seven years ago. Seven years ago I had my daughter. And I think for anyone with kids, I think it really changes you, you know, for the better. And before that, I was young, I was living in London, I was, you know, working in recruitment, I think I got good money and the objective was like, I'm going to get more money, I'm going to buy more of this and that and this. And...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (21:49.07)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (22:11.374)
since I have my daughter, now I really value time with her, time with my family. Because time, I mean, you can't buy time, you can't go back in time. And always, for example, with my daughter, I always think, okay, given the fact that she might leave home at 18, I know in Spain people live more like 35 years old, but I left home at 18, so let's say she leaves home at 18.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (22:36.878)
Yeah, I know that. Yeah.
Alex (22:40.27)
How many years left I have with her? Only 11. 11 years is nothing. So I better make the most of this time with her. Kids grow so fast. So for me, my main definition of success today is being able to spend time with the people I love. My daughter, of course, my girlfriend, my parents, my sisters, my nephews, my nieces.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (22:43.726)
Mmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (23:01.87)
Hmm.
Alex (23:09.166)
So for example, I tried to go more back to France. And that's for me the most important. We've seen that with COVID, things can go to shit really quickly. Without no one expecting it, you can lose your parents with an illness or something. My parents are getting any younger. They're like in their 70s. So for me, that's the most important today. And of course, like on a...
professional side, you know, I would say when you launch a company, first, you're like in a survival mode all the time, you need to survive. As I said, every year, 90 % of the companies die. It's been four years already. So we are, you know, like really surviving and still, you know, growing and we have around 20 people. So of course we want a company to grow, to exist, and we want our mission.
and vision to be transformed into an actual product that's working. And we want to, you know, our mission is to help anyone in the world find a remote job. And when we see millions of people connecting to the website, when we see so many feedbacks of people, you know, finding remote jobs, thanks to our platform, it's really, you know, it really...
gives you the right reason to wake up in the morning because you say, okay, I'm doing something that's actually working and that's actually changing people's life because people in, I don't know, Nigeria or people in Sweden or wherever finding remote jobs and being able maybe to move to the countryside to maybe a bigger house, spend more time with the kids because I've been experiencing that myself. You know, I'm not doing two hours commuting every morning.
I'm not going to an office every day because someone tells me to. For us, yeah, that's the definition of success, of course. So I really have these two parts, but today for me, the personal success is the most important one. And if tomorrow you tell me, jobgather becomes a unicorn, you earn a million euros per year, but you don't see a dot anymore, no, I don't sign for that.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (25:05.454)
Hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (25:16.718)
Love it.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (25:34.702)
Yeah, love that. Wow. All right. So let's talk a little bit about job gather. So I really love what you guys do. And one of the things that I really advocate for also in this podcast is yes, we have a lot of entrepreneurs, we have a lot of amazing like passionate entrepreneurs here on the podcast, but there is really something amazing about having a remote job and
I'm also for our listeners in my nomad journey, I have had for the first few years also a remote job. And just like you said, I had this job and then I had like just my side hustles and some of these things worked and some not, but at least I always had a remote job and I loved it. So I don't, I mean, I understand that like entrepreneurship and all of that super sexy and cool and it looks amazing, but it's like, it's not per se easier to be a freelancer because you need to, you know,
You need to find your clients. There's a lot of like admin stuff that you also got to deal with. And if you're very creative, I mean, that really sucks. There's just so many things that suck about being an entrepreneur or running your business, whether you're a freelancer or you want to do like a bigger thing. So remote jobs. So currently on LinkedIn, you see like it's a remote job, but then you still have to be in the office. There's like remote work from anywhere. Like, can you talk a little bit about like,
Alex (26:37.902)
Yes.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (26:57.262)
What, especially I've job gather, like what does it mean when a remote job is listed as a remote job? Like what does that mean?
Alex (27:04.558)
On our website, where we are really careful, and I know we have more than 99 percent of accuracy, is any job listed on JobGather is a remote job. That means no one will force you to go to an office. Some jobs are listed as remote and the company has no offices. But a lot of the roles listed,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (27:06.318)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (27:33.742)
The company actually have offices, but they don't force you to go. In some cases, you have the option. That's why we call remote first. You have the option to go, but you're not being forced to go.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (27:46.222)
Okay. And what is then the difference between work from anywhere and remote? Because sometimes it can also be remote, but then it's in the location, but then could people still travel or not? Is this specific for our audiences because they're usually also interested in living in another place.
Alex (27:59.278)
So for us, a big part of the work that we do when we aggregate offers is trying to understand, of course, first, if the role is actually remote, but remote from where Only 1.5 1.5 % of the remote roles listed are open from anywhere. That means the company might be American.
but they are able to hire people from anywhere in the world, whether you are in Japan, in Africa, in Colombia, wherever. This is only like 1 .5 % of the world's. And of course, these roles receive thousands and thousands of applicants in one day. For 98 .5 % of the positions, the role is limited to one country, two countries, five countries, one continent, but it's limited.
for legal reasons sometimes, but also for logistic reasons. And for example, if a company is hiring, I don't know, salespeople to work in the European market, they want people in a European time zone. Or in some cases, they say, it's for the German market, we just want people remote but in Germany. So in that case, if you are seeing a row listed as remote from Germany,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (29:23.534)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (29:29.582)
and you live in Spain, okay, technically if you're Spanish, you have the right to work in Germany. But if you're not willing to move to Germany, don't bother, don't apply. If the company wants remote from Germany, don't apply. Other cases, if you are from, I don't know, from the US and you don't have a work permit for Europe, don't apply, there's no point. You're just wasting your time and the company's time. So that's why we are really careful with
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (29:40.686)
Yeah.
Alex (29:57.486)
listing the right locations where the company can hire people from.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (30:02.83)
Cool. That's very clear. Can you talk a bit like explain what those like, like why it is that this is so difficult because so I see like both sides, right? I see a lot of people like, a company needs to be remote and blah, blah, blah, blah. But it's like, I understand that there are some sort of like limitations to that. But a lot of people on the job seeker end of this, they're like, yeah, why still going to an office? And there's a lot of frustration. But I think it would be
good to sort of explain to this a bit like why is this so difficult?
Alex (30:37.326)
Yeah, I think first of all, for a company to move to a remote or really flexible setup, it has to come from the top management and they first have to believe into having a really flexible company. They need to trust the people. And I think in a lot of cases, there's a lack of trust because if your people are working
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (31:03.086)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (31:05.774)
remotely from, I don't know, even from the same country, you will not see when they actually start working. You will not see if they're on the phone. You will not see them. And as a manager, if you don't trust your people, you can't have them remote because the actual point of being remote, of course, is having more freedom and is, you know, knowing that you are being trusted, you know, and that the company will actually...
You know, only check what you actually did. You know, the actual outcome of your work and not how many hours you worked or what time you actually started in the morning or how long was your lunch break. You know, because let's be honest, we adults, you know, we're not at school anymore. We shouldn't be judged. I remember, for example, in my job in London, it was not an official rule, but, you know, like a rule that...
we couldn't leave before our manager. So if our manager for some reason was leaving at, I don't know, 9 pm we were just pretending to work until 9 pm which just is silly, you know? And so first, yeah, I think overall, a lot of managers are bad managers. And when you become a remote manager, your bad management skills are even more obvious.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (32:33.646)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (32:34.702)
So I think a lot of managers don't want their team to be remote because they're just scared of being like, OK, now people will see how bad the manager is. So it makes them safer to have the people around to just be the police watching the people. So that's a big thing. And then there is a legal point of view.
What I'm seeing is companies, normally for many years, when they were hiring people, they were hiring people as permanent employee through the headquarters or through subsidiaries in countries. If a, I don't know, an example of a German company with a German legal entity, if they want to hire someone in Spain.
Today they have different options. Option one, set up an entity in Spain, but it costs money, time, and for one employee it's not really worth it. Option two, they can use an EOR like remote .com, deal, oyster, work motion, this sort of players, to actually have a contract with the EOR, and the EOR has a contract with the person in Spain. However, and let's be honest, there's a bit of a gray area.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (33:53.358)
through them, right?
Alex (34:00.526)
around that because that just didn't exist. So there is no law saying that you can't do it. But there is no law saying you can't do it. So some companies, especially big companies, they have legal departments. Legal departments are lawyers. Lawyers, if the law doesn't say you can't do it, they will say don't do it. The law doesn't say you can't do it, but it doesn't say you can do it. So I think there's a bit of a like...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (34:09.326)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (34:29.934)
limitation in a way because it's a bit of a gray area at the moment. So yeah, I think that's why we don't see much remote. And maybe last point, remote work was the easy target to blame all the problems at the moment. We see in the tech industry for the last two years, it's been difficult, less like fundraising. So of course, let's...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (34:35.502)
Yeah.
Alex (34:59.886)
like sales. yeah, it's because of remote work. That was the easy target. I think now people are realizing that was not just because of remote work, you know, bad management, like a lot of things. And again, one thing you need to understand is remote work doesn't affect just the way you work. It really affects the way you live. And I think it's such a big change in our lives.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (35:04.334)
Mm -hmm.
Alex (35:27.79)
that it might take one or two generations to really be like approved by everyone, you know, and maybe all these old managers, usually men, white, you know, or always the same sort of people, 50, 55 years old, maybe we're gonna have to wait for 10, 15 years until they retire to really see a change, you know. But what's happening is some companies really understood the power of giving freedom to people and they are just winning the war of talents.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (35:33.55)
Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (35:46.926)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Alex (35:57.358)
And actually have another issue, which is they receive too many applicants. But I know a lot of companies, they can open an amazing role and have five applicants in a month. Whereas remote companies can get 1 ,000 applicants in one day.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (36:11.309)
Yeah. Yeah, it's very interesting. Cool. Thanks so much for sharing that. I'm and I know that maybe for some listeners, it's like, yeah, but this, this is too difficult. It's maybe boring, but it's good to understand this because it's set expectations. And like you said, like you want to apply it in for roles that you can, that you actually make a chance, right? So let's talk a bit about these roles. So on the platform, so on JobGather, like what
Like what kind of roles can people find that like in terms of industries or is it just literally anything that is remote? You can find it.
Alex (36:45.102)
anything that is remote, anything. Today we have around 200 ,000 remote roles listed and we update and we add between 25 to 30 ,000 new roles every week. So it's always updated. In 2023, for example, we listed 1 .3 million remote roles on the platform. 2024 will be bigger because it's growing slowly, but it's growing.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (37:03.726)
Wow.
Alex (37:14.734)
And actually, to answer your point, yesterday, I actually did a post a few days ago on LinkedIn saying, I think it's probably harder to get a remote role than getting to Harvard. As I said, companies can easily, and I'm not lying, can easily receive 1 ,000 to 3 ,000 applicants in one day, which is insane. So now we are entering the phase two of job gathering.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (37:27.51)
I saw that, yeah.
Alex (37:45.006)
And what we, because JobGatherers is a remote, is a talent -centric platform. We work for the talents, okay? We know that it's really frustrated to apply to 200 positions a day and get zero feedback. But also, talent need to understand that companies which receive a thousand CVs a day, they physically can't do feedback. We actually, and I'm not gonna name,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (37:53.87)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (38:02.158)
Yeah.
Alex (38:12.526)
that company, but we talked to a company, they were saying they can check 500 CVs per hour, spending one or two seconds per CV. How can you actually show your worth in two seconds? It's just impossible. And it's adding like bias and you know, so it's really not something that's worth. And also, talents applying to 200 positions a day, it's just pointless. You know, you are just wasting your energy and you just end up, you know, giving up on that.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (38:23.054)
That's a lot.
Yeah. Yeah.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (38:40.366)
Yeah.
Alex (38:42.894)
So what we're actually building now is, so on JobGatherer, of course you have the list of all the roles, but you should also create your profile. So profile is of course with the LinkedIn, with your CV, but we also added like a brick of assessments. Like you can record yourself, like a short video. So we added a lot of bricks to really know who you are. And what we're actually developing now, and it will be released like really soon, is...
the ability to not showing you 500 positions of like marketing, you know, remote from the US is showing you only the roles matching more than 80 % with your profile. Now, maybe only eight or 10, but these roles will be the best ones for you regarding, you know, company culture, hard skills, soft skills, legal, like everything. And then if you apply through JobGather,
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (39:16.302)
Mm -hmm.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (39:27.086)
Hmm.
Alex (39:41.23)
you will also increase your chance of being seen because the company will see you are in the top 10. So what we want to create is stop volume, stop applying to 200 positions per day. As a company, stop receiving 1 ,000 CVs a day. Is apply to three or four per day because that's what really matches who you are, you know, your profile. And we are also showing the company that you are.
the best and the company should have an interview with you. We're really creating this global remote, like matching, you know, a platform that's going to serve the talents and the companies. And as a talent, you might be working open for new positions and we will push you the best role. you know, Nina, today, I don't know, HubSpot released that role for whatever position.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (40:12.174)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Alex (40:37.87)
That's matching 90 % of your, you know, that would be really powerful. And that's what we're building. But again, you know, we really want people to understand that we need to stop the volume, the quantity, and we need to aim for more quality.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (40:56.878)
Yeah, yeah. Amazing. my God, that's so exciting. Congrats on starting that. And I'm sure that you're going to help so many people. Like, what a time saver. I mean, right? Because it's also like a lot of people want to be remote because of the freedom. But if, if even creating this freedom is so suffocating already, it's like, it's really hard to push through. So it's like, it's, it's, it's a very, very nice development.
Alex (41:02.382)
Thank you.
Alex (41:16.366)
It is.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (41:22.894)
And guys, if you're listening right now and you're like, yeah, I'm actually looking for a remote job. We have a few episodes on the podcast with remote job coaches. So we have Michelle Coulson here on the podcast, Kristen Vera, you know, all these names. Juliana as well. So that's episode 37, 48 and 53, I believe. So there is like tips on how to find a remote job. Very practical tips. Really loved those episodes.
Alex (41:34.99)
Yeah, of course.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (41:49.902)
All right. So we're almost at the end of the episode. I have like one more question for all the entrepreneurial folks out here that are listening. If there's like, or even just being abroad, like, you know, if there's one thing that you learned from your journey of like living abroad, working abroad, being with like different people from all sorts of cultures, you know,
your startup life, all of this, what you have created, like what is the one big lesson that you would love to share on this podcast that can help other people to pursue their dreams.
Alex (42:26.126)
just you know really get out of your comfort zone in terms of where you work, who you work with, who you work for, travel. I've been lucky you know I've been traveling quite a lot in my life. I've been working with a lot of different people, with a lot of different nationalities, with a lot of different cultures.
Today, the company, we have people in India, in Madagascar, in Colombia, in Sweden, in Ukraine, like in many, many countries. And that really opened my mind. And I'm sure I'm here today working on such a big project with such a big ambition, also because I learned so much from all the people that I met in the last, you know, really...
20 years since I really traveled. And I would really recommend anyone to just do the same. Try to, yes, sometimes the easy option is to work at the company you were in for the last 15 years or with the same people. Get out of that. You will just learn so much. Yes, it might be challenging. Yes, it might be a bit harder. But you will just learn so much and you will grow so much as an individual.
And for me that really changed me and yeah, I really push anyone to just do the same.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (43:55.63)
Beautiful. Thank you so much for sharing that. All right, so we're almost done. A bit of a surprise for you, but I always ask my guests if they have one quick question for me before we end the episode. So, do you have a question?
Alex (44:07.374)
Quick question for you. I didn't expect that question.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (44:12.558)
you
Alex (44:17.422)
No, I would say because I think that would be quite interesting for people to learn. If you, you know, now looking back to your career, is there anything that you would change, you would have changed, or any mistake that you think you did, yeah, anything you would have done differently?
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (44:39.95)
Good question. I'm...
I think I would, and this is more like the self chatter. I think I would, I would more focus on believing in my potential and my, my gut feeling that is driving that potential rather than listening to other people keeping me because of their own like projections in, in a box. Like I've been told very a lot, like whether it was about negotiation on, on an hourly rate or.
work hours or projects or things like I just, I have not focused on working with myself, trusting my gut feeling, trusting my instinct and trusting me and my inner voice and more listen really to other people and maybe be, I've been a bit naive in that. And I think that it's been blocking me. So I've always had like only two years later, I could get the hourly rate I wanted because I've, I, someone told me, no, that's that's.
that that's weird. Why are you asking that? I was like, yeah, that's very weird. You know what I mean? It's like, trusting myself. And if someone tells like, this is not possible, not to take that for granted, but just be like, in their world, it's not possible. Does that mean that's not possible in my world? I can decide that but it's not up to someone else to decide.
Alex (45:45.902)
Yeah, no no, hamsters, yeah.
Alex (46:00.75)
Yeah, yeah, no, I fully agree.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (46:04.846)
Cool. All right. Well, thank you so much for joining. Just for people, if they want to get to know you better, if they want to follow you, what are all the links, the website, places where people can go, and then also the link of JobGatherer. I think that would be great as well.
Alex (46:18.35)
Yeah, I only use one social network, which is LinkedIn. Alex Hernandez, you can find me. I accept everyone, unless you're trying to sell me something that I really don't need. And yeah, if you have questions, just send me a DM on LinkedIn and I will reply to you. And the website is jobgether .com. Easy one. And that's where...
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (46:43.79)
Okay, so not job together, it's job gather.
Alex (46:47.278)
Job get that, yes, exactly.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (46:49.742)
Alright, perfect. Alex, thank you so much for joining today. I really enjoyed this conversation. And yeah, I wish you also all the best for job. I think it's really epic.
Alex (47:01.454)
Thank you very much for having me. It was very nice to share my experience.
Nienke Nina from StartDigital.io (47:09.07)
Cool! Okay, I'm gonna just stop the recording.
