WEBVTT
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Welcome to the Optimizing Beyond podcast. I'm
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Josh Negron, and this show is all about sharing
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lessons, ideas, and strategies that sharpen your
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thinking, strengthen your habits, and push you
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to grow beyond comfort zones. Let's dive in.
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Welcome back to the show. I'm joined again by
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my co -host, Ashley, my wife. Welcome back, Ashley.
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Hello. Yes, and today we want to talk about the
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over -optimization of wearables and overwhelming
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amount of health data that we can be assaulted
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with really in today's age and how it can be
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useful and how it can also be detrimental to
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some. Why some people have abandoned their devices,
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changed to different ones, or... change their
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outlook on performance data in today's age. So
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let's get it kicked off. So I would say just
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to joke around that we are a house divided. And
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what I mean by that is that I have a whoop device
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that is on me 24 seven. And as far as my statistic,
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it says I've been using, I've been a Whoop user
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for 2 ,306 days nonstop. That is, I calculated
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6 .31 years. And according to Whoop, I am in
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their top 0 .2 % of users. And Ashley, you tried
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to whoop for a little while and you ditched it.
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And you also had an Apple Watch for a hot minute
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and also ditched that. Now, I'm being kind of
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funny when I say we're divided because we both
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used to have Apple Watches and have since abandoned
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those like analog normal watches. This is the
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Seiko that I'm rocking today. So let us start
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both by giving a quick statement as to why so
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many people are dropping their... Apple Watches
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or their smartwatches? Well, for me, it kind
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of was twofold. And I think for a lot of people,
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it is. While an Apple Watch is nice because you
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don't necessarily always have to have your phone,
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you can answer a text message or a phone call
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on your watch. At the same time, you were always
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getting a buzz. It was always buzzing. And I
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felt just this. tie to my phone all the time
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like oh my gosh where did i leave it like i can't
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i need to answer text messages i need to do this
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like i couldn't leave anything undone because
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i was getting this physical response to every
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phone call every text message every notification
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and like even though i had pared down my notifications
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on what was even available on my apple watch
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compared to my phone it was just a lot and honestly
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until i ditched it i didn't realize how much
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control it had over my life and actually how
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much anxiety that it was giving me. It actually
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kind of put my phone back into its rightful place
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in my life by ditching the Apple Watch. The second
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thing that the reason I actually started it,
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the byproduct was the lack of the anxiety tied
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to everything. The real reason that I started
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it was sort of doing research and learning around
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the EMF that was emitted by an Apple Watch and
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studies are starting to show. like how toxic
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that that can be to your body and as people who
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optimize our food our sleep what we drink i mean
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all the things right like we get up early i need
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to go to the gym like i felt like for me i was
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actually potentially like undoing all of that
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by wearing this watch um and so for me that was
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kind of the start of it and then the lack of
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anxiety and tied to my phone was actually an
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incredible wonderful byproduct and you'll never
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catch me wearing an apple watch at least on a
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day -to -day basis again now i still wear it
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because i like to track my running but we've
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had conversations around maybe a different kind
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of watch and i don't need the full game of an
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apple watch i really just need like maybe a basic
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garment or some basic trackable to track my miles
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my pace like all of those kinds of things um
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when I'm running outdoors. So yeah, that, that's
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kind of been my journey and we'll talk more about
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this later, but I do wear an aura ring and that
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is because of the low EMFs that it emits and
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it even has an airplane mode. So, but we'll talk
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more about that. down the line. Yeah, absolutely.
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The connected piece is, like you said, it has
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parts of it that are really advantageous. Like
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I remember being able to, you know, tell my watch
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like, hey, your hands are full or whatever. You
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can just pull up your watch and be like, I closed
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the garage door or whatever. Turn on some lights,
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you know, some just send this text message. It's
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it's there were periods like I definitely missed
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certain aspects of it. Right. From a convenience
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standpoint. But you're right. There was this
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aspect where it's really unique, where I had
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a psychologist guest last week that talked about
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where we're more connected than ever. However,
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anxiety and depression are also at its highest
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and people are more open to therapy. But all
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of those things don't make for a less anxious
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generation. Right. So the aspect of being too
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connected, a lot of people will say. that there's
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some disadvantages there that you're missing
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the real world, right? The more you're connected
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to that device, the more that you're missing.
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Just think about like a funny illustration for
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this is like, think about a concert, right? And
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when everybody's got their phones out, they're
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not absorbing that concert the way that they
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would organically. And so there are some concerts
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now that were like phones are banned, you know?
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And I hear friends that have gone to experiences
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like that. They're like, man, that was... that
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was really refreshing, like, and it was really,
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you know, analog and, and just really stimulating
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in a different way. So that, that presence, I
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think there's something to that. And I, I could
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definitely say not having my Apple watch. I mean,
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I had one for, gosh, I want to say at least five
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or six years. Um, it definitely was an adjustment.
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I definitely had one before you, cause I'm more
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of that techie person, but now, and you know,
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there's, there's people that'll say, Well, yeah,
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you mentioned paring down your notifications.
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There may be others that like are masters of
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the iPhone, Apple Watch focus modes. You know,
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you're like, no, I make sure that the only thing
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that comes through on my Apple Watch or even
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my phone, you know, they're not controlled by
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their notifications. And if you can really harness
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the power of those tools, then more power to
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you. You can definitely be a power user in that
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way. It's not anything that I ever got into.
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Like I use Do Not Disturb and Sleep Focus. mode
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and then normal. Like I've never gotten in there
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to really customize those things. And so by a
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byproduct, you're just getting notifications
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all the time. And you're absolutely right that
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that really feels like you have a phone strapped
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to your wrist and the anxiety spike. I've always
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feeling connected and always having something
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to do and not being able to relax is a real thing.
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And so that's from, from when I researched and
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saw a lot of, a lot of influencers and bloggers
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are talking about how they're ditching their
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smart devices, especially in the watch arena.
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That makes, it makes a total, a lot of sense.
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I mean, I wear it, like I said, I wear a whoop.
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It's got no screen. People are like, what is
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that? Is that a watch? I'm like, nope. Um, just
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track some of my stuff. No big deal. And, uh,
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and the aura ring. no screen you know so let's
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move on to that you talked about the emf radiation
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now you know some people could be like oh man
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that's bro science like there's no you know there's
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no definitive research to that or or these devices
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they're uh tested you know and they're within
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acceptable tolerances right and it's one of those
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things where like and obviously i wear a whoop
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and this still emits more less emf than uh than
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an apple watch allegedly but way more still than
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an aura ring you chose that because the radiation
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was the lowest in your research of any wearable
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and like you said it has an airplane mode that
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you can set it to that means it's not transmitting
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mine's transmitting all the time right and so
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walk us through kind of what you what led you
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to that like you know you made a really good
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point there's yes there's not a lot of research
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behind it but if it's 24 7 is it worth the information
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you're getting by the price you're having to
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pay for maybe something that's not good for you,
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right? So walk us through kind of your thought
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process there. Yeah, I don't know. More and more
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stuff was popping up online. We have some family
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members that don't do a lot of any kind of electronic
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kinds of things that it can affect things. You
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know, I don't know that our bodies were made
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to have to fight that off, right? Like we bought
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an EMF mat. to try to help like get that, like
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those toxins out of our body and try to get that
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where it would help harness that. You've got
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some of these longevity health doctors that talk
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about going outside and putting your feet in
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the dirt, on the ground and letting the earth
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do what it's supposed to do. I don't know about
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all of that, but like you said, why really? take
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the risk. I wasn't sure that that was a risk
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that I wanted to take. And so for me, the little
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amount of EMF that the Oura Ring emitted, even
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on a regular basis, was better than what I was
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wearing. So I figured that was better. I can
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put it on airplane mode. What I did discover
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by doing that is, while it's not transmitting
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any data, it's not tracking anything either.
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What I did discover was it didn't track sleep.
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It didn't track workouts, any of those kinds
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of things when was on the airplane mode so for
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me I figured the little amount that it was emitting
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that was gonna be okay and I would just I would
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do that because I'm not gonna remember to shut
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it off and on like before I go to sleep or in
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the morning like I'm I'm not not connected to
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my data I might be lucky if I look at it once
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a week like I really just don't. But that's one
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of the things that like, for me, like I tried
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wearing a whoop for a while. And I think that
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I felt like I had to check the data every day
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because it was giving me this, what's your recovery?
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Where are you at with things? Are you in the
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green? Did you do all your stuff? And I'm just
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like, this is causing me more anxiety than it's
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helping me. Like I'm not, it's not helpful data
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to me. So again, I think I maybe tried it for
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what? 30, 60 days. Like I, it, it was not for
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me. Also, I like to wear really cute bracelets
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and it was getting in the way of all that. So
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there was that too. Yep. Yep. The ring is more
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like jewelry, so it makes it easier there. And
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honestly, you picked the aura when we did the
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research, the, the, the radiation was so significantly
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lower compared to the whoop. And then especially
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the Apple watch that it just made. a ton of sense
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if that was something that was worrying you that
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you know let's just get rid of the risk if there
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is a risk that you know even if you want to call
00:10:32.139 --> 00:10:34.519
it perceived risk if it's something that there
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is some doubt around again it could be bro science
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totally have no idea but if there's an alternative
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that you liked then why wouldn't you choose it
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and so that was like We had friends that had
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our rings and it's been good. You really enjoyed
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it. And like you mentioned, you're not married
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to the data anyway. So something that was more
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of a passive device was something that kind of
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matched your kind of style anyway. So moving
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on into the anxiety producing aspect of all this,
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what some people label as orthosomnia, and that
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is a word thrown around to describe. the people's
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obsession specifically about sleep tracking,
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but I feel like it can extend outside of just
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anxiety surrounding sleep tracking. And then
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more broadly, the anxiety surrounding just what
00:11:19.559 --> 00:11:21.399
the trackers and what all the data is telling
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you seems to, for some people, be like an anxiety
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amplifier, which is what you described. And how
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these can be panic triggers or kind of plugging
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into people's tendencies for perfectionism or
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maybe OCD of like, I've got to keep the streak
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going or it's not green or I got to close the
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ring. And so, and there's also the concern that
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you may wake up feeling great, but then look
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at your whoop or whatever and have it say, oh,
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you're in the red. You got to feel like crap
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and then feel like, is that a self -fulfilling
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prophecy? Are you actually in the red? Does that
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get to dictate how you feel? And vice versa.
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Maybe it says you should feel great and you feel
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like smashed buttercups. So I remember being
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challenged by Trey Frisbee, who was a guest on
00:12:06.419 --> 00:12:08.399
the show previously, who's been a great coach
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to me for a long time, saying like, hey, this
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is a tool. Don't let it dictate everything as
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far as like how you should feel and how you should
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perform. And I always took that with a grain
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of salt because the data can sometimes tell you
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more than you know, you know? I mean, I'll never
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forget like you had a CrossFit competition coming
00:12:27.610 --> 00:12:29.929
up one weekend and you had done all the things
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all week long. We'd been to bed early, you'd
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rested, you'd done all the things and you open
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up your Whoop app the day of the first day of
00:12:38.590 --> 00:12:40.850
the competition and you were in the red and you're
00:12:40.850 --> 00:12:44.169
like, what the crap? And it messed with you mentally
00:12:44.169 --> 00:12:47.529
for a giant chunk of the day. And again, it took
00:12:47.529 --> 00:12:50.669
Trey to go, hey dude, do you feel fine? Yeah,
00:12:50.690 --> 00:12:54.730
I feel great. forget what whoop says, like let
00:12:54.730 --> 00:12:57.450
your body tell you what you're feeling. I think,
00:12:57.450 --> 00:13:00.210
you know, that story sticks out to me because
00:13:00.210 --> 00:13:02.889
like you were, you were fighting what that data
00:13:02.889 --> 00:13:05.350
was telling you how true it was. I don't know.
00:13:05.389 --> 00:13:07.149
A lot of the times it probably is true. Like
00:13:07.149 --> 00:13:09.090
the days that you're in the red, like probably
00:13:09.090 --> 00:13:11.429
need to listen to your body and pay special attention
00:13:11.429 --> 00:13:14.070
to things and like not overtrain and not overdo
00:13:14.070 --> 00:13:17.210
it. But in that moment of like, you have something
00:13:17.210 --> 00:13:19.669
you have to perform for. How is that helping
00:13:19.669 --> 00:13:21.570
you mentally? I think it put you in a different
00:13:21.570 --> 00:13:24.429
mental space and it took you a chunk of the day
00:13:24.429 --> 00:13:27.269
to get out of that space and to go in and to
00:13:27.269 --> 00:13:29.590
attack, I think, you know, the workouts that
00:13:29.590 --> 00:13:31.429
you and Trey were getting ready to do. And so
00:13:31.429 --> 00:13:35.450
I do think that too much data can be a bad thing.
00:13:35.590 --> 00:13:38.049
That's just one particular instance that sticks
00:13:38.049 --> 00:13:41.940
out in my mind very, very clearly. Yeah, no,
00:13:42.039 --> 00:13:43.980
you're absolutely right. I remember that day.
00:13:44.100 --> 00:13:46.620
And that's, yeah, that's why Trey came to mind
00:13:46.620 --> 00:13:49.419
because he's the one who challenged me and we
00:13:49.419 --> 00:13:51.720
butted heads about it, you know, cause in a normal
00:13:51.720 --> 00:13:54.700
day that doesn't have high stakes and you're
00:13:54.700 --> 00:13:57.879
just as normal day in the gym, you know, listening
00:13:57.879 --> 00:14:01.500
to the data and, and how you feel. Make total
00:14:01.500 --> 00:14:05.080
sense. But like you said, when you have to run
00:14:05.080 --> 00:14:07.120
a race that day or a CrossFit competition or
00:14:07.120 --> 00:14:08.940
whatever, and you have to perform regardless
00:14:08.940 --> 00:14:12.379
of what the stat says, then is it worth any head
00:14:12.379 --> 00:14:14.700
trash associated with looking at that? And then
00:14:14.700 --> 00:14:17.279
training yourself to, can you get to the point
00:14:17.279 --> 00:14:19.980
where you can look at it and use it for only
00:14:19.980 --> 00:14:23.860
the benefit that it can offer you and not absorb?
00:14:24.669 --> 00:14:26.950
Anything that it could offer you that maybe wouldn't
00:14:26.950 --> 00:14:28.590
be beneficial. So the negative, you know, is
00:14:28.590 --> 00:14:31.769
it going to help you mentally? And if not, then
00:14:31.769 --> 00:14:34.009
just don't open it that day. But it takes that
00:14:34.009 --> 00:14:36.570
degree of self -control to not take whatever
00:14:36.570 --> 00:14:39.269
you're seeing to go with the bad. And for some
00:14:39.269 --> 00:14:41.529
people, that means they go more analog. Like
00:14:41.529 --> 00:14:43.710
maybe they don't use a device or maybe they don't
00:14:43.710 --> 00:14:46.049
check it as often. And like you said, that for
00:14:46.049 --> 00:14:48.580
you, you don't check it all the time. And so
00:14:48.580 --> 00:14:51.419
I think it's really important to not let the
00:14:51.419 --> 00:14:55.480
device dictate to you because sleep's a big part
00:14:55.480 --> 00:14:58.659
of this for a lot of people because maybe they'll
00:14:58.659 --> 00:15:01.240
have sleep trackers specifically for that purpose.
00:15:01.399 --> 00:15:04.700
And there's this stress of like, I gotta get
00:15:04.700 --> 00:15:06.700
to sleep, I gotta get to sleep. And every sleep
00:15:06.700 --> 00:15:08.759
expert out there will tell you that that kind
00:15:08.759 --> 00:15:11.919
of anxiety, like trying to force yourself and
00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:14.360
your brain to shut off to go to sleep is never
00:15:14.360 --> 00:15:17.460
something that works. And so - That's a perfect
00:15:17.460 --> 00:15:20.480
example of this anxiety that is produced by I
00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:23.539
need to have some sort of good metric or those
00:15:23.539 --> 00:15:26.059
kinds of things. And I remember when I made the
00:15:26.059 --> 00:15:29.159
goal to increase my sleep, like I've talked about
00:15:29.159 --> 00:15:32.240
before, I used only a sleep metric that I could
00:15:32.240 --> 00:15:35.240
directly control. So my commitment was in my
00:15:35.240 --> 00:15:37.360
WHOOP, because WHOOP will track multiple sleep
00:15:37.360 --> 00:15:40.379
metrics. It'll track sleep quality and like whatever
00:15:40.379 --> 00:15:41.960
you were in all the zones and all the stuff.
00:15:42.100 --> 00:15:46.100
But one of the metrics was time in bed. And that
00:15:46.100 --> 00:15:47.960
was the one I latched onto. And I said, okay,
00:15:48.019 --> 00:15:50.539
what's my six month average time in bed? Okay,
00:15:50.580 --> 00:15:52.899
great. Well, I'm going to increase that by 30
00:15:52.899 --> 00:15:55.740
minutes at a time. So at that time, it was six
00:15:55.740 --> 00:15:57.860
hours. I was like, cool, I'm going to do six
00:15:57.860 --> 00:16:00.779
and a half hours in bed. And then if I have a
00:16:00.779 --> 00:16:04.179
decent amount of sleep, great. If not, great.
00:16:04.419 --> 00:16:06.860
Doesn't matter the quality of sleep. I've just
00:16:06.860 --> 00:16:09.379
committed to increasing the time in bed. And
00:16:09.379 --> 00:16:11.779
if every other metric stays relatively the same,
00:16:12.269 --> 00:16:15.629
I'll see an increase of sleep of about 15 to
00:16:15.629 --> 00:16:20.049
25 minutes. And I'll get a net positive out of
00:16:20.049 --> 00:16:22.370
that and then increase it to six, you know, seven
00:16:22.370 --> 00:16:25.289
hours, seven and a half hours if I can. And that
00:16:25.289 --> 00:16:27.169
really worked for me because that was a direct
00:16:27.169 --> 00:16:29.549
metric that I can control. It had nothing to
00:16:29.549 --> 00:16:31.929
do with my tracker. My tracker was just helping
00:16:31.929 --> 00:16:34.690
me calculate that metric. So that was the shift
00:16:34.690 --> 00:16:36.370
for me. And again, I've been a user for over
00:16:36.370 --> 00:16:39.149
six years. I definitely for the first four years
00:16:39.149 --> 00:16:42.870
probably had some unhealthy. tendencies with
00:16:42.870 --> 00:16:45.289
that data. So I think it's absolutely right.
00:16:45.389 --> 00:16:47.710
And that's what's been labeled by a lot of people
00:16:47.710 --> 00:16:51.309
as the closing the rings trap, right? So the
00:16:51.309 --> 00:16:53.809
Apple Watch made it famous. They're like, oh,
00:16:53.850 --> 00:16:56.029
you got to close your rings. Sorry, let me stand
00:16:56.029 --> 00:16:58.929
up for just 90 seconds so it tracks and then
00:16:58.929 --> 00:17:03.070
sit my butt back down and got to close my exercise
00:17:03.070 --> 00:17:06.369
ring and the move ring. I don't think any of
00:17:06.369 --> 00:17:08.289
those things inherently are bad, but there are
00:17:08.289 --> 00:17:11.490
some things that I saw that Just with the Apple
00:17:11.490 --> 00:17:14.130
Watch specifically, it was like those rings kind
00:17:14.130 --> 00:17:16.630
of, you know, if someone needed, if maybe someone
00:17:16.630 --> 00:17:19.309
was in desperate need of rest, like sometimes
00:17:19.309 --> 00:17:21.210
they could push people to, because you got to
00:17:21.210 --> 00:17:23.470
close that exercise ring, right? And so it kind
00:17:23.470 --> 00:17:26.549
of pushes people to maybe push too hard. I think
00:17:26.549 --> 00:17:29.390
that's why I like Whoop in that regard. because
00:17:29.390 --> 00:17:31.509
it measures things in as far as strain goes.
00:17:31.630 --> 00:17:33.430
And sometimes it'll tell me like, hey, maybe
00:17:33.430 --> 00:17:35.650
it'll say you pushed really hard two days this
00:17:35.650 --> 00:17:37.710
week. You didn't feel the full effects of it
00:17:37.710 --> 00:17:40.049
yesterday, but today everything's catching up.
00:17:40.130 --> 00:17:43.049
So if you can, if you want, if you absolutely
00:17:43.049 --> 00:17:46.150
need to move, do some walking. Like, and it'll
00:17:46.150 --> 00:17:49.349
kind of guide you in that like. different ways
00:17:49.349 --> 00:17:51.029
you can respond, right? Now, one of the things
00:17:51.029 --> 00:17:53.670
I remember about that is I had a water tracking
00:17:53.670 --> 00:17:55.990
app because years ago, I wasn't really good about
00:17:55.990 --> 00:17:57.950
drinking enough water. Trey challenged me on
00:17:57.950 --> 00:17:59.170
that. He goes, man, you're super healthy, but
00:17:59.170 --> 00:18:00.410
you don't drink a lot of water. And that's really
00:18:00.410 --> 00:18:02.930
lame because your body needs it. And he was absolutely
00:18:02.930 --> 00:18:06.250
right. So I used a water tracking app and it
00:18:06.250 --> 00:18:10.250
worked great. But I got attached to that streak
00:18:10.250 --> 00:18:13.490
and having that on my device. And I'm like, man.
00:18:13.589 --> 00:18:16.309
And I remember sometimes knowing that I drank
00:18:16.309 --> 00:18:20.009
enough water. for that day, like absolutely knowing
00:18:20.009 --> 00:18:22.950
that I was well above the goal, but I hadn't
00:18:22.950 --> 00:18:26.170
entered it in yet. And I had forgotten, put my
00:18:26.170 --> 00:18:27.869
head on my pillow, get ready to go to sleep.
00:18:28.230 --> 00:18:30.390
And then I remember, oh man, I didn't put that
00:18:30.390 --> 00:18:32.269
in there. And then I'm like, well, I got to go
00:18:32.269 --> 00:18:36.650
back and do it. Do you? It's meant to be a tracking
00:18:36.650 --> 00:18:40.269
device to help you fulfill a habit. One that
00:18:40.269 --> 00:18:43.210
I had been fulfilling, but because of the gamification
00:18:43.210 --> 00:18:47.019
of the app itself, I felt, you know, recovering
00:18:47.019 --> 00:18:50.119
perfectionist, maybe a little OCD, whatever.
00:18:50.859 --> 00:18:54.259
For an embarrassing long period of time, I would
00:18:54.259 --> 00:18:58.440
go back and put all that in, which is just ridiculous.
00:18:58.819 --> 00:19:02.519
So these trackers, these devices, these methods,
00:19:02.759 --> 00:19:06.059
they're designed to help you build good habits,
00:19:06.119 --> 00:19:08.559
but in the right place, yeah? So that takes us
00:19:08.559 --> 00:19:11.200
to our last segment where we're talking about
00:19:11.200 --> 00:19:16.559
how data needs to be moved from an idol. like
00:19:16.559 --> 00:19:19.960
I just talked about, to a tool, to something
00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:23.660
that can help you truly optimize your life versus
00:19:23.660 --> 00:19:29.279
control you. Because it's this illusion that
00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:32.420
it seemed, when I was researching this, it seemed
00:19:32.420 --> 00:19:36.839
like people's biggest frustration was that the
00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:39.819
data gave them, at least early on, this illusion
00:19:39.819 --> 00:19:44.200
of control over their life. But over time, they
00:19:44.200 --> 00:19:47.000
started to realize that they actually became
00:19:47.000 --> 00:19:50.980
controlled by the data and they were changing
00:19:50.980 --> 00:19:53.660
their behavior, sometimes not in the greatest
00:19:53.660 --> 00:19:56.539
ways, like compulsive ways because of the data.
00:19:56.660 --> 00:20:00.740
And so I think it's super important to talk about
00:20:00.740 --> 00:20:03.819
the juxtaposition of those two. And what's the
00:20:03.819 --> 00:20:06.359
difference of using that data for education purposes,
00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:09.539
for learning, for feedback about what you're
00:20:09.539 --> 00:20:12.339
trying? Like the sleep thing was perfect for
00:20:12.339 --> 00:20:15.660
me. I increased my time in bed. I did it by small
00:20:15.660 --> 00:20:19.440
increments and it helped me get my sleep from
00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:21.460
the last six months and improve it drastically
00:20:21.460 --> 00:20:24.380
to another six months. That's totally, totally
00:20:24.380 --> 00:20:27.140
amazing. I have a great water habit now, which
00:20:27.140 --> 00:20:29.480
is great, but I don't use the app anymore. And
00:20:29.480 --> 00:20:33.519
so Ashley, walk us through how you view the data.
00:20:33.740 --> 00:20:35.440
Well, obviously I've already talked about that.
00:20:35.500 --> 00:20:38.779
I might check it once a week or so. And it's
00:20:38.779 --> 00:20:41.220
probably every couple times a week, just depending
00:20:41.220 --> 00:20:43.420
on honestly, if I remember to go in and like
00:20:43.420 --> 00:20:46.799
verify my sleep and to verify that I worked out
00:20:46.799 --> 00:20:48.980
and to, you know, do all the things. One of the
00:20:48.980 --> 00:20:51.519
things I do appreciate about the aura is obviously
00:20:51.519 --> 00:20:53.819
with the sleep tracking. There are days that
00:20:53.819 --> 00:20:56.480
I wake up and I'm like, man, I think I was awake
00:20:56.480 --> 00:20:58.440
a lot in the middle of the night and I'll pull
00:20:58.440 --> 00:21:00.700
up my sleep data. And it's like, oh, no, you
00:21:00.700 --> 00:21:04.220
were really only awake, like kind of maybe. actually
00:21:04.220 --> 00:21:07.079
one time. The rest of it was like awake, asleep,
00:21:07.279 --> 00:21:10.319
awake, you know, like it was a, it was, it was
00:21:10.319 --> 00:21:12.759
a different kind of rest. It may not have been
00:21:12.759 --> 00:21:14.180
asleep, asleep, but it was a different kind of
00:21:14.180 --> 00:21:16.759
rest. And so I think it helps like put me mentally
00:21:16.759 --> 00:21:19.099
in that. I think too, like when we tell ourselves
00:21:19.099 --> 00:21:22.000
we're tired, like then we make that a self -fulfilling
00:21:22.000 --> 00:21:23.759
prophecy, like, man, I think I'm really tired
00:21:23.759 --> 00:21:26.420
today. And then we just live in that being tired.
00:21:26.579 --> 00:21:29.720
And so, you know, learning to get those words
00:21:29.720 --> 00:21:32.799
out of my vocabulary, like not letting that be
00:21:33.160 --> 00:21:35.119
true like even if i didn't get a lot of sleep
00:21:35.119 --> 00:21:38.940
like now it's like nope i'm i am okay i you know
00:21:38.940 --> 00:21:40.480
i think there's some of that mind over matter
00:21:40.480 --> 00:21:42.759
too like that you have to just sometimes you
00:21:42.759 --> 00:21:44.980
have to just tell yourself like i am okay but
00:21:44.980 --> 00:21:48.079
also like the the aura ring measures my stress
00:21:48.079 --> 00:21:51.380
um in a day as well and it will give me similar
00:21:51.380 --> 00:21:55.119
to the are you in the red green yellow of um
00:21:55.119 --> 00:21:57.980
of whoop it'll give me a readiness score and
00:21:57.980 --> 00:21:59.960
sometimes i look at that and sometimes i don't
00:21:59.960 --> 00:22:02.769
and sometimes it goes hey, you were really stressed
00:22:02.769 --> 00:22:05.029
yesterday. You didn't sleep good a couple nights
00:22:05.029 --> 00:22:08.190
ago. You've got a lot going on. You need to be
00:22:08.190 --> 00:22:11.190
kind to your body today, right? It's not saying
00:22:11.190 --> 00:22:14.730
like don't do things, but hey, be kind, be aware.
00:22:14.990 --> 00:22:18.390
I think too, like the older I get, the more appreciation
00:22:18.390 --> 00:22:22.660
I have for not pushing it. crazy in the gym.
00:22:22.900 --> 00:22:26.799
Like I would rather go do the Stairmaster or
00:22:26.799 --> 00:22:30.119
I'm gonna go do weight machines or whatever.
00:22:30.339 --> 00:22:32.700
Like that has become more something that fits
00:22:32.700 --> 00:22:35.720
where, where, what my body feels like. And so,
00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:38.279
you know, it's, it is learning to listen to your
00:22:38.279 --> 00:22:41.200
body. Like we were given a natural intuition
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:44.500
to understand and know how we're feeling, where
00:22:44.500 --> 00:22:47.279
our bodies are at. And sometimes I think we lose
00:22:47.279 --> 00:22:50.059
that ability when we rely too much on the data.
00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:53.420
lose that natural intuition to be able to listen.
00:22:53.759 --> 00:22:56.359
And like you mentioned, it can cause you to overtrain.
00:22:56.380 --> 00:22:59.359
It can cause you to have an injury. It can mentally
00:22:59.359 --> 00:23:02.420
mess with you and cause this unnecessary anxiety
00:23:02.420 --> 00:23:05.180
and stress that's actually doing the opposite
00:23:05.180 --> 00:23:07.839
of what it was intended to do. And so I think
00:23:07.839 --> 00:23:09.640
you just have to really figure out what works
00:23:09.640 --> 00:23:11.680
for you and what parameters you're going to put
00:23:11.680 --> 00:23:14.460
in your life and what data you're going to allow
00:23:14.460 --> 00:23:17.710
in and then what you're going to allow. that
00:23:17.710 --> 00:23:19.609
you're going to stick to and that's going to
00:23:19.609 --> 00:23:21.769
be what you really look at, right? Like some
00:23:21.769 --> 00:23:23.369
of it you can look at and go, yep, doesn't matter.
00:23:23.410 --> 00:23:25.289
Yep, doesn't matter, you know? But there are,
00:23:25.309 --> 00:23:26.990
what are going to be the key metrics that are
00:23:26.990 --> 00:23:28.549
really important to you? And like you said, for
00:23:28.549 --> 00:23:31.250
a while, it was the amount of time in bed. And
00:23:31.250 --> 00:23:33.569
so, you know, we made some shifts in our life.
00:23:34.150 --> 00:23:36.609
I, you know, I don't need as much sleep as what
00:23:36.609 --> 00:23:39.710
you do. And so why will lay in bed and read while
00:23:39.710 --> 00:23:42.509
you, while you go to sleep, right? But it just.
00:23:42.880 --> 00:23:46.079
Like there, there is a, such a thing as too much,
00:23:46.079 --> 00:23:47.740
but each person has to figure out what that is
00:23:47.740 --> 00:23:50.220
for them because we're two very different people.
00:23:50.259 --> 00:23:52.960
And I don't, I didn't need as much as what you
00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:55.160
did. That was something that was helpful in,
00:23:55.160 --> 00:23:57.680
like you said, finding the bits of information
00:23:57.680 --> 00:24:00.619
that are helpful to analyze in those trends and
00:24:00.619 --> 00:24:03.569
finding out for you, you had. three different
00:24:03.569 --> 00:24:06.710
trackers. You had your Apple Watch season, you
00:24:06.710 --> 00:24:09.069
had the Whoop season, which was pretty short,
00:24:09.109 --> 00:24:12.049
but still, and now the Oura Ring. And all of
00:24:12.049 --> 00:24:15.150
them told you that your sleep need was significantly
00:24:15.150 --> 00:24:17.990
less than mine. And that was something that I
00:24:17.990 --> 00:24:20.109
was frustrated by because I'm like, man, like
00:24:20.109 --> 00:24:23.049
what in the heck? Like why aren't we, you know,
00:24:23.049 --> 00:24:25.150
basically we're not on the same sleep schedule
00:24:25.150 --> 00:24:28.089
to an extent. And so that was frustrating to
00:24:28.089 --> 00:24:30.710
me, but just realizing that unfortunately we're
00:24:30.710 --> 00:24:33.359
different and there's evidence, that there's
00:24:33.359 --> 00:24:35.619
different types of people that need more or less
00:24:35.619 --> 00:24:38.400
sleep. And that's just a reality right now. And
00:24:38.400 --> 00:24:42.440
so the devices were helpful in giving some context
00:24:42.440 --> 00:24:44.579
and explanation to that. I think it's important
00:24:44.579 --> 00:24:47.380
to also know, like, again, to have that information
00:24:47.380 --> 00:24:51.640
and be able to know what to wield and when. So
00:24:51.640 --> 00:24:55.400
yeah, we focused specifically on one thing, which
00:24:55.400 --> 00:24:58.259
was sleep. All that other data was still being
00:24:58.259 --> 00:25:00.720
collected. And honestly, there's times, especially
00:25:00.720 --> 00:25:03.319
when I still had analysis paralysis or maybe
00:25:03.319 --> 00:25:06.720
unhealthy view of my metrics of how they would
00:25:06.720 --> 00:25:09.039
control me, I would go through seasons where
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:12.900
I, like you, didn't consume it. And I would still
00:25:12.900 --> 00:25:15.400
wear it. So it's still collecting the data because
00:25:15.400 --> 00:25:18.319
there might be a moment in the future where I
00:25:18.319 --> 00:25:20.980
check it out, figure it out, whatever, but I'm
00:25:20.980 --> 00:25:22.799
not consuming it in that moment. So there are
00:25:22.799 --> 00:25:24.920
times, there are still seasons now where like,
00:25:25.369 --> 00:25:28.750
I won't read it. I won't interact with the AI.
00:25:28.849 --> 00:25:31.829
The AI is cool now in Whoop where it has access
00:25:31.829 --> 00:25:34.789
to all my metrics. I'm a Whoop Labs subscriber
00:25:34.789 --> 00:25:37.589
as well. So all my labs are uploaded in there.
00:25:37.710 --> 00:25:40.690
So now the AI is completely integrated with all
00:25:40.690 --> 00:25:43.970
my health data inside of Whoop from my heart
00:25:43.970 --> 00:25:47.710
rate to sleep. to strain, to stress, to labs.
00:25:48.009 --> 00:25:50.970
And so now I can say, hey, I have increased my
00:25:50.970 --> 00:25:53.289
sleep. How did that affect my labs? And they're
00:25:53.289 --> 00:25:54.930
like, yeah, in the last six months, you increased
00:25:54.930 --> 00:25:57.190
your sleep by this much percent, your testosterone
00:25:57.190 --> 00:25:59.609
raised by this and did it completely naturally.
00:25:59.750 --> 00:26:01.250
And that's the only thing I changed. I'm like,
00:26:01.329 --> 00:26:03.380
yeah, I'll take that. That's pretty sweet. And
00:26:03.380 --> 00:26:05.220
so, and then the clinician gave some feedback
00:26:05.220 --> 00:26:08.400
this last time that was pretty specific about
00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:10.960
a specific metric. And I was like, hey, no, I
00:26:10.960 --> 00:26:13.779
can't talk to the guy. So, but I had a sidebar
00:26:13.779 --> 00:26:16.700
with chat GPT and I was like, hey, this was my
00:26:16.700 --> 00:26:19.779
lab metric that they didn't like. This is what
00:26:19.779 --> 00:26:23.119
he suggested. What he didn't know was this. So
00:26:23.119 --> 00:26:26.059
should I follow his advice or actually make this
00:26:26.059 --> 00:26:28.779
other adjustment? And GPT was like, yeah, given
00:26:28.779 --> 00:26:32.390
that info, make the change. I think it's helpful
00:26:32.390 --> 00:26:35.210
to know what to focus on because sometimes none
00:26:35.210 --> 00:26:38.289
of us can focus on all the data of any data,
00:26:38.430 --> 00:26:40.970
not just health data, but you put a ginormous
00:26:40.970 --> 00:26:42.869
spreadsheet in front of somebody, there's no
00:26:42.869 --> 00:26:45.349
way they can consume all of that. So I think
00:26:45.349 --> 00:26:48.269
that's why I like the AI integration and some
00:26:48.269 --> 00:26:50.269
of these things because I've been a member for
00:26:50.269 --> 00:26:53.049
so long and I haven't had any interest in switching
00:26:53.049 --> 00:26:57.549
platforms because at some point, I knew that
00:26:57.549 --> 00:27:00.670
all of this would be able to be filtered down
00:27:00.670 --> 00:27:03.789
in some more actionable ways. And so now that
00:27:03.789 --> 00:27:05.549
there are clinicians involved, that's pretty
00:27:05.549 --> 00:27:08.809
cool. That was just a recent development. This
00:27:08.809 --> 00:27:11.589
program is only like six months old. And so,
00:27:11.589 --> 00:27:14.049
yeah, just learning how to use those metrics
00:27:14.049 --> 00:27:16.950
over time, focus on ones that are really important
00:27:16.950 --> 00:27:19.470
for you and for like the low -hanging fruit,
00:27:19.609 --> 00:27:21.769
right? So we're always looking for ways that
00:27:21.769 --> 00:27:25.950
we can optimize. It's pretty basic. Move, you
00:27:25.950 --> 00:27:27.430
know, we talk about it all the time. Movement,
00:27:27.569 --> 00:27:31.730
water, sleep. Those are some pretty easy ones
00:27:31.730 --> 00:27:34.289
to tackle. And people always ask me like, hey
00:27:34.289 --> 00:27:36.930
man, what supplements do I need to buy? I'm like,
00:27:37.009 --> 00:27:38.970
how about nothing? How many hours do you sleep
00:27:38.970 --> 00:27:41.730
a night? What's your diet look like? Supplements
00:27:41.730 --> 00:27:46.470
are supplements to supplement your diet for a
00:27:46.470 --> 00:27:48.410
reason. So if you're eating garbage every day,
00:27:48.509 --> 00:27:51.390
you don't need any supplements. You need better
00:27:51.390 --> 00:27:56.109
food. So yeah, data as a tool, not an idol. People
00:27:56.109 --> 00:27:59.150
who are listening to this probably have tendencies
00:27:59.150 --> 00:28:05.150
where they want to customize, perfect, and really
00:28:05.150 --> 00:28:08.609
dial it in. But recognizing that that can take
00:28:08.609 --> 00:28:11.029
you the wrong direction as well with those tendencies
00:28:11.029 --> 00:28:14.000
is important to remember. Thanks for listening
00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:16.339
to the Optimizing Beyond podcast. Remember, growth
00:28:16.339 --> 00:28:19.220
happens when you take action. So subscribe, share
00:28:19.220 --> 00:28:21.480
this with a friend, and most importantly, put
00:28:21.480 --> 00:28:23.240
what you learned into practice. Because as we
00:28:23.240 --> 00:28:26.200
know, daily anything changes everything.
00:00:02.129 --> 00:00:05.169
Welcome to the Optimizing Beyond podcast. I'm
00:00:05.169 --> 00:00:07.389
Josh Negron, and this show is all about sharing
00:00:07.389 --> 00:00:11.109
lessons, ideas, and strategies that sharpen your
00:00:11.109 --> 00:00:13.970
thinking, strengthen your habits, and push you
00:00:13.970 --> 00:00:17.050
to grow beyond comfort zones. Let's dive in.
00:00:21.030 --> 00:00:23.449
Welcome back to the show. I'm joined again by
00:00:23.449 --> 00:00:26.410
my co -host, Ashley, my wife. Welcome back, Ashley.
00:00:26.570 --> 00:00:29.960
Hello. Yes, and today we want to talk about the
00:00:29.960 --> 00:00:33.659
over -optimization of wearables and overwhelming
00:00:33.659 --> 00:00:37.179
amount of health data that we can be assaulted
00:00:37.179 --> 00:00:40.579
with really in today's age and how it can be
00:00:40.579 --> 00:00:43.299
useful and how it can also be detrimental to
00:00:43.299 --> 00:00:45.659
some. Why some people have abandoned their devices,
00:00:45.820 --> 00:00:48.429
changed to different ones, or... change their
00:00:48.429 --> 00:00:51.950
outlook on performance data in today's age. So
00:00:51.950 --> 00:00:54.570
let's get it kicked off. So I would say just
00:00:54.570 --> 00:00:58.130
to joke around that we are a house divided. And
00:00:58.130 --> 00:01:01.490
what I mean by that is that I have a whoop device
00:01:01.490 --> 00:01:06.650
that is on me 24 seven. And as far as my statistic,
00:01:06.829 --> 00:01:08.989
it says I've been using, I've been a Whoop user
00:01:08.989 --> 00:01:14.170
for 2 ,306 days nonstop. That is, I calculated
00:01:14.170 --> 00:01:19.129
6 .31 years. And according to Whoop, I am in
00:01:19.129 --> 00:01:25.859
their top 0 .2 % of users. And Ashley, you tried
00:01:25.859 --> 00:01:28.379
to whoop for a little while and you ditched it.
00:01:28.459 --> 00:01:31.000
And you also had an Apple Watch for a hot minute
00:01:31.000 --> 00:01:33.340
and also ditched that. Now, I'm being kind of
00:01:33.340 --> 00:01:36.159
funny when I say we're divided because we both
00:01:36.159 --> 00:01:39.079
used to have Apple Watches and have since abandoned
00:01:39.079 --> 00:01:41.480
those like analog normal watches. This is the
00:01:41.480 --> 00:01:44.579
Seiko that I'm rocking today. So let us start
00:01:44.579 --> 00:01:47.959
both by giving a quick statement as to why so
00:01:47.959 --> 00:01:51.299
many people are dropping their... Apple Watches
00:01:51.299 --> 00:01:54.420
or their smartwatches? Well, for me, it kind
00:01:54.420 --> 00:01:57.400
of was twofold. And I think for a lot of people,
00:01:57.420 --> 00:02:00.739
it is. While an Apple Watch is nice because you
00:02:00.739 --> 00:02:02.959
don't necessarily always have to have your phone,
00:02:03.040 --> 00:02:04.599
you can answer a text message or a phone call
00:02:04.599 --> 00:02:08.879
on your watch. At the same time, you were always
00:02:08.879 --> 00:02:11.879
getting a buzz. It was always buzzing. And I
00:02:11.879 --> 00:02:15.530
felt just this. tie to my phone all the time
00:02:15.530 --> 00:02:17.330
like oh my gosh where did i leave it like i can't
00:02:17.330 --> 00:02:18.849
i need to answer text messages i need to do this
00:02:18.849 --> 00:02:21.250
like i couldn't leave anything undone because
00:02:21.250 --> 00:02:24.830
i was getting this physical response to every
00:02:24.830 --> 00:02:27.629
phone call every text message every notification
00:02:27.629 --> 00:02:30.409
and like even though i had pared down my notifications
00:02:30.409 --> 00:02:33.189
on what was even available on my apple watch
00:02:33.189 --> 00:02:36.129
compared to my phone it was just a lot and honestly
00:02:36.129 --> 00:02:39.860
until i ditched it i didn't realize how much
00:02:39.860 --> 00:02:42.699
control it had over my life and actually how
00:02:42.699 --> 00:02:45.199
much anxiety that it was giving me. It actually
00:02:45.199 --> 00:02:48.259
kind of put my phone back into its rightful place
00:02:48.259 --> 00:02:51.900
in my life by ditching the Apple Watch. The second
00:02:51.900 --> 00:02:54.759
thing that the reason I actually started it,
00:02:54.780 --> 00:02:57.500
the byproduct was the lack of the anxiety tied
00:02:57.500 --> 00:02:59.699
to everything. The real reason that I started
00:02:59.699 --> 00:03:02.919
it was sort of doing research and learning around
00:03:02.919 --> 00:03:07.219
the EMF that was emitted by an Apple Watch and
00:03:07.219 --> 00:03:09.789
studies are starting to show. like how toxic
00:03:09.789 --> 00:03:12.229
that that can be to your body and as people who
00:03:12.229 --> 00:03:16.349
optimize our food our sleep what we drink i mean
00:03:16.349 --> 00:03:18.509
all the things right like we get up early i need
00:03:18.509 --> 00:03:21.669
to go to the gym like i felt like for me i was
00:03:21.669 --> 00:03:24.189
actually potentially like undoing all of that
00:03:24.189 --> 00:03:28.090
by wearing this watch um and so for me that was
00:03:28.090 --> 00:03:30.469
kind of the start of it and then the lack of
00:03:30.469 --> 00:03:33.409
anxiety and tied to my phone was actually an
00:03:33.409 --> 00:03:36.409
incredible wonderful byproduct and you'll never
00:03:36.409 --> 00:03:38.389
catch me wearing an apple watch at least on a
00:03:38.389 --> 00:03:40.449
day -to -day basis again now i still wear it
00:03:40.449 --> 00:03:42.710
because i like to track my running but we've
00:03:42.710 --> 00:03:44.469
had conversations around maybe a different kind
00:03:44.469 --> 00:03:47.110
of watch and i don't need the full game of an
00:03:47.110 --> 00:03:49.289
apple watch i really just need like maybe a basic
00:03:49.289 --> 00:03:52.990
garment or some basic trackable to track my miles
00:03:52.990 --> 00:03:55.550
my pace like all of those kinds of things um
00:03:56.219 --> 00:03:59.379
when I'm running outdoors. So yeah, that, that's
00:03:59.379 --> 00:04:01.599
kind of been my journey and we'll talk more about
00:04:01.599 --> 00:04:04.819
this later, but I do wear an aura ring and that
00:04:04.819 --> 00:04:08.319
is because of the low EMFs that it emits and
00:04:08.319 --> 00:04:10.599
it even has an airplane mode. So, but we'll talk
00:04:10.599 --> 00:04:12.889
more about that. down the line. Yeah, absolutely.
00:04:13.189 --> 00:04:16.389
The connected piece is, like you said, it has
00:04:16.389 --> 00:04:18.949
parts of it that are really advantageous. Like
00:04:18.949 --> 00:04:21.470
I remember being able to, you know, tell my watch
00:04:21.470 --> 00:04:23.829
like, hey, your hands are full or whatever. You
00:04:23.829 --> 00:04:25.810
can just pull up your watch and be like, I closed
00:04:25.810 --> 00:04:28.810
the garage door or whatever. Turn on some lights,
00:04:28.949 --> 00:04:32.050
you know, some just send this text message. It's
00:04:32.050 --> 00:04:34.910
it's there were periods like I definitely missed
00:04:34.910 --> 00:04:37.779
certain aspects of it. Right. From a convenience
00:04:37.779 --> 00:04:40.680
standpoint. But you're right. There was this
00:04:40.680 --> 00:04:43.600
aspect where it's really unique, where I had
00:04:43.600 --> 00:04:46.939
a psychologist guest last week that talked about
00:04:46.939 --> 00:04:50.459
where we're more connected than ever. However,
00:04:50.759 --> 00:04:53.399
anxiety and depression are also at its highest
00:04:53.399 --> 00:04:56.199
and people are more open to therapy. But all
00:04:56.199 --> 00:04:58.420
of those things don't make for a less anxious
00:04:58.420 --> 00:05:01.500
generation. Right. So the aspect of being too
00:05:01.500 --> 00:05:05.500
connected, a lot of people will say. that there's
00:05:05.500 --> 00:05:07.879
some disadvantages there that you're missing
00:05:07.879 --> 00:05:10.240
the real world, right? The more you're connected
00:05:10.240 --> 00:05:12.360
to that device, the more that you're missing.
00:05:12.620 --> 00:05:15.000
Just think about like a funny illustration for
00:05:15.000 --> 00:05:17.439
this is like, think about a concert, right? And
00:05:17.439 --> 00:05:19.399
when everybody's got their phones out, they're
00:05:19.399 --> 00:05:23.540
not absorbing that concert the way that they
00:05:23.540 --> 00:05:25.939
would organically. And so there are some concerts
00:05:25.939 --> 00:05:27.899
now that were like phones are banned, you know?
00:05:27.920 --> 00:05:30.199
And I hear friends that have gone to experiences
00:05:30.199 --> 00:05:32.110
like that. They're like, man, that was... that
00:05:32.110 --> 00:05:34.509
was really refreshing, like, and it was really,
00:05:34.509 --> 00:05:37.170
you know, analog and, and just really stimulating
00:05:37.170 --> 00:05:39.370
in a different way. So that, that presence, I
00:05:39.370 --> 00:05:41.410
think there's something to that. And I, I could
00:05:41.410 --> 00:05:43.889
definitely say not having my Apple watch. I mean,
00:05:43.910 --> 00:05:47.230
I had one for, gosh, I want to say at least five
00:05:47.230 --> 00:05:51.149
or six years. Um, it definitely was an adjustment.
00:05:51.250 --> 00:05:53.050
I definitely had one before you, cause I'm more
00:05:53.050 --> 00:05:55.310
of that techie person, but now, and you know,
00:05:55.329 --> 00:05:57.829
there's, there's people that'll say, Well, yeah,
00:05:57.990 --> 00:05:59.970
you mentioned paring down your notifications.
00:06:00.089 --> 00:06:02.769
There may be others that like are masters of
00:06:02.769 --> 00:06:05.949
the iPhone, Apple Watch focus modes. You know,
00:06:05.990 --> 00:06:08.129
you're like, no, I make sure that the only thing
00:06:08.129 --> 00:06:10.589
that comes through on my Apple Watch or even
00:06:10.589 --> 00:06:12.870
my phone, you know, they're not controlled by
00:06:12.870 --> 00:06:15.930
their notifications. And if you can really harness
00:06:15.930 --> 00:06:18.509
the power of those tools, then more power to
00:06:18.509 --> 00:06:20.649
you. You can definitely be a power user in that
00:06:20.649 --> 00:06:22.970
way. It's not anything that I ever got into.
00:06:23.189 --> 00:06:26.829
Like I use Do Not Disturb and Sleep Focus. mode
00:06:26.829 --> 00:06:29.490
and then normal. Like I've never gotten in there
00:06:29.490 --> 00:06:31.970
to really customize those things. And so by a
00:06:31.970 --> 00:06:33.670
byproduct, you're just getting notifications
00:06:33.670 --> 00:06:36.089
all the time. And you're absolutely right that
00:06:36.089 --> 00:06:38.990
that really feels like you have a phone strapped
00:06:38.990 --> 00:06:42.810
to your wrist and the anxiety spike. I've always
00:06:42.810 --> 00:06:44.430
feeling connected and always having something
00:06:44.430 --> 00:06:47.110
to do and not being able to relax is a real thing.
00:06:47.290 --> 00:06:50.290
And so that's from, from when I researched and
00:06:50.290 --> 00:06:52.970
saw a lot of, a lot of influencers and bloggers
00:06:52.970 --> 00:06:54.430
are talking about how they're ditching their
00:06:54.430 --> 00:06:56.910
smart devices, especially in the watch arena.
00:06:56.990 --> 00:06:59.250
That makes, it makes a total, a lot of sense.
00:06:59.370 --> 00:07:00.889
I mean, I wear it, like I said, I wear a whoop.
00:07:00.990 --> 00:07:02.529
It's got no screen. People are like, what is
00:07:02.529 --> 00:07:04.870
that? Is that a watch? I'm like, nope. Um, just
00:07:04.870 --> 00:07:06.850
track some of my stuff. No big deal. And, uh,
00:07:06.910 --> 00:07:10.360
and the aura ring. no screen you know so let's
00:07:10.360 --> 00:07:12.519
move on to that you talked about the emf radiation
00:07:12.519 --> 00:07:15.019
now you know some people could be like oh man
00:07:15.019 --> 00:07:17.319
that's bro science like there's no you know there's
00:07:17.319 --> 00:07:19.980
no definitive research to that or or these devices
00:07:19.980 --> 00:07:23.439
they're uh tested you know and they're within
00:07:23.439 --> 00:07:26.420
acceptable tolerances right and it's one of those
00:07:26.420 --> 00:07:29.199
things where like and obviously i wear a whoop
00:07:29.199 --> 00:07:33.439
and this still emits more less emf than uh than
00:07:33.439 --> 00:07:36.759
an apple watch allegedly but way more still than
00:07:36.759 --> 00:07:39.639
an aura ring you chose that because the radiation
00:07:39.639 --> 00:07:43.360
was the lowest in your research of any wearable
00:07:43.360 --> 00:07:45.879
and like you said it has an airplane mode that
00:07:45.879 --> 00:07:47.959
you can set it to that means it's not transmitting
00:07:47.959 --> 00:07:50.779
mine's transmitting all the time right and so
00:07:50.779 --> 00:07:53.379
walk us through kind of what you what led you
00:07:53.379 --> 00:07:55.339
to that like you know you made a really good
00:07:55.339 --> 00:07:57.139
point there's yes there's not a lot of research
00:07:57.139 --> 00:08:03.019
behind it but if it's 24 7 is it worth the information
00:08:03.019 --> 00:08:04.920
you're getting by the price you're having to
00:08:04.920 --> 00:08:07.500
pay for maybe something that's not good for you,
00:08:07.540 --> 00:08:09.620
right? So walk us through kind of your thought
00:08:09.620 --> 00:08:12.199
process there. Yeah, I don't know. More and more
00:08:12.199 --> 00:08:14.920
stuff was popping up online. We have some family
00:08:14.920 --> 00:08:17.800
members that don't do a lot of any kind of electronic
00:08:17.800 --> 00:08:22.220
kinds of things that it can affect things. You
00:08:22.220 --> 00:08:24.639
know, I don't know that our bodies were made
00:08:24.639 --> 00:08:27.459
to have to fight that off, right? Like we bought
00:08:27.459 --> 00:08:31.339
an EMF mat. to try to help like get that, like
00:08:31.339 --> 00:08:34.039
those toxins out of our body and try to get that
00:08:34.039 --> 00:08:36.139
where it would help harness that. You've got
00:08:36.139 --> 00:08:37.779
some of these longevity health doctors that talk
00:08:37.779 --> 00:08:39.820
about going outside and putting your feet in
00:08:39.820 --> 00:08:41.940
the dirt, on the ground and letting the earth
00:08:41.940 --> 00:08:45.340
do what it's supposed to do. I don't know about
00:08:45.340 --> 00:08:48.529
all of that, but like you said, why really? take
00:08:48.529 --> 00:08:52.049
the risk. I wasn't sure that that was a risk
00:08:52.049 --> 00:08:55.570
that I wanted to take. And so for me, the little
00:08:55.570 --> 00:08:59.090
amount of EMF that the Oura Ring emitted, even
00:08:59.090 --> 00:09:01.090
on a regular basis, was better than what I was
00:09:01.090 --> 00:09:03.690
wearing. So I figured that was better. I can
00:09:03.690 --> 00:09:06.049
put it on airplane mode. What I did discover
00:09:06.049 --> 00:09:09.090
by doing that is, while it's not transmitting
00:09:09.090 --> 00:09:11.789
any data, it's not tracking anything either.
00:09:12.090 --> 00:09:14.370
What I did discover was it didn't track sleep.
00:09:14.470 --> 00:09:16.370
It didn't track workouts, any of those kinds
00:09:16.370 --> 00:09:20.009
of things when was on the airplane mode so for
00:09:20.009 --> 00:09:22.730
me I figured the little amount that it was emitting
00:09:22.730 --> 00:09:25.009
that was gonna be okay and I would just I would
00:09:25.009 --> 00:09:26.789
do that because I'm not gonna remember to shut
00:09:26.789 --> 00:09:28.870
it off and on like before I go to sleep or in
00:09:28.870 --> 00:09:31.389
the morning like I'm I'm not not connected to
00:09:31.389 --> 00:09:34.230
my data I might be lucky if I look at it once
00:09:34.230 --> 00:09:37.529
a week like I really just don't. But that's one
00:09:37.529 --> 00:09:39.710
of the things that like, for me, like I tried
00:09:39.710 --> 00:09:42.250
wearing a whoop for a while. And I think that
00:09:42.250 --> 00:09:44.409
I felt like I had to check the data every day
00:09:44.409 --> 00:09:47.350
because it was giving me this, what's your recovery?
00:09:47.710 --> 00:09:49.970
Where are you at with things? Are you in the
00:09:49.970 --> 00:09:52.509
green? Did you do all your stuff? And I'm just
00:09:52.509 --> 00:09:55.289
like, this is causing me more anxiety than it's
00:09:55.289 --> 00:09:57.450
helping me. Like I'm not, it's not helpful data
00:09:57.450 --> 00:10:00.370
to me. So again, I think I maybe tried it for
00:10:00.370 --> 00:10:03.980
what? 30, 60 days. Like I, it, it was not for
00:10:03.980 --> 00:10:06.019
me. Also, I like to wear really cute bracelets
00:10:06.019 --> 00:10:07.620
and it was getting in the way of all that. So
00:10:07.620 --> 00:10:10.139
there was that too. Yep. Yep. The ring is more
00:10:10.139 --> 00:10:12.519
like jewelry, so it makes it easier there. And
00:10:12.519 --> 00:10:14.679
honestly, you picked the aura when we did the
00:10:14.679 --> 00:10:18.720
research, the, the, the radiation was so significantly
00:10:18.720 --> 00:10:21.740
lower compared to the whoop. And then especially
00:10:21.740 --> 00:10:24.740
the Apple watch that it just made. a ton of sense
00:10:24.740 --> 00:10:27.539
if that was something that was worrying you that
00:10:27.539 --> 00:10:30.279
you know let's just get rid of the risk if there
00:10:30.279 --> 00:10:32.139
is a risk that you know even if you want to call
00:10:32.139 --> 00:10:34.519
it perceived risk if it's something that there
00:10:34.519 --> 00:10:36.580
is some doubt around again it could be bro science
00:10:36.580 --> 00:10:39.659
totally have no idea but if there's an alternative
00:10:39.659 --> 00:10:42.659
that you liked then why wouldn't you choose it
00:10:42.659 --> 00:10:44.929
and so that was like We had friends that had
00:10:44.929 --> 00:10:47.990
our rings and it's been good. You really enjoyed
00:10:47.990 --> 00:10:49.850
it. And like you mentioned, you're not married
00:10:49.850 --> 00:10:52.190
to the data anyway. So something that was more
00:10:52.190 --> 00:10:54.230
of a passive device was something that kind of
00:10:54.230 --> 00:10:57.269
matched your kind of style anyway. So moving
00:10:57.269 --> 00:11:01.230
on into the anxiety producing aspect of all this,
00:11:01.269 --> 00:11:04.610
what some people label as orthosomnia, and that
00:11:04.610 --> 00:11:09.039
is a word thrown around to describe. the people's
00:11:09.039 --> 00:11:11.379
obsession specifically about sleep tracking,
00:11:11.539 --> 00:11:14.220
but I feel like it can extend outside of just
00:11:14.220 --> 00:11:16.860
anxiety surrounding sleep tracking. And then
00:11:16.860 --> 00:11:19.559
more broadly, the anxiety surrounding just what
00:11:19.559 --> 00:11:21.399
the trackers and what all the data is telling
00:11:21.399 --> 00:11:24.559
you seems to, for some people, be like an anxiety
00:11:24.559 --> 00:11:28.549
amplifier, which is what you described. And how
00:11:28.549 --> 00:11:31.250
these can be panic triggers or kind of plugging
00:11:31.250 --> 00:11:34.269
into people's tendencies for perfectionism or
00:11:34.269 --> 00:11:36.610
maybe OCD of like, I've got to keep the streak
00:11:36.610 --> 00:11:39.110
going or it's not green or I got to close the
00:11:39.110 --> 00:11:42.190
ring. And so, and there's also the concern that
00:11:42.190 --> 00:11:44.870
you may wake up feeling great, but then look
00:11:44.870 --> 00:11:47.529
at your whoop or whatever and have it say, oh,
00:11:47.590 --> 00:11:49.450
you're in the red. You got to feel like crap
00:11:49.450 --> 00:11:52.509
and then feel like, is that a self -fulfilling
00:11:52.509 --> 00:11:56.120
prophecy? Are you actually in the red? Does that
00:11:56.120 --> 00:11:58.240
get to dictate how you feel? And vice versa.
00:11:58.340 --> 00:12:00.639
Maybe it says you should feel great and you feel
00:12:00.639 --> 00:12:03.899
like smashed buttercups. So I remember being
00:12:03.899 --> 00:12:06.419
challenged by Trey Frisbee, who was a guest on
00:12:06.419 --> 00:12:08.399
the show previously, who's been a great coach
00:12:08.399 --> 00:12:11.019
to me for a long time, saying like, hey, this
00:12:11.019 --> 00:12:14.600
is a tool. Don't let it dictate everything as
00:12:14.600 --> 00:12:17.159
far as like how you should feel and how you should
00:12:17.159 --> 00:12:19.460
perform. And I always took that with a grain
00:12:19.460 --> 00:12:22.259
of salt because the data can sometimes tell you
00:12:22.259 --> 00:12:24.470
more than you know, you know? I mean, I'll never
00:12:24.470 --> 00:12:27.610
forget like you had a CrossFit competition coming
00:12:27.610 --> 00:12:29.929
up one weekend and you had done all the things
00:12:29.929 --> 00:12:32.350
all week long. We'd been to bed early, you'd
00:12:32.350 --> 00:12:35.049
rested, you'd done all the things and you open
00:12:35.049 --> 00:12:38.590
up your Whoop app the day of the first day of
00:12:38.590 --> 00:12:40.850
the competition and you were in the red and you're
00:12:40.850 --> 00:12:44.169
like, what the crap? And it messed with you mentally
00:12:44.169 --> 00:12:47.529
for a giant chunk of the day. And again, it took
00:12:47.529 --> 00:12:50.669
Trey to go, hey dude, do you feel fine? Yeah,
00:12:50.690 --> 00:12:54.730
I feel great. forget what whoop says, like let
00:12:54.730 --> 00:12:57.450
your body tell you what you're feeling. I think,
00:12:57.450 --> 00:13:00.210
you know, that story sticks out to me because
00:13:00.210 --> 00:13:02.889
like you were, you were fighting what that data
00:13:02.889 --> 00:13:05.350
was telling you how true it was. I don't know.
00:13:05.389 --> 00:13:07.149
A lot of the times it probably is true. Like
00:13:07.149 --> 00:13:09.090
the days that you're in the red, like probably
00:13:09.090 --> 00:13:11.429
need to listen to your body and pay special attention
00:13:11.429 --> 00:13:14.070
to things and like not overtrain and not overdo
00:13:14.070 --> 00:13:17.210
it. But in that moment of like, you have something
00:13:17.210 --> 00:13:19.669
you have to perform for. How is that helping
00:13:19.669 --> 00:13:21.570
you mentally? I think it put you in a different
00:13:21.570 --> 00:13:24.429
mental space and it took you a chunk of the day
00:13:24.429 --> 00:13:27.269
to get out of that space and to go in and to
00:13:27.269 --> 00:13:29.590
attack, I think, you know, the workouts that
00:13:29.590 --> 00:13:31.429
you and Trey were getting ready to do. And so
00:13:31.429 --> 00:13:35.450
I do think that too much data can be a bad thing.
00:13:35.590 --> 00:13:38.049
That's just one particular instance that sticks
00:13:38.049 --> 00:13:41.940
out in my mind very, very clearly. Yeah, no,
00:13:42.039 --> 00:13:43.980
you're absolutely right. I remember that day.
00:13:44.100 --> 00:13:46.620
And that's, yeah, that's why Trey came to mind
00:13:46.620 --> 00:13:49.419
because he's the one who challenged me and we
00:13:49.419 --> 00:13:51.720
butted heads about it, you know, cause in a normal
00:13:51.720 --> 00:13:54.700
day that doesn't have high stakes and you're
00:13:54.700 --> 00:13:57.879
just as normal day in the gym, you know, listening
00:13:57.879 --> 00:14:01.500
to the data and, and how you feel. Make total
00:14:01.500 --> 00:14:05.080
sense. But like you said, when you have to run
00:14:05.080 --> 00:14:07.120
a race that day or a CrossFit competition or
00:14:07.120 --> 00:14:08.940
whatever, and you have to perform regardless
00:14:08.940 --> 00:14:12.379
of what the stat says, then is it worth any head
00:14:12.379 --> 00:14:14.700
trash associated with looking at that? And then
00:14:14.700 --> 00:14:17.279
training yourself to, can you get to the point
00:14:17.279 --> 00:14:19.980
where you can look at it and use it for only
00:14:19.980 --> 00:14:23.860
the benefit that it can offer you and not absorb?
00:14:24.669 --> 00:14:26.950
Anything that it could offer you that maybe wouldn't
00:14:26.950 --> 00:14:28.590
be beneficial. So the negative, you know, is
00:14:28.590 --> 00:14:31.769
it going to help you mentally? And if not, then
00:14:31.769 --> 00:14:34.009
just don't open it that day. But it takes that
00:14:34.009 --> 00:14:36.570
degree of self -control to not take whatever
00:14:36.570 --> 00:14:39.269
you're seeing to go with the bad. And for some
00:14:39.269 --> 00:14:41.529
people, that means they go more analog. Like
00:14:41.529 --> 00:14:43.710
maybe they don't use a device or maybe they don't
00:14:43.710 --> 00:14:46.049
check it as often. And like you said, that for
00:14:46.049 --> 00:14:48.580
you, you don't check it all the time. And so
00:14:48.580 --> 00:14:51.419
I think it's really important to not let the
00:14:51.419 --> 00:14:55.480
device dictate to you because sleep's a big part
00:14:55.480 --> 00:14:58.659
of this for a lot of people because maybe they'll
00:14:58.659 --> 00:15:01.240
have sleep trackers specifically for that purpose.
00:15:01.399 --> 00:15:04.700
And there's this stress of like, I gotta get
00:15:04.700 --> 00:15:06.700
to sleep, I gotta get to sleep. And every sleep
00:15:06.700 --> 00:15:08.759
expert out there will tell you that that kind
00:15:08.759 --> 00:15:11.919
of anxiety, like trying to force yourself and
00:15:11.919 --> 00:15:14.360
your brain to shut off to go to sleep is never
00:15:14.360 --> 00:15:17.460
something that works. And so - That's a perfect
00:15:17.460 --> 00:15:20.480
example of this anxiety that is produced by I
00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:23.539
need to have some sort of good metric or those
00:15:23.539 --> 00:15:26.059
kinds of things. And I remember when I made the
00:15:26.059 --> 00:15:29.159
goal to increase my sleep, like I've talked about
00:15:29.159 --> 00:15:32.240
before, I used only a sleep metric that I could
00:15:32.240 --> 00:15:35.240
directly control. So my commitment was in my
00:15:35.240 --> 00:15:37.360
WHOOP, because WHOOP will track multiple sleep
00:15:37.360 --> 00:15:40.379
metrics. It'll track sleep quality and like whatever
00:15:40.379 --> 00:15:41.960
you were in all the zones and all the stuff.
00:15:42.100 --> 00:15:46.100
But one of the metrics was time in bed. And that
00:15:46.100 --> 00:15:47.960
was the one I latched onto. And I said, okay,
00:15:48.019 --> 00:15:50.539
what's my six month average time in bed? Okay,
00:15:50.580 --> 00:15:52.899
great. Well, I'm going to increase that by 30
00:15:52.899 --> 00:15:55.740
minutes at a time. So at that time, it was six
00:15:55.740 --> 00:15:57.860
hours. I was like, cool, I'm going to do six
00:15:57.860 --> 00:16:00.779
and a half hours in bed. And then if I have a
00:16:00.779 --> 00:16:04.179
decent amount of sleep, great. If not, great.
00:16:04.419 --> 00:16:06.860
Doesn't matter the quality of sleep. I've just
00:16:06.860 --> 00:16:09.379
committed to increasing the time in bed. And
00:16:09.379 --> 00:16:11.779
if every other metric stays relatively the same,
00:16:12.269 --> 00:16:15.629
I'll see an increase of sleep of about 15 to
00:16:15.629 --> 00:16:20.049
25 minutes. And I'll get a net positive out of
00:16:20.049 --> 00:16:22.370
that and then increase it to six, you know, seven
00:16:22.370 --> 00:16:25.289
hours, seven and a half hours if I can. And that
00:16:25.289 --> 00:16:27.169
really worked for me because that was a direct
00:16:27.169 --> 00:16:29.549
metric that I can control. It had nothing to
00:16:29.549 --> 00:16:31.929
do with my tracker. My tracker was just helping
00:16:31.929 --> 00:16:34.690
me calculate that metric. So that was the shift
00:16:34.690 --> 00:16:36.370
for me. And again, I've been a user for over
00:16:36.370 --> 00:16:39.149
six years. I definitely for the first four years
00:16:39.149 --> 00:16:42.870
probably had some unhealthy. tendencies with
00:16:42.870 --> 00:16:45.289
that data. So I think it's absolutely right.
00:16:45.389 --> 00:16:47.710
And that's what's been labeled by a lot of people
00:16:47.710 --> 00:16:51.309
as the closing the rings trap, right? So the
00:16:51.309 --> 00:16:53.809
Apple Watch made it famous. They're like, oh,
00:16:53.850 --> 00:16:56.029
you got to close your rings. Sorry, let me stand
00:16:56.029 --> 00:16:58.929
up for just 90 seconds so it tracks and then
00:16:58.929 --> 00:17:03.070
sit my butt back down and got to close my exercise
00:17:03.070 --> 00:17:06.369
ring and the move ring. I don't think any of
00:17:06.369 --> 00:17:08.289
those things inherently are bad, but there are
00:17:08.289 --> 00:17:11.490
some things that I saw that Just with the Apple
00:17:11.490 --> 00:17:14.130
Watch specifically, it was like those rings kind
00:17:14.130 --> 00:17:16.630
of, you know, if someone needed, if maybe someone
00:17:16.630 --> 00:17:19.309
was in desperate need of rest, like sometimes
00:17:19.309 --> 00:17:21.210
they could push people to, because you got to
00:17:21.210 --> 00:17:23.470
close that exercise ring, right? And so it kind
00:17:23.470 --> 00:17:26.549
of pushes people to maybe push too hard. I think
00:17:26.549 --> 00:17:29.390
that's why I like Whoop in that regard. because
00:17:29.390 --> 00:17:31.509
it measures things in as far as strain goes.
00:17:31.630 --> 00:17:33.430
And sometimes it'll tell me like, hey, maybe
00:17:33.430 --> 00:17:35.650
it'll say you pushed really hard two days this
00:17:35.650 --> 00:17:37.710
week. You didn't feel the full effects of it
00:17:37.710 --> 00:17:40.049
yesterday, but today everything's catching up.
00:17:40.130 --> 00:17:43.049
So if you can, if you want, if you absolutely
00:17:43.049 --> 00:17:46.150
need to move, do some walking. Like, and it'll
00:17:46.150 --> 00:17:49.349
kind of guide you in that like. different ways
00:17:49.349 --> 00:17:51.029
you can respond, right? Now, one of the things
00:17:51.029 --> 00:17:53.670
I remember about that is I had a water tracking
00:17:53.670 --> 00:17:55.990
app because years ago, I wasn't really good about
00:17:55.990 --> 00:17:57.950
drinking enough water. Trey challenged me on
00:17:57.950 --> 00:17:59.170
that. He goes, man, you're super healthy, but
00:17:59.170 --> 00:18:00.410
you don't drink a lot of water. And that's really
00:18:00.410 --> 00:18:02.930
lame because your body needs it. And he was absolutely
00:18:02.930 --> 00:18:06.250
right. So I used a water tracking app and it
00:18:06.250 --> 00:18:10.250
worked great. But I got attached to that streak
00:18:10.250 --> 00:18:13.490
and having that on my device. And I'm like, man.
00:18:13.589 --> 00:18:16.309
And I remember sometimes knowing that I drank
00:18:16.309 --> 00:18:20.009
enough water. for that day, like absolutely knowing
00:18:20.009 --> 00:18:22.950
that I was well above the goal, but I hadn't
00:18:22.950 --> 00:18:26.170
entered it in yet. And I had forgotten, put my
00:18:26.170 --> 00:18:27.869
head on my pillow, get ready to go to sleep.
00:18:28.230 --> 00:18:30.390
And then I remember, oh man, I didn't put that
00:18:30.390 --> 00:18:32.269
in there. And then I'm like, well, I got to go
00:18:32.269 --> 00:18:36.650
back and do it. Do you? It's meant to be a tracking
00:18:36.650 --> 00:18:40.269
device to help you fulfill a habit. One that
00:18:40.269 --> 00:18:43.210
I had been fulfilling, but because of the gamification
00:18:43.210 --> 00:18:47.019
of the app itself, I felt, you know, recovering
00:18:47.019 --> 00:18:50.119
perfectionist, maybe a little OCD, whatever.
00:18:50.859 --> 00:18:54.259
For an embarrassing long period of time, I would
00:18:54.259 --> 00:18:58.440
go back and put all that in, which is just ridiculous.
00:18:58.819 --> 00:19:02.519
So these trackers, these devices, these methods,
00:19:02.759 --> 00:19:06.059
they're designed to help you build good habits,
00:19:06.119 --> 00:19:08.559
but in the right place, yeah? So that takes us
00:19:08.559 --> 00:19:11.200
to our last segment where we're talking about
00:19:11.200 --> 00:19:16.559
how data needs to be moved from an idol. like
00:19:16.559 --> 00:19:19.960
I just talked about, to a tool, to something
00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:23.660
that can help you truly optimize your life versus
00:19:23.660 --> 00:19:29.279
control you. Because it's this illusion that
00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:32.420
it seemed, when I was researching this, it seemed
00:19:32.420 --> 00:19:36.839
like people's biggest frustration was that the
00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:39.819
data gave them, at least early on, this illusion
00:19:39.819 --> 00:19:44.200
of control over their life. But over time, they
00:19:44.200 --> 00:19:47.000
started to realize that they actually became
00:19:47.000 --> 00:19:50.980
controlled by the data and they were changing
00:19:50.980 --> 00:19:53.660
their behavior, sometimes not in the greatest
00:19:53.660 --> 00:19:56.539
ways, like compulsive ways because of the data.
00:19:56.660 --> 00:20:00.740
And so I think it's super important to talk about
00:20:00.740 --> 00:20:03.819
the juxtaposition of those two. And what's the
00:20:03.819 --> 00:20:06.359
difference of using that data for education purposes,
00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:09.539
for learning, for feedback about what you're
00:20:09.539 --> 00:20:12.339
trying? Like the sleep thing was perfect for
00:20:12.339 --> 00:20:15.660
me. I increased my time in bed. I did it by small
00:20:15.660 --> 00:20:19.440
increments and it helped me get my sleep from
00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:21.460
the last six months and improve it drastically
00:20:21.460 --> 00:20:24.380
to another six months. That's totally, totally
00:20:24.380 --> 00:20:27.140
amazing. I have a great water habit now, which
00:20:27.140 --> 00:20:29.480
is great, but I don't use the app anymore. And
00:20:29.480 --> 00:20:33.519
so Ashley, walk us through how you view the data.
00:20:33.740 --> 00:20:35.440
Well, obviously I've already talked about that.
00:20:35.500 --> 00:20:38.779
I might check it once a week or so. And it's
00:20:38.779 --> 00:20:41.220
probably every couple times a week, just depending
00:20:41.220 --> 00:20:43.420
on honestly, if I remember to go in and like
00:20:43.420 --> 00:20:46.799
verify my sleep and to verify that I worked out
00:20:46.799 --> 00:20:48.980
and to, you know, do all the things. One of the
00:20:48.980 --> 00:20:51.519
things I do appreciate about the aura is obviously
00:20:51.519 --> 00:20:53.819
with the sleep tracking. There are days that
00:20:53.819 --> 00:20:56.480
I wake up and I'm like, man, I think I was awake
00:20:56.480 --> 00:20:58.440
a lot in the middle of the night and I'll pull
00:20:58.440 --> 00:21:00.700
up my sleep data. And it's like, oh, no, you
00:21:00.700 --> 00:21:04.220
were really only awake, like kind of maybe. actually
00:21:04.220 --> 00:21:07.079
one time. The rest of it was like awake, asleep,
00:21:07.279 --> 00:21:10.319
awake, you know, like it was a, it was, it was
00:21:10.319 --> 00:21:12.759
a different kind of rest. It may not have been
00:21:12.759 --> 00:21:14.180
asleep, asleep, but it was a different kind of
00:21:14.180 --> 00:21:16.759
rest. And so I think it helps like put me mentally
00:21:16.759 --> 00:21:19.099
in that. I think too, like when we tell ourselves
00:21:19.099 --> 00:21:22.000
we're tired, like then we make that a self -fulfilling
00:21:22.000 --> 00:21:23.759
prophecy, like, man, I think I'm really tired
00:21:23.759 --> 00:21:26.420
today. And then we just live in that being tired.
00:21:26.579 --> 00:21:29.720
And so, you know, learning to get those words
00:21:29.720 --> 00:21:32.799
out of my vocabulary, like not letting that be
00:21:33.160 --> 00:21:35.119
true like even if i didn't get a lot of sleep
00:21:35.119 --> 00:21:38.940
like now it's like nope i'm i am okay i you know
00:21:38.940 --> 00:21:40.480
i think there's some of that mind over matter
00:21:40.480 --> 00:21:42.759
too like that you have to just sometimes you
00:21:42.759 --> 00:21:44.980
have to just tell yourself like i am okay but
00:21:44.980 --> 00:21:48.079
also like the the aura ring measures my stress
00:21:48.079 --> 00:21:51.380
um in a day as well and it will give me similar
00:21:51.380 --> 00:21:55.119
to the are you in the red green yellow of um
00:21:55.119 --> 00:21:57.980
of whoop it'll give me a readiness score and
00:21:57.980 --> 00:21:59.960
sometimes i look at that and sometimes i don't
00:21:59.960 --> 00:22:02.769
and sometimes it goes hey, you were really stressed
00:22:02.769 --> 00:22:05.029
yesterday. You didn't sleep good a couple nights
00:22:05.029 --> 00:22:08.190
ago. You've got a lot going on. You need to be
00:22:08.190 --> 00:22:11.190
kind to your body today, right? It's not saying
00:22:11.190 --> 00:22:14.730
like don't do things, but hey, be kind, be aware.
00:22:14.990 --> 00:22:18.390
I think too, like the older I get, the more appreciation
00:22:18.390 --> 00:22:22.660
I have for not pushing it. crazy in the gym.
00:22:22.900 --> 00:22:26.799
Like I would rather go do the Stairmaster or
00:22:26.799 --> 00:22:30.119
I'm gonna go do weight machines or whatever.
00:22:30.339 --> 00:22:32.700
Like that has become more something that fits
00:22:32.700 --> 00:22:35.720
where, where, what my body feels like. And so,
00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:38.279
you know, it's, it is learning to listen to your
00:22:38.279 --> 00:22:41.200
body. Like we were given a natural intuition
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:44.500
to understand and know how we're feeling, where
00:22:44.500 --> 00:22:47.279
our bodies are at. And sometimes I think we lose
00:22:47.279 --> 00:22:50.059
that ability when we rely too much on the data.
00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:53.420
lose that natural intuition to be able to listen.
00:22:53.759 --> 00:22:56.359
And like you mentioned, it can cause you to overtrain.
00:22:56.380 --> 00:22:59.359
It can cause you to have an injury. It can mentally
00:22:59.359 --> 00:23:02.420
mess with you and cause this unnecessary anxiety
00:23:02.420 --> 00:23:05.180
and stress that's actually doing the opposite
00:23:05.180 --> 00:23:07.839
of what it was intended to do. And so I think
00:23:07.839 --> 00:23:09.640
you just have to really figure out what works
00:23:09.640 --> 00:23:11.680
for you and what parameters you're going to put
00:23:11.680 --> 00:23:14.460
in your life and what data you're going to allow
00:23:14.460 --> 00:23:17.710
in and then what you're going to allow. that
00:23:17.710 --> 00:23:19.609
you're going to stick to and that's going to
00:23:19.609 --> 00:23:21.769
be what you really look at, right? Like some
00:23:21.769 --> 00:23:23.369
of it you can look at and go, yep, doesn't matter.
00:23:23.410 --> 00:23:25.289
Yep, doesn't matter, you know? But there are,
00:23:25.309 --> 00:23:26.990
what are going to be the key metrics that are
00:23:26.990 --> 00:23:28.549
really important to you? And like you said, for
00:23:28.549 --> 00:23:31.250
a while, it was the amount of time in bed. And
00:23:31.250 --> 00:23:33.569
so, you know, we made some shifts in our life.
00:23:34.150 --> 00:23:36.609
I, you know, I don't need as much sleep as what
00:23:36.609 --> 00:23:39.710
you do. And so why will lay in bed and read while
00:23:39.710 --> 00:23:42.509
you, while you go to sleep, right? But it just.
00:23:42.880 --> 00:23:46.079
Like there, there is a, such a thing as too much,
00:23:46.079 --> 00:23:47.740
but each person has to figure out what that is
00:23:47.740 --> 00:23:50.220
for them because we're two very different people.
00:23:50.259 --> 00:23:52.960
And I don't, I didn't need as much as what you
00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:55.160
did. That was something that was helpful in,
00:23:55.160 --> 00:23:57.680
like you said, finding the bits of information
00:23:57.680 --> 00:24:00.619
that are helpful to analyze in those trends and
00:24:00.619 --> 00:24:03.569
finding out for you, you had. three different
00:24:03.569 --> 00:24:06.710
trackers. You had your Apple Watch season, you
00:24:06.710 --> 00:24:09.069
had the Whoop season, which was pretty short,
00:24:09.109 --> 00:24:12.049
but still, and now the Oura Ring. And all of
00:24:12.049 --> 00:24:15.150
them told you that your sleep need was significantly
00:24:15.150 --> 00:24:17.990
less than mine. And that was something that I
00:24:17.990 --> 00:24:20.109
was frustrated by because I'm like, man, like
00:24:20.109 --> 00:24:23.049
what in the heck? Like why aren't we, you know,
00:24:23.049 --> 00:24:25.150
basically we're not on the same sleep schedule
00:24:25.150 --> 00:24:28.089
to an extent. And so that was frustrating to
00:24:28.089 --> 00:24:30.710
me, but just realizing that unfortunately we're
00:24:30.710 --> 00:24:33.359
different and there's evidence, that there's
00:24:33.359 --> 00:24:35.619
different types of people that need more or less
00:24:35.619 --> 00:24:38.400
sleep. And that's just a reality right now. And
00:24:38.400 --> 00:24:42.440
so the devices were helpful in giving some context
00:24:42.440 --> 00:24:44.579
and explanation to that. I think it's important
00:24:44.579 --> 00:24:47.380
to also know, like, again, to have that information
00:24:47.380 --> 00:24:51.640
and be able to know what to wield and when. So
00:24:51.640 --> 00:24:55.400
yeah, we focused specifically on one thing, which
00:24:55.400 --> 00:24:58.259
was sleep. All that other data was still being
00:24:58.259 --> 00:25:00.720
collected. And honestly, there's times, especially
00:25:00.720 --> 00:25:03.319
when I still had analysis paralysis or maybe
00:25:03.319 --> 00:25:06.720
unhealthy view of my metrics of how they would
00:25:06.720 --> 00:25:09.039
control me, I would go through seasons where
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:12.900
I, like you, didn't consume it. And I would still
00:25:12.900 --> 00:25:15.400
wear it. So it's still collecting the data because
00:25:15.400 --> 00:25:18.319
there might be a moment in the future where I
00:25:18.319 --> 00:25:20.980
check it out, figure it out, whatever, but I'm
00:25:20.980 --> 00:25:22.799
not consuming it in that moment. So there are
00:25:22.799 --> 00:25:24.920
times, there are still seasons now where like,
00:25:25.369 --> 00:25:28.750
I won't read it. I won't interact with the AI.
00:25:28.849 --> 00:25:31.829
The AI is cool now in Whoop where it has access
00:25:31.829 --> 00:25:34.789
to all my metrics. I'm a Whoop Labs subscriber
00:25:34.789 --> 00:25:37.589
as well. So all my labs are uploaded in there.
00:25:37.710 --> 00:25:40.690
So now the AI is completely integrated with all
00:25:40.690 --> 00:25:43.970
my health data inside of Whoop from my heart
00:25:43.970 --> 00:25:47.710
rate to sleep. to strain, to stress, to labs.
00:25:48.009 --> 00:25:50.970
And so now I can say, hey, I have increased my
00:25:50.970 --> 00:25:53.289
sleep. How did that affect my labs? And they're
00:25:53.289 --> 00:25:54.930
like, yeah, in the last six months, you increased
00:25:54.930 --> 00:25:57.190
your sleep by this much percent, your testosterone
00:25:57.190 --> 00:25:59.609
raised by this and did it completely naturally.
00:25:59.750 --> 00:26:01.250
And that's the only thing I changed. I'm like,
00:26:01.329 --> 00:26:03.380
yeah, I'll take that. That's pretty sweet. And
00:26:03.380 --> 00:26:05.220
so, and then the clinician gave some feedback
00:26:05.220 --> 00:26:08.400
this last time that was pretty specific about
00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:10.960
a specific metric. And I was like, hey, no, I
00:26:10.960 --> 00:26:13.779
can't talk to the guy. So, but I had a sidebar
00:26:13.779 --> 00:26:16.700
with chat GPT and I was like, hey, this was my
00:26:16.700 --> 00:26:19.779
lab metric that they didn't like. This is what
00:26:19.779 --> 00:26:23.119
he suggested. What he didn't know was this. So
00:26:23.119 --> 00:26:26.059
should I follow his advice or actually make this
00:26:26.059 --> 00:26:28.779
other adjustment? And GPT was like, yeah, given
00:26:28.779 --> 00:26:32.390
that info, make the change. I think it's helpful
00:26:32.390 --> 00:26:35.210
to know what to focus on because sometimes none
00:26:35.210 --> 00:26:38.289
of us can focus on all the data of any data,
00:26:38.430 --> 00:26:40.970
not just health data, but you put a ginormous
00:26:40.970 --> 00:26:42.869
spreadsheet in front of somebody, there's no
00:26:42.869 --> 00:26:45.349
way they can consume all of that. So I think
00:26:45.349 --> 00:26:48.269
that's why I like the AI integration and some
00:26:48.269 --> 00:26:50.269
of these things because I've been a member for
00:26:50.269 --> 00:26:53.049
so long and I haven't had any interest in switching
00:26:53.049 --> 00:26:57.549
platforms because at some point, I knew that
00:26:57.549 --> 00:27:00.670
all of this would be able to be filtered down
00:27:00.670 --> 00:27:03.789
in some more actionable ways. And so now that
00:27:03.789 --> 00:27:05.549
there are clinicians involved, that's pretty
00:27:05.549 --> 00:27:08.809
cool. That was just a recent development. This
00:27:08.809 --> 00:27:11.589
program is only like six months old. And so,
00:27:11.589 --> 00:27:14.049
yeah, just learning how to use those metrics
00:27:14.049 --> 00:27:16.950
over time, focus on ones that are really important
00:27:16.950 --> 00:27:19.470
for you and for like the low -hanging fruit,
00:27:19.609 --> 00:27:21.769
right? So we're always looking for ways that
00:27:21.769 --> 00:27:25.950
we can optimize. It's pretty basic. Move, you
00:27:25.950 --> 00:27:27.430
know, we talk about it all the time. Movement,
00:27:27.569 --> 00:27:31.730
water, sleep. Those are some pretty easy ones
00:27:31.730 --> 00:27:34.289
to tackle. And people always ask me like, hey
00:27:34.289 --> 00:27:36.930
man, what supplements do I need to buy? I'm like,
00:27:37.009 --> 00:27:38.970
how about nothing? How many hours do you sleep
00:27:38.970 --> 00:27:41.730
a night? What's your diet look like? Supplements
00:27:41.730 --> 00:27:46.470
are supplements to supplement your diet for a
00:27:46.470 --> 00:27:48.410
reason. So if you're eating garbage every day,
00:27:48.509 --> 00:27:51.390
you don't need any supplements. You need better
00:27:51.390 --> 00:27:56.109
food. So yeah, data as a tool, not an idol. People
00:27:56.109 --> 00:27:59.150
who are listening to this probably have tendencies
00:27:59.150 --> 00:28:05.150
where they want to customize, perfect, and really
00:28:05.150 --> 00:28:08.609
dial it in. But recognizing that that can take
00:28:08.609 --> 00:28:11.029
you the wrong direction as well with those tendencies
00:28:11.029 --> 00:28:14.000
is important to remember. Thanks for listening
00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:16.339
to the Optimizing Beyond podcast. Remember, growth
00:28:16.339 --> 00:28:19.220
happens when you take action. So subscribe, share
00:28:19.220 --> 00:28:21.480
this with a friend, and most importantly, put
00:28:21.480 --> 00:28:23.240
what you learned into practice. Because as we
00:28:23.240 --> 00:28:26.200
know, daily anything changes everything.
