Dawn Brunke's Eight Week Conversation With Her Deceased Husband Bob | EP 484

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Close your eyes and imagine.
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What if the things in life that caused us the greatest pain, the things that bring us grief, are challenges.
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Challenges designed to help us grow to ultimately become what we were always meant to be.
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We feel like we've been buried, but what if, like a seed, we've been planted?
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And having been planted, we grow to become a mighty tree.
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Now, open your eyes.
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Open your eyes to this way of viewing life.
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Come with me as we explore your true, infinite, eternal nature.
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This is Grief to Growth, and I am your host, Brian Smith.
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Hey there, welcome to Grief to Growth.
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I'm Brian Smith, and if you're new here, I'm glad you found us.
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This show exists for the moments when life cracks us open in ways you didn't expect.
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When someone you love is gone and the world keeps moving, but you can't quite move with it.
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We talk about grief, loss, consciousness, and the questions that feel too big to say out loud.
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What happens when we die?
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Are the people we've lost still with us?
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And is it possible that love doesn't end?
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It just changes form.
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I bring guests who've lived these questions, not just studied them.
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So if you're new here, again, welcome, welcome to Grief to Growth.
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My guest today is Dawn Bowman-Brunke.
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And Dawn has spent her life listening to animals, to dreams, to the quiet signals that frankly, most of us learn to ignore.
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Dawn is the author of 10 books.
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She's an animal communicator and a dream enthusiast living in Alaska.
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Dawn has built her entire body of work around one radical premise.
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And that's that consciousness is far more expansive than we've been taught to believe, and that real connection doesn't require physical presence.
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But then that was put to the test.
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Her husband, Bob, died unexpectedly after 33 years together.
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And everything she thought she knew was put to the test.
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What happened next became her most extraordinary book yet.
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Talks with Bob is a true story of grief, love, and an ongoing conversation that refused to end.
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Through dreams, inner world encounters, and shared thoughts, Dawn and Bob kept talking, and what Bob shared from the other side offers a glimpse into the afterlife that is tender, surprising, and deeply hopeful.
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Now time works differently there.
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Love keeps expanding, and the divide between here and whatever comes next may be far thinner than we think.
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And I got to tell you, I read this book and it really enhanced the way I think about the afterlife in the way of only a handful of books I can think of did, so I wanted to rush to get Dawn on, so that's why she's here with me today.
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If you've ever lost someone to wonder whether the silence of follow-up was real, whether the connection you had could possibly survive death, this conversation is for you.
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Dawn's story might just change what you believe is possible also.
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If you want to continue this conversation after the episode, head over to grief2growth.substack.com.
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You'll find an article there about today's discussion where you can comment and connect with me and with other listeners.
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And with that, let's get started with Dawn Brunky.
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Hi Brian, thanks for that lovely intro.
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Yeah, again, thank you so much for being here.
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I said in the intro, I kind of alluded to the fact that my schedule is booked out, we're recording this in April, and I'm booked out through November, but when I read your book, I was like, I've got to get you on now.
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There's a handful of books I've read that really impacted me, and this is definitely one of them.
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Oh, great, great.
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Well, thank you.
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Thank you.
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You know, it didn't start out to be a book.
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It was just conversations, and I am an author, so, you know, within a couple of weeks, I was thinking, maybe that's a book, maybe that would help people.
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And you didn't ask this, but I'll just tell you that the format of the book is basically the conversations that I had with Bob day after day after day.
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So they kind of meander and they're about a lot of different things.
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And it was a challenge for me because the editor in me likes to organize and summarize, you know, and this is more of an invitation for readers to come along and just experience what we experienced, which was a gentle unfolding about the afterlife, about relationship, about my process through grief.
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And you're right.
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In the very beginning, you said, you know, grief cracks you open.
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And that is the word.
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It just cracked me open.
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And and, you know, and then we're open to a lot of different possibilities of how we choose to move once we're opened like that.
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Yeah, absolutely.
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Well, before we get into into the book and everything, I like I always start by ask people, tell me about Bob, tell me about your loved one.
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Oh, well, he was great.
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He was I live in Alaska.
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He was an Alaska guy in hunting, fishing, that kind of thing.
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He was very much what you see is what you get.
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No pretenses.
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Very solid.
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You know, he had he had his challenges like we all do.
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You know, he thought he was right about most things.
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Yeah, we all do.
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Yeah.
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And so, you know, a lot of discussions that way.
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He was just a really good hearted person.
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Not not, you know, I mean, I'm I would say I'm more a little more intellectual and more into the metaphysics.
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He wasn't he was very supportive of my work with animal communication and he experienced it and believe that was true.
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But he was just very, very matter of fact.
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He loved to help people.
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He was a great neighbor.
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Always loved to tell a story.
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The man you could not shut the man up.
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He was just a talker.
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Yeah.
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And, you know, most everybody who met him really appreciated his his huge generous heart.
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Yeah.
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Well, I feel like I got to know him a little bit through the book and he sounds like like a really great guy.
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And I love the way your relationship actually even evolves as you guys are moving through this this eight week period that the book covers.
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But so Bob passed away in September twenty twenty four, I believe.
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Yeah.
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September eleventh, twenty twenty four.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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Oh, tell people just really quickly about about his passing and and when did he start to communicate with you?
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Yeah, it well, it was very unexpected.
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He had been on my neighbors, my elderly neighbor's roof, you know, just days before clearing Moss off with a hose.
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And, you know, he was a healthy guy.
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He really was.
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The day before he passed, he he worked evenings at an air force base to keep wildlife all the off the runways so that the military flights could come and go.
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So he slept during the day.
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He worked in the evenings and the day before he woke up in the afternoon and he told me he had bad heartburn.
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And, you know, he got up and I got him some toms and some ginger ale and, you know, and then and then he was like, OK, I feel better.
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So it wasn't looking back.
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I see that as a little, you know, red flag that came up.
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But it, you know, he got up, had dinner, went to work.
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And then the next morning I got a call.
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And as soon as I got a call, as soon as I heard the phone, I knew I just knew and his supervisor told me that he had collapsed and he had gone, you know, and and it's as you know, it's a shock.
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You do get cracked open and it is a shock.
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And I remember hearing the voice of the supervisor talking to me and my own voice is saying, you're in shock.
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You're in shock, you know, and shock to me was helpful.
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It's an anesthetic of sorts to get through a couple of days.
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And it was within a couple of days that actually was that first night I was sitting in the living room, just, you know, your thoughts are just all over the place.
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Right.
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But I felt Bob's presence.
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I didn't feel his presence there.
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And it wasn't a big, deep, profound, magical thing.
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It was just a knowing, a quiet inner knowing.
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And a few days later, I had an experience walking around a lake and I it was actually quite beautiful.
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It was a little lake.
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My daughter was there.
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She said, we have to get out of the house.
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We're walking with our dogs and she's ahead of me.
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And it's a misty day, very misty day.
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But a kind of sunny early September or mid September.
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And I'm coming around the lake through some trees.
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And when I come out of the trees, I see the lake and I see the sun coming through the clouds in just this very particular way.
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And it looks like there's champagne bubbles in the air.
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And I I in that moment, I felt Bob here on my right shoulder and he whispered in my ear, I'm in your heart.
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And it was just this very profound.
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Again, unasked for just very kind of organic thing that happened.
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And I called to my daughter and she came back and I told her what happened.
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She goes, Mom, I felt it too.
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Wow.
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So there was this lovely confirmation early on.
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And from that point on, I would it was my habit because I love dreams, as you said, a dream enthusiast.
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And so in the early morning, I would often just lay in bed and kind of take in the dream world and transition it to to waking life.
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And I started hearing Bob or sensing him.
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Let me say it that way.
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I would sense his presence.
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And I felt him sharing kind of little dream images with me, almost sensations or visuals of what it was like for him.
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And that just evolved into a conversation back and forth.
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And I would say within a week or 10 days, I got to the point where, you know, so much was happening there.
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And I would because I'm a writer, I want to write it down.
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So I get up.
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So we transitioned to a point where I would get up, have my coffee, get out the laptop and just start typing down our conversation back and forth.
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And that's really most of what you're reading in the book is that daily early morning conversation we were having.
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Yeah.
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And there's so many things I love about the book.
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But one of the things I love a lot is because I think it's 60 or 70 percent of people who have lost a spouse report some sort of afterlife communication with them and they they either deny it or are they scared to tell other people about it?
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And, you know, we really need to have these conversations where people realize this is not as uncommon as people think.
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Now, your level of detail with Bob is unusual.
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And I wonder how much of that you think is because of your work before as an animal communicator, because you're with animals.
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And I guess both living and dead.
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Yeah.
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OK.
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OK.
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Yeah.
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So, yeah, I had done that work for about 20 years.
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So I had a good foundation of how to do that.
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And it was just very natural for me.
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I never took a class, anything like that, it just kind of happened and evolved.
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And it's odd because when he died, I did not think of communicating with him that way.
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It was very kind of reached out to me, you know.
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And and so and I and I also empathize with people.
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You know, we doubt we doubt.
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I doubted it even after 20 years of doing this work.
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I was like, hmm, am I projecting this?
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Am I just missing him so much that I'm seeing what I want to see, hearing what I want to hear?
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You know, so we have to reckon with that.
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Or I did anyway.
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I have a strong inner skeptic.
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But so many things happened that confirmed to me.
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You're really hearing this.
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This is really real, you know, and then it became fascinating.
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And then I started following my curiosity and asking questions because it's something we all want to know, right?
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What happens when we die?
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It's what happens.
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Yeah, we do.
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And I tell you, I have a friend who just lost their their significant other a few weeks ago, and I feel so bad for her.
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And one thing she posted today, she said, you know, I don't get any signs.
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And she said, I just want to know that she's OK.
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You know, and that that's like the number one thing people want to know.
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It's like, is my loved one OK?
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And I think this book, even though Bob's situation is specific and we'll talk about some of those things, I think one of the things we can always say is our loved ones are OK.
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I think so.
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I think without a doubt, they're all OK.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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And so that, you know, Bob passed from a heart attack, a sudden, you know, a heart attack incident.
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Yeah, it's a heart incident.
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Yeah.
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So we you know, another thing we think is like our loved one.
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What was it like for them?
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You know, did they suffer?
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And I know you got some pretty good detail about Bob's passing.
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Yeah, I was I was fascinated by it.
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Like what happens?
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What were your experience?
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And he told me or shared with me visuals and actual feelings of his death numerous times.
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And it was almost like it was a crystal.
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Right.
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And he was showing me one facet one time, then another facet, then another.
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You know, and I think it evolved his understanding of that as he evolved there.
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So, yeah, he went kind of into I mean, the short version is he kind of went into this dark space, not a bad space at all.
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Just a separating space, you know, where he saw some geometric figures and then he was in a park like setting and his family was there and his friends were there and it was great.
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And then he thought of us, myself and my daughter.
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And he wished back and was looking at his body that kind of above, you know, and he realized it was it was too late.
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It was too far damaged to come back, you know.
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And so there was this kind of back and forth and then a gradual acceptance of being in, you know, the afterlife.
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Yeah.
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And I think his curiosity kicked in then, too, because he had a lot of really interesting experiences.
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And yeah, absolutely.
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You know, and I think, too, for people who are wondering again about their loved ones that have just passed.
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I think there is a sense and I've heard this from other near death experiences and others, a sense of being home, you know, and a sense of comfort and something.
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It's something you've always known, even though on Earth we forget.
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You know, we come here kind of with amnesia, right?
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And we forget things.
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And then you open, you expand in your spirit.
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And there's a sense of comfort there, I think.
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Yeah.
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And I think one of the things that the questions that people often have, because I studied near death experiences, a lot of had a lot of near death experiences on and people will say, well, this person had a near death experience and they were given a choice and they came back.
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I know if my loved one had a choice, they would come back.
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And I know some people say, no, I didn't choose to come back.
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I was forced to come back.
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But Bob's case is really interesting.
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It sounds like his it's like his body was too far damaged.
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And there is there is a limit to what our bodies can take.
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Right.
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So if our body is damaged too badly and we're out, we may not have the opportunity to come back.
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Yeah.
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And there was a sense that this was planned, if you will.
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Yeah, it was his path and it was his.
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And later on, there are some discussions in the book about and in the second book about it being his his choice, you know, really to go in that way at that point in time and because it had to happen.
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Yeah.
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I know you had Jonathan Ashford on and he talks about that a little bit.
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You know, how some things happen because they need to happen.
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Yeah.
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Well, from from our perspective, from the people up behind, death is always a tragedy from the perspective of the soul.
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It's it's not necessarily a tragedy.
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And it's a foregone conclusion that we're all going to pass at some point.
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It's just a matter of of when and how.
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Yeah.
00:18:12.740 --> 00:18:15.519
And it's and I tell people it's never enough time.
00:18:15.619 --> 00:18:18.200
You guys were together for the thirty three years.
00:18:18.379 --> 00:18:19.119
Thirty three years.
00:18:19.460 --> 00:18:19.680
Yeah.
00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:21.319
It's never enough time.
00:18:21.559 --> 00:18:23.680
I've had so many people say, I just want it more time.
00:18:23.680 --> 00:18:26.159
It's like, I don't know anybody that said it's enough.
00:18:26.519 --> 00:18:28.119
My my father in law passed.
00:18:28.359 --> 00:18:32.159
They've been together for, I don't know, I'm going to say about 60 years.
00:18:32.639 --> 00:18:34.019
Yeah, probably more than 60 years.
00:18:34.440 --> 00:18:36.399
My mother in law was like, it was too soon.
00:18:36.460 --> 00:18:37.480
I didn't expect him to go.
00:18:38.579 --> 00:18:40.519
So I think that's just always going to be the case.
00:18:40.819 --> 00:18:41.159
Yeah.
00:18:41.539 --> 00:18:41.779
Yeah.
00:18:42.319 --> 00:18:42.559
Yeah.
00:18:43.039 --> 00:18:46.299
You know, and and it's what we're used to and it's what we love.
00:18:46.700 --> 00:18:53.319
And so when that's gone, you're forced to really reevaluate everything about your life.
00:18:53.680 --> 00:18:54.079
Yeah.
00:18:55.079 --> 00:18:58.379
So for Bob, he finds himself on the other side.
00:18:58.980 --> 00:19:05.279
And so it sounds like it's kind of an evolution, you know, when he got there.
00:19:05.740 --> 00:19:12.639
And I think there's some things that are that are unique about our afterlife experience and some things are kind of, you know, kind of universal.
00:19:13.119 --> 00:19:13.779
And he talks about that.
00:19:13.919 --> 00:19:16.200
Now, he was a big outdoors guy, right?
00:19:16.339 --> 00:19:19.220
So describe the environment he found himself in.
00:19:19.519 --> 00:19:21.980
Yeah, well, it was a park like setting.
00:19:21.980 --> 00:19:27.178
And he had every year he loved to go on this hunt by himself, a solitary hunt for moose.
00:19:27.899 --> 00:19:31.759
And I had just bought him this really nice tent and a titanium lightweight stove.
00:19:32.218 --> 00:19:33.500
And, you know, so anyway.
00:19:34.079 --> 00:19:36.579
And I was telling my daughter, because we're looking at it in the garage.
00:19:36.740 --> 00:19:40.599
I'm like, your dad is going to be so irritated that he didn't get to go on his hunt, right?
00:19:41.119 --> 00:19:45.139
And the next morning in that in between space, he said, I'm going to go on the hunt.
00:19:45.599 --> 00:19:49.279
I'm like, what are you going to do that?
00:19:49.799 --> 00:19:59.439
And he did proceed to tell me about this in between space, if you will, kind of between physical life and and the afterlife.
00:20:00.159 --> 00:20:03.459
And it's kind of a melding of that of that space.
00:20:04.240 --> 00:20:05.740
And he did go on his hunt.
00:20:06.139 --> 00:20:09.379
And it wasn't a hunt in the sense that he was going to kill animals.
00:20:09.639 --> 00:20:14.219
It was a hunt that he was going to deepen in awareness with animals.
00:20:14.459 --> 00:20:15.759
It was very unique.
00:20:15.939 --> 00:20:17.439
He showed me how he was pointing his finger.
00:20:17.439 --> 00:20:23.639
And if the animal saw him and looked into him, he would have the opportunity to learn about the animal.
00:20:24.339 --> 00:20:31.719
So it's so interesting, you know, how that in itself, I think, was an evolution and a deepening of what it means to hunt and be hunted.
00:20:32.299 --> 00:20:39.979
And that theme was consistent for him for about a month because he went on a hunt with his other selves.
00:20:40.939 --> 00:20:44.079
And at one point, he said to me, you know what, I'm hunting, right?
00:20:44.259 --> 00:20:44.879
And I go, what?
00:20:45.219 --> 00:20:46.559
He goes, I'm hunting myself.
00:20:47.439 --> 00:20:50.059
I was like, yeah, you're hunting your deeper self.
00:20:50.339 --> 00:20:57.119
You know, you're looking for that deeper sense of connection between your many aged selves, between you and physical, you and spirit.
00:20:57.659 --> 00:21:03.919
So, yeah, it was that was also an evolution of the way that he would see the world.
00:21:04.059 --> 00:21:16.419
Yeah, it was just a really interesting concept because you talked about his other selves, so he was seeing himself at various ages and actually meeting with these with these beings that were that were him.
00:21:16.419 --> 00:21:17.179
Yeah.
00:21:17.699 --> 00:21:17.799
Yeah.
00:21:17.899 --> 00:21:20.019
And that's kind of how he did his life review.
00:21:20.259 --> 00:21:31.699
And again, it's I will say I will preface this by saying Bob was very clear numerous times that everybody's afterlife experience is unique to them, to how they understand the world and their personality.
00:21:32.559 --> 00:21:35.879
And so Bob was very much a do-it-yourself kind of guy.
00:21:36.259 --> 00:21:39.939
So he was going to do his life review the way he was going to do it.
00:21:39.959 --> 00:21:40.159
Right.
00:21:40.659 --> 00:21:40.759
Yeah.
00:21:40.759 --> 00:21:52.500
And that's one way that he did it was meeting with his other aged selves, especially younger selves that had trauma or that had, you know, misunderstandings in life.
00:21:53.079 --> 00:22:03.799
And he was kind of able to to follow his challenges in life to those earlier selves and to kind of see how they developed and how those challenges affected him later in life.
00:22:04.259 --> 00:22:07.079
So, yeah, it was a type of self-healing, I might call it.
00:22:07.479 --> 00:22:07.579
Yeah.
00:22:08.539 --> 00:22:14.519
And that's what, you know, it was interesting because it's not a life review in terms of like judgment or stuff.
00:22:14.639 --> 00:22:19.000
And again, as you said, it's everybody's is probably going to be different.
00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:31.559
But I thought his was really interesting because it was this kind of integration of these various selves and also introduces some ideas that really just blow my mind, like parallel timelines and alternate lives and stuff like that.
00:22:31.659 --> 00:22:36.279
So some of that stuff kind of kind of comes in there, too, and gets explained at least a little bit for me.
00:22:36.619 --> 00:22:37.059
Yeah.
00:22:37.359 --> 00:22:44.319
Yeah, that was interesting because he did introduce the idea of alternate lives, past lives, we might call them.
00:22:44.799 --> 00:22:47.299
And what was interesting to me?
00:22:47.459 --> 00:22:48.939
I mean, I thought it was educational, right?
00:22:49.039 --> 00:22:50.559
Oh, what was our past life together?
00:22:50.779 --> 00:22:52.240
That's how you sort of begin, right?
00:22:52.699 --> 00:23:02.519
But when we went into those experiences, Bob was of the opinion that we could talk to our alternate selves in those lives and help them.
00:23:03.179 --> 00:23:08.039
And I thought it just deepened the experience for me because we were actually affecting changes.
00:23:08.639 --> 00:23:11.959
Maybe you'd say it throughout time, throughout different realities.
00:23:12.679 --> 00:23:14.959
And and those cells were affecting us.
00:23:15.579 --> 00:23:21.779
And I think that just was a whole different way of looking at reality and how we perceive the world.
00:23:22.639 --> 00:23:22.740
Yeah.
00:23:23.519 --> 00:23:26.019
So you you kind of touched on this earlier.
00:23:26.479 --> 00:23:29.419
Your process became like you would you would wake up in the morning.
00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:33.079
You would you would have these in between stages also.
00:23:33.399 --> 00:23:37.339
So you you actually experienced Bob in dreams, I think in between stage.
00:23:37.339 --> 00:23:42.199
And then you'd sit down with your laptop and you would you would continue the conversation with them there.
00:23:42.919 --> 00:23:43.019
Right.
00:23:43.299 --> 00:23:43.539
Right.
00:23:44.019 --> 00:23:49.399
Yeah, I wanted to get it all down because so much, you know, so much of it was kind of wispy and yeah.
00:23:50.000 --> 00:23:57.579
And later I was really appreciating because little things that were talked about one day were then picked up in another and kind of carried through.
00:23:57.879 --> 00:24:04.379
And yeah, it was a whole it was a whole connected thread that was divided up by days.
00:24:04.879 --> 00:24:05.319
Yeah.
00:24:05.319 --> 00:24:10.699
And like, you know, you mentioned the editor in yourself and the I guess the temptation to organize about love.
00:24:10.819 --> 00:24:17.459
I love the organic flow there because we kind of we get we get to go on this journey with you as you and Bob are going on.
00:24:17.579 --> 00:24:21.379
And we see Bob his his involvement in the afterlife.
00:24:21.679 --> 00:24:30.039
And and because there were there were some guides there also, but they seem to kind of kind of step back because it sounds like Bob is like, I'm going to do it myself kind of guys.
00:24:30.039 --> 00:24:32.199
And they're like, we're here if we need if you need it.
00:24:32.219 --> 00:24:34.679
Yeah, yeah, they definitely were there.
00:24:34.679 --> 00:24:36.759
And he refers to them often.
00:24:37.119 --> 00:24:42.339
And and sometimes he would bring in guides like experts, you know, to do a guest appearance.
00:24:43.719 --> 00:24:49.279
But I'll say one other thing about that, which was in the beginning, Bob's voice was very much as I knew it on on earth.
00:24:49.539 --> 00:24:51.559
It was very, you know, very certain way.
00:24:52.019 --> 00:24:58.219
And as he evolved, which I really think is an expansion of consciousness, his voice changed.
00:24:58.740 --> 00:25:07.099
And sometimes he would use words or phrases that would just I would be so surprised because it wasn't like him.
00:25:07.699 --> 00:25:11.939
And oftentimes he would say things that were outside my the way I saw life.
00:25:12.679 --> 00:25:20.379
And that was, again, a little proof like this is another, you know, this is this is him in an extended state talking to me and sharing information.
00:25:21.099 --> 00:25:22.439
And we really evolved together.
00:25:22.839 --> 00:25:25.759
I think it was incredibly helpful for my own journey.
00:25:26.319 --> 00:25:27.859
And here's an interesting thing.
00:25:28.399 --> 00:25:30.619
I think I was helpful for him.
00:25:31.219 --> 00:25:33.959
And I think that's something we don't often think about with life.
00:25:34.279 --> 00:25:37.399
You know, we tend to think, oh, that person's totally expanded.
00:25:37.679 --> 00:25:41.240
But in my experience with Bob, that's not the case.
00:25:41.559 --> 00:25:51.479
You know, that there's still evolution on that side and there's still life planning and life, you know, events that affect us in that world.
00:25:52.240 --> 00:25:55.299
And so it was really helped.
00:25:55.579 --> 00:25:56.799
I mean, he said it to me several times.
00:25:56.799 --> 00:26:05.719
It was really helpful that I was there, both as an anchor in here to help him remember certain things, but also to help him expand.
00:26:06.659 --> 00:26:08.259
Yeah, it's just he was helping me expand.
00:26:08.719 --> 00:26:15.819
And that's really the beauty of relationship, isn't it, of a relationship founded in love and having that expansion.
00:26:16.519 --> 00:26:17.500
Yes, exactly.
00:26:17.839 --> 00:26:24.919
So, yeah, again, one of the things I really loved about the book was, again, him with all the you know, his his younger selves and stuff.
00:26:25.099 --> 00:26:27.319
So that all those they're all still in us.
00:26:27.319 --> 00:26:28.839
They still make us up.
00:26:28.939 --> 00:26:33.979
But also the connection again, that he they still need it with you in order to further his expansion.
00:26:34.939 --> 00:26:38.279
And, you know, again, you use these various vehicles communicating.
00:26:38.699 --> 00:26:42.319
One image I really loved was the image of the bridge that you talked about.
00:26:42.819 --> 00:26:43.139
Yeah.
00:26:43.359 --> 00:26:44.839
So tell people about the bridge.
00:26:45.139 --> 00:26:50.839
Yeah, well, it just became a really good symbol of what was happening.
00:26:50.839 --> 00:26:55.179
And, you know, it was the bridge between the physical world and the afterlife.
00:26:55.179 --> 00:26:56.119
Mm hmm.
00:26:56.500 --> 00:26:59.259
And we would travel back and forth and kind of meet on that bridge.
00:26:59.539 --> 00:27:06.639
It was as if our conversations were that way, because it is it's a segue of meeting between, you know, physicality and spirit.
00:27:08.019 --> 00:27:20.979
And and there were a lot of different experiences, but sometimes I found I could only go so far, you know, and he would say, yeah, it's like dreaming, like dream, you own dreams and then you have to bring them back.
00:27:20.979 --> 00:27:28.459
So it was a little bit of a of bustle work involved in kind of opening to that and then bringing the images back.
00:27:29.459 --> 00:27:39.039
And there's also the notion that that other people had made bridges between the living and the dead and that this was a bridge and that it was very much for everyone.
00:27:39.740 --> 00:27:44.979
You know, so you're welcome to come on this bridge because it's a bridge of connection and it is for everyone.
00:27:45.219 --> 00:27:52.439
And the more that we do that, you know, as a world, the more we openings we give, whether it's film or or music or art.
00:27:52.899 --> 00:27:57.899
You know, there's a lot of those bridges present that help us move between those states.
00:27:58.919 --> 00:28:01.819
And Bob was always the opinion that we are of spirit.
00:28:02.019 --> 00:28:03.039
We're in spirit world.
00:28:03.500 --> 00:28:10.699
We just have forgotten, you know, the bridge is something that helps us reconnect, not only with loved ones, but with ourselves.
00:28:11.399 --> 00:28:18.500
Yeah, you know, you talked about earlier about maybe being a little skeptical was am I making this up or is my imagination?
00:28:19.859 --> 00:28:28.899
And one of the things that really makes me think it's not your imagination, it's just the concepts in it are so profound and they resonate so much.
00:28:29.059 --> 00:28:31.079
And as you said, it's kind of more like a remembering.
00:28:31.979 --> 00:28:36.299
So when people read and hear these things, they're like, yeah, that makes sense to me.
00:28:36.399 --> 00:28:38.419
And that's that's just the feeling I got when I read the book.
00:28:38.759 --> 00:28:39.559
Yeah, thanks.
00:28:39.779 --> 00:28:41.779
Yeah, I think and I think that's true in life.
00:28:41.959 --> 00:28:44.740
You know, we resonate with certain things and we know it's true.
00:28:44.740 --> 00:28:48.519
We don't need it scientifically documented because we know it in our heart.
00:28:48.519 --> 00:28:49.479
We know it with our being.
00:28:49.879 --> 00:28:49.979
Right.
00:28:50.459 --> 00:28:50.559
Yeah.
00:28:50.619 --> 00:28:51.559
So we feel that.
00:28:51.899 --> 00:29:01.939
And I and yeah, I think that's why books like this or artworks or or even songs a lot of times can help us move into that space, which is more open, more.
00:29:02.059 --> 00:29:02.339
Yeah.
00:29:03.219 --> 00:29:03.319
Yeah.
00:29:03.619 --> 00:29:06.939
And so I don't know if you ever heard of the books called The Team.
00:29:07.359 --> 00:29:09.899
It's a series of books by a woman named Frances Key.
00:29:10.039 --> 00:29:13.799
And her mother had passed in the spirit and her mother channeled these books through her.
00:29:13.939 --> 00:29:15.299
It's a trilogy.
00:29:15.639 --> 00:29:17.019
And there's there's a fourth book also.
00:29:17.919 --> 00:29:25.779
And your book reminded me so much of that because it's a lot of these same concepts and concepts that to me are kind of like beyond human concepts.
00:29:25.779 --> 00:29:29.959
Like we can talk to our younger selves and help heal our past.
00:29:30.139 --> 00:29:33.019
I'm like, that's not something I would come up with on my own.
00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:33.679
Right.
00:29:33.879 --> 00:29:34.099
Right.
00:29:34.379 --> 00:29:34.740
Yeah.
00:29:35.219 --> 00:29:39.839
I mean, the whole experience for me was an opening of possibilities.
00:29:39.839 --> 00:29:44.299
And I think when we're in that space, we can take in a lot more.
00:29:44.939 --> 00:29:45.339
Yeah.
00:29:46.119 --> 00:29:46.219
Yeah.
00:29:46.959 --> 00:29:54.879
So as you're going through this experience, I have to tell you, I'm going through it with you as I listen to books because I walk every morning.
00:29:54.939 --> 00:30:02.899
So I was listening to the book and then I get this feeling like, OK, Bob's kind of starting to pull away a little bit and saying this is going to be coming to an end.
00:30:03.019 --> 00:30:04.699
And I got kind of sad.
00:30:04.819 --> 00:30:05.979
How did you feel when that happened?
00:30:06.579 --> 00:30:06.759
Yeah.
00:30:07.259 --> 00:30:09.479
Well, let's talk about more in the second book.
00:30:10.659 --> 00:30:14.000
And yeah, he was wanting to evolve.
00:30:14.399 --> 00:30:18.919
And, you know, it's like this is my perception of the afterlife from him.
00:30:19.139 --> 00:30:22.459
There's this entry realm where souls come and they kind of get acquainted.
00:30:22.619 --> 00:30:23.719
They meet their family, friends.
00:30:23.959 --> 00:30:27.399
You know, maybe they still think they're eating and sleeping and things like that.
00:30:27.539 --> 00:30:30.759
And then it becomes, you know, more open and more expansive.
00:30:30.979 --> 00:30:37.159
And you can do different things in the afterlife, you know, experience different scenes and different things.
00:30:37.259 --> 00:30:38.639
And then it becomes more formless.
00:30:38.639 --> 00:30:39.039
Right.
00:30:39.039 --> 00:30:46.699
So those places are he was of the opinion that when he goes to a formal estate, it would be very difficult to communicate.
00:30:46.859 --> 00:30:50.019
So I think he stayed in that entry level place.
00:30:50.339 --> 00:30:54.139
You know, and yeah, I didn't I at that point in my life.
00:30:54.139 --> 00:30:57.539
That was again, the book is the first eight weeks after he's died.
00:30:57.899 --> 00:30:58.000
Right.
00:30:58.099 --> 00:30:58.240
Right.
00:30:58.500 --> 00:30:59.099
Not that long.
00:30:59.399 --> 00:31:02.919
And that was the highlight of my day is to be able to talk to Bob.
00:31:03.199 --> 00:31:05.259
I was in this open, hard, expanded space.
00:31:05.579 --> 00:31:06.479
Everything was fine.
00:31:06.479 --> 00:31:14.039
And then come 10 o'clock after I looked at it and corrected for grammar and punctuation, I'd be like, oh, no, I'm in the day.
00:31:14.579 --> 00:31:15.559
Yeah, it's despair.
00:31:16.000 --> 00:31:19.699
Now I have a sadness, this loss, this heaviness.
00:31:20.019 --> 00:31:20.119
Right.
00:31:22.339 --> 00:31:24.699
So I forgot my train of thought here.
00:31:24.839 --> 00:31:25.919
What were we talking about?
00:31:25.959 --> 00:31:30.779
We were talking about when when Bob started saying that, you know, eventually he was going to be moving.
00:31:31.299 --> 00:31:31.399
Yeah.
00:31:31.839 --> 00:31:33.159
So he wanted to expand.
00:31:33.159 --> 00:31:39.279
And I understood that and I didn't want to keep him, you know, even though I wanted to keep him, I didn't want to keep him.
00:31:39.799 --> 00:31:43.019
And so there was a sense of him going to go on this adventure.
00:31:44.199 --> 00:31:45.659
And that is covered later.
00:31:46.099 --> 00:31:47.919
And he does go on an adventure.
00:31:48.639 --> 00:31:50.599
And spoiler alert, he comes back.
00:31:52.199 --> 00:31:52.299
Yeah.
00:31:52.859 --> 00:32:02.000
So and I think that was because somewhat because of these books and because of wanting to help people.
00:32:02.000 --> 00:32:12.679
And I think that actually the guide, some of his guides there were very encouraging, you know, not in the beginning, because in the beginning it was it was just us talking something.
00:32:13.559 --> 00:32:15.919
The bridge became real.
00:32:16.159 --> 00:32:17.779
It became more.
00:32:20.859 --> 00:32:30.079
How to say it, you know, I want to say concrete, it wasn't concrete, but it was metaphorically, you know, real for people to travel.
00:32:30.079 --> 00:32:35.199
And that that was an important thing and that is an important thing for all of us.
00:32:35.459 --> 00:32:35.859
Yeah.
00:32:36.419 --> 00:32:39.359
So, you know, I work with a lot of people who have lost spouses.
00:32:40.059 --> 00:32:54.039
And it's actually read a little short story about one day in heaven because I'm almost all my clients like if I could just spend a day with them, if I could just spend an hour with them just to see what their life is like, you know, then I'd be OK.
00:32:55.179 --> 00:32:58.199
And I love that, you know, you like here it is.
00:32:58.199 --> 00:32:59.859
I had eight weeks of this.
00:33:00.339 --> 00:33:03.339
But you're very honest with the fact it's like, OK, I would have this.
00:33:03.679 --> 00:33:05.119
You're on this high in the morning.
00:33:05.179 --> 00:33:06.439
You're having these dreams.
00:33:06.479 --> 00:33:07.919
You're having this in between state.
00:33:08.099 --> 00:33:10.039
You're having your coffee and you're in your writing.
00:33:10.039 --> 00:33:13.539
But then at 10 o'clock, you close the laptop and here you are.
00:33:14.339 --> 00:33:15.379
Well, yeah.
00:33:16.359 --> 00:33:16.839
Yeah.
00:33:17.399 --> 00:33:25.839
And but I will say, and especially for listeners who are going through grief, you know, for me, what happened was the universe conspired.
00:33:25.839 --> 00:33:28.959
All of my animal communication clients went away.
00:33:29.099 --> 00:33:31.079
I didn't have anything on my schedule.
00:33:31.659 --> 00:33:33.319
I'm a very proactive person.
00:33:33.559 --> 00:33:34.819
So I joined some grief groups.
00:33:35.039 --> 00:33:36.199
I read the grief books.
00:33:36.799 --> 00:33:46.159
But more importantly than that, I sat with those emotions because I made that my practice, my meditation, if you will, to really feel that grief, to feel that loss.
00:33:46.559 --> 00:33:47.079
And, you know, it does.
00:33:47.219 --> 00:33:48.139
It kind of comes in waves.
00:33:48.439 --> 00:33:49.919
So, you know, for a while you're fine.
00:33:49.979 --> 00:33:51.500
You're having lunch with friends and it's good.
00:33:51.859 --> 00:33:53.919
And then you come home and you know.
00:33:53.919 --> 00:33:59.839
And so I would really feel that sadness in my body and and just sit with that.
00:34:00.399 --> 00:34:06.799
And and then things come up, you know, old thoughts, old losses, old feelings of being abandoned.
00:34:06.959 --> 00:34:10.260
All of that comes up, you know, as you know, it's a process, right?
00:34:11.059 --> 00:34:13.320
And you're really tapping into it.
00:34:13.480 --> 00:34:25.440
I mean, for me, then it became really helpful to do that because I knew I was clearing things and I was making light of and I really move past my grief relatively quickly.
00:34:26.039 --> 00:34:32.639
And I think it was because of that, not only the conversations with Bob, but also because, you know, doing the work, doing the shadow work, if you will.
00:34:33.380 --> 00:34:33.480
Yeah.
00:34:33.800 --> 00:34:37.139
And that's that is so helpful.
00:34:37.639 --> 00:34:41.059
Yeah, I think that's again, that's a lesson I want.
00:34:41.240 --> 00:34:42.460
People are for me anyway.
00:34:43.559 --> 00:34:52.699
We can have these experiences, you know, and everybody, again, most of us, if I just got, you know, one dream or one sign or whatever then I wouldn't have to go through all the junk.
00:34:53.000 --> 00:34:54.920
And it's like, you know, we still have to go through the junk.
00:34:55.280 --> 00:34:57.059
Yeah, it's an inside job.
00:34:57.240 --> 00:34:58.800
You still got your stuff to go through.
00:34:58.840 --> 00:34:59.139
Yeah.
00:34:59.539 --> 00:35:02.559
Each of us, everybody, you know, and Bob had his stuff to go through.
00:35:02.760 --> 00:35:06.719
You know, he had his ways of looking at life and kind of what.
00:35:06.860 --> 00:35:07.659
And he wanted to.
00:35:07.820 --> 00:35:08.860
He wanted to go back there.
00:35:09.099 --> 00:35:13.119
And he did tell me, you know, there's some people who come here and they just they reincarnate right away.
00:35:13.199 --> 00:35:14.440
They don't want to have to do that.
00:35:14.440 --> 00:35:14.780
Right.
00:35:15.139 --> 00:35:16.300
Just like people here.
00:35:16.460 --> 00:35:24.699
You know, there's a lot of us who we divert, we drink or we eat whatever we do to avoid having that conversation with our deeper self.
00:35:25.619 --> 00:35:26.619
And so and it's a choice.
00:35:27.139 --> 00:35:28.639
I don't know that there's a right or wrong.
00:35:28.840 --> 00:35:31.360
I think it's just a choice of what we want to do.
00:35:32.000 --> 00:35:36.539
And I was very I wanted to I wanted to go into the depths of it.
00:35:36.800 --> 00:35:49.099
And yeah, well, and choice is a really a really good word to talk about here, too, because I remember right after my daughter passed, it was around the time that the book Afterlife and Billy Fingers was really popular.
00:35:49.099 --> 00:35:50.360
Oh, yeah, that's a good one.
00:35:50.920 --> 00:35:52.780
And a friend of mine, you know, recommended me the book.
00:35:52.780 --> 00:35:53.619
She has the best book.
00:35:53.800 --> 00:35:54.619
You know, you should read this book.
00:35:54.719 --> 00:35:55.860
And and I read it.
00:35:56.000 --> 00:35:59.420
And at the end, it's like Billy becomes so enlightened that he just goes away.
00:35:59.519 --> 00:36:01.719
And I was I was so mad.
00:36:02.340 --> 00:36:10.360
It's like this is not what I want to be reading, you know, right after my daughter passed away, because a lot of us feel like we don't we don't want to miss them.
00:36:10.360 --> 00:36:10.599
Right.
00:36:11.159 --> 00:36:11.300
Yeah.
00:36:11.460 --> 00:36:12.800
So there is there is a choice.
00:36:13.179 --> 00:36:16.780
And I think there is at least from my my understanding.
00:36:16.780 --> 00:36:23.240
You tell me if you think this if it's different from your understanding, it's like we go to this in between place and we do some of this work and stuff.
00:36:23.380 --> 00:36:30.800
And then sometimes people will go to the next level, but then they can still come back, but just they're not as attached to the earth as they were before.
00:36:31.360 --> 00:36:32.180
Mm hmm.
00:36:32.660 --> 00:36:34.640
They come back to the afterlife.
00:36:34.840 --> 00:36:35.780
You mean kind of that beginning.
00:36:36.180 --> 00:36:38.880
Yeah, they can come back and still communicate with us, is what I mean.
00:36:39.220 --> 00:36:39.940
Yeah, that's gone.
00:36:40.499 --> 00:36:42.120
It was really interesting with Bob.
00:36:42.280 --> 00:36:49.999
And I can really only speak to his experience was that he did go on this voyage to this other space, this other realm and came back.
00:36:50.220 --> 00:37:03.360
And when he left, you know, he was sort of like he would he would talk a little sassy about the guides, you know, like they're the guys again, you know, and make fun of him in a little bit of a way, not in a bad way.
00:37:03.360 --> 00:37:04.240
And he went back.
00:37:04.380 --> 00:37:07.039
And then when he came back, he's like, I think I'm going to be a guide.
00:37:09.760 --> 00:37:10.200
Right.
00:37:10.720 --> 00:37:21.680
And that's that became his work for a while is to be a guide because it I think I don't know, again, I can't speak to the afterlife in terms of my own memory.
00:37:22.039 --> 00:37:28.300
But I think with some, there is an expansion and then a very purposeful coming back.
00:37:28.559 --> 00:37:34.300
Whereas other people like the Billy Finger story, you know, just went and dissipated right into the big beyond.
00:37:34.640 --> 00:37:35.519
That's a choice.
00:37:36.180 --> 00:37:42.559
And like I said, some people come back reincarnate if you want to call it that or go to alternate lives, however you want to see it.
00:37:42.559 --> 00:37:44.640
You know, there's again, many possibilities.
00:37:45.400 --> 00:37:45.500
Yeah.
00:37:45.740 --> 00:37:45.960
Yeah.
00:37:46.140 --> 00:37:53.059
And so I think sometimes we want to pigeonhole it and say this is what it's like, but just like life on Earth, you know, we all make different different choices.
00:37:53.240 --> 00:37:54.180
We all do different things.
00:37:54.180 --> 00:38:01.720
And, you know, as I was hearing about Bob's afterlife, like this probably not be mine, spending time in a tent.
00:38:01.960 --> 00:38:04.360
It's not something that would really appeal to me.
00:38:04.420 --> 00:38:08.500
But, you know, I could see it's like, well, this is this is the way I experienced Earth.
00:38:08.800 --> 00:38:11.180
So this is like the next the next phase of that.
00:38:11.180 --> 00:38:17.539
And when people have near death experiences, sometimes people will criticize and say, well, is it is it a forest or is it a beach?
00:38:17.820 --> 00:38:21.559
Is it, you know, is it a city or is it is it, you know, whatever?
00:38:21.640 --> 00:38:26.360
It's like it's I think it's customized what we what we need to experience and we want to experience.
00:38:26.700 --> 00:38:26.800
Yeah.
00:38:27.019 --> 00:38:27.180
Yeah.
00:38:27.200 --> 00:38:28.519
The way you want to experience it.
00:38:28.860 --> 00:38:28.960
Yeah.
00:38:29.220 --> 00:38:34.599
You know, and some people have dark afterlives, you know, and they they do feel unworthy or judged in life.
00:38:34.599 --> 00:38:38.940
And that becomes a little bit of a scenario to to deal with.
00:38:38.940 --> 00:38:41.360
And Bob showed me a few, few of those.
00:38:41.519 --> 00:38:43.420
And I think he helped in a few of those.
00:38:43.720 --> 00:38:48.460
And, yeah, it wasn't his experience, but he was also very much an explorer.
00:38:48.460 --> 00:38:52.680
So he was really interested in different scenes and how different people did things.
00:38:52.680 --> 00:38:54.079
And he was still talking.
00:38:54.220 --> 00:38:55.940
He was always asking people how they died.
00:38:56.460 --> 00:38:58.160
You know, what happened?
00:38:58.240 --> 00:38:58.960
What's their story?
00:38:59.099 --> 00:39:04.800
And I think that's a common a little thread there in that in that introductory realm of the afterlife.
00:39:04.880 --> 00:39:05.320
Yeah.
00:39:05.900 --> 00:39:06.000
Yeah.
00:39:06.220 --> 00:39:07.940
So so he was experienced together.
00:39:07.940 --> 00:39:12.079
Other spirits of people across over and he experienced your mother, I believe.
00:39:12.099 --> 00:39:12.559
Yeah.
00:39:12.700 --> 00:39:18.460
My mom had passed away a number and he had a number of years ago and he had always had a close relationship with her.
00:39:18.740 --> 00:39:21.519
And so that was interesting and kind of put me in touch with her.
00:39:22.900 --> 00:39:25.880
And I think when she passed away, I was OK with it.
00:39:26.059 --> 00:39:28.900
She was kind of in a space where she was ready to go.
00:39:29.400 --> 00:39:30.400
And that was good.
00:39:30.900 --> 00:39:34.519
But I realized when he put me in touch with her that I hadn't fully grieved that.
00:39:35.120 --> 00:39:42.880
And so it was a really good opportunity to talk with her and to, you know, allow that kind of stuff to come up.
00:39:43.640 --> 00:39:45.220
And yeah, yeah.
00:39:45.780 --> 00:39:47.800
And yeah, that's lovely.
00:39:48.120 --> 00:39:48.680
Yeah.
00:39:48.960 --> 00:40:07.320
So for so again, you, I think I'm not going to say I had an advantage, but you had preparation, I guess, by doing this work and being maybe open to more subtle energies and and understand and expand the consciousness for people that are going through this now, that what would your advice be to them?
00:40:07.680 --> 00:40:11.420
They're like, because I know I can hear people right now going, how do I get some of this?
00:40:11.519 --> 00:40:14.660
How do I how do I start to experience this or open my mind to it?
00:40:14.920 --> 00:40:15.599
Do you have any suggestions?
00:40:16.300 --> 00:40:16.519
I do.
00:40:16.740 --> 00:40:20.140
It's similar to what I tell people when I do animal communication workshops.
00:40:20.380 --> 00:40:23.420
It's the first step is let go of trying.
00:40:25.340 --> 00:40:26.620
Because that's a big one there, right?
00:40:27.039 --> 00:40:27.900
Oh, dry so hard.
00:40:28.320 --> 00:40:30.620
So you want to get to a quiet space.
00:40:30.620 --> 00:40:39.079
You know, if it's for you in nature, if it's in the evening, laying in your bed or in the early morning and just be open.
00:40:39.079 --> 00:40:45.280
It's really cultivating a space of openness, a space of I'm ready to receive.
00:40:45.780 --> 00:40:46.820
I don't have to receive.
00:40:47.000 --> 00:40:47.940
I don't know how I'm going to receive.
00:40:48.140 --> 00:40:48.420
I don't know.
00:40:48.579 --> 00:40:49.559
I don't let go.
00:40:50.700 --> 00:40:51.800
And I'm just going to be open.
00:40:52.599 --> 00:40:57.320
And I would say to begin, speak to your beloved, whatever you want to say.
00:40:57.940 --> 00:41:00.280
Everything you want to say from your heart, you just start talking.
00:41:00.620 --> 00:41:03.579
Sometimes that in itself is so helpful.
00:41:04.380 --> 00:41:10.140
And then when you allow that to come out and you allow there to be an open space, you might not hear right then.
00:41:10.519 --> 00:41:19.220
But maybe that day a feather comes down, maybe that day you see a flower in a certain way or somebody says something to you that your your beloved used to say.
00:41:19.680 --> 00:41:25.840
You know, there are these very subtle signs and they come when we're not expecting them, when we're not trying so hard.
00:41:26.360 --> 00:41:27.840
You know, so that's what I would say.
00:41:27.960 --> 00:41:28.840
I'd be let go.
00:41:29.420 --> 00:41:30.500
Speak from your heart.
00:41:30.900 --> 00:41:34.579
Be open and and welcome.
00:41:34.980 --> 00:41:35.780
Welcome what comes.
00:41:36.820 --> 00:41:47.380
Yeah, well, that's just one of the first signs you said you got was you were walking around that lake and it was it was you were open to the fact that there's just that that moment kind of presented itself to you.
00:41:48.420 --> 00:42:07.519
Yeah, so just being open to those things, I find that people it's really funny because people tell me I haven't had any signs but then we'll continue to talk and then I'll say, well, except for, you know, the fact that I see the number eleven eleven all the time or this cardinal has been coming and sitting outside my window every day for, you know, for a month or, you know, stuff like that.
00:42:07.579 --> 00:42:11.800
So the signs are not necessarily huge, miraculous things.
00:42:12.559 --> 00:42:16.960
And Bob talked about like you had some animal communications also, right?
00:42:17.720 --> 00:42:18.300
Yeah, yeah.
00:42:18.620 --> 00:42:26.180
He showed up kind of sounds weird, but he would he kind of showed up a few times as an animal and it was an unusual situation.
00:42:26.180 --> 00:42:47.440
And from doing animal communication work, I can tell you this does happen a lot is that well, not a lot, but it happens that those in spirit world will sometimes use an animal to look at us a certain way or to show up at a time when, excuse me, you wouldn't expect them there or you wouldn't, you know, it would be a space that you wouldn't.
00:42:47.660 --> 00:42:49.760
And again, we go back to that resonance.
00:42:50.059 --> 00:42:52.740
There's this inner knowing you have and it is subtle.
00:42:53.079 --> 00:42:54.220
You know, you're like, what's that?
00:42:54.220 --> 00:42:55.940
Why is that cat looking at me?
00:42:56.180 --> 00:42:56.280
Right.
00:42:56.820 --> 00:43:00.579
Or you look up at birds and there's a certain movement of the birds.
00:43:00.840 --> 00:43:01.640
It can be anything.
00:43:02.579 --> 00:43:04.760
And it just it let me say it this way.
00:43:04.760 --> 00:43:05.980
It speaks to our heart.
00:43:06.480 --> 00:43:06.620
Yeah.
00:43:07.180 --> 00:43:13.440
You know, so if you can be open with your heart, that's the sweet spot really is.
00:43:13.500 --> 00:43:14.760
Yeah, it reminds me.
00:43:15.000 --> 00:43:16.260
I hadn't thought about this in a while.
00:43:16.420 --> 00:43:19.240
It was it was a few months after my daughter, Shane, had passed away.
00:43:20.300 --> 00:43:26.200
My daughter, Kale, was sitting on our deck and I was in my office here working and Kayla, I think she sent me a picture.
00:43:26.360 --> 00:43:33.700
She sent me a picture of like this butterfly and I went out there and there's this butterfly that it flew around her for like half an hour.
00:43:33.800 --> 00:43:37.340
Just kept circling around, landing on the rail right next to her.
00:43:37.480 --> 00:43:38.440
It let her touch it.
00:43:39.019 --> 00:43:43.460
And, you know, it was like we both knew that, you know, that that was Shana coming through now.
00:43:43.720 --> 00:43:43.920
Yeah.
00:43:45.120 --> 00:43:45.980
And it's interesting.
00:43:46.099 --> 00:43:54.900
I think, Bobby, like you can kind of like it's kind of like a mind belt, I guess, with with the animal that they if they allow you to and kind of influence its behavior.
00:43:56.360 --> 00:43:58.780
That's what he said from from the spirit world.
00:43:59.079 --> 00:44:03.760
It's like a I don't know if I'd say a mind belt, but it is like that.
00:44:03.940 --> 00:44:06.940
It's an ability to influence.
00:44:07.039 --> 00:44:13.240
Bobby is the word influence in animal, you know, and it's gentle and it's not a possession or anything weird like that.
00:44:13.240 --> 00:44:14.440
It's just a very gentle.
00:44:14.860 --> 00:44:23.140
And I think animals are often open to that, you know, because they're more wide open than than we are and more in tune with nature.
00:44:23.579 --> 00:44:26.640
And so there comes a desire to connect with somebody.
00:44:27.000 --> 00:44:28.320
And sometimes they allow that.
00:44:28.760 --> 00:44:28.860
Right.
00:44:29.320 --> 00:44:29.519
Yeah.
00:44:29.840 --> 00:44:29.980
Yeah.
00:44:30.059 --> 00:44:32.539
So it's very natural and loving.
00:44:33.340 --> 00:44:33.860
Yeah.
00:44:34.039 --> 00:44:36.760
Well, it reminds me of there's a woman that I know.
00:44:36.880 --> 00:44:37.680
Her name is Suzanne Wilson.
00:44:37.960 --> 00:44:42.180
She's a she's a medium and she teaches people how to connect in spirit.
00:44:42.360 --> 00:44:50.120
And one thing she talks about, she says you understand from your love inside the people, they have to learn how to communicate with the animals and to make that connection.
00:44:50.480 --> 00:44:53.099
So some people are better at that than others are.
00:44:53.240 --> 00:44:57.579
And then I guess they they have to or I hate when we say they because it's us.
00:44:57.940 --> 00:44:59.500
When we cross over, we are them.
00:45:00.120 --> 00:45:03.440
But we have to learn how to make that connection once we're over there.
00:45:04.059 --> 00:45:04.500
Yeah.
00:45:04.800 --> 00:45:05.940
And I think you're I think you're right.
00:45:06.019 --> 00:45:07.860
Some people are just more open to that than others.
00:45:08.059 --> 00:45:11.840
And, you know, we all have different areas of expertise and things that we like.
00:45:11.840 --> 00:45:24.280
And I remember later, Bob was talking about when he was a guide becoming an animal often that people, you know, spirits would be there and they not everybody would know that they had passed.
00:45:24.620 --> 00:45:24.720
Right.
00:45:25.079 --> 00:45:38.460
And so sometimes being an animal was a gentler way to convey that information, which makes me think that sometimes for us, seeing an animal, you know, we're having a butterfly circle is it's a gentle way.
00:45:38.460 --> 00:45:38.920
Right.
00:45:39.260 --> 00:45:44.360
It's a gentle way of and a safe way of touching us, of reaching us.
00:45:45.039 --> 00:45:47.180
And so maybe we're a little bit more open to that.
00:45:47.340 --> 00:45:47.740
Yeah.
00:45:48.240 --> 00:45:48.340
Yeah.
00:45:48.620 --> 00:45:48.780
Right.
00:45:49.019 --> 00:45:50.200
It's a great way to do it.
00:45:50.480 --> 00:45:50.579
Yeah.
00:45:50.920 --> 00:46:02.079
Yeah, it's kind of that that bridge, you know, that again, that part of the book, I've actually used that when I'm talking to clients about that, you know, that the bridge that we that we can build, we can meet our loved ones halfway.
00:46:02.300 --> 00:46:16.420
So I think it's a really beautiful analogy that shows that, you know, we've we've got to we've got to kind of raise our vibration to use that if you want to use that term and they kind of have to kind of to come down to where we can come to a place where we can kind of meet in the middle.
00:46:17.519 --> 00:46:19.660
And so you have some great stories about that.
00:46:19.740 --> 00:46:25.140
So I want people to understand, you know, as we're having this conversation, there is so much more in the book.
00:46:25.140 --> 00:46:28.680
So I don't feel like, you know, we're even coming close to touching it.
00:46:28.920 --> 00:46:35.360
It's it's just really, like I said, really made me think a lot about a lot of things in a very different way.
00:46:36.120 --> 00:46:37.860
But again, I was coming to the end of the book.
00:46:38.039 --> 00:46:41.220
I was like, I can't believe it's and it's it's it's a detailed book.
00:46:41.280 --> 00:46:42.960
But I was like, I was sad that it was over.
00:46:43.480 --> 00:46:47.480
And I realize it's been about a year and a half, I guess.
00:46:48.820 --> 00:46:50.559
So what's life like for you now?
00:46:51.280 --> 00:46:51.980
It's good.
00:46:52.280 --> 00:46:52.800
It's good.
00:46:52.980 --> 00:46:55.880
I mean, you know, we're going through a lot of challenges in the world.
00:46:55.880 --> 00:46:56.260
Right.
00:46:56.480 --> 00:46:57.260
So there's that.
00:46:57.700 --> 00:46:57.800
Yeah.
00:46:58.280 --> 00:47:09.480
But, you know, I would say I still talk to Bob and he's just very much a loving being and a guide of sorts, you know.
00:47:10.960 --> 00:47:12.539
And yeah, there is more.
00:47:12.640 --> 00:47:15.980
So I just want to let people know there is a second book and possibly a third.
00:47:16.120 --> 00:47:27.140
But the second book is almost ready to come out because those conversations do continue and there's some and it becomes really interesting, you know, about the nature of time and reality and and how we evolve.
00:47:27.460 --> 00:47:30.940
And in the second book, I talk more about my evolution through grief.
00:47:31.160 --> 00:47:52.280
And really coming through that how a powerful dream helped me move through that and really changed me, changed me in a way where I think I have a different foundation now, I have a different appreciation, more depth, more connection to really, you know, the deep love that's really everywhere as soon as we open to it.
00:47:52.940 --> 00:47:53.039
Yeah.
00:47:53.480 --> 00:47:54.300
Yeah, absolutely.
00:47:54.820 --> 00:48:04.980
So I'm glad to hear that there is a second book coming up, because like I said, the first book really left me, left me wanting more in terms.
00:48:05.200 --> 00:48:14.640
And I'm also kind of glad to hear you say that you're still communicating with Bob, because again, that's I think that's a big fear a lot of us have about our loved ones when they pass.
00:48:14.780 --> 00:48:16.539
It's like, well, what if they what if they move on?
00:48:16.660 --> 00:48:18.099
What if they what if they leave me?
00:48:18.200 --> 00:48:20.320
What if they don't, you know, they forget about me.
00:48:20.820 --> 00:48:30.960
And I think that is one thing I'll speak for myself when my daughter passed away, it's like, I don't want to live another 30 years, you know, at the time I was in my mid 50s.
00:48:31.079 --> 00:48:35.380
I'm like, I want to go see her now because, you know, I don't want her to evolve and become something else.
00:48:36.280 --> 00:48:40.300
So we want to be assured that, you know, where that connection is still there.
00:48:40.980 --> 00:48:51.300
And another thing I guess we didn't want to talk much about, you know, so far, it was like you talk about different lives and even talk about like a dream that you had, I believe.
00:48:51.380 --> 00:48:52.640
And you're like, were those people real?
00:48:52.760 --> 00:48:53.680
Were those characters real?
00:48:55.160 --> 00:48:58.880
And Bob's like, well, yeah, they I guess they kind of are.
00:48:59.140 --> 00:49:04.340
So let's talk about, you know, reincarnation, alternate timelines and that kind of stuff that's also covered.
00:49:05.500 --> 00:49:08.360
OK, well, yeah, I mean, reality.
00:49:08.880 --> 00:49:17.740
Yeah, you know, so in in this book, we accept the idea that there are different frameworks of reality.
00:49:18.079 --> 00:49:20.559
There's different, you know, ways of seeing that.
00:49:20.559 --> 00:49:28.960
So in terms of alternate lives, sometimes, like I said before, you know, sometimes these old you would talk about this past life and we would share this scenario.
00:49:28.960 --> 00:49:31.039
It would be the story of the life.
00:49:31.039 --> 00:49:36.480
OK, is that life exact or is that a metaphor of energies that are working?
00:49:36.720 --> 00:49:37.300
Does it matter?
00:49:37.660 --> 00:49:38.260
I don't know.
00:49:38.880 --> 00:49:38.980
Yeah.
00:49:39.660 --> 00:50:04.400
The point for me that was really most powerful was the ability to connect with those beings, those alternate selves and help them, you know, and I remember when a future self who I got to see her life and the way that she dealt and her her husband, who she who really, really loves so much was living with her in spirit.
00:50:05.380 --> 00:50:07.840
So on Earth, like in her house as a spirit.
00:50:08.260 --> 00:50:11.599
And I was like, wow, that's an interesting way, you know, to do it.
00:50:11.660 --> 00:50:14.720
Like, how do all these different selves deal with this stuff?
00:50:14.720 --> 00:50:16.099
You know, how do they evolve?
00:50:16.740 --> 00:50:24.880
So the connection or the conversation that was allowed between that affected me, maybe it affected her.
00:50:25.500 --> 00:50:29.660
So it's again, I think it's a deepening of our perception of reality.
00:50:30.320 --> 00:50:34.660
It's a deepening of our perception and experience of ourself and of others.
00:50:35.420 --> 00:50:35.559
Yeah.
00:50:35.780 --> 00:50:37.000
So it's just, again, wide open.
00:50:37.160 --> 00:50:38.980
How how how open are you?
00:50:39.079 --> 00:50:43.240
Yeah, and it's it blows my mind because I'm an engineer.
00:50:43.440 --> 00:50:45.019
So I'm kind of a literal thinker and stuff.
00:50:45.019 --> 00:50:48.300
And so I hear about past lives and parallel timelines like that.
00:50:48.360 --> 00:50:51.340
It's just kind of, again, it blows my mind a little bit.
00:50:51.860 --> 00:50:55.860
But I think probably a better way to think about might be like parallel lives.
00:50:56.340 --> 00:50:58.280
And I remember reading a book years ago.
00:50:58.380 --> 00:51:01.380
I can't remember the author right now, but she talked about seeing past lives.
00:51:01.840 --> 00:51:03.720
But she also mentioned seeing future lives.
00:51:03.960 --> 00:51:06.300
And people think, well, how could you see a future life?
00:51:06.440 --> 00:51:07.280
It hasn't happened yet.
00:51:07.460 --> 00:51:09.500
And she's like, well, they're all happening together.
00:51:10.000 --> 00:51:13.700
And so in that sense, it's like all of our little characters.
00:51:13.700 --> 00:51:16.360
We can influence the other one.
00:51:16.519 --> 00:51:18.180
We can influence even a future life.
00:51:19.200 --> 00:51:26.400
And then there may be times in our lives we felt like we got some some sort of insight or something that may be coming from our future self.
00:51:27.059 --> 00:51:27.160
Yeah.
00:51:27.420 --> 00:51:28.240
Yeah, I think so.
00:51:28.400 --> 00:51:33.000
And I think also it helps to think of I know Bob would always say, everything's really now.
00:51:33.180 --> 00:51:34.800
It's all really now, you know.
00:51:35.280 --> 00:51:35.380
Yeah.
00:51:35.420 --> 00:51:36.519
So I would think of the big now.
00:51:36.599 --> 00:51:38.660
And then I would think of, OK, but I'm in the little now.
00:51:39.000 --> 00:51:40.160
I'm in a little now right now.
00:51:40.180 --> 00:51:45.400
And so we have all these little nows and their parallel selves, alternate selves, however you want to say it.
00:51:45.920 --> 00:51:47.740
Yeah, because it's just a construct, right?
00:51:48.099 --> 00:51:50.599
So if it's all in the now, it's all happening right now.
00:51:50.940 --> 00:51:52.120
It's a mind blower.
00:51:52.400 --> 00:51:54.140
You know, we're linear here.
00:51:54.539 --> 00:51:55.620
That's how we see time.
00:51:56.059 --> 00:52:04.200
So you need to be able to step out of that a little bit in order to appreciate kind of the some of the subtleties of time.
00:52:04.360 --> 00:52:05.880
And I don't know if we can do it with our brain.
00:52:06.180 --> 00:52:08.420
You know, I don't think we can really expand to that point.
00:52:10.000 --> 00:52:12.539
Maybe you have to be in spirit to do that.
00:52:12.539 --> 00:52:16.460
But but there's ways, you know, there's ways to appreciate that.
00:52:16.880 --> 00:52:18.720
Yeah, I think that's the conclusion I've come to.
00:52:19.000 --> 00:52:22.519
In fact, it's funny, I was listening to a podcast yesterday with Neil deGrasse Tyson.
00:52:23.220 --> 00:52:25.660
And the title of the it was on my Ambiolek show.
00:52:25.760 --> 00:52:29.820
And the title was I think it was are we smart enough to understand the universe?
00:52:30.740 --> 00:52:40.559
And so I really I thought and like people like him will say, you know, we're basically intelligent chimps and, you know, chimps can't understand, you know, advanced algebra.
00:52:41.079 --> 00:52:45.240
We were these are concepts, I think, that are beyond the ability of my brain to really understand.
00:52:45.519 --> 00:52:49.700
I can use analogies, for example, I can I can travel in my mind to time.
00:52:49.880 --> 00:52:51.460
I can think about things in the past.
00:52:52.200 --> 00:52:55.920
And my understanding is when we're in spirit, we can literally be there.
00:52:55.940 --> 00:52:56.120
Right.
00:52:56.200 --> 00:52:57.240
We have that thought.
00:52:57.300 --> 00:52:58.260
And we're literally there.
00:52:58.539 --> 00:53:07.039
You talked about, you know, Bob, after he passed and the different perspectives and and being in one place and then thinking about you and your daughter and then, you know, being there.
00:53:07.960 --> 00:53:09.620
And it's instantaneous for him.
00:53:09.620 --> 00:53:10.559
That's what he would say.
00:53:10.680 --> 00:53:11.780
It's all in that now.
00:53:12.140 --> 00:53:12.240
Yeah.
00:53:12.840 --> 00:53:29.220
And I would also just add, you know, there have been humans who have had transcended experiences that have gone beyond, you know, and then and then sometimes their life's journey 20, 30 years is bringing it back and integrating it and sharing with others.
00:53:29.280 --> 00:53:30.500
So there's that, too.
00:53:31.039 --> 00:53:34.099
I just wouldn't want to limit, you know, how open we can be.
00:53:34.380 --> 00:53:35.000
I don't know.
00:53:35.320 --> 00:53:35.740
Yeah.
00:53:36.000 --> 00:53:36.480
Well, yeah.
00:53:36.480 --> 00:53:42.860
There are definitely people that have different different levels of understanding as different abilities, even being in the body.
00:53:43.039 --> 00:53:45.760
I think that's like you said, spirit, that's our natural state.
00:53:46.539 --> 00:53:52.180
Most of us are so caught up in the physical and so anchored to this point of view, we can't get outside of that.
00:53:53.200 --> 00:54:04.640
And that's I think another reason why possibly that you had this experience with Bob that that goes beyond what so many people have because of the conditioning, the work that you had done for years before that.
00:54:04.640 --> 00:54:08.900
So I'm like, I don't want to let anybody say you can't have this experience.
00:54:09.340 --> 00:54:13.740
But for people that aren't having it, don't think it's because there's something wrong with you.
00:54:13.860 --> 00:54:16.760
It's like it's just that's the natural human state.
00:54:17.120 --> 00:54:17.800
It is.
00:54:18.000 --> 00:54:21.960
And, you know, the other thing I would want to say about that is go with what you feel.
00:54:21.960 --> 00:54:28.880
If you're an artist, a sculptor or a painter, and that's how you can bring your connection in.
00:54:29.019 --> 00:54:30.059
That's what you want to do.
00:54:30.160 --> 00:54:30.400
Right.
00:54:30.599 --> 00:54:32.200
I mean, I just happen to be a word person.
00:54:32.519 --> 00:54:33.720
So I get I get words.
00:54:33.900 --> 00:54:34.160
Right.
00:54:34.160 --> 00:54:34.559
Yeah.
00:54:35.240 --> 00:54:41.099
But and if you're a dancer, you know, there's something beautiful about the dance, about movement that brings things up.
00:54:41.500 --> 00:54:46.559
So we go with where we are and what our passion is and follow that.
00:54:46.800 --> 00:54:47.039
Yeah.
00:54:47.140 --> 00:54:52.920
If you're a meditator or you like to you like to snorkel or scuba dive, maybe you find, you know, that in the ocean.
00:54:53.120 --> 00:54:53.559
Right.
00:54:53.740 --> 00:54:54.900
There's all kinds of ways.
00:54:55.340 --> 00:54:55.700
Yeah.
00:54:55.880 --> 00:54:56.539
Yeah, you're right.
00:54:56.700 --> 00:55:00.240
It's it's whatever whatever moves you and it helps you to make that connection.
00:55:00.640 --> 00:55:17.420
And, you know, again, I think because you're back and again, even with the afterlife, sometimes people will take some of these things so literally, you know, and it reminds me of someone I knew or someone I know reading the Bible and it says, OK, well, heaven is streets of gold and, you know, rivers of milk and honey.
00:55:17.539 --> 00:55:19.700
And people go, that doesn't sound appealing to me.
00:55:20.180 --> 00:55:28.519
So if you if you read the book and people like I don't want to go have to live in a tent and go, honey, honey, that doesn't like a great afterlife for me.
00:55:28.660 --> 00:55:29.900
That's that's Bob's afterlife.
00:55:30.079 --> 00:55:31.559
That's not going to be your afterlife.
00:55:31.559 --> 00:55:33.059
I'm not going to be in the tent either.
00:55:33.220 --> 00:55:33.740
Let me tell you.
00:55:35.840 --> 00:55:38.800
But yeah, he actually Bob reminds me a lot of a friend of mine.
00:55:38.920 --> 00:55:42.079
And I was like, I could see my friend going, this sounds perfect to me.
00:55:42.740 --> 00:55:42.860
Yeah.
00:55:43.140 --> 00:55:43.360
Yeah.
00:55:43.579 --> 00:55:45.780
It's all what you're what you need.
00:55:46.220 --> 00:55:47.440
It is what is what it is.
00:55:47.660 --> 00:55:47.760
Right.
00:55:48.180 --> 00:55:48.360
Yeah.
00:55:48.660 --> 00:55:53.840
But I think that, again, the overall the overall lessons that we can take away from it.
00:55:54.340 --> 00:55:56.980
Again, I think about the fear that the people have.
00:55:57.519 --> 00:55:59.280
Do our loved ones still care about us?
00:55:59.480 --> 00:56:01.360
Do they still know what's going on with us?
00:56:02.039 --> 00:56:03.500
You know, are they OK?
00:56:04.280 --> 00:56:05.559
Are they are they lonely?
00:56:06.380 --> 00:56:16.920
I think this book answers all those really deep questions that people have when they lose someone that that the first part of it, you know, you're just you're just so fearful.
00:56:17.900 --> 00:56:21.260
I love the fact this is going to really help relieve so much for that for people.
00:56:21.500 --> 00:56:21.700
Good.
00:56:21.920 --> 00:56:24.700
That's that's why we that's why we're putting it out.
00:56:24.940 --> 00:56:25.140
Yeah.
00:56:25.720 --> 00:56:25.820
Yeah.
00:56:25.820 --> 00:56:26.360
Oh, yeah.
00:56:26.360 --> 00:56:29.400
So we're recording this in April 2026.
00:56:29.660 --> 00:56:31.099
When do you think the next book will be out?
00:56:31.720 --> 00:56:32.820
Within a few weeks.
00:56:32.980 --> 00:56:33.599
Oh, really?
00:56:33.640 --> 00:56:34.500
It's already written.
00:56:34.620 --> 00:56:35.559
I'm just formatting it.
00:56:35.680 --> 00:56:37.000
And it's, yeah, a week or two.
00:56:37.079 --> 00:56:37.380
Yeah.
00:56:38.180 --> 00:56:38.280
Yeah.
00:56:38.280 --> 00:56:38.500
Yeah.
00:56:38.500 --> 00:56:39.760
And it's the same title.
00:56:39.920 --> 00:56:42.340
Just book two, two Beyond Grief.
00:56:42.840 --> 00:56:43.240
Yeah.
00:56:44.099 --> 00:56:44.440
So, yeah.
00:56:44.960 --> 00:56:50.320
So, Don, is there anything that I didn't ask you that you that you'd like to get across today?
00:56:52.320 --> 00:56:53.640
You know, I think you did a great job.
00:56:54.099 --> 00:56:55.500
I think we covered a lot here.
00:56:55.880 --> 00:56:58.180
And I think there's no one answer.
00:56:58.760 --> 00:57:01.099
And that, you know, again, it's about resonance.
00:57:01.099 --> 00:57:03.180
What works for you, for each individual.
00:57:04.460 --> 00:57:11.220
And I would say if there's one message from Bob, it's about trusting love.
00:57:12.420 --> 00:57:12.519
Yeah.
00:57:13.079 --> 00:57:13.180
Yeah.
00:57:14.019 --> 00:57:14.160
Yeah.
00:57:14.420 --> 00:57:14.660
Great.
00:57:14.980 --> 00:57:16.340
Great way to end it.
00:57:16.840 --> 00:57:21.559
So remind people of your name and the title of the book.
00:57:22.420 --> 00:57:22.519
Sure.
00:57:22.820 --> 00:57:23.539
Don Bauman Brunky.
00:57:24.099 --> 00:57:28.880
The book is called Talks with Bob, a true story of love, death and life in the afterlife.
00:57:29.559 --> 00:57:29.720
Yeah.
00:57:29.720 --> 00:57:33.640
And again, I want to just make sure I emphasize this for people that are listening to this.
00:57:34.059 --> 00:57:37.460
There's so much more in the book that we just barely touched on today.
00:57:37.640 --> 00:57:39.000
So I do.
00:57:39.019 --> 00:57:39.700
I highly recommend.
00:57:39.840 --> 00:57:41.599
That's why I wanted to rush to get you on.
00:57:41.700 --> 00:57:43.000
I think it's really, really important.
00:57:43.380 --> 00:57:44.039
Thank you.
00:57:44.260 --> 00:57:45.079
Thank you.
00:57:45.740 --> 00:57:46.660
Don, have a great afternoon.
00:57:47.240 --> 00:57:47.720
You too.
00:57:48.160 --> 00:57:48.500
All right.