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So someone listening to this who's like, all right, this is interesting, or someone coming to you as a patient, how do you integrate in the plant piece of this, the herbal medicine into what they're doing? It's listening to the patient. I think because I have this reputation in my community for being open-minded and for doing these kinds of things while still practicing in a totally conventional manner and using hormone replacement therapy, which I take hormones, okay? I love them, thank God. Me too, you'll have to prine from me. Right? Exactly.
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So it depends on the person. And I think that's really what the therapeutic alliance is, right? Where are they? A lot of my patients, and especially now where people are much more educated and learning about perimenopause and how this all starts, a lot of them are curious and they want to prevent chronic disease, which I'm so excited about. What an opportunity to work with somebody at 37 who's thinking about this rather than 57 when they're in it. When you're unfrying the egg. Right. Exactly. Exactly. You can't, which you cannot do.
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So sometimes we start with herbal and botanicals first because they're not quite ready or they're curious or they have a symptom that is actually maybe going to respond better to the herb. A lot of our nervous system issues respond really, really well to things like ashwagandha or rhodiola, adaptogens. They're really powerful. The sleep issues that people are starting to have, sometimes the botanicals are a more gentle entrance point for them.
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And the thing is that a lot of these, most of these are actually very amenable to work with the hormones. So there's lots of plant estrogen-like molecules out there. They can work very well for certain things like hot flashes or vasomotor symptoms. One of my favorites is a very specific form of Siberian rhubarb. And we know that it acts like a selective estrogen receptor modulator. So it's
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activating in places that you want, brain and bone, and not activating proliferation in places like the uterus or the breast. We don't have the best data in the world, but we have some data. So super, super interesting, and I can fine tune based on what's going on with her. And then if we're layering in hormones, we are. And look, I'm a breast cancer survivor. Some of my patients are in treatment. They cannot be using hormones at that time,
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they choose not to usually. I mean, they can do whatever they want, actually. That's what shared decision making is. Or maybe they have another reason why they can't. Maybe they've had a stroke or a blood clot. So maybe they can't use hormones. And these can be really, really, really helpful for modulating not only symptoms, but potentially for impacting long-term health issues like insulin resistance or bone health or brain health or gut health or cardiometabolic profiles.
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Again, they're not, we don't have the same level of data as we do for a lot of our pharma stuff, but we have a lot of data to support their use and their safety. Yeah, and I think that's the most important. There's safety data. We need your book, clearly, because I see this seems very, very relevant for a woman inting perimenopause and menopause. Like, there's so many things they can do.
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But for someone, let's go back over to nervous system. And I'd like to dig a little deeper into ashwagandha and moneola. So for someone, because, I mean, what woman isn't in a little bit of sympathetic overdrive? I mean, who's, so what are some of the things that she could look at here?
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Well, I mean, first of all, if some of it is timing and where you take it in the day, ashwagandha can be a little more sedating. And again, remembering that it can take some time for these things to get into your system and work. So ashwagandha, I would say for most people, I would start with trying to take it at night. And it really can help with sleep as well because it can kind of downregulate the nervous system and it can interact with GABA receptors and help relax, right?
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Rhodiola is a little more activating and it can be a little more beneficial like maybe earlier in the day. This is like, these are broad brush strokes we're painting in. So those are two things I would just think about. But adaptogens are really interesting because their goal is to get you back to homeostasis, which sounds really weird in Western medicine. It's like, well, how could it do both? But it does because as I mentioned with plants, there's synergy.
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And they're activating more than one pathway at the same time. So those are two that are actually really well tolerated and very effective. I think understanding like the dosage and you're getting the right extract and that it's a certified product, things like that is very, very helpful. Yeah.
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I see a lot of anxiety in perimenopause, a big uptick. And we also know anybody who's had any kind of hormone-mediated mood disorder, so maybe around puberty, for sure, if they've had pregnancy-related anxiety or depression, they're almost certainly gonna have an uptick in those symptoms again in perimenopause. And we see, like, up to 40% of women have some kind of mood symptom. So really targeting that nervous system regulation is so important.
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Game changing. And sleep, regulating sleep. If you don't sleep, I could dip you in all the hormones and you're just, you're not going to get better. Well, it's a massive problem, let's be honest, during perimenopause. So beyond the ashwagandha, are there other things that you like for sleep?
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It depends on what you're trying to do. I mean, valerian is really powerful. I would be careful with it because it can make you very groggy in the morning, but it is really good at inducing sleep. Saffron and passionflower also have some efficacy. I think it depends on what the issue, right? Is it falling asleep? Is it staying asleep? Honestly, most of my patients, it's staying asleep.
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But also looking at things like blood sugar and activity level, right? If you're super, super active later in the day, you're going to have, your cortisol is going to be up. You're going to have a harder time going to sleep. If you're drinking alcohol, I feel like I shouldn't have to say this, but I have to say it like, sure, it's going to make you fall asleep. You are not going to have a good sleep for a million reasons. It's not good for your brain and it's definitely not good for your blood sugar. So understanding insulin resistance is also climbing at this time of life and insulin resistance and glucose metabolism actually play a big role in our sleep.
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So it's kind of hard to nail it all on just like one. But I think passionflower and saffron are ones that people don't think about. And they're great. And saffron also can be used for mood disorders. Yes, for sure. A lot of the things, anything that works on the HPA axis or the HP ovarian axis in this case, is going to help with mood and with sleep. So you see a lot of crossover here. And you can layer these as well.
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Now, of course, the other big issue, and you mentioned it, is all of the, we're starting to get more insulin resistant, so we've got blood sugar issues. Are there some things you like to use for that? Yeah, I mean, these herbs are not as great, but I like them. I mean, it depends on how big your issue is. Berberine actually has plenty of data to support its use. I think that we're seeing some newer ones coming online, and some of the older ones, like, look, there was a,
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Kyolic acid, which is aged garlic and it's a very specific thing, was having its moment for a while there. I cannot take that step. Yeah, I don't think it works that well. There's some really interesting work with a very specific hops that really is acting like a GLP-1. I mean, it's not in the same long-acting way. Oh, is that the calicurb?
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Yes. And honestly, the data is really fascinating. It's very interesting. So those are some of the ones I know I'm leaving something out. I can see my slide and I'm just like blanking on what that was. But these are some that I reach for. There's a plant sterols, which is going to be more for your cholesterol and fiber. I mean, really, like, you don't have to get fancy. Like people need people don't get enough fiber.
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It could be as basic as that. Well, when you look at fiber, because there's different types of fiber, how do you recommend doing this for your patients? I mean, it's such a basic that the reality is the majority of people are getting a third of what they need. Oh yeah. First of all, people have to track what they're doing, right? Because I'm gonna tell you something, when I talk about fiber just generically, I mean, are you talking about soluble fiber? Are you talking about insoluble fiber? And they all say to me, especially my, I have a very,
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a very educated demographic and very health-focused demographic, right? And they are all telling me about vegetables, which are amazing. Absolutely, you need to eat vegetables. You're not getting nearly as much fiber in your fruits and vegetables as you think you are. That arugula just did not crank up your fiber intake. No, it really didn't. So the first thing I do is have them kind of look at what they're doing. I actually have a cheat sheet, JJ, that I send them, because some people like lentils and some people like chia pudding. I don't know.
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Maybe we can include the cheat sheet. Oh, my God. Absolutely. I'm voluntolding that we'll gift the cheat sheet to the audience. Yeah, absolutely. Cool. Yeah. So there's – and some of my patients are vegan and some – you know, whatever. So I think helping them make selections and understanding like 25 to 30 grams if you can do it. But I have a hard time with it. It's like a freaking full-time job.
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I know. I track it every day, too. I'm a big tracker, but I love it. It's so important. Look at me with my two devices. I stack everything. Yeah. But fiber especially, that is like that 10 grams per meal. Yep. Yep. Exactly. Divide it up. Divide it up. Although I will brag about it. I've already gotten 20 grams. Of course you have. Just so you know, it's like a new one, you guys.
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I haven't had lunch yet, though. And a lot of this is actually, the perimenopause and menopause stuff that I talk about botanically, a lot of it is actually in my book, Menopause Boot Camp, because I focused a lot on stuff that people just were not talking about yet.
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And people still are not talking about this enough. So we're going to keep bringing it to the floor. And what we're going to do is we're going to put that in the show notes. Amazing. Because we did your interview on that. That was a while ago. Yes. Yes. So we did that interview. It was four years ago. Four years ago. Yes. Wow. Yeah.
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All right. Crazy times. So other things for people that they can use here. We talked about things for mood. Yeah. We talked about things for sleep and blood sugar. But what about just, you know, hormonal symptoms? Yeah. I mean, so again...
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Some of these phytoestrogens and some of these CIRMs are actually really interesting. What's a CIRM? So CIRM is a selective estrogen receptor modulator. So it is selectively turning on or off estrogen receptors in different areas because estrogen acts all over the body, right? It is not just...
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you know, in your uterus or your ovary, it's in your bones, it's in your brain, it's in your heart, it's in your liver, it's in your muscles, it's everywhere. So we want to be careful that we are targeting the areas that are causing us a problem. So if you're having hot flashes and night sweats, that's coming from the brain, actually. And as by the way, a big red flag for cardiovascular disease and dementia. What? Yeah.
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Yeah, that is a signal. I have never heard this. Yes, severe hot flashes are a signal. Okay, so if you have severe hot flashes, but then you control them. It's probably having a positive impact. Okay, so it's like it's not just that. They're not benign. They're not just a joke. They're not just like a funny meme. Why is that a big risk factor?
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Because part of what's happening is it's originating in the thermoregulatory center in your brain, but it's having an impact actually on the vascular system as well, which is where the hafash is kind of being acted out. So we know that it's related to reactivity and then...
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more issues like you're losing nitrous oxide, which helps to relax the blood vessels, and you're also having an impact on the endothelial lining, the lining of the vascular tree of all those vessels, which of course is going to, you have more inflammation, so okay, and then the inflammation is,
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Yeah, and you know, I'll tell you something. So should you have some beetroot or what should you do? Well, I mean, you should, here's the thing, you should not grin and bear it. You should treat your hot flashes. So whether you're using- No suffering. Yeah, suffering is like not, not only is it like unnecessary, you're not getting a gold star for it and it's harming you. So I really want people to know, yeah, a hot flash is not just a funny joke and like, oh, get a fan, I mean, get a fan if you need it, but like take care of that. And if your clinician does not understand that this is a signal for your longevity,
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We got to find you another doctor, okay? We just really do. So, look, black cohosh, which is much maligned and does not act as an estrogen, works pretty well. Very specifically, rummy famine. The Germans are always on it. They're really good with plants. But 50% reduction in hot flashes. Wow. Yeah.