Katie McManus
00:00:18
Let's get you mastering your sales conversations.
Katie McManus
00:00:21
Hi, I'm Katie McManus, business strategist and money mindset coach.
Katie McManus
00:00:24
And welcome to the Weapon.
Katie McManus
00:00:27
Even my clients who come from a sales background need to be retrained on how to sell their own services.
Katie McManus
00:00:35
This is because selling your own services is like selling your own expertise, your own time.
Katie McManus
00:00:41
It's like selling your soul.
Katie McManus
00:00:42
In some instances, it's very different to sell your service than it is to sell a house or a luxury car or a fancy handbag or software.
Katie McManus
00:00:54
As a service, they are worlds apart.
Katie McManus
00:00:57
Mainly because when someone rejects you, when you're selling an object or something that's separate from you, well, you can rationalize that they're not rejecting you, they're rejecting the thing.
Katie McManus
00:01:09
You know, if you're a real estate agent and you're showing someone houses, like, no, I don't want this house because it only has three bedrooms and I wanted four.
Katie McManus
00:01:17
Cool.
Katie McManus
00:01:18
That has nothing to do with me as a human being.
Katie McManus
00:01:21
That has to do with the house not having enough bedrooms.
Katie McManus
00:01:24
Got it.
Katie McManus
00:01:25
Or maybe you wanted a craftsman instead of a mid century modern.
Katie McManus
00:01:29
Okay, cool.
Katie McManus
00:01:30
That has to do with the quality of the house, not me.
Katie McManus
00:01:33
But when you're selling your service, when you're on the phone with someone or on Zoom and you're explaining what you do and you're just being yourself and they say, no, I don't want this, there's no external object that you can point at to say, oh, well, it was just this they didn't want.
Katie McManus
00:01:51
It feels like a personal rejection.
Katie McManus
00:01:53
And there's a reason why we have so many love stories in movies and in books.
Katie McManus
00:01:59
Because the stakes are really high.
Katie McManus
00:02:01
The stakes are heartbreak.
Katie McManus
00:02:04
Being rejected, not being wanted.
Katie McManus
00:02:07
That is really hard for the human spirit to deal with.
Katie McManus
00:02:10
It's hard in romance, and it's hard in business.
Katie McManus
00:02:13
If you are starting your business, growing your business, and sales is still really hard for you, it feels like a massive emotional lift and you feel zero confidence doing it.
Katie McManus
00:02:24
Know that you're not alone.
Katie McManus
00:02:26
This happens for most people.
Katie McManus
00:02:28
Like I said, even my clients who come from a sales background, I have to retrain them on how to sell their own services.
Katie McManus
00:02:37
It's hard.
Katie McManus
00:02:38
And there are a few things a lot of people do that actually makes it harder to a get the sale and to feel good about it.
Katie McManus
00:02:45
So in this episode, I'm going to break down what those things are that are making selling difficult.
Katie McManus
00:02:51
And I'm going to talk you through the simple shifts you can make to feel far more grounded in your sales call to understand the rejection is not about you and to get more clients right off the bat, we got to ditch the pitch.
Katie McManus
00:03:10
Pitches don't work.
Katie McManus
00:03:11
When you're doing a service, you jump into a sales conversation with someone and then immediately whip out your slide deck.
Katie McManus
00:03:20
What did you think I was going to say?
Katie McManus
00:03:22
To go through what your offer is, you're going to have a much lower yes rate, meaning fewer people are going to say yes to working with you.
Katie McManus
00:03:31
Pitches are dead.
Katie McManus
00:03:32
There are a few reasons for this.
Katie McManus
00:03:34
Number one, watching a slideshow about a thing is boring.
Katie McManus
00:03:39
As f.
Katie McManus
00:03:40
Have you ever gone over to someone's house for dinner and had them tell you, oh, yeah, I did this huge presentation for work this week and then been like, oh, my God, can I see the slides that you did?
Katie McManus
00:03:50
Oh, my God, can you do it for me?
Katie McManus
00:03:52
No, of course not.
Katie McManus
00:03:53
That sounds awful.
Katie McManus
00:03:55
That sounds like going through a meeting, like a bad meeting where you don't really understand what they're talking about.
Katie McManus
00:04:02
And I know as the person who's selling the thing, it feels like something that makes you look credible.
Katie McManus
00:04:08
It feels like something that facilitates you convincing this person to buy your stuff, to buy your program, your service, whatever.
Katie McManus
00:04:18
And it feels like a checklist, right?
Katie McManus
00:04:19
So you don't miss anything.
Katie McManus
00:04:21
They might care about all of it.
Katie McManus
00:04:22
And what if you forget to mention it?
Katie McManus
00:04:24
But it's boring.
Katie McManus
00:04:26
I have never in my life sat through a slide presentation and walked away, remembering even a fraction of what was just presented to me.
Katie McManus
00:04:36
Most of the time, my eyes are glazed over, and I'm just nodding when I sense it's the right time to nod, because I don't want to be rude and leave the meeting or end the call early, but I can't wait to get away from it.
Katie McManus
00:04:50
The other side of it is when we present slides, when we have a PowerPoint presentation and we're pointing to something other than us, we actually create distance.
Katie McManus
00:05:01
And so it makes sense that folks who are just starting to sell their service or who are trying to branch out into bigger deals will try to use a slide deck because it makes it feel less vulnerable.
Katie McManus
00:05:12
It's almost like this armor that you put up.
Katie McManus
00:05:15
It's like this wall, like, oh, cool, here's the thing that you're going to reject.
Katie McManus
00:05:18
Just like you rejected that house and that car in that handbag, you can reject this instead of me.
Katie McManus
00:05:24
But when you're selling a service, that wall, that armor, that distance, all it does is kills connection.
Katie McManus
00:05:31
And there's this huge question that I get all the time from clients who work with me who are just starting their business to clients who have been running their business for five years and who want to scale.
Katie McManus
00:05:41
And it's.
Katie McManus
00:05:42
How do I describe what I do?
Katie McManus
00:05:44
And I truly believe it comes from the fact that we've just figured out at some level that, like, what we do, the service we provide, the work we do.
Katie McManus
00:05:54
That's so intellectual.
Katie McManus
00:05:56
It's so in our head.
Katie McManus
00:05:56
It's so innate to us.
Katie McManus
00:05:58
We've just kind of figured out that not everyone thinks this way.
Katie McManus
00:06:01
We've just figured out that this is, like, unique to us.
Katie McManus
00:06:04
We have this way of doing this thing that is useful to other people.
Katie McManus
00:06:07
And because we've gone through our whole life just assuming everyone knows how to do this thing, it seems so weird to try to describe what it is that's valuable to someone who doesn't think that way.
Katie McManus
00:06:19
And especially when you end up in a conversation where someone has come to you and they're saying, hey, I'm interested in that thing you do.
Katie McManus
00:06:25
We think, oh, God.
Katie McManus
00:06:26
Well, I have to tell them what it is.
Katie McManus
00:06:28
It's like someone saying, hey, I know you have a device that helps you go from one point to the other.
Katie McManus
00:06:33
I'd like to buy it.
Katie McManus
00:06:34
And you're like, oh, God, well, it's a bike.
Katie McManus
00:06:35
Do they know how to ride a bike?
Katie McManus
00:06:37
I have to describe what the bike is, right?
Katie McManus
00:06:40
It's the wrong question.
Katie McManus
00:06:42
Especially when you're selling a service, because people don't give a F what you do.
Katie McManus
00:06:46
If you were a magic belly dancer and people paid you $7,000 to just do a magic belly dance, and they got the result that they wanted.
Katie McManus
00:06:54
Do you know how many people you'd have lined around the block just telling you to dance?
Katie McManus
00:06:59
God, your abs would be so sore.
Katie McManus
00:07:03
Your neighbors would be complaining about the music and the jingling from your little jingle belt.
Katie McManus
00:07:08
I think that's the technical word for them.
Katie McManus
00:07:10
I don't know the word, but we're just going to say jingle belt because it sounds good.
Katie McManus
00:07:14
People actually don't care what you do.
Katie McManus
00:07:17
They care that you solve the problem that they have and that you help them reach their goal.
Katie McManus
00:07:22
And all these things that we do to try to get clients using these kinds of practices, where we're describing our process, they're all manifestations of the same thing.
Katie McManus
00:07:34
Convincing them.
Katie McManus
00:07:35
We feel like we have to convince this person to buy from us.
Katie McManus
00:07:40
And it's the furthest thing from the truth.
Katie McManus
00:07:42
And to shift away from this, I want you to remember this acronym that I just Made up.
Katie McManus
00:07:48
That sounds like a piece of Ikea furniture.
Katie McManus
00:07:50
This acronym is AD coeffle A D K O F L.
Katie McManus
00:08:01
And step one, the A is I want you to assume.
Katie McManus
00:08:06
I know that saying.
Katie McManus
00:08:07
When you assume, you make an ass of you and me.
Katie McManus
00:08:10
Go ahead and make an ass of yourself.
Katie McManus
00:08:12
Full permission to be the ass.
Katie McManus
00:08:15
Because think about it.
Katie McManus
00:08:16
Do you just willy nilly go and book sales calls with everyone and their mother for things that you don't even want?
Katie McManus
00:08:23
Do you do that for fun?
Katie McManus
00:08:25
Do you go to car lots when you don't want a car and go through the whole sales process?
Katie McManus
00:08:30
Do you go on tours of homes and start drafting up offers with real estate agents when you don't want something?
Katie McManus
00:08:37
Do you go to the appliance store and check out refrigerators when you're not actually looking for a refrigerator?
Katie McManus
00:08:43
Probably not.
Katie McManus
00:08:45
People don't do that.
Katie McManus
00:08:47
At least normal people.
Katie McManus
00:08:48
If you're not.
Katie McManus
00:08:48
If you're one of those weirdos who does this and we have to have a different conversation.
Katie McManus
00:08:52
So you have full permission to assume that this person came here because they want to say yes.
Katie McManus
00:09:00
That this person booked a call with you because they believe that hiring you will solve their problem, will help them reach their goal.
Katie McManus
00:09:11
Why would someone take a half hour out of their day to have, let's be honest, an uncomfortable conversation with you where they may need to tell you no?
Katie McManus
00:09:23
Because people don't like saying no to other people if they didn't want your thing?
Katie McManus
00:09:29
When I book a sales call with someone, it's because I believe that I want the thing.
Katie McManus
00:09:33
Now, sometimes in the sales call, I realize the thing is not actually what I thought it was, or it's not a good fit for me, or it requires too much time or effort on my part and I need to find something else.
Katie McManus
00:09:46
And that's okay.
Katie McManus
00:09:48
That's absolutely okay.
Katie McManus
00:09:50
But I walk into it fully believing I want to buy this thing.
Katie McManus
00:09:54
The main key to confidence in a sales call is just simply assuming everyone who books a sales call with you wants to buy your service or your program.
Katie McManus
00:10:06
So that's a D.
Katie McManus
00:10:33
Don't convince.
Katie McManus
00:10:35
Listen, you know how we were talking about the slideshow and how it doesn't work?
Katie McManus
00:10:41
The reason it doesn't work is because you're usually blasting them with a ton of information that they don't give a fuck about.
Katie McManus
00:10:46
Okay?
Katie McManus
00:10:47
When I buy a car, the last thing I care about is the engine.
Katie McManus
00:10:51
I could not give a flying F about the upholstery, the sound system.
Katie McManus
00:10:57
I don't care about how special the tires Are.
Katie McManus
00:11:00
I don't even know all the things that I do not care about.
Katie McManus
00:11:04
But if a salesperson tries to tell me all this stuff, I will be bored out of my mind.
Katie McManus
00:11:08
Do you know I do care about?
Katie McManus
00:11:10
Is there room for my dog?
Katie McManus
00:11:12
Will she be comfortable in the backseat?
Katie McManus
00:11:14
Will she be able to safely jump from the backseat into the front seat?
Katie McManus
00:11:17
Because that's where she actually likes to sit no matter how much I want her in the backseat.
Katie McManus
00:11:21
Do the headlights work?
Katie McManus
00:11:23
Are there buttons?
Katie McManus
00:11:25
I really like a good button.
Katie McManus
00:11:26
I don't like this like, screen thing.
Katie McManus
00:11:29
There was a conversation on LinkedIn a few days ago where someone was talking about their son and how their son really liked flying planes.
Katie McManus
00:11:36
Like being a passenger in a plane.
Katie McManus
00:11:38
And the dad is like, oh my God, you could be a pilot and you could do this and you could do this and you could do this.
Katie McManus
00:11:43
And the kid's like, okay, yeah, uh huh.
Katie McManus
00:11:45
And he's like, but are there buttons?
Katie McManus
00:11:48
Would I be able to press buttons?
Katie McManus
00:11:50
And I so connected with this because the one time I drove a Porsche Macan, it was a friend's Porsche Macan.
Katie McManus
00:11:56
The thing I loved most about this car was not how cool it was, wasn't how expensive it was or fancy or any of the features.
Katie McManus
00:12:03
It was the fact that there are so many buttons.
Katie McManus
00:12:06
It was like a control center.
Katie McManus
00:12:07
And while you're driving it, it was so intuitive that the first time I drove it, I didn't even have to look.
Katie McManus
00:12:15
I could just go and feel around all these buttons and press a button and the air conditioning went off.
Katie McManus
00:12:20
Magic.
Katie McManus
00:12:22
Oh my God.
Katie McManus
00:12:22
I still like.
Katie McManus
00:12:23
It was one of the best driving experiences in my life because of that one thing.
Katie McManus
00:12:29
That's what I care about.
Katie McManus
00:12:30
Not this touchscreen crap, okay?
Katie McManus
00:12:33
That requires me to take my eyes off the road.
Katie McManus
00:12:34
I don't like that.
Katie McManus
00:12:35
The other thing I care about, trunk space and is it going to be covered up?
Katie McManus
00:12:40
You know, because I'm sorry, I'm very disorganized and I like to leave a lot of crap in the car because I know I'm going to forget and I don't want people thinking that, you know, there's valuable things in the car because there's usually not.
Katie McManus
00:12:52
But I also don't want to take it out and put it back in and take it out and put it back in.
Katie McManus
00:12:56
So I need, I need the trunk space to be covered so people won't try to break into my car.
Katie McManus
00:13:01
You're never going to find that out.
Katie McManus
00:13:02
These weird things about your clients, the things they care about, the questions they have, are there buttons?
Katie McManus
00:13:08
Unless you listen.
Katie McManus
00:13:10
So you need to stop trying to convince them of all the cool features of working with you and all the interesting things that you do.
Katie McManus
00:13:17
Because chances are they do not give a fuck about most of it.
Katie McManus
00:13:21
They care about the things that they care about.
Katie McManus
00:13:24
And the only way for you to figure out what those things are is to listen to them.
Katie McManus
00:13:28
So ad coeffle ad k know that no isn't bad.
Katie McManus
00:13:40
A lot of the anxiety we get when we get on a sales call is around the fear that they might say no.
Katie McManus
00:13:46
Because again, like we've already discussed, it feels like a very deep rejection of who we are and all the gifts we have.
Katie McManus
00:13:55
It's like you were dating for 30 minutes and then they broke up with you because they didn't like you.
Katie McManus
00:14:00
Oh, so sad.
Katie McManus
00:14:02
But actually, hearing no is a really healthy thing to hear as a business person.
Katie McManus
00:14:06
Right?
Katie McManus
00:14:07
Not everyone who comes to you is going to be your ideal client or can afford to work with you.
Katie McManus
00:14:12
In fact, if you have a solid offer that sells really well, chances are you're only hearing yes 25 to 50% of the time.
Katie McManus
00:14:19
That's a really strong yes no ratio.
Katie McManus
00:14:23
So out of every four people, two to three of them should say no to working with you.
Katie McManus
00:14:29
That's a good sign.
Katie McManus
00:14:31
Now, if your yes rate drops below 25%, we need to look at some things and it might be that we need to look at your sales process, we might need to redesign your offer, we might need to tweak your marketing, but it's just information.
Katie McManus
00:14:47
It's just data.
Katie McManus
00:14:48
It doesn't mean that you're not good at this.
Katie McManus
00:14:50
It doesn't mean that your business is going to fail.
Katie McManus
00:14:53
Our brains are these beautiful meaning making machines, right?
Katie McManus
00:14:57
And that's the source of some of the most beautiful poetry and stories and art and music that we've had as a species.
Katie McManus
00:15:04
Think of that part of your brain that sees something random throughout the day and it's like, oh my God, this is a sign I have to do the thing.
Katie McManus
00:15:10
And then it completely changes your life.
Katie McManus
00:15:12
That is one of the most beautiful things about humans.
Katie McManus
00:15:15
It's also one of the most destructive things about us because we take raw data that someone said no to us and we make it all about us.
Katie McManus
00:15:23
We make it mean something about how we're not good enough, we're not smart enough, we're not articulate enough, we weren't convincing enough, all the things.
Katie McManus
00:15:32
And then we spiral into this is never going to work.
Katie McManus
00:15:36
Babes, slow the down.
Katie McManus
00:15:39
It Just means a part of the process isn't working.
Katie McManus
00:15:43
And that part of the process, now that you're getting the data that something is not working, we can go and start tweaking things.
Katie McManus
00:15:49
We can change your marketing a little bit and see if that changes it.
Katie McManus
00:15:52
We can update your offer or your pricing and see if that changes it.
Katie McManus
00:15:56
We can adjust your sales process and see if that helps it.
Katie McManus
00:16:00
You have to know that no is not bad.
Katie McManus
00:16:03
It's just data and related to this.
Katie McManus
00:16:06
Ed Coeffle.
Katie McManus
00:16:56
Oh, objections aren't rejections.
Katie McManus
00:16:59
And let me.
Katie McManus
00:17:00
Let me break this down, because a lot of people don't know what this word actually means.
Katie McManus
00:17:03
An objection.
Katie McManus
00:17:04
Right.
Katie McManus
00:17:05
So back to the example of me going and buying a car.
Katie McManus
00:17:08
An objection might be, I don't like the touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:11
Doesn't mean that you're not going to sell me a car, because I hate this touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:14
That's not a rejection.
Katie McManus
00:17:16
It's information.
Katie McManus
00:17:17
If I'm saying I'm rejecting this model of this car because I don't like the touchscreen, I prefer buttons.
Katie McManus
00:17:24
You as a salesperson, like, oh, I'm so glad you said that.
Katie McManus
00:17:28
Because we actually have a model of this that doesn't have a touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:31
And it's actually less expensive because most people do want the touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:34
Cause it's fancy.
Katie McManus
00:17:36
You're obviously not a very fancy person, so we'll give you some buttons.
Katie McManus
00:17:39
Like, I want you to think about the last time you went and bought clothes and you got a bunch of stuff and you went into the fitting room and you tried them on.
Katie McManus
00:17:46
You didn't stand there in front of the mirror in a shirt that you liked the idea of, but it didn't quite fit your chest very well.
Katie McManus
00:17:55
Or pants that, like, were maybe just a little too baggy in the thigh.
Katie McManus
00:18:00
This whole brand sucks.
Katie McManus
00:18:02
I hate them.
Katie McManus
00:18:03
Who's the designer?
Katie McManus
00:18:04
I want to go and burn their house down.
Katie McManus
00:18:06
No, of course not.
Katie McManus
00:18:07
You're just like, oh, bummer.
Katie McManus
00:18:09
Like, okay, I need a shirt that has a little more give here.
Katie McManus
00:18:13
Or I need pants that are a little tighter in the thigh.
Katie McManus
00:18:16
Or this color.
Katie McManus
00:18:18
I like it, but it just doesn't do anything for my complexion.
Katie McManus
00:18:21
Do you have it in a different color?
Katie McManus
00:18:23
When people raise objections, they're helping you find the better option for them.
Katie McManus
00:18:30
And in the moment, it feels like a rejection because they're saying, I don't like this.
Katie McManus
00:18:33
This is the part that I don't like.
Katie McManus
00:18:35
And when it's a service you're providing, it feels like they're saying they don't like your service.
Katie McManus
00:18:39
No, no, no, no, no, no.
Katie McManus
00:18:41
They're saying there's a part of this service that just doesn't fit me.
Katie McManus
00:18:44
And sometimes there's no adjustment to be made.
Katie McManus
00:18:48
That is the service, that is the program.
Katie McManus
00:18:49
And if it doesn't fit them, it helps you sort for are they the right client for you.
Katie McManus
00:18:54
Right?
Katie McManus
00:18:54
This is a two way street.
Katie McManus
00:18:56
It's not just a one way interview where they're sitting here judging you, seeing if you're the right person for them.
Katie McManus
00:19:01
You are also sorting for are they the right client for you.
Katie McManus
00:19:05
Because let me tell you, there's nothing worse than having the like a business full of your wrong clients.
Katie McManus
00:19:11
It's maddening.
Katie McManus
00:19:12
Everyone feels like a pain in the ass.
Katie McManus
00:19:15
You're going to feel like you're changing gears so many times in a day you can't get into a groove and you're always going to feel like you can't make anyone happy.
Katie McManus
00:19:23
No one wants that.
Katie McManus
00:19:24
So remember that objections are not rejections.
Katie McManus
00:19:32
Next f the follow up, freak out.
Katie McManus
00:19:36
I had this coworker when I worked at Equinox and her name was Emily.
Katie McManus
00:19:40
We actually ended up being roommates and it was so much fun.
Katie McManus
00:19:42
But she had this very quirky way of looking at the world.
Katie McManus
00:19:45
She told the, the funniest stories that usually had her being in the wrong, but like, you know, in a charming way.
Katie McManus
00:19:51
She always had this way of looking at follow up, right?
Katie McManus
00:19:54
Because people would come into the gym and inquire about what membership was, how much it was, they'd get a tour and then if they didn't say yes or no, we would follow up with them.
Katie McManus
00:20:05
Right.
Katie McManus
00:20:05
Reasonably.
Katie McManus
00:20:06
That's what salespeople do.
Katie McManus
00:20:08
You follow up until you get a clear answer either way.
Katie McManus
00:20:11
And we do these little pow wows where we'd meet as a sales team with our manager and she'd talk about how she'd call someone after they did a tour of the club and she designed with them that she was going to call them to follow up and they'd get upset that she was calling because some people are weird like that.
Katie McManus
00:20:30
And her whole philosophy is like, listen, you came into my house, you asked for my time, you came into my sphere and wanted the things from me.
Katie McManus
00:20:44
What is unreasonable about me calling you like you agreed to and me asking for an answer either way?
Katie McManus
00:20:52
Now obviously she wouldn't say this to people in that way, but as she's, you know, debriefing it with us, this was her perspective on it.
Katie McManus
00:20:59
And when you say it like that, it Sounds so reasonable to follow up with people.
Katie McManus
00:21:04
If you're a consultant or a coach, chances are you charge anywhere from 200 to $3,000 an hour, depending on what you do.
Katie McManus
00:21:12
If someone came in and booked a half hour of your time, took it away from, like, other paid work you could potentially do, other promotional work you could potentially do, and then refused to give you an offer and then got weird about you following up with them, like, what an asshole.
Katie McManus
00:21:29
It's not unreasonable for you to follow up with someone to find out if they're a yes or a no.
Katie McManus
00:21:36
And most of the time, when people want to sign up for the thing, when they're a yes, and they just haven't gotten around to saying yes yet, when you follow up, they see it as, oh, my God, thank you.
Katie McManus
00:21:47
I've been meaning to call you.
Katie McManus
00:21:48
You saved me time and energy.
Katie McManus
00:21:50
And now I get to have this thing that I want or this service or this program.
Katie McManus
00:21:54
Yay.
Katie McManus
00:21:55
Following up is part of the sales process.
Katie McManus
00:21:58
Now, one of the things I train in my programs is how do you follow up in a way that you're basically guaranteed to get an answer either way, there's practically no such thing as getting ghosted in holistic selling.
Katie McManus
00:22:12
And if you're curious about those programs, then I want you to go to weenycast.com strategycall and book a call with me and we can talk all about it.
Katie McManus
00:22:20
But for right now, in the process, the sales process that you have, give yourself full permission to follow up.
Katie McManus
00:22:27
There's nothing wrong with it.
Katie McManus
00:22:29
What's wrong with it is their reaction.
Katie McManus
00:22:31
If they get upset because they came into your house and asked you for information about your thing and said, yes, I want you to follow up with me.
Katie McManus
00:22:40
And for the final letter in our weird acronym, our weird IKEA acronym, AD coeffle.
Katie McManus
00:22:49
Elle Learn.
Katie McManus
00:22:52
Do you know that there is no college degree that covers selling in the United States?
Katie McManus
00:22:59
There are no college programs that are focused on sales.
Katie McManus
00:23:02
And yet 50% of people who graduate college will end up in a sales role at some point in their career.
Katie McManus
00:23:10
How insane is that?
Katie McManus
00:23:13
We look down on sales.
Katie McManus
00:23:15
We look down on people who are sales professionals because we see it as something that is, for some reason, not noble.
Katie McManus
00:23:24
And when we get into these situations where we have to sell, we have this weird expectation of ourselves that we should know how to do this naturally, which is complete bull.
Katie McManus
00:23:35
You have to learn.
Katie McManus
00:23:37
There's nothing wrong with admitting you don't know something.
Katie McManus
00:23:40
I mean, you know this.
Katie McManus
00:23:41
You offer a service.
Katie McManus
00:23:43
You teach people things.
Katie McManus
00:23:45
You help them with stuff that's beyond their scope.
Katie McManus
00:23:48
Why is it okay for your clients to hire you to learn from you and not okay for you to learn yourself?
Katie McManus
00:23:56
What makes you so different?
Katie McManus
00:23:58
As with anything, learning to sell, it's a skill building process.
Katie McManus
00:24:04
By the way you've been doing it this whole episode.
Katie McManus
00:24:07
You've been learning about how to be more confident in your sales.
Katie McManus
00:24:11
Figure out a process that feels good to you and go and learn it.
Katie McManus
00:24:15
Go hire someone who teaches it or read a book, whatever.
Katie McManus
00:24:19
Because the only way to get better at anything is to learn and then practice.
Katie McManus
00:24:25
But you can't not know how to do it and then practice not knowing how to do it.
Katie McManus
00:24:29
I mean, you can and a lot of people do.
Katie McManus
00:24:32
Let me tell you.
Katie McManus
00:24:32
It doesn't go well for them.
Katie McManus
00:24:34
That's usually when they call me freaking out that it's not working and then bring me in a little too late.
Katie McManus
00:24:42
Not, not irredeemably too late, but just, they could have, they could have saved themselves a lot of time and energy and made a lot more money if they just brought me in earlier.
Katie McManus
00:24:51
So go and invest in learning how to sell.
Katie McManus
00:24:54
It'll make a world of difference.
Katie McManus
00:24:57
And think about it.
Katie McManus
00:24:58
If you bought a bike and you didn't know how to ride a bike, how confident would you be hopping on the bike and riding it to the store?
Katie McManus
00:25:05
Not very.
Katie McManus
00:25:06
You need someone to show you.
Katie McManus
00:25:09
You need someone to keep an eye on how you're holding onto the brakes and how you're pedaling and how you're turning.
Katie McManus
00:25:15
And you know you have to watch where you're going.
Katie McManus
00:25:17
Be careful of the bush.
Katie McManus
00:25:19
So when in doubt, just remember, add coffee and that'll help you be better at sales.
Katie McManus
00:25:28
This acronym that I just made up, that sounds like a piece of Ikea furniture, I think it would be a bedside table.
Katie McManus
00:25:34
Like one of those unfinished ones that like, is raw wood that you could like add a stain or paint little designs on or whatever.
Katie McManus
00:25:42
Maybe, maybe use some wallpaper on the top that would be kind of fancy with some, whatever the applique is that seals it in.
Katie McManus
00:25:49
Obviously very handy.
00:00:18
Let's get you mastering your sales conversations.
Katie McManus
00:00:21
Hi, I'm Katie McManus, business strategist and money mindset coach.
Katie McManus
00:00:24
And welcome to the Weapon.
Katie McManus
00:00:27
Even my clients who come from a sales background need to be retrained on how to sell their own services.
Katie McManus
00:00:35
This is because selling your own services is like selling your own expertise, your own time.
Katie McManus
00:00:41
It's like selling your soul.
Katie McManus
00:00:42
In some instances, it's very different to sell your service than it is to sell a house or a luxury car or a fancy handbag or software.
Katie McManus
00:00:54
As a service, they are worlds apart.
Katie McManus
00:00:57
Mainly because when someone rejects you, when you're selling an object or something that's separate from you, well, you can rationalize that they're not rejecting you, they're rejecting the thing.
Katie McManus
00:01:09
You know, if you're a real estate agent and you're showing someone houses, like, no, I don't want this house because it only has three bedrooms and I wanted four.
Katie McManus
00:01:17
Cool.
Katie McManus
00:01:18
That has nothing to do with me as a human being.
Katie McManus
00:01:21
That has to do with the house not having enough bedrooms.
Katie McManus
00:01:24
Got it.
Katie McManus
00:01:25
Or maybe you wanted a craftsman instead of a mid century modern.
Katie McManus
00:01:29
Okay, cool.
Katie McManus
00:01:30
That has to do with the quality of the house, not me.
Katie McManus
00:01:33
But when you're selling your service, when you're on the phone with someone or on Zoom and you're explaining what you do and you're just being yourself and they say, no, I don't want this, there's no external object that you can point at to say, oh, well, it was just this they didn't want.
Katie McManus
00:01:51
It feels like a personal rejection.
Katie McManus
00:01:53
And there's a reason why we have so many love stories in movies and in books.
Katie McManus
00:01:59
Because the stakes are really high.
Katie McManus
00:02:01
The stakes are heartbreak.
Katie McManus
00:02:04
Being rejected, not being wanted.
Katie McManus
00:02:07
That is really hard for the human spirit to deal with.
Katie McManus
00:02:10
It's hard in romance, and it's hard in business.
Katie McManus
00:02:13
If you are starting your business, growing your business, and sales is still really hard for you, it feels like a massive emotional lift and you feel zero confidence doing it.
Katie McManus
00:02:24
Know that you're not alone.
Katie McManus
00:02:26
This happens for most people.
Katie McManus
00:02:28
Like I said, even my clients who come from a sales background, I have to retrain them on how to sell their own services.
Katie McManus
00:02:37
It's hard.
Katie McManus
00:02:38
And there are a few things a lot of people do that actually makes it harder to a get the sale and to feel good about it.
Katie McManus
00:02:45
So in this episode, I'm going to break down what those things are that are making selling difficult.
Katie McManus
00:02:51
And I'm going to talk you through the simple shifts you can make to feel far more grounded in your sales call to understand the rejection is not about you and to get more clients right off the bat, we got to ditch the pitch.
Katie McManus
00:03:10
Pitches don't work.
Katie McManus
00:03:11
When you're doing a service, you jump into a sales conversation with someone and then immediately whip out your slide deck.
Katie McManus
00:03:20
What did you think I was going to say?
Katie McManus
00:03:22
To go through what your offer is, you're going to have a much lower yes rate, meaning fewer people are going to say yes to working with you.
Katie McManus
00:03:31
Pitches are dead.
Katie McManus
00:03:32
There are a few reasons for this.
Katie McManus
00:03:34
Number one, watching a slideshow about a thing is boring.
Katie McManus
00:03:39
As f.
Katie McManus
00:03:40
Have you ever gone over to someone's house for dinner and had them tell you, oh, yeah, I did this huge presentation for work this week and then been like, oh, my God, can I see the slides that you did?
Katie McManus
00:03:50
Oh, my God, can you do it for me?
Katie McManus
00:03:52
No, of course not.
Katie McManus
00:03:53
That sounds awful.
Katie McManus
00:03:55
That sounds like going through a meeting, like a bad meeting where you don't really understand what they're talking about.
Katie McManus
00:04:02
And I know as the person who's selling the thing, it feels like something that makes you look credible.
Katie McManus
00:04:08
It feels like something that facilitates you convincing this person to buy your stuff, to buy your program, your service, whatever.
Katie McManus
00:04:18
And it feels like a checklist, right?
Katie McManus
00:04:19
So you don't miss anything.
Katie McManus
00:04:21
They might care about all of it.
Katie McManus
00:04:22
And what if you forget to mention it?
Katie McManus
00:04:24
But it's boring.
Katie McManus
00:04:26
I have never in my life sat through a slide presentation and walked away, remembering even a fraction of what was just presented to me.
Katie McManus
00:04:36
Most of the time, my eyes are glazed over, and I'm just nodding when I sense it's the right time to nod, because I don't want to be rude and leave the meeting or end the call early, but I can't wait to get away from it.
Katie McManus
00:04:50
The other side of it is when we present slides, when we have a PowerPoint presentation and we're pointing to something other than us, we actually create distance.
Katie McManus
00:05:01
And so it makes sense that folks who are just starting to sell their service or who are trying to branch out into bigger deals will try to use a slide deck because it makes it feel less vulnerable.
Katie McManus
00:05:12
It's almost like this armor that you put up.
Katie McManus
00:05:15
It's like this wall, like, oh, cool, here's the thing that you're going to reject.
Katie McManus
00:05:18
Just like you rejected that house and that car in that handbag, you can reject this instead of me.
Katie McManus
00:05:24
But when you're selling a service, that wall, that armor, that distance, all it does is kills connection.
Katie McManus
00:05:31
And there's this huge question that I get all the time from clients who work with me who are just starting their business to clients who have been running their business for five years and who want to scale.
Katie McManus
00:05:41
And it's.
Katie McManus
00:05:42
How do I describe what I do?
Katie McManus
00:05:44
And I truly believe it comes from the fact that we've just figured out at some level that, like, what we do, the service we provide, the work we do.
Katie McManus
00:05:54
That's so intellectual.
Katie McManus
00:05:56
It's so in our head.
Katie McManus
00:05:56
It's so innate to us.
Katie McManus
00:05:58
We've just kind of figured out that not everyone thinks this way.
Katie McManus
00:06:01
We've just figured out that this is, like, unique to us.
Katie McManus
00:06:04
We have this way of doing this thing that is useful to other people.
Katie McManus
00:06:07
And because we've gone through our whole life just assuming everyone knows how to do this thing, it seems so weird to try to describe what it is that's valuable to someone who doesn't think that way.
Katie McManus
00:06:19
And especially when you end up in a conversation where someone has come to you and they're saying, hey, I'm interested in that thing you do.
Katie McManus
00:06:25
We think, oh, God.
Katie McManus
00:06:26
Well, I have to tell them what it is.
Katie McManus
00:06:28
It's like someone saying, hey, I know you have a device that helps you go from one point to the other.
Katie McManus
00:06:33
I'd like to buy it.
Katie McManus
00:06:34
And you're like, oh, God, well, it's a bike.
Katie McManus
00:06:35
Do they know how to ride a bike?
Katie McManus
00:06:37
I have to describe what the bike is, right?
Katie McManus
00:06:40
It's the wrong question.
Katie McManus
00:06:42
Especially when you're selling a service, because people don't give a F what you do.
Katie McManus
00:06:46
If you were a magic belly dancer and people paid you $7,000 to just do a magic belly dance, and they got the result that they wanted.
Katie McManus
00:06:54
Do you know how many people you'd have lined around the block just telling you to dance?
Katie McManus
00:06:59
God, your abs would be so sore.
Katie McManus
00:07:03
Your neighbors would be complaining about the music and the jingling from your little jingle belt.
Katie McManus
00:07:08
I think that's the technical word for them.
Katie McManus
00:07:10
I don't know the word, but we're just going to say jingle belt because it sounds good.
Katie McManus
00:07:14
People actually don't care what you do.
Katie McManus
00:07:17
They care that you solve the problem that they have and that you help them reach their goal.
Katie McManus
00:07:22
And all these things that we do to try to get clients using these kinds of practices, where we're describing our process, they're all manifestations of the same thing.
Katie McManus
00:07:34
Convincing them.
Katie McManus
00:07:35
We feel like we have to convince this person to buy from us.
Katie McManus
00:07:40
And it's the furthest thing from the truth.
Katie McManus
00:07:42
And to shift away from this, I want you to remember this acronym that I just Made up.
Katie McManus
00:07:48
That sounds like a piece of Ikea furniture.
Katie McManus
00:07:50
This acronym is AD coeffle A D K O F L.
Katie McManus
00:08:01
And step one, the A is I want you to assume.
Katie McManus
00:08:06
I know that saying.
Katie McManus
00:08:07
When you assume, you make an ass of you and me.
Katie McManus
00:08:10
Go ahead and make an ass of yourself.
Katie McManus
00:08:12
Full permission to be the ass.
Katie McManus
00:08:15
Because think about it.
Katie McManus
00:08:16
Do you just willy nilly go and book sales calls with everyone and their mother for things that you don't even want?
Katie McManus
00:08:23
Do you do that for fun?
Katie McManus
00:08:25
Do you go to car lots when you don't want a car and go through the whole sales process?
Katie McManus
00:08:30
Do you go on tours of homes and start drafting up offers with real estate agents when you don't want something?
Katie McManus
00:08:37
Do you go to the appliance store and check out refrigerators when you're not actually looking for a refrigerator?
Katie McManus
00:08:43
Probably not.
Katie McManus
00:08:45
People don't do that.
Katie McManus
00:08:47
At least normal people.
Katie McManus
00:08:48
If you're not.
Katie McManus
00:08:48
If you're one of those weirdos who does this and we have to have a different conversation.
Katie McManus
00:08:52
So you have full permission to assume that this person came here because they want to say yes.
Katie McManus
00:09:00
That this person booked a call with you because they believe that hiring you will solve their problem, will help them reach their goal.
Katie McManus
00:09:11
Why would someone take a half hour out of their day to have, let's be honest, an uncomfortable conversation with you where they may need to tell you no?
Katie McManus
00:09:23
Because people don't like saying no to other people if they didn't want your thing?
Katie McManus
00:09:29
When I book a sales call with someone, it's because I believe that I want the thing.
Katie McManus
00:09:33
Now, sometimes in the sales call, I realize the thing is not actually what I thought it was, or it's not a good fit for me, or it requires too much time or effort on my part and I need to find something else.
Katie McManus
00:09:46
And that's okay.
Katie McManus
00:09:48
That's absolutely okay.
Katie McManus
00:09:50
But I walk into it fully believing I want to buy this thing.
Katie McManus
00:09:54
The main key to confidence in a sales call is just simply assuming everyone who books a sales call with you wants to buy your service or your program.
Katie McManus
00:10:06
So that's a D.
Katie McManus
00:10:33
Don't convince.
Katie McManus
00:10:35
Listen, you know how we were talking about the slideshow and how it doesn't work?
Katie McManus
00:10:41
The reason it doesn't work is because you're usually blasting them with a ton of information that they don't give a fuck about.
Katie McManus
00:10:46
Okay?
Katie McManus
00:10:47
When I buy a car, the last thing I care about is the engine.
Katie McManus
00:10:51
I could not give a flying F about the upholstery, the sound system.
Katie McManus
00:10:57
I don't care about how special the tires Are.
Katie McManus
00:11:00
I don't even know all the things that I do not care about.
Katie McManus
00:11:04
But if a salesperson tries to tell me all this stuff, I will be bored out of my mind.
Katie McManus
00:11:08
Do you know I do care about?
Katie McManus
00:11:10
Is there room for my dog?
Katie McManus
00:11:12
Will she be comfortable in the backseat?
Katie McManus
00:11:14
Will she be able to safely jump from the backseat into the front seat?
Katie McManus
00:11:17
Because that's where she actually likes to sit no matter how much I want her in the backseat.
Katie McManus
00:11:21
Do the headlights work?
Katie McManus
00:11:23
Are there buttons?
Katie McManus
00:11:25
I really like a good button.
Katie McManus
00:11:26
I don't like this like, screen thing.
Katie McManus
00:11:29
There was a conversation on LinkedIn a few days ago where someone was talking about their son and how their son really liked flying planes.
Katie McManus
00:11:36
Like being a passenger in a plane.
Katie McManus
00:11:38
And the dad is like, oh my God, you could be a pilot and you could do this and you could do this and you could do this.
Katie McManus
00:11:43
And the kid's like, okay, yeah, uh huh.
Katie McManus
00:11:45
And he's like, but are there buttons?
Katie McManus
00:11:48
Would I be able to press buttons?
Katie McManus
00:11:50
And I so connected with this because the one time I drove a Porsche Macan, it was a friend's Porsche Macan.
Katie McManus
00:11:56
The thing I loved most about this car was not how cool it was, wasn't how expensive it was or fancy or any of the features.
Katie McManus
00:12:03
It was the fact that there are so many buttons.
Katie McManus
00:12:06
It was like a control center.
Katie McManus
00:12:07
And while you're driving it, it was so intuitive that the first time I drove it, I didn't even have to look.
Katie McManus
00:12:15
I could just go and feel around all these buttons and press a button and the air conditioning went off.
Katie McManus
00:12:20
Magic.
Katie McManus
00:12:22
Oh my God.
Katie McManus
00:12:22
I still like.
Katie McManus
00:12:23
It was one of the best driving experiences in my life because of that one thing.
Katie McManus
00:12:29
That's what I care about.
Katie McManus
00:12:30
Not this touchscreen crap, okay?
Katie McManus
00:12:33
That requires me to take my eyes off the road.
Katie McManus
00:12:34
I don't like that.
Katie McManus
00:12:35
The other thing I care about, trunk space and is it going to be covered up?
Katie McManus
00:12:40
You know, because I'm sorry, I'm very disorganized and I like to leave a lot of crap in the car because I know I'm going to forget and I don't want people thinking that, you know, there's valuable things in the car because there's usually not.
Katie McManus
00:12:52
But I also don't want to take it out and put it back in and take it out and put it back in.
Katie McManus
00:12:56
So I need, I need the trunk space to be covered so people won't try to break into my car.
Katie McManus
00:13:01
You're never going to find that out.
Katie McManus
00:13:02
These weird things about your clients, the things they care about, the questions they have, are there buttons?
Katie McManus
00:13:08
Unless you listen.
Katie McManus
00:13:10
So you need to stop trying to convince them of all the cool features of working with you and all the interesting things that you do.
Katie McManus
00:13:17
Because chances are they do not give a fuck about most of it.
Katie McManus
00:13:21
They care about the things that they care about.
Katie McManus
00:13:24
And the only way for you to figure out what those things are is to listen to them.
Katie McManus
00:13:28
So ad coeffle ad k know that no isn't bad.
Katie McManus
00:13:40
A lot of the anxiety we get when we get on a sales call is around the fear that they might say no.
Katie McManus
00:13:46
Because again, like we've already discussed, it feels like a very deep rejection of who we are and all the gifts we have.
Katie McManus
00:13:55
It's like you were dating for 30 minutes and then they broke up with you because they didn't like you.
Katie McManus
00:14:00
Oh, so sad.
Katie McManus
00:14:02
But actually, hearing no is a really healthy thing to hear as a business person.
Katie McManus
00:14:06
Right?
Katie McManus
00:14:07
Not everyone who comes to you is going to be your ideal client or can afford to work with you.
Katie McManus
00:14:12
In fact, if you have a solid offer that sells really well, chances are you're only hearing yes 25 to 50% of the time.
Katie McManus
00:14:19
That's a really strong yes no ratio.
Katie McManus
00:14:23
So out of every four people, two to three of them should say no to working with you.
Katie McManus
00:14:29
That's a good sign.
Katie McManus
00:14:31
Now, if your yes rate drops below 25%, we need to look at some things and it might be that we need to look at your sales process, we might need to redesign your offer, we might need to tweak your marketing, but it's just information.
Katie McManus
00:14:47
It's just data.
Katie McManus
00:14:48
It doesn't mean that you're not good at this.
Katie McManus
00:14:50
It doesn't mean that your business is going to fail.
Katie McManus
00:14:53
Our brains are these beautiful meaning making machines, right?
Katie McManus
00:14:57
And that's the source of some of the most beautiful poetry and stories and art and music that we've had as a species.
Katie McManus
00:15:04
Think of that part of your brain that sees something random throughout the day and it's like, oh my God, this is a sign I have to do the thing.
Katie McManus
00:15:10
And then it completely changes your life.
Katie McManus
00:15:12
That is one of the most beautiful things about humans.
Katie McManus
00:15:15
It's also one of the most destructive things about us because we take raw data that someone said no to us and we make it all about us.
Katie McManus
00:15:23
We make it mean something about how we're not good enough, we're not smart enough, we're not articulate enough, we weren't convincing enough, all the things.
Katie McManus
00:15:32
And then we spiral into this is never going to work.
Katie McManus
00:15:36
Babes, slow the down.
Katie McManus
00:15:39
It Just means a part of the process isn't working.
Katie McManus
00:15:43
And that part of the process, now that you're getting the data that something is not working, we can go and start tweaking things.
Katie McManus
00:15:49
We can change your marketing a little bit and see if that changes it.
Katie McManus
00:15:52
We can update your offer or your pricing and see if that changes it.
Katie McManus
00:15:56
We can adjust your sales process and see if that helps it.
Katie McManus
00:16:00
You have to know that no is not bad.
Katie McManus
00:16:03
It's just data and related to this.
Katie McManus
00:16:06
Ed Coeffle.
Katie McManus
00:16:56
Oh, objections aren't rejections.
Katie McManus
00:16:59
And let me.
Katie McManus
00:17:00
Let me break this down, because a lot of people don't know what this word actually means.
Katie McManus
00:17:03
An objection.
Katie McManus
00:17:04
Right.
Katie McManus
00:17:05
So back to the example of me going and buying a car.
Katie McManus
00:17:08
An objection might be, I don't like the touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:11
Doesn't mean that you're not going to sell me a car, because I hate this touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:14
That's not a rejection.
Katie McManus
00:17:16
It's information.
Katie McManus
00:17:17
If I'm saying I'm rejecting this model of this car because I don't like the touchscreen, I prefer buttons.
Katie McManus
00:17:24
You as a salesperson, like, oh, I'm so glad you said that.
Katie McManus
00:17:28
Because we actually have a model of this that doesn't have a touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:31
And it's actually less expensive because most people do want the touchscreen.
Katie McManus
00:17:34
Cause it's fancy.
Katie McManus
00:17:36
You're obviously not a very fancy person, so we'll give you some buttons.
Katie McManus
00:17:39
Like, I want you to think about the last time you went and bought clothes and you got a bunch of stuff and you went into the fitting room and you tried them on.
Katie McManus
00:17:46
You didn't stand there in front of the mirror in a shirt that you liked the idea of, but it didn't quite fit your chest very well.
Katie McManus
00:17:55
Or pants that, like, were maybe just a little too baggy in the thigh.
Katie McManus
00:18:00
This whole brand sucks.
Katie McManus
00:18:02
I hate them.
Katie McManus
00:18:03
Who's the designer?
Katie McManus
00:18:04
I want to go and burn their house down.
Katie McManus
00:18:06
No, of course not.
Katie McManus
00:18:07
You're just like, oh, bummer.
Katie McManus
00:18:09
Like, okay, I need a shirt that has a little more give here.
Katie McManus
00:18:13
Or I need pants that are a little tighter in the thigh.
Katie McManus
00:18:16
Or this color.
Katie McManus
00:18:18
I like it, but it just doesn't do anything for my complexion.
Katie McManus
00:18:21
Do you have it in a different color?
Katie McManus
00:18:23
When people raise objections, they're helping you find the better option for them.
Katie McManus
00:18:30
And in the moment, it feels like a rejection because they're saying, I don't like this.
Katie McManus
00:18:33
This is the part that I don't like.
Katie McManus
00:18:35
And when it's a service you're providing, it feels like they're saying they don't like your service.
Katie McManus
00:18:39
No, no, no, no, no, no.
Katie McManus
00:18:41
They're saying there's a part of this service that just doesn't fit me.
Katie McManus
00:18:44
And sometimes there's no adjustment to be made.
Katie McManus
00:18:48
That is the service, that is the program.
Katie McManus
00:18:49
And if it doesn't fit them, it helps you sort for are they the right client for you.
Katie McManus
00:18:54
Right?
Katie McManus
00:18:54
This is a two way street.
Katie McManus
00:18:56
It's not just a one way interview where they're sitting here judging you, seeing if you're the right person for them.
Katie McManus
00:19:01
You are also sorting for are they the right client for you.
Katie McManus
00:19:05
Because let me tell you, there's nothing worse than having the like a business full of your wrong clients.
Katie McManus
00:19:11
It's maddening.
Katie McManus
00:19:12
Everyone feels like a pain in the ass.
Katie McManus
00:19:15
You're going to feel like you're changing gears so many times in a day you can't get into a groove and you're always going to feel like you can't make anyone happy.
Katie McManus
00:19:23
No one wants that.
Katie McManus
00:19:24
So remember that objections are not rejections.
Katie McManus
00:19:32
Next f the follow up, freak out.
Katie McManus
00:19:36
I had this coworker when I worked at Equinox and her name was Emily.
Katie McManus
00:19:40
We actually ended up being roommates and it was so much fun.
Katie McManus
00:19:42
But she had this very quirky way of looking at the world.
Katie McManus
00:19:45
She told the, the funniest stories that usually had her being in the wrong, but like, you know, in a charming way.
Katie McManus
00:19:51
She always had this way of looking at follow up, right?
Katie McManus
00:19:54
Because people would come into the gym and inquire about what membership was, how much it was, they'd get a tour and then if they didn't say yes or no, we would follow up with them.
Katie McManus
00:20:05
Right.
Katie McManus
00:20:05
Reasonably.
Katie McManus
00:20:06
That's what salespeople do.
Katie McManus
00:20:08
You follow up until you get a clear answer either way.
Katie McManus
00:20:11
And we do these little pow wows where we'd meet as a sales team with our manager and she'd talk about how she'd call someone after they did a tour of the club and she designed with them that she was going to call them to follow up and they'd get upset that she was calling because some people are weird like that.
Katie McManus
00:20:30
And her whole philosophy is like, listen, you came into my house, you asked for my time, you came into my sphere and wanted the things from me.
Katie McManus
00:20:44
What is unreasonable about me calling you like you agreed to and me asking for an answer either way?
Katie McManus
00:20:52
Now obviously she wouldn't say this to people in that way, but as she's, you know, debriefing it with us, this was her perspective on it.
Katie McManus
00:20:59
And when you say it like that, it Sounds so reasonable to follow up with people.
Katie McManus
00:21:04
If you're a consultant or a coach, chances are you charge anywhere from 200 to $3,000 an hour, depending on what you do.
Katie McManus
00:21:12
If someone came in and booked a half hour of your time, took it away from, like, other paid work you could potentially do, other promotional work you could potentially do, and then refused to give you an offer and then got weird about you following up with them, like, what an asshole.
Katie McManus
00:21:29
It's not unreasonable for you to follow up with someone to find out if they're a yes or a no.
Katie McManus
00:21:36
And most of the time, when people want to sign up for the thing, when they're a yes, and they just haven't gotten around to saying yes yet, when you follow up, they see it as, oh, my God, thank you.
Katie McManus
00:21:47
I've been meaning to call you.
Katie McManus
00:21:48
You saved me time and energy.
Katie McManus
00:21:50
And now I get to have this thing that I want or this service or this program.
Katie McManus
00:21:54
Yay.
Katie McManus
00:21:55
Following up is part of the sales process.
Katie McManus
00:21:58
Now, one of the things I train in my programs is how do you follow up in a way that you're basically guaranteed to get an answer either way, there's practically no such thing as getting ghosted in holistic selling.
Katie McManus
00:22:12
And if you're curious about those programs, then I want you to go to weenycast.com strategycall and book a call with me and we can talk all about it.
Katie McManus
00:22:20
But for right now, in the process, the sales process that you have, give yourself full permission to follow up.
Katie McManus
00:22:27
There's nothing wrong with it.
Katie McManus
00:22:29
What's wrong with it is their reaction.
Katie McManus
00:22:31
If they get upset because they came into your house and asked you for information about your thing and said, yes, I want you to follow up with me.
Katie McManus
00:22:40
And for the final letter in our weird acronym, our weird IKEA acronym, AD coeffle.
Katie McManus
00:22:49
Elle Learn.
Katie McManus
00:22:52
Do you know that there is no college degree that covers selling in the United States?
Katie McManus
00:22:59
There are no college programs that are focused on sales.
Katie McManus
00:23:02
And yet 50% of people who graduate college will end up in a sales role at some point in their career.
Katie McManus
00:23:10
How insane is that?
Katie McManus
00:23:13
We look down on sales.
Katie McManus
00:23:15
We look down on people who are sales professionals because we see it as something that is, for some reason, not noble.
Katie McManus
00:23:24
And when we get into these situations where we have to sell, we have this weird expectation of ourselves that we should know how to do this naturally, which is complete bull.
Katie McManus
00:23:35
You have to learn.
Katie McManus
00:23:37
There's nothing wrong with admitting you don't know something.
Katie McManus
00:23:40
I mean, you know this.
Katie McManus
00:23:41
You offer a service.
Katie McManus
00:23:43
You teach people things.
Katie McManus
00:23:45
You help them with stuff that's beyond their scope.
Katie McManus
00:23:48
Why is it okay for your clients to hire you to learn from you and not okay for you to learn yourself?
Katie McManus
00:23:56
What makes you so different?
Katie McManus
00:23:58
As with anything, learning to sell, it's a skill building process.
Katie McManus
00:24:04
By the way you've been doing it this whole episode.
Katie McManus
00:24:07
You've been learning about how to be more confident in your sales.
Katie McManus
00:24:11
Figure out a process that feels good to you and go and learn it.
Katie McManus
00:24:15
Go hire someone who teaches it or read a book, whatever.
Katie McManus
00:24:19
Because the only way to get better at anything is to learn and then practice.
Katie McManus
00:24:25
But you can't not know how to do it and then practice not knowing how to do it.
Katie McManus
00:24:29
I mean, you can and a lot of people do.
Katie McManus
00:24:32
Let me tell you.
Katie McManus
00:24:32
It doesn't go well for them.
Katie McManus
00:24:34
That's usually when they call me freaking out that it's not working and then bring me in a little too late.
Katie McManus
00:24:42
Not, not irredeemably too late, but just, they could have, they could have saved themselves a lot of time and energy and made a lot more money if they just brought me in earlier.
Katie McManus
00:24:51
So go and invest in learning how to sell.
Katie McManus
00:24:54
It'll make a world of difference.
Katie McManus
00:24:57
And think about it.
Katie McManus
00:24:58
If you bought a bike and you didn't know how to ride a bike, how confident would you be hopping on the bike and riding it to the store?
Katie McManus
00:25:05
Not very.
Katie McManus
00:25:06
You need someone to show you.
Katie McManus
00:25:09
You need someone to keep an eye on how you're holding onto the brakes and how you're pedaling and how you're turning.
Katie McManus
00:25:15
And you know you have to watch where you're going.
Katie McManus
00:25:17
Be careful of the bush.
Katie McManus
00:25:19
So when in doubt, just remember, add coffee and that'll help you be better at sales.
Katie McManus
00:25:28
This acronym that I just made up, that sounds like a piece of Ikea furniture, I think it would be a bedside table.
Katie McManus
00:25:34
Like one of those unfinished ones that like, is raw wood that you could like add a stain or paint little designs on or whatever.
Katie McManus
00:25:42
Maybe, maybe use some wallpaper on the top that would be kind of fancy with some, whatever the applique is that seals it in.
Katie McManus
00:25:49
Obviously very handy.
