ABOUT THIS EPISODE
What does it look like when a general counsel doesn't just adopt AI—but rewires her entire legal function around it?
In this episode, Mary O'Carroll sits down with Shannon Thyme Klinger, Chief Legal Officer at Moderna and President of Moderna Charitable Foundation. Named by the Financial Times as one of the most innovative GCs of the past two decades, Shannon is reshaping what it means to lead a legal team—and a profession—through profound change.
In this episode:
- "AI won't replace lawyers, but…" Shannon lays out her bold vision: why lawyers who don't harness AI may get left behind—and how her team at Moderna is using GPTs, reasoning models, and agents to transform everything from contracts to compliance.
- From Skepticism to Buy-In: How Shannon got a room full of reluctant legal leaders to see AI's potential—by showing, not telling.
- The Self-Service Revolution: Why Moderna's business teams now use AI-powered contract tools to answer 90% of their questions—freeing legal to focus on higher-value work.
- Fearless Experimentation: The mindset shift that changed everything: fail fast, learn faster.
- Beyond Legal: Why Shannon sees legal ops as a strategic engine, not a back-office function—and how her team is training other departments to work smarter with AI.
- The Big Picture: Shannon's take on the future of legal—what's at risk, what needs to change, and why it's time for GCs and law firms to rewrite the playbook.
If you've ever wondered what real legal transformation looks like—led from the top, grounded in purpose, and driven by tech—this conversation is your blueprint.
English
United States
TRANSCRIPT 🔗
Are you the producer of this podcast?
Add a podcast transcript
Need Audio-to-Text?
Transcribe with Listen411 in Just 60 Seconds
SEARCH PAST EPISODES
Search past episodes of Pearls On, Gloves Off: The Legal Innovation Podcast.
OTHER EPISODES IN THIS PODCAST
In today's episode, Mary sits down with James O'Dowd, CEO and founder of Patrick Morgan, to explore what legal can learn from the PE and AI disruption already reshaping accounting and consulting. James breaks down why governance is the real unlock private equity brings, how compensation models are …
In today's episode, Mary sits down with Ilona Logvinova, Chief AI Officer at HSF Kramer, to talk about what it actually takes to turn a global law firm into an AI native organization. They cover why the Chief AI Officer title means something different from innovation, what it takes to build a forwa…
In today's episode, Mary sits down with Winston Weinberg, CEO and Co-Founder of Harvey.ai, to talk about what it actually takes to transform legal - and why buying AI tools without rethinking how your entire organization operates is the wrong place to start.
This episode is presented by Workday.
…
In today's episode, Mary sits down with Michael Pierson and Joel Ferdinand, Co-Chairmen of Pierson Ferdinand, and Christina Wojcik, their Chief Innovation Officer. Together, they break down what it actually takes to build the law firm of the future and why buying AI tools without rethinking your st…
In today's episode, Mary sits down with Aine Lyons, Senior Vice President & Deputy General Counsel and Chief Strategy Officer at Workday, to talk about what it actually takes to build a modern legal department. They cover why Aine deliberately designed Workday's function without a traditional l…
Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Mary O'Carroll, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
EDIT
Thank you for helping to keep the podcast database up to date.
