STOP! Answer This Before Adding Anything

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for every additional service.
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It's not linear.
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It's almost exponential in a way in how complex it feels.
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Your menu...
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In-home services is what services you offer.
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And if that's a long menu, it's gonna be very difficult to do multi-location.
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If I will drop a service when I realize that it is 20% of revenue and causing 80% of my problems.
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We doubled the business every year for the first five or six years.
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My experience was that as we got out of things, things just kept getting better and we went faster.
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It's the level of leadership that most people don't have.
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The ability to lead from two hours away, an hour and a half away, have management in place that is solid, have the systems in place that they can actually duplicate and be effective at.
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I've always loved that idea that the big breakthroughs really come from looking at other industries and swiping what they're doing in other industries and bringing it into your business or into our industry.
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Hey, everyone.
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How's it going today?
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Mike, how are you doing?
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Fantastic.
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Ready for another episode.
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Yeah.
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Hey, last week we broke the two hour sound barrier.
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And I think we broke another like 45 minutes just for the first topic.
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So that's how you break the two hour barrier.
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So out of curiosity, what's the temperature there?
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Right now, I think it's like 63, 64 degrees.
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That'll be relevant for a little later when we're chatting.
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Okay.
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I'll bring that back up.
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So today we've got quite a few things for you.
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So we're talking about when do you add services?
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When do you drop services?
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When do you add markets?
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Yeah.
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How much of a market can you realistically take?
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Like what percentage of market share?
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What are the best ways to expand?
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How do you find employees?
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So we got a lot of really relevant stuff today.
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But before we hop into that, Mike made a pretty interesting announcement yesterday, which will probably be about a week ago for you now when you're watching this.
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But when we're recording, it's about a week ago.
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And he announced that he's going to move to Texas for six months.
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Is this the temperature thing going to come up?
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Yeah.
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could.
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I mean, what do you think?
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It's only 100 here today.
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So anyway, he's moving to Texas for six months.
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He's starting a mowing business at a fertilization weed control business.
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He's going to show you how to go from zero to a million bucks a year.
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He's going to record it all on camera, which I think is pretty cool.
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That's going to be pretty cool to watch.
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Would you say all that's correct?
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Is that, did I, I read your thing, watched your video yesterday.
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Does that sound about right?
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Sounds about right.
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But given that this is the cold open and I don't have any notes on this, I know there's, it's going somewhere.
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What would give you that idea?
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Yeah, and that leads right into the next part, which is,
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The thing Mike didn't tell you in his videos, he's coming into the city turf market.
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Let's go.
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He's coming into my market.
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So city turf had a big meeting yesterday and we believe the best defense is a really, really strong offense.
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Yeah.
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And so we don't want Mike, I know he's already got some franchisees here, but we don't want him to feel too terribly comfortable about the Texas market and think it's too good.
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So we've come up with some strategies, Mike, where we think we're going to be able to bleed away your money and your time when you come into the market.
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It's a war of attrition.
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Yeah, but because we're friends, I thought I'd let you choose how we're going to do it.
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Okay, okay.
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I picked my poison.
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That's a good idea.
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Yeah, exactly.
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So I've got two.
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So first on the time front, how we're going to bleed you financially, I'm going to let you pick how we're going to do it.
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Okay.
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All right, so our first idea is we're going back to bi-weekly and weekly mowing, and you don't have to pair it with another service.
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Okay.
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We're also going to constantly monitor your pricing.
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We're going to price 20% under market.
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Okay.
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And we're about to release online sign-up.
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So that's the first one.
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Whoa, that's just one.
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That's just one attack.
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Oh, that's one.
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That's just part.
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Like I said, it's wrong offense.
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This is how you win.
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Okay.
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So it could either be that or...
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we're going to deploy a marketing budget so ridiculous that we're willing to spend $500, $700, doesn't really matter to us, per client to acquire these $40 mowing clients.
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Okay.
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So we can either drop prices...
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Quit putting conditions on buying mowing from us, or we will just spend crazy amounts of money in the market.
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Which direction would you prefer we go?
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That's a great question.
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Okay.
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So I would probably take the second one because I do think I could out-market you on Facebook ads.
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I will bet you all my money you can because we're not marketing on Facebook.
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If you spend $700 per person, I'm happy to take that bet.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, I wasn't entirely sure which would be the worst.
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I kind of theorize actually number one because, yeah, I don't know because man, trying to bundle mowing, not doing biweekly, bundling it with fertilization weed control really slows down the sales.
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But spending a lot of money in a market doesn't.
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So I was curious what you're going to say.
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All right.
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So your next one.
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This one's really aggressive, kind of mean, frankly.
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All right.
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So this one, you had made mention that you're only going to spend 10 hours a week on this.
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So I figured if we could burn down your 10 hours.
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Did you take this?
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Okay, wait, I have a question.
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Before we get into this, did you take the transcript and dump this into AI to figure this out?
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Or did you come up with these while you're listening?
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Okay.
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I wasn't going to tell you.
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I actually came up with all of these.
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Okay.
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So I got to tell you a funny story, but I wasn't, I wasn't going to do it here, but I got to tell you.
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So I, I, I've been testing out Fable, but I can't really figure out when to use it.
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So I ran this through Fable and I think usually I'm asking the DC stuff.
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It blocked you.
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It blocked you.
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Like you cannot use the model for destructing someone else's business.
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No, no, it didn't do that.
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Although this second point that I'm going to make here in a minute, it didn't like that.
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It said maybe I shouldn't say it.
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So anyway.
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Okay, but here's what it did.
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So I said, I want to come up with something, you know, gave it the whole spiel, funny, cold open, something like that.
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I already had this basic outline that I'm giving you now.
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And I pasted it in there, but I thought it would come up with something different.
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Here's what it did.
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It came back and said, before we proceed, I want to bring something to your attention that you might want to talk to Mike about.
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Did you know he's coming into your market?
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And then it said, do you know that he's launching a school and he used to do coaching?
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And I'm like, Fable, he owns franchises.
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He's already in my market.
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And I don't have a coaching business.
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So anyway, it decided it should bring it to my attention before it even would give me anything funny.
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So anyway, it's your PR.
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It's trying to protect me.
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So whatever.
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Anyway, so, but this second one, it didn't like it.
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And I understand why, but I'm going to go with it anyway.
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All right.
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So I'm going to bleed your time.
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Okay, so my ideas to bleed your time are one.
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Longer answers to the podcast questions.
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Yeah, exactly.
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No, no.
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These are mean.
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These are mean.
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I'll just go ahead and say I would never in 100 million years do these.
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But okay, which would suck up more of your time?
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Okay.
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Every time you hire an operations manager, we will aggressively recruit them and offer...
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Offer them a $15,000 signing bonus to join CityTurf.
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My theory being you have to hire your operations managers yourself.
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It's too big of a hire.
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You're going to be involved.
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And second, it'll suck you back into ops for a moment where you can't focus on your Facebook ads.
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Let's go.
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Okay, that's one.
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Okay.
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Or this is the really mean one that I would never ever do.
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Or we could follow around your trucks with the new and offer the new P4P compensation plan that we've just done to all your technicians.
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So which would be worse?
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Constantly losing an ops manager or constantly trying to keep your team?
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Obviously, they wouldn't all switch, but you'd lose a few here or there.
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You'd be constantly battling this problem.
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Which would hurt a company worse?
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Oh, man.
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So I have to choose which one I would want.
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I would probably...
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Anything.
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I'd probably have you follow my crew around, mostly because I know that you don't do the model where they take their vehicles home.
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So yeah.
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Okay.
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That'll be your competitive advantage.
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Yeah.
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Now if you were following them around convincing them to like, Hey, I'll give you a hundred thousand dollars to go start your own business.
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Then I would be, I would be a contractor.
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Yeah, exactly.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I would never do the following one.
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I think that, I think that is how you start a war in a market.
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We had somebody do that to us in the early days of city turf and we,
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We, I'm pretty calm, but we got pretty aggressive on that.
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I think, so I just think it's a cruel thing to do.
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Anyway.
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All right.
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Okay.
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I got, I got, we're, I got four more for you.
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These are different though.
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I want to see how big of a threat assessment you are.
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This, I absolutely used, Claude, to help me come up with these.
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And I think, so, all right.
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Okay.
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So imagine you're now a Texas based company.
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Yeah.
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So imagine it's January and a customer calls you and they say, hey, we're supposed to get a really hard freeze tonight.
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Do I need to worry about my sprinkler system?
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What do you tell them?
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Well, I'm not gonna answer the phone.
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Command Center's going to.
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They're gonna have no idea.
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And so we just don't do sprinklers.
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That's it.
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And we would have someone that we would refer them to around sprinklers.
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And so- Maybe CityTurf?
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Well, I hate to ruin this for everyone, but we're not in your market.
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I know.
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Hey, hey, but I thought you might say that.
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Exactly.
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This is how it starts.
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Exactly.
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Definitely year two when we move up to Frisco, probably.
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That's probably when, yes, 100%, I will be having City Tour for every ancillary service.
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Then you'll be directly in my market.
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There you go.
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You don't like mowing.
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You hand us the mowing.
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You can have everything else, the trees, the sprinklers.
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We'll hand it all over, you know?
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We still like mowing.
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It's just we can't build the size mowing business we want at the profit we want.
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I'm going to go ahead and ask you my next three.
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I just want to see if you can answer them.
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Okay.
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Okay.
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All right.
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So a customer says, I've got Bermuda in my front yard and I've got St. Augustine in my back.
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Which one can you scalp and which one can you not scalp?
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So I have zero experience on Williamson and Grassi.
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Yes.
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This is where an operations manager is.
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These are bad questions.
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Yeah.
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So this is when I have to have a great operations manager.
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So fortunately, I've hired the – my GM has worked there for 20 years for all their parks.
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Oh, really?
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Their parks department.
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You already found somebody.
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Yep.
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Yep.
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When I was down there last time, I went out to eat dinner with him and his wife and stuff like that.
247
00:10:23.717 --> 00:10:25.558
So really solid and –
248
00:10:28.620 --> 00:10:29.601
He will know that answer.
249
00:10:29.701 --> 00:10:31.182
Oh, he'll know all these answers.
250
00:10:31.462 --> 00:10:32.883
I won't even ask the next two.
251
00:10:33.223 --> 00:10:33.944
It's not as fun.
252
00:10:34.004 --> 00:10:34.844
So, yeah.
253
00:10:35.305 --> 00:10:35.625
All right.
254
00:10:35.645 --> 00:10:36.125
Well, anyway.
255
00:10:36.325 --> 00:10:39.247
Just proving my incompetence for the local area.
256
00:10:39.328 --> 00:10:41.269
Hire Augusta lawn care today.
257
00:10:42.710 --> 00:10:46.052
If you did it to me in your market, I'd sound like a complete idiot.
258
00:10:46.072 --> 00:10:46.312
Oh, yeah.
259
00:10:46.332 --> 00:10:46.993
We can bag clippings.
260
00:10:47.013 --> 00:10:47.493
Let's go.
261
00:10:47.653 --> 00:10:48.654
Yeah.
262
00:10:49.174 --> 00:10:49.915
It's so funny.
263
00:10:49.975 --> 00:10:57.380
Like little stuff, like even like warm season grasses, but also the fact that you guys don't have to bag literally changes the whole business model, whole business model.
264
00:10:58.125 --> 00:10:58.665
Yeah.
265
00:10:58.725 --> 00:10:58.945
Yeah.
266
00:10:59.566 --> 00:10:59.726
Yeah.
267
00:10:59.746 --> 00:11:01.587
The, what do you do with all your clippings?
268
00:11:02.007 --> 00:11:04.968
We have to take them to our, we recycle them on site.
269
00:11:05.528 --> 00:11:11.751
And then if we don't have a spot to dump them long-term looking on property, then our locations will take them to the dump like once a year.
270
00:11:12.211 --> 00:11:14.052
So, so you're bringing them all back to your shop.
271
00:11:14.232 --> 00:11:14.432
Yep.
272
00:11:15.673 --> 00:11:16.133
Yeah.
273
00:11:16.173 --> 00:11:26.518
So, when people bag here or historically when they used to bag, they'd put them a lot of times in these Brown bags and even put them behind the client's fence that the city will pick up.
274
00:11:26.758 --> 00:11:26.918
Yeah.
275
00:11:27.488 --> 00:11:29.909
So, but other than scalping, we don't bag.
276
00:11:30.289 --> 00:11:30.450
Yeah.
277
00:11:30.470 --> 00:11:33.051
When I, when I did my location in North Carolina, it was more like that.
278
00:11:33.071 --> 00:11:41.075
Like you could put debris out next to the curb, but if you had like a big property cleanup, you run the risk of like them not wanting to pick it up or taking like two weeks.
279
00:11:41.115 --> 00:11:42.896
And now it's like the customer's mad.
280
00:11:42.956 --> 00:11:43.516
It's horrible.
281
00:11:44.137 --> 00:11:44.357
Yeah.
282
00:11:44.537 --> 00:11:44.717
Yeah.
283
00:11:45.217 --> 00:11:46.198
So what are you working on this week?
284
00:11:47.036 --> 00:11:50.357
This week, we are dropping the first part of the refactor for events.
285
00:11:50.557 --> 00:11:51.838
So it's called the all events page.
286
00:11:51.938 --> 00:11:52.638
That's exciting.
287
00:11:52.738 --> 00:11:53.778
It's all in the new code base.
288
00:11:54.298 --> 00:11:55.739
And then also the rev share program.
289
00:11:55.779 --> 00:11:58.240
So 25% for people if they refer people.
290
00:11:58.300 --> 00:11:59.260
Oh, you announced that.
291
00:11:59.280 --> 00:11:59.500
Yeah.
292
00:11:59.600 --> 00:11:59.780
Yeah.
293
00:11:59.840 --> 00:12:00.000
Yeah.
294
00:12:00.020 --> 00:12:00.760
You said that well back.
295
00:12:00.860 --> 00:12:01.120
Yeah.
296
00:12:01.140 --> 00:12:02.341
So it's dropping.
297
00:12:02.361 --> 00:12:02.461
Yeah.
298
00:12:02.981 --> 00:12:03.561
And I'm excited.
299
00:12:03.782 --> 00:12:04.322
I'm excited.
300
00:12:04.342 --> 00:12:08.384
It was a good point of like telling the story of like, here's why we're affording the 25%.
301
00:12:08.424 --> 00:12:11.146
We're not spending, we don't spend money on ads, et cetera.
302
00:12:11.526 --> 00:12:14.207
And just kind of making it more of a community led growth.
303
00:12:14.528 --> 00:12:18.310
And then I've been developing a lot of this assets for the rev share partners.
304
00:12:18.550 --> 00:12:21.832
So like, here's logos, here's graphics, here's how to make a post.
305
00:12:22.132 --> 00:12:25.914
Here's how to make a comment that would get someone to actually use your referral link.
306
00:12:26.414 --> 00:12:27.195
So things like that.
307
00:12:28.157 --> 00:12:29.338
Yeah, I think that's a good idea.
308
00:12:29.398 --> 00:12:32.299
Are you doing the rev share for the first year or forever?
309
00:12:32.379 --> 00:12:33.319
Forever, yeah.
310
00:12:33.419 --> 00:12:33.639
Okay.
311
00:12:33.819 --> 00:12:34.720
I fought with this a lot.
312
00:12:34.960 --> 00:12:38.441
And it was just like, what's the most, like what can we actually afford?
313
00:12:38.702 --> 00:12:42.543
Like we just work backward from CAC and like what can we afford on spending ads?
314
00:12:42.563 --> 00:12:43.083
What would I do?
315
00:12:43.204 --> 00:12:45.364
And then what would I do if this was community led?
316
00:12:45.865 --> 00:12:50.507
And so they're giving away basically one free month and they can't get that free month from anyone outside the rev share program.
317
00:12:50.927 --> 00:12:53.288
So like we don't use it for internal sales or marketing.
318
00:12:53.488 --> 00:12:57.810
It has to come from someone has an existing account if they're gonna get a free month.
319
00:12:58.130 --> 00:13:00.871
So that's kind of like the bait for them to share the referral.
320
00:13:02.072 --> 00:13:09.695
So whomever is getting the offer gets the free month and then the person making the offer gets 25% of the deal forever.
321
00:13:09.875 --> 00:13:10.636
Yep, exactly.
322
00:13:10.716 --> 00:13:10.896
Yeah.
323
00:13:11.236 --> 00:13:11.416
Yeah.
324
00:13:12.596 --> 00:13:14.737
Seems pretty, pretty strong to me.
325
00:13:14.857 --> 00:13:15.638
Really strong, actually.
326
00:13:15.898 --> 00:13:16.778
So that's good.
327
00:13:16.798 --> 00:13:17.859
You came back from vacation.
328
00:13:18.199 --> 00:13:20.260
Are we hitting the ground running or where are we at?
329
00:13:21.732 --> 00:13:24.216
We went to the World Cup game Monday, so I didn't get anything done Monday.
330
00:13:24.376 --> 00:13:25.137
Oh, really?
331
00:13:25.197 --> 00:13:25.537
Which one?
332
00:13:25.557 --> 00:13:26.158
Yeah.
333
00:13:26.899 --> 00:13:27.600
Spain and Portugal.
334
00:13:27.901 --> 00:13:28.281
Oh, really?
335
00:13:28.321 --> 00:13:28.561
Cool.
336
00:13:28.581 --> 00:13:29.002
Let's go.
337
00:13:29.102 --> 00:13:29.282
Yeah.
338
00:13:29.703 --> 00:13:29.863
Yeah.
339
00:13:29.923 --> 00:13:32.066
It's kind of a boring game, wasn't it?
340
00:13:32.326 --> 00:13:32.727
From what I heard?
341
00:13:33.087 --> 00:13:34.309
Well, I mean, I enjoyed it.
342
00:13:34.389 --> 00:13:36.712
I like it better than watching football, like American football.
343
00:13:36.852 --> 00:13:37.353
I enjoyed it.
344
00:13:37.373 --> 00:13:38.154
Yeah.
345
00:13:39.028 --> 00:13:45.551
But yeah, as far as some of the games, the only score of the game happened at the very, very end.
346
00:13:46.071 --> 00:13:49.112
So it wasn't super exciting, but I really enjoyed it.
347
00:13:49.392 --> 00:13:49.972
So it was cool.
348
00:13:50.033 --> 00:13:50.513
It was a good game.
349
00:13:50.613 --> 00:13:52.974
It should have been for the Argentina game, the comeback.
350
00:13:53.134 --> 00:13:54.935
That would have been... That would have been incredible.
351
00:13:55.115 --> 00:13:55.655
It's crazy.
352
00:13:56.055 --> 00:13:57.676
I would have liked to have seen a USA game.
353
00:13:58.836 --> 00:14:03.160
And, but I'm glad I didn't go to the USA game up your direction.
354
00:14:03.220 --> 00:14:10.666
I'm glad I was at the Portugal and Portugal, Spain is cool because we took the boys to Europe, to Spain way back, like a long time ago.
355
00:14:10.686 --> 00:14:13.108
And we wanted to go to one of those games and it just didn't work out.
356
00:14:13.168 --> 00:14:15.510
And so it's cool that we, Riley and Gage both went with us.
357
00:14:15.530 --> 00:14:17.011
So it's cool that we finally got to do it.
358
00:14:17.271 --> 00:14:17.571
Very cool.
359
00:14:17.671 --> 00:14:19.013
We had tried to do one in Barcelona.
360
00:14:19.713 --> 00:14:20.333
So that was fun.
361
00:14:20.533 --> 00:14:22.954
And then while I was there, we were looking at tickets.
362
00:14:22.994 --> 00:14:23.854
Tickets are so stupid.
363
00:14:24.034 --> 00:14:27.475
I don't know how many people can afford these tickets.
364
00:14:27.935 --> 00:14:28.675
It's so insane.
365
00:14:29.135 --> 00:14:30.716
But we were looking at tickets.
366
00:14:31.176 --> 00:14:38.157
And if we wanted to go to the next game and sit where we were sitting, it was like $30,000 a ticket.
367
00:14:38.518 --> 00:14:39.958
What?
368
00:14:40.058 --> 00:14:41.438
How do people write these checks?
369
00:14:41.618 --> 00:14:42.178
That's crazy.
370
00:14:43.179 --> 00:14:44.879
It's just mind-boggling.
371
00:14:45.079 --> 00:14:46.239
FIFA is a non-profit.
372
00:14:46.279 --> 00:14:46.780
Non-profit.
373
00:14:47.300 --> 00:14:47.640
Yeah.
374
00:14:49.322 --> 00:14:49.822
Is it really?
375
00:14:50.202 --> 00:14:50.962
Is that what they call it?
376
00:14:50.982 --> 00:14:51.763
Hell yeah, I say that.
377
00:14:52.443 --> 00:14:52.943
Didn't know that.
378
00:14:53.223 --> 00:14:53.543
Crazy.
379
00:14:53.723 --> 00:14:53.903
Huh.
380
00:14:54.423 --> 00:14:54.563
Yeah.
381
00:14:54.703 --> 00:14:55.864
Somebody's getting paid big salaries.
382
00:14:56.384 --> 00:14:56.704
All right.
383
00:14:57.844 --> 00:15:01.545
So to answer your question, the last two days, I'm back at it.
384
00:15:02.365 --> 00:15:05.786
And I did some prep for this because I was in Wyoming.
385
00:15:05.806 --> 00:15:06.846
So I just did that this week.
386
00:15:06.886 --> 00:15:13.208
And then I was kind of everybody that I'm working with, I was sort of doing meetings with them, making sure everybody's moving.
387
00:15:14.287 --> 00:15:20.311
The thing I got to get done this week for a project we're working on is I've got to get some offers done for a project.
388
00:15:21.091 --> 00:15:22.813
But I probably won't get to that, frankly, till Friday.
389
00:15:22.833 --> 00:15:31.178
This week's a lot of keeping everything moving and doing a few things and responding to lots of people that the projects have come back to me.
390
00:15:31.198 --> 00:15:34.120
And now it's my turn to do something so I can turn them back over the team.
391
00:15:34.500 --> 00:15:36.201
So I feel like it's a little bit of a catch up week.
392
00:15:37.202 --> 00:15:37.502
Very cool.
393
00:15:37.962 --> 00:15:39.623
You're back to your marketing manager mode.
394
00:15:39.823 --> 00:15:40.184
Let's go.
395
00:15:40.204 --> 00:15:40.304
Yeah.
396
00:15:41.493 --> 00:15:42.814
Yeah, I need to get out of this mode.
397
00:15:43.714 --> 00:15:44.815
What about you?
398
00:15:45.015 --> 00:15:47.056
I'd have so much more time if I wasn't marketing manager.
399
00:15:47.477 --> 00:15:48.397
Anyway, what's up with you?
400
00:15:48.577 --> 00:15:50.979
Yeah, mostly just been working on the homework stuff.
401
00:15:51.159 --> 00:15:51.819
Oh, what you said.
402
00:15:51.859 --> 00:15:53.540
I'm sorry, you did say, yeah, yeah, yeah.
403
00:15:54.001 --> 00:15:54.261
Okay.
404
00:15:54.841 --> 00:15:59.744
So is the official public launch about to happen or has it happened?
405
00:15:59.784 --> 00:16:00.745
I'm not in the loop.
406
00:16:01.105 --> 00:16:01.765
Yeah, this week.
407
00:16:01.845 --> 00:16:03.646
So this week it's going out.
408
00:16:04.286 --> 00:16:06.207
It's just one of those things you want to be careful with betas.
409
00:16:06.407 --> 00:16:08.968
So like I have learned not to give dates, times.
410
00:16:09.308 --> 00:16:11.529
It's one of those things where it's like, it'll go out this week.
411
00:16:11.609 --> 00:16:13.150
It'll go out in the next few weeks.
412
00:16:13.610 --> 00:16:16.071
I've stopped like, hey, tomorrow it's coming out.
413
00:16:16.091 --> 00:16:19.472
It's like, no, there'll be a last minute bug that all of a sudden we need to figure out.
414
00:16:19.532 --> 00:16:22.213
So yeah, one day it'll be, it'll come out this quarter.
415
00:16:22.273 --> 00:16:23.234
Yeah, exactly.
416
00:16:23.434 --> 00:16:24.954
After you get kicked in the face enough.
417
00:16:25.014 --> 00:16:26.155
Yeah, man, totally.
418
00:16:26.175 --> 00:16:26.315
Yep.
419
00:16:27.062 --> 00:16:35.126
So I was browsing the financial news and one of the things that I've seen, saw in a couple places, not a ton of it.
420
00:16:35.146 --> 00:16:36.687
So I was kind of a question for you.
421
00:16:37.007 --> 00:16:46.272
So the gist of it was that there are June reports that are showing that small businesses, not necessarily, this wasn't necessarily specific to the trades.
422
00:16:46.292 --> 00:16:55.377
They were calling it more services, like small businesses offering services are finding it harder and harder to find employees and that they're starting to report that this is their top challenge.
423
00:16:56.565 --> 00:17:03.229
And but the government data, like at the federal level is reporting that they're softening in the jobs data.
424
00:17:03.309 --> 00:17:08.132
So I'm curious, across your franchisees, are you hearing anything?
425
00:17:08.172 --> 00:17:10.053
Has anything actually really even changed?
426
00:17:10.354 --> 00:17:12.535
Do you have you ever felt softening?
427
00:17:12.575 --> 00:17:13.856
Has it ever felt easier?
428
00:17:13.996 --> 00:17:16.077
Does it does recruiting always feel the same?
429
00:17:16.097 --> 00:17:17.398
Here's your take on this.
430
00:17:18.083 --> 00:17:24.710
Yeah, like, first off, compared to when we first started the franchise, like 2020, 2021, it feels very easy still.
431
00:17:25.070 --> 00:17:33.058
Because, like, 2020 and 2021, it was just so hard to get people to apply, let alone show up, let alone work out for two or three weeks.
432
00:17:33.679 --> 00:17:35.260
So it still feels very easy.
433
00:17:35.340 --> 00:17:37.703
So this morning, they'll actually pulled... Easy to get people?
434
00:17:38.163 --> 00:17:39.885
Yeah, mostly applicants.
435
00:17:40.165 --> 00:17:42.328
So I'll get into kind of like the fine print.
436
00:17:42.388 --> 00:17:45.472
But like in terms of applications, I ran a poll with the owners of Augusta.
437
00:17:45.532 --> 00:17:46.953
Jason, if you could throw it up.
438
00:17:47.194 --> 00:17:48.095
It's only from this morning.
439
00:17:48.115 --> 00:17:49.577
So it's somewhat limited data.
440
00:17:50.017 --> 00:17:55.584
But it was like, hey, if you throw up an Indeed ad or a Facebook ad, how many applications are you getting within two to three days?
441
00:17:56.084 --> 00:17:58.405
And so they're still getting quite a few applications.
442
00:17:58.766 --> 00:18:03.348
Most of them are getting 40 plus applications in a couple of days.
443
00:18:04.068 --> 00:18:10.632
I think the part that I still see as the bottleneck to getting good people, because good people is not good applications, right?
444
00:18:10.952 --> 00:18:12.293
Even the volume of applications.
445
00:18:12.633 --> 00:18:15.154
This more or less just measures the volume of applications.
446
00:18:15.495 --> 00:18:20.978
It's really a matter of filtering those applications to get good candidates and then turning people
447
00:18:21.818 --> 00:18:23.679
recently hired into great technicians.
448
00:18:24.119 --> 00:18:29.882
And so last year we really focused on like, how do we weed out 50 applications down to the two or three that you should be looking at?
449
00:18:30.382 --> 00:18:36.585
And that's like using the video process, using AI, like get down to the cream of the crop out of your applications.
450
00:18:37.126 --> 00:18:40.667
And now we're really focusing on like, how do you get someone once you've given them a job offer?
451
00:18:40.687 --> 00:18:43.349
And they're like, yes, I'm showing up to not turn after one or two days.
452
00:18:44.149 --> 00:18:49.091
And that's just really onboarding, training, creating a better system for that process.
453
00:18:49.371 --> 00:18:50.951
That's something that I feel like we've been a week on.
454
00:18:51.331 --> 00:18:56.693
And so the past year, we've really focused on the front end of that funnel, which is like from Indeed into job hire.
455
00:18:57.213 --> 00:18:59.454
Now we're focusing on, okay, you showed up to the first day of work.
456
00:18:59.494 --> 00:19:00.334
What does that look like?
457
00:19:00.674 --> 00:19:04.235
So having training modules, integrating a better onboarding system.
458
00:19:04.635 --> 00:19:09.677
But in terms of like getting applications, this is definitely not our biggest constraint right now.
459
00:19:09.697 --> 00:19:10.557
Yeah.
460
00:19:11.377 --> 00:19:12.597
But it's very regional.
461
00:19:12.797 --> 00:19:16.918
Like even underneath this survey, there was members of the community were talking.
462
00:19:17.258 --> 00:19:21.059
And some of them were like, people are like hostile when I contact them.
463
00:19:23.140 --> 00:19:24.900
Or they don't even know if they applied.
464
00:19:24.920 --> 00:19:26.421
Like they've just bulk applying.
465
00:19:26.701 --> 00:19:29.461
I think some of this has to do with how Indeed is playing with some of these things.
466
00:19:30.021 --> 00:19:34.462
But even running Facebook ads has been really interesting recently to get job applications.
467
00:19:34.983 --> 00:19:41.064
And so we've been averaging, at Augusta, at least like $9 to $11 per application running Facebook ads for applicants.
468
00:19:41.604 --> 00:19:43.505
And that's something we had not really played with before.
469
00:19:44.845 --> 00:19:54.788
But I thought your video last week was really excellent about making this more of an internal marketing engine and actually deploying energy towards creating a referral plan for your technicians.
470
00:19:55.048 --> 00:19:56.529
And I think it's funny how people are like, you'll get like $100.
471
00:19:57.609 --> 00:20:02.352
If you bring one of your friends, like the amount of cost of getting a new technician is like astronomical.
472
00:20:02.712 --> 00:20:04.133
And so we've done the calculation on this.
473
00:20:04.153 --> 00:20:11.917
It's almost $10,000 by the time you take all costs into the marketing costs, interview costs, onboarding costs, training costs.
474
00:20:12.097 --> 00:20:15.259
Would you take all of that and then calculate churn of technicians?
475
00:20:15.759 --> 00:20:18.861
A churned employee, for us at least, is around $10,000.
476
00:20:19.441 --> 00:20:26.165
And so why would I not be offering $2,000, $3,000 to my current team to bring in a great technician?
477
00:20:26.185 --> 00:20:26.345
Yeah.
478
00:20:26.600 --> 00:20:26.880
Yeah.
479
00:20:27.360 --> 00:20:27.560
Yep.
480
00:20:27.580 --> 00:20:33.202
That was, that was the gist of my argument as well as, and you gave it from the cost side and I actually don't know that number.
481
00:20:33.662 --> 00:20:38.403
The team probably would know I'm not involved in 10,000 hearing 10,000 is interesting.
482
00:20:38.823 --> 00:20:46.405
I was thinking about it purely from the standpoint I talk about this in that video that if a cruise worth, what we'll make up a number and say $200,000 to you,
483
00:20:48.912 --> 00:20:54.594
Why would you take six months or eight more months to get to a place where you finally staff the crew?
484
00:20:54.634 --> 00:21:03.516
Because you're going so slow and you're just trying to find a person through normal means versus just arguably throwing money at the problem and solving the problem quick.
485
00:21:04.196 --> 00:21:11.738
Because the longer you wait, the less you're growing the business, the slower it's growing, the slower, the longer it's going to take to fix other problems inside the business.
486
00:21:11.798 --> 00:21:12.098
Yeah.
487
00:21:12.477 --> 00:21:18.802
I think when I heard your video too, and even looking at this, I was, it kind of goes back to the basics of knowing your numbers.
488
00:21:18.862 --> 00:21:27.429
Because I think if most people knew their numbers, this would become a binary decision of where I deploy my energy, time, and money to getting more technicians.
489
00:21:27.629 --> 00:21:33.453
Because yes, it makes perfect sense if I get $200,000, that this is my main constraint of my business and I focus on it.
490
00:21:33.833 --> 00:21:35.335
But most people don't even know what that number is.
491
00:21:36.243 --> 00:21:36.443
Sure.
492
00:21:36.463 --> 00:21:42.028
They don't know their gross profit or they don't know if I had one more technician without having to buy any more trucks and equipment.
493
00:21:42.088 --> 00:21:43.270
I had another technician.
494
00:21:43.530 --> 00:21:45.512
They had $130,000 of revenue.
495
00:21:45.772 --> 00:21:47.353
I paid them $60,000.
496
00:21:47.654 --> 00:21:48.514
I'm very profitable.
497
00:21:48.534 --> 00:21:50.116
The rest is what's left over.
498
00:21:50.376 --> 00:21:52.958
Oh, this is a $50,000 problem.
499
00:21:53.339 --> 00:21:54.680
And it's not seen that way.
500
00:21:54.780 --> 00:22:02.007
And we chased whatever like the fire in the businesses versus the very basic economics of like, if I just get one more technician, I unlock this revenue.
501
00:22:03.048 --> 00:22:03.228
Yeah.
502
00:22:03.488 --> 00:22:04.048
Yeah.
503
00:22:04.208 --> 00:22:05.329
I just, I so agree.
504
00:22:05.369 --> 00:22:08.109
It's amazing how so many things just come back to knowing the numbers.
505
00:22:09.429 --> 00:22:17.671
As I did service autopilot and as I've grown and learned in business, it's like, and it's been a long time now, I've understood this idea of the numbers are key to everything.
506
00:22:17.711 --> 00:22:23.713
But it's like, once I finally got that concept earlier in my career, it's like, how could you not see this sooner?
507
00:22:23.813 --> 00:22:24.733
It's the key to everything.
508
00:22:25.273 --> 00:22:26.273
It answers every question.
509
00:22:26.313 --> 00:22:26.813
Well, not really.
510
00:22:26.833 --> 00:22:27.994
It answers most questions.
511
00:22:28.634 --> 00:22:29.334
It tells you what to do.
512
00:22:30.068 --> 00:22:31.148
Yeah, it's been so interesting.
513
00:22:31.168 --> 00:22:43.291
Like obviously from the service business side, knowing your numbers is important, but even like on the software side, the ability now with AI to be able to get your numbers, assuming like you have some sort of data architecture is so much better.
514
00:22:43.331 --> 00:22:45.812
Like for example, the other day I was like, we were making a product decision.
515
00:22:45.832 --> 00:22:50.193
I was just like, I went in and I just asked, we call it stew, it's just our open claw in the backend.
516
00:22:50.453 --> 00:22:50.873
And it was just-
517
00:22:51.233 --> 00:22:57.436
And I just said, hey, I want to know in the past 30 days what percentage of transactions were credit cards, check, and like everything else.
518
00:22:57.776 --> 00:23:02.198
And for it to spit that out within 30 seconds and you're making that decision is super useful.
519
00:23:02.718 --> 00:23:08.640
And so even if someone might not know, quote unquote, know their numbers, like when Jonathan says $200,000 per crew, you're like, well, I don't know what mine is.
520
00:23:08.860 --> 00:23:15.283
But the ability to be able to have some data architecture to be able to ask and get that information is like super valuable.
521
00:23:16.558 --> 00:23:17.058
That's true.
522
00:23:17.418 --> 00:23:25.782
That idea right there is really going to change the game for a lot of people where it used to be hard to get your numbers and now it's going to be easy.
523
00:23:28.104 --> 00:23:30.585
Do you guys use, that's interesting, you mentioned OpenClaw.
524
00:23:30.605 --> 00:23:33.186
Are you doing a lot with OpenClaw?
525
00:23:33.935 --> 00:23:34.956
Our internal team is.
526
00:23:35.156 --> 00:23:40.381
So we've connected to like a lot of our like notion where we do a lot of product stuff to our Slack.
527
00:23:40.641 --> 00:23:46.206
So like, for example, for myself, I'm not in a lot of Slack's channels, but I can have it send me reports.
528
00:23:46.326 --> 00:23:50.129
I can go in there and ask it things like, hey, what's the status of this current project?
529
00:23:50.449 --> 00:23:51.150
Where is it in beta?
530
00:23:51.170 --> 00:23:55.314
You know, how many people have responded back to a response form and not have to go and find it?
531
00:23:55.594 --> 00:23:59.857
So it's really just a portal inside Slack right now that allows us to be able to like,
532
00:24:01.823 --> 00:24:05.746
even asking technical things for me to be able to get, hey, this is what the engineer said.
533
00:24:05.786 --> 00:24:06.466
Can you break this down?
534
00:24:06.666 --> 00:24:07.787
Go reference the ticket.
535
00:24:07.807 --> 00:24:08.707
Tell me what's going on here.
536
00:24:08.727 --> 00:24:11.509
So we mostly use it for internal.
537
00:24:12.410 --> 00:24:14.071
Okay.
538
00:24:14.171 --> 00:24:18.794
Was part of that motivated to save money or was it motivated to more sandbox your data?
539
00:24:19.829 --> 00:24:20.670
A little bit of both.
540
00:24:20.911 --> 00:24:23.835
A lot of it, for the engineers, they probably use it differently than I do.
541
00:24:24.035 --> 00:24:30.745
I use it much more for the sake of, I wanna know what's going on, but not have to be in every single meeting, not be in every single Slack channel.
542
00:24:31.246 --> 00:24:33.890
And if I'm communicating to the members, I need to know
543
00:24:34.771 --> 00:24:37.914
what's going on and where's the status of that project.
544
00:24:38.414 --> 00:24:55.969
But more importantly, what I'm using it now more and more for is making a product decision based upon the true accurate numbers without being like, in the past, this would have been a couple of years ago, even this is probably, hey, get back to me in a day or two and let's run some serious number calculations on transaction volume of hundreds of thousands of invoices.
545
00:24:56.629 --> 00:25:03.680
And so now for that to be two minutes, it's just so, it's almost like you have to retrain yourself to think, I can get those numbers very quickly now.
546
00:25:04.000 --> 00:25:09.668
Versus in the past, that was like, oh, I'm gonna have to sit down for a considerable amount of time and do some extrapolation.
547
00:25:10.129 --> 00:25:11.511
And so I'm really excited because like,
548
00:25:12.252 --> 00:25:23.621
In a way, that level of hopefully data architecture in homeworks will give people the ability to just be like, ask Claude or anything with MCP access, be like, hey, what's my churn based upon channel?
549
00:25:23.641 --> 00:25:26.143
Things like that, that'll be hopefully very useful.
550
00:25:26.784 --> 00:25:30.827
Right now, even, is very hard to figure out and takes a lot of time.
551
00:25:30.847 --> 00:25:31.608
Yeah.
552
00:25:32.932 --> 00:25:33.333
Interesting.
553
00:25:34.774 --> 00:25:40.822
Earlier, you mentioned talking to some of the franchisees and the challenge of labor was different in different markets.
554
00:25:40.882 --> 00:25:45.008
Do any markets come to mind that you noticed were more difficult than others?
555
00:25:45.709 --> 00:25:57.937
I feel like when we get extreme weathers, so dead winter, dead summer, the churn, the quality of the candidates seem lower, mostly because they show up for their first day and then they bounce.
556
00:25:58.517 --> 00:26:05.702
And so one of the biggest thing that we're trying to focus on is like during onboarding and training is how do I make sure that expectations reality match?
557
00:26:06.303 --> 00:26:12.587
Because if someone churns within their first couple of weeks, it's almost always a mismatch of like, here's what I expected and here's what it looks like.
558
00:26:13.087 --> 00:26:27.859
Now, in the middle of summer, when it's 100 degrees outside, like you're talking about 110, whatever it might be, humidity, if they didn't expect that and that was not clearly articulated and there wasn't expectations of what it looks like in the fall, what does it look like in terms of your pay?
559
00:26:28.039 --> 00:26:35.505
Like for us with P4P, we've got to set the expectation that, hey, your first one or two paychecks, you probably aren't going to make a bonus because you're still getting good at this.
560
00:26:35.885 --> 00:26:38.086
But here's what people's paychecks have looked like in the past.
561
00:26:38.386 --> 00:26:40.446
And like your third or fourth, here's what it starts to look like.
562
00:26:40.466 --> 00:26:41.887
And here's someone who's been at this for six months.
563
00:26:42.247 --> 00:26:43.887
And yes, they're making $10 an hour more.
564
00:26:44.267 --> 00:26:46.008
And so that's really been our focus.
565
00:26:46.028 --> 00:26:49.609
Like how do we make sure the expectations are correct so we don't have churn in the first two weeks?
566
00:26:50.089 --> 00:26:53.470
You know, if you can't keep someone two weeks, you're not going to keep them for a year.
567
00:26:53.930 --> 00:27:02.612
And I look at even someone like Tommy Mello, where in garage doors, they train their guys for six weeks and they pull them from the entire country to Phoenix.
568
00:27:02.632 --> 00:27:02.972
Yeah.
569
00:27:03.595 --> 00:27:08.977
And it's a very extensive, very well, yes, their tenor for those technicians is significantly higher.
570
00:27:08.997 --> 00:27:10.637
They also pay them significantly more.
571
00:27:11.018 --> 00:27:17.060
But I do believe like the amount that we invest in our technicians on that upfront has a direct correlation to how long they stay with us.
572
00:27:17.380 --> 00:27:20.501
And yes, it's going to be hard work and it's going to be bad weather and all the rest of it.
573
00:27:20.521 --> 00:27:26.463
But if we don't set the expectations correctly and give them the right tools and the training and we just throw them in a truck, like what do we expect to happen?
574
00:27:27.023 --> 00:27:35.789
And so for us, it hasn't really been the candidate or getting people in the door as much as once they're here, how do we make sure they stick and ensure that our onboarding is better?
575
00:27:35.809 --> 00:27:38.471
And that's really been my, it's going to be my focus here in the next six months.
576
00:27:40.032 --> 00:27:40.492
Will you...
577
00:27:41.855 --> 00:27:43.518
have a corporate level training for them?
578
00:27:43.558 --> 00:27:45.540
Would you do such a thing like Tommy does?
579
00:27:45.681 --> 00:27:48.484
Or does that make sense for what you're doing?
580
00:27:48.705 --> 00:27:49.886
No, I would love it.
581
00:27:50.007 --> 00:27:54.713
I would love it to be where we know, if you consider the lifetime value of a customer, right?
582
00:27:54.753 --> 00:27:57.137
That's how much we can determine our customer acquisition costs.
583
00:27:57.497 --> 00:28:02.459
If we just flip that to labor, it's like, well, I know how much revenue and profit this person can bring me for the long term.
584
00:28:02.819 --> 00:28:06.041
Here's where I'm willing to spend to acquire them, get them trained up and ready to roll.
585
00:28:06.361 --> 00:28:13.104
The problem is if even the average technician stays a year, I can't make sense of flying them across the country and spending two weeks in training.
586
00:28:13.164 --> 00:28:14.504
It's just that the math doesn't make sense.
587
00:28:14.524 --> 00:28:15.505
Yeah.
588
00:28:16.345 --> 00:28:32.642
And so what we're really focused on right now is how do we embed the expectations around like pay for performance, profit sharing, open book management, the culture, the stages of success in a video format that is repeatable, but not in a way like we can't train them how to do the work because every single market is so different.
589
00:28:33.102 --> 00:28:35.845
Grass types, mower types, equipment trailers, all that.
590
00:28:36.185 --> 00:28:46.411
But what we can do, and the part that I feel like the owners have struggled with in the past is communicating the message and the branding and the opportunity for the technicians and make sure their expectations do match reality.
591
00:28:46.811 --> 00:28:52.375
And so being able to have like our leadership team that all started as technicians be able to talk on the training about like, here's how I felt.
592
00:28:52.495 --> 00:28:53.656
And here's what I did for a year or two.
593
00:28:53.676 --> 00:28:55.717
And this is what got me to like the next stage of my career.
594
00:28:56.157 --> 00:28:58.801
And then we tie it to where they have to listen to each module.
595
00:28:59.161 --> 00:29:00.803
They finish 90% of each video.
596
00:29:01.124 --> 00:29:02.465
And at the end, they get a certificate.
597
00:29:02.526 --> 00:29:04.528
And that gets them to the next stage.
598
00:29:05.109 --> 00:29:07.011
We have seven stages for the technicians.
599
00:29:07.452 --> 00:29:11.037
And so some of the owners are baking that into prior to them showing up for day one.
600
00:29:11.137 --> 00:29:12.519
They got to watch the video, get the tech...
601
00:29:12.779 --> 00:29:16.801
the unlock the certificate and they get paid for the time they spent on that.
602
00:29:16.821 --> 00:29:22.384
And day one, how I'm approaching it for my locations is much more a matter of like, Hey, day one, we're going to do this video module.
603
00:29:22.444 --> 00:29:23.304
Then we're going to talk about it.
604
00:29:23.324 --> 00:29:24.145
We're going to do examples.
605
00:29:24.385 --> 00:29:25.325
You're going to ask questions.
606
00:29:25.385 --> 00:29:28.727
We're going to really digest it and then spend a whole day on it.
607
00:29:29.547 --> 00:29:35.170
But it is tough when you start looking at the math of like, how much can I spend on the upfront time, energy, et cetera.
608
00:29:35.190 --> 00:29:41.013
But I'd say the vast majority, 95% of us are not overspending on onboarding and training.
609
00:29:41.073 --> 00:29:42.254
It's, it's quite the opposite.
610
00:29:42.274 --> 00:29:42.414
Yeah.
611
00:29:42.654 --> 00:29:42.834
Yeah.
612
00:29:43.715 --> 00:29:48.999
One thing Tommy's also doing is he's doing a lot of sales training because his installers are also sales guys.
613
00:29:49.619 --> 00:29:52.922
So that's a harder thing.
614
00:29:52.942 --> 00:29:57.385
You can almost imagine why that probably has to happen at a corporate office, especially that sales side.
615
00:29:57.845 --> 00:29:58.586
Makes a lot of sense.
616
00:29:59.327 --> 00:30:04.991
So something we've talked about quite a bit or at least touched on are some of the topics we're going to talk about here where...
617
00:30:06.314 --> 00:30:07.635
we've talked about markets before.
618
00:30:07.655 --> 00:30:14.242
We've talked about not doing too many things, services, not being in too many markets.
619
00:30:14.342 --> 00:30:17.145
So I wanted to run through some of these topics today.
620
00:30:17.225 --> 00:30:23.953
So one of the big ones that I've addressed for years, and I know you think about, and again, we've talked about it here, is when you think about...
621
00:30:25.345 --> 00:30:31.387
this scenario, you might have started your business and you started doing all these services.
622
00:30:31.407 --> 00:30:32.627
You were saying yes to a client.
623
00:30:32.647 --> 00:30:33.287
Now you're doing this.
624
00:30:33.347 --> 00:30:34.488
And another client says, hey, can you do this?
625
00:30:34.528 --> 00:30:35.448
Now you've had another service.
626
00:30:35.748 --> 00:30:37.669
You've got all this stuff that you're doing.
627
00:30:39.189 --> 00:30:42.190
How do you think about as you clean up that business,
628
00:30:43.125 --> 00:30:45.227
dropping a service or getting out of a service.
629
00:30:45.728 --> 00:30:47.270
So that'd be like, we'll call that part A.
630
00:30:47.330 --> 00:30:54.759
How do you think about improving the business and refining it and making that decision when and how would I drop a service?
631
00:30:54.799 --> 00:30:56.661
And then the other part of it is the inverse.
632
00:30:57.181 --> 00:30:58.903
How do you know when it's time to add a service?
633
00:30:59.444 --> 00:31:03.509
So how do you think about stuff like that as you're working with your franchisees or other people?
634
00:31:04.350 --> 00:31:07.432
Yeah, I kind of always look at the 80-20 rule when it comes to services.
635
00:31:07.452 --> 00:31:15.135
And it's like, if I will drop a service when I realize that it is 20% of revenue and causing 80% of my problems.
636
00:31:15.356 --> 00:31:16.856
That's usually what happens.
637
00:31:17.657 --> 00:31:19.498
You can also say it's like 80% of mistakes
638
00:31:20.557 --> 00:31:22.198
are caused by 20% of services.
639
00:31:22.978 --> 00:31:28.841
80% of your time, attention, your focus of the owner, like the dependence of the business on you comes from 20% of the services.
640
00:31:29.201 --> 00:31:30.282
So that's what I'm always looking at.
641
00:31:30.722 --> 00:31:34.884
What's the indiscriminate value coming from in terms of upside and downside?
642
00:31:34.904 --> 00:31:36.265
And I'm just trying to cut the downside ones.
643
00:31:36.725 --> 00:31:42.328
I'd say anything above two or three services just starts to get very difficult to manage if you're under a million.
644
00:31:43.068 --> 00:31:47.655
in terms of having the time and attention to be able to deploy towards marketing, training, et cetera.
645
00:31:48.176 --> 00:31:50.479
So dropping it, I'm a big fan of dropping services.
646
00:31:50.499 --> 00:31:52.001
It's also very difficult to do.
647
00:31:52.562 --> 00:31:56.447
And so I first started, like the first location in Augusta had so many services.
648
00:31:56.708 --> 00:31:58.290
Tearing those out was very, very hard.
649
00:31:58.510 --> 00:31:59.431
It took three years to,
650
00:31:59.972 --> 00:32:03.515
of trying to like just stabilize revenue, slowly bring out the worst performing ones.
651
00:32:03.915 --> 00:32:07.878
But it was always just a matter like, hey, which were the ones we don't hit budget hours accurately on?
652
00:32:08.179 --> 00:32:11.681
We don't make great margins or it's all over the place.
653
00:32:12.342 --> 00:32:13.523
And where are the complaints happening?
654
00:32:14.544 --> 00:32:22.149
And if you just fix those things, most of the time, your time and attention poured into the other services, it'll buoy the revenue.
655
00:32:22.169 --> 00:32:23.651
It'll increase the margin.
656
00:32:24.451 --> 00:32:27.334
But have you guys dropped services in the past ever?
657
00:32:27.434 --> 00:32:29.015
And why have you all done that?
658
00:32:30.095 --> 00:32:30.835
Yeah.
659
00:32:30.855 --> 00:32:36.938
So when I started CityTurf, it started as commercial and switched to residential.
660
00:32:37.758 --> 00:32:40.259
And because I came from commercial, you had to sell.
661
00:32:40.960 --> 00:32:44.541
To win the contracts, you had to be doing the irrigation, the fertilization we control.
662
00:32:44.561 --> 00:32:45.442
You had to do bushes.
663
00:32:45.482 --> 00:32:46.362
You had to do all of it.
664
00:32:46.422 --> 00:32:47.362
Flowers, all of it.
665
00:32:48.103 --> 00:32:53.005
And so that was my mindset coming into the residential side of CityTurf.
666
00:32:54.523 --> 00:32:59.647
I also had bought 75 counts from a fence company in residential.
667
00:33:00.467 --> 00:33:03.990
That's sort of what I had been thinking about this residential thing.
668
00:33:04.910 --> 00:33:07.972
And then I had this opportunity to buy these accounts from this fence company.
669
00:33:07.992 --> 00:33:08.553
I wanted out.
670
00:33:08.573 --> 00:33:12.556
I bought the accounts and that fence company was doing a whole bunch of stuff for them as well.
671
00:33:13.476 --> 00:33:20.101
And so I ended up literally doing all the services from irrigation to fertilization, weed control, mowing, all the stuff I named.
672
00:33:21.030 --> 00:33:22.191
And the business was terrible.
673
00:33:23.272 --> 00:33:25.234
And so, yeah, we dropped...
674
00:33:26.595 --> 00:33:28.737
I think we dropped irrigation first.
675
00:33:29.958 --> 00:33:32.121
I can't remember now the order.
676
00:33:32.541 --> 00:33:34.082
We dialed it back quite a bit.
677
00:33:34.343 --> 00:33:37.426
And we did hang on to... We never dropped flowers.
678
00:33:37.466 --> 00:33:38.747
We still do flowers to this day.
679
00:33:38.807 --> 00:33:39.908
We never dropped flowers.
680
00:33:40.729 --> 00:33:41.369
So there are some things...
681
00:33:41.589 --> 00:33:43.812
If I could do it again, I would have dropped them as well.
682
00:33:45.490 --> 00:33:49.912
But flowers and mulch tended to work out okay for us back at that time.
683
00:33:50.313 --> 00:33:51.513
But I would have dropped those services.
684
00:33:51.553 --> 00:34:02.399
But we really, even though we still had several services, we predominantly were a mowing and bed and bush company for quite a while.
685
00:34:02.619 --> 00:34:05.301
So we did fertilization weed control and that was pretty good.
686
00:34:05.881 --> 00:34:08.723
But it was pretty lousy in the early years.
687
00:34:09.143 --> 00:34:12.084
We probably should have dropped it as well and then added it back.
688
00:34:12.785 --> 00:34:12.965
Yeah.
689
00:34:13.647 --> 00:34:17.008
So yeah, no, I've been through that whole process.
690
00:34:17.028 --> 00:34:18.549
But it was even worse than that.
691
00:34:18.689 --> 00:34:19.989
I was dropping lots of clients.
692
00:34:20.369 --> 00:34:22.190
So I had to fire all the commercial clients.
693
00:34:22.530 --> 00:34:25.931
Then I fired all the big residential clients over a certain property size.
694
00:34:26.271 --> 00:34:28.292
Then I fired all the clients that were in certain markets.
695
00:34:28.912 --> 00:34:30.593
Then I got rid of out of services.
696
00:34:30.653 --> 00:34:32.234
So the cuts were very painful.
697
00:34:32.414 --> 00:34:34.334
I'm the one that made all those calls.
698
00:34:34.494 --> 00:34:36.095
And it was really, really painful.
699
00:34:36.555 --> 00:34:41.879
I was stuck in a few contracts for commercial that I couldn't get out of for a period of time.
700
00:34:41.899 --> 00:34:48.124
So we might be doing three commercial properties and residential that lasted for a little bit, but that's how we unwound it.
701
00:34:48.564 --> 00:34:51.667
Was it like a few years of basically flat revenue as you'd made the transition?
702
00:34:52.267 --> 00:34:55.449
No, actually, we doubled the business every year for the first five or six years.
703
00:34:56.890 --> 00:35:02.295
So no, I think my experience was that as we got out of things, things just kept getting better.
704
00:35:02.475 --> 00:35:02.635
Mm-hmm.
705
00:35:03.218 --> 00:35:04.499
And we went faster.
706
00:35:04.519 --> 00:35:07.481
There were less distractions.
707
00:35:07.581 --> 00:35:09.402
And CityTurf was always part-time for me.
708
00:35:09.422 --> 00:35:11.884
I was doing two other businesses at the same time.
709
00:35:12.524 --> 00:35:16.947
And so it was just imperative that we got out of these other things.
710
00:35:17.007 --> 00:35:18.648
And so it was two things.
711
00:35:18.688 --> 00:35:22.050
It was one, by getting out of the services and shrinking the market.
712
00:35:22.090 --> 00:35:24.652
I was still in the early days of CityTurf, I was selling all the work.
713
00:35:25.112 --> 00:35:25.772
or most of it.
714
00:35:26.333 --> 00:35:31.736
And so it made it easier for me, I could do more faster, which allowed us to keep growing.
715
00:35:32.416 --> 00:35:36.018
And then it just made it easier to hire, like everything got easier.
716
00:35:36.118 --> 00:35:38.319
So no, we never took a step back.
717
00:35:38.720 --> 00:35:44.223
If I were to drop big service line today, that would be a different kind of thing that would hurt in a different way.
718
00:35:45.043 --> 00:35:49.706
But you know, when I was making those cuts, we were probably a $400,000 $500,000 business wasn't that big.
719
00:35:52.608 --> 00:36:00.471
And so, but frankly, I mean, if you kind of think about it, almost all that revenue got replaced.
720
00:36:00.831 --> 00:36:01.492
Almost all of it.
721
00:36:01.512 --> 00:36:05.133
Because if you think about starting as commercial and transitioning to residential.
722
00:36:05.233 --> 00:36:07.614
So, but no, we grew right through it.
723
00:36:07.994 --> 00:36:12.456
And did you start with the commercial just because you had done the movie theaters, you knew the commercial game.
724
00:36:12.776 --> 00:36:16.098
And so it was like, oh, we should just be doing outdoor and do commercial fit.
725
00:36:16.138 --> 00:36:16.558
Okay, got it.
726
00:36:17.118 --> 00:36:18.640
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
727
00:36:18.680 --> 00:36:20.682
And real quick on that story.
728
00:36:20.742 --> 00:36:29.010
So I actually, before CityTurf, did a different business with my partners in real just like for a very short time, one year with my partners in that cleaning company.
729
00:36:29.631 --> 00:36:31.473
It's not CityTurf, it's a different business.
730
00:36:32.033 --> 00:36:37.679
And so because we already had the experience, they wanted to do the business, I didn't, but they knew I had experience in it.
731
00:36:38.569 --> 00:36:42.772
And so we ended up buying this lawn care company for like seven or...
732
00:36:43.092 --> 00:36:43.632
I don't remember now.
733
00:36:43.692 --> 00:36:44.913
It's like 7,000 bucks or something.
734
00:36:45.093 --> 00:36:46.374
About 50,000 of revenue.
735
00:36:46.394 --> 00:36:48.355
They're these warehouse properties in Irving.
736
00:36:49.476 --> 00:36:51.157
Not too far from where you're going to be living.
737
00:36:52.097 --> 00:36:52.357
And...
738
00:36:53.470 --> 00:36:56.012
That's what got us into the business.
739
00:36:56.172 --> 00:36:58.014
I never wanted to be in the business.
740
00:36:58.034 --> 00:36:59.415
I did not want to be back in lawn care.
741
00:36:59.435 --> 00:37:00.376
I had no interest.
742
00:37:00.516 --> 00:37:01.337
I was only...
743
00:37:01.577 --> 00:37:04.580
I just wanted to be in technology and I was doing the cleaning thing with my friends.
744
00:37:05.621 --> 00:37:06.942
And I just wanted to be in tech.
745
00:37:06.962 --> 00:37:10.445
And so it's really a fluke and an accident that I even ended up in the business.
746
00:37:10.485 --> 00:37:15.790
So as soon as we got into that business, my partners in the cleaning company, they wanted nothing to do with it.
747
00:37:15.810 --> 00:37:18.272
So it became my problem and I never even wanted to be in it.
748
00:37:18.592 --> 00:37:20.034
That's kind of how the whole thing happened.
749
00:37:20.594 --> 00:37:25.238
And so I'm like, I just kind of got to this point where it's like, I don't really want to build this business for the long term.
750
00:37:25.458 --> 00:37:26.619
This isn't what I want to do.
751
00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:30.243
And then I started thinking about, well, if I did do this, what would be the best business?
752
00:37:30.523 --> 00:37:32.305
That's where I started thinking about the residential thing.
753
00:37:32.665 --> 00:37:34.086
So that's how we got started commercial.
754
00:37:34.106 --> 00:37:35.908
That's what got me back into the business.
755
00:37:36.607 --> 00:37:40.330
Yeah, like I think it's so painful for many people to remove services.
756
00:37:40.390 --> 00:37:42.792
The additional services on the hand, people love.
757
00:37:43.172 --> 00:37:44.253
People love adding services.
758
00:37:44.273 --> 00:37:45.414
It's so fun and exciting.
759
00:37:45.834 --> 00:37:48.076
And so what services have you added?
760
00:37:48.096 --> 00:37:50.478
Because the question kind of is like, when should I remove?
761
00:37:50.498 --> 00:37:51.238
When should I add?
762
00:37:52.039 --> 00:37:55.401
When did you add those services and why as the business began to grow?
763
00:37:56.222 --> 00:37:57.003
Well, we've done it right.
764
00:37:57.043 --> 00:37:57.743
We've done it wrong.
765
00:37:58.704 --> 00:38:00.926
And I think we've generally done it wrong.
766
00:38:00.946 --> 00:38:02.467
I'll give you an example.
767
00:38:02.487 --> 00:38:03.448
I'll give you an example.
768
00:38:05.061 --> 00:38:06.022
some of the things I've learned.
769
00:38:06.062 --> 00:38:10.944
So we cut a lot of services and then eventually we added back, for example, irrigation.
770
00:38:11.344 --> 00:38:12.645
Long time ago, I don't remember.
771
00:38:14.125 --> 00:38:15.766
Well, let's rewind even further than that.
772
00:38:15.866 --> 00:38:18.988
So we're predominantly a mowing company and a fertilization weed control company.
773
00:38:19.008 --> 00:38:20.548
I'm sorry, mowing and Ben Bush company.
774
00:38:21.029 --> 00:38:23.650
Then we get serious about fertilization weed control.
775
00:38:23.730 --> 00:38:30.033
So for the longest time on fertilization weed control, it was a huge time suck for fill up.
776
00:38:30.978 --> 00:38:33.360
Because there's complications in that business.
777
00:38:33.380 --> 00:38:34.561
There's a lot you have to know.
778
00:38:34.581 --> 00:38:42.166
A lot more you have to know to run that business and deal with all the problems and the advice and consulting than you do with, say, mowing or trimming bushes.
779
00:38:42.346 --> 00:38:43.267
Just a lot of additional.
780
00:38:43.527 --> 00:38:51.133
So it's one of those things where you don't necessarily trust just anybody to do this and maintain your reputation.
781
00:38:51.593 --> 00:38:56.897
And so Philip is the first area where I felt like Philip was really stuck having to do it.
782
00:38:57.397 --> 00:39:02.380
So while we didn't cut that, it just wasn't going very fast.
783
00:39:02.980 --> 00:39:07.923
And then even as it started going faster, now it's like, man, this is taking up all his time.
784
00:39:08.203 --> 00:39:09.964
He's working a bazillion hours.
785
00:39:10.705 --> 00:39:13.807
How do we get him out of that so he can really grow the business?
786
00:39:14.287 --> 00:39:19.410
And so we recruited somebody away from True Green that was very senior, a lot of experience at True Green.
787
00:39:19.830 --> 00:39:34.116
that was all their trucks around i got you i got you hurt the guy the guy was not on the truck it's not a $15,000 signing bonus i apologize it's not as hard as that to recruit away from truth
788
00:39:36.737 --> 00:39:38.979
people were happy to leave and come to us.
789
00:39:38.999 --> 00:39:39.559
That's right.
790
00:39:39.879 --> 00:39:40.700
Yeah.
791
00:39:40.720 --> 00:39:43.241
So anyway, so that was a pretty...
792
00:39:43.522 --> 00:39:46.523
I'm turning this into a long answer, but hopefully there's some interesting lessons here.
793
00:39:46.563 --> 00:39:55.269
So that was a real... One of the first times there's like, man, before you add a service line, you should really go hire somebody that could run the service line.
794
00:39:55.329 --> 00:39:58.371
Otherwise, it's just too big of a distraction for the current team.
795
00:39:58.971 --> 00:40:04.495
I don't think we fully had learned that lesson yet, but that was like the first time was like, okay, this is how maybe we think about it.
796
00:40:05.403 --> 00:40:10.706
And so then when we did irrigation, I remember we ended up getting somebody to help us run irrigation.
797
00:40:10.726 --> 00:40:11.827
So we got back into that.
798
00:40:12.287 --> 00:40:13.408
Then we got into pest control.
799
00:40:13.448 --> 00:40:18.191
We went and found a guy that I think had been running a few branches at home team.
800
00:40:18.411 --> 00:40:20.553
If I'm remembering, my facts could be slightly off.
801
00:40:20.573 --> 00:40:21.133
It's been a while.
802
00:40:21.413 --> 00:40:22.114
We brought him in.
803
00:40:22.454 --> 00:40:23.995
Well, then that became the next lesson.
804
00:40:24.035 --> 00:40:24.995
It's like, okay, great.
805
00:40:25.035 --> 00:40:27.397
We went and found people to help us run this stuff.
806
00:40:27.857 --> 00:40:31.920
But we weren't ready as an organization and prepared to do all the marketing.
807
00:40:32.440 --> 00:40:35.742
So a lot of times you might say, I've got X number of clients.
808
00:40:35.782 --> 00:40:40.906
If I could just sell 50% of my clients this service, this is going to be great.
809
00:40:41.066 --> 00:40:49.672
The reality is really hard to sell 50% of your clients any service, even if you're doing a great job at that extra service and for a whole ton of reasons.
810
00:40:50.513 --> 00:40:59.119
And so that was then the next lesson to me where it's like, okay, one, we should never add a division until we're ready to hire somebody to own the thing.
811
00:40:59.639 --> 00:41:00.961
to our service line.
812
00:41:01.322 --> 00:41:13.740
We should never add another service line until we can both hire the person and we're ready to deploy a marketing budget to really go build it, both selling back into our clients and promote it in the broader market and train our team to sell this thing.
813
00:41:14.581 --> 00:41:22.746
And so those are probably by two really big learnings and lessons that when you think about what would you do differently, I would have done those two things differently.
814
00:41:22.766 --> 00:41:26.128
And I've learned them because I felt like we got them both wrong.
815
00:41:26.168 --> 00:41:29.050
And it just made adding services more painful in the business.
816
00:41:29.511 --> 00:41:35.975
And to the point where the services sort of became a little distracting for the amount of revenue and profit that they were producing.
817
00:41:36.640 --> 00:41:38.200
Yeah, I was talking to- That's how we've done it.
818
00:41:38.320 --> 00:41:41.721
I was talking to a big operator the other day, probably 12 million.
819
00:41:42.142 --> 00:41:45.422
And he said, basically all those same things before they added service.
820
00:41:45.442 --> 00:42:01.627
The other thing he added, and it was interesting, was they would actually make sure that they had already honed the offer and the marketing and then sold it to their existing customers with a timeline so that they already knew when they were training their team that this work was like on the schedule, ready to go, the revenue was booked.
821
00:42:02.727 --> 00:42:06.928
And so it wasn't a fact of like, let's go hire someone and then go find the work or upsell our customers.
822
00:42:07.188 --> 00:42:11.729
It was already like, we have sold X amount of weeks worth of work, revenue.
823
00:42:12.069 --> 00:42:14.349
And now we're going to go hire this person, train the team.
824
00:42:14.489 --> 00:42:17.850
And like, he was just ultra conservative before adding a service.
825
00:42:17.870 --> 00:42:28.232
Like, we must, he actually said there was one or two services they thought they were going to do, but they could never get enough upsell to their existing customer base to ever warrant going out and finding someone or bringing in the extra complexity.
826
00:42:28.672 --> 00:42:30.633
But obviously it's a larger, larger skill.
827
00:42:32.053 --> 00:42:33.795
build a whole department around that service.
828
00:42:34.436 --> 00:42:35.317
That's really smart.
829
00:42:35.417 --> 00:42:40.283
I would tell you that had we pre-sold pest control, we would have never got into pest control.
830
00:42:40.784 --> 00:42:41.945
So it's an interesting point.
831
00:42:42.325 --> 00:42:49.594
I'm glad we got into pest control, but we got into pest control really slow because it was way harder to build, add pest control to the business.
832
00:42:50.215 --> 00:42:51.436
And what I've learned...
833
00:42:52.513 --> 00:42:59.034
is that is exactly what a lot of other people that are in the green industry find when they try to add pest control, like in-house pest control.
834
00:42:59.674 --> 00:43:05.295
Like you can add perimeter pest control and you'll get some number of clients and you don't have to roll the truck on a separate visit.
835
00:43:05.315 --> 00:43:06.256
So it's like, who cares?
836
00:43:06.816 --> 00:43:09.536
It's not that end of the world if you don't sell a ton of it because you're already there.
837
00:43:09.576 --> 00:43:12.077
So there's not a digital stop cost or anything like that.
838
00:43:12.097 --> 00:43:14.457
It's not that hard to even learn.
839
00:43:14.797 --> 00:43:15.997
You're just doing a perimeter treatment.
840
00:43:16.237 --> 00:43:19.678
But as soon as you add pest control from the standpoint of going into the house,
841
00:43:20.782 --> 00:43:24.346
most companies don't have very strong success adding that service.
842
00:43:24.426 --> 00:43:25.827
It's way harder than you expect.
843
00:43:26.268 --> 00:43:30.672
And so had we done his approach, we wouldn't have ended up in pest control.
844
00:43:31.393 --> 00:43:32.194
Yeah, it's interesting.
845
00:43:32.314 --> 00:43:33.075
So not a bad idea.
846
00:43:33.315 --> 00:43:39.821
As I've been planning out, like even the location on Texas, it's like, I tried to break down kind of like what you do with your marketing, where it's like, instead of,
847
00:43:40.562 --> 00:43:42.344
by role, it's by like task.
848
00:43:42.904 --> 00:43:54.736
And so I did that and what I did is I would add services as a variable and the number of tasks that were, it was like very multiple, multiple exponential, I guess.
849
00:43:55.136 --> 00:43:55.597
Like a diff?
850
00:43:55.797 --> 00:43:56.358
Yeah, yeah.
851
00:43:56.378 --> 00:44:02.084
As soon as you start adding services, the amount of tasks that would be required, like it just, it compounded.
852
00:44:02.524 --> 00:44:09.672
And it was enough for me to convince myself like, okay, we let's strip out everything possible, get to get down to the point where I can at least just cover my off season slightly.
853
00:44:10.052 --> 00:44:15.518
But outside of that, like, adding each service would sometimes double or triple my list.
854
00:44:15.818 --> 00:44:16.439
So for example, like,
855
00:44:17.475 --> 00:44:26.598
hauling away debris immediately is a whole nother level because it changes the trucks, the trailers, where the debris goes, where I, how's that debris?
856
00:44:27.179 --> 00:44:28.619
Uh, am I trimming bushes?
857
00:44:28.639 --> 00:44:30.700
Well, can now I got to teach people how to trim bushes.
858
00:44:30.780 --> 00:44:30.940
Okay.
859
00:44:30.960 --> 00:44:31.700
Is it flowering?
860
00:44:31.960 --> 00:44:32.881
What time of season is it?
861
00:44:32.901 --> 00:44:33.301
Is it dead?
862
00:44:33.341 --> 00:44:34.781
Like whole nother level.
863
00:44:35.322 --> 00:44:35.842
And, um, yeah,
864
00:44:36.822 --> 00:44:40.224
It really showed to me just how much more complexity services can add.
865
00:44:41.064 --> 00:44:48.928
And I think I kind of mentioned it last week in terms like my thought process for adding a service is literally, I'm only going to have, it's going to fill my off season.
866
00:44:49.669 --> 00:44:57.653
If for some reason I've extremely limited LTV, like lifetime value, and I have to do that in order to make sense of my CAC.
867
00:44:57.673 --> 00:45:01.235
Or if I'm in a really, really small market and the only way to grow my business is,
868
00:45:01.895 --> 00:45:10.119
is through additional services, even that it starts to become, should I just move to a different market or do another location in 30 minutes away?
869
00:45:10.699 --> 00:45:20.084
I still think that friction might be lower than the complexity that comes with, okay, let's add a whole other service, a different type of truck, a different type of equipment, a whole new sales cycle.
870
00:45:20.104 --> 00:45:22.285
It's a lot of moving parts.
871
00:45:23.203 --> 00:45:23.663
Yeah, it is.
872
00:45:24.444 --> 00:45:24.944
Two things.
873
00:45:25.144 --> 00:45:29.366
One, going back to something you said, just to make sure everybody understood it, you were talking about LTV to CAC.
874
00:45:29.426 --> 00:45:34.589
And so I know we've talked about it before, but just for anybody listening, let's say you added fertilization weed control.
875
00:45:34.629 --> 00:45:40.592
And just for simple math, let's say it just generates 500 bucks a year and you only keep your client for three years.
876
00:45:41.433 --> 00:45:46.715
And so that client's worth $1,500, some percentage of that's profit, but it costs you 500 to acquire a client.
877
00:45:46.975 --> 00:45:47.636
That's a problem.
878
00:45:48.576 --> 00:45:51.538
you might be able to continue acquiring clients at $500.
879
00:45:51.918 --> 00:45:54.300
Again, don't bank on these numbers.
880
00:45:54.320 --> 00:45:55.581
I'm just using them as examples.
881
00:45:55.941 --> 00:46:01.725
But if you could turn that client into a client worth $7,000 a year, suddenly $500 isn't so bad.
882
00:46:02.286 --> 00:46:03.887
That's what Mike's talking about there.
883
00:46:04.452 --> 00:46:08.376
Yeah, and so assuming you can reduce churn so much to where they keep them longer, awesome.
884
00:46:08.576 --> 00:46:09.597
Yeah, that's another way.
885
00:46:09.958 --> 00:46:16.144
And so, again, that's where always it's like adding more services is one of those things that's kind of like you will always make more revenue.
886
00:46:16.204 --> 00:46:21.049
But my question is first, did we really decipher, can we reduce churn on our existing customers?
887
00:46:21.309 --> 00:46:23.031
That would fix the LTV problem.
888
00:46:23.491 --> 00:46:24.693
You might grow a little slower, but – Yeah.
889
00:46:27.115 --> 00:46:40.108
I think it's the easy button and many times it's the thing that has to be undone, especially if the business is not of size to where they can go out and get a manager for that department, get someone who really owns that service and really create structure for the organization.
890
00:46:40.882 --> 00:46:41.082
Yeah.
891
00:46:41.583 --> 00:46:43.164
And generally, it's not just one thing.
892
00:46:43.184 --> 00:46:44.085
That's the frustrating thing.
893
00:46:44.105 --> 00:46:45.647
We're all like, want that silver bullet.
894
00:46:45.667 --> 00:46:47.529
Like, oh, if I just fix this, it's fixed.
895
00:46:47.569 --> 00:46:52.514
And usually it's three things you've got to do to get to the outcome you want, which is the frustrating thing.
896
00:46:52.715 --> 00:46:54.016
So which of the three do you do first?
897
00:46:54.056 --> 00:46:57.359
And well, is it really one of these three or is it one of five?
898
00:46:57.440 --> 00:47:01.664
I was like, so this is where it all gets frustrating and people, we all feel like, is it worth it?
899
00:47:01.844 --> 00:47:02.325
Yeah.
900
00:47:02.785 --> 00:47:10.148
So yeah, around this whole complexity thing where you talk about for every additional service, it's, you know, it's not linear.
901
00:47:10.188 --> 00:47:13.630
It's like almost exponential in a way in how complex it feels.
902
00:47:14.470 --> 00:47:16.191
CityTurf has no desire to sell.
903
00:47:16.251 --> 00:47:19.193
I seriously doubt we would sell our business in any time.
904
00:47:19.213 --> 00:47:21.073
But Philip jokes or maybe it's not a joke.
905
00:47:21.113 --> 00:47:22.054
I think he's actually serious.
906
00:47:22.414 --> 00:47:26.316
If we were doing CityTurf, he'd just start a pest control business and he'd only do pest control.
907
00:47:27.097 --> 00:47:32.271
It's that craving of when you live inside a big business that has a lot of services...
908
00:47:34.639 --> 00:47:40.121
the dream is that, boy, it should be nice if I just had to do one thing with one type of client, it'd be so much easier.
909
00:47:40.741 --> 00:47:42.042
Whether it's easier, I don't know.
910
00:47:42.722 --> 00:47:47.944
Because you have to get a lot of pest control clients to grow a decent size revenue or business.
911
00:47:47.984 --> 00:47:51.745
Whereas if you're offering three services, it can be a fraction of size.
912
00:47:52.206 --> 00:47:55.967
Or if you're serving big properties versus small properties, it could be a fraction of size.
913
00:47:56.007 --> 00:47:58.088
So who knows what's really easier.
914
00:47:58.437 --> 00:48:06.348
I think sometimes too, adding more services is actually a band-aid for not being able to acquire customers repeatedly or consistently and not knowing your customer acquisition cost.
915
00:48:06.929 --> 00:48:13.678
Because the only way to make more money and grow the business from a top-line revenue perspective is add more services because you don't know how to get new ones.
916
00:48:14.399 --> 00:48:14.559
Yeah.
917
00:48:14.599 --> 00:48:14.759
Yeah.
918
00:48:16.428 --> 00:48:16.628
Yep.
919
00:48:17.549 --> 00:48:26.877
So along these lines of complexity, at CityTurf, we created some complexity for ourselves, but I believe for the right reason.
920
00:48:27.398 --> 00:48:38.668
So the backstory here, and we've probably talked about it here, is our mowing business is smaller than it used to be by a decent amount, and that's intentional.
921
00:48:39.678 --> 00:48:43.921
And we started transitioning the business years ago to more fertilization weed control.
922
00:48:43.961 --> 00:48:48.204
So something like 93% to 95% of all our clients buy fertilization weed control.
923
00:48:48.885 --> 00:48:50.246
It's almost all of them.
924
00:48:51.086 --> 00:49:00.153
And the reason we like mowing, we still love mowing to this day, but we have found it incredibly difficult to build a...
925
00:49:01.738 --> 00:49:03.419
We'll call mowing a...
926
00:49:03.539 --> 00:49:08.421
Even in Dallas, mowing a service that's doing more than $10 million a year just in mowing.
927
00:49:08.581 --> 00:49:09.461
We found that to be...
928
00:49:10.002 --> 00:49:12.663
But doing it, no, not as much the problem.
929
00:49:12.683 --> 00:49:17.185
There's problems with mowing, but more the staffing has always been our challenge.
930
00:49:17.225 --> 00:49:21.007
And so what we did years ago is we got rid of biweekly.
931
00:49:21.187 --> 00:49:25.589
We found biweekly, there'll be more troublesome, less profitable.
932
00:49:25.949 --> 00:49:30.031
If you're going to get negative reviews, if you're going to get complaint calls, generally biweekly.
933
00:49:30.691 --> 00:49:33.453
It's like, so we just got rid of biweekly a long time ago.
934
00:49:34.194 --> 00:49:37.257
That was an example of some problems.
935
00:49:37.837 --> 00:49:40.199
People were not happy when we got rid of biweekly.
936
00:49:40.279 --> 00:49:46.264
At the time, if I remember correctly, 18% of our clients, something like that were biweekly clients.
937
00:49:46.865 --> 00:49:48.146
So people were upset.
938
00:49:48.406 --> 00:49:51.048
They're like, hey, we've been your loyal clients for all these years.
939
00:49:51.929 --> 00:49:53.291
And you're just going to let us go.
940
00:49:53.331 --> 00:49:59.418
We, of course, tried to move them to weekly, but that was painful and caused us some problems.
941
00:49:59.478 --> 00:50:01.821
But it was definitely the right decision for the business.
942
00:50:02.682 --> 00:50:11.131
And so it allowed us to reserve our pool of labor and team members for the weekly clients who also tended to be the clients that would buy other services.
943
00:50:12.022 --> 00:50:22.447
So then we progressed that even further where we got to a place like we'll only take you as a mowing client if you buy mowing and we'll say fertilization weed control.
944
00:50:22.507 --> 00:50:23.147
Core services.
945
00:50:23.987 --> 00:50:26.928
Core services, but that is dead.
946
00:50:28.708 --> 00:50:29.329
That is over.
947
00:50:29.529 --> 00:50:32.650
Sorry, inside joke.
948
00:50:32.850 --> 00:50:35.450
For the sake of this video, mowing and fertilization we control.
949
00:50:36.691 --> 00:50:39.712
So anyway, that's a whole other conversation.
950
00:50:40.152 --> 00:50:43.333
But I will tell you, that really suppresses the buying.
951
00:50:44.073 --> 00:50:44.574
Absolutely.
952
00:50:44.594 --> 00:50:50.900
And that's why when I was joking at the beginning of our intro, I was like, hey, we're going to bring back bi-weekly mowing and you don't have to buy anything else.
953
00:50:51.220 --> 00:50:55.864
Because we just, if you look at our lead flow, we just get unbelievable amounts.
954
00:50:55.945 --> 00:51:01.250
We get so many mowing leads, so many, but we don't win a lot of them because of the combination.
955
00:51:02.291 --> 00:51:04.433
And so anyway...
956
00:51:05.547 --> 00:51:07.528
Where I'm going with this is I just wanted to give the setup.
957
00:51:07.548 --> 00:51:08.689
That's what CityTurf looks like.
958
00:51:08.709 --> 00:51:19.555
So kind of my question to Mike that I wanted to talk through was, if you wanted to build a really big mowing business, like you can use the Dallas market because it's huge.
959
00:51:22.337 --> 00:51:27.280
And you wanted to grow to call it 10 million in residential revenue.
960
00:51:27.320 --> 00:51:31.402
And also keep in mind in the Dallas market, you're mowing 32, 34 weeks a year.
961
00:51:31.482 --> 00:51:32.543
That's your number of cuts.
962
00:51:35.066 --> 00:51:36.586
How would you staff that business?
963
00:51:37.587 --> 00:51:43.630
Based on what you've learned over time, do you think that you could realistically have... Let's say you had a franchisee.
964
00:51:43.650 --> 00:51:44.691
We'll just use a franchisee.
965
00:51:44.711 --> 00:51:48.933
A franchisee, could they realistically, you think, staff a $10 million business?
966
00:51:49.073 --> 00:51:56.997
Or is it better to run these smaller mowing businesses, like a million-dollar mowing business, than trying to build to a $10 million business?
967
00:51:57.237 --> 00:51:58.157
So it's two parts here.
968
00:51:58.358 --> 00:51:58.518
One...
969
00:51:59.719 --> 00:52:03.282
is the million probably a much easier business to build than 10?
970
00:52:03.402 --> 00:52:04.863
Is 10 even realistic?
971
00:52:04.964 --> 00:52:07.726
And if it is realistic, how would you go about staffing that business?
972
00:52:08.327 --> 00:52:10.629
Okay, I will answer the question, but I wanted to follow up on another one.
973
00:52:10.649 --> 00:52:10.929
Sorry.
974
00:52:11.269 --> 00:52:11.650
Yeah, please.
975
00:52:11.690 --> 00:52:13.111
I will come back to it though.
976
00:52:13.191 --> 00:52:13.512
Yeah, yeah.
977
00:52:14.112 --> 00:52:19.778
So when you say you require weekly, do you require weekly year round or for like eight months of the year, nine months of the year?
978
00:52:19.798 --> 00:52:21.839
Oh, weekly during the growing season.
979
00:52:22.120 --> 00:52:22.400
Got it.
980
00:52:22.480 --> 00:52:24.262
And then it's just off outside of that.
981
00:52:24.876 --> 00:52:27.337
We actually require some of our mower.
982
00:52:27.417 --> 00:52:28.557
Yeah, we're off other than that.
983
00:52:28.577 --> 00:52:32.199
We have some of our competitors probably mow more frequently than we do.
984
00:52:32.439 --> 00:52:38.641
They'll, you know, especially if they're putting you into like a package or something where you're just paying a monthly amount.
985
00:52:38.961 --> 00:52:40.582
But we just mow when it needs mowing.
986
00:52:40.822 --> 00:52:41.863
We're anyway.
987
00:52:42.183 --> 00:52:42.823
Yeah, I got you.
988
00:52:43.083 --> 00:52:43.303
Okay.
989
00:52:43.543 --> 00:52:43.704
Yeah.
990
00:52:43.724 --> 00:52:46.245
So like I kind of attack it from a few different angles.
991
00:52:46.486 --> 00:52:48.907
The first one is probably closer.
992
00:52:48.927 --> 00:53:02.677
I would imagine what you do, which is basically allowing people, allowing technicians to be okay with, Hey, you're going to be off for three months or bringing in like temporary labor, whether it be H2B or you even temporary housing for people that you would do.
993
00:53:02.737 --> 00:53:08.902
Hey, you're, you're eight, nine months, and then you don't have any work for three months of the year and potentially taking some hit.
994
00:53:09.482 --> 00:53:18.769
on that in terms of like whether it be from people being laid off and taking unemployment or if your HDB program costs extra, et cetera.
995
00:53:19.070 --> 00:53:23.493
So I think that's probably the first place I'd be going in terms of like if that's the model.
996
00:53:23.833 --> 00:53:30.639
How we're doing it, like when I'm going there, because essentially what we're doing is we're trying to push everything to do with treatments outside of the mowing as much as possible.
997
00:53:30.659 --> 00:53:33.781
I also like the peak growing season when we acquire weekly.
998
00:53:34.042 --> 00:53:38.305
So we're acquiring weekly for certain ones and then every other month will be biweekly.
999
00:53:38.585 --> 00:53:44.008
including the quote off season, those, the biweekly work will be intact.
1000
00:53:44.028 --> 00:53:56.496
But how I'm trying to do it specifically in my location is by having the crews be governed routes with their truck or their van and equipment, they're really incentivized to make sure that they keep everyone on the route.
1001
00:53:57.036 --> 00:54:07.803
And so they're going to do the extra little bit, you know, if there's a branch, et cetera, the little things to make sure that their customers do stay on schedule since we don't have contracts.
1002
00:54:08.583 --> 00:54:15.008
And I also believe you can, but how we're doing is using the offer to keep them on that schedule.
1003
00:54:15.028 --> 00:54:19.651
It's like, hey, if you go up the schedule, if you go to buy weekly, it's such a price difference, you might as well just stay on weekly.
1004
00:54:20.251 --> 00:54:23.133
And so I'm kind of shoehorning them into it.
1005
00:54:23.494 --> 00:54:26.996
And therefore, from a labor perspective, I have to then set the expectation for my crew.
1006
00:54:27.036 --> 00:54:28.717
Hey, you're gonna make, you're gonna probably get 25 to 30 hours
1007
00:54:29.918 --> 00:54:36.062
during the off season, you're not going to get 40, 45 plus that you would during the season.
1008
00:54:36.322 --> 00:54:43.407
And so from like our P4P perspective, you might make eight, $10 more per hour during growing season because you got a full route and you're just cranking.
1009
00:54:44.067 --> 00:54:49.051
But now when we say, hey, people are going back to biweekly, you are likely going to make...
1010
00:54:49.831 --> 00:54:55.355
Let's call it 25 hours, 30 hours and three to five dollars more per hour above base pay.
1011
00:54:55.895 --> 00:55:00.638
And so just the expectation, like setting the expectation is really the model I'm using.
1012
00:55:00.959 --> 00:55:07.483
I think the third option that some people use for Augusta specifically is adding a completely new service.
1013
00:55:08.104 --> 00:55:12.587
So that's like we have Augusta Lights is it's a whole new thing you bring in.
1014
00:55:13.207 --> 00:55:18.211
I think this is where, again, it's a slippery slope to adding more services to keep your crew busy.
1015
00:55:19.111 --> 00:55:23.633
But it's probably the last line of defense in terms of making sure you fill your offseas.
1016
00:55:23.973 --> 00:55:33.917
So are you saying, like, for example, your franchisees in my market right now in here in Texas, are they doing biweekly outside of the growing?
1017
00:55:34.017 --> 00:55:37.398
So essentially, are they there at least every two weeks, 52 weeks a year?
1018
00:55:38.351 --> 00:55:38.671
Correct.
1019
00:55:39.091 --> 00:55:42.332
And some of them have varying degrees of enforcement.
1020
00:55:42.852 --> 00:55:48.493
Some people might be like, hey, you are not a client unless, kind of like the city chair model, you must do this.
1021
00:55:48.913 --> 00:55:53.475
And other ones are like, hey, I will upsell them into this optional thing during the offseason.
1022
00:55:53.835 --> 00:55:55.535
I will promote that value.
1023
00:55:56.135 --> 00:55:58.476
And if people drop off, it is what it is.
1024
00:55:58.936 --> 00:56:01.376
And so I think there's varying degrees of enforcement.
1025
00:56:01.776 --> 00:56:02.997
I'm going to be pretty rigid on it.
1026
00:56:03.297 --> 00:56:04.357
But then I think also by
1027
00:56:09.038 --> 00:56:13.120
route on schedule, like keeping them on the route, it'll be helpful.
1028
00:56:14.921 --> 00:56:21.484
See, I wouldn't have thought that the client would go for biweekly through December, January, February.
1029
00:56:21.764 --> 00:56:22.405
That's interesting.
1030
00:56:22.605 --> 00:56:27.607
Right now, like in most of our markets, we have about a 60 to 70% take rate, even if we don't enforce it.
1031
00:56:28.228 --> 00:56:30.849
And it's just a matter of selling it to the customer on the upfront,
1032
00:56:31.589 --> 00:56:34.150
Um, there's usually things we can do on the property still.
1033
00:56:34.850 --> 00:56:43.872
Um, and we just, we are able to show like, Hey, we could, we could come do your leaves, you know, in fall, it's gonna cost you a thousand dollars to get them all off the lawn, whatever.
1034
00:56:44.212 --> 00:56:46.072
Or we can just keep coming on a bi-weekly basis.
1035
00:56:46.412 --> 00:56:47.573
We'll keep mowing if needed.
1036
00:56:48.073 --> 00:56:50.253
So some markets like you might need mowing once a month.
1037
00:56:50.793 --> 00:56:57.655
Um, even in Washington state, it didn't snow last year and we were mowing like kind of on a monthly basis throughout the winter.
1038
00:56:57.675 --> 00:56:57.735
Um,
1039
00:56:58.717 --> 00:57:05.281
But in other markets, they might have to throw in something like, hey, if it's frozen, we'll put down salt melt on your steps, for example.
1040
00:57:05.541 --> 00:57:10.604
And they'll throw some other little things in to sweeten the pot during those winter months.
1041
00:57:11.384 --> 00:57:11.664
Okay.
1042
00:57:12.225 --> 00:57:19.068
Yeah, if we do our job right on fertilization weed control, there is absolutely nothing to mow at least three months of the year.
1043
00:57:19.408 --> 00:57:20.729
It's just completely dormant.
1044
00:57:21.450 --> 00:57:23.851
But if we don't do our job, then there would be weeds in the lawn.
1045
00:57:24.751 --> 00:57:27.553
The challenge, this is interesting, the challenge is...
1046
00:57:29.186 --> 00:57:33.449
I'd be scared to add leaves, but you come from markets that are heavily treed.
1047
00:57:33.850 --> 00:57:38.694
So if you're saying, hey, we're going to kind of mow up the leaves, you're going to bag them.
1048
00:57:39.995 --> 00:57:45.299
Do you just like, let's say you normally spend 30 minutes on the property just to make up a number.
1049
00:57:46.059 --> 00:57:51.343
Would you just give it 30 minutes and there will still be whatever leaves are left or what is what's left?
1050
00:57:51.384 --> 00:57:54.286
Because leaf cleanups can be huge undertakings here.
1051
00:57:54.985 --> 00:57:58.307
Yeah, so I'll broadly speak for Augustination because there's so many different... Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1052
00:57:58.347 --> 00:57:59.068
Every market's so different.
1053
00:57:59.428 --> 00:58:02.670
But in general, we try to explain our best to the customer.
1054
00:58:02.690 --> 00:58:05.712
Hey, we're going to spend the same amount of time on your property that we would mowing.
1055
00:58:06.373 --> 00:58:08.254
And if that means, hey, there's leaves in...
1056
00:58:08.274 --> 00:58:09.735
Okay, we're going to spend a little extra time.
1057
00:58:09.755 --> 00:58:10.736
We're going to moult them up.
1058
00:58:10.996 --> 00:58:12.417
We're going to bag them if that...
1059
00:58:12.977 --> 00:58:15.719
what it requires, but we're spending this amount of time on your property.
1060
00:58:16.159 --> 00:58:22.965
And then how we do it is like, there's a checklist of things that we can get through that might not be mowing the lawn, but there's some things we can do value add.
1061
00:58:23.025 --> 00:58:28.569
So for example, if it's a market where it can freeze, we'll check the downspouts, making sure it's like, Hey, is there flow?
1062
00:58:28.769 --> 00:58:30.611
It's all things that are just straight labor.
1063
00:58:30.651 --> 00:58:31.691
There's no technical.
1064
00:58:32.692 --> 00:58:51.383
skill needed, even putting down like salt in some markets where it's freezing, it adds value and customers usually really like it because someone's showing up their property and making sure it just looks decent when otherwise we would be gone for three months and there's a branch down, there's a bush that died, there's that sort of thing.
1065
00:58:51.403 --> 00:58:51.563
And then
1066
00:58:51.563 --> 00:58:53.584
And so we edge the property, blow off everything.
1067
00:58:53.864 --> 00:58:57.887
We look for things like cobwebs up in the eaves, little stuff like that that we will do.
1068
00:58:58.507 --> 00:59:00.789
And we still have about 60 to 70% people will take it.
1069
00:59:01.349 --> 00:59:03.251
New customers, we can get 80 to 90%.
1070
00:59:03.671 --> 00:59:09.214
It's if you're trying to convert people after they've already, they've got used of three or four months off, maybe 30% will take it.
1071
00:59:10.555 --> 00:59:10.715
Huh.
1072
00:59:11.156 --> 00:59:11.496
Interesting.
1073
00:59:11.516 --> 00:59:13.237
Do you have any idea how you're selling?
1074
00:59:13.297 --> 00:59:16.019
You're explaining all that upfront on the initial call?
1075
00:59:16.626 --> 00:59:18.628
We do, but take it back.
1076
00:59:18.808 --> 00:59:20.350
We say this is a year-round service.
1077
00:59:20.370 --> 00:59:21.171
These are the schedule.
1078
00:59:21.511 --> 00:59:22.392
But people forget.
1079
00:59:22.492 --> 00:59:25.275
And so we usually try to get ahead of about six weeks.
1080
00:59:25.675 --> 00:59:30.761
So, for example, if it's going to start dying off in November, we're going to start talking about this in October.
1081
00:59:31.401 --> 00:59:36.366
And we're going to explain it thoroughly to the customer so that when that time comes, they already know what's going on.
1082
00:59:36.947 --> 00:59:39.828
And then we do, we just allow it because people miss it or whatever.
1083
00:59:40.209 --> 00:59:43.170
If they call after their first bill and they're like, it's not even, it doesn't need it.
1084
00:59:43.450 --> 00:59:44.871
And they didn't get the communication.
1085
00:59:45.151 --> 00:59:46.192
We just refund them.
1086
00:59:46.572 --> 00:59:49.073
But if we've done our job right, we've sent them a video.
1087
00:59:49.393 --> 00:59:50.194
We've called them.
1088
00:59:50.254 --> 00:59:53.415
We've communicated and confirmed like, hey, this is what the service is.
1089
00:59:53.936 --> 00:59:55.036
The costs are exactly the same.
1090
00:59:55.056 --> 00:59:56.337
We spend the same amount of time on the property.
1091
00:59:56.557 --> 00:59:58.518
We just do these other services while we're there.
1092
00:59:59.518 --> 01:00:00.459
And a lot of people really like it.
1093
01:00:02.377 --> 01:00:03.138
It's very interesting.
1094
01:00:03.598 --> 01:00:05.981
That solves or greatly reduce it.
1095
01:00:06.061 --> 01:00:16.752
That can offset some of the labor problem because part of the labor problem is also, as you know, I'm not saying anything you don't know, it's how do you staff great people nine months of the year?
1096
01:00:16.893 --> 01:00:19.415
Because they're not going to sit on unemployment.
1097
01:00:19.435 --> 01:00:21.878
They're going to go get a job and they may not be coming back next year.
1098
01:00:22.158 --> 01:00:23.620
And that's a huge part of the problem.
1099
01:00:24.040 --> 01:00:32.622
And I've seen some people get creative too with finding other people in their market that have a completely different service and they have a good relationship with like, hey, we end this date.
1100
01:00:33.576 --> 01:00:37.359
You're going to take my employees and then your service is done and they come back to me.
1101
01:00:37.879 --> 01:00:42.843
And so, for example, up in Alberta, there's Yard Dogs, their company.
1102
01:00:42.863 --> 01:00:49.789
They do just treatments and all their crew goes to a snow company for the winter and they come right back to when spring comes.
1103
01:00:50.289 --> 01:00:52.471
And so sometimes that works depending on your market as well.
1104
01:00:52.751 --> 01:00:53.431
Finding someone else.
1105
01:00:53.451 --> 01:01:00.417
So they actually it's just like everyone moves over there because they need labor and they all come back and they're not competing for that labor in between.
1106
01:01:00.437 --> 01:01:00.537
Yeah.
1107
01:01:00.657 --> 01:01:01.358
Because that's the challenge.
1108
01:01:01.378 --> 01:01:05.882
If they go find a job, to your point, they might not come back.
1109
01:01:05.942 --> 01:01:06.382
Yeah.
1110
01:01:06.682 --> 01:01:14.790
When you added Christmas lights to the business, I assume you did it to solve for this winner challenge because that's adding another service.
1111
01:01:15.070 --> 01:01:15.610
Yep.
1112
01:01:15.650 --> 01:01:20.675
What percentage of your franchisees are installing Christmas lights at this point?
1113
01:01:20.933 --> 01:01:21.914
About 55%.
1114
01:01:22.714 --> 01:01:23.355
Okay.
1115
01:01:23.375 --> 01:01:28.958
So we kind of have, that's your last resort if you can't solve Q4, is you add in the Christmas lights.
1116
01:01:29.518 --> 01:01:34.341
But before that, it's like, can I just advertise and absorb a higher customer equity cost?
1117
01:01:35.002 --> 01:01:38.204
If it's completely dormant and there's snow on the ground, good luck trying to sell a million customers.
1118
01:01:38.244 --> 01:01:38.884
That's not gonna work.
1119
01:01:38.904 --> 01:01:41.626
You gotta keep moving along to snow services.
1120
01:01:41.866 --> 01:01:46.189
Okay, can I sell a recurring package where it's recurring revenue year round?
1121
01:01:46.469 --> 01:01:49.051
Well, some markets that doesn't work and you're getting huge amounts of cancellations.
1122
01:01:49.911 --> 01:01:50.793
Can I do Christmas lights?
1123
01:01:50.873 --> 01:01:55.540
And so it's always solving for the off scene because I believe that's like the problem with home services in general.
1124
01:01:55.821 --> 01:01:57.383
And to your point, it's not just the marketing side.
1125
01:01:57.463 --> 01:02:02.672
It is how do I retain my staff if I have a huge downfall of those leads?
1126
01:02:03.937 --> 01:02:09.623
So one question I have for you is on the mowing side, understand there's that three month lull.
1127
01:02:10.083 --> 01:02:11.324
Do you for the treatment side?
1128
01:02:11.364 --> 01:02:19.652
Do you make your packages to the point where essentially doing pre-emergent during those months and you're able to fill that with a little bit less of a dip in labor?
1129
01:02:20.280 --> 01:02:21.521
We don't use the same people.
1130
01:02:21.861 --> 01:02:23.822
Our techs are completely different people.
1131
01:02:24.422 --> 01:02:27.464
We do an aid application program, and so we keep our techs busy.
1132
01:02:27.844 --> 01:02:31.306
Because our techs could also be doing grubs, or they could be doing ants.
1133
01:02:31.886 --> 01:02:36.588
They could be doing a variety of additional services that kind of go into the fertilization weed control world.
1134
01:02:36.908 --> 01:02:43.312
So maybe you'll have take-all root rot, or you'll have some other kind of a... People will periodically get these different issues in their property.
1135
01:02:43.332 --> 01:02:45.273
So the techs can stay busy.
1136
01:02:50.235 --> 01:02:51.916
stay busy in January and February.
1137
01:02:51.997 --> 01:03:01.584
So theoretically, if you could use a mowing technician when they're off, there's definitely applications to be doing during the winter.
1138
01:03:01.885 --> 01:03:05.167
But we also have a lot of applications to do throughout the summer as well, because we do eight.
1139
01:03:05.628 --> 01:03:08.810
I think if you were doing five or something like that, maybe it'd be a little bit different.
1140
01:03:09.551 --> 01:03:09.891
Very cool.
1141
01:03:10.091 --> 01:03:11.773
I don't know what other companies, that's just how we do it.
1142
01:03:12.013 --> 01:03:12.193
Yeah.
1143
01:03:12.778 --> 01:03:19.346
Yeah, that's one thing that part of it is like when I get there, the winter, I really want to see that winter is before I scale hard next spring.
1144
01:03:19.366 --> 01:03:21.048
I really want to feel it.
1145
01:03:21.308 --> 01:03:24.332
Like I have some ideas of two different routes we could go.
1146
01:03:24.672 --> 01:03:26.634
One more being winter services, like I've mentioned.
1147
01:03:26.895 --> 01:03:30.198
One being more, do I need to cross train people or do I lay them off?
1148
01:03:30.979 --> 01:03:34.121
Um, yeah, so I'm gonna sell eyes for that specific market.
1149
01:03:34.141 --> 01:03:51.614
I don't know the answer but from what's worked with Gus It's a matter of like figure out one of these four or five routes and then you just gotta stick to it And for some people like Christmas lights is their best service of the year That's where they make all their profit It's like the whole year is you just are getting your crew ready for three months of installing a lot of lights Yeah
1150
01:03:53.160 --> 01:03:55.782
Are you going to do, you're not doing beds and bushes, right?
1151
01:03:55.963 --> 01:03:56.123
No.
1152
01:03:56.423 --> 01:03:56.643
Okay.
1153
01:03:56.904 --> 01:03:57.044
Yeah.
1154
01:03:57.264 --> 01:04:00.307
Those are some of the things that you can do in the off season as well.
1155
01:04:00.387 --> 01:04:03.029
But if you're not doing it, the problem is you complicate the rest of the year.
1156
01:04:03.550 --> 01:04:03.710
Yep.
1157
01:04:03.770 --> 01:04:05.912
You, you can't use the same people.
1158
01:04:06.032 --> 01:04:06.693
I'll be honest.
1159
01:04:06.713 --> 01:04:13.579
Like when it comes to doing the winter services, that's when we start to, even though we don't offer that service, it's one of those things the crew will start to just do.
1160
01:04:13.819 --> 01:04:14.820
Hey, there's a limb down.
1161
01:04:14.940 --> 01:04:16.482
I will just go ahead and trim that up for them.
1162
01:04:17.122 --> 01:04:21.344
Because they're looking for things to do on the property to add value to retain the customer.
1163
01:04:21.944 --> 01:04:26.886
And we see if you have the route locked to the technician, there's even more of that.
1164
01:04:26.946 --> 01:04:29.747
Like they really want to make sure they don't lose anyone on their route.
1165
01:04:30.187 --> 01:04:33.929
So they'll talk to the customer like, hey, do you like, hey, I'll take that down real quick for you.
1166
01:04:33.949 --> 01:04:34.429
No problem.
1167
01:04:34.789 --> 01:04:36.610
Little stuff like that just to add value.
1168
01:04:37.210 --> 01:04:39.331
But every market is so different.
1169
01:04:39.371 --> 01:04:42.672
So I'm looking forward to seeing this winter, like specifically in that market, what I do.
1170
01:04:43.559 --> 01:04:48.262
When you say they talk to the home, we'll call it the homeowner, who's doing the talking?
1171
01:04:48.462 --> 01:04:50.003
The owner of the franchise or the crew?
1172
01:04:50.023 --> 01:04:50.663
The technician.
1173
01:04:50.763 --> 01:04:51.564
The technician is.
1174
01:04:51.584 --> 01:04:53.865
Yeah, like they won't typically talk to the customer.
1175
01:04:53.925 --> 01:05:05.752
I'm saying when they have ownership of their route and they want to make sure the customer's happy, satisfied, knows what's going on with the winter service, understands why we might not get everything done on the property, that's when they'll talk to the customer.
1176
01:05:06.732 --> 01:05:08.373
You see high propensity for them to do that.
1177
01:05:08.493 --> 01:05:12.696
If they know that this customer is not satisfied and they cancel,
1178
01:05:13.356 --> 01:05:14.076
I have less hours.
1179
01:05:14.556 --> 01:05:20.998
And so we've always just been really cool with the technicians like, hey, the whole objective here is to add value to the customers so that we can keep 60, 70% of your hours.
1180
01:05:21.359 --> 01:05:24.019
It's not gonna be full time, but you might get 25, 30 hours.
1181
01:05:24.319 --> 01:05:27.060
And what happens usually for the person that's like, hey, that's not okay with me.
1182
01:05:27.380 --> 01:05:31.922
They'll go get another job that's temporary, bringing therefore the work for everyone else up.
1183
01:05:32.462 --> 01:05:34.563
And so that's, we've seen it usually balance out pretty good.
1184
01:05:34.663 --> 01:05:38.423
We just tell everyone very upfront at the beginning, hey, hours are going to be less.
1185
01:05:38.443 --> 01:05:40.504
You're going to be 25 to 32 hours a week.
1186
01:05:40.824 --> 01:05:42.264
And if you're not okay with that, let us know.
1187
01:05:42.324 --> 01:05:42.804
Totally fine.
1188
01:05:42.824 --> 01:05:47.546
We'll have a guaranteed start date with a return to work bonus at the beginning of spring.
1189
01:05:48.066 --> 01:05:50.306
Otherwise, you're just going to have less hours.
1190
01:05:50.526 --> 01:05:51.466
And then it's really up to them.
1191
01:05:53.367 --> 01:05:53.767
Interesting.
1192
01:05:54.947 --> 01:05:56.007
Well, this might be interesting.
1193
01:05:56.027 --> 01:05:58.128
We'll see if you come up with any great ideas that I can swipe.
1194
01:05:58.400 --> 01:05:58.700
It's okay.
1195
01:05:58.740 --> 01:06:01.063
I'll let you follow my technicians around late in the season.
1196
01:06:01.323 --> 01:06:03.926
They can hop over to city turf, help out, then come back in the spring.
1197
01:06:06.242 --> 01:06:08.223
I'm also going to watch all your Facebook ads.
1198
01:06:08.283 --> 01:06:08.643
That's right.
1199
01:06:08.663 --> 01:06:09.444
That's right.
1200
01:06:09.464 --> 01:06:10.644
Swipe in the floor, baby.
1201
01:06:10.664 --> 01:06:11.525
Swipe in the floor.
1202
01:06:11.625 --> 01:06:12.925
I'm going to copy them.
1203
01:06:13.085 --> 01:06:14.386
I'm going to upload them to Claude.
1204
01:06:14.406 --> 01:06:17.327
I'm going to have them change the logo and I'm going to put them up on Facebook.
1205
01:06:17.367 --> 01:06:21.089
We've talked so much now and so much voice and video of our faces.
1206
01:06:21.109 --> 01:06:22.030
You can be like, hey, this face.
1207
01:06:22.070 --> 01:06:22.990
Now they see this face.
1208
01:06:23.070 --> 01:06:23.910
Swap it over.
1209
01:06:23.930 --> 01:06:25.671
There you go.
1210
01:06:25.751 --> 01:06:26.992
This is going to work out wonderfully.
1211
01:06:27.012 --> 01:06:28.112
Fantastic.
1212
01:06:28.373 --> 01:06:28.653
Okay.
1213
01:06:29.733 --> 01:06:30.473
All right.
1214
01:06:30.813 --> 01:06:31.774
Anything else on that topic?
1215
01:06:31.794 --> 01:06:33.314
I think we covered that one pretty well.
1216
01:06:33.354 --> 01:06:33.894
It's a tough one.
1217
01:06:33.954 --> 01:06:34.494
Yeah, it's a tough one.
1218
01:06:34.514 --> 01:06:37.475
I think for every industry, it's the hardest thing to crack.
1219
01:06:37.495 --> 01:06:50.379
And I think most time these topics, I feel like, correspond so well because adding more services, for most people, what it does is just build and build and build their peak season and make the difference between their peak season and their slow season even more and more.
1220
01:06:51.667 --> 01:06:52.527
further and further apart.
1221
01:06:53.028 --> 01:06:57.029
And so to say, Hey, I'm mowing, therefore I'm going to add pressure washing.
1222
01:06:57.409 --> 01:07:01.651
You just took the exact same demand curve and just compounded it.
1223
01:07:02.251 --> 01:07:09.454
And so for me, it's like, if you're going to add a service, kind of what we talked about before, it's got to be an inverse demand curve of your primary service.
1224
01:07:09.774 --> 01:07:14.495
That's like the best case scenario, or at least something that you can do during those months if you're going to add a service.
1225
01:07:14.835 --> 01:07:14.995
Yeah.
1226
01:07:15.016 --> 01:07:16.016
A hundred percent agree.
1227
01:07:17.030 --> 01:07:25.112
Mike mentioned this earlier, but I did just put up a video a week ago or so about finding team members and recruiting and looking for people.
1228
01:07:25.153 --> 01:07:26.553
We talked about it earlier in the session.
1229
01:07:27.153 --> 01:07:30.134
And if you're struggling with it, I would recommend checking it out.
1230
01:07:30.174 --> 01:07:31.274
And we covered one of the points.
1231
01:07:31.314 --> 01:07:38.797
One of the big points is just get aggressive with what you're willing to spend and get aggressive with the amount of time you're investing in this because it's the key to everything.
1232
01:07:39.097 --> 01:07:41.838
Low view videos equals high value videos.
1233
01:07:42.558 --> 01:07:42.798
So...
1234
01:07:43.611 --> 01:07:44.431
Wait, say it again.
1235
01:07:44.471 --> 01:07:45.732
What equals high value videos?
1236
01:07:46.072 --> 01:07:48.473
Low view videos equals high value videos.
1237
01:07:48.594 --> 01:07:50.695
Oh, I think it is another low view video.
1238
01:07:50.715 --> 01:07:51.375
I saw it.
1239
01:07:51.475 --> 01:07:51.995
I saw it.
1240
01:07:52.415 --> 01:07:52.916
I shared it.
1241
01:07:53.016 --> 01:07:54.456
I shared it with several people.
1242
01:07:54.957 --> 01:07:55.697
Yeah.
1243
01:07:55.977 --> 01:08:00.259
All the stuff that I think, like, man, this is stuff that actually really matters.
1244
01:08:00.279 --> 01:08:02.681
Like, if you do it, you'll make more money.
1245
01:08:03.021 --> 01:08:04.281
That stuff never does that good.
1246
01:08:04.421 --> 01:08:06.122
It's all the feel good stuff.
1247
01:08:06.222 --> 01:08:07.763
It's all the feeling stuff.
1248
01:08:07.803 --> 01:08:10.945
Like, oh, if you're feeling kind of down and burned out.
1249
01:08:11.945 --> 01:08:12.865
It's okay.
1250
01:08:13.265 --> 01:08:14.145
That stuff does way better.
1251
01:08:15.726 --> 01:08:17.066
But everybody needs that too.
1252
01:08:17.126 --> 01:08:21.667
But I'm just like, man, the tools, the tactics, this is how you get it done.
1253
01:08:21.707 --> 01:08:28.208
I did a four hour video the other day for about marriage and budgeting with your spouse for the school community.
1254
01:08:28.248 --> 01:08:35.169
And I was like, guys, the reason that this is here is because if I put this on YouTube, my demand, my, my, my chart would be off.
1255
01:08:35.730 --> 01:08:36.570
Collapse your numbers.
1256
01:08:36.650 --> 01:08:37.270
Exactly.
1257
01:08:37.290 --> 01:08:37.470
Yeah.
1258
01:08:39.130 --> 01:08:40.851
I'm just not really a fluff person.
1259
01:08:40.871 --> 01:08:42.371
I'm like, just solve the problem.
1260
01:08:42.551 --> 01:08:43.532
Let's quit talking about the problem.
1261
01:08:43.552 --> 01:08:43.932
Let's solve it.
1262
01:08:43.952 --> 01:08:46.593
So I want to create stuff that solves the problem.
1263
01:08:46.913 --> 01:08:48.693
Anyway, all right, moving on.
1264
01:08:49.454 --> 01:08:57.556
A question I've been asked many times is, what is a realistic, and I'll be right up front, I'll say, I don't have a good answer for this, but I'd love to just talk through it.
1265
01:08:57.696 --> 01:08:58.577
I don't know the answer.
1266
01:08:59.057 --> 01:09:04.639
But what do you think is a realistic percentage of a market that somebody could capture?
1267
01:09:05.459 --> 01:09:07.580
So in other words, you'd say, I have...
1268
01:09:08.420 --> 01:09:11.541
3% of the homes or 10% of the homes in my market.
1269
01:09:11.601 --> 01:09:13.842
Now I think this would very much depend on the service.
1270
01:09:14.202 --> 01:09:27.726
For example, mowing is going to give you a much, you could capture a much higher percentage of a market for mowing because a lot of people buy mowing services in some markets, whereas a lot fewer people might buy pest control.
1271
01:09:27.786 --> 01:09:29.427
Pest controls bought quite a bit as well.
1272
01:09:29.747 --> 01:09:30.527
Not as much as mowing.
1273
01:09:30.547 --> 01:09:31.188
I don't believe.
1274
01:09:32.128 --> 01:09:32.308
Um,
1275
01:09:33.980 --> 01:09:36.762
More people will buy mowing than they'll buy house cleaning.
1276
01:09:37.202 --> 01:09:39.804
So it kind of depends on what service we're talking about.
1277
01:09:40.444 --> 01:09:45.748
But in regards to so we could use mowing examples, we could use other services as an example.
1278
01:09:45.768 --> 01:09:47.069
But how do you think about this?
1279
01:09:47.089 --> 01:09:48.750
Do you have any insights on this or ideas?
1280
01:09:49.110 --> 01:09:50.851
Yeah, I think this is a great use case for AI.
1281
01:09:50.951 --> 01:09:53.812
So I actually pull up an image where I use like my local area.
1282
01:09:54.352 --> 01:09:56.193
And this is like just really quick and dirty math.
1283
01:09:56.493 --> 01:09:58.114
And you can see what my prompt was.
1284
01:09:58.134 --> 01:09:58.955
I tried to keep it simple.
1285
01:09:59.255 --> 01:10:00.355
You could make it better.
1286
01:10:01.216 --> 01:10:05.758
But in my service area, how many households have over, let's just call $100,000 household income.
1287
01:10:05.998 --> 01:10:14.462
You'll see here in the response chat to VT gave me is it broke down how many households in my county have above certain household income.
1288
01:10:14.502 --> 01:10:14.622
So
1289
01:10:15.533 --> 01:10:19.557
First off, okay, above 100,000, that's like immediately only 40% of my market.
1290
01:10:19.897 --> 01:10:24.080
So that's like, okay, that's probably who I'm trying to probably target in terms of has discretionary income.
1291
01:10:24.581 --> 01:10:29.685
So like, for example, in Whatcom County, you can say customer served last year was, let's just call it 1,000.
1292
01:10:30.186 --> 01:10:32.107
And there's 36,000 potential customers.
1293
01:10:32.628 --> 01:10:35.791
That's like 3% of the total market share.
1294
01:10:36.531 --> 01:10:41.395
And I think the vast majority of us, because we're in our businesses all day long, just completely overblow.
1295
01:10:42.276 --> 01:10:43.777
how much of the market we actually have.
1296
01:10:44.798 --> 01:10:48.600
And so I think this is a good exercise to determine what is actually your market share.
1297
01:10:49.401 --> 01:10:56.645
And I think it's much more a matter of like, adding another service or expansion because of a small market.
1298
01:10:57.466 --> 01:11:02.029
I think running this exercise is very useful to really question, are you actually boiling the puddle?
1299
01:11:02.549 --> 01:11:03.590
I use this terminology all the time.
1300
01:11:03.610 --> 01:11:07.012
It's like, I like small markets because I can boil the puddle instead of trying to boil the ocean.
1301
01:11:07.532 --> 01:11:14.998
And so, but still, even in a smaller market, the ability to know, okay, I only have three, four, 5% of my market.
1302
01:11:15.359 --> 01:11:24.446
I'm much more looking at my customer acquisition costs to determine whether or not I've actually exploited and fully mined or stripped out everyone inside that TAM that I can.
1303
01:11:25.627 --> 01:11:26.968
And so is my TAM rising?
1304
01:11:26.988 --> 01:11:32.753
That's like, that is more of the thing I'm looking at as an indicator because market percentage is just...
1305
01:11:34.097 --> 01:11:37.942
I don't see that as a viable way to say, oh, I have 10% of the market.
1306
01:11:38.043 --> 01:11:39.104
I tried to determine this before.
1307
01:11:39.124 --> 01:11:42.228
I'm like, okay, is there a threshold where I see CAC start going up?
1308
01:11:42.549 --> 01:11:43.050
And I don't.
1309
01:11:43.170 --> 01:11:48.617
Like, I've seen multiple locations where they have 5% and their CAC starts going up, and I don't know why.
1310
01:11:48.637 --> 01:11:49.699
I don't know if it's because...
1311
01:11:51.012 --> 01:11:53.054
I tried to put a bunch of math to it, but I couldn't.
1312
01:11:53.134 --> 01:11:56.357
And then I see other where they have 15, 20% in a very small market.
1313
01:11:56.657 --> 01:11:59.379
And their CAC is still just the same as it's always been.
1314
01:11:59.860 --> 01:12:03.843
And so I would much more rack looking at, is your CAC below your target?
1315
01:12:04.383 --> 01:12:11.469
If not, you just keep deploying cash towards it, optimizing that before you start thinking about needing to go to a new market, new service, et cetera.
1316
01:12:11.830 --> 01:12:14.512
Yes, this has always been my same conclusion as well.
1317
01:12:17.134 --> 01:12:18.635
I've looked at our city turf data.
1318
01:12:18.675 --> 01:12:19.136
We don't...
1319
01:12:20.560 --> 01:12:23.662
I didn't use 8i to do it because I didn't know how accurate it'd be.
1320
01:12:23.703 --> 01:12:28.386
So we literally got, we have every home in our market.
1321
01:12:29.427 --> 01:12:40.656
And so if I look at all the homes in the market compared to how many clients we have in that area, our biggest city, we have 13% of all the homes in the market.
1322
01:12:41.336 --> 01:12:42.597
And then we have a lot of 5% or 6%.
1323
01:12:44.915 --> 01:12:48.416
And I'm not convinced that the 13% means anything.
1324
01:12:48.876 --> 01:12:54.437
I mean, other than the reason why I think we have 13% in that market is because it's closer to our office.
1325
01:12:54.877 --> 01:13:02.959
And so we have all these rolling billboards, essentially our trucks, passing by these neighborhoods, this city all the time.
1326
01:13:03.539 --> 01:13:09.780
And the two biggest cities by house count that we have, one's a smaller city, one's a bigger city.
1327
01:13:10.200 --> 01:13:12.041
They're both the closest to our office.
1328
01:13:12.882 --> 01:13:14.624
And I think that's very, very telling.
1329
01:13:15.684 --> 01:13:23.491
And I, again, I'm not the, I've always believed working with other people, CAC, just as you said, Mike, is the way you figured this out.
1330
01:13:24.072 --> 01:13:28.595
It's not how I can figure it out in my business because we haven't been spending any money on marketing in this business.
1331
01:13:28.615 --> 01:13:30.497
That's why I've gotten back involved.
1332
01:13:30.937 --> 01:13:35.902
And so eventually I'll start to be able to see these types of numbers and understand what we're spending by market.
1333
01:13:36.342 --> 01:13:38.304
I have no idea how else you would figure this out.
1334
01:13:38.364 --> 01:13:40.706
I think that the percentages are meaningless to your point.
1335
01:13:41.416 --> 01:13:44.318
But they're just interesting to know, but they don't tell me anything.
1336
01:13:44.998 --> 01:13:58.725
Yeah, even as we go into like further out from your market, but like we're actually doing different LSA accounts, different Google accounts, et cetera, just to be able to have the granular detail of like, OK, so this very small area has 15,000 people.
1337
01:13:59.166 --> 01:14:09.771
I might be able to boil that pretty quickly, but is my CAC actually going to be higher or do I just keep deploying energy towards there compared to a location or another territory that has 150,000 people?
1338
01:14:10.912 --> 01:14:24.019
And so it's been really interesting because even when we were trying to figure out Augusta Leads, it's like we've got to separate all the accounts because I want like super granular detail, even on LSA of what my CAC actually is for each market.
1339
01:14:25.040 --> 01:14:27.261
And separating the accounts gives us the most granular detail.
1340
01:14:27.401 --> 01:14:31.483
Are you going to run a Google, a different Google business profile for each one as well?
1341
01:14:31.784 --> 01:14:31.944
Yeah.
1342
01:14:32.764 --> 01:14:33.224
Interesting.
1343
01:14:34.045 --> 01:14:38.988
Are you going to use one location and one physical address or two?
1344
01:14:39.008 --> 01:14:39.088
Two.
1345
01:14:39.408 --> 01:14:39.608
Two.
1346
01:14:40.850 --> 01:14:41.030
Yeah.
1347
01:14:41.350 --> 01:14:42.871
It just makes such a big impact on Google.
1348
01:14:43.652 --> 01:14:44.212
Yep.
1349
01:14:44.292 --> 01:14:54.458
And even when, if someone's searching in the area versus searching outside the area, if you have an address inside, like we are already on the top and we didn't even, we haven't verified that address yet.
1350
01:14:54.478 --> 01:14:55.679
We're just at service area.
1351
01:14:56.140 --> 01:14:57.620
To verify the address, you have to be in person.
1352
01:14:58.081 --> 01:15:00.202
And so I won't get the addresses done until I'm there.
1353
01:15:00.722 --> 01:15:00.862
Yeah.
1354
01:15:00.882 --> 01:15:07.667
So one of my to-dos is to set up another office over on the opposite side of our market,
1355
01:15:08.450 --> 01:15:17.833
And then the other challenge I have is like, oh man, if there's any service in our business that should be separated out, it's pest control, which brings up a whole different...
1356
01:15:17.853 --> 01:15:26.376
So there's both geography and then there's this service that frankly doesn't really fit as nicely with the other services from a branding.
1357
01:15:26.436 --> 01:15:27.776
We have the same thing that got the lights.
1358
01:15:28.476 --> 01:15:29.877
So some of our owners will do too.
1359
01:15:30.921 --> 01:15:32.502
Yeah, this is good.
1360
01:15:32.762 --> 01:15:43.251
So years ago, I think we lost 1,000 or 1,200 reviews years ago because I used to have multiple locations.
1361
01:15:43.591 --> 01:15:45.913
Oh, so people would do two or three?
1362
01:15:46.253 --> 01:15:53.617
Well, what we were doing is we were paying people to use their addresses or giving them free lawn care and doing things like that.
1363
01:15:54.018 --> 01:15:57.580
And then Google went through and shut down like five of our accounts at the same time.
1364
01:15:57.820 --> 01:15:58.180
Brutal.
1365
01:15:58.220 --> 01:15:59.641
Yeah, we lost all of it.
1366
01:15:59.661 --> 01:16:00.822
It was pretty significant.
1367
01:16:01.342 --> 01:16:01.902
It was painful.
1368
01:16:03.263 --> 01:16:03.623
Yeah.
1369
01:16:03.743 --> 01:16:05.625
I've always felt it really hurt our lead flow.
1370
01:16:05.665 --> 01:16:07.125
I mean, our lead flow held up really well.
1371
01:16:07.606 --> 01:16:10.948
We always had too many leads to what we could even close because...
1372
01:16:12.088 --> 01:16:13.049
I mean, we just, we did.
1373
01:16:13.109 --> 01:16:17.772
And we really changed our lead flow when we combined mowing with fertilization weed control.
1374
01:16:18.432 --> 01:16:23.036
It really changed how many, how many our conversions and frankly started to change our leads.
1375
01:16:23.116 --> 01:16:26.918
As our prices on mowing started to move up, we saw our leads start to come down.
1376
01:16:26.938 --> 01:16:27.939
You could directly see it.
1377
01:16:28.379 --> 01:16:33.643
And so we, there was a couple of things going on, but losing all those separate addresses was a kick in the butt.
1378
01:16:34.604 --> 01:16:35.825
Our face, it hurt.
1379
01:16:36.325 --> 01:16:37.286
So interesting.
1380
01:16:37.346 --> 01:16:37.566
Okay.
1381
01:16:37.906 --> 01:16:39.167
There is a legit way to do it.
1382
01:16:39.207 --> 01:16:40.388
There is a legit way to do it.
1383
01:16:40.728 --> 01:16:43.130
Yeah, I know that's not the legit way to do it anymore.
1384
01:16:43.150 --> 01:16:49.055
And I know I, yeah, I've talked to some other people about this in terms of the legit way, but I'd love to chat with you about that at some point.
1385
01:16:49.155 --> 01:16:50.176
Make sure I'm thinking about it right.
1386
01:16:51.357 --> 01:16:53.458
Cause I want to spin up a account.
1387
01:16:53.858 --> 01:16:54.538
Let's go.
1388
01:16:55.159 --> 01:16:57.079
Let's go get those rolling billboards.
1389
01:16:57.119 --> 01:16:58.980
Just going to get ready.
1390
01:16:59.380 --> 01:17:00.040
So, all right.
1391
01:17:00.781 --> 01:17:01.681
Just park a trailer.
1392
01:17:01.861 --> 01:17:09.984
I would say we have, you could park your trailer right outside and just have like, so this happened one time in our market, like here in Washington, a new competitor came into town.
1393
01:17:10.164 --> 01:17:11.444
They, the private equity got involved.
1394
01:17:11.464 --> 01:17:14.145
They bought someone else out merged and started a big company.
1395
01:17:14.666 --> 01:17:18.167
So then they, they kind of number two in the market, got a semi truck, uh,
1396
01:17:18.747 --> 01:17:31.877
with a semi-trailer, parked it on the other side of the road where their office was, and rented that land, parked their trailer, and all it said on there was now hiring their hourly rates.
1397
01:17:31.957 --> 01:17:33.838
It was just right when they drove out.
1398
01:17:33.858 --> 01:17:34.719
It was crazy.
1399
01:17:37.781 --> 01:17:44.925
There was a friend of mine that had, I think it was his competitor, or he did it, or his competitor did it, put up a billboard at their location.
1400
01:17:44.965 --> 01:17:46.146
That's so funny.
1401
01:17:47.287 --> 01:17:47.827
Oh, man.
1402
01:17:48.267 --> 01:17:49.768
Again, that's how you start a war.
1403
01:17:49.788 --> 01:17:53.270
So it gets expensive.
1404
01:17:53.350 --> 01:17:53.991
That's funny.
1405
01:17:54.111 --> 01:17:55.091
All right.
1406
01:17:55.111 --> 01:17:56.292
I think we've, anything else?
1407
01:17:56.332 --> 01:17:57.373
I think we both agree.
1408
01:17:57.413 --> 01:17:57.693
CAC.
1409
01:17:57.913 --> 01:18:03.076
I just don't know how else to do it when we're talking about determining if you can keep going deeper into a market.
1410
01:18:03.437 --> 01:18:05.818
Yeah, some people will look at close rate, but...
1411
01:18:07.531 --> 01:18:12.772
Like I'd say like your triple cross is you have your CAC is rising.
1412
01:18:13.432 --> 01:18:21.354
Your close rate is dropping and like your ops are stable enough to where you could do it without any disruption.
1413
01:18:21.774 --> 01:18:25.695
That would be like the time where I'm like, okay, let's move to a new market or let's add new services.
1414
01:18:26.315 --> 01:18:26.555
Yeah.
1415
01:18:26.595 --> 01:18:31.016
If you're, if your conversions are dropping, that obviously is going to drive up CAC.
1416
01:18:31.096 --> 01:18:33.096
So you can, yeah.
1417
01:18:33.897 --> 01:18:34.057
Yeah.
1418
01:18:34.177 --> 01:18:35.037
I don't know of a better number.
1419
01:18:35.057 --> 01:18:35.437
Okay.
1420
01:18:35.457 --> 01:18:35.637
Okay.
1421
01:18:36.867 --> 01:18:37.127
All right.
1422
01:18:37.367 --> 01:18:46.209
The next one I wanted to talk about was, do you think going deep in a market, like market share, going deep into the market is even the right goal?
1423
01:18:46.769 --> 01:18:48.549
So there's a couple of ways you could play it.
1424
01:18:49.089 --> 01:18:54.911
And I know that in your business, because you're franchising, you're covering lots of markets.
1425
01:18:54.931 --> 01:18:59.872
So I think we kind of need to ignore franchising and just look at it in a different sense.
1426
01:19:07.173 --> 01:19:13.659
Would you prefer to have one location go really deep or two locations and go deep in the market?
1427
01:19:13.719 --> 01:19:22.066
Or do you think the faster way to grow the business is to spit up a number of locations and sort of skim all the easy to get clients off the top of the market?
1428
01:19:22.226 --> 01:19:24.448
Because I do think there's an element where...
1429
01:19:25.368 --> 01:19:26.649
I could actually argue both ways.
1430
01:19:26.669 --> 01:19:31.233
I was going to say, I do think there's this element where it's easy to skim some number of clients off.
1431
01:19:31.253 --> 01:19:34.296
They just want a different solution than everybody else is buying.
1432
01:19:34.616 --> 01:19:35.577
They don't want the...
1433
01:19:36.526 --> 01:19:38.167
the same company everybody else has.
1434
01:19:38.507 --> 01:19:39.488
So how do you think about that?
1435
01:19:39.548 --> 01:19:41.510
Is going deep in the market even the right goal?
1436
01:19:41.770 --> 01:19:43.211
Because that's what we were just talking about.
1437
01:19:44.211 --> 01:19:59.002
I think in general, I'm a big fan of trying to take your existing customers and make more from them, whether it be adding, like when I say, when we talk about going deep, I see this as add more services, continue to really focus on lifetime value, going deep that way.
1438
01:20:00.721 --> 01:20:06.666
And spending more and more money in that market versus taking some of the budget and adding another zip code and another zip code.
1439
01:20:06.686 --> 01:20:08.407
So you could look, that's how I think about it.
1440
01:20:08.487 --> 01:20:12.410
Yeah, I think of it like, it still just goes back to CAC.
1441
01:20:12.471 --> 01:20:14.932
Like, the cream rise at the top.
1442
01:20:14.952 --> 01:20:23.179
Like, if you're just going to take the cream, that is only going to usually work if you dominate online to where you just have to put your site up and you start getting passive leads.
1443
01:20:24.000 --> 01:20:25.100
And because...
1444
01:20:25.901 --> 01:20:30.625
If I'm going to start running ads, unless my CAC goes down, I'm just going to keep putting more money in that market.
1445
01:20:30.645 --> 01:20:32.086
There's no reason to move on.
1446
01:20:32.546 --> 01:20:34.328
And so I think the last question answers this one.
1447
01:20:34.348 --> 01:20:50.661
It's like, I go deep until my CAC is going up to the point where the disruption that comes with operations and the dilution of my marketing efforts and my management efforts, when that is equal to the weight of my increasing CAC, that's the only time I would move along.
1448
01:20:51.746 --> 01:21:03.072
And like, cause when you do, whether it be multiple locations, whether it be adding more services, you are diluting your marketing and you're diluting your management focus, like whether it be managers or yourself.
1449
01:21:03.913 --> 01:21:06.214
And that comes at a cost.
1450
01:21:06.534 --> 01:21:13.418
And I'm only going to do that if me getting more customers costs so much more to continue just doing the same thing over and over again.
1451
01:21:14.950 --> 01:21:18.675
I would say in general, we should focus on one, like the vast majority of us.
1452
01:21:19.035 --> 01:21:23.421
But it's easy to, to your point, like I never had really thought about it until I actually saw your question.
1453
01:21:23.461 --> 01:21:29.208
It's like, you can jump into a market and almost immediately get to like, you know, 100, 200 customers, just like, just by putting a site up
1454
01:21:29.608 --> 01:21:30.609
having a decent looking truck.
1455
01:21:30.989 --> 01:21:31.969
Like it's not difficult.
1456
01:21:32.129 --> 01:21:38.913
It's that, okay, from 100 to 500, from 500 to 1,000, that's when you start to feel a little bit of like friction.
1457
01:21:38.933 --> 01:21:46.396
And what I think some people will watch this video and they will interpret that slight amount of friction that usually is actually operational with like, oh, I need to go to a new market.
1458
01:21:46.416 --> 01:21:46.996
It's like, no, no, no.
1459
01:21:47.097 --> 01:21:47.317
Right.
1460
01:21:47.337 --> 01:21:49.037
You're having operational stress.
1461
01:21:49.798 --> 01:21:51.799
It has nothing to do with your customer acquisition cost.
1462
01:21:52.707 --> 01:22:01.307
And so this is where, again, knowing your numbers is the actual unlock here to know, am I actually, what is the cost of me going deeper versus going to a different market?
1463
01:22:02.148 --> 01:22:02.348
Yeah.
1464
01:22:03.088 --> 01:22:03.789
Yeah, I agree.
1465
01:22:04.049 --> 01:22:11.952
I was wondering if you'd have any different perspective on this because of the franchising experience and you've spread out, like working with other people you've spread out.
1466
01:22:11.992 --> 01:22:13.512
But I agree.
1467
01:22:13.552 --> 01:22:17.154
I think the density sort of builds a moat in a market to a degree.
1468
01:22:17.194 --> 01:22:18.774
And I actually...
1469
01:22:19.015 --> 01:22:23.876
There's this one argument where, okay, CAC could start to go up as you go deeper in a market.
1470
01:22:23.916 --> 01:22:30.099
But there's this counter argument that says, if I go really deep inside a market and I have trucks everywhere, I have...
1471
01:22:30.679 --> 01:22:31.659
Maybe yard signs.
1472
01:22:31.719 --> 01:22:33.020
I'm just seen everywhere.
1473
01:22:33.520 --> 01:22:36.240
All my marketing spend is concentrated on this group of people.
1474
01:22:36.400 --> 01:22:38.641
It actually brings down my cack because it works better.
1475
01:22:39.141 --> 01:22:41.561
All that marketing is supporting all the other marketing.
1476
01:22:42.121 --> 01:22:43.042
And it makes it work better.
1477
01:22:43.062 --> 01:22:48.343
It's kind of back to the old saying that they need to see you seven times before they trust you.
1478
01:22:49.443 --> 01:22:54.224
Or there was a similar argument that you could enter a new market.
1479
01:22:54.624 --> 01:22:58.005
And if somebody has seen you seven times, they think you've been in the market forever.
1480
01:22:58.025 --> 01:22:58.625
Right?
1481
01:22:58.765 --> 01:23:03.109
They, so how fast can you get in front of them over and over and over again?
1482
01:23:03.390 --> 01:23:12.319
And that's an example of concentrating all your money, all your spend, all your visibility in one very tight area actually brings down CAC.
1483
01:23:13.069 --> 01:23:13.389
Yeah.
1484
01:23:13.509 --> 01:23:15.851
And I'm a big fan of boiling the puddle.
1485
01:23:15.891 --> 01:23:19.193
So even when we have like our five mile radiuses, we usually go after a one mile radius.
1486
01:23:19.533 --> 01:23:22.515
I don't even look at like expansion as like another territory.
1487
01:23:22.535 --> 01:23:27.658
I think of like inside of my five mile radius, I still am going after 2000 houses to start.
1488
01:23:27.678 --> 01:23:27.858
Yeah.
1489
01:23:28.318 --> 01:23:29.839
And I'm going to boil that.
1490
01:23:29.899 --> 01:23:31.880
And before I expand even outside of that.
1491
01:23:33.501 --> 01:23:36.123
But I think people underestimate the cost.
1492
01:23:37.144 --> 01:23:45.030
of diluting your management talent, diluting your route density, diluting your marketing focus, especially when we're talking under a million dollars.
1493
01:23:45.851 --> 01:23:46.051
Yeah.
1494
01:23:46.831 --> 01:23:52.075
Yeah, when I was in my 20s, I did that cleaning business and with several other guys.
1495
01:23:52.896 --> 01:24:00.001
And we were cleaning theaters around the country and cleaning wall carpet and carpet and movie theaters and seats.
1496
01:24:00.061 --> 01:24:01.182
So we're 22 states and,
1497
01:24:03.063 --> 01:24:09.047
And one of the big lessons I learned inside that business was we were based out of Texas.
1498
01:24:09.708 --> 01:24:13.631
And Texas was our best market because that's where all the owners were.
1499
01:24:14.491 --> 01:24:16.673
And so those clients got the most attention.
1500
01:24:16.693 --> 01:24:18.094
That's where our core management was.
1501
01:24:18.134 --> 01:24:19.174
It's where our office was.
1502
01:24:19.595 --> 01:24:23.157
It wasn't that we neglected the other clients, but there was a difference.
1503
01:24:23.177 --> 01:24:26.820
For example, if you just had one theater in Montana...
1504
01:24:27.440 --> 01:24:30.122
It didn't get visited very much by a manager.
1505
01:24:30.142 --> 01:24:31.583
It just had some people cleaning there.
1506
01:24:31.843 --> 01:24:40.510
But if you're in Florida, where we had bazillions of theaters, then you had a region leader, a district manager, you had dedicated people there, that market was better.
1507
01:24:40.550 --> 01:24:42.892
So I always think about this too, as you spread out.
1508
01:24:43.472 --> 01:24:50.016
It's like if you're the owner, you've got to go drive four miles to see Susie or you've got to drive 38 miles to see Bob.
1509
01:24:50.396 --> 01:24:54.278
Bob's going to not be quite as happy probably in the long term with your company as Susie.
1510
01:24:54.739 --> 01:25:01.803
And there's these little things like that that just slowly harm your company, your reputation, how well your marketing works as you spread the thing out.
1511
01:25:02.303 --> 01:25:12.709
And in this case, too, it might be worth having a higher CAC to be able to have better route density because now your efficiency is 20% higher just by having better route density.
1512
01:25:13.365 --> 01:25:13.565
Yep.
1513
01:25:13.885 --> 01:25:14.006
Yep.
1514
01:25:14.026 --> 01:25:14.506
I would agree.
1515
01:25:15.987 --> 01:25:31.201
So continuing on with this idea of potentially adding and growing, if we think about an expansion, whenever you, and we've kind of talked about this, but when you hit a wall and you, your CAC is rising, you've hit a wall,
1516
01:25:32.582 --> 01:25:40.775
And let's just assume you did the proper analysis to understand, is this really, I just can't get more clients at a reasonable amount of money in my market.
1517
01:25:41.456 --> 01:25:44.581
And so you've decided I need to add new markets
1518
01:25:45.943 --> 01:25:49.464
Or when you hit the wall, I guess the better question is, do you add new markets?
1519
01:25:49.604 --> 01:25:52.246
Do you first add new services or do you do something else?
1520
01:25:52.266 --> 01:25:53.346
Because those are...
1521
01:25:53.726 --> 01:25:55.407
I don't know if the something else exactly would be.
1522
01:25:55.427 --> 01:25:57.027
That's kind of a little bit of a question for you.
1523
01:25:57.047 --> 01:26:00.809
But the first thing I think of is probably add a new service.
1524
01:26:01.329 --> 01:26:01.809
Depends.
1525
01:26:02.089 --> 01:26:03.510
Maybe then add a new market.
1526
01:26:03.830 --> 01:26:06.351
Or is there something else that you would think of doing?
1527
01:26:07.412 --> 01:26:08.212
Yeah, I'm...
1528
01:26:09.750 --> 01:26:12.971
I see all the pros and cons of multi-location because obviously we do that.
1529
01:26:13.571 --> 01:26:16.172
I think that multi-location demands simple systems.
1530
01:26:16.452 --> 01:26:21.993
So whether you look at like Raising Cane's, In-N-Out, Chick-fil-A, they have a very, very simple menu.
1531
01:26:22.913 --> 01:26:25.854
And that's why they can aggressively grow into new markets.
1532
01:26:25.974 --> 01:26:35.456
And so to think that like the new market's gonna solve all of your problems, but you have 12 services, you're involved in operations all of the time, you can't step away for a few days without things falling through the cracks.
1533
01:26:35.717 --> 01:26:37.237
Like it's going to be chaos.
1534
01:26:37.757 --> 01:26:39.260
You're just going to dilute your attention.
1535
01:26:39.280 --> 01:26:49.040
You're going to dilute the amount of high-level management directed towards the first location, and your second location is not going to do so great because you're going to be stressed out by the first one doing less good.
1536
01:26:50.669 --> 01:26:58.335
And so if you look at those examples, even from restaurants perspective, there's by having a large menu, you have a lot of food waste.
1537
01:26:58.755 --> 01:27:00.096
There's more training the employees.
1538
01:27:00.576 --> 01:27:02.818
You make more mistakes on the different menu items.
1539
01:27:03.058 --> 01:27:10.604
There's more logistics for the kitchen, like how long things have to be in the freezer, all the rest of it, more storage, have larger restaurant footprint.
1540
01:27:10.944 --> 01:27:13.726
All of these complications are just a downstream of large menu.
1541
01:27:13.746 --> 01:27:13.927
Yeah.
1542
01:27:14.587 --> 01:27:23.073
And so I think this goes all the way back to what we talked about earlier in terms of adding services is like your menu in home services is what services you offer.
1543
01:27:23.454 --> 01:27:27.897
And if that's a long menu, it's going to be very difficult to do multi-location.
1544
01:27:28.457 --> 01:27:29.138
Very difficult.
1545
01:27:29.338 --> 01:27:30.199
It's just so hard.
1546
01:27:30.799 --> 01:27:37.704
This has opened my eyes even so much more even now with thinking about, okay, this location starting out on the other side of the country, that I'm not going to be able to be there half the year.
1547
01:27:38.104 --> 01:27:39.866
Like you think about it completely different.
1548
01:27:40.346 --> 01:27:50.177
And so if someone's genuinely thinking about a new market, we have to first address the menu and nail that before we think about, let's do another one 30 minutes away.
1549
01:27:50.217 --> 01:27:55.122
I think as soon as you go above 30 minutes to an hour away, like you have to have these things.
1550
01:27:55.263 --> 01:27:56.964
If you're like, if we're talking 15 minutes away,
1551
01:27:57.835 --> 01:28:02.501
Okay, you can probably juggle a little bit, but that's kind of what I've seen.
1552
01:28:02.521 --> 01:28:08.209
And a lot of times when I look at sales, operations, and admin in a business, we want someone to run the first location.
1553
01:28:08.910 --> 01:28:10.732
And usually that's a really good operations person.
1554
01:28:10.752 --> 01:28:14.397
Someone who knows how to get the work done, take care of their crew, train them up.
1555
01:28:15.158 --> 01:28:18.081
But then we also are like, oh yeah, by the way, I need you to meet the customers.
1556
01:28:18.641 --> 01:28:20.103
I need to understand all about projects.
1557
01:28:20.283 --> 01:28:21.464
I need you to sell the job.
1558
01:28:21.804 --> 01:28:22.745
I need you to run payroll.
1559
01:28:22.805 --> 01:28:23.886
I need you to check the email.
1560
01:28:24.306 --> 01:28:27.709
Doing all these sales and admin tasks, nothing to do with operations.
1561
01:28:28.070 --> 01:28:29.831
And then we're setting it up for failure.
1562
01:28:30.812 --> 01:28:33.234
And, you know, by the way, I need you to answer the phone when it rings.
1563
01:28:33.514 --> 01:28:47.326
And so it's very difficult to actually think that scaling a new location or a new market is going to be effective if we have not simplified things down to the point where your key person takes care of operations, which is the work itself and the people that do the work.
1564
01:28:47.806 --> 01:28:50.829
And that's what I've seen work is like that model perfected.
1565
01:28:51.149 --> 01:28:54.732
And as soon as we start complicating it, it's miserable failure.
1566
01:28:56.121 --> 01:28:56.882
Makes tons of sense.
1567
01:28:57.542 --> 01:29:09.871
I don't know what Philip would say to this, but I've thought before if we were to spin up, and it's not something we're going to do anytime I could even possibly imagine, but if we were to go hypothetically where you're starting up,
1568
01:29:10.560 --> 01:29:17.003
I would probably just start fertilization weed control in that market or just start pest control, probably fertilization weed control, frankly.
1569
01:29:17.364 --> 01:29:20.025
And then I'd add pest control next or something like that.
1570
01:29:20.625 --> 01:29:24.107
Because if you try to take all the service offering there, what a mess.
1571
01:29:24.828 --> 01:29:38.595
I just, that would be almost, that would be so complex to scale and have that many people with that much expertise getting the business to a place where it can support enough, bring in enough revenue to support that level of expertise.
1572
01:29:39.115 --> 01:29:40.216
It would be really tough.
1573
01:29:40.746 --> 01:29:47.251
And it's very different to like, even in Dallas, when I think about our next location, it's like, oh, it's 15, 20 minutes away.
1574
01:29:47.672 --> 01:29:55.558
It's very different when someone that's listening is like they're middle of wherever and the next territory that they're moving into is an hour and a half or two hours away.
1575
01:29:55.858 --> 01:30:04.025
That's a completely different next location compared to, okay, I'm going to drive down that highway and 15 minutes down the street is just a different city.
1576
01:30:05.568 --> 01:30:06.008
very different.
1577
01:30:06.148 --> 01:30:09.591
And I think that's what a number of people in small markets are facing.
1578
01:30:09.611 --> 01:30:10.611
They can't go 30 minutes.
1579
01:30:10.631 --> 01:30:12.152
They need to go the hour, hour and a half.
1580
01:30:13.293 --> 01:30:15.135
And so how do they start that business?
1581
01:30:15.335 --> 01:30:18.497
And that's like the only time I'd say maybe we add some more services.
1582
01:30:18.657 --> 01:30:19.858
We go deeper with the customer.
1583
01:30:19.878 --> 01:30:28.865
We try to upsell our distinct customer base because that level for some people is honestly, it's the level of leadership that most people don't have.
1584
01:30:29.305 --> 01:30:39.251
the ability to lead from two hours away, an hour and a half away, have management in place that is solid, have the systems in place that they can actually duplicate and be effective at.
1585
01:30:39.971 --> 01:30:41.152
It's a tall task.
1586
01:30:42.232 --> 01:30:47.175
Have you ever heard some kind of a number that, well, I'll ask the question and I'll give a little more detail.
1587
01:30:47.455 --> 01:30:51.938
Have you ever heard some kind of number that says a market with 50,000 homeowners can support
1588
01:30:53.307 --> 01:30:59.132
X size, 10, $1 million businesses, or have you, anything of that sort?
1589
01:30:59.152 --> 01:31:01.375
Have you ever heard any rules of thumb or theories?
1590
01:31:01.795 --> 01:31:04.778
I could make some up, but I've never heard any that are like really solid.
1591
01:31:04.818 --> 01:31:05.278
I haven't either.
1592
01:31:05.398 --> 01:31:08.841
It's so dependent on like your pricing, service mix, the whole nine.
1593
01:31:10.043 --> 01:31:13.586
Income in the market, like the household income, there's so many variables.
1594
01:31:13.606 --> 01:31:13.726
Yeah.
1595
01:31:13.946 --> 01:31:14.767
I've not heard anything.
1596
01:31:14.787 --> 01:31:15.808
That's just curious if you had.
1597
01:31:16.093 --> 01:31:32.897
Yeah, there was one thing kind of in relation to several things we talked about today that I remember Alex said one time, and it threw some of our owners through a loop I felt like, because he was talking about how sometimes you take on the client that wants everything to cover basically your op cost.
1598
01:31:33.277 --> 01:31:34.997
For example, the cost of your general manager.
1599
01:31:35.317 --> 01:31:44.020
Okay, I'm going to have two customers that they spend three grand, four grand a month, but I'm going to extend my services for them and everything else will be simplified.
1600
01:31:44.500 --> 01:31:45.480
I think that's a slippery slope.
1601
01:31:46.200 --> 01:32:00.660
Because as soon as I start saying, okay, I'm going to do premium for a few people, because his point was he did personal training for one client five days a week, personal training one-on-one, it was $5,000 a month that paid for his living expenses, and then everything else was gravy.
1602
01:32:00.680 --> 01:32:00.941
Okay.
1603
01:32:01.579 --> 01:32:08.844
And I feel like sometimes people hear that, but they don't understand that adding services in your home service means new equipment.
1604
01:32:09.445 --> 01:32:11.807
It means new services and it ties you directly to the business.
1605
01:32:11.827 --> 01:32:13.468
Like you're not going to be able to scale that.
1606
01:32:13.768 --> 01:32:17.791
And if you do try to scale, which is the slippery slope, because now all of a sudden, what if you get a third one?
1607
01:32:17.911 --> 01:32:18.832
What if you get a fourth one?
1608
01:32:19.212 --> 01:32:23.495
Okay, let's just start a new division that just does very high end residential.
1609
01:32:23.935 --> 01:32:25.396
It's a totally different business.
1610
01:32:26.057 --> 01:32:27.258
So it's a slippery slope.
1611
01:32:28.098 --> 01:32:35.661
Yeah, if I'm hearing what he was saying correctly, he's making more money delivering more of the same service.
1612
01:32:35.922 --> 01:32:36.742
Is that what you were saying?
1613
01:32:36.762 --> 01:32:38.363
More individualized.
1614
01:32:38.423 --> 01:32:41.544
More frequent personal training for longer or something like that.
1615
01:32:41.584 --> 01:32:42.865
So that's how he's driving more revenue.
1616
01:32:43.105 --> 01:32:44.325
Maybe he's selling them supplements.
1617
01:32:44.345 --> 01:32:47.107
That doesn't complicate the business that much because I know he did a lot of that.
1618
01:32:47.647 --> 01:32:49.368
But in our world's...
1619
01:32:50.228 --> 01:32:54.650
we're doing mowing and pass or mowing and fur and irrigation and bush trimming.
1620
01:32:54.710 --> 01:32:56.992
And is that what you're kind of alluding to here?
1621
01:32:57.212 --> 01:32:57.352
Yeah.
1622
01:32:57.372 --> 01:33:00.713
Like he, he, his thing was like, it's not the same comparison.
1623
01:33:00.753 --> 01:33:00.874
Yeah.
1624
01:33:00.894 --> 01:33:07.357
Like I would say he was doing more individualized service by going one on one for a very premium customer.
1625
01:33:07.377 --> 01:33:08.838
It was willing to pay five times more.
1626
01:33:09.818 --> 01:33:16.286
I think, though, that when we serve that customer in home services, we have to change the business, like the equipment, the type of work that's being done.
1627
01:33:16.806 --> 01:33:20.010
And you are inextricably tied to that customer forever.
1628
01:33:20.330 --> 01:33:21.051
And so we're not.
1629
01:33:21.131 --> 01:33:23.334
It's a short term gap measure to cover expenses.
1630
01:33:23.874 --> 01:33:29.601
But many times is either a slippery slope to adding more services or locks you into daily operations and doing the work.
1631
01:33:30.283 --> 01:33:30.543
Yeah.
1632
01:33:30.923 --> 01:33:50.593
So the equivalent analogy in what we would be doing, like let's say you're using a mowing example, you could mow 20 quarter lot homes, or you could go win a campus of a corporate location that's massive that'll take you three days of mowing, and that equals 60 small properties.
1633
01:33:50.633 --> 01:33:55.776
That would be more the equivalent to what he was talking about if you didn't want to spread out your services.
1634
01:33:56.136 --> 01:33:56.356
Correct.
1635
01:33:56.396 --> 01:33:57.037
That's what I'm hearing.
1636
01:33:57.197 --> 01:33:57.317
Yeah.
1637
01:33:57.337 --> 01:33:57.437
Yeah.
1638
01:33:58.191 --> 01:34:04.636
Yeah, that's the thing with like, you've got to, people really have to kind of think through this advice that's given out there.
1639
01:34:04.656 --> 01:34:05.277
It's not wrong.
1640
01:34:05.297 --> 01:34:05.997
It's the same with us.
1641
01:34:06.017 --> 01:34:08.439
Like we could be talking about mowing examples right now.
1642
01:34:09.240 --> 01:34:15.845
And in this example, we did talk a lot about green industry type examples, but it may not apply to garage doors.
1643
01:34:16.246 --> 01:34:17.767
It may not apply to HVAC.
1644
01:34:17.787 --> 01:34:21.030
So you've got to kind of, I think it's really good to hear
1645
01:34:22.379 --> 01:34:30.408
in Alex's world, how he'll be talking to different kinds of businesses, or maybe you're not doing the kinds of businesses Mike and I do, but you're hearing what we do.
1646
01:34:30.428 --> 01:34:36.775
It's like, what I'd encourage you to do is when you're listening to Alex, or you're listening to us, or you're listening to somebody else, like what ideas can you swipe?
1647
01:34:37.156 --> 01:34:37.276
Like,
1648
01:34:37.676 --> 01:34:42.742
Or what ideas could you be like, okay, well, it doesn't fully apply, but it kind of applies.
1649
01:34:43.242 --> 01:34:44.644
How could I model that in my business?
1650
01:34:44.664 --> 01:34:56.317
I've always loved that idea that the big breakthroughs really come from looking at other industries and swiping what they're doing in other industries and bringing it into your business or into our industry.
1651
01:34:56.957 --> 01:34:57.258
100%.
1652
01:34:57.578 --> 01:35:00.941
Well, let's wrap it up with non-financial advice.
1653
01:35:01.121 --> 01:35:07.027
Aside from stealing people's employees, offering more money to their general managers, sucking them dry.
1654
01:35:07.047 --> 01:35:08.628
That was going to be my advice.
1655
01:35:08.928 --> 01:35:12.131
I recommend everybody... Run Facebook ads today.
1656
01:35:12.151 --> 01:35:13.853
Yeah, no.
1657
01:35:14.173 --> 01:35:15.074
I do not recommend that.
1658
01:35:15.214 --> 01:35:17.436
That was all a joke.
1659
01:35:17.676 --> 01:35:21.000
Mine would be, so I think last week...
1660
01:35:21.974 --> 01:35:24.395
and I might've got mentioned again this week, it's kind of this joke.
1661
01:35:24.575 --> 01:35:27.597
I did this video with my French bulldog.
1662
01:35:27.617 --> 01:35:28.517
His name's Oliver.
1663
01:35:29.418 --> 01:35:34.020
And the premise, and look it up on 5 for 50 and subscribe if you would as well.
1664
01:35:34.921 --> 01:35:40.464
No, the premise of the video was that when you're selling...
1665
01:35:41.469 --> 01:35:44.131
you're not just selling to the person you're talking on the phone.
1666
01:35:44.151 --> 01:35:48.153
And so I'm going to set this up and I'll give you some advice that I really believe in.
1667
01:35:48.514 --> 01:35:59.661
So normally when we think about selling something to our prospect, if we don't close the deal, we naturally think, okay, well, I need to follow up.
1668
01:35:59.881 --> 01:36:03.864
Most of us don't do enough follow up, but we do intuitively know we need to be following up.
1669
01:36:04.364 --> 01:36:10.168
And in that video, one of the things I was talking about is there's more to it than just following up.
1670
01:36:11.057 --> 01:36:26.950
And so the idea is that if you don't make the sell, then the person that, but they're still considering you, then that person is talking possibly to their spouse who is now they're jointly making the buying decision together, but you only talked to one of the parties.
1671
01:36:27.010 --> 01:36:28.010
You didn't talk to the other.
1672
01:36:28.491 --> 01:36:30.352
And that leaves the other person
1673
01:36:31.353 --> 01:36:41.358
generally, if the spouse isn't doing a good job selling them on why you're better and different than everyone else, they're generally, you're going to find yourself in a situation where it's more of a price discussion.
1674
01:36:41.578 --> 01:36:46.260
And nobody, none of us hopefully want to be the cheapest price solution in the market.
1675
01:36:46.800 --> 01:36:54.364
And so one of the ideas that I put forward in that video, and I would recommend you watch it, because there's more than just this, is that...
1676
01:36:55.104 --> 01:36:57.786
How can you show up in their mailbox?
1677
01:36:57.826 --> 01:37:05.251
This is complicated, but if you don't make the sale today, can you show up in their mailbox tomorrow so you get in front of the other party?
1678
01:37:06.032 --> 01:37:10.955
Or if that's not the idea, what do you have to do so that you get in front of the other person?
1679
01:37:11.996 --> 01:37:14.898
And think about that a little bit because it can move the needle.
1680
01:37:16.605 --> 01:37:17.686
I like it.
1681
01:37:17.766 --> 01:37:19.467
Back to my direct mail.
1682
01:37:20.107 --> 01:37:22.268
My like and dislike of direct mail.
1683
01:37:22.368 --> 01:37:24.929
You could also use Facebook ads to target just men and women.
1684
01:37:26.490 --> 01:37:26.790
Kind of.
1685
01:37:26.970 --> 01:37:28.310
As long as you cast a wide enough net.
1686
01:37:29.091 --> 01:37:29.451
You could.
1687
01:37:30.731 --> 01:37:32.092
I'm pondering that for a second.
1688
01:37:32.172 --> 01:37:37.994
We'll split them so it'll be like, we'll do one for the women and be like tired of nagging your husband to mow the lawn, for example.
1689
01:37:38.194 --> 01:37:41.956
And then we'll swap it and do tired of your wife nagging you to mow the lawn.
1690
01:37:42.116 --> 01:37:43.477
And we'll just target different people.
1691
01:37:45.864 --> 01:37:46.745
Maybe.
1692
01:37:46.765 --> 01:37:48.147
Yeah, I can turn that into a long.
1693
01:37:48.207 --> 01:37:49.869
I've got all these ideas that you said this.
1694
01:37:49.889 --> 01:37:50.069
So.
1695
01:37:50.450 --> 01:37:50.650
All right.
1696
01:37:50.670 --> 01:37:51.111
What do you got?
1697
01:37:51.211 --> 01:37:52.092
What do you got for us today?
1698
01:37:52.172 --> 01:37:54.435
I thought this was more common language, like common knowledge.
1699
01:37:54.455 --> 01:37:54.936
But I shared it.
1700
01:37:55.116 --> 01:37:56.518
And a lot of people were like, oh, this is new.
1701
01:37:56.558 --> 01:37:59.321
So I'll share it here in case it's new for someone else.
1702
01:37:59.942 --> 01:38:01.544
And that is instead of doing a budget.
1703
01:38:02.445 --> 01:38:16.808
especially if the business is doing well, you have a little more profit, and it's not necessarily like pinching pennies, is instead of doing a budget, doing a P&L for your personal expenses and running it through QuickBooks just like you normally would for your business.
1704
01:38:17.468 --> 01:38:22.929
And it's more of a categorization and awareness instead of like, we only have X amount to spend this month.
1705
01:38:23.229 --> 01:38:28.630
It's much more of a general awareness and having your assets and your liabilities and your balance sheet and then your P&L.
1706
01:38:29.710 --> 01:38:31.251
So run your personal life like a business.
1707
01:38:31.271 --> 01:38:32.632
Yeah, yeah.
1708
01:38:32.772 --> 01:38:35.074
Run through QuickBooks like you do for everything else in your life, you know?
1709
01:38:35.894 --> 01:38:36.314
Interesting.
1710
01:38:37.355 --> 01:38:38.516
I don't know that I've heard that either.
1711
01:38:39.256 --> 01:38:39.896
It's useful.
1712
01:38:40.137 --> 01:38:40.997
It's been really good.
1713
01:38:41.177 --> 01:38:42.218
So I assume you do that?
1714
01:38:42.656 --> 01:38:50.220
Yeah, it's more useful when, for us at least, where it's not like, am I going to tell her you can't buy this on the 30th because there's not enough in that specific category?
1715
01:38:50.240 --> 01:38:51.041
I'm not going to do that.
1716
01:38:51.601 --> 01:38:59.085
But I do want us to be generally aware of how much we're spending, what our overall burn rate is, where's our investments going, where the money's going.
1717
01:38:59.466 --> 01:39:10.512
And so it's the same way that P&L kind of gives you that inside a monthly basis, the ability to be able to just not have the constraints of a budget, but then still having the awareness of...
1718
01:39:12.153 --> 01:39:12.974
Where the money's going.
1719
01:39:13.154 --> 01:39:14.395
So you don't do a budget.
1720
01:39:14.875 --> 01:39:15.876
You just look at this.
1721
01:39:16.816 --> 01:39:18.177
Yeah.
1722
01:39:18.217 --> 01:39:18.397
Okay.
1723
01:39:18.517 --> 01:39:21.980
We started off with the budget, like the EveryDollar app from Dave Ramsey.
1724
01:39:22.020 --> 01:39:22.260
Okay.
1725
01:39:22.380 --> 01:39:24.682
But it was more the confines.
1726
01:39:24.862 --> 01:39:25.582
These are artificial.
1727
01:39:25.602 --> 01:39:29.345
It's not like we're going to run out of money if we spend extra on food this month.
1728
01:39:29.365 --> 01:39:32.707
So the awareness has been more useful for us and better conversations.
1729
01:39:33.608 --> 01:39:33.828
Cool.
1730
01:39:33.968 --> 01:39:34.668
That's interesting.
1731
01:39:34.688 --> 01:39:36.890
So that is my financial, non-financial advice.
1732
01:39:37.601 --> 01:39:37.881
All right.
1733
01:39:37.901 --> 01:39:38.462
Fantastic.
1734
01:39:39.142 --> 01:39:39.522
All right.
1735
01:39:39.722 --> 01:39:43.705
Well, thank you everyone for showing up and watching and we will see you next week.
1736
01:39:43.785 --> 01:39:45.646
Everyone needs to go check out the video with the dog.
1737
01:39:45.826 --> 01:39:47.568
We've talked about it like five times.
1738
01:39:47.888 --> 01:39:48.108
Yeah.
1739
01:39:48.268 --> 01:39:50.109
And you also need a comment on it.
1740
01:39:50.169 --> 01:39:51.210
Like get the views up.
1741
01:39:51.250 --> 01:39:52.131
It's a great video.
1742
01:39:52.211 --> 01:39:53.251
I've never brought a dog.
1743
01:39:53.571 --> 01:39:55.573
I don't even have a dog and the dog is my mascot.
1744
01:39:55.833 --> 01:40:01.817
And here a man is committed fully to not only having the mascot on the truck, but also bring into a video and no one likes the video.
1745
01:40:02.907 --> 01:40:03.628
Do a man a solid.
1746
01:40:04.469 --> 01:40:05.030
Yeah, please.
1747
01:40:05.271 --> 01:40:06.212
I'd appreciate it.
1748
01:40:06.292 --> 01:40:07.634
And a few subscribes.
1749
01:40:07.915 --> 01:40:08.255
Let's go.
1750
01:40:08.275 --> 01:40:08.796
See you all.
1751
01:40:08.836 --> 01:40:09.277
All right.
1752
01:40:09.337 --> 01:40:09.677
Thank you.
1753
01:40:09.838 --> 01:40:10.338
Great seeing you.