النص الكامل لحلقة The Shining

actually, about his performance, and I was like, what has this kid been in otherwise? 00:05:44.079 --> 00:05:44.879 He's incredible. 00:05:45.040 --> 00:05:45.360 Yeah. 00:05:45.519 --> 00:05:45.920 Nothing. 00:05:46.160 --> 00:05:47.040 I had the same thought. 00:05:47.279 --> 00:05:48.240 Literally nothing. 00:05:48.560 --> 00:05:50.480 He was probably scarred from this movie. 00:05:50.959 --> 00:05:52.240 The one minute wonder. 00:05:52.639 --> 00:05:54.319 The chops on that kid. 00:05:54.800 --> 00:05:56.079 Probably living off the royalties. 00:05:56.399 --> 00:05:56.879 Yeah, truly. 00:05:57.680 --> 00:05:58.240 He's making money. 00:05:58.480 --> 00:06:01.519 I know I was calculating it and it was like, how old is he now? 00:06:02.079 --> 00:06:04.399 And he's still probably getting money. 00:06:05.040 --> 00:06:05.279 Yeah. 00:06:05.519 --> 00:06:05.920 Anyways. 00:06:06.240 --> 00:06:09.279 Well, Danny Lloyd, any relation? 00:06:09.680 --> 00:06:10.480 Nope. 00:06:12.639 --> 00:06:16.160 Um Although Caroline does the same finger puppet. 00:06:20.160 --> 00:06:20.480 Oh. 00:06:21.759 --> 00:06:23.600 Get your mind out of the gutter. 00:06:25.120 --> 00:06:31.759 Scatman Cruthers, awesome name, plays the role of Halloran, another awesome name. 00:06:32.240 --> 00:06:44.879 He was also in one flew over the cuckoo's nest from 1975, and a lot of other voiceover work, including the Scat Cat and Aristacats from 1970. 00:06:45.040 --> 00:06:48.399 Which, like I have to go back and watch that now. 00:06:48.720 --> 00:06:49.920 Everybody. 00:06:50.240 --> 00:06:50.560 Yeah. 00:06:50.800 --> 00:06:51.519 Everybody. 00:06:51.920 --> 00:06:55.199 Have you seen the new Everybody wants to be a cat? 00:06:55.519 --> 00:06:58.800 Have you seen the video of the Lizzo song with the Aristacat? 00:06:59.199 --> 00:06:59.759 Yeah. 00:07:00.160 --> 00:07:00.800 So cute. 00:07:01.040 --> 00:07:02.319 Is it Lizzo or Lizo? 00:07:02.560 --> 00:07:02.879 Lizzo. 00:07:03.199 --> 00:07:05.120 Lizzo, my god, Lizo. 00:07:07.120 --> 00:07:23.680 The IMDB summary is quote: a family heads to an isolated hotel for the winter where a sinister presence influences the father into violence, while his psychic son sees horrific forebodings from both past and future. 00:07:24.079 --> 00:07:29.279 I must say, I don't think I read that when I put this in these notes, and I think it's horrendous. 00:07:40.959 --> 00:07:59.040 The critics' consensus is quote Though it deviates from Stephen King's novel, Stanley Kubrick's The Shining is a chilling, often baroque journey into madness, exemplified by an unforgettable turn from Jack Nicholson. 00:07:59.360 --> 00:08:10.079 After this movie was released, very mixed to negative reviews of it, saying that it was not uh faithful enough to Stephen King's work. 00:08:10.399 --> 00:08:24.560 And uh over time it has like less than 10 years later, I think there was a Rolling Stone article published that was like re-evaluating The Shining, and just with time it has become more and more like a classic and a staple of pop culture. 00:08:25.519 --> 00:08:46.320 You probably recognize a ton of imagery from this movie, like the twins and the elevator and Jack Nicholson's face in that door, even the music, like there's so many elements of this movie that I don't know, even growing up, I I've seen this movie quite a few times, but even before I saw it, I knew what some of these things were. 00:08:46.720 --> 00:08:48.879 What was the plot difference? 00:08:49.200 --> 00:08:50.159 Oh, everything. 00:08:50.240 --> 00:08:52.960 There's so much difference between I've read the novel. 00:08:53.039 --> 00:09:01.039 I read it when I was younger, so I don't quite remember it necessarily, but like re- I've read some summaries preparing for this episode. 00:09:01.279 --> 00:09:13.120 But basically, when Stanley Kubrick chose The Shining, he chose the story and kind of the atmosphere and mood of it, and just kind of threw the rest out. 00:09:13.279 --> 00:09:28.720 So they're the same characters, there's the same basic premise, but there's so much deviation in character and arc, and um, like some examples are like Wendy is a lot stronger in Stephen King's novel, and there's not a hedgemace. 00:09:28.879 --> 00:09:29.360 Not hard to be. 00:09:29.600 --> 00:09:30.639 Not hard to beat, yeah. 00:09:30.879 --> 00:09:40.320 There's a hedge maze uh in the movie, but in the book, there are just these big like uh topiary animals that come to life and chase them around. 00:09:40.559 --> 00:09:41.600 And that'd be cool. 00:09:41.919 --> 00:09:50.399 All of the uh like guests at the party, there's a lot of backstory to the what's going on in the hotel and who those people are. 00:09:50.559 --> 00:10:02.399 There's a lot of backstory with uh Wendy and Jack's parents and kind of the lineage of what's led them to become who they are, and also Jack passing some of those things on to Danny. 00:10:02.639 --> 00:10:10.799 So there's just a bunch that s uh Kubrick just kind of sliced out to make this more like atmospheric psychological piece. 00:10:11.200 --> 00:10:23.279 Like for the better, though, because I could see where like trying to fit all of that in would have I feel like after like afterwards, right now when we're talking about it, I would have been like, why did they include all that backstory in the beginning? 00:10:23.519 --> 00:10:42.559 Yeah, and there's actually a mini-series from 1997 by McGarris, um, that tried to stay really faithful to it and in response to all these criticisms of the movie, and I haven't seen it personally, but everything I've read for the most part says that it's kind of unsuccessful just because I don't know. 00:10:42.799 --> 00:10:43.440 I don't know. 00:10:44.320 --> 00:10:45.919 I'm kinda in the other boat. 00:10:46.000 --> 00:11:17.840 I think one of the parts of the movies that or the movie missed for me was I feel like some of that backstory, having now known that it's deviated

from the book so much on that, like I could see where that would be beneficial because like for example, I feel like I did get confused with the like the guests, the relation of the the guy that was the former hotel Grady. 00:11:18.159 --> 00:11:27.039 Yeah, like I I felt a little discon like disjointed when maybe a little more context would have been good. 00:11:27.360 --> 00:11:34.000 Yeah, the th the guests and like the bartender and like some of the other people that show up towards the end, I'm like, what's going on here? 00:11:34.480 --> 00:11:38.879 But I think like family lineage, maybe like we're good. 00:11:39.200 --> 00:11:56.559 Yeah, I think it's interesting too because I do think some of that was intentional though by Kubrick, because I've also seen a lot of it's just so bizarre because reading about the production of this movie, they it took them like over a year to make, and he was really anal about everything that he did. 00:11:56.960 --> 00:12:02.080 And it's bizarre because there's so many weird visual things. 00:12:02.240 --> 00:12:07.679 Like uh if you look, if you pay attention to the layout of the hotel, like it doesn't make sense. 00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:45.679 Doors lead to places that they wouldn't physically be able to, and there are so many uh and even like the guests having no context, and you know, there's this guy in the bear costume that we'll talk about later, and there's all sorts of just things that are just kind of in there that it's like they must have meaning, but maybe they don't, and it's created this weird like piece of art that people have like really projected a lot of crazy conspiracy theories, and since people love it so much, they put so much thought and work into it, and it's just like this we I mean, Stanley Kubrick's dead now. 00:12:45.759 --> 00:12:47.759 He died in 99 of a heart attack. 00:12:48.240 --> 00:12:49.200 More on that later. 00:12:49.519 --> 00:12:50.960 Theories, conspiracies. 00:12:51.200 --> 00:12:51.600 Oh my god. 00:12:52.000 --> 00:13:01.919 But um it's just insane that there's just no way it's this movie to me has just become this like weird like ghost of its own. 00:13:02.000 --> 00:13:04.240 Like it's there's so much mystery to it. 00:13:04.720 --> 00:13:11.120 Was this shot in an actual art lodge or another interesting thing? 00:13:11.360 --> 00:13:23.039 So some of the exterior shots, a few of them were, and especially those big sweeping ones at the beginning, those were shot, I believe, in Oregon, and um beautiful as well. 00:13:23.600 --> 00:13:39.519 Um so most of the movie was shot in a studio in Britain, and even they built the entire hotel in this studio, and a lot of the exterior shots of the hotel are in a studio. 00:13:40.720 --> 00:13:43.120 Oh, like on a miniature or something? 00:13:43.519 --> 00:13:44.559 No, they built it. 00:13:44.799 --> 00:13:49.120 There's no hedge maze at the uh hotel that they did that at. 00:13:49.279 --> 00:13:59.200 Like they built so much of this, and I believe I read a fact that said it was the largest set ever built at this studio in Britain, which I mean I have no idea what that means. 00:13:59.279 --> 00:14:04.720 Like maybe it's a small studio, but I was like, I mean, I believe it because that sounds like a lot. 00:14:05.600 --> 00:14:06.720 Yeah, huh? 00:14:08.080 --> 00:14:09.279 Interesting. 00:14:09.519 --> 00:14:13.039 So, what would y'all say, just like coming out of it, was your first thought? 00:14:13.120 --> 00:14:15.759 I mean, Ian, you aired towards confusion. 00:14:16.000 --> 00:14:19.440 Any other tentacles in that old brain of yours? 00:14:19.759 --> 00:14:20.240 Tentacles. 00:14:21.120 --> 00:14:21.360 Yeah. 00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:23.360 I didn't say that by accident. 00:14:23.679 --> 00:14:26.480 I had a really good thought and then I just lost it. 00:14:27.039 --> 00:14:32.240 I like beautiful performance, start to finish. 00:14:32.720 --> 00:14:35.519 It was a touch too long for me. 00:14:36.240 --> 00:14:38.320 It comes in at about two and a half hours. 00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:45.679 Yeah, I think that extra half hour probably could have been negated. 00:14:47.440 --> 00:15:00.799 One of my opening thoughts was uh probably for a good half of the movie, I was like, I wonder why everyone talks about the shining and you know, raises it to a high pedestal. 00:15:00.960 --> 00:15:09.440 And I was like, wait a minute, is this whole movie not gonna show one like scary person or have one actual jump scare? 00:15:09.600 --> 00:15:19.200 And the whole fact of the scary movie is actually just the atmosphere in which they're in, and that's gonna add this like suspense. 00:15:19.440 --> 00:15:20.879 I mean, yeah, for the most part. 00:15:21.600 --> 00:15:28.399 Yeah, for the most part, yeah, but I mean there ended up actually being things, but yeah, like that's what my initial thought was. 00:15:28.559 --> 00:15:36.720 I I just thought it was cool that like the quote unquote scariest part for me was the performance of the actors. 00:15:37.360 --> 00:15:38.320 Oh yeah, for sure. 00:15:38.559 --> 00:15:41.600 Like Jack Nicholson, fucking terrifying. 00:15:42.080 --> 00:15:43.279 He carried the movie. 00:15:43.600 --> 00:15:48.879 The kid was amazing, like those shots of him like screaming and everything, like beautiful. 00:15:49.120 --> 00:15:49.519 Yeah. 00:15:49.759 --> 00:15:53.120 Um, the little girls, not so much, but like I understood that from like. 00:15:54.720 --> 00:15:55.200 Yeah, yeah. 00:15:55.440 --> 00:15:57.679 But um even Wendy was there. 00:15:58.399 --> 00:15:58.720 Yeah. 00:15:58.799 --> 00:16:01.200 Um Wendy was terrifying. 00:16:01.519 --> 00:16:02.639 I love Wendy's. 00:16:03.039 --> 00:16:06.960 I I kept thinking, Carolyn, you basically wear the same outfits. 00:16:09.360 --> 00:16:12.960 Excuse me, dress just like there was one she was wearing like the junk. 00:16:16.240 --> 00:16:21.519 I wish we would have watched this movie earlier because

I would have been mine is much more stylish. 00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:24.240 I would have been Danny for Halloween for sure. 00:16:24.639 --> 00:16:25.759 Riding tricycle around. 00:16:28.240 --> 00:16:29.360 Danny is an ear, Mrs. 00:16:29.440 --> 00:16:29.679 Torrence. 00:16:30.720 --> 00:16:31.360 Thank you, Mrs. 00:16:31.519 --> 00:16:32.080 Torrance. 00:16:32.720 --> 00:16:33.039 Wow. 00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:36.159 You see, I told you scarier than the movie. 00:16:36.480 --> 00:16:37.600 She does that. 00:16:39.840 --> 00:16:40.720 Oh my god. 00:16:41.200 --> 00:16:43.360 I thought it was- I didn't know I had it in me. 00:16:43.600 --> 00:16:44.399 The shiny. 00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:52.639 There were there were a lot of moments there were a lot of parts of the movie that frustrated me, but there's a lot of the movie that was really, really solid. 00:16:52.960 --> 00:16:53.440 I lied. 00:16:53.600 --> 00:16:56.559 One of the scariest moments for me was the old lady in the bathtub. 00:16:56.799 --> 00:16:57.679 Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:16:57.759 --> 00:17:00.320 That actually, I had nightmares about that when I was younger. 00:17:00.480 --> 00:17:02.159 That really terrified me as well. 00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:21.599 Yeah, but um, I mean, I think what's made it so scary, like, yes, she looked scary, but I think the actual cinematography of that scene, like, I I feel like from watching the movies that we do, the current ones at least, like, it's things are scary sometimes because they rely on jumping out at you. 00:17:21.759 --> 00:17:30.720 But that was just like fully visible, like uh it was on screen for too long almost, and that was what was scary about it. 00:17:31.200 --> 00:17:36.000 That's a recurring theme like all like when she's looking at the papers specifically. 00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:37.119 Oh my god, yes. 00:17:37.200 --> 00:17:38.400 I was like, okay, we get it. 00:17:38.640 --> 00:17:39.839 Do you have to read every page? 00:17:39.920 --> 00:17:40.880 It's are you crazy? 00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:41.920 Fun fact about that. 00:17:42.319 --> 00:17:44.079 Really creative typography, though. 00:17:44.319 --> 00:17:50.319 Rumor has it that Stanley Kubrick sat down and hand-typed all 500 of those pages. 00:17:50.640 --> 00:17:53.440 So I loved it because there were time will tell. 00:17:53.680 --> 00:17:56.880 It was like Well, there were mistakes in the time has not told. 00:17:57.359 --> 00:18:00.799 There were mistakes in it, and like that made it more real. 00:18:00.960 --> 00:18:03.839 And then it got really creative with like the format and like it's like. 00:18:04.000 --> 00:18:08.400 Yeah, it's like he actually thought he was writing a book there, but it's just weird. 00:18:08.480 --> 00:18:10.400 She's seeing it, she's like, oh shit. 00:18:10.559 --> 00:18:11.200 Yeah. 00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:13.440 Yeah, that'd be crazy. 00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:18.480 If I saw papers from you that wrote that, that would be a sign. 00:18:19.200 --> 00:18:27.599 What if one day you just like we're cleaning out the closet and you found like a huge like stack and it was all the same text? 00:18:28.799 --> 00:18:32.559 What if I didn't have a job and that's what I was doing all day? 00:18:34.559 --> 00:18:35.279 Scary. 00:18:36.799 --> 00:18:38.079 All work, no play. 00:18:38.240 --> 00:18:39.519 You gotta have a good time too. 00:18:39.759 --> 00:18:40.720 Yeah, shit happens. 00:18:41.039 --> 00:19:07.759 Uh, circling back to your complaint about the runtime, that was a big criticism when this movie first came out was that it was too long, and actually, it was a little bit longer when it first came out, but as it was in theaters, Stanley Kubrick had like theaters cut the projection and send scenes back to the studio and kept making it shorter while it was in theaters as they were getting like reviews back, which is insane to me. 00:19:08.000 --> 00:19:10.000 Um it was longer than what we watched? 00:19:10.240 --> 00:19:11.680 Only slightly, but it was. 00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:18.160 He had people, like I said, go in with like literal scissors and remove scenes and return them to the studio. 00:19:18.400 --> 00:19:18.720 Huh. 00:19:19.279 --> 00:19:27.039 What's frustrating also about that is it seemed like the whole movie was the whole movie was pretty slow. 00:19:28.000 --> 00:19:35.680 But then like the last five minutes, it's like they tried to cram everything that they should have like just spanned it out in the movie with. 00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:52.160 I think there are a few scenes where it's like when you think about the order of events and things that happen, like I wouldn't want anything to go away, but there were some scenes by the end where I just kind of like, why are you taking so long to say it? 00:19:52.319 --> 00:19:53.599 Just spit your words out. 00:19:53.759 --> 00:19:53.920 Yeah. 00:19:54.160 --> 00:20:12.160 Because they had there were just weird pauses between sentences and things, and specifically like when Wendy is watching TV after Danny has like been strangled or whatever, she says two sentences, and I'm like, we were there for like a solid 12 minutes. 00:20:12.319 --> 00:20:13.119 I was like, What? 00:20:14.720 --> 00:20:18.559 I mean, a really good scene in the movie, just I was like, why is it taking so long? 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:31.039 But when Jack is in the bathroom with Grady, like a really great scene and a really like pivotal one, because you know, Grady's like, you need to take care of your wife and your son, and he's like, Yeah, I do. 00:20:31.359 --> 00:20:39.839 But um, it was just something where it's like someone would say something and then you just kind of look at them for like 30 seconds, and then the other one would respond, and I was like, Okay. 00:20:40.559 --> 00:20:44.319 Yeah, I mean the bar p the bartender, another great like Lloyd. 00:20:44.559 --> 00:20:45.680 Oh yeah. 00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:47.279 Yeah. 00:20:48.319 --> 00:20:49.279 His

name's Lloyd. 00:20:50.160 --> 00:20:51.680 Carol, you're just all over this movie. 00:20:52.000 --> 00:20:56.880 They do they I noticed in the casting characters the the names repeat. 00:20:57.039 --> 00:21:00.880 Wendy is one of the musicians, composers, yeah. 00:21:01.200 --> 00:21:05.039 Yeah, but I'm saying you specifically there's oh, I guess just Lloyd. 00:21:05.119 --> 00:21:07.279 I was going to say the Caroline, but there's no Caroline. 00:21:07.440 --> 00:21:08.160 Jack and Jack. 00:21:08.480 --> 00:21:09.359 Jack and Jack. 00:21:09.599 --> 00:21:14.640 Um, but I mean at the same time, this is based on a novel, so that's all coincidence. 00:21:15.440 --> 00:21:17.039 But were the bum bumps. 00:21:17.279 --> 00:21:19.519 Were your phone drops coincidences? 00:21:20.319 --> 00:21:21.119 I don't know. 00:21:21.279 --> 00:21:22.720 I don't know what was going on there. 00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:24.720 A ghost in the apartment. 00:21:25.039 --> 00:21:29.359 No, Ian was dozing off, and Parker slammed things around to wake him up. 00:21:29.680 --> 00:21:30.240 I don't know. 00:21:30.559 --> 00:21:31.599 I don't know. 00:21:32.319 --> 00:21:33.920 Little past progressive over here. 00:21:36.240 --> 00:21:38.000 It almost scares me. 00:21:39.599 --> 00:21:41.839 You don't, you never know what I'm doing in here. 00:21:41.920 --> 00:21:45.680 I'm always eyes on everything in here. 00:21:47.599 --> 00:21:49.279 Alright, I'm losing my train of thought. 00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:50.319 I'm losing my train. 00:21:50.880 --> 00:21:52.880 Tell me some of these conspiracy theories. 00:21:53.039 --> 00:21:53.920 I need to know. 00:21:54.160 --> 00:21:59.200 Alright, well, I don't have anything like super flashed out because as I said, that's not what we're here for. 00:21:59.359 --> 00:22:04.240 Tell me about the I just that's the one big Well, that's the one that I have the most on. 00:22:04.400 --> 00:22:07.759 So I'll just like run off a few interesting ones for you. 00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:10.480 You can look these up for a lot more info. 00:22:10.559 --> 00:22:18.000 Maybe I'll post some links in our show notes if you want some further reading on these conspiracy theories. 00:22:18.160 --> 00:22:25.519 In fact, there's an entire documentary called Room 237 that is just two hours of this type of info. 00:22:25.759 --> 00:22:27.279 So you can really dive in. 00:22:27.359 --> 00:22:36.000 Like I said, I mean this movie's been around since 1980, and people love it, and there's just all these weird idiosyncrasies in it that just people are like, what does it mean? 00:22:36.240 --> 00:22:37.599 So who knows? 00:22:37.920 --> 00:22:50.400 So there was a rumor going around before this movie was created that Stanley Kubrick had helped the government direct and orchestrate the Apollo 11 moon landing. 00:22:50.640 --> 00:22:51.680 That it was fake. 00:22:53.119 --> 00:23:08.000 So people had said, you know, Danny wears a suspicious sweater at one point, and they were

saying that part of this movie is him apologizing or admitting guilt to his help with the moon landing. 00:23:08.319 --> 00:23:08.960 Fake. 00:23:09.599 --> 00:23:14.720 Another one, which this one I actually kind of think there's some food for thought in here. 00:23:14.960 --> 00:23:15.759 Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. 00:23:15.839 --> 00:23:17.599 Do you think the moon landing is fake? 00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:20.160 I think everything's fake, Caroline. 00:23:20.559 --> 00:23:21.680 I have no clue. 00:23:23.279 --> 00:23:26.319 I mean what do we have? 00:23:26.400 --> 00:23:27.440 What proof do we have? 00:23:27.680 --> 00:23:28.160 Just kidding. 00:23:28.240 --> 00:23:29.599 I know nothing about this. 00:23:30.319 --> 00:23:34.240 If you're listening, do you think the moon landing happened? 00:23:34.480 --> 00:23:37.279 Yeah, leave us a five-star review and give us your answer. 00:23:39.039 --> 00:23:42.960 Uh, I think this one has some legs, if you know what I mean. 00:23:43.119 --> 00:23:52.960 But that the int but the thing is they're saying the entire movie is a commentary on the Native Indian journey and American oppression against Native Americans. 00:23:53.359 --> 00:23:54.960 I think that's really interesting. 00:23:55.200 --> 00:24:04.880 And it is strange that there is so much Native American imagery and yeah, talk, and that's actually not part of Stephen King's book. 00:24:05.039 --> 00:24:09.920 He likes King likes to throw around an Indian burial ground, but that was not in this. 00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:13.759 So that is a product of the movie, and you have to ask why? 00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:16.799 Why would they do that if there wasn't meaning, you know? 00:24:17.279 --> 00:24:22.720 I but like, are there in this theory are there examples in like the script or like the stuff? 00:24:22.880 --> 00:24:29.680 Yeah, I mean, they uh just reference uh, you know, Jack throwing the ball against the picture on the wall. 00:24:29.839 --> 00:24:34.960 Apparently there was a cut scene where there were arrows left on his desk and things like that. 00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:39.440 So I mean, all of these have interesting pieces of evidence. 00:24:39.680 --> 00:24:54.799 So another one is that this movie, this and uh Eyes Wide Shut, the last film he directed, that have come under the same fire, that these were exposes against the Illuminati. 00:24:56.240 --> 00:24:57.039 Exactly. 00:24:57.279 --> 00:25:09.759 And that he didn't die of a heart attack, but they killed him in 1999 before the release of Eyes Wide Shut to uh because he'd exposed them in The Shining. 00:25:10.079 --> 00:25:12.480 Um, I don't actually know what the Illuminati is. 00:25:12.720 --> 00:25:14.480 Oh, I can't talk about it. 00:25:14.720 --> 00:25:15.359 Yeah, yeah. 00:25:15.599 --> 00:25:19.519 One of my friends in high school said that his grandfather was a Freemason. 00:25:19.680 --> 00:25:20.640 Get on that. 00:25:21.759 --> 00:25:22.720 Mm-hmm. 00:25:23.039 --> 00:25:25.039 They stole the Declaration of Independence. 00:25:26.000 --> 00:25:33.039 And then what a more recent one is a theory from 2014 by someone named Mary Catherine Hamm. 00:25:33.119 --> 00:25:37.200 You can look at it on her blog, but some convincing evidence be legit. 00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:38.799 Convincing evidence. 00:25:38.960 --> 00:25:41.039 Well, everyone can make conspiracy theories. 00:25:41.119 --> 00:25:43.039 You don't have to have a degree. 00:25:43.359 --> 00:25:44.160 Legitimate proof. 00:25:44.640 --> 00:25:51.759 But she has some curious examples saying that it is the same film as Frozen. 00:25:52.160 --> 00:25:52.720 Wow. 00:25:52.960 --> 00:26:03.279 She offers specific pieces of the story that have similarities and specific side-by-side screenshots uh connecting Elsa and Jack Torrance. 00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:06.000 I'm on board to research that one at least. 00:26:06.240 --> 00:26:10.160 Those were the main ones that I wrote down, but there are so many. 00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:15.200 Like I said, there's a really long movie about the conspiracy theories here. 00:26:15.440 --> 00:26:17.039 Uh and they're really interesting. 00:26:17.200 --> 00:26:19.279 So you want to know about this bear costume? 00:26:19.440 --> 00:26:19.839 Yes. 00:26:20.079 --> 00:26:20.640 Alright. 00:26:20.799 --> 00:26:31.440 There's an incredible uh video, really well put together and researched by Rob Eger's Collative Learning. 00:26:31.839 --> 00:26:33.440 Uh, really interesting stuff. 00:26:33.599 --> 00:26:39.359 In fact, he really he has this really long piece on the entire movie that's interesting that I was reading. 00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:50.240 But I specifically am referencing here a video called The Shining, Danny's Ordeal, and the Bear Costumed Man that you can go watch, and I highly recommend. 00:26:50.400 --> 00:26:52.079 I'll give you the facts here. 00:26:52.400 --> 00:27:06.880 So in the book, there's this big subplot about the party guests, and one is a guy uh who has this like gay backstory, and there's this like scene, but he wears a dog costume in the book. 00:27:07.039 --> 00:27:09.279 In the movie, he wears a bear costume. 00:27:09.599 --> 00:27:10.400 Curious. 00:27:10.799 --> 00:27:12.079 Why change it? 00:27:12.400 --> 00:27:28.319 Well, collative learning suggests the bear costumed man sucking some D in that room represents a realization that Jack has been sexually abusing Danny this whole time. 00:27:28.640 --> 00:27:29.599 I had that thought. 00:27:30.000 --> 00:27:47.440 So the book says that Jack's father was not specifically sexually abusive, but was abusive and alcoholic, and that now Jack is an alcoholic, and you can make assumptions about also, you know, abuse towards Danny, obviously, where it ends up. 00:27:47.759 --> 00:27:54.559 But he um this video's piece specifically links a few things. 00:27:54.799 --> 00:28:05.279 One, that when Ullman comes in to take Jack into his interview for the position, he's reading a

Playgirl magazine, not a Playboy. 00:28:05.599 --> 00:28:14.880 And so that's obviously the one geared towards women with uh some sexy men, which good on him. 00:28:15.519 --> 00:28:20.079 But um, so that's Curious Thing one. 00:28:20.640 --> 00:28:31.200 Curious thing uh not two, it's kind of like many things in one, is the repetition of bear imagery in the movie uh related to Danny. 00:28:31.680 --> 00:28:35.279 Uh he is on like a bear pillow at the beginning. 00:28:35.359 --> 00:28:57.759 There's some weird like images that line up with bears, and he kind of boils this all down to Danny being represented by bears and him being abused by his father, and there's some really crazy evidence that he brings up in that video, so you should look it up for sure. 00:28:58.000 --> 00:29:02.480 Why why are bears always synonymous with like scary movies? 00:29:02.559 --> 00:29:15.039 It seems like, or like creepy, like midsummer, obviously, with the bears and Midsummer, I believe we discussed in the episode, has a lot of imagery in folklore, and that's why that's a folklory thing. 00:29:15.279 --> 00:29:17.039 Well, that's specifically for Midsummer. 00:29:17.200 --> 00:29:20.480 This here is about childhood and teddy bears and things like that. 00:29:20.799 --> 00:29:22.640 So I mean it's just different movie to movie. 00:29:22.880 --> 00:29:27.119 I didn't catch when we see the bear, who is it that is with him? 00:29:27.440 --> 00:29:35.279 That's what's so curious about scenes like that, is there's no context for it, it's just in there, and it's for people to kind of be like, What's going on? 00:29:35.519 --> 00:29:35.920 Yeah. 00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:45.839 So for me, I was interpreting on this theory that's Wendy having this epiphany that, like, oh my god, what has my husband been doing this whole time? 00:29:46.079 --> 00:29:51.359 So the Dead Meat podcast just did an episode on creepy kids, which was really good. 00:29:51.599 --> 00:30:06.559 But they bring up uh a discussion where they say that Danny represents the continuation of past traumas, and they discuss how his powers are what unveils the evils in the overlook and Jack. 00:30:07.039 --> 00:30:14.319 I agree that he kind of seems like a reprim representation of like generational abuse. 00:30:14.559 --> 00:30:20.400 You know, it was from one guy to Jack, from Jack to Danny, like it's scary, will it be Danny to the next? 00:30:20.559 --> 00:30:21.759 You know, things like that. 00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:27.200 You know what I think about is what's that what's that series we watched in Portugal? 00:30:28.000 --> 00:30:29.119 Haunting Hill House. 00:30:29.359 --> 00:30:29.519 Yeah. 00:30:29.759 --> 00:30:39.759 I think of the the episode where the the w the sister goes into that that family's home where the foster kid is. 00:30:40.079 --> 00:30:51.440 Oh yeah, the smiley on the lays on the couch and then feels the fact that um the daughter had was being abused by her foster dad. 00:30:52.079 --> 00:31:14.799 I feel like that correlates with Danny's finger puppet, like a way to get or like Well, I think Tony and the Shining are different, but I definitely think that those two characters, the daughter, I forgot her name from the Hill House and Danny have kind of the same like heightened perception of other people, like they're just open to receiving energies and things like that. 00:31:15.119 --> 00:31:23.119 Um here specifically, I think that one, Tony's a coping mechanism for what's been happening to him. 00:31:23.440 --> 00:31:29.279 You know, Wendy says that Tony came about when Jack dis uh dislocated his shoulder. 00:31:29.599 --> 00:31:44.960 And after uh the moment that this video actually pauses is the moment when uh Jack abuses Danny sexually, is when uh Tony takes over and he says, like, Danny's not here, Mrs. 00:31:45.039 --> 00:31:48.079 Torrance, like he's gone for the rest of the movie. 00:31:48.400 --> 00:31:52.000 Um that's what I think about Tony. 00:31:52.720 --> 00:32:00.720 But I think that this movie is not I don't think that Danny's powers are what unlock the evil in the overlook. 00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:10.720 I think that his powers are what allow us to see what's in the overlook, and that this whole building has been like us as an audience, like we see it because Danny can show us. 00:32:11.039 --> 00:32:16.559 I had a hard time deciphering when things were going wrong, or like you start seeing things. 00:32:16.640 --> 00:32:26.960 I couldn't tell if this was like a peek into the journey of Jack's mental stableness or from the powers of Danny. 00:32:27.519 --> 00:32:29.759 Well, I think it's all just us seeing. 00:32:30.319 --> 00:32:30.720 Well, yeah. 00:32:30.960 --> 00:32:41.680 Yeah, I think the overlook, as cliche as it sounds and reviews to say that a place is a character, I think the overlook is a big presence in this movie. 00:32:42.160 --> 00:32:56.720 But I think we're seeing it because Danny's letting us, and we're just seeing like a past full of like hatred and trauma and evil that is just living here, and Danny's just the one who can see it. 00:32:57.039 --> 00:33:03.119 Well, like specifically room 237, the bathtub lady. 00:33:03.279 --> 00:33:03.759 Mm-hmm. 00:33:04.640 --> 00:33:08.000 Like I didn't know if that was part of like the history of the hotel. 00:33:08.079 --> 00:33:12.240 Did like was that the wife in the bathtub? 00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:16.880 Or like, or was it Jack going crazy? 00:33:17.200 --> 00:33:33.359 I think that one part of that is that that's definitely like um it's definitely supposed to be, I think, like guilt or um regret over like his maybe like lusts or angers towards his wife. 00:33:34.799 --> 00:33:39.440 Yeah, maybe he hasn't cheated on Wendy, but he's grown such a hatred for Wendy. 00:33:39.519 --> 00:33:48.480 Maybe it's like this visual representation of like he sees someone that he wants and then oop bad, you know, don't want her. 00:33:48.720 --> 00:33:59.279 The

guy, the uh the collative learning guy says that this is a dream that Jack has where he takes on the role of Danny and sees the woman as his abuser. 00:33:59.759 --> 00:34:01.039 I thought that was interesting. 00:34:01.519 --> 00:34:04.960 But like I said, there's so many different ways to interpret these things. 00:34:05.359 --> 00:34:11.599 It kind of blows my mind because it's just like, how am I supposed to comprehend all of this? 00:34:12.239 --> 00:34:20.719 I do think there's a big like for how long it was the blend of Jack and his mental stability. 00:34:21.760 --> 00:34:26.400 There was a big jump for me when he lashes out at Wendy for the first time. 00:34:26.719 --> 00:34:35.519 Yeah, I don't think it was a gradual It was it said one month later, and then it was just like a get the fuck out of here kind of thing. 00:34:35.840 --> 00:34:36.239 Yeah. 00:34:36.480 --> 00:34:49.840 Uh it is interesting you bring that up because one of King's criticisms of this movie is that he didn't like Jack Nicholson being cast because he said that he looked crazy from the first moment and there's no arc there. 00:34:50.239 --> 00:34:50.480 He did. 00:34:50.639 --> 00:34:53.760 That he's just crazy the whole time, and so there's no journey. 00:34:54.159 --> 00:34:59.920 But his craziness is good when the crazy needs to be crazy. 00:35:00.480 --> 00:35:00.639 Right. 00:35:00.880 --> 00:35:07.519 I felt like really like upset inside every time he would yell at Wendy because she's just so sweet. 00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:13.039 But like, even in his like job interview in the office, I was like, this guy's nuts. 00:35:14.079 --> 00:35:17.119 Yeah, I mean, he does seem that way. 00:35:17.360 --> 00:35:31.280 On the same note, uh, in 2013, journalist Laura Miller wrote a piece on King disliking this movie and kind of what you were just hitting on with uh Jack Nicholson being crazy. 00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:37.360 She wrote uh quote, King is essentially a novelist of morality. 00:35:37.519 --> 00:35:45.440 The decisions his characters make, whether it's to confront a pack of vampires or to bring ten years break ten years of sobriety, are what matter to him. 00:35:45.679 --> 00:35:51.360 But in Kubrick's The Shining, the characters are largely in the grip of forces beyond their control. 00:35:51.760 --> 00:36:03.519 It's a film in which domestic violence occurs, while King's novel is about domestic violence as a certain as a choice certain men make when they refuse to abandon delusion or defensive entitlement. 00:36:03.760 --> 00:36:11.360 As King sees it, Kubrick treats his characters like insects because the director doesn't really consider them capable of shaping their own fates. 00:36:11.519 --> 00:36:17.920 Everything they do is subordinate to an overweening, irresistible force, which is Kubrick's highly developed aesthetic. 00:36:18.079 --> 00:36:19.280 They are its slaves. 00:36:19.440 --> 00:36:25.760 In King's The Shining, the monster's Jack, and Kubrick's

The Monster is Kubrick. 00:36:26.159 --> 00:36:29.039 I thought that was an interesting quote in there. 00:36:29.760 --> 00:36:38.719 Well, yeah, and it's true because the book is, I would say, for a Stephen King book, a lot more plot-driven than other ones that I've read. 00:36:38.960 --> 00:37:01.199 Um, but this movie doesn't even really matter who's who or what they're doing, but it's more about this like overwhelming sensation of dread that's going on the whole time, and the discomfort you can feel as the characters start to clash more, or maybe as Danny's innocence starts feeling more substantial against like Jack's evil and things like that. 00:37:01.440 --> 00:37:03.119 I'm gonna go out on a limb here. 00:37:03.360 --> 00:37:09.039 Go out there and say an alternate viewpoint of this movie. 00:37:09.360 --> 00:37:14.159 You get an inkling of what is it, secret window? 00:37:15.519 --> 00:37:15.840 You know? 00:37:16.320 --> 00:37:17.599 Secret window with Johnny Depp. 00:37:18.000 --> 00:37:18.639 Johnny Depp. 00:37:19.679 --> 00:37:27.519 Like that, I feel like is what this movie would be if it were from Jack's perspective. 00:37:28.000 --> 00:37:35.199 He definitely has like an alternative like truth in his mind of what is happening. 00:37:35.599 --> 00:37:35.920 Yeah. 00:37:36.079 --> 00:37:47.360 I think what was upsetting for me is from the very beginning, like Wendy and Danny are just trying to have a good time, and like from the first moment where they're all three in the car together, he's just being so rude. 00:37:47.840 --> 00:37:50.800 He's just like, get out of my face, you can eat when we get to the hotel. 00:37:51.440 --> 00:37:52.800 What do you what do you think? 00:37:53.199 --> 00:37:56.320 I thought it was interesting about the cannibalism. 00:37:56.800 --> 00:37:57.199 Yeah. 00:37:57.519 --> 00:38:01.840 And and I thought that would come up or like something would happen. 00:38:02.159 --> 00:38:06.079 Do you think that was just I mean, one, I think that's just to set the scene. 00:38:06.159 --> 00:38:10.239 It's spooky, it tells us that bad things have happened in this area before. 00:38:10.480 --> 00:38:31.840 Uh two, I think that cannibalism anytime it's in something is kind of an indicator or symbol of like almost like same thing with zombie movies, overwhelming like greed and the desire to like destroy other people in service of yourself. 00:38:32.000 --> 00:38:38.800 So I think thematically that sets the scene a little bit, a little foreshadowing, but also it's just spooky. 00:38:39.119 --> 00:39:03.519 I think what Jack says in his perspective is like key in that moment because he takes the side of like they did it to survive, they had to do it, and that plays into his ideology later of like I have to kill my family because I have this goal of like m like doing my job well. 00:39:03.920 --> 00:39:08.719 And even on the same thread, Wendy's immediate reaction was protect Danny. 00:39:09.199 --> 00:39:12.480 So maybe that whole scene, whole movie right there. 00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:22.159 Maybe I just like ladies in horror films, but since I just really like Shelly Duval in this movie, uh, I wanted to take a moment to chat about her. 00:39:22.480 --> 00:39:37.039 So when they were filming this movie, Stanley Kubrick was apparently specifically really hostile towards Shelly Duval and was always kind of like heckling her over everything, and it was such a long process of shooting. 00:39:37.199 --> 00:39:45.199 Apparently, she was in and out of like sickness the whole time, and that eventually her hair started falling out because she was so stressed out. 00:39:50.159 --> 00:39:52.559 We're killing ourselves out here, and you're gonna be ready. 00:39:55.119 --> 00:39:55.599 No, I can't. 00:39:58.239 --> 00:40:01.039 We're sitting there because they say, wait a minute, and then you say on the radio. 00:40:01.599 --> 00:40:03.280 When you do it, you've got to look desperate, Shelley. 00:40:03.360 --> 00:40:04.559 You're just wasting everybody's time there. 00:40:04.800 --> 00:40:05.840 I can't even get this recording. 00:40:06.239 --> 00:40:17.599 So it was a really traumatic thing, and then she said that when she went straight to being doing Popeye right afterwards, it was such a relief, and she had so much fun filming that movie because that had been so horrible. 00:40:18.079 --> 00:40:22.400 I started laughing out loud when she was running around with that knife. 00:40:23.280 --> 00:40:25.519 I'm that was hilarious. 00:40:25.920 --> 00:40:30.239 It's funny actually because I was watching when we were doing Scream 2 an interview. 00:40:30.559 --> 00:40:35.440 No, when we were doing I Know What You Did Last Summer, an interview with Sarah Michelle Geller. 00:40:35.840 --> 00:40:47.760 And she said, because she had been coming off of playing Buffy the Vampire Slayer, that when they were doing her chasing, they kept telling her, Stop running like that, you look too strong, you need to flail your arms around more. 00:40:48.719 --> 00:40:55.119 So I mean Shelly, she just knew what she was, she knows how to run like a damsel. 00:40:55.440 --> 00:41:08.079 My mom, okay, so this is my mom has brought up something about the hotel and the shining before, and I couldn't remember, so I texted her and I said I asked her if she stayed in it in Colorado. 00:41:08.960 --> 00:41:14.880 And my mom texted me back just now and said, No, we visited it, and so did you. 00:41:16.639 --> 00:41:17.280 What? 00:41:17.519 --> 00:41:21.920 Apparently, when I was a baby, my mom took me to the hotel. 00:41:22.239 --> 00:41:23.280 Oh my god. 00:41:23.840 --> 00:41:24.719 In Colorado? 00:41:24.960 --> 00:41:28.159 Yeah, I think like my family had gone skiing. 00:41:28.320 --> 00:41:34.079 I did not because I was an infant, and they like knew it was there, and we like stopped by. 00:41:34.320 --> 00:41:36.480 So you're probably talking about the Stanley Hotel. 00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:37.440

Yes, the Stanley. 00:41:37.920 --> 00:41:42.800 Is the hotel that Stephen King stayed in and was inspired to write the story The Shining. 00:41:42.960 --> 00:41:43.760 Yes, that's what it is. 00:41:44.400 --> 00:41:47.360 Different hotel than this was filmed at, but that's the Shining Hotel. 00:41:47.599 --> 00:41:48.320 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:41:48.559 --> 00:41:49.360 Very cool. 00:41:49.840 --> 00:41:50.559 I was there. 00:41:50.880 --> 00:41:53.360 No wonder you're so spooky now. 00:41:53.679 --> 00:41:56.480 I bet some ghosts just like right into you. 00:41:56.639 --> 00:41:57.039 Yeah. 00:41:57.360 --> 00:42:03.519 Ooh! So the snow in this movie was made from 900 tons of salt and crushed gyro foam. 00:42:03.679 --> 00:42:04.159 Huh. 00:42:04.400 --> 00:42:05.599 It was not snowing there. 00:42:05.760 --> 00:42:06.400 That's a lot of snow. 00:42:06.800 --> 00:42:07.440 You know. 00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:11.199 I wonder, uh, it probably wasn't fun to get that in your mouth. 00:42:11.519 --> 00:42:14.000 Also, Danny's escape was pretty brilliant. 00:42:14.480 --> 00:42:15.599 Sliding out the window? 00:42:15.760 --> 00:42:15.920 No. 00:42:16.320 --> 00:42:17.039 No, the maze. 00:42:17.679 --> 00:42:18.960 He like steps backwards. 00:42:19.199 --> 00:42:19.360 Oh. 00:42:19.760 --> 00:42:20.079 Good. 00:42:20.239 --> 00:42:20.719 Good stuff. 00:42:20.960 --> 00:42:24.239 Which reminds me that Maze scene, Ian, I have a fact just for you. 00:42:24.480 --> 00:42:29.119 This was in the first uh dozen, as the internet says. 00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:36.880 Uh there were, I believe, three movies, I believe, before it that for sure used it, but one of the first films to ever use a steady cam. 00:42:37.760 --> 00:42:38.079 Oh. 00:42:38.800 --> 00:42:47.360 And they really use that pup following Danny on that tricycle, and then the way it's kind of weaving around uh Jack and Danny in the hedge maze. 00:42:47.679 --> 00:42:51.119 I I did enjoy the tricycle scene where he goes around. 00:42:51.440 --> 00:42:52.480 Yeah, those were good. 00:42:52.719 --> 00:42:53.119 Nice. 00:42:53.440 --> 00:42:54.239 So there you go. 00:42:54.400 --> 00:43:01.599 Also, in 2018, this film was selected for preservation in the United States National Film Registry by the Library of Congress. 00:43:02.079 --> 00:43:04.800 Does that mean if the world blows up, the movies will be safe? 00:43:05.039 --> 00:43:07.280 The aliens will find it, yeah, first. 00:43:07.679 --> 00:43:08.639 What would you say? 00:43:08.719 --> 00:43:13.840 And I think we have to be a little creative here to come up with our most memorable murder. 00:43:14.079 --> 00:43:15.199 We have a few. 00:43:15.440 --> 00:43:20.559 We have Dick Holloran stabbed right to the chest with that axe. 00:43:20.960 --> 00:43:21.599 Oh yeah. 00:43:21.840 --> 00:43:32.800 We have the Grady twins in that iconic scene uh on the floor, recreated by Jordan Peel with the twins and us. 00:43:33.199 --> 00:43:38.320 I've heard that he

very specifically placed those twins' bodies to look the same. 00:43:39.519 --> 00:43:48.480 Um we have, I mean, we could say Jack was murdered, but I mean, like, not really, but like he died, so count it. 00:43:49.119 --> 00:43:52.000 Um I gotta answer. 00:43:52.159 --> 00:43:59.760 I gotta go with Jack because you don't see anything, it's just like morning, and he's like there with his eyes. 00:44:01.760 --> 00:44:04.320 It was more like the most anticlimactic murder. 00:44:04.559 --> 00:44:05.519 I loved it though. 00:44:06.079 --> 00:44:07.760 I hate anti-climactic. 00:44:12.480 --> 00:44:13.440 That was pretty good. 00:44:14.159 --> 00:44:14.480 Yeah. 00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:16.559 I'm gonna go with the Grady twins. 00:44:16.639 --> 00:44:25.760 I think that's a pretty fun scene where it keeps flashing back and forth between them standing there and them being on the ground all slashed up. 00:44:26.880 --> 00:44:29.199 I have to go to X to the chest. 00:44:29.360 --> 00:44:30.559 So Wow. 00:44:30.880 --> 00:44:32.000 Three-way draw. 00:44:32.480 --> 00:44:36.880 Also, that was the first time that I, you know, him frozen as a meme. 00:44:37.280 --> 00:44:38.000 Have you seen that one? 00:44:38.480 --> 00:44:38.800 Yeah, yeah. 00:44:39.199 --> 00:44:44.079 And I saw it and like it wasn't moving, and I was like, is this whole movie a meme? 00:44:44.719 --> 00:44:45.440 Kind of. 00:44:45.679 --> 00:44:46.320 Inception. 00:44:46.480 --> 00:44:46.639 Yeah. 00:44:46.880 --> 00:44:47.280 In a way. 00:44:47.440 --> 00:44:49.039 Well, yeah, so many famous things. 00:44:49.280 --> 00:44:50.400 I didn't even know. 00:44:50.639 --> 00:44:55.039 I think I've even said like, here comes Here's Johnny. 00:44:55.199 --> 00:44:55.840 Here's Johnny. 00:44:56.079 --> 00:44:56.800 Here's Johnny. 00:44:57.360 --> 00:44:59.679 And I didn't know where it was from, and then I was like, huh. 00:45:00.079 --> 00:45:02.559 Well, I always used to get because I didn't see Mrs. 00:45:02.639 --> 00:45:10.559 Doubtfire until recently, but the the cream on the face and his face in the door I thought were the same thing for a while. 00:45:11.119 --> 00:45:11.360 Yeah. 00:45:11.760 --> 00:45:20.000 Well, here's Johnny was improvised by Jack Nicholson from the announcer on the Johnny Carson show. 00:45:20.239 --> 00:45:28.239 And since Stanley Kubrick is British, he had not seen that, didn't know what it was, almost didn't use it in the movie, and now it's iconic. 00:45:28.559 --> 00:45:33.840 That whole scene on the stairs, I imagine it was just Jack Nicholson improvising. 00:45:34.159 --> 00:45:35.360 With the baseball bat? 00:45:35.519 --> 00:45:35.840 Yes. 00:45:36.079 --> 00:45:41.519 Everything like he like sticks out his tongue and his eyes are going crazy and he's slotting. 00:45:52.079 --> 00:45:53.519 You fucking kidding me. 00:45:53.920 --> 00:46:01.039 That's why she that's why her hair was falling out because she was in such a terrible spot from having to do shit like

that. 00:46:01.199 --> 00:46:12.079 I was going to point out there were some scenes with music that seem strange because the music seems to be like pointing at something and then necessarily matched up. 00:46:12.320 --> 00:46:26.639 But I actually think the music here is really interesting because I noticed like when Wendy walks into the big like grand room and the music is like really intense, and she's like, hey, what's up? 00:46:26.800 --> 00:46:32.400 And then it like does like a bum, like when he rips the paper out of his typewriter, and you both laughed. 00:46:32.559 --> 00:46:35.360 And I was thinking, like, yeah, that is kind of out of place. 00:46:40.960 --> 00:46:42.000 Hi, honey. 00:46:45.519 --> 00:46:46.639 How's it going? 00:46:49.679 --> 00:46:50.079 Fine. 00:46:50.400 --> 00:46:52.400 And then right afterwards, it's silent. 00:46:52.559 --> 00:46:56.000 He's like yelling at her, like, when I'm in here, you don't come in here. 00:46:56.159 --> 00:46:56.880 Get out. 00:46:57.039 --> 00:46:58.719 And we're gonna make a new rule. 00:46:58.960 --> 00:47:02.239 Whenever I'm in here, you hear me typing. 00:47:04.480 --> 00:47:07.519 Whether you don't hear me typing, what the fuck you hear me doing in here? 00:47:07.599 --> 00:47:09.840 When I'm in here, that means that I am working. 00:47:10.000 --> 00:47:11.679 That means don't come in. 00:47:12.159 --> 00:47:13.920 How do you think you can handle that? 00:47:17.039 --> 00:47:17.440 Yeah. 00:47:20.800 --> 00:47:23.519 Why don't you start right now and get the fuck out of here? 00:47:24.079 --> 00:47:27.679 And I thought, actually, then I started tuning in with the music. 00:47:28.800 --> 00:47:34.239 And it seems like every time it's lined up with people's like mental states instead. 00:47:34.320 --> 00:47:42.159 Like you can see the music kind of following the trend of like Jack's inner monologue or whatever going on. 00:47:42.239 --> 00:47:48.000 So like there's the scene where Danny uh comes in and he's being quiet because he thinks Jack's asleep. 00:47:48.320 --> 00:47:49.039 Oh, that was the creepy. 00:47:49.519 --> 00:47:50.559 Come here, let's talk. 00:47:50.800 --> 00:48:06.719 And if the music had been nice, it might have been like a nice sweet scene or something, but instead the music is this really eerie, creepy music because Jack is like not being loving, he's being creepy weird, like I'm gonna kill you soon. 00:48:07.039 --> 00:48:16.880 So I think I was really trying to like catch when the music because the music's never really pointing to like a jump, or it's never point like we're used to with horror films. 00:48:17.199 --> 00:48:24.480 I think the music has a deeper like character in the film where it's kind of guiding our thoughts with Jack. 00:48:24.880 --> 00:48:31.280 I think in a way though, for me, it like callused me in a way. 00:48:31.920 --> 00:48:45.679 Like there were one scene, I don't remember when it was, but I remember thinking it was Wendy and she was by

herself, and there were a couple of like jumpy moments in the music, and she was like doing something really mundane. 00:48:46.400 --> 00:48:46.880 Yeah. 00:48:47.199 --> 00:48:50.880 And I was like, like opening is something happening now? 00:48:51.119 --> 00:48:52.639 Like I yeah, yes. 00:48:52.880 --> 00:48:53.119 Yeah. 00:48:53.280 --> 00:48:57.760 And it was like I was just spooky pretty at that point on. 00:48:57.840 --> 00:49:01.599 I was like, okay, like I need to just like not pay attention to the music at all. 00:49:01.920 --> 00:49:05.920 I feel like I knew that aligned with what Parker said. 00:49:06.000 --> 00:49:17.280 I I feel like they were doing something intentional with the music to not align with the scare, but I think they did it so much. 00:49:17.519 --> 00:49:19.039 Right, that's why I'm saying it callously. 00:49:19.280 --> 00:49:21.599 Two-thirds of the movie, yeah, two-thirds of the way in. 00:49:21.679 --> 00:49:25.280 I was like, I liked the concept, now I'm over it. 00:49:25.599 --> 00:49:42.079 Maybe if you go with Caroline's train of thought, maybe it's like you could think of it as like things like the music are kind of like the extra tone that's going on in the background, and you're like seeing everything within the music and not as part of it. 00:49:42.159 --> 00:49:43.280 Does that make sense? 00:49:43.519 --> 00:49:55.519 Like maybe like you're like the music is like the hotel, like you're in the music and the scene's happening, and the music is more of setting the tone for the entire movie. 00:49:55.840 --> 00:50:12.719 I think that's why it made more sense for me let's say two-thirds of the way in, because like until the very last part or ha let's say halfway, like there wasn't a lot of scary, you know, extra like things. 00:50:12.800 --> 00:50:16.880 It was just like we discussed earlier, just the ambiance itself. 00:50:17.599 --> 00:50:20.880 And so that's when I was like, oh, this music makes sense. 00:50:21.199 --> 00:50:36.639 Like you said, maybe it is a living part of being in the atmosphere, but then that paired with the actual actions and the quote unquote horror stuff, it was just too off. 00:50:37.199 --> 00:50:51.199 I think because we've seen such like a varied amount of scary horror films, it's like I I love going from like a really happy place to like something dark is happening. 00:50:51.360 --> 00:51:19.760 I feel like that contrast works for me, but I think people have played over time with the thought of like happy music with something dark happening as creepy, like the whole like children's kind of like in uh Insidious with the like Yeah, yes, like and there's that version, and then I think on the opposite spectrum of that is this, like just like scary the whole time. 00:51:20.159 --> 00:51:34.159 Well, and also we talked about the music in Insidious Lot 2, because you know it has like the like all the like really aggressive, like uh I don't even know how to describe that music where it just is really overwhelming. 00:51:34.559 --> 00:51:35.199 Yeah. 00:51:36.880 --> 00:51:42.639 So this is the first time that I've seen this tactic used, and I think that's why it was so jarring to me. 00:51:42.960 --> 00:51:49.599 The real question is, how stoked did you get when you saw all that meat? 00:51:51.119 --> 00:51:52.559 All that frozen meat. 00:51:52.800 --> 00:52:03.920 I did think, wow, they're saving money working there, five months, no rent, no food costs, pork, just getting paid. 00:52:04.079 --> 00:52:05.840 Guys, would you would you do this? 00:52:06.000 --> 00:52:08.800 All three of us, and we could just focus on the podcast. 00:52:09.199 --> 00:52:14.639 No, no, yeah, and all and all we would do is watch scary movies and record the podcast. 00:52:15.119 --> 00:52:17.440 I hate big buildings like that. 00:52:17.840 --> 00:52:23.599 I think the building would be the only thing saving me because I could go if I was sick of y'all, I could go somewhere totally different. 00:52:23.760 --> 00:52:24.320 No, I couldn't. 00:52:24.480 --> 00:52:28.880 If it was in a smaller building, it creaks or noises coming from everywhere. 00:52:29.360 --> 00:52:32.719 I can't do big, non-occupied buildings. 00:52:32.960 --> 00:52:36.159 I feel like I would probably stay in that little apartment that they had the whole time. 00:52:36.320 --> 00:52:37.440 I would be terrified the whole thing. 00:52:37.519 --> 00:52:47.679 If it were the three of us in that in that one little apartment or this apartment we're living in right now for five months not getting out, it would happen just like the movie, where I would just act ya. 00:52:48.079 --> 00:52:49.039 I'd do the same thing. 00:52:49.199 --> 00:52:55.039 I'd be like, Caroline, when I'm at my desk, that means I'm working. 00:52:55.280 --> 00:52:57.599 I would be clinging to you guys the whole time. 00:52:58.400 --> 00:53:01.199 It's what it's how you are when you get in your cleaning mode. 00:53:01.519 --> 00:53:03.199 I like things to be clean. 00:53:03.440 --> 00:53:05.519 Then all of a sudden she has a bat. 00:53:07.360 --> 00:53:09.599 Swinging it for no one to get hit. 00:53:09.840 --> 00:53:15.920 I'm like laxadacally swinging it, and Ian's like, get away. 00:53:16.400 --> 00:53:17.440 Don't touch me. 00:53:19.199 --> 00:53:20.960 Alright, alright, alright. 00:53:21.280 --> 00:53:23.920 If we were going to, I think let's try this. 00:53:24.079 --> 00:53:27.679 If we were going to rate this movie on a scary scale. 00:53:27.920 --> 00:53:28.719 One to five. 00:53:28.880 --> 00:53:32.559 Well, this one is weird because like sitting here asking myself, would I do this? 00:53:32.719 --> 00:53:34.320 The concept is scary. 00:53:34.719 --> 00:53:35.920 Execution was not. 00:53:36.159 --> 00:53:38.800 I think you have to dig deep into how it's made you feel. 00:53:39.119 --> 00:53:44.000 I think you have to, like, Ian is very astutely tapping into. 00:53:44.400 --> 00:53:49.760 Think more about it's

not about being like, ugh, or covering your eyes. 00:53:49.840 --> 00:53:52.320 It's like, how do you, like Ian said, feel afterwards? 00:53:52.480 --> 00:53:53.599 Does anything creep with you? 00:53:53.760 --> 00:53:55.519 Did it dig under your skin? 00:53:55.760 --> 00:54:10.880 For example, I think, even though I have a lot of criticisms of the movie, I think from a one to five scare scale, personally, was in context to all the other movies we watched, was like a five. 00:54:12.159 --> 00:54:14.320 A five from a four or five. 00:54:14.480 --> 00:54:15.760 And too late, you said five. 00:54:15.840 --> 00:54:16.079 Yeah. 00:54:16.320 --> 00:54:16.880 Carol? 00:54:19.119 --> 00:54:20.719 I'm gonna go with a six. 00:54:20.960 --> 00:54:21.360 Whoa! 00:54:21.679 --> 00:54:22.719 It's one to five. 00:54:22.960 --> 00:54:23.760 Oh, sorry. 00:54:23.920 --> 00:54:24.639 I thought it was ten. 00:54:25.039 --> 00:54:26.000 I thought it was ten. 00:54:26.559 --> 00:54:28.079 I was like, why are you saying wow? 00:54:28.159 --> 00:54:29.039 He went middle of the road. 00:54:29.280 --> 00:54:30.719 One to five, six. 00:54:31.039 --> 00:54:32.079 Okay, I'm alright. 00:54:32.159 --> 00:54:33.599 I'll go with a four. 00:54:34.639 --> 00:54:44.239 Because it's not like hearing someone walk behind me, like creepiness that I'll get later, but like I could see myself in a situation in the future. 00:54:44.400 --> 00:54:49.760 Like when I was watching this, it reminded me of the hotel that we stayed in Melnick, Bulgaria. 00:54:50.079 --> 00:54:51.119 Oh, for sure. 00:54:51.519 --> 00:54:52.079 We get it. 00:54:52.159 --> 00:54:52.719 You've traveled. 00:54:53.840 --> 00:54:55.199 No, no, listen to me. 00:54:55.519 --> 00:55:05.440 It was like it used to be a huge communist leader headquarter in this tiny little mountain town in Bulgaria, and we went down to play ping pong in their little basement. 00:55:05.679 --> 00:55:06.800 And it was dark. 00:55:07.199 --> 00:55:28.480 Just like pitch black dark, and the lights turned on when we walked in, and then all of a sudden there were mannequins and different communist uniforms, and I turned around and there are all of these like propaganda posters and like all this stuff, and I was like, freaking like pure, like pure marble white. 00:55:28.880 --> 00:55:33.920 Oh, it was grand and beautiful, and it looked like something out of a war movie. 00:55:34.159 --> 00:55:36.559 Like it was quite interesting. 00:55:36.880 --> 00:55:45.280 It was, and you could tell you were like, this is where the officers ate their dinner, and this is where like the officers stayed and they partied. 00:55:45.679 --> 00:55:47.199 Long story short. 00:55:48.480 --> 00:55:49.599 But you have time to do it. 00:55:49.840 --> 00:56:00.800 Yes, but uh when I was watching this movie, I was like, Yeah, if I were to go back and stay in that hotel right now after seeing this movie, I would be freaked out. 00:56:01.119 --> 00:56:01.840 Oh yeah. 00:56:02.079 --> 00:56:02.719 Yeah. 00:56:03.360 --> 00:56:04.239 For myself. 00:56:04.480 --> 00:56:05.280 That's a good point. 00:56:05.599 --> 00:56:10.000 Through the eyes of someone, if I were to see this for the first time, I think I would give it a four. 00:56:10.239 --> 00:56:17.360 Especially because I haven't seen this in a bit, and I saw it a few times when I was younger, and I just don't think I quite got what it was going for. 00:56:18.000 --> 00:56:24.000 So based on like how many times I've seen it, I would give it like a 3.5 or a 3 or something like that. 00:56:24.079 --> 00:56:36.400 But I think I'm gonna go with a four because watching it now and kind of being able to like understand and tap into some of the deeper things going on, I think uh it's a little more scary. 00:56:36.480 --> 00:56:40.159 Whereas when I was younger, there's layers like I was like, what's going on here? 00:56:40.320 --> 00:56:41.039 Kill 'em. 00:56:41.519 --> 00:56:42.400 A lot of layers. 00:56:42.559 --> 00:56:46.239 I want to see someone get axed like Friday the 13th. 00:56:46.719 --> 00:56:51.039 I do think this movie provides a lot of like different types of scares, though. 00:56:51.679 --> 00:56:59.119 Like there's like a haunting element, and then like for adults, you like think about like this progression into like mental instability. 00:56:59.360 --> 00:57:09.840 And also, like, I feel like it was maybe early for the whole like kind of like abuse, yeah, domestic violence, like stuff as well, which is interesting. 00:57:10.480 --> 00:57:10.800 Yeah. 00:57:10.960 --> 00:57:12.079 So like a lot of layers. 00:57:12.320 --> 00:57:13.920 And like old hotels are creepy. 00:57:14.239 --> 00:57:14.480 Yeah. 00:57:14.719 --> 00:57:16.320 I also think it's winter. 00:57:16.719 --> 00:57:28.239 It's tough because as much as we've been talking about this movie like being a progression of all of these things finally out of control, I think it's kind of clear that this isn't new. 00:57:28.320 --> 00:57:31.760 These things have kind of been happening to this family over time. 00:57:32.000 --> 00:57:32.159 Right. 00:57:32.400 --> 00:57:34.000 And they've been struggling with that. 00:57:34.239 --> 00:57:35.840 So I think that's scary as well. 00:57:36.159 --> 00:57:39.679 So we got a four from me and Carol and a five from Ian. 00:57:40.400 --> 00:57:45.039 Alright, would you give this movie a smash or a slash? 00:57:48.639 --> 00:58:05.920 This is like a I mean a smash, but like a uh dating app match that like you know go over to like three times and then never speak to again. 00:58:06.239 --> 00:58:08.159 Three times, so you'd watch it again, you'd smash again. 00:58:08.400 --> 00:58:13.280 Yeah, like when it's like a Sunday rainy night and it's like the invite's there. 00:58:14.159 --> 00:58:20.239 It is a nice like warm, cozy fire, autumnal, maybe more winter, yeah. 00:58:20.400 --> 00:58:21.599 Kind of a cozy mood. 00:58:21.920 --> 00:58:28.559 I am

embarrassed to say that the smash would happen a couple times, but then like get rid of it. 00:58:28.800 --> 00:58:30.079 Oh, don't be embarrassed. 00:58:30.320 --> 00:58:34.480 I know, but like that kind of like live your uh live your expression and your freeze. 00:58:36.000 --> 00:58:37.840 I'm just gonna wait over here until you're ready. 00:58:38.079 --> 00:58:38.960 Yeah, Ian. 00:58:39.519 --> 00:58:42.320 Um I'd give it a smash. 00:58:42.559 --> 00:58:51.360 I would say it's one of those movies I would like to see a remake of. 00:58:51.679 --> 00:58:52.639 Oh, boo. 00:58:52.800 --> 00:58:54.079 No, no, no, no, no, no, no. 00:58:54.239 --> 00:58:57.039 Yeah, I think part of the charm here is the datedness. 00:58:57.280 --> 00:58:59.760 I think the a shining two. 00:59:00.320 --> 00:59:02.639 Oh, oh, well that's what I mean. 00:59:03.119 --> 00:59:05.280 Well, you might be in luck. 00:59:05.599 --> 00:59:15.280 Uh so I think the entire value and charm of this movie is story, crumble, piece of paper, throw it over my shoulder. 00:59:15.440 --> 00:59:20.079 It's all visuals, it's all style, it's all the like Kubrickness of it. 00:59:20.239 --> 00:59:30.320 I think that a remake of this movie would be like, don't even try, people would riot, uh, someone would get murdered in real life. 00:59:30.480 --> 00:59:31.119 I know. 00:59:31.599 --> 00:59:33.119 But the Illuminati would say. 00:59:36.960 --> 00:59:38.559 NASA would be like, hey. 00:59:39.840 --> 00:59:41.840 Hey, we had to fake this once. 00:59:42.400 --> 00:59:45.679 Um, so I'm gonna definitely give it a pretty hard smash. 00:59:46.000 --> 00:59:53.119 Uh, and since Ian has already brought it up, I'm just gonna go ahead and spoil what's happening next week. 00:59:53.360 --> 00:59:56.000 We are going to uh so Dr. 00:59:56.159 --> 01:00:02.960 Sleep, you may have heard of it, or you may be like Ian wondering, ugh, where does Danny go? 01:00:03.119 --> 01:00:06.719 What does the Shining Saga have to reveal? 01:00:07.039 --> 01:00:14.079 Right now, we are releasing this episode the same weekend that, or I guess this past weekend that Dr. 01:00:14.159 --> 01:00:15.440 Sleep hit theaters. 01:00:15.599 --> 01:00:20.559 And next week we ourselves will be going to the theaters and talking about Dr. 01:00:20.719 --> 01:00:21.440 Sleep. 01:00:21.760 --> 01:00:26.000 So tune in as we watch and review the sequel. 01:00:26.239 --> 01:00:28.719 Danny's Journey Continues in Dr. 01:00:28.880 --> 01:00:29.280 Sleep. 01:00:29.440 --> 01:00:32.400 So you know what we're doing next week, and I'm pretty freaking excited. 01:00:32.480 --> 01:00:33.920 That trailer is really good. 01:00:34.239 --> 01:00:39.679 But we have to backtrack a little bit and say, what's your favorite scary movie? 01:00:40.239 --> 01:00:41.280 The Shining. 01:00:41.519 --> 01:00:42.639 Yeah, The Shining. 01:00:42.880 --> 01:00:46.800 I'm gonna keep it with Daniel Isn't Real from Brooklyn Horror Film Festival. 01:00:48.960 --> 01:00:50.480 No, I'm gonna say The Shining. 01:00:50.719 --> 01:00:52.400 Yeah, it's the Shining. 01:00:52.639 --> 01:00:54.239 Yeah! Got him. 01:00:54.639 --> 01:00:55.360 You got me. 01:00:55.599 --> 01:00:56.719 Peer Pressure. 01:00:57.280 --> 01:01:02.400 While you're waiting for us to reveal all the juicy deets on Dr. 01:01:02.559 --> 01:01:11.760 Sleep, you can go over to Apple Podcasts and leave us a rating and a review. 01:01:12.239 --> 01:01:15.440 This review is from Mickey Pfeiffer. 01:01:17.039 --> 01:01:21.679 Um Mickey says, great podcast, excited for more. 01:01:22.000 --> 01:01:26.320 So far, I've loved the mix of new horror movies and classics that the crew has covered. 01:01:26.480 --> 01:01:31.679 There is a great analysis and commentary as well as subjective input from all hosts. 01:01:32.000 --> 01:01:33.360 V subjective. 01:01:33.679 --> 01:01:36.159 Mickey loves my subjective input. 01:01:36.320 --> 01:01:37.920 That's my face. 01:01:38.400 --> 01:01:38.719 No. 01:01:39.760 --> 01:01:42.480 They said all all hosts, though, so that includes me. 01:01:42.719 --> 01:01:43.280 Aww. 01:01:43.599 --> 01:01:46.559 Until next Monday. 01:01:46.719 --> 01:01:48.559 My name is Parker Heron. 01:01:48.639 --> 01:01:54.719 You can find me on Instagram and Twitter, and letterboxed at Parker Del Rey. 01:01:55.280 --> 01:01:56.559 My name is Caroline. 01:01:56.639 --> 01:01:59.920 You can find me on Instagram at Carol Manifesto. 01:02:00.960 --> 01:02:02.480 And my name is Ian Hoyt. 01:02:02.800 --> 01:02:07.039 You can find me on YouTube at Ian Hoyt. 01:02:07.440 --> 01:02:23.280 And check out the whole crew on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, at ScarymoviePod, and find some flamin' hot reviews at ScarymoviePod.com slash reviews. 01:02:23.599 --> 01:02:24.880 Or just go to the website. 01:02:24.960 --> 01:02:26.880 I don't know why I specified reviews. 01:02:27.039 --> 01:02:29.840 Reviews, calendar, all sorts of stuff. 01:02:30.159 --> 01:02:37.840 You can send us your thoughts, feedback, requests, whatever your heart desired desires at Scarymoviepod at gmail.com. 01:02:39.760 --> 01:02:41.119 Danny is in here, Mrs. 01:02:41.360 --> 01:02:41.840 George. 01:02:43.199 --> 01:02:45.039 Here's Danny