النص الكامل لحلقة The Techno Optimist: Rethinking fashion through innovation

didn't invent the phrase, but have you met any other people that describe themselves in the same way? 00:06:14.089 --> 00:06:16.250 Not that I know of, no. 00:06:16.730 --> 00:06:32.969 I think it's uh it's yeah, it's something that's that I came across a while ago, and I've been using it more and more, and I can also feel it really yeah, resonates with people, and it's it also because it's quite difficult to describe what I actually do. 00:06:33.129 --> 00:06:39.209 Even my my boyfriend cannot explain what I do because we do so many different things. 00:06:39.529 --> 00:06:47.209 Um but we always use different formats, different ways of of implementing this true belief, I would say. 00:06:47.370 --> 00:06:52.889 So this is yeah, it's more this yeah, this core message that I want to get across. 00:06:52.969 --> 00:07:09.209 And then I use a lot of different projects and and formats to uh yeah, to actually uh make it happen, or yeah, have other people uh look at things the way I look at them, maybe, and and try to share this uh enthusiasm uh for change. 00:07:09.449 --> 00:07:10.089 I think it's great. 00:07:10.250 --> 00:07:15.290 I think it's it's a really lovely shorthand for something that's actually quite complicated. 00:07:15.529 --> 00:07:21.449 And that again, that that's something that really appeals to us because that that's what we try and do a lot of the time for people as well. 00:07:21.769 --> 00:07:26.250 So you've worked across brands, institutions, networks, and advisory roles. 00:07:26.410 --> 00:07:29.370 So you've seen the system from multiple angles. 00:07:29.610 --> 00:07:34.569 So let's zoom out a little bit and talk about machine and the bigger mission behind it. 00:07:34.810 --> 00:07:40.889 So, for anyone new to machine, how would you describe what you do and the change that you're trying to make happen? 00:07:41.209 --> 00:07:48.889 Uh, I think also uh one of our core baselines is pushing buttons and boundaries and challenging the status quo. 00:07:49.050 --> 00:08:01.129 So it's it's really looking at the sector as we know it today and see where we can create change uh to push more purpose, to push uh a positive impact. 00:08:01.689 --> 00:08:07.129 Um, for me, specifically on technology and innovation, I focus on two areas. 00:08:07.209 --> 00:08:13.769 So, on one, where can it accelerate sustainability, and the other one is where can it make creativity flourish? 00:08:14.089 --> 00:08:21.129 Because I think also technology is giving us uh tools and opportunities to be more creative in so many ways. 00:08:21.290 --> 00:08:27.290 Um, so these are like two big areas that I uh I usually uh work on. 00:08:27.449 --> 00:08:30.649 Um, and what we actually do is quite uh diverse. 00:08:30.730 --> 00:08:44.170 So indeed we do consultancy, we work with different uh companies and brands, but we also work a lot with institutions, with uh governments, with fashion councils, fashion weeks, how to bring this topic alive. 00:08:44.569 --> 00:09:10.970 Um, so we always like to say like we want to inspire people, we want to spark conversations, and for that, we also um like to set up certain ecosystems to connect people in a very personal way, but also to create opportunities so people can actually meet each other, see each other's work, um learn more about what's happening out there in a very relevant and uh and specific way, I would say. 00:09:11.210 --> 00:09:19.769 And when you look at the industry today, what do you see as the biggest barriers stopping fashion from moving faster on sustainability? 00:09:20.089 --> 00:09:22.730 I think it's the the biggest challenge. 00:09:22.809 --> 00:09:32.490 I think it's it's a movement that we see already for for many years is the the speed and the quantity of consumerism. 00:09:32.730 --> 00:09:36.490 Everybody wants something new, everybody wants something different. 00:09:36.730 --> 00:09:45.450 Um, the value of of certain things, the value of creativity, but also the value of quality sometimes is yeah, is getting lost. 00:09:45.849 --> 00:09:56.890 When I I I tell my kids, for example, if you can buy uh some piece of clothing that that costs less than than a plate of spaghetti, something is wrong, you know. 00:09:57.049 --> 00:10:22.170 So this, yeah, I think it's a general movement that has made it quite difficult, both for the consumer, but of course also for brands and and people to create this offering that is on one hand, yeah, it needs to be fast and quick and consumed in a way, and on the other hand, how to create love brands and and build these stories. 00:10:22.329 --> 00:10:33.930 And there's so much noise also, um, cutting through the noise, getting these stories um yeah, right and and authentic. 00:10:34.170 --> 00:10:42.569 Um it also creates a lot of opportunities, but I think this is also yeah, probably one of the barriers to actually create this uh this movement. 00:10:42.730 --> 00:10:47.289 And then lastly, I think it's um today, even more. 00:10:47.450 --> 00:10:51.049 I feel like sustainability was never a hype. 00:10:51.130 --> 00:11:11.849 I hope it was never um a momentum, but at the same time, I feel that today it's becoming even more and more difficult to communicate about it and get across because for the last decade maybe it was something we felt everybody found very uh relevant and interested and wanted to know more about. 00:11:12.009 --> 00:11:27.210 And I feel that it's also um yeah, becoming more challenging to yeah, to keep it on the agenda, to keep it relevant, to keep it um yeah, on top of the of the communication uh pillars, I would say. 00:11:27.529 --> 00:11:46.410 That's interesting, and that that brings me nicely on to what I was going to talk about next, and and that was about how important is storytelling and communication in accelerating change, and what's what's maybe missing from how the industry typically talks about sustainability. 00:11:46.809 --> 00:12:07.769 Yeah, I

think in the end, is the same why I started in fashion is fashion has a certain way of giving people an identity, of adding to a dream, adding to emotion, uh, creating a certain yeah, atmosphere, or people are not buying clothes because they are naked or the closet is empty. 00:12:07.849 --> 00:12:13.529 No, they want to buy into a moment, they want to uh feel differently. 00:12:13.769 --> 00:12:27.769 It's and and I think this is yeah, this has sometimes yeah, get lost uh in a way because it's there is an over-offering, and and sometimes people do not know anymore like where to choose from. 00:12:28.089 --> 00:12:33.529 Um so storytelling is indeed a way to connect to this consumer even more. 00:12:33.609 --> 00:12:56.569 And and I think the whole concept of love brands is becoming even more and more important, of yeah, of truly connecting with um not only with the garment itself, but with yeah the identity, the story, the the values of the brands that um yeah, that belong or or that get across uh with the garments uh itself, I would say. 00:12:56.890 --> 00:13:30.569 Yeah, I mean, going back to what you were saying about what people expect now in terms of consumerism and speed and cost, the story is really important because the story is the thing which will maybe change someone's perspective and make them understand why things have to cost a certain amount and what what the expectations are for that and care enough to want to take that choice rather than what might seem like the easy choice, which is something which is fast and available and and and cheap, I guess. 00:13:30.970 --> 00:13:31.690 Absolutely. 00:13:31.849 --> 00:13:41.130 Yeah, and I think there are also so many tools and opportunities today to actually do this enriched storytelling, I would say. 00:13:41.450 --> 00:14:18.410 Um, so of course, you have all kinds of uh social media and and the more traditional communication channels, but when I think also of innovations such as uh AR or even the digital product passports, uh connected products, um all these different kinds of innovations that can create new opportunities to enrich the storytelling and to create a better connection with the end consumer is a really exciting time, I think, to see like how can you get across to all your consumers in these different ways. 00:14:18.650 --> 00:14:26.009 But at the same time, be really authentic about it and have a very strong message and tone of voice. 00:14:26.089 --> 00:14:36.809 And I mean, that's what we love so much about Blast is that yeah, to actually get across a certain message, I think this is this is very, very important and very relevant uh today. 00:14:36.970 --> 00:14:40.329 And the consumer of today is also very well informed. 00:14:40.490 --> 00:14:53.049 So if it's not authentic, if it's not well designed, I think they see through the fog, I would say, if it's if it's not not authentic enough to really believe it. 00:14:53.289 --> 00:15:02.890 Yeah, and I think also picking up on what you said about innovations like the digital passport, a lot of people don't necessarily see that as traditional communication. 00:15:02.970 --> 00:15:10.809 But I think I think from our point of view, uh innovations like that um quite often can be quite dry and cold. 00:15:10.970 --> 00:15:21.289 And so storytelling is really important to make them culturally relevant and emotive and you know make make people care on a personal level. 00:15:21.529 --> 00:15:30.410 I think that's where we see a big role for communication because you can understand an idea and and feel nothing about it. 00:15:30.650 --> 00:15:34.650 Um you can follow the logic and still not care where it's going. 00:15:35.049 --> 00:15:44.170 Um especially maybe when the thing that you're you're building is is unfinished or technical or or still evolving, a bit like turbo. 00:15:44.490 --> 00:15:49.369 If people can't experience in some form, they won't believe in it early enough to engage with it. 00:15:49.450 --> 00:15:53.930 And without belief in something, then momentum quite often stalls. 00:15:54.089 --> 00:16:04.490 So design's job for us in kind of innovation um is not just to simplify the complexity, but to make it feel real enough to matter to people. 00:16:04.809 --> 00:16:05.609 Yeah, absolutely. 00:16:05.690 --> 00:16:18.170 And it's also indeed, as you say, technology is only a tool, uh, and and in the end, it's to get a certain message across and uh and to simplify it and to not make it more complicated than necessary. 00:16:18.809 --> 00:16:33.130 Um, it's very, very important because uh it's not by using uh buzzwords or or making things very complicated to look smarter or or whatever, is uh it's not what what we prefer at machine. 00:16:33.210 --> 00:16:50.250 We always try to yeah trickle it down into very understandable and very engaging uh ways of communicating and and transferring or enthusiasm because that's that's also where people are more connected and also start the conversations better, I would say. 00:16:50.569 --> 00:16:56.970 Let's talk a little bit about credibility because vision is one thing, but trust is another. 00:16:57.210 --> 00:17:06.970 So, how do you communicate progress without tipping into greenwashing, um, especially when solutions and data are still evolving? 00:17:07.289 --> 00:17:35.769 Yeah, I think that's that's always a challenge because, on one hand, specifically when you work in in innovation, you want to share on what's new, what are the possibilities, and at the same time, you need to be transparent that sometimes things are still in the making, uh, the the famous uh curve, when are innovations in a hype cycle, where are they in the true of uh disillusionment and and getting ready for mainstream? 00:17:36.009 --> 00:17:45.690 I think I learned a lot because I, as I said, I was very active in the in the whole era of Web3, uh, innovation on digital fashion, virtual fashion. 00:17:45.769 --> 00:17:52.730 So I've

seen it firsthand, like when are things moving fast, when are there certain hypes, when is it an innovation? 00:17:52.890 --> 00:17:59.130 Sometimes you also need to admit that certain implications were too soon or not ready or not the right uh fit. 00:17:59.289 --> 00:18:20.570 But on the other hand, what I always believe is that um I like to look at the mechanic of certain things, on the infrastructure behind it, what is this innovation, for example, actually trying to change, and then see if can we actually see a better fit or a better implementation. 00:18:20.730 --> 00:18:30.809 So, for example, looking back at Web3 and what blockchain was bringing as an infrastructure of trust, I still see opportunities today. 00:18:30.890 --> 00:18:36.890 It did not become the infrastructure for the creator economy as I saw it at that time. 00:18:37.289 --> 00:19:02.490 But now it has created for me, for example, uh a lot of inspiration and foundation for how I look at digital product passports today, because it can definitely enhance in a different way the same um bridge to a rich storytelling, to using this infrastructure to engage with people, but also to get more trusted and transparent uh in certain ways. 00:19:02.730 --> 00:19:05.370 And you have that with all kinds of technologies. 00:19:05.529 --> 00:19:20.250 Um, I think to communicate about it very openly is always uh important, not to sugarcoat it or, but on the other hand, yeah, to be inspirational, you also need to highlight these novelties. 00:19:20.490 --> 00:19:25.690 So I I feel uh find this balance is not always easy. 00:19:25.850 --> 00:19:31.210 Um again, transparent communication about it is is the most important, I think. 00:19:31.370 --> 00:19:38.330 And then it's also up to the to the listener or the brands that are going to implement these uh technologies. 00:19:38.490 --> 00:19:49.210 It's also up to them um to do their own research um and and to see is it a match for me, is it a match for my company, is it a match for my strategy? 00:19:49.450 --> 00:20:01.769 Because this is indeed also one of the of the key messages at uh at Turbo is to yeah, to do a curated, very strategic selection of the technology that is relevant for you and your company. 00:20:01.930 --> 00:20:11.130 And I think it's up to me to engage with the possibilities, the opportunities, and to showcase what are the possibilities. 00:20:11.450 --> 00:20:19.130 But then it's also, and that's indeed also something we we do sometimes together with the companies, but then you need to make the strategic decision. 00:20:19.289 --> 00:20:20.730 Is this relevant for me? 00:20:20.970 --> 00:20:25.210 But if you are not aware that it exists, you cannot make these kind of decisions. 00:20:25.370 --> 00:20:32.170 So for me, number one, I I coming back to techno-optimism, it's not about that. 00:20:32.410 --> 00:20:39.930 I want to make sure that everybody uses all the technology that is out there, but I want people to know it

exists. 00:20:40.170 --> 00:20:44.650 Um, because don't forget, our sector is very, very conservative. 00:20:44.809 --> 00:20:46.730 They are not moving very fast. 00:20:46.890 --> 00:20:54.570 So there I see it's it's important that they know that things are moving and there are certain opportunities out there to create change. 00:20:54.809 --> 00:21:02.250 But of course, then the next step is to yeah to make the wise decisions and and start implementing them uh correctly. 00:21:02.570 --> 00:21:07.690 Let's bring that thinking into something concrete and talk about turbo now. 00:21:08.170 --> 00:21:18.009 Uh so tell tell me what sparked the idea for turbo and what particular gap um were you trying to fill with it? 00:21:18.410 --> 00:21:25.370 Um so, first of all, I would like to say Turbo is a sandbox, which is uh a nice way of saying we don't know yet. 00:21:25.610 --> 00:21:27.289 For us, it's a playground. 00:21:27.690 --> 00:21:35.370 Um we have been working a lot on innovation, on sustainability, we see a lot of opportunities. 00:21:35.529 --> 00:21:43.289 Um, but we also like to actually work on these innovations, to implement them, to test them. 00:21:43.769 --> 00:21:48.570 Um so not only talking, but also walking the talk, I would say. 00:21:48.730 --> 00:22:06.809 So for us, Turbo has become um this playground, the sandbox to actually uh implement some innovations, but above all, it's also a manifesto, I would say, um, a clear message, uh maybe an accelerator to create change. 00:22:07.370 --> 00:22:13.210 So my main message now is to indeed to stack technology. 00:22:13.289 --> 00:22:21.130 How can you implement technology at best um to accelerate sustainability, to um make creativity flourish? 00:22:21.289 --> 00:22:24.890 But how can I do it in a very strategic way? 00:22:25.289 --> 00:22:34.410 How can technology enhance my company strategy, my communication strategy, my sustainability goals? 00:22:34.650 --> 00:22:56.410 Um, because I truly believe that implementing Technology at best and not one on the left and do a pilot on the right and do an experiment here and there, but to yeah, to curate um your own toolbox where one technology gives certain output and it becomes the input of the next. 00:22:56.809 --> 00:23:02.809 And then in this way you get even like a compound result, like one plus one becomes three. 00:23:02.890 --> 00:23:14.330 So it's becoming bigger, more relevant, um, a better system, creating this tech infrastructure to support your uh your company at best. 00:23:14.970 --> 00:23:16.809 It's a complex thing to explain. 00:23:16.890 --> 00:23:20.570 I'm sure you found that over the time that you've been doing it. 00:23:20.809 --> 00:23:26.330 So for people that are new to this, in simple terms, how would you describe it? 00:23:26.809 --> 00:23:31.289 You said it's a sandbox project, but how does it kind of manifest itself? 00:23:31.610 --> 00:23:40.809 Yeah, so at this moment, a little bit similar to what we do at Machine in in general, but this is then specifically more focused on uh innovation and technology. 00:23:41.049 --> 00:23:49.529 So for now, it's this main key message and even manifesto, as I just mentioned, but then we are uh implementing it in different ways. 00:23:49.690 --> 00:23:59.769 So for now, uh for example, uh, we have collaborated with Blast in developing not only the visual identity, but also to translate it into a keynote presentation. 00:23:59.930 --> 00:24:18.570 And this keynote presentation is of course uh engaging people uh with the uh messaging behind it, but it's also uh already the first uh network collaboration between different partners in implementing certain technologies that we are actually showcasing. 00:24:18.730 --> 00:24:28.650 So, for this, I have chosen not to set up a completely new brand because we do not want to push more products out there uh if if it's not necessary. 00:24:28.890 --> 00:24:36.970 So I have chosen to work with um a 90s uh iconic Belgian brand that does not exist anymore. 00:24:37.130 --> 00:24:38.970 It's called uh Zeno and Judy. 00:24:39.130 --> 00:24:47.450 They were known for fantastic uh leather jackets in this specific Y2K uh I would say uh look and feel. 00:24:47.769 --> 00:25:06.490 Um, and we have been implementing um different technologies such as 3D creation, digital product passport, virtual try-ons, uh, digital search uh on pre-loft, um, communication and storytelling. 00:25:06.650 --> 00:25:16.090 So all these different types of innovation we have implemented uh specifically on this um 90s collection. 00:25:16.330 --> 00:25:40.650 Because I truly believe that if you we see very often that there are, for example, trend watchers that do presentations with all the newest innovations, but by implementing them on one specific collection and then also connecting the different inputs and outputs of these technologies suddenly make it very understandable what it could mean for your own collection. 00:25:40.809 --> 00:25:53.130 Because you could actually see in the presentation, for example, we are implementing it on one specific red letter jacket, and you see this red leather jacket implemented in in all these different technologies. 00:25:53.210 --> 00:26:06.170 And in the end, the you you see the storytelling of the red letter jacket through these different technologies coming alive and and getting even uh this bigger results uh towards the end of the presentation. 00:26:06.410 --> 00:26:32.250 So, indeed, today it's um it has the shape of a keynote, uh, but I definitely see it as an accelerator of the network of different uh innovators, different technology providers, but also as a starting point for a community where we uh inspire, where we inform uh about innovation and technology specifically to uh to accelerate sustainability and circularity? 00:26:32.730 --> 00:26:38.730 One of the things that we worked with you on was actually showing that as a digital platform. 00:26:38.970

--> 00:26:52.170 So, you know, with a UI where it's somewhere that people can come and explore and find technologies and see practical examples and connect with other people. 00:26:52.410 --> 00:26:57.130 Is that still how you see it manifesting in the future? 00:26:57.450 --> 00:27:01.130 It's definitely an option we are still uh looking at. 00:27:01.289 --> 00:27:07.529 I think in general at Machine, we always do uh different uh types of projects. 00:27:07.610 --> 00:27:21.690 Uh so we have uh projects that are purely uh assignments, collaborations, uh projects that come on our path, and then we have our own projects that we develop because we think there is a need uh for them. 00:27:22.090 --> 00:27:26.490 Um so this is definitely one of these projects that is growing over time. 00:27:26.650 --> 00:27:37.370 So um it is something that is um yeah, that is taking uh the energy and and uh resources that we need to make it uh to make it happen. 00:27:37.610 --> 00:27:52.250 Um, but for example, previously we have been uh setting up an AI chatbot called uh Josie, uh, which is like uh your go-to person to um to check your communication and avoid greenwashing. 00:27:52.410 --> 00:27:57.289 So this is a project we have developed also from A to Z from uh from Machine Bottom Up. 00:27:57.370 --> 00:28:06.250 Uh and I think with Turbo we have a similar approach, um, with the difference that we want to create bridges to other opportunities. 00:28:06.410 --> 00:28:11.450 So bring more keynotes, but also bring it in different ways to a bigger audience. 00:28:11.610 --> 00:28:19.690 And yes, I think uh a platform could definitely uh help uh getting a bigger reach and uh and transmit the message. 00:28:20.090 --> 00:28:38.809 And from a purely personal perspective, what did creating a brand, messaging, a visual presence, and the prototype do for you in terms of enabling people to understand uh the project's the credibility and emotional connection to it? 00:28:38.970 --> 00:28:44.170 For instance, when you presented it at Berlin Fashion Week, how beneficial was that? 00:28:44.410 --> 00:28:53.850 Yeah, indeed, I think the first presentation we did was at Metamorphosis, the Dialogues of Change, an initiative from uh Fashion Council Germany and eBay. 00:28:54.170 --> 00:29:04.009 Um, it was an audience that is uh again very mixed of uh fashion brands, fashion entrepreneurs, designers, people working in the in the fashion system at large. 00:29:04.170 --> 00:29:11.769 And then it's always very important to get your message across in a very understandable way, but also in a very engaging way. 00:29:11.930 --> 00:29:19.049 And that's why the visual identity is definitely a very uh big aspect also of the messaging. 00:29:19.210 --> 00:29:25.210 So you need to uh bring this in a very engaging way, but also in a very understandable way. 00:29:25.529 --> 00:29:47.210 And what I liked so much about the presentation and also the tangible physical uh presentation we uh collaborated on is that it not only um supports the manifesto and the message behind it, but also actually translated it into how we visually got the message across. 00:29:47.450 --> 00:29:57.930 Um so, for example, the very dynamic uh identity um completely represents the the concept of a sandbox. 00:29:58.009 --> 00:30:11.690 It is um it is uh not only reflecting innovation and implementing the visual aspects, but also yeah, implementing technology with purpose uh in the identity itself. 00:30:11.930 --> 00:30:40.970 And then also, of course, from a more practical uh perspective, I really liked it a lot that we have been building this presentation in a way where um I can still be proactive, adapt certain parts of the presentation by adding in uh new partnerships, by adding new technologies and innovations, uh, but at the same time keep uh emphasizing on the core message, uh, which was designed uh so nicely and very understandably. 00:30:41.210 --> 00:31:03.529 So, yeah, this collaboration has brought um, I think a lot of uh insights on how to get um the message across, not purely by choosing nice colors or a good font, but also to yeah, how to build up the momentum of the messaging, how to yeah, use all the design tools as well to to support the the main message. 00:31:03.690 --> 00:31:06.809 Uh so this is very nice uh to understand that part. 00:31:07.210 --> 00:31:08.250 I think there's three things there. 00:31:08.330 --> 00:31:21.210 There's the understanding because it it's quite difficult to talk about, like you say, a sandbox project that's so experimental in a way that people can get their heads around without actually making it visual. 00:31:21.370 --> 00:31:35.850 So there's that kind of understanding, and then there's making it tangible, um, and then there's a kind of emotional side of it, which is getting people behind it and uh making people feel that it's real and that it's something that they want to be involved in as well. 00:31:36.090 --> 00:31:40.809 So, what do you think needs to happen to take Turbo to the next level? 00:31:40.970 --> 00:31:42.650 What's what's next for it? 00:31:43.130 --> 00:31:49.210 Uh on the short term, uh it's definitely uh spreading the you know optimism even more. 00:31:49.370 --> 00:32:05.130 So bringing the presentation and and the message um to different places, to different platforms, um, to all the people listening here that are setting up different events uh or opportunities, very welcome to collaborate on that. 00:32:05.289 --> 00:32:09.130 I think this is this is mainly um goal number one. 00:32:09.370 --> 00:32:27.529 And then secondly, I think we have started a very nice collaboration with some people who have this same way of looking at things, of creating change in our sector, creating a sector with more purpose and bring sustainability in a very tangible uh way. 00:32:28.170 --> 00:32:40.490 So I think it's also nice to see uh how we can collaborate between the different partners, bring

on board even more uh partners or solutions um to create this change. 00:32:40.570 --> 00:32:46.730 And then looking into that, like what is the next format um that that would be most relevant? 00:32:46.970 --> 00:32:48.410 Is it an online platform? 00:32:48.570 --> 00:32:51.610 Is it going to be offline uh activations as well? 00:32:51.769 --> 00:32:54.730 Yeah, as we said, it's a sandbox, so it's in the making. 00:32:54.809 --> 00:33:01.289 And every time we see opportunities to see this as a next next goal, I think we uh we should dive into that. 00:33:01.450 --> 00:33:05.370 Um presumably it needs somewhere along the line it needs some investment. 00:33:05.450 --> 00:33:11.450 So if do you want to make this a call out to in investors that are listening to uh to get in touch? 00:33:11.850 --> 00:33:32.250 Yes, I think uh what's what we have seen very often at at machine is indeed you always need budget and investors to work with certain things, but on the other hand, I think it's also uh important to to align very well on on what is the the exact goal and what do you want to achieve? 00:33:32.490 --> 00:33:36.090 And I think that's that's something we're still figuring out. 00:33:36.250 --> 00:33:40.809 Like what do we actually uh want to build? 00:33:40.970 --> 00:33:52.090 And does it need certain investments uh in a monetary way, or does it need mainly investment from people that align on the belief and and want to create this uh this change? 00:33:52.250 --> 00:33:52.490 Yeah. 00:33:52.890 --> 00:33:53.210 Sure. 00:33:53.289 --> 00:34:07.690 Um and let's zoom out again from Turbo um because many of our listeners are founders or leaders outside fashion, um, and the same principles apply across green tech and sustainability innovation more broadly. 00:34:07.850 --> 00:34:15.369 Um, so from your perspective, what helps innovation move from interesting to adopted? 00:34:15.769 --> 00:34:18.090 Change management, I would say. 00:34:18.329 --> 00:34:40.409 I think it's very important to have a good communication inside uh different part departments inside a company because we see that a lot of uh innovation, for example, is detected by certain innovation managers, sustainability managers, uh sometimes the CEOs if they are engaged as well. 00:34:40.650 --> 00:34:48.570 But very often to actually create change, you need to implement all the different departments inside a company. 00:34:49.050 --> 00:34:59.450 Um, when I have been uh mentoring so many companies in the past, I always describe like people do underestimate how complicated a fashion company is. 00:35:00.090 --> 00:35:18.250 Um, there are so many different aspects, and I say like it's it's like a little machine on its own with so many different buttons, and it's not only the style and the fit and the color and the price, but also is it delivered on time with the right communication in the right setting, etc. 00:35:18.409 --> 00:35:55.530 So that there are so many different aspects that

define if a fashion company is actually successful, and bringing innovation and novelty and specifically to create purpose and impact on a sustainability level, we need so much more than just a sustainability manager with a dedicated goal and budget doing novelties and doing specific activations, but to actually get it across the complete companies, redefine what we are doing, looking at it from a helicopter perspective, I would say. 00:35:55.769 --> 00:36:03.369 And for that, I think the yeah, the biggest change is to create these conversations between departments. 00:36:03.610 --> 00:36:14.170 Change management starts very often with with people that understand with people who believe in this change and yeah, and want to actually make it happen. 00:36:14.329 --> 00:36:17.690 So that that would be my main advice. 00:36:17.769 --> 00:36:20.889 And then secondly, listen to your younger employees. 00:36:21.130 --> 00:36:31.369 They are the ones that are very often the ones with true values when it comes to creating change, creating uh better impact. 00:36:31.849 --> 00:36:39.210 Very often they're also open for innovation, they are digital natives, they have new ideas, fresh ideas. 00:36:39.450 --> 00:36:49.690 Uh, and I think there's a lot of value in listening to them, engaging uh conversations with the younger people in your uh organizations. 00:36:49.929 --> 00:37:00.010 So that has for me already uh proven a lot of times to be very fruitful and very interesting and relevant uh for the people in the different uh stages. 00:37:00.409 --> 00:37:02.490 Yeah, that that's a great piece of advice. 00:37:02.650 --> 00:37:05.769 Um you you talk a lot about networks. 00:37:06.570 --> 00:37:10.730 So, how important is collaboration in making progress? 00:37:10.809 --> 00:37:13.610 And what does good collaboration look like in in practice? 00:37:13.929 --> 00:37:18.090 Yeah, I think networking is a little bit my my second nature. 00:37:18.250 --> 00:37:22.970 I don't do it on purpose, but I have been doing it uh already for so many years. 00:37:23.130 --> 00:37:44.010 And and it's probably because I, as you as you mentioned, uh my enthusiasm is is well, but it's also because I I'm also very curious uh from nature and I always I'm always very interested in what other people are doing and and how they are actually making their own changes and doing their own uh way of things. 00:37:44.250 --> 00:37:56.090 And by learning what other people are doing, you sometimes also learn about what they actually need or what they are up to, or what are the opportunities they can bring. 00:37:56.170 --> 00:38:13.530 And then sometimes I talk to somebody else and I see there is a certain connection, and then I love to create these bridges because I truly believe that human connection and and where people are pushing certain things, if you can do it together, it's yeah, it's becoming much bigger and faster. 00:38:13.690 --> 00:38:21.769 So the one plus one is three principle and make the network work are like two of my mantras already for many years. 00:38:22.010 --> 00:38:28.889 Um, and these collaborations, I think very often they must start with a common goal. 00:38:29.130 --> 00:38:38.809 Also, I think very often you can be very honest and open that there is a personal goal in this collaboration. 00:38:38.970 --> 00:38:46.329 You will just you just need to align how to make things work, then it that it will benefit everybody on board. 00:38:46.490 --> 00:38:53.450 And if if you can discuss this openly and align on this, then the collaboration becomes even more important. 00:38:53.690 --> 00:39:11.690 Collaborations can have so many different uh shapes and formats, but if we see, for example, two different fashion brands collaborate, very often is because one has a certain uh community and the other one has the budget, for example, or they align on certain values or whatever. 00:39:11.849 --> 00:39:14.090 So there is always a common goal. 00:39:14.250 --> 00:39:26.010 And if this is well aligned and they are transparent about it and it's an authentic common goal, I think this is yeah, the most fruitful uh collaboration you can have. 00:39:26.409 --> 00:39:27.610 I completely agree. 00:39:27.769 --> 00:39:41.369 Um, and if and if you could if you could reshape the narrative more broadly, if you could change one thing about how sustainability is communicated across industries, what what would that be? 00:39:41.690 --> 00:40:00.490 I remember very well I was at uh at the global fashion summits many, many years ago, and Vanessa Friedman was doing uh a keynote on sustainability and the messaging, and she said at that time already, like we need to be able to communicate in a more sexy way. 00:40:00.730 --> 00:40:07.610 And I think even all these years later, it still stands, it's still a big challenge. 00:40:07.929 --> 00:40:16.889 People go to fashion, as I mentioned earlier, for for identity, for the dream, for what it can, yeah, what it can become. 00:40:17.450 --> 00:40:22.970 Um and I think sustainability should should be part of that messaging. 00:40:23.130 --> 00:40:37.369 It should be it should be aspiring, it should be inspirational, it should be fun, it should be something that maybe makes you think or or laugh or be inspired uh differently. 00:40:37.610 --> 00:41:10.170 Um I think this is for me personally, it has much more effect if you can get this message across in this way than instead of all the, although it's important to have a awareness of of the the bad impact, but by communicating the amount of yeah of negative impacts that that we are causing is not going to change consumer behavior enough that we have seen the last years. 00:41:10.329 --> 00:41:20.809 So I do think we need to communicate in a positive and engaging way and turn people around in yeah, in making thoughtful positive decisions. 00:41:21.050 --> 00:41:26.650 So, yeah, make it more sexy is is definitely uh a good way forward, I

would say. 00:41:27.289 --> 00:41:31.210 We'll uh we'll take on that mantra and we'll we'll we'll do our best. 00:41:32.970 --> 00:41:48.490 Um so before we before we finish, um just like to ask you what what excites you most about what's coming next for machine, uh for for turbo or for the the wider sustainability movement? 00:41:48.889 --> 00:41:52.090 Um there are so many different things. 00:41:52.329 --> 00:42:04.090 Um what excites me most is we are always most happy with a project if we can actually see the change happening. 00:42:04.250 --> 00:42:16.570 For example, when I was presenting Turbo in a room full of people in Berlin Fashion Week, and then we get messages afterwards of people coming up to us afterwards saying, like, wow, that was really inspiring. 00:42:16.730 --> 00:42:19.530 This was really something that I needed to hear. 00:42:19.769 --> 00:42:23.369 This is what gives us the drive to move forward. 00:42:23.610 --> 00:42:32.490 So we are definitely looking forward to yeah, creating more uh moments of these and and create uh a bigger uh impact. 00:42:33.130 --> 00:42:38.730 Um Yasmin is already uh also collaborating a lot with uh younger generations. 00:42:39.050 --> 00:42:58.170 Um I'm also setting up uh more programs uh for teenagers later this year, and I think this is also very exciting to yeah, to bring people on board with a positive messaging uh in the early years when when they are maybe still very receptive in in thinking differently. 00:42:58.250 --> 00:43:00.490 Um, so this is very exciting. 00:43:00.809 --> 00:43:09.130 And then on the other hand, yeah, I'm really looking forward to what technology and innovation are bringing uh in opportunities. 00:43:09.210 --> 00:43:24.409 Um I have been working on hackathons for a fashion museum, I've been working on digital and and holographic fashion shows and all these opportunities to yeah, to engage with fashion in a in a in a different way. 00:43:24.730 --> 00:43:27.210 Um, yeah, it's very exciting to look forward. 00:43:27.769 --> 00:43:31.929 I knew that you'd have plenty to be enthusiastic about, without doubt. 00:43:32.090 --> 00:43:45.130 Um, so lastly, I'd like to wrap up with a big and quite difficult question and ask if you could achieve one major sustainability breakthrough in the next decade, what would it be? 00:43:45.530 --> 00:44:01.849 Personally, because it's my very specific dada, and I know um not everybody will like it, but I do think we will need to produce less, we will need to make better choices. 00:44:02.090 --> 00:44:22.970 And for me personally, for example, having digital or virtual versions of fashion that can still give people this way of expressing identity and engaging with the fun and nice part of what fashion stands for, instead of producing too many clothes. 00:44:23.130 --> 00:44:28.970 I think this this definitely could be um a better way forward. 00:44:29.130 --> 00:44:37.450 Um, it's completely against uh economic growth, but also degrowth uh should be on the table. 00:44:37.929 --> 00:44:56.010 Um, and I do believe, again, my optimistic view, maybe uh naive, maybe, but I do think there are other ways that we can engage with fashion and what it stands for without pushing garments at the speed and quantity we are doing today. 00:44:56.250 --> 00:45:01.289 So if I can dream, this would definitely be one of the solutions. 00:45:01.369 --> 00:45:01.610 Yeah. 00:45:01.929 --> 00:45:03.210 You have to have a dream. 00:45:03.450 --> 00:45:04.409 Absolutely. 00:45:04.730 --> 00:45:07.210 And thank you for joining us today. 00:45:07.369 --> 00:45:13.210 What I've loved about this conversation is that it reminds us that innovation alone isn't enough. 00:45:13.369 --> 00:45:22.250 Um, it's about networks, it's about connection, about clarity and communication that that turn that that possibility into progress. 00:45:22.650 --> 00:45:24.409 So um thanks for joining us. 00:45:24.490 --> 00:45:35.450 And we look forward to seeing what impact machine and turbo and any other innovations that you put into the world, what impact they have on the planet in the future. 00:45:35.610 --> 00:45:36.409 So thank you. 00:45:36.730 --> 00:45:44.409 No, thank you for having me and for the fantastic collaboration already up till now and for everything the future uh brings to us. 00:45:44.730 --> 00:45:45.690 Thank you so much, Colin.