النص الكامل لحلقة From Basketball, Etc. — The Secret Life of NBA Mascots

he became this like leftist icon. I've interviewed famous people and whatnot, but this was a whole other level of celebrity. People literally bowed down to him like he was a god. And he's this terrifying orange blob. And you'd think that maybe he'd scare children, but everybody just fell in love with him. 00:03:58 Speaker 1: You told me that you were considering hiring a mascot to come to your wedding and that you didn't end up doing it and that it's a huge regret for you. Yes. 00:04:09 Speaker 2: My husband and I got married in 2023, and we had fairly recently moved to the Portland, Oregon area. And we looked into hiring Blaze, who is one of the mascots for the Portland Trailblazers, to attend our wedding. And we didn't end up doing it because planning a wedding is really hectic for a lot of reasons. But it's a huge regret of ours. And I actually recorded a conversation with my husband Hudson about this. 00:04:36 Speaker 1: Like without joking at all, man, I wish I had. That blazed the trail cat. 00:04:40 Speaker 3: It'd been my wedding. 00:04:42 Speaker 1: It's like one of the. 00:04:44 Speaker 3: It's one of my key regrets about the entire affair. 00:04:46 Speaker 2: And, you know, I've obviously in my life as a reporter now spent extensive time with mascots. And I don't think there's anything else I've reported on that makes me like it more. 00:05:00 Speaker 3: The more you look into it. 00:05:01 Speaker 1: The more I look into it. Right. Usually it's the opposite. 00:05:04 Speaker 2: On several occasions, I've really liked something, done a reported feature about it, and then never revisited it again. 00:05:10 Speaker 1: Yeah, right. 00:05:11 Speaker 2: But with mascots, it's like the more I learn about them and see what it's like behind the scenes, the more I'm like, these are like the best parts of American culture. And the fact that we thought about integrating it into like the most special day of our life and didn't, sucks. 00:05:30 Speaker 1: Well those regrets aside because i i know that must really keep you up at night and i think you might be it's hard to be the only person in the world it's something but you might be the one person in the world who's just filled with deep regret that they didn't have a mascot at their wedding have you ever looked into sort of like the history of mascots like have you have you done the deep diving into sort of this whole phenomenon or how they even became a thing Yes. 00:05:56 Speaker 2: Mascots emerged in the late 1800s. In the 1880s, sports teams began using live animals as mascots. Really? 00:06:08 Speaker 1: Yes. That sounds messy. It does. 00:06:10 Speaker 2: I mean, there's several college, I think just football teams that still have, like Georgia has a bulldog that they bring out in games. It seems more difficult wrangling a an animal than a person. But in 1889, a Yale student began to bring a bulldog named Handsome Dan to baseball and football games. And it wasn't just live animals. Teams would also use children as their mascots. Is that legal? I mean, in the late 1880s, I think anything went. Pre-labor laws, yep. 00:06:44 Speaker 1: Yeah. 00:06:45 Speaker 2: And, you know, in the earliest newspaper articles about mascots, they were considered to be lucky charms for teams and ways to intimidate their opponents. But it wasn't really until the late 1960s that mascots as we know them today began to emerge. Part of this had to do with puppetry becoming more mainstream and popular in the United States. Like the first iteration of The Muppets premiered in the mid-50s. 00:07:18 Speaker 4: And. 00:07:21 Speaker 2: that was influential on mascots. And it wasn't really until the late 1960s that we saw some of the earliest mascots that still exist today, like Mr. Met for the New York Mets and Benny the Bull, who might be the oldest NBA mascot. He debuted in 1969. But what really changed everything was the The San Diego Chicken, who was a mascot for the Padres. 00:07:50 Speaker 1: The San Diego Chicken? Yes. 00:07:52 Speaker 2: Interesting. So in 1974, a San Diego radio station hired a college student to wear a chicken suit at Padres games. And fans went crazy for it. He was so much a fan favorite that the team formally adopted him because it was like some radio station's idea. And in 1979, he hatched out of an egg at a Padres game. There it is. 00:08:23 Speaker 4: The egg cracks open. 00:08:24 Speaker 1: And there he is, the Padres' Wonderbird. That is incredible. I can only imagine just the palpable energy inside. in the baseball stadium when people saw someone hatch out of an egg. 00:08:42 Speaker 2: And just a side note is that it's actually now a thing that happens with avian mascots all the time. When they premiere, they hatch out of eggs or reptilian mascots. Incredible. If you're an animal who comes from an egg, you'll probably debut by hatching out of an egg at a sporting event. 00:09:00 Speaker 1: Really just like setting the tone for future winged mascots everywhere. So after the chicken exploded in popularity in San Diego, how did it expand to being something that's so ubiquitous now and that, like you said earlier, that 27 out of 30 NBA teams have a mascot? 00:09:17 Speaker 2: When the San Diego chicken was getting really popular, the Philadelphia Phillies saw what was going on and thought, we need to redo our mascots. 00:09:26 Speaker 1: At the time, their mascots. 00:09:27 Speaker 2: Were these two super creepy animatronic dolls who were twins named Phil and Phyllis. And I don't think they were super popular. So the team hired a woman named Bonnie Erickson to redo their mascot. And she used to work for Jim Henson. 00:09:45 Speaker 1: Oh, okay. 00:09:46 Speaker 2: She created the Philly Fanatic, who became incredibly popular and who I have also interviewed the guy who's been in the suit since the 80s. 00:09:56 Speaker 1: As the preeminent mascot beat reporter in the United States. Yes. 00:10:00 Speaker 2: This is a reputation I

really want to cultivate, so I appreciate this 100%. 00:10:03 Speaker 1: The Fanatic was. 00:10:06 Speaker 2: Became a phenomenon as well. And since then, they've become essential in the wider world of sports entertainment. 27 of the 30 NBA teams have mascots. And I don't want to totally diss the three that don't. But if you're figuring out what your sports team is, It's hard to imagine how you do that without also having a mascot. 00:10:29 Speaker 1: So you live specifically in the greater Portland, Oregon metro area. So, of course, your local team is the Portland Trailblazers. And they actually have two mascots. Can you give us the 411 on the local mascot scene in Portland? 00:10:44 Speaker 5: Yeah. 00:10:44 Speaker 1: Okay. 00:10:44 Speaker 2: So their longest standing one is named Blaze the Trail Cat. And he is a gray feline who has like this perpetually enormous smile. And he's not, some mascots are like really tall and loom over you. He's not like super big. Like he's the size of a man. He's wearing like some padding and he's wearing like a big cat head. So he's one of their mascots. And the other mascot they have is named Douglas Fur. It's a pun on a Douglas fir tree, except fur is spelled F-U-R. 00:11:15 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, of course. 00:11:17 Speaker 2: And he is a tawny haired Sasquatch who wears a plaid lumberjack vest. And they're both team ambassadors. They do a lot of entertainment for kids at the game. And they also do a lot of marketing stuff for the team, working with sponsors and various advertisers. And they're both really incredible entertainers and also really good athletes. It's not just the players on the team who are the athletes. 00:11:47 Speaker 4: Yeah. 00:11:48 Speaker 1: Wait, so how does that work? Because that's pretty uncommon, right? To have two mascots for one team? Like, are they on the court at the same time? How does the timeshare work there? 00:11:57 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think it's particularly uncommon to have two mascots. Some teams do, some teams don't. A lot of the time they are together and they're kind of playing off of each other's energy. They also do like a pregame parade. And so each of them will kind of interact with the kids watching the parade separately. 00:12:14 Speaker 1: So it just. 00:12:15 Speaker 2: gives people more access to mascots by having two of them. And sometimes a sponsor will use one mascot in one way and one mascot in another way, and they use them for various campaigns. 00:12:29 Speaker 1: And why do you think mascots did take off like they did? Because as you point out, it is kind of when you actually zoom out, you know, it's an adult person in humongous animal cosplay in most cases, and it's now just something that we expect to see at a sporting event. So how did that happen? 00:12:46 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I spoke to Douglas Furr, or rather the man inside the satsquatch suit last December, and he told me why he thinks they're so popular. 00:12:56 Speaker 3: I think what's really important about them is it's kind of like the backbone of your franchise in a sense, because the players retire and get traded and all that. But Blaze has been here every single game for 20 years. It's a really consistent thing that the fans can attest themselves to that gives them a direct pathway to the team. 00:13:18 Speaker 1: It's almost like unnerving to hear the mascot speak. I mean, like I've never met a mascot. It feels so uncommon that you get to actually have a conversation with one. 00:13:27 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is uncommon. I mean, a big part of mascots is that they don't talk. And I honestly got way more access than I was expecting. 00:13:38 Speaker 1: So now are you just like hanging out until the game starts? 00:13:42 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm going to change into this suit. Get out of this gross one and put on my nice one for the game. 00:13:47 Speaker 1: So what's the difference between these two suits? 00:13:50 Speaker 3: This one's three years old. That one's like six months old. 00:13:53 Speaker 2: And you just like wear your crappy one for the parade? 00:13:57 Speaker 3: Yeah, so I can help preserve the hair of that one. And it helps I can change into a dry suit, which is nice. Because otherwise I'm stuck in the same suit the entire game and it gets so heavy from me sweating so much in it. 00:14:09 Speaker 1: Okay, so it sounds like wearing this giant mascot costume is as hot and uncomfortable as one would imagine. It's probably worse than one would imagine. 00:14:19 Speaker 4: I like. 00:14:20 Speaker 2: Touched the suit. It seemed really heavy. The hair seemed really thick. Here's how Douglas Furr described what it feels like to wear the suit. 00:14:29 Speaker 3: It's 30 pounds of fur. And so imagine wearing a raincoat and then going in the sauna. I can't tell you how many times, oh, you must be hot in there. And it's like, I don't need to hear you say that. I know I am. Don't remind me. I actually wasn't feeling it for a second. 00:14:44 Speaker 4: You reminded me. 00:14:45 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's actually a good shout. He probably does get really sick of hearing, because that's probably the number one thing most people are like, is it really hot in there? 00:14:52 Speaker 2: A former Mr. Met wrote a memoir about his time as a mascot and then also about the history of mascots. And the title of it was... Yes, it's hot in here. But while I was observing Douglas for at the game, I saw him during all his breaks. And there was a moment where I saw him take off the fake hands in the mascot suit. And he's wearing latex gloves underneath that. And I don't know if you've ever had a sweaty hand in a latex glove. It gets so wet. And he like took off the glove and it was soaking. 00:15:26 Speaker 1: Oh, my God. That sounds so awful. 00:15:28 Speaker 5: Yes. 00:15:29 Speaker 1: It's a really distinctly miserable experience. So who is the man behind the mascot, I guess? 00:15:38 Speaker 2: So, mascots often keep their

identities secret. So I would love to introduce you to the man inside the Douglas fursuit. But I was only allowed to do this story on the condition that he remains anonymous. So we're going to call him Johnny. 00:15:52 Speaker 1: Johnny. Got it. And. 00:15:56 Speaker 2: There's kind of a sliding scale of secrecy when it comes to mascots. As I mentioned earlier, I've interviewed the guy who is the Philly fanatic and his identity is public and they don't keep it a secret. Yeah. But with most mascots, they protect their identity a lot. When I followed around Gritty, they wouldn't even let me behind the scenes, like see him, see what the guy looks like. 00:16:23 Speaker 4: Wow. 00:16:23 Speaker 2: Yeah. And the reason I followed around Johnny Douglas-Furr at this game as opposed to Blaze, who's the primary mascot for the Trailblazers, is because Blaze didn't want to expose his identity. And when I met him at the game, I only saw him in costume. I didn't see him out of costume. I also talked to the director of corporate communications for the Blazers, Walt Scherr. And he had some great insights into why mascots have to remain anonymous. 00:16:54 Speaker 5: Sometimes the person in the suit might change. You know, everybody has life. Things come up. You might need to fill in here and there. Or also people transition to different jobs and the mascot has to live on. So keeping the identity a secret allows just the mascot's identity to be the true identity. Yeah. 00:17:11 Speaker 2: And like Johnny doesn't even tell all his friends what his job is. 00:17:16 Speaker 1: So what do they think he does to pay bills if they don't know that he's Douglas Fir? 00:17:21 Speaker 2: He just says generally he works for the Blazers, but you have to reach like a certain threshold to get to the point where he'll tell you he's Douglas Fir. 00:17:33 Speaker 1: I am very curious to learn more about this secret society of NBA mascots that you got to embed yourself with. And we'll be right back with more secrets of NBA mascots after a short break. So, Eve, describe your experience shadowing Douglas firr. 00:18:09 Speaker 2: So I got there 3 or 4 p.m. and the game started at 7. And Johnny has a whole ritual that he does before he performs at every game. 00:18:18 Speaker 1: He starts by stretching. 00:18:20 Speaker 2: Then there is a staff meeting for everybody who's doing all the entertainment that's not basketball related. So they go through as a team everything. all of the breaks in the game, basically. So they're like, we're going to go to C6 during the first time out because there's someone here, there's some sponsor that we need to do something with and the mascots will be there. And then during the second time out, we do this. It's like a dress rehearsal kind of thing. Yeah, it kind of is like a dress rehearsal. That's a good way of putting it. The players get to choose the pregame songs for each game. So they're like, oh, it's this player's turn to choose the song. So we're going to play this music. I don't know if every team does it or just the Blazers. So then he doesn't want to get in the suit too early because it's pretty uncomfortable. So before he gets in the suit, the one thing he does is a backflip. 00:19:17 Speaker 1: That's just part of the routine. Just like I have to do a backflip while I still can before I get into this ginormous suit that's so heavy. Yes. 00:19:24 Speaker 2: He does a single backflip. He then changes into the suit. And because he's mascot number two, he doesn't have like a super swanky dressing room, but he has this like chain link fence that he has covered in fake foliage. 00:19:39 Speaker 1: Because he's a Sasquatch, which is very cute. Commitment to the bit. So committed. 00:19:45 Speaker 2: And then Blaze, the main mascot, has like a pretty swanky dressing room. He has a mini fridge in there that's, full of Spindrift. There are like TVs playing the games. It's like really nice. So he's in like a different class of mascots. Like there's like a tier system of the mascots, like kind of like the bench players versus the starters for the actual team. I think that's a great way of putting it. I think seniority is definitely a big thing. 00:20:13 Speaker 1: Is it seniority or is it the, like, fame of their character? Like, would you say that Blaze the Trail Cat and Douglas Fir are equally, like, important characters, legends to, like, the Blazers fandom? 00:20:25 Speaker 2: Douglas Fir, he was a mascot for them for, like, a few years, several decades ago. 00:20:30 Speaker 1: And then they reintroduced him fairly recently. 00:20:32 Speaker 2: So Blaze is definitely the primary mascot people associate with the team. And they're still... I mean, people... love both of the mascots, but they're still... He's on a different echelon. 00:20:46 Speaker 1: Yeah. For now. For now. As history, you know, as we build history in real time. So what was the man behind the suit like? His name is Johnny, we're calling him for now. Johnny, to protect his identity. What was Johnny like? 00:21:00 Speaker 2: He is a super sweet guy. He's in his 20s. He's really, really enthusiastic about his profession. He has a really warm relationship with his coworkers. He was like super pleasant to be around. And I really liked how enthusiastic he was about his career. It's kind of rare that you talk to people who just genuinely love their job so much. 00:21:28 Speaker 1: Yeah. I asked him if he had always wanted to be a mascot. 00:21:33 Speaker 3: In a sense, yeah. So I grew up as a gymnast. And when I got out of that world, I wanted to find a way to keep using my acrobatic ability. And so I started coaching gymnastics and then I kind of weaseled my way into the world a little bit. But it's always been something I've known about because I actually had known Blaze since I was. 00:21:51 Speaker 1: Like nine or ten. How did you meet Blaze? 00:21:54 Speaker 3: He was one of my coaches in gymnastics. 00:21:57 Speaker 5:

Yeah. 00:21:57 Speaker 3: So I'd always known and thought it was like super awesome. 00:22:00 Speaker 1: What a meet cute for him to meet Blaze in his gymnastics training. So did Johnny have to audition for the job or was he kind of like a nepo baby since he knew Blaze already? He was not a nepo baby, but he also did not have to audition for the job. 00:22:14 Speaker 2: So before he was a mascot, he was a professional trampoline dunker. 00:22:21 Speaker 4: Oh, wow. 00:22:21 Speaker 2: And he worked for the Blazers and also several other NBA teams. Trampoline dunking is not a super common skill. 00:22:28 Speaker 4: Right. 00:22:29 Speaker 2: So like, The Sacramento Kings would fly him and several other trampoline dunkers into Sacramento specifically to do five minutes of trampoline dunking during a timeout, which is so funny to me. And so when the Blazers decided in 2023 that they wanted to reintroduce Douglas Furr, Johnny was the first in line for the job. They just knew him and knew what a talented performer he was and hired him. And I asked him about how he saw his future with the team. 00:23:02 Speaker 3: This is definitely my career. Ideally, I will retire as a mascot. 00:23:06 Speaker 1: That's the goal. I got to say, just prior to this conversation with you, I don't think I ever would have I don't even know if I would have like considered how long people perform as mascots or like what the kind of career outlook is for that. But imagining that as a path to retirement, that is kind of blowing my mind a little bit. It's like such a silly, and I don't mean silly in like a pejorative, but it's such a silly, like lighthearted gig. And it sounds like these guys... take it really seriously and have potential to make a lot of money is kind of the implication here? 00:23:37 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, it definitely depends on the team and the sport, but a lot of mascots make a pretty good living. I've read some reporting that the highest paid mascot in the NBA, who is the Denver Nuggets mascot, his name is Rocket, makes $ 625, 000 a year. 00:23:53 Speaker 4: Wow. 00:23:53 Speaker 1: $ 625, 000 to be a mascot? Yes, absolutely. That's like an NBA rookie scale salary. That's a lot of money. 00:24:04 Speaker 4: Yeah. 00:24:06 Speaker 2: It's possible to make an insanely good living as a mascot, which is hilarious and amazing. So yeah, I asked Walt, one of the communications guys for the Blazers, why they invest so much in their mascots. 00:24:20 Speaker 5: I think in some sense, it's the perfect introduction for sports for kids. You know, when you're three or five, like you probably can't really comprehend what's going on on a basketball court. But if you see a mascot that looks like one of your stuffed animals, it's something you can kind of grab onto and like share with your parents, share with your siblings and kind of grow that love. 00:24:41 Speaker 1: Because that makes sense. They kind of hook them young, you know, they kind of get kids invested in

the team identity more than the team itself. Yeah. 00:24:50 Speaker 2: And I think it's a great way to get a kid excited about a sports team. And also, obviously, by the time they're older and understand the sport more, the players are going to probably be totally different. But if they have those connections with a mascot as a kid, then they're a fan for life. It's really nice that, you know, fosters like this really good energy at games, makes games more accessible to more people. And I think that it's really nice that also the people who do the job really love it. You know, there's a lot of people whose jobs are to make others happier, to be entertainers who are kind of miserable. But the fact that their job is to foster connection and passion and joy about basketball. And then, I mean, at least in Johnny's case, he really feels that way about his job is kind of beautiful. 00:25:44 Speaker 3: The best part is just getting to kind of be like an ambassador of joy. I get to every day just spread positivity to people that are actually looking for it. You know, when I'm going up to people, they anticipate something fun to happen and then something fun happens and they get to walk away excited about that interaction. And for me, that's such an important part of it. And it's where I get the most fulfillment. 00:26:08 Speaker 1: I love that idea of an ambassador of joy. That's just such a beautiful concept and him kind of describing that interaction as reciprocal. People come up to him looking for joy and he's able to provide that to them. And I think that's really beautiful and like kind of shockingly profound. That's a really important thing that he's bringing to the world. So how do you put like a numerical value on bringing joy to people? 00:26:34 Speaker 2: I think it's a fairly easy way for teams to engage their fan base, especially teams in smaller markets. The three NBA teams that don't have mascots are the Lakers, the Knicks, and the Nets. And I don't think it's a coincidence that the three teams that don't have mascots are the teams that are the biggest market teams. I mean, like the Lakers literally could stop selling food at their games and people would still go. You can tell that the teams in the smaller markets have a different way of relating to their fans than teams in the bigger markets. In Portland, like there's not as much to do. There's not as much competition. So in a sense, you'd think, oh, well, then it's easier to get people to go to the games. And it's not difficult. There's lots of diehard Blazers fans in Portland. But it does seem like there's something, the team has almost a cozier relationship with its fans. And I think that leads to things like, oh, we should have a mascot for the kiddos. And I think it's kind of special that there's like all these billion dollar operations that make an investment literally in making a child smile. Like that's incredible to me. 00:27:53 Speaker 1: That is really wholesome, especially in,

a not wholesome world sometimes. And I can imagine that that's a really rewarding feeling for the mascots inside the suit, like seeing the way kids react to you and like seeing those smiles form because you're there. Do the mascots do this for their whole life? Is this like a lifetime kind of commitment? Like how does that work? 00:28:15 Speaker 2: Some people are lifers when it comes to mascots. Another person I interviewed is a friend of mine, Josh Lay, who's an actor, comedian, and musician who went to the University of Tennessee on a full mascot scholarship, which exists. 00:28:32 Speaker 4: What? 00:28:32 Speaker 2: And his path to becoming a mascot is pretty different than Johnny's. 00:28:38 Speaker 4: Yeah, so I played football, basketball, baseball, ran track in high school, and I was in all the school musicals. 00:28:44 Speaker 1: And. 00:28:45 Speaker 4: I was a huge Tennessee fan. And so like, I didn't want to go to any other college except University of Tennessee. 00:28:52 Speaker 5: They had a good theater program. 00:28:53 Speaker 4: And I found out that the mascot got a full scholarship, books and tuition. And I was like, I think I can do this. And so I auditioned my senior year of high school and found out I got the mascot. It's crazy. You just become an instant celebrity. 00:29:13 Speaker 1: He makes a really good point. Like you just go from being a normal kid applying to colleges to being this like giant on-campus celebrity in a way, but in another way, like maybe not if you're anonymous. But so how did he, once he got that, his big break into the mascot world as the college mascot, how did he go from that to being the New Jersey Devil? So for all his years at college in the summers, he'd go to mascot camp and learn how to be a better mascot. Then after he graduated, he moved to New York City and he wanted to become an actor and comedian and was taking classes at UCB and working at Borders Books. And he got a call from from a friend from Mascot Camp who said that the guy who was the current New Jersey devil was leaving to go to law school. And so he put together an audition reel and got the gig. That sentence, he got a call from a friend from Mascot Camp in and of itself is an incredible just like micro story. But so what was it like for him? He's a struggling actor in New York. So it's like by day, he's this struggling actor who is not a celebrity for all intents and purposes. 00:30:29 Speaker 2: And by night, he's the New Jersey Devil. Yeah, he told me his thoughts on what that was like. 00:30:35 Speaker 4: The surreal moments of being the New Jersey Devil's mascot was performing during a playoff run. And it's a sold out 20,000 plus arena. And then quickly going back to New York City. to go to under St. Mark's and perform with your comedy troupe from a like level two or three comedy class in front of six people, half of like, the majority was like a friend doing you a favor. And then yeah, a couple of like, drunk people who just stumbled in off of St. Mark's trying to catch some like $ 5 improv. 00:31:11 Speaker 1: Yeah, that must have been kind of I don't know, like an ego killer in a way to like have this experience of having all these people like cheering for you, even if it's for the character you're playing. And then, yeah, having to go kind of humble yourself in comedy where you're not nearly at that level yet of success. Those also seem like kind of different skill sets, especially because you can't use your voice at all for being a mascot. It's more of like a body acting kind of thing versus like Being an actor and a comedian, like you can use your face, you can use your voice. There's all these other skills. Those seem maybe a little incongruent. 00:31:49 Speaker 2: So, yeah, being a mascot and a comedian actor are both performers, but they are really different skills. And something I think about a lot kind of in relationship to mascots is I don't know if you've seen the movie Inside Man. It's a Spike Lee movie with Clive Owen and Jentel Washington. 00:32:08 Speaker 1: It's a great movie. I love that movie. 00:32:10 Speaker 4: Yeah. 00:32:10 Speaker 2: Clive Owen is a bank robber, and for most of the film, his face is totally covered. And most actors did not want the role because they lost their most important tool, their face, which makes a lot of sense. 00:32:25 Speaker 1: So I talked with Josh about this. 00:32:27 Speaker 4: I mean, it's definitely borderline mime work, but again, without the face. But it's definitely like, how can I convey this emotion? You're really aware of like, how your character moves, where the eyes are, where the nose is, where the ears are. So like for Smokey, I had this big floppy ear. I could always like lift up, you know, the devil, the ears were actually higher. And also the eyes were up here for the devil. Whereas like Smokey, the eyes were down here. So it's just like, you kind of do a lot of like cartoon tropes almost, you know, it's like the hand on the mouth pointing, like shaking, you know, it's like laughter, you know, taking a towel, You know, and it's like blowing your nose. It's like this, you know, it's just like classic comedy, classic physical work, very larger than life. 00:33:18 Speaker 1: There's so much that goes into this that I never would have considered before. Like, you know, it does make sense that you're not gesturing with your own hands and your own face. You're like manipulating something way larger than you and having to do these very exaggerated actions to manipulate make subtle gestures with this large form. 00:33:39 Speaker 2: Yeah. And you have to totally rethink how you'd normally use your body because in many mascot suits, your eye holes are out of the mouth. So your physicality is just totally different. And you have to learn a new way of being, of walking. When I was shadowing Johnny during a Trailblazers game, He was telling me about developing his like signature sassy Sasquatch walk of

like shaking his booty and being so big and so exaggerated. And it's so funny because that's just not the type of guy he was like out of the suit at all. But you adopt this different persona. And I think Josh mentioning that being a mascot is a lot like being a mime is really apt for where you have to be so much larger than life because all these tools you usually have in life have been taken away from you and you're really hot in this insane suit trying to make kids laugh. 00:34:43 Speaker 1: Incredible. Incredible tenacity we're seeing. After the break, we're going to hear about a group chat that will really surprise you. So, Eve, what other weird niche little facts did you learn about mascots while you were doing this research and reporting? 00:35:18 Speaker 2: So all the mascots of the NBA are a pretty tightly knit community. 00:35:23 Speaker 1: They all know each other. Really? Yeah. 00:35:26 Speaker 2: I mean, it makes sense because arguably it's actually harder to become a mascot than to than an NBA player. 00:35:33 Speaker 1: It's a hot take, but I'll hear it out. 00:35:35 Speaker 2: I mean, there are 15 players on every team. There's zero to two mascots for each team. 00:35:40 Speaker 1: I mean. That's a good point. I can't really argue with that. 00:35:43 Speaker 2: You could tear it apart by saying that many more people want to become basketball players than mascots. But they're like a super tight-knit community. Obviously, you have to have like a really distinct personality and skill set to both want and get this job. A lot of times teams will give their mascot a birthday and the mascot will have a birthday party and then mascots from all over the country will fly in for the party. 00:36:07 Speaker 1: Do they dress in costume for these parties? 00:36:09 Speaker 4: Yes. Yes. 00:36:10 Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. I mean, it's like an event for the team, you know? 00:36:13 Speaker 2: No way. 00:36:13 Speaker 1: It's a birthday party with a bunch of mascots in costume? 00:36:17 Speaker 2: Well, it's not like the guy in the suit's birthday. It's like Douglas Fir's birthday. It's not Johnny's birthday. 00:36:24 Speaker 4: I see. I see. 00:36:25 Speaker 2: Also, all of the NBA mascots are in a group chat together. 00:36:29 Speaker 1: Johnny told me about it. 00:36:30 Speaker 3: Any silly stuff that happens throughout the league, we're sharing with each other. So if anyone wants to take that idea and run with it on their end, then they can. I would say from a perspective of trying to help each other, I think a lot of that is dependent on who you're talking about because our characters are all so different. And so there might be talks of body language and how to read body language versus, you know, but I would say that a lot of our stuff is more tailored towards sharing content with each other and bouncing those kind of ideas off each other. 00:36:59 Speaker 1: I still am just trying to wrap my brain around the fact that there's a group chat with all

of the NBA mascots giving each other advice about how to properly mascot and being supportive of each other. 00:37:10 Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that so much that they're all so tight with each other and like want each other to be better mascots. 00:37:18 Speaker 1: It's just like really cute. So there's like a real mascot community there, it sounds like. 00:37:23 Speaker 2: It's just like the whole thing, the theme is community. There's community among the mascots. There's a really good community between the mascots and the fans. It's about fostering connection and finding new ways to relate to people. Josh told me this story about his time as a mascot that really melted my heart. 00:37:45 Speaker 4: I did a camp for special needs kids, kids that had different scale of learning abilities. And I remember interacting with this kid and the kid was like lighting up and we were doing, you know, you talk about communicating. It's like you watch their movement. We were, I was kind of mirroring their movements. 00:38:01 Speaker 1: She was mirroring my movements. 00:38:03 Speaker 4: And I look around and all the counselors and everyone are like crying. And I found out later, once I took the suit off, they said that that kid has been completely unresponsive, hasn't talked, doesn't communicate, has never expressed emotion. I just thought I was like, oh, I'm just interacting with a kid, you know, like I normally do only to find out like for whatever reason, this, larger than life, stuffed animal transcends language and all the other things that we put in the way because you're just this thing that people love. 00:38:34 Speaker 1: I find that so deeply moving. Like the idea that this thing that we take as silly or frivolous maybe even really impacted a child's life to this degree. I mean, it really makes me think about sort of the unintended positive consequences of choosing joy. So much of today's society, everything is just calibrated for peak efficiency and things only exist if they absolutely need to. And it's the bare minimum to do everything as cheap and fast as possible. Like that is the, you know, overall goal, the bottom line. And then you have this where there's all these potential positive ripple effects. And this just feels like something from a different time that has somehow survived all of that. And it just exists to be like joy for joy's sake. 00:39:26 Speaker 2: I mean, I know there's a lot of anxiety, like many fields about, oh, what if my job gets automated or whatever? But like, this is something you can't automate. You can take shortcuts. It's about being in person. And it's just really about creating a special, strange type of human connection. And before I reported the story, I didn't think about, you know, the positive impact it has on kids, like how it can help kids who can't express themselves. 00:39:55 Speaker 1: Yeah, it was beautiful. And I think, you know, even for people who. 00:40:01 Speaker 2: aren't super into sports, they're also a way for people to connect to teams. And it's really nice to have something that someone can unconditionally root for. I mean, something that I think in general is cool about sports is like watching all these people do things that I could never do. 00:40:19 Speaker 1: And so it's just like, oh, right. 00:40:21 Speaker 2: Like, it's just like there are these ways for all these different types of people to come in and And connect with a team and it makes it about so much more than just basketball. 00:40:34 Speaker 1: And, you know, sports are ultimately in a lot of ways about winning and they're about achieving a certain outcome. And the mascot is just happiness. That's what they're there to do, you know. Yes, they rile up the crowd. And if the crowd is riled up, then maybe they're more likely to incentivize the team to win. But at the end of the day, it just seems like everyone involved in this venture is just in search of creating joy. And joy for joy's sake in that way does feel rare in today's world. It really does. 00:41:09 Speaker 2: And that's something I really like about mascots is that they transcend the petty minor differences that break people apart all the time. They're not human. They're not really animals. They might be some insane caricature of an animal. But they're just something like totally different that is like idiosyncratic and strange and then also totally universal where anybody can connect with them. 00:41:39 Speaker 1: And that's really cool. 00:41:42 Speaker 2: I agree. 00:41:43 Speaker 1: Well, thank you so much for joining me today, Eve. It was a pleasure to learn about this with you. And I hope that if you guys renew your wedding vows someday that you're able to bring in a mascot this time. and achieve that dream that you have that was never realized. We won't make the same mistake twice. Basketball Etc. is a production of School of Humans, iHeart Podcasts, and Life Here is Grand. I'm your host, creator, and producer, Claire DeLune. Eve Pizer was today's guest contributor. Amelia Brock is our senior producer and story editor. Kurt Guerin is our audio guru. Our theme song is India, India by Dosh. Executive producers are myself, Jason English, Peter Bauer, Raj Haldar, Virginia Prescott, Brandon Barr, and Elsie Crowley. Special thanks to Will Pearson. If you enjoyed today's episode, tell a friend to tell a friend. Don't forget to hit that follow or subscribe button on your podcast platform of choice so you don't miss an episode. And please take a moment to rate and review. Tune in again next week for more Basketball Etc.