النص الكامل لحلقة Embarking on a Thrilling Journey Through BIM and VDC: Insights and Experiences in Construction Technology

BIM execution plan that we did on some of our projects. 00:03:09.646 --> 00:03:19.205 I've looked at models, how to operate a model and stuff like that Not actually build it out but can drive it in coordination meetings and stuff like that. 00:03:19.205 --> 00:03:28.967 But no, I do not have any drafting experience or any actual doing experience of BIM, more of like an oversee or management level. 00:03:29.919 --> 00:03:45.056 So, and when you say management level, are you participating in design coordination meetings or is it mostly just referencing the model in the field, or can you share? 00:03:45.076 --> 00:03:45.419 a little bit. 00:03:45.419 --> 00:03:47.067 Well, both I've done both. 00:03:47.067 --> 00:04:00.026 One in pre-construction I've worked with all these design teams and our self-contractors kind of lead the meeting to get everyone on the same page to go through those coordination meeting. 00:04:00.026 --> 00:04:07.507 And then we have our drafters and our tech that actually does the integrations and the class detection and the fixing. 00:04:07.507 --> 00:04:30.951 And then I also, once we get to the point of production, I've done meetings with self-contractors on site to kind of mostly age-back contractors for overhead ceilings and stuff like that in closure to help facilitate that piece of work, above ceiling MVP work, to get that into production. 00:04:32.459 --> 00:04:34.608 But never really went past that. 00:04:34.608 --> 00:04:39.689 We never really wrapped it all together to send out a complete as-built package. 00:04:39.689 --> 00:04:46.867 We never got to that point because there's always been section of this as project A and section B is like project C. 00:04:46.867 --> 00:04:48.665 So there's never been on one project. 00:04:48.665 --> 00:04:56.091 So on one project I just wanted all the design coordination up front, all the LFIs, all the self-gatherers fast, you can. 00:04:56.639 --> 00:05:06.288 And there's another project who the person that's only driving the model is our HVAC contractors and I was with the general contractor. 00:05:06.288 --> 00:05:10.846 So I kind of help facilitate that with them, with the other self-contractors. 00:05:10.846 --> 00:05:15.749 The other self-contractors that didn't really have a lot of firm experience. 00:05:15.749 --> 00:05:36.322 So it was a partnership between me and our HVAC contract that kind of drove those meetings and it was mainly just to get the age-backs equipment up above the ceilings, Because that company policy is we won't build anything unless we have a proof model and that was unique for us and that never did and it worked well. 00:05:36.322 --> 00:05:39.747 I said yes for the HVAC contractor. 00:05:39.747 --> 00:05:40.382 It worked well. 00:05:40.382 --> 00:05:44.764 It was a challenge for some of the foaming contractors and the electric contractors. 00:05:45.660 --> 00:05:49.204 But your experience with the mechanical contractor using it that part worked well. 00:05:50.480 --> 00:05:59.326 Yeah, it took us a little bit of time to get used to, because in past we've always approved 2D submittals, shop drawings, stamp it and then proceed. 00:05:59.326 --> 00:06:12.086 This go around, even if we get that, they wanted a approved Claxie section model that they put together before they could do so it was kind of a different, but it worked out well in the end. 00:06:12.086 --> 00:06:15.408 We didn't have a lot of rework when it comes to HVAC. 00:06:16.019 --> 00:06:16.523 You did not. 00:06:17.060 --> 00:06:17.762 Yeah, did not. 00:06:18.581 --> 00:06:20.940 OK, good, awesome, yeah. 00:06:20.940 --> 00:06:24.466 So my background is construction as well, construction management. 00:06:24.466 --> 00:06:46.908 I went to school in Colorado State their construction management program and then worked for Turner Construction for a couple of years and then Fleur, which is actually an EPC Engineering Procurement Construction Company, and built a very large mega project, mostly on the life science side, and so you don't really have a choice on those projects. 00:06:46.908 --> 00:07:12.129 It's complex enough that you have to use BIM and basically all the contractors have to use BIM because it's just that level of complexity and so that's and I kind of touched BIM a couple of times but on one project was the BIM manager for a billion dollar facility, multiple buildings. 00:07:12.129 --> 00:07:19.543 So I went from knowing nothing about BIM to knowing all of the things about BIM, at least in that point in time, just because I got to. 00:07:19.543 --> 00:07:32.319 When you have five different projects or buildings on the same site and over time you kind of get to rapidly learn from all your mistakes. 00:07:32.319 --> 00:07:35.509 So it was a great opportunity in that sense. 00:07:35.509 --> 00:07:46.629 And then mostly on the I've done project management, but also very closely tied to construction technology in general. 00:07:46.629 --> 00:07:52.889 So there's the BIM piece, there's the specifically, but then there's all kinds of other construction tech piece. 00:07:52.889 --> 00:08:04.627 So that's what led me to BIM designs actually was the interest in construction technology, and we tend to focus on the LOD 400, that's where most of our clients come from. 00:08:04.627 --> 00:08:10.805 But and then there's times where we get to play in other spaces and so it's always fun to. 00:08:10.964 --> 00:08:13.223 It's just it's honestly. 00:08:13.223 --> 00:08:16.764 There's so much opportunity and so much rapid change. 00:08:16.764 --> 00:08:33.846 It can feel even for myself this is all I do, right, but it still feels like I'm always on my back foot trying to learn the new technology, just because it changes so quickly, and so I'm super excited about the opportunity. 00:08:33.846 --> 00:08:35.626 You're not your experience is not. 00:08:35.626 --> 00:08:37.046 You're not alone in your experience. 00:08:37.046 --> 00:09:00.527 I

think all over the gamut you've got small companies, very large companies and folks lists kind of similar feedback that they did this on one project or this other thing on one project, but there wasn't that standardization or there wasn't that company-wide adoption on the construction technology side. 00:09:00.527 --> 00:09:23.412 And so what I wanted to do today is meet with you and kind of give you a high-level overview of our typical, the ways that we typically engage with clients that need a similar consulting that you've identified, and kind of get your feedback and see if that you know matches kind of what you had in mind. 00:09:24.085 --> 00:09:25.610 Gotcha, that works, thank you. 00:09:26.585 --> 00:09:27.847 Awesome. 00:09:27.847 --> 00:10:02.893 So typically what we would do is we would engage in there's usually a group meeting, we call it the kickoff meeting, and there's a particular exercise because the person who we're our counterpart right which I think would be you, our counterpart may have a list based on feedback you know, or personal experience or who knows as that starting point of what you're envisioning and to make sure that we have the full teams buy-in on the types of problems we're trying to solve. 00:10:02.893 --> 00:10:29.871 We like to start with that kickoff meeting and we run this exercise where everybody kind of brain dumps all the different you know solutions or problems that they want to solve and then as a team we kind of prioritize those and if your list and your vision is based off of feedback from your team, we would expect similar results, right, but it's kind of a touch point, it's a checkpoint. 00:10:29.871 --> 00:10:47.092 Maybe there's things that have shifted, maybe certain stakeholders weren't included, but it helps us really start set the tone with the team so that they feel that engagement right from the beginning, that they're able to contribute their thoughts or concerns or whatnot. 00:10:47.092 --> 00:11:03.692 And then obviously we would work very closely with you to shape that roadmap, if you will, to just make sure we're aligned on what you feel is the priority, because all stakeholders don't necessarily have that visibility right. 00:11:03.692 --> 00:11:15.414 But my point is that it's a group exercise and that really helps engagement and feedback and, you know, just kind of aligning on the overall goal. 00:11:15.414 --> 00:11:24.352 Really it just helps on the implementation side because people feel bought in from the very beginning versus a directive being handed down right. 00:11:25.365 --> 00:11:37.109 So once we have that kickoff meeting then you would have identified the stakeholders ahead of time and it's usually we usually like to talk to somebody from every department. 00:11:37.109 --> 00:11:51.572 So on the safety side, detailing side, project management side, we also like to talk with previous clients, you know, or end users, depending on which type of client we're working with. 00:11:51.572 --> 00:11:56.028 So there could be some external folks as well to get feedback from. 00:11:56.028 --> 00:11:58.942 And we're usually looking to. 00:11:58.942 --> 00:12:03.927 You know what worked well, what didn't work well, what information do you find yourself needing and not having? 00:12:03.927 --> 00:12:17.895 You know what inefficiencies are you seeing, because it all seems to relate back to construction technology in some way and more specific to really expected then. 00:12:17.895 --> 00:12:39.094 So in that stakeholder feedback we kind of usually there's some themes that come out of that and it usually acts as a good check on that initial kickoff meeting to say, okay, in the way that the team prioritized there is that also what we're seeing in these one-on-one stakeholder interviews. 00:12:39.094 --> 00:12:46.416 And then we have another group meeting at the tail end of that to basically confirm that roadmap. 00:12:46.416 --> 00:13:01.052 So we would have talked with you offline after that initial meeting, we would have you know, let you know kind of what that stakeholder feedback was and so you would have input going into that that second group meeting. 00:13:01.052 --> 00:13:06.730 And in that second group meeting we're basically kind of presenting this is what we found right. 00:13:06.730 --> 00:13:09.692 So this was the feedback initially. 00:13:09.692 --> 00:13:26.708 This is kind of this is what matched, this is what didn't match and this is kind of what we recommend from a roadmap perspective and in that they should be able to see their feedback incorporated at some level, even if it's on a roadmap. 00:13:26.808 --> 00:13:38.373 You know, on down the road and I'll just give you a quick for instance sometimes people say their starting point is we really wanna do 5D. 00:13:38.373 --> 00:13:41.373 You know that's our huge priority pain point, whatever. 00:13:41.373 --> 00:13:45.714 So sometimes people expect that to be priority number one. 00:13:45.714 --> 00:13:56.971 But depending on where the company is as a starting point, right, it's not priority number one because there's like three steps that need to happen before you get to that point right. 00:13:56.971 --> 00:14:00.629 So that's kind of the that's the type of detail that's laid out in that roadmap. 00:14:00.629 --> 00:14:06.472 Is that these are the things that we're gonna tackle in order to achieve that first priority. 00:14:06.472 --> 00:14:08.548 Does that make sense so far? 00:14:09.410 --> 00:14:11.436 Yep, nope, Awesome. 00:14:11.436 --> 00:14:16.899 So my only question is this typically happens after. 00:14:16.899 --> 00:14:23.150 I guess this, for my point is that this is what we're talking about right now. 00:14:23.150 --> 00:14:35.490 It's kind of like just understanding each other more, but what you're talking about is after we come to an agreement and we selected this team as, and then, from that point forward, Okay, I just wanna make sure.

00:14:36.192 --> 00:14:37.054 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 00:14:37.054 --> 00:14:55.230 This is absolutely because we have getting a proposal together that I guess, if what I'm laying out to you as far as process, if it didn't match kind of your expectations or what you feel is needed, then I would need to know that now so that we incorporate whatever-. 00:14:55.852 --> 00:14:56.214 Gotcha. 00:14:56.684 --> 00:15:01.952 We need to into the proposal right, which is why I'm kind of presenting our typical. 00:15:01.952 --> 00:15:08.333 But obviously there's different needs, every client has different needs and so we can adapt. 00:15:08.333 --> 00:15:29.232 But that kind of fundamental layout that beginning, middle end of that first phase we found works really well in any sort of organizational change management, whether it's project controls, bim, doesn't really matter what the topic is, it's the overall approach to yeah. 00:15:29.253 --> 00:15:32.750 I agree, yeah, yeah, gotcha. 00:15:32.750 --> 00:15:59.869 So I just wanted to make sure, because Luke and the other partner I don't remember his name, mark Mark yeah, so we had this conversation and kind of what you're talking about is more of a next step, which totally I'm glad we were talking about this, but for the meeting next week, I just want to make sure that you have an understanding of that, what it is. 00:15:59.869 --> 00:16:29.225 So, pretty much what we want to do is sit down with some of our leaders in each team, stakeholders, and they're going to quickly go through kind of their vision for VDCs and BIM and hopefully by the end of that meeting, you can put together to us a proposal based on the list that was in that email, and then what you said makes a lot of sense about meeting with them again in a group and then individually, because you have to, that's. 00:16:29.225 --> 00:16:49.914 I agree that you need to be able to understand how we operate, not just through one meeting, but to multiple meetings and individual meetings as well, to really understand, and not only with us, but with our partners from design and subcontractors, because they're probably going to have a different perspective than a person who thinks we are what we are right. 00:16:50.765 --> 00:16:57.068 There's certain stuff that and issues and challenges that some people in my LSC that we can't. 00:16:57.068 --> 00:17:01.389 So no, I like the game plan After we sign up for goals. 00:17:01.389 --> 00:17:05.230 I just want to make sure we're not skipping the part before the proposal. 00:17:05.230 --> 00:17:06.930 Does that kind of make sense? 00:17:07.944 --> 00:17:09.249 Yes, so it is. 00:17:09.249 --> 00:17:11.605 I'm glad that we're doing that it's. 00:17:11.605 --> 00:17:20.891 I always love hearing the feedback and just trying to understand what problem they're trying to solve, and obviously, the better we understand that, the more accurate our proposal can be. 00:17:20.891 --> 00:17:28.630 We've done this enough times,

though that we have a, it's not necessarily blocking us from giving you a proposal. 00:17:28.630 --> 00:17:36.009 Okay, right, that type of feedback, because it's sort of just inherent to the plan, the overall plan. 00:17:36.009 --> 00:17:41.035 But so, yeah, so no issues at all for having that meeting. 00:17:41.035 --> 00:17:51.371 Love that we're doing that, and if you needed any sort of clarity beforehand or if you had any questions from us, feel like the team might have questions. 00:17:51.371 --> 00:17:54.393 Then we can also be prepared to answer those. 00:17:56.505 --> 00:18:23.816 The one thing I would say is our leadership team is very new to BIM and VDC, so it will be good if you can somehow use your experience and your expertise and I'll do the same to kind of guide the meeting to something that's more obtainable versus some stuff that they've visionary 20 years from now is something that's really not applicable to our business. 00:18:23.904 --> 00:18:29.292 At the end of the day, we want BIM to help improve our profit. 00:18:29.292 --> 00:18:30.651 I'm just gonna be straight out. 00:18:30.651 --> 00:18:48.173 It's to help improve efficiency, which includes right, which will bring us more profit, more projects and grow the company right, and sometimes people's vision or the agenda might always not relate to growing the company. 00:18:48.173 --> 00:18:49.727 Okay. 00:18:49.727 --> 00:18:55.512 So I kind of want to use your expertise, based on kind of the size of our company. 00:18:55.512 --> 00:19:01.571 We do 100 mil, 150 mil a year, a lot of federal projects, some commercial. 00:19:01.571 --> 00:19:12.211 So kind of using your expertise to kind of help guide that meeting as far as helping them what typically other companies do and what we should do versus what they want to do. 00:19:12.211 --> 00:19:20.356 Okay, and then from that point you can have enough information to give us a proposal. 00:19:23.376 --> 00:19:24.085 Yeah, they won't have the idea. 00:19:27.390 --> 00:19:32.097 The idea is it's very similar to that category that I gave you the 1-5 year plan or something like that. 00:19:32.097 --> 00:19:39.297 Yeah, but those are really industry standards and you can Google and find those categories. 00:19:40.808 --> 00:19:46.252 Yeah, absolutely, and those are what I would call solutions, right, like the map that you sent us. 00:19:46.733 --> 00:19:51.691 Super helpful to see kind of where your head's at as to what you feel is important in the timing of those. 00:19:51.691 --> 00:20:02.537 That's great to have going into any of those meetings and in that let's see how do I say this. 00:20:02.537 --> 00:20:19.939 And ultimately it's still a solution, and you want your stakeholders to be bought into the solution, and so usually I think the first step is identifying a problem statement, and you just did that. 00:20:19.939 --> 00:20:20.179 Right. 00:20:20.179 --> 00:20:29.894 You said, hey, we want to find a way to employ construction

technology in a way that helps us maximize profitability, right. 00:20:29.894 --> 00:20:46.136 So having that problem statement and starting out whether it's this next meeting that we're in or the first meeting after a proposal would be agreed to, right, meeting with that problem statement to keep people focused, and it's okay. 00:20:46.136 --> 00:20:55.813 I'm used to people throwing out all kinds of solutions that are like I want to fly to the moon, like crazy things that would be, that are so far down. 00:20:55.813 --> 00:20:56.547 That's okay. 00:20:56.547 --> 00:21:06.314 People feel heard because their idea or their solution to solving that problem of how to maximize profitability still makes it on the roadmap. 00:21:09.951 --> 00:21:12.136 It just may be like on the far end of the roadmap, right? 00:21:12.136 --> 00:21:15.574 I think what you said in the beginning there is perfect. 00:21:15.574 --> 00:21:21.076 I think we should start out with a meeting saying, hey, identify a problem that we need to solve. 00:21:21.076 --> 00:21:24.211 I think what you just said, what you told me, is perfect. 00:21:24.211 --> 00:21:36.277 To kick off the meeting, to set the expectation how the rest of the meeting will go, is that we're not trying to understand things that you dream up and driving road trip over Thanksgiving or something. 00:21:36.277 --> 00:21:40.534 It's something that we can actually apply and see results. 00:21:40.534 --> 00:21:45.234 Not this year, next year, but at least we see results and we have a goal. 00:21:45.234 --> 00:21:51.297 Not something you thought of when you were driving six hours home to Thanksgiving with your family. 00:21:53.067 --> 00:21:53.690 So what you said? 00:21:53.750 --> 00:21:54.250 is perfect. 00:21:54.952 --> 00:21:55.595 Oh, good, good. 00:21:55.595 --> 00:22:01.276 And if you don't have another agenda for the meeting, what I would actually? 00:22:01.276 --> 00:22:12.601 Because I am tempted, just naturally, when you're getting all those folks in the room, I'm tempted to jump into that first step, right where we are doing that idea dump. 00:22:12.601 --> 00:22:16.153 And it's any idea, I mean, it's just like word vomit, right? 00:22:16.153 --> 00:22:24.147 And if you're not ready to go there, if you don't want to, you're not ready for that type of engagement. 00:22:24.147 --> 00:22:45.037 The step before that one, then I would say it's still helpful to get their pain points and so keep it focused on the pain they're feeling and not a solution, right, so that we get better alignment going in, because the problem statement may be slightly different from, you know, maximizing profitability. 00:22:45.037 --> 00:22:50.195 Maybe there's a different problem statement we need to tackle. 00:22:50.195 --> 00:23:03.676 And so if we, how does that sound, if we were to have that meeting where they could kind of brain dump the pain points that they have, what's creating issues in their day to day work life? 00:23:03.676 --> 00:23:06.965 What are your thoughts on that? 00:23:09.565 --> 00:23:21.897 Yes and no, because I don't want them to also be a venting session where they start looking outside of kind of our scope, which is what problem does BDC and BIM solve? 00:23:22.644 --> 00:23:27.395 They might go to some operational stuff that has nothing to do with them. 00:23:28.305 --> 00:23:59.994 So I would like to I mean understanding the problem they want to solve with them I think it's kind of the vision of that meeting so that it's enough for you at the end of the day, what I want to get out of that meeting is this team has enough information so you can help us come up, that you can come up with a proposal to help us grow or implement BIM right, and whatever the question you may need to ask you can ask. 00:24:00.244 --> 00:24:01.328 There's no limit to that. 00:24:01.328 --> 00:24:16.298 So, just as I'm thinking right now that's kind of where my head is at is that at the end of that meeting I really want you to have enough information to have a proposal ready for us. 00:24:16.298 --> 00:24:35.632 And if that has to do with you doing an issue dump where they're throwing up all kinds of visions and stuff at the board and then you use your experience to kind of guide them and put them into a quantum-erotic order to achieve it, that's fine, I kind of want to leave that up to you and the expert. 00:24:35.632 --> 00:24:37.096 How have you done it with all the companies? 00:24:37.096 --> 00:24:43.454 Because you have more experience than I do and it comes understanding enough to get a proposal ready. 00:24:46.067 --> 00:24:58.864 Yeah, honestly, based on what you're describing, I do think we have enough to have the proposal, because you're not describing anything that's atypical of a client or a company. 00:24:58.864 --> 00:25:03.686 We would engage with Anything that would help me. 00:25:03.686 --> 00:25:07.174 The only thing that would help me dial it in more are those pain points. 00:25:07.875 --> 00:25:08.037 Okay. 00:25:09.228 --> 00:25:12.220 I don't know what I thought in case I change on that. 00:25:12.220 --> 00:25:18.237 But if I heard, and honestly what I'd be looking for is, is there a broad consensus on the pain points? 00:25:20.476 --> 00:25:21.300 That's the thing. 00:25:21.300 --> 00:25:33.671 That's the thing that I'm afraid might happen, and an hour meeting might become two hours, because there might be a disagreement on what the pain points are, and then one thing led to another thing. 00:25:34.092 --> 00:25:34.452 Got it. 00:25:34.953 --> 00:25:35.295 Yeah. 00:25:36.244 --> 00:25:38.656 So the beauty of this, and we'll have to figure out how to do it. 00:25:38.656 --> 00:25:41.667 If we're doing it remotely, we'll have to figure out. 00:25:41.667 --> 00:25:54.778 I think maybe there's probably some pre-work where folks could, because the first thing, what I would normally first ask for is for them to give me all of their pain points.

00:25:54.778 --> 00:26:02.795 What are the things that just create a rub with them that every time they have to do it or they need a certain information or they have to talk to so-and-so or whatever. 00:26:02.795 --> 00:26:06.691 What are those points where it just makes them just go? 00:26:06.691 --> 00:26:10.211 I'm so annoyed and what are those things? 00:26:10.211 --> 00:26:14.807 And they could send those to me in advance and I could go ahead. 00:26:14.807 --> 00:26:21.730 And because we won't have enough time, it's not even time issue, because I have ways to manage that piece. 00:26:21.730 --> 00:26:23.125 It's more so. 00:26:24.229 --> 00:26:33.236 It's harder to do some of this when you're not in person, and then there's added pressure to make sure that I'm interpreting things in real time. 00:26:33.805 --> 00:26:55.971 So, having them send and I could send an email with this or send you an email with a specific language for them to create that list, and then I could come to them and say, okay, getting feedback from the team, and understand that, working with Chan, that these are the things that these are the pain points the team is feeling. 00:26:55.971 --> 00:26:59.532 And then usually I spend like a one minute. 00:26:59.532 --> 00:27:16.613 A timed it's not debate, or if there is a debate it's a very timed, strict debate, right, so you've got two minutes to feedback here, but before I have the job, because I can be really tough on people in those moments, so before I have the job, I usually don't try to get into that. 00:27:16.613 --> 00:27:21.476 I think it would more so just be a recap of this is what we've heard from the team so far. 00:27:21.476 --> 00:27:24.172 Is this, you know, or any surprises here? 00:27:24.172 --> 00:27:38.425 And I can kind of get a sense of that consensus from that conversation and then we can, we can prioritize later once we actually get going with the the, the, the. 00:27:38.445 --> 00:27:40.111 After we're past the proposal point. 00:27:40.131 --> 00:27:40.432 Gotcha. 00:27:40.432 --> 00:27:51.932 Yeah, it'd be nice to have, like the light version of, I think, what you said I agree with, but I think that's more of once we come to an agreement with each other that we're moving forward to yellow as partners. 00:27:51.932 --> 00:27:59.372 I think I really want you know you to dive in and have those hard conversations and challenge our leaders to get to that point. 00:27:59.372 --> 00:28:02.733 I just don't think this meeting is totally ready for that. 00:28:03.526 --> 00:28:04.490 Yeah, I might not get the job. 00:28:06.826 --> 00:28:12.230 The thing is that I don't want to waste your time right when we're still in the selection process. 00:28:12.471 --> 00:28:13.333 Yeah yeah, no, okay. 00:28:15.007 --> 00:28:22.576 I want to be fair to everyone, because time is money, right, and I don't want you to do this and then turns out there's other things. 00:28:22.576 --> 00:28:25.172 You know that we went with someone else, blah, blah, blah. 00:28:25.172 --> 00:28:35.796 Right, I don't know what the reason is, but I just want you to have enough information to get the proposal and then we can, that leaders can make a decision on who to move forward with. 00:28:35.796 --> 00:28:38.432 And from that point on, I agree with you 100%. 00:28:38.432 --> 00:28:48.250 We need, we need to go to that granular level to get to understand what we really need and the problem that we're trying to solve. 00:28:48.250 --> 00:29:00.430 Okay, we're doing the technologies to solve a problem, right, right, and at some time we don't understand what that problem is, unless we have an outside voice challenging us on what those problems are. 00:29:01.352 --> 00:29:02.474 Absolutely yeah. 00:29:02.474 --> 00:29:07.394 And when you speak to the selection process, what is your decision criteria? 00:29:10.951 --> 00:29:12.615 I'm not trying to hide information from you. 00:29:12.615 --> 00:29:13.627 I actually don't know. 00:29:13.627 --> 00:29:17.425 Okay, I actually do not know, I know. 00:29:17.425 --> 00:29:34.419 Talking to our leadership team, I think it's about finding the right partner, and for us, for them too, it's not only the resources, but have you done this before? 00:29:34.419 --> 00:29:44.209 I think that's the other big cut here, for have you successfully shown that you've done this with other best construction companies before too? 00:29:44.209 --> 00:29:56.740 Then I'm pretty sure, before we select, there's going to be another meeting where, most likely, one of our leaders will probably lead that meeting. 00:29:56.740 --> 00:29:59.156 They go through like an interview process. 00:29:59.156 --> 00:30:14.700 Really, my thought behind this whole process is okay, I meet individually with the consultants to give them overall view of what we need and then have a meeting with our actual leader. 00:30:14.700 --> 00:30:18.599 You have enough information to come up with a proposal. 00:30:18.599 --> 00:30:24.998 Then, after that, I'm pretty sure there'll be an interview process and then a selection. 00:30:24.998 --> 00:30:30.520 Does that sound fair, because I don't want to use too much of your time either. 00:30:33.596 --> 00:30:49.319 No, that makes sense to me, because if the decision when we submit a proposal, who would you say the decision maker is for deciding whether whoever it is that's submitting proposal which one? 00:30:50.451 --> 00:31:22.034 It'll be a team of probably me, pain or VP of operations and our VP of business development, because, at the end of the day, every other team you learn that meeting coming up next week or the week after you meet with our pre-con team, the head of our pre-con, you meet with the head of estimating, you meet with our business development VP, you meet with the operation VP, this marketing. 00:31:22.034 --> 00:31:27.400 There's our corporate control which controls our technology and accounting. 00:31:27.400 --> 00:31:42.115 But

at the end of the day, those accounting, it, estimating, we all fall up to VP, which is VP of business development and VP of operations. 00:31:42.115 --> 00:31:52.933 Then the interviewer's expulsion will be a little bit smaller but at the end of the day, those are the decision makers at that level. 00:31:58.512 --> 00:32:04.811 Okay, excellent, in that case, I appreciate the opportunity to be in the room and hear. 00:32:04.811 --> 00:32:17.454 That cements my feel that I wouldn't like to hear from them if the same folks that are making the decisions are going to be in the room are roughly the same folks. 00:32:18.096 --> 00:32:18.258 Yeah. 00:32:18.450 --> 00:32:24.758 I think, making sure I understand their pain points, because that way I can make sure the proposal reflects that and they feel heard. 00:32:25.339 --> 00:32:25.559 Yeah. 00:32:26.711 --> 00:32:28.438 I think that would be really important. 00:32:28.438 --> 00:32:37.800 Then it would be helpful if you could give some thought, maybe get with the team to just try to understand. 00:32:37.800 --> 00:32:49.440 Is it about exhibiting that past performance and what does the right partner look like? 00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:51.718 You spoke to finding the right partner. 00:32:51.718 --> 00:32:53.194 What is that right partner? 00:32:53.194 --> 00:32:58.801 What traits does that right partner exhibit? 00:32:58.801 --> 00:33:02.239 That would be really helpful to us just to make sure. 00:33:02.239 --> 00:33:04.597 Just honestly, make sure we are the right fit. 00:33:04.597 --> 00:33:12.858 Depending on what you define as the right fit, it may not be the right fit and maybe we know that before we even get to the proposal. 00:33:12.858 --> 00:33:20.057 I sense that it definitely could be for sure just in the interactions that Luke had described. 00:33:20.057 --> 00:33:33.700 But I think getting more definition around that would be helpful just to making sure that we have what we are putting together is meeting your team's expectations. 00:33:34.411 --> 00:33:43.113 Yeah, gotcha, I guess you have more of a actual questions, or do you want us to? 00:33:43.113 --> 00:33:51.577 Just because I honestly I don't know if they know the answer to that, because this is something that's new to a lot of us. 00:33:51.577 --> 00:34:16.516 I think it might be based on the proposal, what's in the proposal, how well you understand the company, but the thing is there's always going to be that phase two, which is we define a partner and you're going to come in and spend the next I don't know how many months understanding who we are. 00:34:16.516 --> 00:34:22.911 A lot of stuff right now is going to be based on your resume, really. 00:34:23.213 --> 00:34:25.614 Yeah, it sounds like that, for sure. 00:34:27.275 --> 00:34:30.552 Yeah, if I can answer that question right now is what I would say Right now. 00:34:30.552 --> 00:34:34.478 For me, it's like interviewing someone to join our company. 00:34:34.478 --> 00:34:36.235 We don't know until we know. 00:34:36.235 --> 00:34:41.835 All we can do is look at the resume at that point and decide who we want to interview with. 00:34:42.550 --> 00:34:43.655 Yeah, no, that's super helpful. 00:34:43.655 --> 00:34:58.994 I'm glad I asked that question because I'm glad that you're offering such transparency as well, because normally we would focus our proposal on basically saying this is what we're going to do for you. 00:34:58.994 --> 00:35:04.001 We don't spend a lot of time capturing what we've done in the past. 00:35:04.001 --> 00:35:21.780 But, knowing that that's important, that you'll want to be able to see that Super helpful because I can make sure, whether it's part of the proposal or presentation or a conversation, I can make sure that we are able to show you Similar engagements that we've done and how those are forked out. 00:35:23.152 --> 00:35:25.561 Yeah, Then I sent the email. 00:35:25.561 --> 00:35:33.338 I sent the different categories, that we want them, but I also sent the second half of it. 00:35:33.338 --> 00:35:38.016 I know with our VP of operation he put that part together. 00:35:38.016 --> 00:35:42.635 I know that's important to him making sure that the proposal include all those items. 00:35:49.833 --> 00:35:51.840 Would you say for the team that we'd be meeting with? 00:35:51.840 --> 00:35:53.858 Has that what you sent us? 00:35:53.858 --> 00:35:57.956 Has that been pretty much socialized with all of them, or is it going to be a surprise to any of them? 00:35:59.090 --> 00:36:03.742 No, because the five-year plan has been talked about for like 12 months now. 00:36:03.742 --> 00:36:11.141 It's something they've all seen the bullet points of consultant service we're looking for. 00:36:11.141 --> 00:36:17.302 So that was it 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. 00:36:17.302 --> 00:36:23.996 So that 12 bullet point is something I know of VP of operation really wants to be part of the proposal. 00:36:29.353 --> 00:36:30.338 Luke the bullet points. 00:36:30.338 --> 00:36:33.378 Those were on the other screen we looked at right. 00:36:33.849 --> 00:36:36.518 Yeah, the email I sent, I think, last Friday. 00:36:36.518 --> 00:36:49.760 Yeah, the test file is what we put together of needs and wants with BIM, then the bullet points of what we're looking for in our consultant service. 00:36:49.760 --> 00:36:53.777 I know what the resume we talked about. 00:36:54.510 --> 00:36:55.956 Do you want me to pull them up real quick, Ashley? 00:36:55.956 --> 00:36:56.954 I have the email here. 00:36:57.891 --> 00:37:07.355 Yeah, Because if you feel like that's well socialized with the group already, that's essentially probably the same feedback I would hear from the pain points. 00:37:07.355 --> 00:37:21.240 I would imagine I'm just thinking on the fly here but probably what it makes sense to do pull up the five-year plan real quick, and then we'll come back to this part. 00:37:21.731 --> 00:37:23.717 Sure

Should be here here. 00:37:24.570 --> 00:37:30.862 Yeah, so probably what I would. 00:37:30.862 --> 00:37:37.682 Let's see I may end up having. 00:37:37.682 --> 00:37:42.717 When Luke and I looked at this yesterday, it made sense. 00:37:42.717 --> 00:37:47.601 Probably my only question I had in that meeting is why five years to do this? 00:37:47.601 --> 00:37:50.637 What's stopping you from doing this in three years? 00:37:52.672 --> 00:37:53.414 That's what we don't know. 00:37:53.414 --> 00:38:00.617 Okay, this list right here is based on the knowledge that we have internally right now. 00:38:00.617 --> 00:38:21.217 Okay, and it might be wrong, I can tell you that, okay, we don't have an expert BIM person that has done this for a company before, when they started at zero and grew it into a part of the process and part of the way a company conducts business and construction. 00:38:21.217 --> 00:38:22.750 I don't have the experience. 00:38:22.750 --> 00:38:24.938 I don't think anyone else in our company has the experience. 00:38:25.590 --> 00:38:29.597 They might say they have, but I don't believe we do, and I'm just being transparent with you. 00:38:29.597 --> 00:38:32.918 Right, some say they do, but when I talk to them they don't. 00:38:32.918 --> 00:38:36.599 So this is based on that. 00:38:36.599 --> 00:38:42.094 So there's no saying that, oh, this can't be done in a year, we don't have the experience. 00:38:42.094 --> 00:38:48.059 So we were being very conservative and I thought, yeah, so does that kind of answer your question? 00:38:48.059 --> 00:38:49.202 Yeah, absolutely. 00:38:49.510 --> 00:38:58.523 This thing can all be like using your expert opinion and you telling us that, hey, maybe fabrication and mechwood design can be done in three years if you do this and this and this. 00:38:58.523 --> 00:39:10.394 So we're open for it, when we're just looking for a partner that's really want to help us grow to that point understanding that they will be phased out at a certain point. 00:39:10.956 --> 00:39:13.380 Yes, yeah, no, we love being phased out. 00:39:13.380 --> 00:39:16.514 Yeah, I get bored if I have to stay around too long. 00:39:16.514 --> 00:39:22.940 Yeah, so I think that it's definitely a good fit from that standpoint. 00:39:22.940 --> 00:39:41.181 But, yeah, and it depends like the timeline, some organizations, the timeline this would be overachieving for some organizations because they're they really struggle to make decisions or they're really bought into their current processes or any number of things. 00:39:41.181 --> 00:39:47.202 Other organizations, they could probably do this in two to three years, no problem. 00:39:47.202 --> 00:39:50.338 And so it really just does depend on the team. 00:39:50.750 --> 00:39:59.900 So I probably I'll probably have some questions around that that would help me get a feel for how quick the team could, because that was my gut feel. 00:39:59.900 --> 00:40:09.231 Is that the team, that it could be, that it's a the team legitimately needs this much time just for the organizational change piece. 00:40:09.231 --> 00:40:12.253 And then there's a couple, and so I would. 00:40:12.253 --> 00:40:15.460 I'd have questions around like how do you do it now? 00:40:15.460 --> 00:40:18.996 Like the layout, how is that done now? 00:40:18.996 --> 00:40:28.181 And, particularly with the problem statement you laid out, how do you see that that would help your profit margin? 00:40:28.181 --> 00:40:35.061 Right, if you could maximize or optimize the way that you do layout, how would that help you? 00:40:36.110 --> 00:40:44.177 Yeah, no, that's kind of where the subject matter expert can answer that question a lot better than I can, right? 00:40:44.197 --> 00:40:44.378 now. 00:40:45.150 --> 00:40:46.556 Yeah, there'll be another one. 00:40:47.090 --> 00:40:51.059 Yeah, we'll have a director of estimating will be there. 00:40:51.059 --> 00:40:55.217 Director of field operation will be there as well. 00:40:55.217 --> 00:41:07.150 So we're going to have a lot of our mid-management and above people that will be there, and that's why I kind of it's kind of more people than I want to, but I don't have a choice. 00:41:07.150 --> 00:41:33.853 But that's why I kind of want to use your expertise to kind of guide the meeting, but without going into in depth, like we already agreed to our partnership enough, so you have information where we can effectively navigate the meeting, where you can have a proposal by the end of the meeting enough information to get a proposal by the end of the meeting without going way into depth. 00:41:34.155 --> 00:41:41.456 Like we already signed you guys up, that kind of makes sense and we're kind of on the same page on that. 00:41:42.452 --> 00:41:52.900 Yeah, absolutely To be honest with you, just to give you some feedback, you're already the fact that you'll have a roadmap and that you've been talking about this for 12 months. 00:41:52.900 --> 00:41:58.780 You're already really far ahead of a lot of people that we start engagements with. 00:41:58.780 --> 00:42:01.096 They don't even have this list. 00:42:01.096 --> 00:42:17.155 So you've already made a lot of progress and the next step is just vetting the list, really figuring out what tweaks need to be made, either because of capability or priority, or there are a couple of different factors there. 00:42:17.155 --> 00:42:25.976 But you'll have done a lot of great work already, even without a consultant, so that's something to celebrate for sure. 00:42:25.976 --> 00:42:33.463 I probably will start the meeting with that acknowledgement to the team, because that is really helpful. 00:42:33.463 --> 00:42:58.380 That's why I already have so much clarity of what's needed for the proposal just from this, so I can focus that meeting and just kind of asking some questions specific around this and then managing the time in a way that we don't get stuck into anything, any one specific

thing, and focus on whatever clarity that will improve the proposal. 00:42:59.032 --> 00:43:00.431 Gotcha and then. 00:43:00.431 --> 00:43:06.262 So, as of right now, what I've told them this is what I told them before I even talked to anyone. 00:43:06.262 --> 00:43:09.056 It's like kind of the meeting is based on. 00:43:09.056 --> 00:43:15.233 So marketing, what is your vision for BIM Estimating what is your vision for BIM Fuel operation? 00:43:15.233 --> 00:43:16.295 What is your vision for BIM? 00:43:16.295 --> 00:43:22.072 Is that the right agenda or do you have something else in mind? 00:43:22.072 --> 00:43:29.463 Because my agenda right now is just going down each team and have them lay out what they want. 00:43:29.463 --> 00:43:31.842 What does good look like in them? 00:43:31.842 --> 00:43:37.782 That's the question I laid out to them and I don't know if that's the right approach. 00:43:37.782 --> 00:43:40.722 I'm leaning on your expertise here. 00:43:40.722 --> 00:43:44.182 Is that the right agenda or do you want to go through this list? 00:43:48.858 --> 00:44:06.561 Typically I would really push off solutions and even this is a solution Because it's so easy to argue about the solution but most people and it's very easy to find consensus when it comes to the problem or the pain point. 00:44:06.561 --> 00:44:11.987 Understanding those pain points help me understand. 00:44:11.987 --> 00:44:13.320 Is this the right list? 00:44:13.320 --> 00:44:23.599 So, for example, if I were to go into that meeting and just say, okay, estimating, tell me what your biggest pain points are in estimating or operations. 00:44:23.599 --> 00:44:24.784 What are your biggest pain points? 00:44:25.536 --> 00:44:44.663 Say, estimating, says, oh, my biggest pain point is I have no idea what benchmarking I should use or what our average, whatever it is, then I'm going to look at this and I'm going to because I see proposals there and I see question mark. 00:44:44.663 --> 00:45:07.126 My question would be there are lots of areas that BIM can help in order to provide that benchmarking or to complement that benchmarking right to enable the benchmarking, but I don't see that listed as an item. 00:45:07.126 --> 00:45:08.802 So they may have benchmarking settled. 00:45:08.802 --> 00:45:17.925 In that case, I want to know more to make sure that the BIM plan basically executes in the way that they've already had set up. 00:45:17.925 --> 00:45:24.443 So I really do think it is, rather than, what solution do you see? 00:45:24.443 --> 00:45:29.123 Because they may not know, but they definitely would be able to speak to the pain points they have. 00:45:29.916 --> 00:45:33.463 Okay, so you want to focus more on the pain points? 00:45:35.737 --> 00:45:39.940 I really do what I've observed in the past. 00:45:39.940 --> 00:45:50.844 When you jump to the solution piece, I'd even be hesitant to pull this up to share it with the team, because it just becomes really easy to debate the solution. 00:45:52.277 --> 00:45:53.844 Yeah, no, that makes sense. 00:45:53.844 --> 00:45:57.083 Okay, no, that changed my mindset. 00:45:57.083 --> 00:46:07.206 No, I like the idea If you want to approaches as one of the pain points and then have you provide us what the solution looks like. 00:46:07.206 --> 00:46:11.264 Yeah, no, that does make sense. 00:46:12.157 --> 00:46:16.643 Well, and, believe me, I love coming up with solutions all by myself in a vacuum. 00:46:16.643 --> 00:46:36.985 But the approach we take is first to build that collaboration to basically facilitate the team to create their own solution, Because I'd have the same solution probably for everybody, but it's not always the right fit based on that organization. 00:46:36.985 --> 00:46:43.382 It's more so we're facilitating the process to help the team get to the solution. 00:46:43.382 --> 00:46:47.340 Then we're able to point some things like okay, you can do that. 00:46:47.340 --> 00:46:50.324 Here's some pros and cons to that. 00:46:50.324 --> 00:46:58.143 Ultimately, if the team needs this to weigh in, we have some clients that say, look, we have no idea at all whatsoever. 00:46:58.143 --> 00:47:01.885 You can ask us, but we're not going to know the answer. 00:47:01.885 --> 00:47:12.320 I still always ask Okay, Then ultimately, if I may need to make that decision because I think it's the right fit for what they are running into, then that's not a problem. 00:47:12.320 --> 00:47:16.644 But collaboration is definitely a focus of ours in the process. 00:47:17.327 --> 00:47:18.257 Okay, gotcha. 00:47:18.257 --> 00:47:49.681 Okay, then, based on how I have it in my head right now, based on our conversation today, we want to start out with you explaining we're here to what the statement that you made earlier I forgot what you said, I can't wait for a word, but to understand our pain points of each one of those teams and then, from that point on, I guess, do we go through this list. 00:47:53.143 --> 00:47:54.438 Let's see In that meeting is an hour. 00:47:55.677 --> 00:47:56.139 It's up to you. 00:47:56.139 --> 00:47:58.222 I didn't put a time to it. 00:47:58.222 --> 00:48:03.255 That's my next question after we have an over-high-level view of the agenda. 00:48:03.255 --> 00:48:04.498 It's like how much time do you need? 00:48:07.579 --> 00:48:09.626 I would start with an acknowledgement to the team. 00:48:09.626 --> 00:48:11.621 Set a common vision. 00:48:11.621 --> 00:48:12.920 What are we trying to achieve? 00:48:12.920 --> 00:48:14.842 A lot of times, that's the problem statement. 00:48:14.842 --> 00:48:22.242 We want to figure out how you can incorporate construction technology to improve your profit margin. 00:48:22.242 --> 00:48:31.027 In order to do that, I want to check in with everybody to understand their pain points. 00:48:31.027 --> 00:48:34.244 What are their biggest hurdles? 00:48:34.244 --> 00:48:39.286 They feel and not everybody can speak to that specific

problem statement. 00:48:39.286 --> 00:48:43.304 Pre-construction, for example, may not be able to. 00:48:43.304 --> 00:48:48.405 I'll give that a little bit of thought and dial the common vision in. 00:48:48.405 --> 00:48:55.182 But then I would go around to each of the departments and I can ask them their pain points. 00:48:55.182 --> 00:49:01.748 Typically I ask them to write it down on stickies because it can get pretty lengthy. 00:49:01.748 --> 00:49:08.947 Some people like to talk and it'll get a lot of time with a couple of people. 00:49:08.947 --> 00:49:21.887 It would be good if they came prepped with those, if they could share them in advance, because then I can maximize the time in finding consensus between the groups. 00:49:22.135 --> 00:49:29.742 Is there a limit to what you want to put within three or five pinpoints, or do you want them to have an open-ended? 00:49:30.516 --> 00:49:31.780 Yeah, no, I like three to five. 00:49:31.780 --> 00:49:34.884 We'll do the open-ended after we do the engagement. 00:49:35.376 --> 00:49:41.242 That's where they can put all the pain points they ever want, but in this one, yeah, I think it makes sense to limit three to five. 00:49:41.242 --> 00:49:49.864 If they could send those in advance, then what I'll do is based on the feedback. 00:49:49.864 --> 00:50:02.081 I won't necessarily put this on, the wouldn't necessarily show this, but the questions I ask would be very much informed by what's showing up here and what I'm seeing in their comments. 00:50:02.081 --> 00:50:11.487 If I see complete consensus across the board, then I can show this right from the get-go Right. 00:50:11.798 --> 00:50:12.409 Got you. 00:50:12.409 --> 00:50:17.318 Yeah, Right now, what I have is introductions, problem statement. 00:50:17.318 --> 00:50:21.641 And you want to go by teams, by individuals. 00:50:23.617 --> 00:50:24.059 It's actually. 00:50:24.059 --> 00:50:26.284 If they could send the problem statement in advance. 00:50:26.284 --> 00:50:31.603 Okay yeah, then they could always read those aloud. 00:50:31.603 --> 00:50:35.603 We can have them read their top three. 00:50:37.398 --> 00:50:38.362 Okay, problem statement. 00:50:38.362 --> 00:50:42.021 Then the pinpoints. 00:50:44.077 --> 00:50:47.246 Are you saying problem statements are the same as pain points, Ashley. 00:50:48.778 --> 00:50:50.204 Yeah, that's where I'm trying to wrap. 00:50:50.204 --> 00:50:51.800 Is that one thing, or is that? 00:50:51.800 --> 00:51:03.907 Are you looking for a sense of the company's problem statement of why we need them and then go on to the pain points of each individual teams? 00:51:03.907 --> 00:51:10.420 Or is each of your teams supposed to come up with one statement of the problem and then the pinpoints? 00:51:10.420 --> 00:51:13.338 Or do we just skip the statement problems, go straight to the pain points? 00:51:15.900 --> 00:51:22.324 So we'll do introductions, I'll do an acknowledgement, we'll set a what we call set a common vision. 00:51:22.324 --> 00:51:24.382 So what are we trying to achieve from this? 00:51:24.382 --> 00:51:34.306 Okay, then pain points, and if I get their pain points in advance, then we should be able to build that problem statement closed with the problem statement. 00:51:34.306 --> 00:51:44.559 Okay, I would, because if I get their pain points in advance, I'm still going to have questions. 00:51:44.559 --> 00:51:56.163 So we'll build in when they're discussing their pain points, they'll present them and then I think we just need a little bit of time for me to ask questions and then the answer them. 00:52:00.155 --> 00:52:05.327 So what are you looking to define in the common statement from us? 00:52:05.327 --> 00:52:10.505 So I just want to prep our team for it, so that we're not fumbling around that agenda. 00:52:14.661 --> 00:52:19.643 If I get the pain points in advance, I don't know that they do need to create a problem statement. 00:52:20.757 --> 00:52:20.978 Okay. 00:52:22.235 --> 00:52:26.467 I think I would present a problem statement based on the pain points. 00:52:27.317 --> 00:52:29.664 Okay, so you would present that part I got you. 00:52:30.235 --> 00:52:33.625 And then get their feedback to make sure that I heard them. 00:52:35.297 --> 00:52:36.221 Okay, got you. 00:52:36.221 --> 00:52:41.547 Okay, that makes sense now. 00:52:41.547 --> 00:52:42.878 Thanks for doing that. 00:52:43.400 --> 00:52:44.083 Yeah, no problem. 00:52:44.135 --> 00:52:47.322 I appreciate that that helps a lot. 00:52:48.257 --> 00:52:48.657 Okay, good. 00:52:49.494 --> 00:52:50.780 I just want to be mindful. 00:52:50.780 --> 00:52:53.481 I think Chan has them two o'clock in four minutes Okay. 00:52:53.561 --> 00:52:55.106 Oh, yeah, I do yeah. 00:52:56.016 --> 00:53:03.648 So, Chan, sorry, should we schedule this meeting offline instead of right now? 00:53:03.648 --> 00:53:09.722 I was thinking we'd take some time to schedule it now, but what do you yeah let's schedule it offline I have to look at the calendars too. 00:53:11.858 --> 00:53:20.054 Okay, but based on this meeting, it seems like I have some homework to do with the team, so probably next week is not a good week anymore. 00:53:20.054 --> 00:53:24.034 It's probably be the first week of December, okay, great. 00:53:24.034 --> 00:53:30.804 Because a lot of people are not even working this week, so I can't help anyone and I'm thinking at least an hour. 00:53:32.134 --> 00:53:33.981 Okay, does that sound right, ashlee? 00:53:34.235 --> 00:53:35.900 Yeah, whatever time you need. 00:53:35.900 --> 00:53:38.340 If you need an hour and a half, let me know. 00:53:38.340 --> 00:53:39.402 I just need to know in advance. 00:53:40.215 --> 00:53:42.382 Should we do an hour and a half and then, if we don't need it, we could just-. 00:53:42.574 --> 00:53:44.842 Yeah, since we're doing introductions, yeah, let's do an hour and a half. 00:53:45.384 --> 00:53:47.740 Okay, oh, I think you lost them. 00:53:47.740

--> 00:54:00.043 Uh-oh, maybe I don't know if he meant to do that or it looked like he was I don't know if I can call him back in actually. 00:54:00.996 --> 00:54:03.516 It's okay, we can follow up with that piece, right Okay? 00:54:06.639 --> 00:54:07.563 Oh, he's trying to get back in. 00:54:07.563 --> 00:54:11.063 Okay, hey Chan. 00:54:12.094 --> 00:54:12.737 Hey, it's all right. 00:54:12.737 --> 00:54:15.884 My laptop died even though it was plugged in, no problem. 00:54:15.884 --> 00:54:21.320 My battery's just working, so I don't know why my laptop died, so I have to call you on my phone. 00:54:21.916 --> 00:54:24.610 No problem, teams sucks the energy out of my laptop. 00:54:24.610 --> 00:54:25.838 I don't know if you're on a Mac, but-. 00:54:26.994 --> 00:54:30.483 No, we're on a PC, but yeah, I don't know what happened. 00:54:30.945 --> 00:54:31.467 Okay, all right. 00:54:31.855 --> 00:54:37.161 But sorry, the last thing I heard was an hour and a half for now, and then something, something, and then it just died. 00:54:38.036 --> 00:54:44.878 Okay, so I was just saying let's schedule it for an hour and a half and then if we don't need it, we can call get the time back. 00:54:45.655 --> 00:54:46.318 Okay, gotcha. 00:54:46.318 --> 00:54:50.346 No, I know I really appreciate you helping define the agenda. 00:54:50.346 --> 00:54:51.958 That's really helpful. 00:54:51.958 --> 00:54:58.431 It's just really nice to know there's expertise in guiding this process. 00:54:58.431 --> 00:54:59.534 I really appreciate it. 00:54:59.534 --> 00:55:01.369 I know the reason why we're doing this. 00:55:01.369 --> 00:55:03.500 I'm being honest we just don't have the expertise. 00:55:03.500 --> 00:55:04.885 We just don't. 00:55:06.135 --> 00:55:06.657 Absolutely. 00:55:06.657 --> 00:55:11.501 It's honestly facilitating this type of thing is really challenging. 00:55:11.501 --> 00:55:16.804 It's something I really love doing, but most clients, most companies don't have the expertise. 00:55:17.215 --> 00:55:24.320 Yeah, it's just that we just have a lot of people who's experienced pieces and pieces of it and like, oh, this is what we want, and this is what we want, oh, this is cool to have. 00:55:24.320 --> 00:55:33.355 But then this is how it's really challenging putting it all into a true timeline and organizing it, and we just don't have that expertise. 00:55:33.355 --> 00:55:35.141 So I mean, we have a lot of opinions. 00:55:35.141 --> 00:55:38.389 I have my opinion about what you put it in the next guy. 00:55:38.389 --> 00:55:41.043 I have opinion and I can tell you it's not a line. 00:55:45.746 --> 00:55:46.389 So, this is nice. 00:55:46.389 --> 00:55:47.195 No, I appreciate it. 00:55:47.195 --> 00:55:48.483 Thank you for the conversation. 00:55:48.483 --> 00:55:49.268 Thank you for your time. 00:55:49.268 --> 00:55:52.184 If I don't talk to you again, have a happy Thanksgiving. 00:55:52.496 --> 00:55:55.500 Yeah, I'll follow up with you by email, shannon, and then we can try to aim. 00:55:55.500 --> 00:56:00.003 Maybe we could just put something like tentative on the calendar so it's blocked off for the four of us. 00:56:00.003 --> 00:56:09.282 So I think Marco will want to be here too, if he can, and then at least we have a hold, and then if it doesn't work, we can always move it around. 00:56:09.663 --> 00:56:10.324 Okay, perfect. 00:56:10.324 --> 00:56:13.083 And then I got some homework to do with our leadership team. 00:56:14.615 --> 00:56:15.277 Good luck with that. 00:56:15.277 --> 00:56:16.721 All right, shannon, thanks a lot. 00:56:16.721 --> 00:56:21.114 Thanks again for the opportunity. 00:56:21.114 --> 00:56:23.824 Hopefully see you meet you in person sometime in Minneapolis. 00:56:24.137 --> 00:56:25.195 Okay, definitely, thank you. 00:56:25.335 --> 00:56:26.340 All right, take care. 00:56:26.340 --> 01:04:29.423 Okay, bye, thank you, thank you, Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you.