النص الكامل لحلقة Chris Scott-Thomas | Stop Being the Bottleneck: The Business Lessons Most Founders Learn Too Late

00:04:02.860 --> 00:04:07.039 interesting how most people look at what they're good at 71 00:04:07.090 --> 00:04:09.229 and think that's what they're supposed to do. But what 72 00:04:09.250 --> 00:04:14.150 they're good at isn't necessarily what they love. And that 73 00:04:14.229 --> 00:04:17.930 really is the kind of underpinning part of Collaboration Global 74 00:04:17.949 --> 00:04:20.970 is bring good people together who are doing what they 75 00:04:21.129 --> 00:04:24.779 love and are utilising their business to to make a 76 00:04:24.839 --> 00:04:29.019 positive difference in the world. So that people know exactly 77 00:04:29.040 --> 00:04:33.319 what you're up to. You talk about giving clarity and 78 00:04:33.360 --> 00:04:36.480 you talk about helping people to not be a bottleneck 79 00:04:36.920 --> 00:04:40.519 in their business. How did all that come about for you? 80 00:04:40.579 --> 00:04:41.949 How did you get into that role? 81 00:04:43.230 --> 00:04:48.250 Well, yeah, so I spent a long time, since I 82 00:04:48.269 --> 00:04:53.910 was 16 years old, I'm now 44, I believe. I 83 00:04:53.949 --> 00:04:57.600 was working in technology, started in like when IT meant 84 00:04:57.699 --> 00:05:01.259 IT and that was as clever as it got. Working 85 00:05:01.300 --> 00:05:07.660 in schools and whatever else to data centres and working 86 00:05:07.680 --> 00:05:13.490 for service providers, all this sort of fun stuff. And 87 00:05:14.490 --> 00:05:21.449 eventually worked up into working for consultancies. And that's where 88 00:05:21.509 --> 00:05:26.850 I was most recently in technology. an employed capacity. And 89 00:05:26.870 --> 00:05:30.470 I just, I worked my way up through the levels 90 00:05:30.569 --> 00:05:35.990 as you do. And I started to become detached from 91 00:05:36.050 --> 00:05:38.850 technology and started to see it more as a tool 92 00:05:39.149 --> 00:05:41.709 that helped a business succeed than it was the business. 93 00:05:42.689 --> 00:05:44.509 And I think it's really easy when you're, especially when 94 00:05:44.529 --> 00:05:46.600 you're working in technology where it's very clever and it's 95 00:05:46.629 --> 00:05:50.180 very eyes down, do all the work and you can 96 00:05:50.300 --> 00:05:53.860 feel like you are the business. Because that's what your 97 00:05:53.899 --> 00:05:58.290 customers are consuming. The customer is consuming the product that 98 00:05:58.310 --> 00:06:05.670 you're creating. And that is still true. But actually, there's 99 00:06:05.709 --> 00:06:07.810 a lot of clever things going on behind that have 100 00:06:07.889 --> 00:06:12.310 nothing to do with technology. Like, you know, sales, marketing, 101 00:06:12.810 --> 00:06:15.209 all of these sorts of things that if those things 102 00:06:15.250 --> 00:06:18.089 didn't exist, there would be no customers. And no one 103 00:06:18.149 --> 00:06:21.129 would care about the products. You can build a fantastic product, 104 00:06:21.209 --> 00:06:23.649 but if nobody knows about it, then no one's going 105 00:06:23.670 --> 00:06:26.720 to buy it. So there's all these things I started 106 00:06:26.740 --> 00:06:30.540 to learn about. And I actually just got more interested 107 00:06:30.740 --> 00:06:35.420 in all the other things that existed and less about technology. 108 00:06:35.889 --> 00:06:38.990 I still enjoy technology. But again, just start to see 109 00:06:39.009 --> 00:06:41.189 it as a tool used by a business to win 110 00:06:41.430 --> 00:06:43.910 rather than it being the business and the be all 111 00:06:43.949 --> 00:06:48.389 and end all. And working in a consultancy capacity, I 112 00:06:48.449 --> 00:06:51.920 was able to go from one business to another business 113 00:06:52.339 --> 00:06:56.139 and see patterns. And I could see how one business 114 00:06:56.199 --> 00:06:59.639 was using something to win that another business that was 115 00:06:59.680 --> 00:07:03.009 a client, I could go out. you could do this too. 116 00:07:03.389 --> 00:07:05.050 And it was nothing to do with technology. It was 117 00:07:05.110 --> 00:07:06.790 more to do with how you would approach, how you 118 00:07:06.829 --> 00:07:12.329 would serve your customer better or whatever asset it was 119 00:07:12.370 --> 00:07:16.649 that wasn't technology. And there still was some technology trades 120 00:07:16.689 --> 00:07:18.189 as well of, oh, they do this and you should 121 00:07:18.230 --> 00:07:21.189 do that. But that all worked and I started to 122 00:07:21.230 --> 00:07:25.870 get more enjoyment out of the buttons and the levers 123 00:07:25.889 --> 00:07:28.879 that you could use in that capacity than I was 124 00:07:28.889 --> 00:07:33.600 in you know, coding and technology and so on. I 125 00:07:34.360 --> 00:07:38.920 just found that really rewarding. And then I've always mentored. 126 00:07:39.199 --> 00:07:42.579 I've always enjoyed mentoring people. I've always enjoyed building great 127 00:07:42.600 --> 00:07:47.240 relationships and helping other people succeed. Why I really enjoyed 128 00:07:47.279 --> 00:07:50.240 consultancy was it was me being able to go into 129 00:07:50.300 --> 00:07:55.500 multiple different businesses and help them win and And I 130 00:07:55.560 --> 00:07:58.620 like surrounding myself with people that had that same attitude, 131 00:07:58.639 --> 00:08:02.410 that we were there because the client came first. And 132 00:08:02.470 --> 00:08:06.910 anybody that didn't really fit that mindset, I didn't really 133 00:08:06.990 --> 00:08:11.370 operate with. And I would gather these serious operators around 134 00:08:11.410 --> 00:08:15.100 me that delivered that sort of stuff. And then I 135 00:08:15.139 --> 00:08:17.000 would help them and they would help me. And it's 136 00:08:17.040 --> 00:08:21.860 very reciprocal and really good. And I always found mentoring rewarding, 137 00:08:22.139 --> 00:08:25.519 like watching people leapfrog and

get into a position that 138 00:08:25.850 --> 00:08:28.149 took me three years to get to and they could 139 00:08:28.170 --> 00:08:29.829 do it in six months just because I could give 140 00:08:29.870 --> 00:08:31.689 them the cheat codes to go, just focus on this. 141 00:08:32.129 --> 00:08:34.929 Just do this. Don't do those things. Those things don't work. 142 00:08:35.169 --> 00:08:36.960 I spent a lot of time going down the wrong path. 143 00:08:38.259 --> 00:08:39.980 You know, and as they say, if you get on 144 00:08:40.000 --> 00:08:43.659 the train and it's going the wrong direction, get off 145 00:08:43.700 --> 00:08:47.250 at the first stop. Don't wait. So I was enabling 146 00:08:47.269 --> 00:08:49.370 people to realize they were on the wrong train quicker, 147 00:08:49.870 --> 00:08:53.370 get off, get on the right one and succeed. And 148 00:08:53.429 --> 00:08:57.529 I just came out with big ideas. I started last 149 00:08:57.710 --> 00:09:00.090 October with big ideas of how I was going to 150 00:09:00.129 --> 00:09:02.269 change the world and all this sort of stuff. It 151 00:09:02.289 --> 00:09:07.990 was completely the wrong thing. It was too clever. Nobody 152 00:09:08.029 --> 00:09:13.190 really got it. Everybody needed it. I know everybody needed it, 153 00:09:13.850 --> 00:09:17.019 but I couldn't explain it well enough. I couldn't get 154 00:09:17.039 --> 00:09:20.019 my point over. I couldn't make it seem valuable enough 155 00:09:20.039 --> 00:09:22.419 that people would buy it. But it was a thing 156 00:09:22.460 --> 00:09:25.019 that everybody needed. And I think that's a big problem, 157 00:09:25.419 --> 00:09:27.500 is if nobody can understand what it is you're trying 158 00:09:27.519 --> 00:09:29.820 to sell to them, no one's going to buy it, right? 159 00:09:30.779 --> 00:09:33.730 And then we had a little bit of a rethink 160 00:09:34.549 --> 00:09:38.009 as I was talking to more people, dealing with mentors myself, 161 00:09:38.169 --> 00:09:40.029 all this sort of thing, came to realise I could 162 00:09:40.070 --> 00:09:45.179 just simplify this by just providing business advisory and going 163 00:09:45.360 --> 00:09:47.659 i could just use the skills and knowledge that i 164 00:09:47.759 --> 00:09:50.919 learned to help more people and that was always the 165 00:09:50.940 --> 00:09:52.700 goal because we just wanted to help as many people 166 00:09:52.720 --> 00:09:56.200 as we could So in April, we were like, why 167 00:09:56.240 --> 00:09:59.440 don't we just do business advisory and just, you know, 168 00:09:59.460 --> 00:10:02.179 and we'll just do it as a, we have a 169 00:10:02.710 --> 00:10:06.389 hands-off capacity where we just talk just like this and 170 00:10:06.730 --> 00:10:08.490 I would ask you questions and you would answer them 171 00:10:08.549 --> 00:10:13.129 and I would give you advice on various things. Or 172 00:10:13.409 --> 00:10:16.769 hands-on in that, you know, I know what the problem is. 173 00:10:16.889 --> 00:10:19.820 I just don't know how to do it. But And 174 00:10:19.860 --> 00:10:21.600 I could think, well, I know how to do it. 175 00:10:21.620 --> 00:10:22.919 Would you like me to do it? And then I 176 00:10:23.500 --> 00:10:25.500 could do it hands-on, come into the business and I 177 00:10:25.519 --> 00:10:28.620 could press the buttons and talk to the people or 178 00:10:28.679 --> 00:10:31.120 introduce you to people, whatever that thing is. So we 179 00:10:31.159 --> 00:10:34.580 have a fractional capacity that we offer. We do fractional leadership. So, 180 00:10:34.600 --> 00:10:39.120 and in that, that's a lot easier to talk about 181 00:10:39.139 --> 00:10:41.580 because people get it when you just say, this is 182 00:10:41.600 --> 00:10:43.080 what I do. And I can say it in one 183 00:10:43.139 --> 00:10:47.289 sentence and people are like, ah, I understand. um so 184 00:10:47.330 --> 00:10:49.330 it's a bit of a yeah it was a revelation 185 00:10:49.409 --> 00:10:52.210 it was a revelation like fantastic. 186 00:10:52.230 --> 00:10:54.850 What i always used to find interesting was um when 187 00:10:54.909 --> 00:10:56.870 people are in their own business they can't see the 188 00:10:56.889 --> 00:10:59.620 wood for the trees and it's taking that light to 189 00:10:59.659 --> 00:11:02.220 shine on it from somebody from the outside in that 190 00:11:02.240 --> 00:11:04.759 then you go oh of course yeah you can see 191 00:11:04.799 --> 00:11:07.039 it all so clearly when somebody else goes just look 192 00:11:07.100 --> 00:11:10.039 over in that bit there oh flipping heck i'm no 193 00:11:10.100 --> 00:11:12.259 i meant to do that and just didn't so quite 194 00:11:12.299 --> 00:11:14.710 often people know what they should be doing or what 195 00:11:14.730 --> 00:11:17.389 they could be doing I don't think there's any should 196 00:11:17.610 --> 00:11:19.860 in any of it because every business is different. So 197 00:11:19.879 --> 00:11:24.539 everyone's got a different way of coming to a conclusion. Yeah, 198 00:11:24.559 --> 00:11:26.480 they're very, very similar, but the person in them is very, 199 00:11:26.519 --> 00:11:28.970 very different. So that's how you. 200 00:11:29.889 --> 00:11:34.610 Yes. Business doesn't care about that business. I think that's 201 00:11:34.690 --> 00:11:36.830 I think that's a problem that people have is that 202 00:11:37.330 --> 00:11:41.759 business is an unemotional game. And if you get emotional 203 00:11:41.799 --> 00:11:46.250 about business, business will win. You know what I mean? 204 00:11:46.549 --> 00:11:48.990 Whereas if you can take the emotion out of it, 205 00:11:49.110 --> 00:11:51.110 it becomes very clear what it is that you should do. 206 00:11:51.129 --> 00:11:56.860 I think that's where people struggle. So the first thing 207 00:11:56.879 --> 00:12:00.580 that you said there is I love that. There's somebody 208 00:12:00.620 --> 00:12:03.600 I don't

know who to give credit to, but the 209 00:12:03.639 --> 00:12:06.250 saying is you can't read the label from inside the jar. 210 00:12:06.639 --> 00:12:08.629 And I think that's a big thing that people don't. 211 00:12:09.220 --> 00:12:12.090 And I'm the same. I have to talk to other 212 00:12:12.110 --> 00:12:14.950 people about my business. I know I do because I 213 00:12:15.049 --> 00:12:18.590 cannot do it because I'm too invested. It's mine. So 214 00:12:18.629 --> 00:12:20.389 I have to talk to other people and just to 215 00:12:20.429 --> 00:12:22.799 get someone else's reflection and just go, I get it. 216 00:12:22.950 --> 00:12:25.220 And then I just go, right, we're changing. and we're 217 00:12:25.240 --> 00:12:29.289 doing something new, which flusters my wife sometimes, because I'm 218 00:12:29.309 --> 00:12:33.870 just like, no, it's because I'm not objective enough. And 219 00:12:34.029 --> 00:12:36.649 very rarely people are objective enough about their own thing, 220 00:12:36.669 --> 00:12:43.919 and they need that help. But we talk about these 221 00:12:43.980 --> 00:12:47.799 two primary business debts. There are lots of debts in business, right? 222 00:12:48.019 --> 00:12:51.039 But the two primary business debts that I think exist 223 00:12:51.129 --> 00:12:55.500 are ignorance debt and avoidance debt. Ignorance debt is what 224 00:12:55.559 --> 00:12:59.279 you pay every year to not know something that will 225 00:12:59.320 --> 00:13:00.980 get you where you want to be. So if you 226 00:13:01.019 --> 00:13:03.940 want to return having a revenue of a million pounds 227 00:13:04.000 --> 00:13:08.580 and you're currently 10,000 pounds or 600,000 pounds, let's make 228 00:13:08.620 --> 00:13:14.519 the math easier, you're currently paying your business 900,000 pounds 229 00:13:14.559 --> 00:13:17.279 a year to not know how to get to a million. 230 00:13:17.919 --> 00:13:21.179 That's it. So it's a debt that you are incurring 231 00:13:21.299 --> 00:13:27.570 consistently year on year. Yeah. The other debt, the avoidance debt, 232 00:13:28.230 --> 00:13:32.330 is that you know you should be doing something. There 233 00:13:32.370 --> 00:13:36.129 are things that people avoid in business, like talking to 234 00:13:36.169 --> 00:13:39.809 people they don't know. Yes, talking to people you don't 235 00:13:39.870 --> 00:13:43.110 know is part of business. It's just part of outreach. 236 00:13:43.149 --> 00:13:45.769 However much we do it, it's posting on social media, 237 00:13:46.230 --> 00:13:50.909 phoning people, emailing people, direct messaging people, whatever that thing is. 238 00:13:51.779 --> 00:13:55.519 your best customer is somebody you don't know and people 239 00:13:56.139 --> 00:13:59.820 avoid it like the plague, especially us Brits. We are 240 00:13:59.840 --> 00:14:03.159 too polite. we are too kind we're too nice and 241 00:14:03.179 --> 00:14:05.879 we do not we feel it's rude to talk to 242 00:14:05.919 --> 00:14:08.899 people that we don't know therefore we don't do it 243 00:14:09.659 --> 00:14:12.720 and we do often comment on how americans work and 244 00:14:12.740 --> 00:14:14.799 so on but they don't care they will just talk 245 00:14:14.820 --> 00:14:17.379 to anybody and that's why there is much bigger money 246 00:14:17.399 --> 00:14:20.429 in american businesses than there is that and it being 247 00:14:20.590 --> 00:14:23.789 you know whatever 20 something 30 times the size of 248 00:14:23.830 --> 00:14:27.710 our own country but still there's a big reason why 249 00:14:27.769 --> 00:14:30.090 they can be more successful. It's because they just don't care. 250 00:14:30.549 --> 00:14:33.100 And I think if you rip that band-aid off and 251 00:14:33.129 --> 00:14:35.899 just do it, you get better at it. But that's 252 00:14:35.980 --> 00:14:38.980 one of the primary things that people avoid. And it's 253 00:14:39.179 --> 00:14:41.679 that avoidance, that not doing the thing you know you 254 00:14:41.700 --> 00:14:45.860 should be doing is costing you money every year, which 255 00:14:46.360 --> 00:14:51.389 usually loops back onto ignorance there, is that you know 256 00:14:51.429 --> 00:14:53.590 you should be doing something, but you don't know how 257 00:14:53.629 --> 00:14:57.600 to do it. then comes back into ignorance that is, okay, 258 00:14:57.639 --> 00:14:59.639 you now need to either learn how to do it, 259 00:15:00.230 --> 00:15:02.169 you need to hire someone who knows how to do it, 260 00:15:02.230 --> 00:15:05.049 or rent that skill from another business so that they 261 00:15:05.090 --> 00:15:08.309 can do it for you. But pick one. And it's 262 00:15:08.330 --> 00:15:11.129 a conversation I have a lot with a lot of people, 263 00:15:11.389 --> 00:15:15.769 is choose one of those options and do something about it. 264 00:15:15.870 --> 00:15:22.720 Because trying to learn everything yourself is very difficult. And 265 00:15:22.740 --> 00:15:23.419 you'll never learn. 266 00:15:23.970 --> 00:15:26.529 No, and there's no fun in that. I don't want 267 00:15:26.549 --> 00:15:28.769 to be a jack-of-all-trades. I want to be good at 268 00:15:28.840 --> 00:15:31.080 what I love doing. I don't want to be good 269 00:15:31.100 --> 00:15:33.200 at the stuff that I don't love doing. What would 270 00:15:33.240 --> 00:15:35.220 you say, I don't know if there's an answer to this, 271 00:15:37.019 --> 00:15:41.539 is there a common thing that people are avoiding doing 272 00:15:42.179 --> 00:15:44.990 that's costing them money, do you think, in today's day 273 00:15:45.019 --> 00:15:45.409 and age? 274 00:15:46.389 --> 00:15:52.230 It's people they don't know. Yeah, talking to people they 275 00:15:52.250 --> 00:16:00.100 don't know. People will hide in warm networks. They will 276 00:16:00.139 --> 00:16:06.980 hide in referrals because they'll get work. Most people know 277 00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:12.889 somebody that knows somebody. And

eventually, I imagine if you 278 00:16:12.929 --> 00:16:17.629 were to track everybody you spoke to through this network, 279 00:16:19.159 --> 00:16:22.159 how did you get your first client? I reckon you're 280 00:16:22.179 --> 00:16:25.899 going to be in the high 80s to 90%. It'll 281 00:16:25.919 --> 00:16:30.009 be a referral. Because friends help friends, right? And they 282 00:16:30.049 --> 00:16:32.490 will do it for whatever. That's how I got my 283 00:16:32.529 --> 00:16:36.129 first client. It was through a referral. Fantastic. That's how 284 00:16:36.269 --> 00:16:38.210 I got my first client. It was through a referral. 285 00:16:39.429 --> 00:16:42.370 It was a really weirdly cold referral, but it was 286 00:16:42.409 --> 00:16:47.169 still a referral, right? It was like, I know, you know, 287 00:16:47.210 --> 00:16:50.409 it was one of those like seven steps from Kevin Bacon. 288 00:16:50.470 --> 00:16:52.710 I felt like I was Kevin Bacon in the referral phase, 289 00:16:52.730 --> 00:16:54.610 but it was still a referral. I didn't speak to 290 00:16:54.649 --> 00:16:57.070 the people. I didn't do any of the work. Somebody 291 00:16:57.129 --> 00:17:01.340 else did it for me. But there you go. But 292 00:17:01.360 --> 00:17:03.649 I think people then get comfortable in the fact I 293 00:17:03.690 --> 00:17:06.809 don't have to do anything in order to get clients. 294 00:17:06.970 --> 00:17:10.349 They will just find me or people will keep doing 295 00:17:10.390 --> 00:17:12.990 the work for me. And it's like they won't because 296 00:17:13.029 --> 00:17:15.130 they're running their own business or have other things that 297 00:17:15.170 --> 00:17:17.160 are their problem. And there is nothing in it for 298 00:17:17.200 --> 00:17:21.799 them to keep referring people to you unless you're clever 299 00:17:21.839 --> 00:17:25.319 and you build yourself a really good referral scheme. Then 300 00:17:25.619 --> 00:17:28.779 great people may refer you, but that requires a lot 301 00:17:28.799 --> 00:17:32.299 of people to make powerful enough that it will work, 302 00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:36.880 which is fantastic for B2C, less so for B2B. But 303 00:17:39.359 --> 00:17:41.740 I think that's where people hide. They'll get the first 304 00:17:41.769 --> 00:17:44.990 couple of clients, things will start to look good. And 305 00:17:45.029 --> 00:17:50.029 then those clients finish for whatever reason. And you're like, okay, 306 00:17:50.049 --> 00:17:51.990 I have no idea what to do now. And it's like, 307 00:17:52.009 --> 00:17:54.509 because you did no work in order to build a 308 00:17:54.569 --> 00:17:56.809 pipeline and start talking to people you don't know, go 309 00:17:57.430 --> 00:17:58.309 out and speak to people. 310 00:17:58.329 --> 00:18:01.349 It's such a hard lesson to learn in the beginning, 311 00:18:01.410 --> 00:18:01.730 isn't it? 312 00:18:03.410 --> 00:18:07.789 It is. And the sooner you learn it, the better. Yeah. 313 00:18:08.630 --> 00:18:09.950 It's just bringing back memories. 314 00:18:11.210 --> 00:18:15.009 Yeah. I mean, I think people don't, I guess the 315 00:18:15.089 --> 00:18:17.230 one thing to talk about in that space is that 316 00:18:17.369 --> 00:18:22.730 no one, is part of the job i think nobody 317 00:18:22.769 --> 00:18:25.869 likes being told no but it's a result your result 318 00:18:26.309 --> 00:18:28.809 sales is a results-based game and there are only two 319 00:18:28.849 --> 00:18:30.319 results yes or no. 320 00:18:30.190 --> 00:18:34.480 And that either one is fine with you yeah either 321 00:18:34.559 --> 00:18:35.500 one is fine. 322 00:18:35.200 --> 00:18:37.380 You just want to get a result what you don't 323 00:18:37.420 --> 00:18:41.480 want to do is spend weeks getting neither result talking 324 00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:43.819 to someone over and over and over and over and 325 00:18:43.880 --> 00:18:47.039 never asking them the question and therefore never getting a 326 00:18:47.079 --> 00:18:49.990 yes or a no Because you're just wasting the time. 327 00:18:50.009 --> 00:18:52.470 You could be working with people to try and get 328 00:18:52.529 --> 00:18:56.039 to an answer as soon as possible. And there are 329 00:18:56.059 --> 00:18:58.500 ways of doing that. But yes and no are the 330 00:18:58.559 --> 00:19:00.539 only two results you'll get. No is fine. 331 00:19:01.339 --> 00:19:04.440 And it's interesting how people do hide in their technology. 332 00:19:04.519 --> 00:19:06.509 It's like, oh, well, my website's not done yet, so 333 00:19:06.569 --> 00:19:08.990 I can't talk to anybody about anything because it's not finished. 334 00:19:09.690 --> 00:19:12.049 And the other one is expecting their website to do 335 00:19:12.089 --> 00:19:12.730 all of the work. 336 00:19:13.490 --> 00:19:17.829 No one looks at your website. nobody looks at your 337 00:19:17.849 --> 00:19:19.029 website no that's it. 338 00:19:19.970 --> 00:19:22.390 Like i go to the website to be nosy and 339 00:19:22.470 --> 00:19:24.509 to just do a little bit of background but i've 340 00:19:24.549 --> 00:19:26.210 kind of already made my decision if i want to 341 00:19:26.230 --> 00:19:27.950 work with someone it's them that i want to work 342 00:19:28.009 --> 00:19:29.369 with and i go and have a little nose at 343 00:19:29.390 --> 00:19:31.710 the website oh yeah it's quite nice very pretty and 344 00:19:31.750 --> 00:19:34.109 that's it but i don't find the website and then 345 00:19:34.130 --> 00:19:36.569 go i want to work i've never have you i've 346 00:19:36.630 --> 00:19:39.950 never paid money to a person that i've found through 347 00:19:39.970 --> 00:19:43.109 their website first before i found them i always knew 348 00:19:43.150 --> 00:19:45.589 about them with a recommendation beforehand. 349 00:19:47.240 --> 00:19:51.710 That's it. Nobody will see a website. so don't worry 350 00:19:52.029 --> 00:19:54.779 and again it's because i'm not

sure how different it 351 00:19:54.859 --> 00:19:58.539 is i think it works differently different countries different regions 352 00:19:58.779 --> 00:20:02.940 and so on yeah um because America is very big 353 00:20:03.059 --> 00:20:06.730 on video sales letters and landing pages and all of 354 00:20:06.789 --> 00:20:10.250 these things that are really powerful things that will drive 355 00:20:10.289 --> 00:20:14.450 people to buying stuff from you. They love it. Whereas 356 00:20:14.490 --> 00:20:18.789 I think over here, we don't like that sort of stuff. 357 00:20:19.250 --> 00:20:22.410 I think we want to be interrupted doing no. 358 00:20:22.809 --> 00:20:27.180 And we like, we get to know people. We want 359 00:20:27.200 --> 00:20:31.490 to buy from people more than anything. We're more patient 360 00:20:32.430 --> 00:20:35.769 or a result to find the right thing. And there's 361 00:20:35.809 --> 00:20:38.759 a lot of things that put British people off from 362 00:20:38.819 --> 00:20:43.160 buying things. But I don't get how good the thing 363 00:20:43.200 --> 00:20:46.259 that you are selling is. Like you could be selling 364 00:20:46.339 --> 00:20:50.259 golden geese that lay golden eggs. If you have on 365 00:20:50.299 --> 00:20:53.920 your website, call us for more info. No one will 366 00:20:53.960 --> 00:20:54.400 phone you. 367 00:20:54.420 --> 00:20:55.029 Yeah. 368 00:20:56.140 --> 00:20:58.900 Because it's like, no, no, tell me how much it is. 369 00:20:58.980 --> 00:21:00.869 I do not want to be sold to. Just put 370 00:21:00.890 --> 00:21:05.589 the price on the goddamn website. Like, so it's another, 371 00:21:05.630 --> 00:21:07.809 if you want people to buy stuff from your website, 372 00:21:07.829 --> 00:21:10.829 just tell them how much it'll cost. Like, what are 373 00:21:11.089 --> 00:21:13.230 you scared of? You'll get noticed again. 374 00:21:13.250 --> 00:21:15.509 There's got to be something on there for everybody. The 375 00:21:15.549 --> 00:21:17.880 people that are just curious and, oh, buy the book. 376 00:21:18.059 --> 00:21:21.440 That's only 10 quid. You know, that's fine. Or there's 377 00:21:21.480 --> 00:21:23.930 a group session you can come and dip into. There's 378 00:21:23.950 --> 00:21:25.980 something for free, there's something for five grand, there's something 379 00:21:26.000 --> 00:21:28.940 for ten grand, and there's everything in between. And without 380 00:21:28.960 --> 00:21:31.140 too much choice, you can have three or four options of, 381 00:21:31.640 --> 00:21:35.220 you know, dabble and then just go for it. But 382 00:21:35.740 --> 00:21:38.950 if you're going to go for it with the most 383 00:21:38.990 --> 00:21:41.990 expensive thing on the menu, you're going to know the 384 00:21:42.029 --> 00:21:45.410 person already. You're just looking for stuff that you hadn't 385 00:21:45.450 --> 00:21:47.529 quite found out from the last conversation. 386 00:21:48.089 --> 00:21:50.690 It might just

be that you want that one person. 387 00:21:50.910 --> 00:21:53.740 You can sell one thing for a million pounds. and 388 00:21:53.789 --> 00:21:55.670 make a million pounds a year and you can take 389 00:21:55.710 --> 00:21:57.869 you all year to sell it but once you've sold 390 00:21:57.930 --> 00:22:02.170 it you've made your money are you that patient that's 391 00:22:02.210 --> 00:22:05.029 all it is like be that be patient like don't 392 00:22:05.069 --> 00:22:07.259 try and sell it because you're you're looking for that 393 00:22:07.480 --> 00:22:10.240 one person has a very specific problem is willing to 394 00:22:10.279 --> 00:22:12.880 pay that amount of money to solve it that's okay 395 00:22:13.240 --> 00:22:17.220 like there's nothing wrong with having an incredibly unscalable business 396 00:22:17.240 --> 00:22:21.490 that just sells one thing incredibly expensively You've just got 397 00:22:21.529 --> 00:22:24.849 to find the right person. But again, people think that 398 00:22:24.910 --> 00:22:29.869 websites channel thousands of views and all this. Those things 399 00:22:29.930 --> 00:22:32.299 work better when you want thousands of views because you're 400 00:22:32.319 --> 00:22:36.000 selling things for 99 pence. Then you want lots of 401 00:22:36.019 --> 00:22:39.619 website traffic, like your eBay, your Amazon, all this is 402 00:22:39.640 --> 00:22:42.500 where you're driving sales, your e-commerce, and you're driving sales 403 00:22:42.539 --> 00:22:45.609 to your website. If you're not and it's just a brochure, 404 00:22:46.930 --> 00:22:49.140 it's just a brochure people will skim it and then 405 00:22:49.180 --> 00:22:51.680 move on or they'll click it they'll open it and 406 00:22:51.759 --> 00:22:54.480 if it's not entertaining enough within the first three seconds 407 00:22:54.579 --> 00:22:56.720 they move on like okay. 408 00:22:57.160 --> 00:22:59.400 And ironically if you are selling a product for a 409 00:22:59.420 --> 00:23:02.480 million pounds once you get your first one in the 410 00:23:02.529 --> 00:23:04.690 others are so much easier to follow because those people 411 00:23:04.710 --> 00:23:06.529 with a million pounds have just spent a million pounds 412 00:23:06.569 --> 00:23:08.549 with you are going to tell their friends about it 413 00:23:08.609 --> 00:23:11.410 and then it will happen you just carry on going 414 00:23:11.470 --> 00:23:12.809 but it's that first one that's. 415 00:23:12.690 --> 00:23:18.980 The yeah it's it's something it's an on uh underrated 416 00:23:19.319 --> 00:23:23.509 tool is put premium or luxury in front of whatever 417 00:23:23.529 --> 00:23:26.230 it is that you're selling and then just put another 418 00:23:26.250 --> 00:23:28.130 zero on the end of it and you'll get more 419 00:23:28.190 --> 00:23:30.569 interest from completely different people that are willing to spend 420 00:23:30.589 --> 00:23:34.950 that sort of money i spoke to somebody who was 421 00:23:35.009 -->

00:23:40.519 working in surveying thing you know that you have You 422 00:23:40.539 --> 00:23:42.220 have a survey done in your house, when you're selling 423 00:23:42.240 --> 00:23:45.519 your house, somebody comes around and goes, it's all falling apart, whatever. 424 00:23:46.519 --> 00:23:50.000 The way that that currently works is you as a 425 00:23:50.039 --> 00:23:54.700 surveyor put yourself into a pool of other surveyors. You 426 00:23:54.769 --> 00:23:58.490 are presented by an estate agent to a client in 427 00:23:58.549 --> 00:24:02.150 a list. Funnily enough, that list is probably in price 428 00:24:02.289 --> 00:24:06.049 order and they just look to whoever's the cheapest. 429 00:24:05.680 --> 00:24:07.099 And pick that one, right? 430 00:24:07.319 --> 00:24:09.460 And it's like, that's it. So if I have Lucky 431 00:24:09.480 --> 00:24:11.960 Dip or whatever, there's nothing, you can't do anything about 432 00:24:12.039 --> 00:24:14.380 the sale, right? You're just in a pool of people 433 00:24:14.420 --> 00:24:16.640 and it's completely random. Or if you're the cheapest, you 434 00:24:16.660 --> 00:24:19.089 might get a lot of people or whatever. but it's 435 00:24:19.109 --> 00:24:21.130 usually the biggest companies are the cheapest and all that 436 00:24:21.150 --> 00:24:23.529 sort of stuff. And it was frustrating. This person is like, 437 00:24:23.650 --> 00:24:25.970 because it's lucky dip. I've got nothing. I can't drive 438 00:24:26.029 --> 00:24:28.390 any sales through it. There's nothing I can do. I'm just, 439 00:24:28.690 --> 00:24:31.289 I just wait to see if I get work. So 440 00:24:31.369 --> 00:24:34.680 I suggested to him, just put luxury in front of 441 00:24:34.740 --> 00:24:39.460 your name. Yeah. Say that you only deal with houses 442 00:24:39.700 --> 00:24:43.660 in the range of nine, nine, nine, nine, nine, nine 443 00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:49.400 or above. Yeah. And then do really, really nice, get 444 00:24:49.460 --> 00:24:52.539 nice paper, do really nice printouts of the report that 445 00:24:52.579 --> 00:24:56.480 you do, wear a goddamn suit, and turn up to 446 00:24:56.519 --> 00:24:59.589 these places. And probably should only deal with people that 447 00:24:59.680 --> 00:25:01.930 have the sort of money that are willing to pay 448 00:25:02.589 --> 00:25:05.450 for a premium service. And then just do that. Like, 449 00:25:05.569 --> 00:25:08.549 just make yourself a pond that only you fish in. 450 00:25:09.069 --> 00:25:09.230 Yep. 451 00:25:09.430 --> 00:25:11.369 And then go and fish in it. And just do that. 452 00:25:11.410 --> 00:25:12.859 And he was like, he just sort of stared at 453 00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:15.730 me like I was mental. Oh, wow. And then he 454 00:25:15.750 --> 00:25:18.450 went away and he went, actually, I can see what 455 00:25:18.470 --> 00:25:21.559 you're saying. And it's like, great, just do that. It's like, 456 00:25:21.799 --> 00:25:24.400 if you're a dog grooming service, put luxury in front 457 00:25:24.440 --> 00:25:27.380 of it and charge more than everyone else. And you will, 458 00:25:28.279 --> 00:25:30.539 all the yummy mummies and the ladies who lunch that 459 00:25:30.579 --> 00:25:33.859 have their little poodles or whatever will come to you 460 00:25:33.880 --> 00:25:36.859 because you're a luxury service that they're paying a premium 461 00:25:36.940 --> 00:25:39.440 for to get done. Because that's what it is that 462 00:25:39.480 --> 00:25:41.740 you do. And you have a nice uniform and you 463 00:25:41.779 --> 00:25:44.930 keep a clean van and and do a good job 464 00:25:45.210 --> 00:25:47.789 obviously you will make money at the tennis club and 465 00:25:47.809 --> 00:25:51.069 the golf club and whatever else it is and you 466 00:25:51.109 --> 00:25:54.930 don't care about doing 30 pound cuts for magtag you 467 00:25:55.619 --> 00:25:58.839 know mongol dogs you just do pedigree dogs of a 468 00:25:58.880 --> 00:26:02.440 certain blah whatever there's an option to do that for 469 00:26:02.460 --> 00:26:04.980 everybody people don't want to choose it they want to 470 00:26:05.000 --> 00:26:06.380 be everything to everybody. 471 00:26:06.690 --> 00:26:09.329 Yes it's like the the old niching argument isn't it 472 00:26:09.509 --> 00:26:11.869 and you know what's your niche oh I can help 473 00:26:11.950 --> 00:26:16.869 everybody oh no don't say that because it's just it's 474 00:26:17.089 --> 00:26:20.529 it's gray noise and people just won't be interested in 475 00:26:20.730 --> 00:26:22.849 find I don't want to be helped by that business 476 00:26:22.890 --> 00:26:25.349 coach that can help everybody I want a one that 477 00:26:25.369 --> 00:26:28.430 knows my problems and my business and what I'm about 478 00:26:28.509 --> 00:26:30.829 and and they need to be able to show me 479 00:26:30.869 --> 00:26:33.750 that they know what my business is about and quite 480 00:26:33.799 --> 00:26:38.099 often I mean that's why I think There are some 481 00:26:38.119 --> 00:26:42.269 good people in franchise organisations, but there are franchises out 482 00:26:42.309 --> 00:26:48.049 there that just make everybody this bland beige colour. And, 483 00:26:48.690 --> 00:26:50.710 you know, you want to spend your money where you 484 00:26:50.730 --> 00:26:54.200 know it is going to be well spent, whether that's 485 00:26:54.380 --> 00:26:56.099 a little or a lot. You just want it to... 486 00:26:56.839 --> 00:26:58.299 Everyone wants to get value, don't they? 487 00:26:59.079 --> 00:27:01.819 They do, and it depends on what problem you're solving, right? 488 00:27:02.279 --> 00:27:04.940 And there's a reason why there's a difference in price 489 00:27:04.980 --> 00:27:09.019 between a McDonald's and a steak restaurant. you know because 490 00:27:09.059 --> 00:27:11.470 if I'm hungry right now and I want to eat 491 00:27:11.869 --> 00:27:15.329 right now then McDonald's is a great option because I 492

00:27:15.369 --> 00:27:17.690 can walk in there and within two minutes, I can 493 00:27:17.829 --> 00:27:20.650 have a cheeseburger and leave, right? And there's a reason, 494 00:27:20.910 --> 00:27:23.299 and that works really well. I can't walk into a 495 00:27:23.339 --> 00:27:28.079 high-end steak restaurant and get steak immediately, right? No, there's 496 00:27:28.099 --> 00:27:30.819 an experience. There's a whole thing, and I'm solving a 497 00:27:30.839 --> 00:27:33.460 different problem because in the steak restaurant, there's a different 498 00:27:33.599 --> 00:27:35.519 outcome that I'm trying to achieve. It could be that 499 00:27:35.599 --> 00:27:37.500 I'm going on a date. It could be that I'm 500 00:27:37.579 --> 00:27:40.279 meeting a client. It could be that I'm celebrating a birthday. 501 00:27:40.680 --> 00:27:44.289 I'm not doing any of those things, at mcdonald's because 502 00:27:44.410 --> 00:27:48.430 i'm solving a problem i'm hungry now versus it's more 503 00:27:48.450 --> 00:27:50.890 of a status problem that i'm solving at my own 504 00:27:50.910 --> 00:27:54.839 state restaurant it's completely different and it's that's how you're 505 00:27:54.859 --> 00:27:57.259 picking your niche like what problem am i solving who 506 00:27:57.380 --> 00:27:59.279 am i picking in this group don't try and be 507 00:27:59.319 --> 00:28:02.140 mcdonald's if you want people to have an experience no 508 00:28:02.180 --> 00:28:04.460 one goes to mcdonald's for the experience they go because 509 00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:06.990 they're hungry and they know what they're going to get 510 00:28:07.170 --> 00:28:10.339 there's a high level of confidence that the experience that 511 00:28:10.410 --> 00:28:12.099 I will have and the result that I will get 512 00:28:12.500 --> 00:28:15.519 is delivered. That's why people go to McDonald's and franchises 513 00:28:15.559 --> 00:28:18.359 work really well. Whereas when you go into a high-end 514 00:28:18.380 --> 00:28:21.259 steak restaurant, there may be factors in, I know what 515 00:28:21.319 --> 00:28:23.900 I'll get and there's an experience involved and I know 516 00:28:23.940 --> 00:28:27.500 the outcome, but I'm also willing to wait and pay 517 00:28:27.559 --> 00:28:30.960 a lot more for it. Sure. Do you know what? 518 00:28:31.000 --> 00:28:35.559 I know somebody who went to work as a 15-year-old 519 00:28:35.579 --> 00:28:40.700 or 16-year-old in McDonald's purely to understand the systems that 520 00:28:40.740 --> 00:28:44.289 were within the business. So I think he left when 521 00:28:44.329 --> 00:28:46.369 he was like 19 or 20 and he'd worked his 522 00:28:46.410 --> 00:28:49.150 way up from all the ranks that go on. So 523 00:28:49.170 --> 00:28:50.970 he was a manager of a shop by the time 524 00:28:51.009 --> 00:28:54.490 he left. And then he took those systems and he 525 00:28:54.569 --> 00:28:58.990 put them into a window cleaning round. And then he 526 00:28:59.009 --> 00:29:01.930 says on day one, now don't forget this person talking 527 00:29:02.009 --> 00:29:06.029 now is suited and booted with a flash car outside, right? 528 00:29:06.049 --> 00:29:08.119 So you think he wasn't in window cleaning for long, 529 00:29:08.130 --> 00:29:10.200 was he? He said, on day one, I got home 530 00:29:10.259 --> 00:29:12.500 and I'd earned 35 pence. He said, it was one 531 00:29:12.519 --> 00:29:14.059 of the worst days of my life and I thought 532 00:29:14.099 --> 00:29:16.859 I'd made the biggest mistake. It was just awful. Everything 533 00:29:16.880 --> 00:29:19.180 that could go wrong did go wrong, cost me money. 534 00:29:19.200 --> 00:29:21.680 He said, and I very nearly gave in on the 535 00:29:21.720 --> 00:29:26.259 first day. But he said, fast forward two years, he said, 536 00:29:27.059 --> 00:29:31.059 no longer doing domestic, now doing commercial. And by the 537 00:29:31.099 --> 00:29:34.039 time I saw him, him and his team, one of 538 00:29:34.140 --> 00:29:38.289 many teams, were cleaning the windows of the Gherkin in London. 539 00:29:40.829 --> 00:29:45.109 And it's completely because the McDonald's system worked. He said, 540 00:29:45.210 --> 00:29:47.849 everything I learned there I put into my business and 541 00:29:47.869 --> 00:29:51.589 I just worked the system. And this is what I've got. 542 00:29:51.609 --> 00:29:53.269 He said, you could do it for any business, wherever 543 00:29:53.309 --> 00:29:54.849 you are, whatever you're doing. He said, I did it 544 00:29:54.890 --> 00:29:56.769 for window cleaning. He said, I'm doing other things now. 545 00:29:56.789 --> 00:29:58.410 He said, I've got lots of other stuff going on business. 546 00:29:58.690 --> 00:30:01.549 I just put a system into a business. It's a 547 00:30:01.750 --> 00:30:03.549 bucket and a ladder. 548 00:30:04.619 --> 00:30:06.619 That's like going back to what you were saying about 549 00:30:06.640 --> 00:30:12.359 the founder bottleneck. That's one of the big solutions to 550 00:30:12.420 --> 00:30:18.460 a founder bottleneck is systemizing processes. And obviously McDonald's learned 551 00:30:18.509 --> 00:30:22.549 it very quickly a long time ago because it means 552 00:30:22.589 --> 00:30:25.990 that if I break down a workflow or a thing 553 00:30:26.029 --> 00:30:28.250 that has to happen, a result that needs to occur, 554 00:30:28.859 --> 00:30:31.079 And I can break that down into steps and I 555 00:30:31.119 --> 00:30:33.880 can put one person in charge of each step. That 556 00:30:33.920 --> 00:30:36.039 means that they only have to focus on one small 557 00:30:36.079 --> 00:30:37.920 thing that they need to deliver and they can deliver 558 00:30:37.940 --> 00:30:40.079 it very quickly, which means the next thing can happen. 559 00:30:40.099 --> 00:30:44.000 I can guarantee that the next thing will happen and 560 00:30:44.079 --> 00:30:46.460 so on. And that's how it works on. So that 561 00:30:47.180 --> 00:30:50.740

that burger is put together by one person, sauce goes 562 00:30:50.799 --> 00:30:52.900 on by another person, another person does the fries, another 563 00:30:52.920 --> 00:30:56.200 person does the shake, whatever that thing is, goes in 564 00:30:56.240 --> 00:30:57.880 the bag. Somebody else is putting it in the bag. 565 00:30:58.579 --> 00:31:00.880 It goes to the person, off it goes. And that's 566 00:31:00.900 --> 00:31:03.000 how you get speed. That's how you get reliability. And 567 00:31:03.059 --> 00:31:05.980 it's how you can predict, successfully predict outcomes is just 568 00:31:06.029 --> 00:31:08.890 by having systems. The problem that people have when they 569 00:31:08.910 --> 00:31:12.329 get into a business is they're often translating a skill 570 00:31:12.390 --> 00:31:16.930 that they learn in the corporate world. And they've learned, 571 00:31:17.180 --> 00:31:19.740 they've spent 30 years or whatever it is, learning the 572 00:31:19.779 --> 00:31:23.130 thing like I've done. Yeah. It's all in my head. 573 00:31:23.269 --> 00:31:25.109 I've never written any of this thing down. I just 574 00:31:25.190 --> 00:31:27.380 know it. I inherently know it because I've spent a 575 00:31:27.390 --> 00:31:30.500 lot of time under the bar doing the thing. So 576 00:31:30.619 --> 00:31:32.960 I'm really good at it. If I get my first 577 00:31:33.000 --> 00:31:35.640 hire and I want them to be as good as me, 578 00:31:35.980 --> 00:31:39.970 I can't afford to give them 30 years worth of experience. Like, oh, 579 00:31:40.049 --> 00:31:43.190 just go and start. in this you know in this 580 00:31:43.259 --> 00:31:46.160 school over here and then leave that after a certain 581 00:31:46.180 --> 00:31:48.619 amount of time then you have to go and then 582 00:31:48.660 --> 00:31:51.480 you and all these things that happen to me sequentially 583 00:31:51.539 --> 00:31:53.440 plus all my personal things that happen to me all 584 00:31:53.480 --> 00:31:55.779 have to happen to you in exactly the same way 585 00:31:56.720 --> 00:31:59.490 so that you will be me like that's never going 586 00:31:59.509 --> 00:32:04.210 to happen but with systems you can operationalize how you 587 00:32:04.250 --> 00:32:07.119 deliver something, how you think about things so that you 588 00:32:07.130 --> 00:32:09.079 can train other people to do it. And then it's, 589 00:32:09.500 --> 00:32:11.319 they don't have to be you. They just have to 590 00:32:11.400 --> 00:32:14.660 own a small part of you that can then become consistent. 591 00:32:15.359 --> 00:32:18.500 So it's like, how do I generate a quote for 592 00:32:18.559 --> 00:32:20.980 a client? How do I assess a piece of work? 593 00:32:21.099 --> 00:32:23.640 How do I write an invoice? How do I produce 594 00:32:23.660 --> 00:32:26.130 a piece of content? How do I write a blog? 595 00:32:26.190 --> 00:32:29.009 How do I dot, dot, dot, dot. And all these things, 596 00:32:29.089 --> 00:32:31.109 and that's all little roles, right? 597 00:32:31.720 --> 00:32:33.579 All of this is going to be shortcutted now as 598 00:32:33.619 --> 00:32:36.079 well because of AI. So if we're teaching our AI 599 00:32:36.279 --> 00:32:38.740 what we do and how it works in this company, 600 00:32:39.329 --> 00:32:42.849 then everyone has got that access to go to your 601 00:32:42.990 --> 00:32:45.890 kind of avatar and learn the next things as well. 602 00:32:45.970 --> 00:32:50.670 So it's short-circuiting, short-cutting everything. Not short-circuiting, that's the wrong way. 603 00:32:51.230 --> 00:32:54.900 Short-cutting everything along the way. I mean, for example, with 604 00:32:54.940 --> 00:33:01.009 my VAs, as they're doing something new– generally they're telling 605 00:33:01.069 --> 00:33:02.450 me how it should go not the other way around 606 00:33:02.470 --> 00:33:04.549 which I quite like always have somebody cleverer than you 607 00:33:04.950 --> 00:33:08.150 being a VA and they're videoing it all so whatever 608 00:33:08.170 --> 00:33:10.049 they've done so if somebody else has to take over 609 00:33:10.069 --> 00:33:12.019 or they can't be there it goes to another one 610 00:33:12.039 --> 00:33:14.079 of their VAs and then they take over and then 611 00:33:14.119 --> 00:33:16.920 they can still do it so it's having those records 612 00:33:16.960 --> 00:33:19.539 and when I started 2007 as a business coach I 613 00:33:19.559 --> 00:33:22.579 was telling people to write this stuff down which can 614 00:33:22.619 --> 00:33:25.180 you imagine having to write down processing systems but now 615 00:33:25.220 --> 00:33:28.119 it's so much easier so much faster because Your AI 616 00:33:28.160 --> 00:33:30.059 is just learning it as you go along, doing it 617 00:33:30.099 --> 00:33:32.900 straight away. And therefore, it can be licensed. It can 618 00:33:32.920 --> 00:33:35.210 be franchised. And you've got a load of whole options. 619 00:33:35.269 --> 00:33:37.569 And when it's sold, if you've got all your systems 620 00:33:37.609 --> 00:33:40.230 and processes in place, this is what makes it work. 621 00:33:40.309 --> 00:33:43.779 There you go. Somebody will pay you a lot of 622 00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:44.259 money for that. 623 00:33:44.940 --> 00:33:49.539 Yeah. And I think the thing where I guess I'm 624 00:33:49.940 --> 00:33:52.799 trying to give as many secrets and tips away as 625 00:33:52.859 --> 00:33:56.849 I can. Where people generally fail with AI is they 626 00:33:56.890 --> 00:33:59.289 try and give it too much. So they try and 627 00:33:59.890 --> 00:34:03.279 in one prompt, for example, or in one chat session, 628 00:34:03.900 --> 00:34:07.740 explain all of the things that you do. Don't do that. 629 00:34:08.420 --> 00:34:12.179 Think again about outcomes. What outcome am I trying to 630 00:34:12.199 --> 00:34:18.110 get to? I'm trying to create a LinkedIn post. Okay. 631 00:34:18.590 --> 00:34:21.929 Only with that. outcome in mind what are the

steps 632 00:34:21.949 --> 00:34:24.130 that you need to do to get to do that 633 00:34:24.230 --> 00:34:27.409 go through those steps write down each step describe those 634 00:34:27.449 --> 00:34:30.730 steps to ai then you can have a repeatable process 635 00:34:30.769 --> 00:34:34.050 you can say okay remember this process that when you 636 00:34:34.110 --> 00:34:36.559 say create me a linkedin post it goes step by 637 00:34:36.619 --> 00:34:39.019 step through your process to create one what you don't 638 00:34:39.079 --> 00:34:41.679 want is to try and recreate you and all the 639 00:34:41.739 --> 00:34:43.840 things that you do and all the outcomes you try 640 00:34:43.860 --> 00:34:47.929 and achieve in one thing where you're like Do this thing. 641 00:34:47.989 --> 00:34:51.389 It's like, no, break things down into small workflows and 642 00:34:51.550 --> 00:34:55.260 outcomes that then you can describe, that you can describe 643 00:34:55.320 --> 00:34:58.360 really well, that ideally you want to be able to 644 00:34:58.500 --> 00:35:00.880 describe to a child because you have to assume that 645 00:35:00.940 --> 00:35:04.619 the AI has no idea what you're talking about. And 646 00:35:04.659 --> 00:35:07.440 especially if you want to train people, you want them 647 00:35:07.500 --> 00:35:09.489 to be able to easily understand it. So it's not 648 00:35:09.550 --> 00:35:11.809 just AI, but if we talk about from any position, 649 00:35:12.869 --> 00:35:15.510 if you're making your first hire to take some load 650 00:35:15.570 --> 00:35:19.289 off you, You're not trying to offload all of your thinking. 651 00:35:19.309 --> 00:35:21.630 It's just what is the bit that is no longer 652 00:35:21.670 --> 00:35:23.789 of value for me to do, but you need to do? 653 00:35:23.809 --> 00:35:26.989 How do I describe that thing, that outcome, those steps? 654 00:35:27.710 --> 00:35:34.110 Walk them through that. And then I use a document, demonstrate, 655 00:35:34.469 --> 00:35:38.679 duplicate process of document down the thing that I'm going 656 00:35:38.699 --> 00:35:42.559 to do. I demonstrate to the person I'm showing. I 657 00:35:42.639 --> 00:35:46.500 follow the documentation and they watch that. And then if 658 00:35:46.519 --> 00:35:49.820 there are any mistakes, we fix the documentation. And then 659 00:35:49.840 --> 00:35:53.130 when we've done that and it works, then they duplicate 660 00:35:53.150 --> 00:35:56.369 it by they follow the documentation and I watch. And 661 00:35:56.429 --> 00:35:59.250 if they get through it, great. If there's still things, 662 00:35:59.349 --> 00:36:02.070 we fix up the documentation. If things don't work and 663 00:36:02.090 --> 00:36:04.280 we've got a three-step process then of how we get 664 00:36:04.320 --> 00:36:07.340 things dialed into the documentation works every time. But it's 665 00:36:07.380 --> 00:36:10.579 a thing that it's hard work, but you've got to 666 00:36:10.599 --> 00:36:14.239 do it. And whether using AI or hiring somebody, that's 667 00:36:14.260 --> 00:36:17.039 how you should think about things is start at the 668 00:36:17.099 --> 00:36:19.610 end where I don't want to get to work your 669 00:36:19.650 --> 00:36:22.690 way logically back and then work your way to the 670 00:36:22.730 --> 00:36:25.070 end again and describe that process really well. 671 00:36:25.110 --> 00:36:30.909 And it might feel painstaking at times, but if you 672 00:36:30.949 --> 00:36:34.159 don't do it, then that's when you you're in trouble 673 00:36:34.699 --> 00:36:36.920 further down the line. If something happens and the person 674 00:36:36.960 --> 00:36:38.599 that you used to do that A, B or C 675 00:36:38.960 --> 00:36:41.230 isn't there anymore and you've got to start doing it. 676 00:36:41.239 --> 00:36:47.630 Yeah. It's just back to avoidance debt, right? I don't 677 00:36:47.650 --> 00:36:50.500 write anything down because I want to be fast. Yeah, 678 00:36:50.519 --> 00:36:54.239 you're fast now, but you'll be slow later. And we've 679 00:36:54.280 --> 00:36:56.380 always used to speak about this in the tech world 680 00:36:56.440 --> 00:36:58.659 is we try and go slow to begin with so 681 00:36:58.699 --> 00:37:02.059 we can go faster later by putting in as many 682 00:37:02.139 --> 00:37:04.760 checks and balances and ways of assuring the things that 683 00:37:04.780 --> 00:37:08.469 we're doing really early. which is boring and it looks 684 00:37:08.489 --> 00:37:11.309 like we're doing nothing. But once that's all done and 685 00:37:11.329 --> 00:37:13.969 we've proven that that works, the speed that we can 686 00:37:14.030 --> 00:37:17.210 get to, because we have so much confidence in the output, 687 00:37:18.289 --> 00:37:22.409 that we can go really, really, really quickly. And it's like, great. 688 00:37:22.570 --> 00:37:25.869 And all the green lights are on and everything's fantastic. 689 00:37:25.909 --> 00:37:29.110 Whereas if you do it the other way around, when 690 00:37:29.130 --> 00:37:32.170 you're getting closer to the deadline and everybody's really annoyed 691 00:37:32.190 --> 00:37:35.750 with you, You're fixing things that you look incompetent. You 692 00:37:35.789 --> 00:37:39.389 don't want that impression. It's better to look incompetent internally 693 00:37:39.409 --> 00:37:42.349 and at the start when you're being, you can be 694 00:37:42.389 --> 00:37:44.570 dumb at the start because you don't know. And it's 695 00:37:44.710 --> 00:37:46.989 easy to explain to a client. I don't know. I 696 00:37:47.889 --> 00:37:50.150 having to learn, we're having to do this ourselves. We're 697 00:37:50.170 --> 00:37:52.780 having to build this. We're having to understand it. People 698 00:37:52.820 --> 00:37:55.440 have more patience when you can be open and honest. 699 00:37:55.940 --> 00:37:57.460 If you do the other way around where you're trying 700 00:37:57.480 --> 00:38:01.000 to show off and be clever, not knowing

at the end, 701 00:38:01.860 --> 00:38:03.570 if you think about putting yourself in that situation, if 702 00:38:03.590 --> 00:38:06.210 someone was to say that to you, and you're expecting something, 703 00:38:06.230 --> 00:38:08.670 like you're buying a car, and you go to the 704 00:38:08.710 --> 00:38:11.090 car showroom, and the guy is trying to put the 705 00:38:11.130 --> 00:38:13.349 door on the car upside down, and he's not got 706 00:38:13.369 --> 00:38:16.030 the carburetor in properly, he doesn't know where the petrol 707 00:38:16.110 --> 00:38:18.650 cap should be, you'd be like, what in the hell 708 00:38:18.670 --> 00:38:21.050 is going on here? They've worked all that out in 709 00:38:21.070 --> 00:38:22.789 the factory, you don't need to know that, and it 710 00:38:22.829 --> 00:38:24.449 comes out really quickly, and they can send you a 711 00:38:24.449 --> 00:38:28.039 nice shiny car. That's the reason why it happens that way. 712 00:38:28.059 --> 00:38:30.820 And if you want to get into a a rhythm 713 00:38:30.860 --> 00:38:34.489 where you can produce consistent outcomes. Put all the struggle 714 00:38:34.570 --> 00:38:35.110 at the start. 715 00:38:36.349 --> 00:38:37.949 It's a bit like writing a book, isn't it? You've 716 00:38:37.969 --> 00:38:40.110 got to put a lot more thought in at the 717 00:38:40.150 --> 00:38:42.449 beginning for that end result. So kind of when it 718 00:38:42.510 --> 00:38:46.760 all comes together, people don't see the agony of reading 719 00:38:46.780 --> 00:38:49.380 it and rereading and editing and re-editing and all of 720 00:38:49.400 --> 00:38:51.239 the other stuff that goes with it just to make 721 00:38:51.280 --> 00:38:53.360 it look like it's a nice story. It just comes 722 00:38:53.460 --> 00:39:00.480 out beautifully. Chris, when you're in your happy place, in 723 00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:03.179 in a work environment what is it what's the thing 724 00:39:03.239 --> 00:39:06.090 that you go that's what i'm damn good at that's 725 00:39:06.159 --> 00:39:07.630 the bit i love to do oh. 726 00:39:10.449 --> 00:39:16.429 Talking um that it's i think um it's kind of 727 00:39:16.449 --> 00:39:19.789 like this like going through situations and being able to 728 00:39:20.670 --> 00:39:23.409 dig into what i know and what i've thought about 729 00:39:23.469 --> 00:39:25.929 and experiences that i've had and pass that knowledge on 730 00:39:25.949 --> 00:39:31.639 i think that's where that's what excites me uh was 731 00:39:31.659 --> 00:39:37.780 speaking with somebody at an expo. We stood at our stand. 732 00:39:37.820 --> 00:39:40.059 We had a little stand and the guy comes over 733 00:39:40.139 --> 00:39:42.489 and he's explaining, he's taking pictures and we're like, oh, 734 00:39:42.500 --> 00:39:44.360 are you the official photographer? He's like, no, I've got 735 00:39:44.389 --> 00:39:47.150 a stand out there, but I'm just taking photographs for people, 736 00:39:47.190 --> 00:39:48.610 you know, and all this stuff. I was like, great. 737 00:39:49.480 --> 00:39:54.199 And he explained to us how he was an ex-forensic photographer. 738 00:39:54.219 --> 00:39:56.369 He used to work for the police and he would 739 00:39:56.389 --> 00:39:58.510 do crime scene photos and all this sort of stuff. 740 00:39:58.570 --> 00:40:00.570 And he got a bit too much for him. And 741 00:40:00.590 --> 00:40:02.250 he's like, look, I just need to get out of 742 00:40:02.289 --> 00:40:04.789 that world. I've seen too much stuff. And I was like, 743 00:40:04.949 --> 00:40:06.860 I want to do something where I'm taking photos of 744 00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:08.860 things that are making people smile. And I was like, 745 00:40:09.119 --> 00:40:13.920 totally understandable. And he was looking about how to position 746 00:40:13.960 --> 00:40:17.820 himself because he was like, And I say that it's 747 00:40:17.860 --> 00:40:20.980 a tough world, right? Because every photographer that is in 748 00:40:21.019 --> 00:40:24.519 your game that is doing events or birthday parties or 749 00:40:24.659 --> 00:40:27.320 headshots or whatever it is, you're all kind of the same. 750 00:40:27.579 --> 00:40:30.739 You're a person that's been doing photography for X amount 751 00:40:30.760 --> 00:40:33.599 of time that takes pictures with a camera and no 752 00:40:33.639 --> 00:40:35.960 one gives a crap about what camera you have. No 753 00:40:36.000 --> 00:40:38.539 matter how cool it is, they won't. Again, people care 754 00:40:38.559 --> 00:40:44.139 about outcomes and not tools. So, you know, what is your... 755 00:40:44.840 --> 00:40:46.820 you know what's your position how you make yourself different 756 00:40:47.500 --> 00:40:50.579 is that just don't know and I was like well 757 00:40:50.639 --> 00:40:54.420 you used to be a forensic photographer right so why 758 00:40:54.440 --> 00:40:58.650 don't you use that yeah because you can say that 759 00:40:58.750 --> 00:41:02.949 you pay more attention to detail than anybody else because 760 00:41:02.969 --> 00:41:06.469 of your years of experience in forensic photography and what 761 00:41:06.510 --> 00:41:10.170 you could do is actually try and niche yourself into 762 00:41:10.190 --> 00:41:17.610 um manufacturing and machining where they create incredibly complex and 763 00:41:17.949 --> 00:41:22.909 really detailed like fabrication of stuff and they want photos 764 00:41:23.010 --> 00:41:24.989 of it yeah like i don't know if it's a 765 00:41:25.010 --> 00:41:26.889 thing i'm just thinking about it and i'm like this 766 00:41:26.949 --> 00:41:29.789 is how i position myself is leveraging your past to 767 00:41:29.809 --> 00:41:33.210 go and he and he says he goes that isn't 768 00:41:33.250 --> 00:41:38.010 a thing i was like they don't fucking know But 769 00:41:38.070 --> 00:41:41.480 it sounds really cool when you're like, I'm an expert 770 00:41:41.519 --> 00:41:44.019 forensic photographer who's got

an eye for detail and it 771 00:41:44.039 --> 00:41:46.239 should be me taking photographs of the things that you 772 00:41:46.280 --> 00:41:48.300 spend a hell of a lot of money fabricating and 773 00:41:48.340 --> 00:41:52.510 trying to sell to other big manufacturing firms. They'd be like, 774 00:41:52.829 --> 00:41:54.610 this is the guy we need to go with because 775 00:41:54.650 --> 00:41:58.329 of his history. It sounds amazing. Right. And it's like, cool. 776 00:41:59.170 --> 00:42:01.289 And that's what I like doing is I just thought 777 00:42:01.309 --> 00:42:04.119 about that completely on the fly and And Jess just 778 00:42:04.139 --> 00:42:05.630 stood next to me and just went, how did you 779 00:42:05.650 --> 00:42:07.250 do that? And I was like, I don't know. It 780 00:42:07.289 --> 00:42:09.190 just comes out of my head. It's just the things 781 00:42:09.289 --> 00:42:10.170 I think about. 782 00:42:10.409 --> 00:42:11.510 Mic drop moment. 783 00:42:11.530 --> 00:42:13.670 Yeah, there you go. And that's just a piece of 784 00:42:13.690 --> 00:42:15.989 information I gave away. And hopefully he goes away and 785 00:42:16.309 --> 00:42:17.039 wins it. 786 00:42:17.090 --> 00:42:19.289 I'd love him to come back next year at the 787 00:42:19.309 --> 00:42:21.269 next exhibition. Who's that guy that told me this? I 788 00:42:21.289 --> 00:42:23.309 want to tell him how my business is going. Maybe 789 00:42:23.329 --> 00:42:25.889 he's listening to this and he's really successful now and 790 00:42:25.909 --> 00:42:28.210 he can come and find you and say thank you 791 00:42:28.329 --> 00:42:28.949 in the long run. 792 00:42:29.199 --> 00:42:30.639 Yeah. Yeah. 793 00:42:30.780 --> 00:42:33.500 It's a great feeling, isn't it, when somebody, gets what 794 00:42:33.519 --> 00:42:36.500 you're talking about and they're like oh I remember when 795 00:42:36.539 --> 00:42:38.920 I was a teacher 100 years ago and the little 796 00:42:38.940 --> 00:42:40.599 naughty kid in the corner would kind of come up 797 00:42:40.639 --> 00:42:43.059 and do some work and you go that's it you've 798 00:42:43.099 --> 00:42:46.159 got it you've nailed it and they're like oh wow 799 00:42:46.199 --> 00:42:47.550 so a kid doing it but then when you get 800 00:42:47.570 --> 00:42:49.690 an adult doing it I used to sit there go 801 00:42:50.309 --> 00:42:53.389 that's what I do yeah you know is that moment 802 00:42:53.409 --> 00:42:56.369 of when the penny drops and they're like that's genius 803 00:42:56.510 --> 00:42:58.510 and it's like you're welcome yeah You know, this is 804 00:42:58.630 --> 00:43:00.230 who I am and this is what I do. I 805 00:43:00.250 --> 00:43:01.710 think you've said to me in the past as well, 806 00:43:01.750 --> 00:43:03.750 you're kind of like this problem solver that you like 807 00:43:03.769 --> 00:43:06.269 to go get the nitty gritty and find out what's 808 00:43:06.309 --> 00:43:09.269 going on and pull it apart and put it back together. 809 00:43:09.329 --> 00:43:11.710 Yeah, and you often find that it's not the problem 810 00:43:11.750 --> 00:43:16.570 that they thought it was. There's a thing that, so 811 00:43:17.809 --> 00:43:21.909 it's an inherent problem with clever people. So clever people, 812 00:43:21.929 --> 00:43:25.300 and I think you're a clever person, Jill, so let's 813 00:43:25.340 --> 00:43:27.679 see if you've ever done this. You have a problem. 814 00:43:29.659 --> 00:43:32.800 and you want to solve it, and you think that 815 00:43:32.840 --> 00:43:35.719 the solution is you've gone, ah, I think I know 816 00:43:35.739 --> 00:43:37.239 what the problem is, and I think what I need 817 00:43:37.280 --> 00:43:40.519 to do to solve it is this. So you go 818 00:43:40.579 --> 00:43:42.940 and ask for help on the thing you think is 819 00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:45.789 the solution to the problem that you've got. Yes, yes. 820 00:43:46.110 --> 00:43:49.309 It happens all the time because clever people think about things, right? 821 00:43:49.349 --> 00:43:51.409 So they're like, oh, how am I going to do this? 822 00:43:51.570 --> 00:43:54.989 If you can't open a jar, you're like, well, I'll 823 00:43:55.030 --> 00:43:57.230 try the tea towel. I'll try the rubber cap thing. 824 00:43:57.309 --> 00:44:00.289 I'll tap it on. But you're going through, we're all 825 00:44:00.389 --> 00:44:02.690 apes and we're all trying to break open the, you know, 826 00:44:02.730 --> 00:44:04.869 the egg with the rock. This is just what we do. 827 00:44:05.369 --> 00:44:07.909 We work through the problem first. And the thing that 828 00:44:07.969 --> 00:44:10.420 got us closest, the thing that sounds like there was 829 00:44:10.460 --> 00:44:14.199 logical solutions, We then go and ask for help on 830 00:44:14.239 --> 00:44:16.920 the thing we've perceived as the solution. It's called the 831 00:44:17.019 --> 00:44:20.019 XY problem. So the problem is X. Y is the 832 00:44:20.059 --> 00:44:22.179 solution we think is the problem. And we go and 833 00:44:22.219 --> 00:44:25.329 ask for help on Y. And we never tell people 834 00:44:26.010 --> 00:44:30.190 what X is. And the smart consultants or the smart thinkers, 835 00:44:31.030 --> 00:44:33.909 when they listen to it, the first thing they should 836 00:44:33.949 --> 00:44:36.369 ask is, what problem are you trying to solve? and 837 00:44:36.429 --> 00:44:39.210 that gets them to explain x and then you're like 838 00:44:39.230 --> 00:44:41.650 oh okay that's the thing that you think is the 839 00:44:41.690 --> 00:44:44.360 thing isn't the thing you should be thinking about this 840 00:44:44.820 --> 00:44:46.960 and it's oftentimes the thing that i do when i 841 00:44:47.000 --> 00:44:51.199 see people talking it's rife in technical people because and 842 00:44:51.219 --> 00:44:54.000 i'm still in lots of like technical groups is that 843 00:44:54.039 --> 00:44:56.409 they always come because they've done all of the thinking 844

00:44:56.429 --> 00:44:58.389 they've done a lot of work and they're asking they 845 00:44:58.530 --> 00:45:01.469 always ask about why i need help doing and i 846 00:45:01.489 --> 00:45:03.929 just chip in what problem do you want to solve 847 00:45:03.949 --> 00:45:06.809 when they explain that you're like And then even more 848 00:45:06.829 --> 00:45:09.460 people are like, why are you doing this? This isn't 849 00:45:09.500 --> 00:45:10.320 the right thing to do. 850 00:45:10.659 --> 00:45:13.000 It's like the Irish traveler when he's asking for directions 851 00:45:13.039 --> 00:45:14.519 and he says, how'd you get to so-and-so? And the 852 00:45:14.539 --> 00:45:18.440 other guy says, well, I wouldn't start from here. It depends. 853 00:45:18.519 --> 00:45:20.360 I wouldn't go this from here. You know, it's like 854 00:45:20.460 --> 00:45:22.420 too late now. It's that, why are you trying to 855 00:45:22.440 --> 00:45:24.449 get there? And how are we going to help you? 856 00:45:24.750 --> 00:45:25.369 I love that. 857 00:45:25.690 --> 00:45:29.050 It really is. It's so true. And quite often we 858 00:45:29.110 --> 00:45:33.789 think we know why we're doing something. And in reality, it's, 859 00:45:34.130 --> 00:45:37.170 that's not the solution to the problem that we have. 860 00:45:38.050 --> 00:45:39.809 So you go, there's the problem. So this is going 861 00:45:39.829 --> 00:45:41.909 to be the solution. So this is my workaround. This 862 00:45:41.969 --> 00:45:42.849 is how I'm going to do it, but I can't 863 00:45:42.869 --> 00:45:44.730 do that last bit. And if you go back to 864 00:45:44.750 --> 00:45:46.739 the back, to the back, to the beginning, you go, well, 865 00:45:46.929 --> 00:45:47.989 why are you trying to do it that way? Why 866 00:45:48.010 --> 00:45:51.840 don't you do it that way? And they're like, oh yeah, 867 00:45:51.980 --> 00:45:52.699 it's that moment. 868 00:45:54.019 --> 00:46:00.000 Yeah. And it's oftentimes where expertise, experience, knowledge comes into play. 869 00:46:00.019 --> 00:46:02.360 Someone that's seen it before, been there before can just go, 870 00:46:03.659 --> 00:46:05.260 Or if you just lifted it up and turned it over, 871 00:46:05.280 --> 00:46:08.429 there's instructions there. Or something like that. It can be 872 00:46:08.449 --> 00:46:11.630 real kicky moments, being like, oh, I didn't know that 873 00:46:11.670 --> 00:46:14.150 that was a thing. So this happened recently. I'm telling 874 00:46:14.230 --> 00:46:17.929 my wife's story. She went to see a sister who 875 00:46:17.949 --> 00:46:21.349 lives in Herefordshire. And she's like, can I use your toilet? 876 00:46:21.489 --> 00:46:23.530 And they're like, yeah. The back downstairs toilet is just 877 00:46:23.610 --> 00:46:26.449 in there. And they said, don't panic when it doesn't 878 00:46:26.530 --> 00:46:30.679 have a lock. And she's like, OK. She goes in. 879 00:46:31.869 --> 00:46:34.320 She comes back out. She's like, does it have a lock? 880 00:46:35.119 --> 00:46:38.960 I'm like, no, it doesn't. We've seen, there's nothing. It does. 881 00:46:39.219 --> 00:46:40.869 What you do is you put the handle down and 882 00:46:40.889 --> 00:46:42.909 there's a little button on the handle. If you press that, 883 00:46:43.010 --> 00:46:46.690 it locks it. And they were like, they've been in 884 00:46:46.730 --> 00:46:49.369 this house for nearly a year and they had no 885 00:46:49.530 --> 00:46:52.809 idea that they'd be telling everybody that this downstairs toilet 886 00:46:52.829 --> 00:46:55.340 doesn't have a lock it doesn't lock and she just 887 00:46:55.360 --> 00:46:58.619 went click there you go but it's you know you 888 00:46:58.659 --> 00:47:00.960 can have expectations of a thing and then you believe 889 00:47:01.000 --> 00:47:04.360 it as well because you're like I have formed expectations 890 00:47:04.400 --> 00:47:06.309 in my mind this is now the truth and then 891 00:47:06.329 --> 00:47:08.469 someone comes along and shatters those by going uh. 892 00:47:10.030 --> 00:47:11.800 Oh I love it. 893 00:47:11.920 --> 00:47:14.500 And then you feel a bit dumb, but that's, I 894 00:47:14.519 --> 00:47:18.599 don't think, and it's one of those weird LinkedIn stories about, oh, 895 00:47:18.679 --> 00:47:20.579 I saw something and it made me think about business. 896 00:47:21.530 --> 00:47:23.570 But these are things that happen in business is that 897 00:47:23.610 --> 00:47:25.730 don't be afraid to ask about these things that you 898 00:47:25.750 --> 00:47:29.070 think you have like firm beliefs on because somebody else 899 00:47:29.110 --> 00:47:30.070 can crush those things. 900 00:47:30.929 --> 00:47:31.630 Absolutely. 901 00:47:32.230 --> 00:47:34.809 But for your benefit, because it's better to know, right? 902 00:47:34.889 --> 00:47:36.909 And I didn't know I could do it this way. 903 00:47:36.929 --> 00:47:40.889 That's a lot easier than doing, because you've built some oh, 904 00:47:40.949 --> 00:47:44.469 what are those stupid machines? You know, the really complex 905 00:47:44.550 --> 00:47:46.969 machines that people, you know, that like have the ball 906 00:47:46.989 --> 00:47:49.550 that rolls down the thing. And it does all of 907 00:47:49.570 --> 00:47:52.190 this stuff just to open a door or just to, 908 00:47:52.210 --> 00:47:56.199 you know, do something. You could have just done that. 909 00:47:56.960 --> 00:48:00.340 But it's one of those people build these wild machines. 910 00:48:01.380 --> 00:48:04.159 um you know and it's you didn't need to you 911 00:48:04.179 --> 00:48:06.599 could have just done this really simple step what you 912 00:48:06.639 --> 00:48:08.300 didn't know you know what. 913 00:48:08.199 --> 00:48:10.880 That's that's one of the reasons i like collaborating global 914 00:48:10.900 --> 00:48:13.519 because when you are stuck you've got somebody else you 915 00:48:13.539 --> 00:48:15.639 can go to and you don't have to

feel like 916 00:48:15.659 --> 00:48:18.239 you're being stupid i'm not sure i was gonna do 917 00:48:18.300 --> 00:48:20.320 this what do you think about and you've got somebody 918 00:48:20.360 --> 00:48:22.800 you can bounce an idea off of and they're like 919 00:48:22.860 --> 00:48:24.239 what the hell are you doing that way i wouldn't 920 00:48:24.280 --> 00:48:26.510 go that do that way you could try that oh 921 00:48:26.630 --> 00:48:28.769 great and and you can put your hand up and 922 00:48:28.809 --> 00:48:31.480 go This isn't working for me. I don't know what's 923 00:48:31.500 --> 00:48:34.019 going on, but can someone help me with that? And 924 00:48:34.139 --> 00:48:37.519 having other people that you can allow yourself to go, 925 00:48:37.539 --> 00:48:40.960 I don't understand. I don't understand. I still don't understand. 926 00:48:41.019 --> 00:48:43.440 I still don't understand. I mean, there's other people that 927 00:48:43.460 --> 00:48:44.610 can go, have you thought of it this way? Have 928 00:48:44.619 --> 00:48:45.929 you seen it that way? You could look at it 929 00:48:45.989 --> 00:48:48.349 that way. And it just makes me go, oh, I'm 930 00:48:48.449 --> 00:48:50.949 not on my own. I'm not that idiot that's just 931 00:48:50.989 --> 00:48:53.550 on her own. I always say we've got a Thursday 932 00:48:53.630 --> 00:48:56.690 question and answer session just online. People have got a 933 00:48:56.710 --> 00:48:58.699 question they can ask her. And I say the only 934 00:48:58.760 --> 00:49:01.739 stupid question is the one that you don't ask. If 935 00:49:01.780 --> 00:49:03.860 you've got a problem and you don't ask the question, 936 00:49:03.889 --> 00:49:07.349 then you're the one that's stupid because we've got people here. 937 00:49:07.369 --> 00:49:09.710 And if we don't know, we probably know the person 938 00:49:09.750 --> 00:49:12.070 that does that can get you out of that jam 939 00:49:12.110 --> 00:49:14.590 that you might be in or of your own creation usually. 940 00:49:14.610 --> 00:49:19.079 And I'm quite happy when we have meetings like members 941 00:49:19.099 --> 00:49:22.159 meetings and somebody will say it's usually a business coach 942 00:49:22.179 --> 00:49:24.980 will go can I just challenge you on that and 943 00:49:25.039 --> 00:49:27.239 some days you're like oh not today I can't cope 944 00:49:27.260 --> 00:49:28.920 with that but other days it's like yeah go on 945 00:49:28.980 --> 00:49:30.940 and everyone kind of sits forward because they want to 946 00:49:30.980 --> 00:49:33.519 know the answer for themselves you know you might say 947 00:49:33.539 --> 00:49:35.219 something a bit silly and they're like can I challenge 948 00:49:35.260 --> 00:49:37.139 you on that what did you mean by that bit 949 00:49:37.219 --> 00:49:40.159 or if How do you see yourself in that situation? 950 00:49:40.639 --> 00:49:43.559 And then when you actually stop and go, no, that 951 00:49:43.619 --> 00:49:46.199 isn't what I meant at all. Actually, I said those words, 952 00:49:46.239 --> 00:49:48.739 but what I meant was, and then it helps you 953 00:49:48.760 --> 00:49:50.869 to unpack what's going on in your head. Cause I 954 00:49:50.869 --> 00:49:53.719 don't know about you, but nine times out of 10, 955 00:49:53.710 --> 00:49:55.210 the day goes bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang, bang. 956 00:49:55.429 --> 00:49:57.630 And you're like, and you're just doing the doing and 957 00:49:57.650 --> 00:49:59.909 you don't actually get much space for why was I 958 00:49:59.969 --> 00:50:01.769 doing it that way? Or is there an easy way 959 00:50:01.829 --> 00:50:03.909 to do it? And I shouldn't have done that that way. 960 00:50:03.969 --> 00:50:07.389 And you just get the job done and, Quite often 961 00:50:07.429 --> 00:50:10.030 it's bad. It doesn't work at all. It's making the 962 00:50:10.070 --> 00:50:12.829 situation worse. I know, I put my hand up. I've 963 00:50:12.849 --> 00:50:14.510 been having a problem with Zoom. It's not my best 964 00:50:14.550 --> 00:50:17.090 friend at the moment, but it will be from now on. 965 00:50:17.210 --> 00:50:20.239 And the details aren't important, but I've had to ask 966 00:50:20.280 --> 00:50:22.619 a load of people, what do you do? 967 00:50:22.639 --> 00:50:23.119 What do you do? 968 00:50:23.159 --> 00:50:25.239 What are you doing? Bit by bit, I've kind of 969 00:50:25.340 --> 00:50:28.039 unpacked where it's gone. And now I'm not a techie, 970 00:50:28.500 --> 00:50:30.260 so I feel quite proud of myself that I've done this, 971 00:50:30.659 --> 00:50:34.110 but I kind of wanted to be in control so 972 00:50:34.150 --> 00:50:37.280 that I could, you know, feel like, Now I know 973 00:50:37.599 --> 00:50:40.280 where the problem came from, what it was, what it 974 00:50:40.300 --> 00:50:43.159 was stopping me doing. And now I think, she said, 975 00:50:43.179 --> 00:50:47.380 you never know with tech. I think it's all OK again. 976 00:50:47.860 --> 00:50:50.300 So I just like to be able to fail. 977 00:50:50.320 --> 00:50:57.880 Yeah, fail often, fail fast, fail often. Yes. Yeah. Again, 978 00:50:58.340 --> 00:51:00.880 people talk about in tech quite a lot, but do 979 00:51:01.079 --> 00:51:04.599 it as much as possible. I'm going to just one 980 00:51:04.639 --> 00:51:06.960 thing for all the people listening at home is shouting 981 00:51:06.980 --> 00:51:10.300 at the screen. Heath Robinson, Heath Robinson machines. They're the 982 00:51:10.360 --> 00:51:13.760 thing that I was describing. You can Google Heath Robinson. 983 00:51:13.800 --> 00:51:18.840 You'll see the complex machines. But yes, fail fast and 984 00:51:18.880 --> 00:51:23.820 fail often is a really good principle to live by. 985 00:51:25.610 --> 00:51:29.869 As Bezos describes, most decisions are a two-way door. Like, 986 00:51:30.309 --> 00:51:32.730 if you can understand enough about the decision you have 987 00:51:32.769 -->

00:51:35.309 to make and what's going to happen afterwards, you realize 988 00:51:35.329 --> 00:51:37.550 that most of the time you can walk back on it. 989 00:51:37.690 --> 00:51:39.300 You can go, I tried that, it didn't work, let's 990 00:51:39.320 --> 00:51:43.380 do something else. And on those, he always would advocate 991 00:51:43.420 --> 00:51:45.440 within his teams that if it was a two-way decision, 992 00:51:45.460 --> 00:51:48.239 you didn't need to involve him in the decision. Because 993 00:51:48.300 --> 00:51:50.579 it's like, if it's a two-way door, don't care, because 994 00:51:50.619 --> 00:51:52.349 if it doesn't work, just walk back through the door 995 00:51:52.369 --> 00:51:54.690 and we'll do something else. If it was a one-way door, 996 00:51:54.710 --> 00:51:58.159 it's like, if we go down this path... Like if, 997 00:51:58.800 --> 00:52:02.380 I don't know, for some decision that Amazon decides to 998 00:52:02.480 --> 00:52:06.429 back a public, you know, the Republican Party on their website, 999 00:52:06.840 --> 00:52:09.929 it's probably no going back from putting things on there, right? 1000 00:52:10.349 --> 00:52:14.469 So maybe, so he would want to be involved in 1001 00:52:15.050 --> 00:52:16.769 things like this will set us on a path that 1002 00:52:16.789 --> 00:52:18.590 we can never go back on. We have to go 1003 00:52:18.630 --> 00:52:22.710 down this path. then and those decisions don't come along 1004 00:52:22.750 --> 00:52:25.809 as often as what people think like mostly like you've 1005 00:52:25.969 --> 00:52:28.949 changed your website and it doesn't look great and you've 1006 00:52:28.969 --> 00:52:30.429 tried it for a couple of months and you're like 1007 00:52:30.570 --> 00:52:32.610 oh i can't change it now because people know what 1008 00:52:32.630 --> 00:52:35.030 it looks like no one's been on your website no 1009 00:52:35.090 --> 00:52:38.389 one cares like honestly no one cares like change the 1010 00:52:38.429 --> 00:52:42.099 title change your linkedin title no one cares No one cares. 1011 00:52:42.179 --> 00:52:44.000 I know people that change it every week. I watch 1012 00:52:44.019 --> 00:52:46.559 them change it every week because they're testing. They want 1013 00:52:46.579 --> 00:52:50.059 to see what works. And so change your about section. 1014 00:52:50.420 --> 00:52:51.019 No one cares. 1015 00:52:51.079 --> 00:52:54.539 And what works today might not work in five years 1016 00:52:54.559 --> 00:52:55.579 or even five weeks time. 1017 00:52:56.239 --> 00:52:59.960 Exactly, because you'll learn stuff. You'll find, oh, I don't do, actually, 1018 00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:02.820 I found my niche. So I should say that. Yeah, 1019 00:53:02.860 --> 00:53:06.000 you probably should, because it will get you more clients. Like, it's, 1020 00:53:06.599 --> 00:53:10.099 you know, focus on, just change stuff, just test stuff, 1021 00:53:10.139 --> 00:53:14.630 just see what works. Nobody cares. Like, honestly. nobody's going 1022 00:53:14.789 --> 00:53:19.389 to sleep thinking about Jill changed her status again on 1023 00:53:19.409 --> 00:53:23.420 LinkedIn nobody cares like nobody cares honestly. 1024 00:53:23.159 --> 00:53:25.960 Nobody's talking about me down the pub it's outrageous they 1025 00:53:26.039 --> 00:53:27.440 should be talking about the all-day. 1026 00:53:27.179 --> 00:53:30.260 Love and I think that's again where people live in 1027 00:53:30.300 --> 00:53:32.500 their heads people live in their heads thinking that people 1028 00:53:32.559 --> 00:53:36.059 care about the things that they do nobody cares and 1029 00:53:36.409 --> 00:53:38.469 we're all going to die some days as well just 1030 00:53:38.530 --> 00:53:40.820 get on with what you enjoy doing I. 1031 00:53:40.780 --> 00:53:45.380 Think there's a lot of historical weight carried to that emotion. 1032 00:53:45.400 --> 00:53:47.440 Because I remember as a child, it's like, what will 1033 00:53:47.460 --> 00:53:52.159 the neighbours say? And I don't care, mother. I really 1034 00:53:52.199 --> 00:53:54.449 don't care. They can say it to their heart's content. 1035 00:53:54.989 --> 00:53:55.489 They can move. 1036 00:53:56.110 --> 00:53:58.409 It's not that bad. Yes, I'm going to leave home. 1037 00:53:58.429 --> 00:53:59.329 So you don't have to worry about it. 1038 00:53:59.329 --> 00:53:59.590 All right. 1039 00:54:00.650 --> 00:54:03.849 But yeah, we worry too much about what other people 1040 00:54:03.869 --> 00:54:06.429 get up to, what other people do. It's what Instagram's 1041 00:54:06.469 --> 00:54:09.110 all about, isn't it? Keeping up with the Joneses. 1042 00:54:09.690 --> 00:54:13.869 Yeah, which is fine if that's your thing, good. That's 1043 00:54:13.909 --> 00:54:21.760 totally okay, but they're not thinking about you. So what? 1044 00:54:22.480 --> 00:54:26.860 I've always really struggled with the concept of fame because 1045 00:54:27.840 --> 00:54:32.739 you know how people can be obsessive about fame and 1046 00:54:33.260 --> 00:54:36.619 you know, pop stars, film stars, whatever it is. And 1047 00:54:36.639 --> 00:54:38.320 they want to get, even to the point of, I 1048 00:54:38.360 --> 00:54:40.949 just want to go because I want to get that 1049 00:54:40.969 --> 00:54:47.070 person's autograph. And I'm like, why? Yeah. I, I never 1050 00:54:47.130 --> 00:54:50.050 understood it. And if I'd met famous people, I used 1051 00:54:50.070 --> 00:54:54.000 to many, many moons ago, I was, uh, a skater 1052 00:54:54.039 --> 00:54:55.800 and I used to hang around with, you know, and 1053 00:54:55.840 --> 00:54:58.050 I got the opportunity to go to some like big 1054 00:54:58.110 --> 00:55:00.489 tournaments and I would meet professional skaters. 1055 00:55:00.510 --> 00:55:01.070 Right. 1056 00:55:01.590 --> 00:55:05.909 And like, they were friends of mine in Apoplexy because 1057 00:55:05.949 --> 00:55:07.750 these people were close by and I'd just

go up 1058 00:55:07.789 --> 00:55:10.730 to them and go, so, I just, I'm, I just 1059 00:55:10.750 --> 00:55:13.639 start talking to them. Turns out, well enough they're humans 1060 00:55:14.039 --> 00:55:16.719 yes and just having a conversation with them they just 1061 00:55:16.760 --> 00:55:19.019 have a conversation back and then i end up sitting 1062 00:55:19.039 --> 00:55:20.679 with them drinking a beer with them and i got 1063 00:55:20.760 --> 00:55:24.329 more engagement with that person now will you sign of 1064 00:55:24.409 --> 00:55:28.690 course it just never like this is weird right and 1065 00:55:28.750 --> 00:55:31.750 it just makes me feel weird someone wanted my autograph would. 1066 00:55:31.650 --> 00:55:36.559 Be like why yeah yeah go away i had that 1067 00:55:36.579 --> 00:55:39.760 experience once when i was at um the london golf 1068 00:55:39.800 --> 00:55:42.480 club for an event that was going on and I 1069 00:55:42.519 --> 00:55:44.239 was a little bit early so I had my little 1070 00:55:44.260 --> 00:55:46.539 laptop sat in the corner waiting away and some of 1071 00:55:46.559 --> 00:55:48.420 the guys that were coming to the event came high 1072 00:55:48.440 --> 00:55:49.559 they got themselves a drink. 1073 00:55:49.360 --> 00:55:51.199 And all of a sudden I felt behind me the 1074 00:55:51.219 --> 00:55:53.219 atmosphere changed and I was like what's going on and 1075 00:55:53.239 --> 00:55:56.289 they were like and I'm like I didn't know these 1076 00:55:56.329 --> 00:55:58.909 guys from Adam right apparently it was the England football 1077 00:55:58.929 --> 00:56:01.269 team at the time so we're going back about 10 1078 00:56:01.269 --> 00:56:07.010 years so I think I recognized Jamie Redknapp because he's 1079 00:56:07.110 --> 00:56:09.789 Louise's husband he was at the time so that's that 1080 00:56:09.809 --> 00:56:11.849 was my And so they're all going, oh, my God. 1081 00:56:11.989 --> 00:56:14.469 I said, look, you're like 10 yards away. Go and 1082 00:56:14.510 --> 00:56:16.929 say hello. Go and say they're just standing there with 1083 00:56:16.969 --> 00:56:19.409 a drink, chatting to each other. They're not sitting down 1084 00:56:19.429 --> 00:56:21.699 having dinner. It's not a private conversation. 1085 00:56:21.719 --> 00:56:22.639 We're in a bar. 1086 00:56:23.280 --> 00:56:25.639 Go and say, I think you're a brilliant footballer. 1087 00:56:25.780 --> 00:56:26.539 I can't do that. 1088 00:56:27.000 --> 00:56:29.340 You wouldn't do that. Why wouldn't I? I said I 1089 00:56:29.380 --> 00:56:30.659 wouldn't because I don't like football. 1090 00:56:30.679 --> 00:56:30.880 Right. 1091 00:56:30.920 --> 00:56:33.909 But why don't you go? Anyway, I didn't realize at 1092 00:56:33.929 --> 00:56:40.070 the time, but it was Celebrity. pro football golf championship thing. 1093 00:56:40.090 --> 00:56:41.449 Yeah. 1094 00:56:41.800 --> 00:56:44.239 So this guy came in and it was Len Goodman. 1095 00:56:44.380

--> 00:56:47.340 You might not know Len Goodman from Strictly Come Dancing. 1096 00:56:47.920 --> 00:56:49.639 And he was there chatting to people and this guy 1097 00:56:50.119 --> 00:56:52.099 punched me on the arm and Gordon, you like Strictly 1098 00:56:52.119 --> 00:56:54.960 Come Dancing. Look, there's Len Goodman over there. I said, hello, really? 1099 00:56:55.519 --> 00:56:56.019 And I was off. 1100 00:56:56.559 --> 00:56:58.860 I went and I chatted with Len Goodman. He bought 1101 00:56:58.889 --> 00:57:01.110 me a nice drink. I said, my mother loves you 1102 00:57:01.150 --> 00:57:02.550 and it's brilliant. Can I have a hug? And all 1103 00:57:02.570 --> 00:57:04.210 the rest of it. And then I was late to 1104 00:57:04.230 --> 00:57:05.889 my meeting, which was a bit naughty. And they were like, 1105 00:57:06.260 --> 00:57:08.280 I can't believe you did that. I said, look, I 1106 00:57:08.360 --> 00:57:10.469 admire the man. I'm going to go up and say, 1107 00:57:10.489 --> 00:57:13.329 I think dancing is amazing. I think the show is brilliant. 1108 00:57:13.389 --> 00:57:15.190 I love what you do on the show. You seem 1109 00:57:15.230 --> 00:57:18.269 like a really fair judge. People like being told nice 1110 00:57:18.289 --> 00:57:20.769 things about themselves. So I had no qualms in going 1111 00:57:20.849 --> 00:57:23.429 up and I didn't want his autograph. I didn't want to, 1112 00:57:23.869 --> 00:57:25.590 you know, I just wanted to say to my mum, 1113 00:57:25.699 --> 00:57:26.599 I've met Lynn Goodman. 1114 00:57:26.619 --> 00:57:30.579 He's lovely. You engaged with him. Yeah. Not like you 1115 00:57:30.599 --> 00:57:33.380 didn't want anything from him. There was no demand of time. 1116 00:57:33.400 --> 00:57:38.900 There's no interruption of his day. And it's like to 1117 00:57:38.920 --> 00:57:41.179 weirdly flip it into business. If you can be like 1118 00:57:41.219 --> 00:57:45.219 that with people in sales, like if you can engage 1119 00:57:45.480 --> 00:57:49.500 and you can show genuine interest in them, not like 1120 00:57:49.539 --> 00:57:51.699 you're trying to jam what you're trying to sell down 1121 00:57:51.739 --> 00:57:52.280 their throat. 1122 00:57:52.300 --> 00:57:53.360 Right. 1123 00:57:53.699 --> 00:57:55.300 But if you can just engage with them and get 1124 00:57:55.320 --> 00:57:57.480 to know them, it's way more likely they'll be more 1125 00:57:57.519 --> 00:57:59.820 interested in talking to you again. Right. 1126 00:58:00.360 --> 00:58:04.320 Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. And the thing is when you 1127 00:58:04.400 --> 00:58:08.320 are genuinely interested in a person, the connection is so 1128 00:58:08.360 --> 00:58:11.579 much stronger than if you go up to them and go, hey, 1129 00:58:11.599 --> 00:58:13.400 this is my 60-second pitch. I'm going to tell you 1130 00:58:13.420 --> 00:58:15.380 exactly what I do. And they're like, I don't care 1131 00:58:15.420 --> 00:58:17.380 what you do for a living. Tell me what you're 1132 00:58:17.400 --> 00:58:19.519 passionate about. Tell me what gets you out of bed 1133 00:58:19.539 --> 00:58:21.340 in the morning. Tell me what you do for funsies 1134 00:58:21.389 --> 00:58:23.190 so that I can remember you. So they go, oh, yeah, 1135 00:58:23.230 --> 00:58:26.929 that's the guy that does the websites or whatever. It's 1136 00:58:26.969 --> 00:58:30.210 a different ballgame. But treat human beings as human beings 1137 00:58:30.289 --> 00:58:33.289 and be interested in your fellow human being. And they 1138 00:58:33.329 --> 00:58:35.150 will remember you more because you listened. 1139 00:58:36.300 --> 00:58:38.860 That's it. And if you're wondering what to say, I've 1140 00:58:38.900 --> 00:58:41.699 got this great tip that I've used in networking. It's 1141 00:58:41.719 --> 00:58:47.730 called high-low buffalo. High-low buffalo. So you say something good 1142 00:58:48.489 --> 00:58:51.329 that's happening to you. You say something bad that isn't 1143 00:58:51.369 --> 00:58:55.139 going so well. And then some sort of random fact 1144 00:58:55.199 --> 00:58:59.760 about yourself is your buffalo. That's your gear for small talk. 1145 00:58:59.800 --> 00:59:01.960 And at some point, either on the high, the low, 1146 00:59:02.139 --> 00:59:05.699 or the buffalo... it's likely to get them to engage 1147 00:59:05.719 --> 00:59:09.179 with you and talk about things. right so you can 1148 00:59:09.320 --> 00:59:10.980 and you can flip it on them and you can 1149 00:59:11.059 --> 00:59:13.590 ask you know what's going what's going well what's what's 1150 00:59:13.630 --> 00:59:16.510 not going so well tell me something like what would 1151 00:59:16.530 --> 00:59:18.750 you not normally tell somebody that you think is really 1152 00:59:18.769 --> 00:59:21.489 interesting about you like people will engage you and you 1153 00:59:21.510 --> 00:59:23.190 can just and the best thing you can do is 1154 00:59:23.230 --> 00:59:25.760 let other people talk like if you hate small talk 1155 00:59:26.050 --> 00:59:28.780 just just ask them things that get them to talk i. 1156 00:59:28.719 --> 00:59:31.570 Have three questions that are gonna be you know, you 1157 00:59:31.610 --> 00:59:33.590 can get them going and that's, then just sit back 1158 00:59:33.630 --> 00:59:35.869 and listen. And then they think you're the nicest person 1159 00:59:35.909 --> 00:59:38.199 in the room because they don't realise that you were 1160 00:59:38.239 --> 00:59:40.219 just doing the listening. They just think you're amazing and 1161 00:59:40.300 --> 00:59:41.699 you've told them all these wonderful things. 1162 00:59:42.059 --> 00:59:45.480 Yeah. And it's them talking and it's the, tell me 1163 00:59:45.500 --> 00:59:49.800 more about that. Oh, that's so interesting. And the trick 1164 00:59:49.820 --> 00:59:52.820 to being interested in stuff is actually being interested in it. 1165 00:59:53.280 --> 00:59:55.010 It's the same as

like, you know, how do we 1166 00:59:55.050 --> 00:59:59.050 care more about our employees? Actually care about them. Yeah. 1167 01:00:00.110 --> 01:00:00.550 Give a shit. 1168 01:00:01.219 --> 01:00:04.329 Yeah actually give a shit and then it that will 1169 01:00:04.630 --> 01:00:07.070 that will like rub off and it will happen you 1170 01:00:07.110 --> 01:00:09.739 can't fake stuff like that you have to actually care 1171 01:00:10.159 --> 01:00:13.679 but actually be interesting want to know more like it's 1172 01:00:13.960 --> 01:00:15.820 quite clear that not all of the things they're talking 1173 01:00:15.840 --> 01:00:19.489 about are super interesting but get them to talk if 1174 01:00:19.530 --> 01:00:21.690 you find that you you can get them to feel 1175 01:00:21.710 --> 01:00:25.659 like they're interesting They will keep talking. It's the same 1176 01:00:25.719 --> 01:00:28.300 in like a sales thing. Like the person that is 1177 01:00:28.659 --> 01:00:32.340 asking the questions is in control. It's the same with negotiations. 1178 01:00:32.360 --> 01:00:34.469 It's the same with, you know, all that sort of, 1179 01:00:34.469 --> 01:00:39.349 you know, interrogation, right? Via asking the questions. Like you 1180 01:00:39.389 --> 01:00:42.110 want to be the people asking the questions and getting 1181 01:00:42.170 --> 01:00:46.230 them to impart information because they feel like you're interested, 1182 01:00:46.250 --> 01:00:48.809 that you care, that you're listening, especially if you can 1183 01:00:48.849 --> 01:00:52.960 repeat that stuff back. So you said this. That's really interesting. 1184 01:00:53.019 --> 01:00:55.440 Tell me more about that and get them to dig 1185 01:00:55.519 --> 01:00:58.980 into those little bits. And you just, it's a game 1186 01:00:59.019 --> 01:01:01.820 of tennis where you just keep saying, you said that, 1187 01:01:02.260 --> 01:01:06.889 that's super interesting. And that's like the level that you 1188 01:01:06.909 --> 01:01:09.110 need to get to. If you can just find this 1189 01:01:09.170 --> 01:01:11.230 and go, oh, that's a nugget that I think they 1190 01:01:11.250 --> 01:01:14.130 should talk more about. Tell me more about that. You 1191 01:01:14.170 --> 01:01:16.409 said that that was really, is that really important to you? 1192 01:01:16.909 --> 01:01:20.289 Yeah, absolutely. So on that note, let me ask you 1193 01:01:20.309 --> 01:01:22.630 a question, a final question, because we're coming to the 1194 01:01:22.710 --> 01:01:25.260 close of our time. What is it that you're passionate 1195 01:01:25.300 --> 01:01:27.960 about in your life? It could be a funsy thing, 1196 01:01:28.000 --> 01:01:30.019 it could be to do with your business, but what's 1197 01:01:30.059 --> 01:01:32.260 that thing that, it might be the thing that makes 1198 01:01:32.280 --> 01:01:34.199 you angry, or it might be the thing that just goes, oh, 1199 01:01:34.340 --> 01:01:36.679 I love doing that. What are you passionate about in 1200 01:01:36.719 --> 01:01:37.059 your life? 1201 01:01:38.760 --> 01:01:39.789 I like working. 1202 01:01:41.269 --> 01:01:41.710 That's nice. 1203 01:01:41.750 --> 01:01:46.219 I do. I like working. I am passionate about I 1204 01:01:46.619 --> 01:01:49.800 like helping people. I like the idea that things that 1205 01:01:49.820 --> 01:01:57.489 I'm doing, providing value to other people, energizes me. Imparting knowledge, 1206 01:01:57.590 --> 01:02:02.969 teaching people. That's the stuff. I coached rugby. for as 1207 01:02:03.070 --> 01:02:05.130 long as I can remember as well with my kids 1208 01:02:05.170 --> 01:02:07.489 being in rugby and I always end up because I 1209 01:02:07.550 --> 01:02:10.889 played people go oh well you can coach not really 1210 01:02:11.369 --> 01:02:13.070 being good at something doesn't mean you can teach other 1211 01:02:13.110 --> 01:02:14.590 people how to be good at it it's not a 1212 01:02:14.610 --> 01:02:18.889 direct translation but I would learn and be like well 1213 01:02:19.260 --> 01:02:22.179 can I coach so okay how do I do that 1214 01:02:22.199 --> 01:02:24.619 and then been involved in that so my son is 1215 01:02:24.619 --> 01:02:29.199 17 and he started at under fives and I've coached 1216 01:02:29.260 --> 01:02:31.760 him all the way through that now to the now 1217 01:02:31.860 --> 01:02:34.429 in his under 18s and i've coached all the way 1218 01:02:34.449 --> 01:02:37.769 through for various different teams in various different ways but 1219 01:02:37.789 --> 01:02:41.349 i've always been involved good fun right and it's i 1220 01:02:41.369 --> 01:02:44.710 always enjoyed that i enjoyed engaging with those people um 1221 01:02:45.030 --> 01:02:48.809 and getting them to make them better than they thought 1222 01:02:48.849 --> 01:02:51.469 they could be i think that is always the goal 1223 01:02:51.510 --> 01:02:54.380 of imparting knowledge is to get somebody to a level 1224 01:02:54.409 --> 01:02:56.599 where they didn't think that they could get there and 1225 01:02:56.619 --> 01:02:59.789 then you've helped them get there it isn't just like 1226 01:03:00.230 --> 01:03:03.389 now you can throw a ball because that's what they 1227 01:03:03.429 --> 01:03:06.110 wanted to learn yeah but now you can throw a 1228 01:03:06.130 --> 01:03:08.510 ball better than you thought you were going to be 1229 01:03:08.679 --> 01:03:12.639 able to throw a ball that's special that's they will 1230 01:03:12.659 --> 01:03:15.179 remember that forever like those are good things that they 1231 01:03:15.199 --> 01:03:17.280 will take away so it's you always want to try 1232 01:03:17.300 --> 01:03:21.679 and over deliver in that sort of space and that's 1233 01:03:21.699 --> 01:03:24.110 what I try and do um sometimes it's to my 1234 01:03:24.130 --> 01:03:27.369 detriment but I always try and over deliver and try 1235 01:03:27.389 --> 01:03:29.550 and help people yeah you know and a lot of

1236 01:03:29.570 --> 01:03:33.170 the things I talk about with people is because I 1237 01:03:33.230 --> 01:03:38.130 want them to win I genuinely like if you do 1238 01:03:38.190 --> 01:03:40.389 these things and do them really well this will earn 1239 01:03:40.409 --> 01:03:42.670 you a lot of money and you know I'd say 1240 01:03:42.789 --> 01:03:48.139 like um generally what people don't like hearing is unfortunately 1241 01:03:48.179 --> 01:03:51.019 some of the things i talk about doing really boring 1242 01:03:51.059 --> 01:03:53.260 stuff is where you'll make lots of money and people 1243 01:03:53.300 --> 01:03:55.389 want to be exciting and i like to say this 1244 01:03:55.449 --> 01:03:58.670 right back to the start yeah you should do the 1245 01:03:58.690 --> 01:03:59.610 thing that they love. 1246 01:03:59.409 --> 01:04:04.250 And it's like you should but be prepared to do 1247 01:04:04.309 --> 01:04:08.050 really boring stuff like and it won't be all the 1248 01:04:08.090 --> 01:04:11.289 things that you look because if This again goes back 1249 01:04:11.309 --> 01:04:12.329 to the avoidance stuff. 1250 01:04:12.550 --> 01:04:15.530 People hide behind the thing that they're good at. And 1251 01:04:15.550 --> 01:04:20.130 if you're really good at sales, but your delivery sucks, 1252 01:04:21.469 --> 01:04:24.429 you may get good clients coming in, but they won't 1253 01:04:24.519 --> 01:04:27.059 stay for very long. Your churn will be high because 1254 01:04:27.079 --> 01:04:30.039 your delivery is awful. So you need to stop doing 1255 01:04:30.059 --> 01:04:33.500 the thing that you love, which is sales, and start 1256 01:04:33.539 --> 01:04:37.739 getting better at delivery. Or... we need to rent that 1257 01:04:37.780 --> 01:04:41.440 capacity from someone else or hire it, buy it in, right? 1258 01:04:42.039 --> 01:04:45.000 But you can only keep focused on the thing that 1259 01:04:45.019 --> 01:04:48.800 you love if you're willing to get someone to help 1260 01:04:48.840 --> 01:04:50.719 you with the things that you don't love or learn 1261 01:04:50.760 --> 01:04:54.050 how to do it yourself and shift that focus away 1262 01:04:54.409 --> 01:04:57.050 because it's an easy place to hide is in doing 1263 01:04:57.070 --> 01:05:00.489 the stuff that you're good at because it's easy. The 1264 01:05:00.510 --> 01:05:02.250 things that people love and things that people are good 1265 01:05:02.329 --> 01:05:05.510 at They're generally the easiest things that they do because 1266 01:05:05.530 --> 01:05:06.469 they've done it a lot. 1267 01:05:07.369 --> 01:05:11.630 What I always say about business is that it's not difficult, 1268 01:05:12.469 --> 01:05:15.630 but it is hard work. And there's stuff that you 1269 01:05:15.650 --> 01:05:18.139 have to do that you don't want to do. But 1270 01:05:18.880 --> 01:05:20.980 if you can get by on that or get someone 1271 01:05:21.000 --> 01:05:25.940 else to help you, not abdicating responsibility, but abdicating the 1272 01:05:26.000 --> 01:05:29.380 chore of doing it and then overseeing it, then you 1273 01:05:29.420 --> 01:05:31.500 can move forward. But what a lot of people think 1274 01:05:31.559 --> 01:05:34.210 is that I'm going to have an overnight success. I've 1275 01:05:34.230 --> 01:05:35.809 got this brilliant idea. I'm just going to get loads 1276 01:05:35.849 --> 01:05:38.010 of clients and it's going to be easy. There's all 1277 01:05:38.030 --> 01:05:40.389 the other stuff that goes with running a business as well. 1278 01:05:40.789 --> 01:05:44.050 It's not just that fun stuff in that corner. 1279 01:05:44.250 --> 01:05:48.110 So you could be the greatest painter and decorator in 1280 01:05:48.130 --> 01:05:51.230 the world. You can cut the best lines in, you 1281 01:05:51.269 --> 01:05:55.449 can mix the best paint, but if you can't sell 1282 01:05:55.869 --> 01:05:59.500 water to a man in the desert, Then it doesn't 1283 01:05:59.539 --> 01:06:01.260 matter how good you are at painting and decorating. If 1284 01:06:01.280 --> 01:06:03.539 you can't convince anyone to buy your services, you'll never 1285 01:06:03.579 --> 01:06:06.699 sell anything. There's always stuff that you didn't realize when 1286 01:06:06.739 --> 01:06:08.360 you're getting into business. And that's kind of what we 1287 01:06:08.900 --> 01:06:12.090 sit there as business coaches and mentors and advisors and 1288 01:06:12.130 --> 01:06:14.829 whatever to help people with is to help them with 1289 01:06:14.849 --> 01:06:17.530 those things that they didn't know were coming. Right. That 1290 01:06:17.550 --> 01:06:20.110 returns suck, but it's part of business. 1291 01:06:21.519 --> 01:06:24.380 Okay and luckily there's a lot of people out there 1292 01:06:24.400 --> 01:06:26.500 that you can hire to do those things for you 1293 01:06:26.739 --> 01:06:28.489 but no one wants to be sat in the car 1294 01:06:28.530 --> 01:06:30.969 on a friday night going through the back returns or 1295 01:06:30.989 --> 01:06:34.110 the invoices or chasing leads when all. 1296 01:06:34.070 --> 01:06:35.469 That makes it in the pub and you're sat in 1297 01:06:35.489 --> 01:06:39.090 your van you know not watching your kid play football 1298 01:06:39.130 --> 01:06:41.690 on a sunday morning because you're doing the things that 1299 01:06:41.710 --> 01:06:44.219 you hate like there are ways around that and there 1300 01:06:44.260 --> 01:06:45.480 are people out there that can help. 1301 01:06:45.340 --> 01:06:48.940 You yeah and you are one of them to help 1302 01:06:49.000 --> 01:06:53.489 identify those little things and niches and tricks of the 1303 01:06:53.530 --> 01:06:55.869 trade uh to get people free from the stuff they 1304 01:06:55.909 --> 01:06:58.190 don't want to do because that's ultimately why we're going 1305 01:06:58.230 --> 01:07:00.449 to business on our own isn't it one to have 1306 01:07:00.510 --> 01:07:02.750 control two for no one

to tell you what to 1307 01:07:02.789 --> 01:07:06.119 do and three to do the stuff you love but 1308 01:07:06.139 --> 01:07:08.099 there's a lot of other bits and pieces that get 1309 01:07:08.159 --> 01:07:11.179 caught up in that as well and sometimes it's a 1310 01:07:11.199 --> 01:07:13.800 reality check when you realize that you've got to do 1311 01:07:13.960 --> 01:07:17.059 everything but once you once you kind of have that 1312 01:07:17.119 --> 01:07:19.090 list of Well, I can do that, but I don't 1313 01:07:19.130 --> 01:07:20.929 want to do that. And then bit by bit by bit, 1314 01:07:20.949 --> 01:07:22.519 you get rid of those and you just get to 1315 01:07:22.599 --> 01:07:24.880 focus on stuff that you love to do. Like you 1316 01:07:24.920 --> 01:07:28.280 and me, it's the talking stuff. And now I don't 1317 01:07:28.320 --> 01:07:30.179 have to do reports because AI does it for me, 1318 01:07:30.219 --> 01:07:33.199 which is wonderful. I spent hours doing those. 1319 01:07:33.920 --> 01:07:36.429 It's funny that you should say that people start their 1320 01:07:36.469 --> 01:07:39.349 own business for no one to tell them what to do. 1321 01:07:39.610 --> 01:07:41.860 I think that's a really good reason why people do it. 1322 01:07:42.329 --> 01:07:44.650 And then people get out into business and realise they 1323 01:07:44.750 --> 01:07:50.019 really miss having someone telling them what to do. Because this, again, 1324 01:07:50.059 --> 01:07:53.110 places a digress there. You don't know what you need 1325 01:07:53.119 --> 01:07:56.369 to do next. That's why you had a boss. That's 1326 01:07:56.389 --> 01:07:59.309 why you had a CEO or whatever in that business 1327 01:07:59.329 --> 01:08:00.769 that would be like, well, I've made the plan. I 1328 01:08:00.809 --> 01:08:03.210 know what we should be doing. When it's you and 1329 01:08:03.250 --> 01:08:05.260 it's only you, especially if you're on your own, you're 1330 01:08:05.280 --> 01:08:08.019 a solo founder. Nobody's there telling you what to do. 1331 01:08:08.829 --> 01:08:10.789 There's some days where you can just be sat there going, 1332 01:08:10.989 --> 01:08:13.750 I have no idea what I should be doing next, 1333 01:08:14.210 --> 01:08:17.130 because all of your experience probably lives in the delivery. 1334 01:08:17.489 --> 01:08:19.380 It lives in the, I can go and do it, 1335 01:08:21.000 --> 01:08:23.600 but I need somebody to do it for. And they 1336 01:08:23.640 --> 01:08:25.539 don't even know that I exist, and I don't even 1337 01:08:25.560 --> 01:08:27.770 know how to let them know that I exist. and 1338 01:08:27.810 --> 01:08:29.880 all of those things and like how do you make 1339 01:08:29.920 --> 01:08:32.699 those plans i mean that's why people like us exist 1340 01:08:32.760 --> 01:08:35.520 and communities like this exist is for so you can 1341 01:08:35.539 --> 01:08:37.739 go i'm saying i don't know what to do next 1342 01:08:37.760 --> 01:08:41.739 because nobody you notice on linkedin nobody posts that nobody 1343 01:08:41.800 --> 01:08:44.800 says this sucks and i have no idea what i 1344 01:08:44.819 --> 01:08:46.960 should be doing next like i'm really good at this 1345 01:08:47.020 --> 01:08:49.140 thing i'm awful at all this other stuff because someone 1346 01:08:49.180 --> 01:08:51.239 helped me nobody says that on linkedin because everybody has 1347 01:08:51.260 --> 01:08:54.380 to wear that I should demonstrate the face, right? Where 1348 01:08:54.399 --> 01:08:57.789 it's like, I'm wonderful and you should buy my stuff. Like, great. 1349 01:08:58.229 --> 01:09:00.500 Nobody says that they're having a really bad month and 1350 01:09:00.779 --> 01:09:03.460 nobody wants to buy their stuff or whatever or they 1351 01:09:03.500 --> 01:09:05.560 don't know what to do and they're just sat there 1352 01:09:06.500 --> 01:09:09.220 you know with the lights off you know wondering what 1353 01:09:09.239 --> 01:09:10.579 the hell they should be doing with their life and 1354 01:09:10.619 --> 01:09:14.029 maybe they should get another job It's tough. And that's 1355 01:09:14.170 --> 01:09:16.640 why people like us exist and communities like this exist. 1356 01:09:16.649 --> 01:09:18.239 So you can come and ask and you can go 1357 01:09:18.279 --> 01:09:22.560 and find out, you can get that help because yeah, 1358 01:09:23.159 --> 01:09:27.560 I think as people, we actually sometimes really enjoy having 1359 01:09:27.600 --> 01:09:29.380 a little bit of, I don't have to think about 1360 01:09:29.420 --> 01:09:31.420 everything and somebody can just tell me what to do. 1361 01:09:33.399 --> 01:09:35.479 But they don't have to be people that are in 1362 01:09:35.520 --> 01:09:37.949 your business. They don't have to own your business. They 1363 01:09:37.989 --> 01:09:41.840 don't have to be your boss, but somebody who, like 1364 01:09:42.020 --> 01:09:45.539 a mentor or a coach or somebody that's just done 1365 01:09:45.579 --> 01:09:46.180 it before. 1366 01:09:46.520 --> 01:09:50.000 Been there and done it and know that experience. 1367 01:09:50.659 --> 01:09:53.229 Just do this. Focus a lot on that and then 1368 01:09:53.270 --> 01:09:55.329 go and do it as well. Someone says you should 1369 01:09:55.409 --> 01:09:58.789 invest a lot of time into this thing. Don't just 1370 01:09:58.970 --> 01:10:02.289 smile and wave. Go and do it because you've got 1371 01:10:02.329 --> 01:10:05.510 no one else to blame. Like if you want to win, 1372 01:10:05.789 --> 01:10:07.899 you've actually got to play the game to win. You 1373 01:10:07.939 --> 01:10:10.550 can't just... play the game to go ah. 1374 01:10:10.609 --> 01:10:13.869 I tried I did these little favorite bits over here 1375 01:10:13.949 --> 01:10:15.810 but I didn't quite get around to that stuff but 1376 01:10:16.090 --> 01:10:18.409 that's nobody. 1377 01:10:17.369 --> 01:10:21.329 Cares nobody cares but it comes back when you're like 1378

01:10:21.409 --> 01:10:24.350 I tried and everyone's like yeah so. 1379 01:10:26.409 --> 01:10:28.449 Again it's all about the individual isn't it when you're 1380 01:10:28.479 --> 01:10:30.880 on your own in a business other people don't care 1381 01:10:30.920 --> 01:10:33.199 what you're getting up to it's only down to you 1382 01:10:33.260 --> 01:10:34.520 if you you've got to face you at the end 1383 01:10:34.539 --> 01:10:38.340 of the day um whether you did enough And whether 1384 01:10:38.380 --> 01:10:41.119 you were efforting or whether you were actually working hard, 1385 01:10:41.199 --> 01:10:44.689 there's a big difference between the two. On that note, Chris, 1386 01:10:44.949 --> 01:10:47.310 I'm going to wrap this up now because I think 1387 01:10:47.329 --> 01:10:49.590 you and I could have a happy part two on 1388 01:10:49.609 --> 01:10:51.250 this because we didn't even get to find out about 1389 01:10:51.670 --> 01:10:55.310 Chris as a six-year-old or Chris at school or what 1390 01:10:55.350 --> 01:10:58.199 you were like. But I think we gather from your 1391 01:10:58.260 --> 01:11:02.640 whole tone and your persona, you're passionate about business and 1392 01:11:02.659 --> 01:11:05.600 you're passionate about making a difference for people in their 1393 01:11:05.640 --> 01:11:09.279 businesses because you like to see that success and that curve. 1394 01:11:09.319 --> 01:11:11.140 And I love it as well. I know exactly where 1395 01:11:11.159 --> 01:11:13.319 you're coming from. Because when you see somebody who's kind 1396 01:11:13.340 --> 01:11:16.659 of like, and then they go whoosh, and it's like, yes. 1397 01:11:16.899 --> 01:11:18.800 And you feel like they're on their roller skates and 1398 01:11:18.880 --> 01:11:21.100 you just push them and they're going and they're fine 1399 01:11:21.159 --> 01:11:22.859 and off you go. You go and have fun now. 1400 01:11:23.420 --> 01:11:26.520 And then they're okay. So thank you for your time today. 1401 01:11:26.560 --> 01:11:31.170 You've given us lots of food for thought. Have I 1402 01:11:31.189 --> 01:11:33.689 got any other questions? I'm just going to What's your 1403 01:11:33.750 --> 01:11:37.170 dream with your business, Clarity? What would you like to 1404 01:11:37.210 --> 01:11:38.430 see this time next year? 1405 01:11:42.189 --> 01:11:45.619 I don't have... I just want to help as many 1406 01:11:45.659 --> 01:11:50.420 people as I can. Don't get me wrong, I'd love 1407 01:11:50.460 --> 01:11:54.399 to make lots of money. Only because I want to 1408 01:11:54.439 --> 01:11:56.510 just see how much I can make. It's not about, like, 1409 01:11:56.670 --> 01:12:00.529 I don't have any aspirations of large yachts or, you know, 1410 01:12:00.550 --> 01:12:05.409 buying islands or anything like that. I want to play 1411 01:12:05.430 --> 01:12:07.649 the game. That's why when people said, why do you 1412 01:12:07.670 --> 01:12:08.869 want to do it? I want to play the game 1413

01:12:09.489 --> 01:12:11.109 and see how well I can play it because it's 1414 01:12:11.149 --> 01:12:13.550 the game that never ends, right? It only ends when 1415 01:12:13.569 --> 01:12:16.869 you quit or you die. But that's it. It's just, 1416 01:12:17.270 --> 01:12:20.600 unless you quit, It keeps going. It's just like, okay, 1417 01:12:20.619 --> 01:12:23.539 how can I keep leveling up? Can I keep going 1418 01:12:23.560 --> 01:12:25.010 to the next level? And that's what I want to 1419 01:12:25.060 --> 01:12:27.930 test myself at is just, that's it. That's my dream. 1420 01:12:28.529 --> 01:12:30.010 And because I want to just do it behind, I 1421 01:12:30.029 --> 01:12:31.430 want to help as many people as I can. I'm 1422 01:12:32.909 --> 01:12:36.189 hoping that those things happen because I will just get 1423 01:12:36.229 --> 01:12:39.199 to more people and therefore more people means more and 1424 01:12:39.479 --> 01:12:43.460 scale and stuff and then more challenges. And it's like, great. 1425 01:12:43.619 --> 01:12:45.479 I'm looking forward to it. Yeah. 1426 01:12:45.720 --> 01:12:46.960 So technically you're living the dream. 1427 01:12:47.539 --> 01:12:50.039 Right now yeah i would say so as much as 1428 01:12:50.140 --> 01:12:53.600 like you can lie even and i will be frank 1429 01:12:53.619 --> 01:12:55.479 i can lie away in bed at night going what 1430 01:12:55.560 --> 01:12:59.699 the what have i done like you know because i don't. 1431 01:12:59.539 --> 01:13:01.640 Know stuff and i've got to go and find out 1432 01:13:01.800 --> 01:13:05.220 i ask people and then i go okay i do 1433 01:13:05.260 --> 01:13:07.800 that stuff i just need a word with myself sometimes 1434 01:13:07.819 --> 01:13:10.739 i go i can be that guy that's going i'm 1435 01:13:10.800 --> 01:13:13.760 not doing my outreach and i probably should i'm playing 1436 01:13:13.779 --> 01:13:15.659 around with claude too much and i need to just 1437 01:13:15.699 --> 01:13:20.550 go and And I will. So nobody's perfect. I'm not 1438 01:13:20.569 --> 01:13:24.729 saying that I'm perfect. I definitely made some mistakes, but 1439 01:13:25.510 --> 01:13:26.649 you learn. 1440 01:13:27.189 --> 01:13:29.510 Yeah. As long as you learn taking the lessons from 1441 01:13:29.529 --> 01:13:32.649 what you've learned. If people are interested in getting in 1442 01:13:32.670 --> 01:13:34.390 touch with you because they'd like a chat or find 1443 01:13:34.449 --> 01:13:36.949 out more how they can grow their business and make 1444 01:13:36.989 --> 01:13:38.689 it better than it already is. What's the easiest way 1445 01:13:38.720 --> 01:13:40.109 for people to get in touch with you? 1446 01:13:40.949 --> 01:13:44.779 Yeah. LinkedIn is probably the easiest way. I think I'm 1447 01:13:44.819 --> 01:13:50.090 the only Chris Scott-Thomas in existence. So I'm not hard 1448 01:13:50.109 --> 01:13:57.869 to find. You can look at our website, which is getclarity.win. Cool. 1449 01:13:57.930 --> 01:14:01.720 Or if you're in Collaboration Global, probably message me on 1450 01:14:01.729 --> 01:14:05.060 the platform. But try me on LinkedIn as well, because 1451 01:14:05.100 --> 01:14:07.119 I'm terrible at looking at lots of stuff. 1452 01:14:07.800 --> 01:14:11.600 That's the problem when we're all over the place, isn't it? 1453 01:14:11.659 --> 01:14:14.390 But LinkedIn is a good place to start. And also 1454 01:14:14.489 --> 01:14:17.289 if anybody wants to meet Chris, he's often at our 1455 01:14:17.430 --> 01:14:19.289 guest meetings as well. So if you wanted to come 1456 01:14:19.329 --> 01:14:24.039 along to a Collaboration Global guest meeting, just go to collaborationglobal.org 1457 01:14:24.500 --> 01:14:26.760 or go and have a look on Eventbrite. We've usually 1458 01:14:26.779 --> 01:14:29.640 got some events on LinkedIn as well, and then come 1459 01:14:29.680 --> 01:14:32.060 along to a meeting. And hopefully if you see him there, 1460 01:14:32.119 --> 01:14:33.560 you might be able to go into a little chat 1461 01:14:33.590 --> 01:14:36.369 space with him, a little breakout room and get to 1462 01:14:36.409 --> 01:14:39.029 know him even better. Thank you so much, Chris, for 1463 01:14:39.050 --> 01:14:41.850 your time today. I really appreciated this. And I look, 1464 01:14:42.189 --> 01:14:44.300 Now I know that we are so on the same page. 1465 01:14:44.310 --> 01:14:44.960 It's not true. 1466 01:14:44.979 --> 01:14:45.779 I absolutely love it. 1467 01:14:46.420 --> 01:14:48.960 I look forward to the next time as well. Thank 1468 01:14:48.979 --> 01:14:49.430 you so much. 1469 01:14:49.479 --> 01:14:51.149 Fantastic, Jill. Thank you for having me.